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Nancy Grace
Mel Gibson Reportedly Under Criminal Investigation
Aired July 09, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Hollywood superstar Mel Gibson under police criminal investigation. After years of racist, sexist, anti-Semitic hate talk, a DUI arrest, divorce scandal and bitter custody dispute, Mel Gibson tonight under investigation for the brutal beating of a Russian singer, the mother of their 8-month-old baby girl. An emergency restraining order claims Mel Gibson repeatedly punching Oksana Grigorieva, leaving her with two black eyes, knocking out teeth and leaving her with a concussion. There are photos.
Not only that, Gibson hurling more racist, sexist remarks and threats. It`s all caught on tape. Reports Gibson even admits to the attack, saying she, quote, "deserved it."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Breaking news about actor Mel Gibson.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... domestic violence accusations...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nobody tells you officially, but you hear...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... a domestic violence investigation in connection with Mel Gibson`s alleged attack against Oksana Grigorieva.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I like it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) work very hard and really long hours.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Reportedly caught on tape admitting he hit the mother of his love child...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On that tape, Gibson reportedly told his girlfriend that she was dressed like an F-ing pig in heat...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I really don`t care.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... and would get raped by a pack of N-words...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do (ph) not control the situation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... and it would be her own fault.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t walk around in tight clothes. I stay at home most of the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) do. You go out in public and it`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) embarrassment to me. You look like a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) bitch on heat. And if you get raped by a pack of (EXPLETIVE DELETED), it`ll be your fault, all right, because you provoked it! You are provocatively dressed all the time, with your fake boobs you feel you have to show off!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, a beautiful young Virginia Tech co-ed goes to a Metallica concert with all of her friends. Just before the band takes the stage, she goes missing, missing from a packed arena of 16,000 people. Found in the parking lot, her purse, cell phone, battery removed. After an exhausting search, a partially skeletalized body found in the midst of a pasture of thick grass confirmed to be 20-year- old Morgan Harrington.
Breaking tonight. Is there a break in the case? Virginia police confirm forensic evidence links Harrington`s killer to a 2005 sex stalker. Is Morgan`s killer a serial stalker linked to multiple vicious attacks on young women? Tonight, just released, a composite sketch of the killer.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: New developments in the case of 20-year-old co- ed Morgan Harrington.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... DNA link...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This I think is a big step.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... to a previous crime...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police confirm forensic evidence linked to a 2005 abduction and sex assault of a 26-year-old woman 100 miles away.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s no longer merely a matter of testimony. It`s hard evidence.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... Morgan Harrington...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... skeletal remains...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is not a random place that someone came upon accidentally.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... found on Anchorage Farm on route 29 in southern Albemarle County.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is known to someone here. It`s a local person.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Authorities have released a composite sketch from the 2005 case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s a killer among us, and now there`s a fact (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Hollywood superstar Mel Gibson under police criminal investigation for a brutal attack.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m pleased as punch.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mel Gibson`s foul and offensive rant...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The domestic violence investigation by authorities...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m here and I`m smiling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is worse -- F-ing pig in heat.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... allegedly caught on tape admitting he hit his ex-girlfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m not upset.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I did not plan this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What kind of man is that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, somebody`s got to win.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s a jerk. So what?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m just doing what I`ve always been doing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... using words that most men would never even think to use.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Next question.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I find him repulsive.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The people have spoken.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mel Gibson lost his mind.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t walk around in tight clothes. I stay at home most of the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) do. You go out in public and it`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) embarrassment to me. You look like a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) bitch on heat. And if you get raped by a pack of (EXPLETIVE DELETED), it`ll be your fault, all right, because you provoked it! You are provocatively dressed all the time, with your fake boobs you feel you have to show off!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Dylan Howard joining us out of LA, senior executive editor, Radaronline, who has actually heard the alleged threats by Mel Gibson -- racist, sexist, including physical threat of violence. What about it, Dylan? What did you hear?
DYLAN HOWARD, RADARONLINE.COM: Well, Nancy, by their very nature, when you read the words that Mel Gibson has said and what he called the mother of his illegitimate child, Oksana Grigorieva, they are explosive. But when you hear the tape, by God, it is disgusting, vile! It`s laced with profanity. And it`s threatening.
And that is why Oksana Grigorieva, I understand, recorded these conversations, because she feared for her life. And in one of those conversations, not only did Mel Gibson admit that he did hit her and the reason that he hit her was because she F-ing deserved it, he also goes on to describe that she could be raped by a pack of black men. Of course, he used the N-word. And he goes on to say other vile and very disturbing things about other races, including Latinos, too, by referring to a worker of his and Oksana as being a wetback.
GRACE: OK, Liz, let`s go through the transcript again. This is what we know right now. We know Mel Gibson, Hollywood superstar, under investigation, a police criminal investigation. This is part of the evidence, according to reports.
This is Gibson. "You are an embarrassment to me. You look like an F-ing pig (SIC) in heat. If you get raped by a pack of N-words, it will be your fault. How dare you act like such a B-I-T-C-H when I`ve been so F-ing nice. Look what you did to me. Look what you are. Look what every part of you is, F-ing fake. F-ing fake. You are the most synthetic person. Who the F are you? I`m going to come and burn the F- ing house down, but you will blow me first. You are a B-I-T-C-H.
Grigorieva, "I didn`t do anything." Gibson, "Did so." Grigorieva, "What kind of man is that who would hit a woman when she`s holding a child in her hands, hitting her twice in the face? What kind of man is that?" Response, "You know what? You F-ing deserved it."
OK. Carlos Diaz, syndicated radio host, journalist joining us out of LA. Couldn`t he see he`s being set up? She gives the facts right there in the phone call, and he goes, yes, you deserved it.
CARLOS DIAZ, SYNDICATED RADIO HOST, JOURNALIST: Yes. I mean, this is absolutely a death sentence to Mel Gibson`s career, first and foremost, and secondly, to Mel Gibson as a person. You know, we forgave him once. But now you`re coming out and -- first you say terrible things about Jewish people. Then you have a remark against women while you`re being arrested. Then you`re alleged to hit the mother of your child. Then you use the N-word, and then you use a word that I`ve been called several times, a wetback, you know, which brings up, you know, terrible memories.
So this is one of these things where -- what demographic, A, and what ethnic group is going to watch your movies from now on, when you seem to be ticking off all of America?
GRACE: Well, wait a minute. Wait a minute. To Chris Garrett, crisis management expert, partner, Impact Strategies joining us out of D.C. Chris, they said that last time. Remember when he got pulled over for, I guess it was DUI -- and Ellie Jostad, what did he call the cop?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: He called her sugar -- I can`t say the word -- breasts.
GRACE: OK. That`s a nice way to put it.
JOSTAD: Yes. (INAUDIBLE) like that.
GRACE: And nothing happened. Didn`t he -- what did he say, that Jewish people were the reason for every war ever in the world? Was that it? What did he say about that?
JOSTAD: Right. He said the Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world. Are you a Jew? He reportedly said that to a male police officer.
GRACE: That was to the female or the male police officer?
JOSTAD: That was to the male officer.
GRACE: OK. So basically, Chris Garrett, nobody`s left out. This time, he manages to work in farm animals, pigs, OK?
CHRIS GARRETT, CRISIS MANAGEMENT EXPERT: Right.
GRACE: Everybody gets it this time! And it doesn`t matter. Everybody keeps going back to the movies. This guy is worth nearly a billion -- that`s with a B, as in brother -- a billion dollars.
GARRETT: Well, I think, Nancy, you hit the nail right on the head. I mean, this is a disturbing pattern of behavior. Maybe, you know, the first time (INAUDIBLE) this occurred, he would get some sort of a -- you know, pass is probably -- probably the wrong term, but people kind of let him go through the redemption process.
But now you have a pattern of egregious behavior. So kind of the public image and the PR component of his career -- that`s the last thing he needs to be concerned about at this point. He needs to be worried about this investigation and worried about the litigation that he`s facing.
GRACE: You`re right. You`re right because the guy`s sitting on about a billion dollars. Why does he need to make another movie?
To the lines. Christy, Nevada. Hi, Christy.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just want to say that I love you and it`s an honor to talk to you and that I want to thank my 7-year-old little girl, who kept hitting redial and redial until she finally got through to you for me.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: You know what? I want to thank her, too. Thank you, little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For 30 minutes, she tried and tried. And she got through to you the first time, and I hung up by accident. She was so disappointed! And my question is -- I`m Hispanic, first of all, so I think he`s a disgusting pig. And can all the things he`s -- all his antics and the crazy things he`s done in the past -- I mean, could that just come back to haunt him now and it just all crash down on him for everything?
GRACE: It really could. Let`s unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, sex crimes prosecutor -- specialty, crimes on women and children -- Peter Odom, defense attorney, Atlanta, and Mickey Sherman, criminal defense attorney and author of "How Can You Defend Those People?" joining us out of our New York studio.
First of all, Eleanor, if this does -- if this does go to trial -- and it could because when you`ve got a client like Mel Gibson, you never know if they`re going to agree to a plea or not -- or it may get settled by a little bit of money, all right? Maybe he could pay for her silence. But if he got on the stand, for instance, or put up a character witness that said, He`s a great guy, all of this could come flooding into the courtroom.
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Exactly, Nancy. It could come in. Also, the prosecutor could file something called "similar transactions," and if the judge allows it, then all these actions could come into the trial.
GRACE: What about it, Mickey?
MICKEY SHERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Trial`s over, Nancy. It`s already been done. As Mr. Diaz pointed out, this is a window to his character. He`s offended everybody except Eskimos, and that`s only because he probably ran out of time. I mean, what he`s done to himself is far worse and far more effectively...
GRACE: You know, I disagree, Sherman...
SHERMAN: ... negative...
GRACE: ... because he does not want to spend a night in the can.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... a domestic violence...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... domestic violence...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... F-ing pig...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m just so lucky.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was bad enough...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) beastly (ph) creatures (ph)...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mel Gibson lost his mind.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s being investigated for a possible domestic violence incident.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I hadn`t planned on that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The Academy Award-winning actor was reportedly caught on tape admitting he hit the mother of his love child...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... knocking out two of her front teeth.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... while she was holding their baby girl.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do not control the situation. I did not plan this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... pleased (ph) as punch.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are hearing that the alleged incidents occurred in January and February of this year.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On that tape, Gibson reportedly told his girlfriend that she was dressed like an F-ing pig in heat...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For dramatic purposes, you got to make it compelling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... and would get raped by a pack of N-words and it would be her own fault.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t walk around in tight clothes. I stay at home most of the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) do. You go out in public and it`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) embarrassment to me. You look like a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) bitch on heat. And if you get raped by a pack of (EXPLETIVE DELETED), it`ll be your fault, all right, because you provoked it! You are provocatively dressed all the time, with your fake boobs you feel you have to show off!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Ellie Jostad. We`re talking about Mel Gibson, Hollywood superstar. You don`t really get a whole lot bigger than Mel Gibson. I mean, there are some bigger stars, but that`s pretty big. This guy`s sitting on about how much money, Ellie, that you researched?
JOSTAD: Yes. He`s estimated to be worth between $900 million and $1 billion. He gets paid $25 million a movie.
GRACE: And who is Oksana Grigorieva?
JOSTAD: Well, she is a pianist and a singer. She grew up in a small town in the Ukraine. She moved to Moscow when she was just 19, started studying the piano, started singing. She`s trying to make a career as a pop singer now.
GRACE: Does she have a record, an album?
JOSTAD: I don`t know of any records that she`s released, but she does tour around and perform. She probably has released records.
GRACE: I though that he helped produce her CD. What about it, Dylan Howard? Didn`t she release a CD?
HOWARD: She did. I don`t believe it went to CD, though, Nancy. She released an album that is available on iTunes, I understand. But she met Mel Gibson on the set of "The Edge of Darkness," which was Mel`s, if you like, return to fame after that 2006 incident. And he certainly bankrolled her music career, if you like, her aspirations...
GRACE: Wait a minute. Wait a minute.
HOWARD: ... and she, too...
GRACE: Mel Gibson bankrolled her music career, and all she had was something released on iTunes? Thanks, Mel!
HOWARD: That`s as I understand it, Nancy.
GRACE: All right. Big favor! Ellie, wasn`t there another alleged -- a threat with some other woman kind of sandwiched in between, his wife, who`s got what, like, seven children by him...
JOSTAD: Seven, right.
GRACE: ... seven kids, Robyn Gibson, long-suffering, they always say in the tabloids. Then there`s Oksana Grigorieva.
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: But somewhere in the middle, wasn`t there somebody else?
JOSTAD: Yes, there is. There`s this other woman who talked to "In Touch Weekly." She`s a Polish actress. In some reports, she`s alleged to be a porn star. She claims that she met Gibson when he was still married.
GRACE: You know, you kind of rushed through that. In some reports, she what?
JOSTAD: She is a Polish porn star, according to some reports.
GRACE: A Polish porn star.
JOSTAD: Yes.
GRACE: You know, I couldn`t have made this one up, but I`m taking notes for my next book. Go ahead.
JOSTAD: Right. Right. Well, she claims that -- there she is. She claims that she met him while he was still married to his wife, Robyn. She says they started dating. They started having a sexual relationship...
GRACE: Ellie, Ellie, that could be anybody. Everybody met Mel Gibson while he was still married to his ex-wife, Robyn. Go ahead.
JOSTAD: Right. Well, the key is, this woman claims that last summer, July of `09 -- at this point, he was already dating Grigorieva. He had split from his wife. She says she got a call from him. He made threats. He said, Don`t "F" me up, or something to that effect. She says she was so frightened that she hired a bodyguard, moved out of town, laid low for about a month.
GRACE: Was that ever reported to police?
JOSTAD: Not that we know, Nancy. And as far as we know, she didn`t get it on tape, but she says Gibson did call her.
GRACE: Well, if it`s not reported to police, Eleanor Odom, there`s really not a lot that people can do with it now. Now, what they could do, Eleanor, is if this case -- this alleged pretty vicious assault -- alleged -- a concussion, teeth knocked out, two black eyes, alleged by Oksana Grigorieva, the mother of Mel Gibson`s 8-month-old baby girl -- apparently, she has on tape, according to Dylan Howard with Radaronline, threats. That could be a similar transaction even without a police report.
ELEANOR ODOM: Yes, Nancy. You don`t have to have a police report in order to get a similar transaction into evidence. You just have to show that it`s the same motive, same MO, he`s doing it for the same reasons. And clearly, he has a streak not only of meanness but of violating women, of threatening women.
GRACE: To Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Deal Breakers. What about it, Bethany?
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Well, I think he relates to women on the basis of power and control, not affection. And I hear pure homicidal rage. She probably did something that we would consider benign or trivial, and the control slipped and he went into a rage. And Nancy...
GRACE: Well, Bethany, even if she wanted more money, more money than she should have had -- even if that were the case, he`s sitting on a billion dollars!
MARSHALL: He`s sitting on a billion dollars. You know, women rarely file a restraining order the first time they`re abused. So what that tells me is there has been a history of abuse. Women try to leave on average eight times before they successfully leave an abuser. So how many times did she try to leave him before she finally said, Enough is enough, and made a recording?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Breaking news about actor Mel Gibson.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s ridiculous.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One doesn`t plan these things. They`re organic and they emerge.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The LA County Sheriff`s Department is investigating allegations the actor attacked his ex-girlfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She was left bloodied...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He punched her in the face.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... and her two front teeth were knocked out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It must have been a fairly heart-stopping, harrowing event when it happened.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She also claims that he gave her a concussion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Somebody`s got to win.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Hey, you know what? This isn`t that trivial. To Eleanor Odom, a concussion, teeth knocked out, two black eyes. Plus, if she`s telling the truth, you`ve got her holding the baby when it all went down.
ELEANOR ODOM: Exactly. It`s called felonies, Nancy -- aggravated assault, aggravated battery because of the injuries to her teeth and her head. This is very serious stuff.
GRACE: But you know, the reality -- back to you, Chris Garrett, crisis management expert, partner, Impact Strategies, joining us out of D.C. What do you think the cops out there, LA -- what do you think they`ll do with it? Nothing? Nothing?
GARRETT: Well, yes, I think the interesting part about it is -- I think kind of what I`ve talked to people that have covered Hollywood and kind of the Hollywood insider studio executives -- Gibson has not really been looked at as the huge, bankable star that he was ever since this original incident happened. I believe it was in `06. So I think that`s kind of been the calculus now. It`s a little bit changed.
If this -- if he hadn`t had this pattern, I think you`d see him more out front on this, trying to put out his position on it, whatever that may be. But I think this is very a telltale sign, the fact that he`s kind of bunkered down now and having to deal with solely the litigation.
GRACE: OK. You know what? I`ve got another -- another fight going on here. To -- I think I need a shrink on this one, or maybe a pastor. Dr. Bethany Marshall, we all know that he masterminded "The Passion of the Christ," which after all those years of dealing with felonies and prosecuting people, I couldn`t even bring myself to watch the movie because I thought it would be so upsetting to me personally to see that. But there are all these reports of what a devout and religious person he is.
MARSHALL: Well...
GRACE: And this does not fit. What does that mean?
MARSHALL: Well, perhaps he thinks he is the Christ. And you know...
GRACE: OK, Bethany, don`t go crazy on me right now, OK? Don`t!
MARSHALL: Well, you know...
GRACE: Just -- no!
MARSHALL: ... religiosity can be...
GRACE: He does not think he`s Christ, and don`t drag Christ into this, please, all right?
MARSHALL: But you know religiosity...
GRACE: Just stick with Mel Gibson!
MARSHALL: Religiosity can be a form of grandiosity...
GRACE: What do you mean, religiosity? Whoa, whoa. Religiosity?
MARSHALL: Well, I`m saying that...
GRACE: What do you mean by that? What`s religiosity?
MARSHALL: I`m saying that...
GRACE: I think you made that up. Ellie, go to Dictionary.com. I don`t think that`s even a word. Go ahead, Bethany.
MARSHALL: (INAUDIBLE) saying is that when he made the film, he may not have made it out of a spiritual, faithful -- a sense of his faith and his relationship with God, rather to buttress his own feelings of superiority in relationship to other people.
GRACE: Yes, I don`t know what you just said, so when we come back, could you break it down?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Mel Gibson`s alleged attack against Oksana Grigorieva...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No one has bothered to explain to me in a reasonable manner...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... Mel Gibson`s foul and offensive rant...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wrote (ph) it down (ph).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t walk around in tight clothes. I stay at home most of the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes you (inaudible) do. You look a (inaudible) bitch on heat and if you get raped by a pack of (inaudible) it will be your fault. All right? Because you provoked it. You are provocatively dressed all the tile with your fake boobs you feel you have to show off.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Strike a woman holding your child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s an entirely predictable response.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gave her a concussion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was also a possible concussion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: With his history of alcohol abuse, I think people are going to think, he fell off the wagon again and got carried away.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s all I want to do is get my message out there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NANCY GRACE, HOST: OK, Dr. Bethany Marshall, I guess you told me. Religiosity is in fact a word. OK, now, have you thought about how you can break down whatever it was you were saying so us normal people can understand it?
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": Men who fall into the narcissistic type of personality disorders feel that they are the holder of what is right the world. Therefore, they deserve to have power over everybody, even including their wives.
And sometimes they become highly religious because that supports their sense that they are right. And they use religion as a weapon and I would suspect that that is true for him and that his faith is not --
GRACE: Bethany, I don`t want to get too deep into religion because I am the last person to have any comment at all. I don`t even deserve to talk about religion. But it just dawns on me, being the sinner that I am, when you have to build your own church in your own backyard because you can`t get along with everybody in the regular church --
MARSHALL: Right.
GRACE: -- that`s kind of a problem. It`s only a church for you. You`re the only one that goes there. That`s kind of unusual, right?
MARSHALL: Well, he`s the pastor of his own little congregation of seven -- no, eight, seven children and his wife. You know, Nancy, I`m an ordained minister and when you are called in to that profession, what you do is you really think of what`s best for the needs of the congregation.
And in this case, he really is not thinking about anybody but himself and I think that`s because of his personality disorder and his substance abuse.
GRACE: To Dr. Jennifer Shu, pediatrician, editor of "Baby and Child Health." Dr. Shue, I want to talk to you about what kind of impacts results in a concussion and to have two teeth knocked out. How difficult is that?
DR. JENNIFER SHU, PEDIATRICIAN, EDITOR, "BABY AND CHILD HEALTH": Well, I mean, clearly if you bump your face on something your teeth aren`t going to fall out. It really had to take a huge impact. A concussion is basically when the brain bounces inside the skull and has some bruising.
That can take a couple of weeks to get better and so you might have slurred speech, memory problems. Headache is really severe. Nausea, vomiting so definitely some force was involved if a concussion did actually happen as she says.
GRACE: Back to Dillon Howard with Radar Online. Dillon, you heard the tapes. What more do the police need out there? They`ve got a witness. That would be Oksana Grigorieva.
They`ve got dental records, medical records. I would guess -- I got a little feeling she took a lot of polaroids of herself. I`m sure there are photos. What else do they need? They got him confessing, saying you deserved it.
DILLON HOWARD: Well, Nancy, we broke the story that Oksana has these photos. They show her, according to one source, bloodied and bruised. Now, I also spoke to law enforcement, two independent law enforcement experts, if you like.
Nancy, being a former prosecutor, you would know, too, that that type that Oksana has will be crucial to any police investigation and the sheer fact that he admits and says she (inaudible) deserves to be beaten when, of course, don`t forget, of course. Oksana asked the question.
What kind of a person, what kind of a man hits a woman while she`s holding her daughter? And that`s when Mel responded, you (inaudible) deserved it that there is going to be a crucial piece of evidence according to the law enforcement experts that I spoke with today.
GRACE: You know what, back out to you, Eleanor Odom, Peter Odom, Mickey Sherman. Eleanor, we also have, if it`s on tape, a terroristic threat, which is a felony, saying I will come burn your house down but you will blow me first.
ELEANOR ODOM, SEX CRIMES PROSECUTOR: Exactly, Nance. You know, domestic violence is really domestic terrorism. So terroristic threats is quite clear because you have the corroboration with the tape.
GRACE: What about it, Peter Odom?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: That tape might never come into evidence. California is a two-party consent tape and it looks like that tape might have been illegally made unless there was a beep going with the tape. So my first fight as a defense attorney will be to keep that tape out.
GRACE: I kind of don`t believe -- what about it, Mickey. That when you`re leaving a terroristic threat on a recording, I don`t think you have to get the perp`s permission.
MICKEY SHERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY, AUTHOR "HOW CAN YOU DEFEND THOSE PEOPLE?": Well, she did the tapes to prevent a crime or to report a crime. I mean, let her pay a $50 fine. But my question, how come he hasn`t been arrested?
GRACE: That`s my question. Carlos Diaz, what`s going on out there in L.A.? What now? What`s the police problem now why they can`t make an arrest? Out getting a manicure and pedicure.
CARLOS DIAZ, SYNDICATED RADIO HOST, JOURNALIST, COVERING STORY: Yes. They`re too busy with Lindsay Lohan. No, the thing is she just made this -- here I go. I`m going to stoke the fire here, Nancy. She just made this assessment.
She just went to the police on Monday. So you have to ask yourself -- this all happened -- the concussion and teeth being knocked down her throat back in January. The tapes were made or the last few months. Why does she wait six months to go to the police to make this formal charge against Mel Gibson.
GRACE: Carlos, if you are suggesting she`s in it for more money, that she came out of that mediation --
DIAZ: I`m just throwing it out there, Nancy. I`m playing devils out of it.
GRACE: As I was saying, and that now in retrospect she wants more money. Say she is a gold digger. I don`t care. I don`t care what she is. I don`t care if she`s a hooker, a gold digger. I don`t care if she`s a nun.
OK, up in your sister`s chastity cathedral. I don`t care. That doesn`t make it OK, and you know what, it`s your attitude that just displayed that somehow this is not legitimate because she could be a gold digger.
DIAZ: I`m not --
GRACE: I heard you loud and clear.
DIAZ: I`m not - I`m not saying that it`s OK, hitting a woman is the absolute worst thing that a man can do. It`s a despicable thing.
GRACE: I don`t know about that. Murder.
DIAZ: But what I`m saying is what Mel Gibson did was despicable. The things he said if these tapes are legit are despicable. All I`m saying is throwing that one little tidbit out there to kind of stoke the fire.
GRACE: Yes, OK, thanks, Carlos. To you, Phyllis in Pennsylvania. Hi, Phyllis. What`s your question, dear?
CALLER: Hi, Nancy. It`s such a pleasure to talk to you.
GRACE: Likewise.
CALLER: I just want to know if there are tapes out there, why isn`t Mel Gibson already arrested?
GRACE: You know, I don`t know. Eleanor, what`s the problem?
ODOM: Who knows. What more evidence do the police need? They have more than enough. They have probable cause. They need to go get him.
GRACE: Janet in North Carolina. What`s your question?
CALLER: My question is how can a man like Mel Gibson produce and/or direct a movie like "The Passion of Christ" and then do what he`s doing to his wife by calling her the n-word and other things? Personally, I will never, ever watch any of his movies ever again. The man needs to be shut out Hollywood.
GRACE: You know, Paul Penzone, I know you`re not a Hollywood insider and neither am I. You`re with childhelp.org, but former sergeant in Phoenix PD. You know, some of the worst of the bunch come straight out of the church even the synagogue and goes and commits crime. So I`m not surprised about that at all. But what do you think should happen? You`re a former cop. You`re a sergeant.
PAUL PENZONE: Well, one of the things that`s being overlooked -- I`m not sure how the laws apply in California. But if she was holding that child during the assault, which should be a felony and aggravated assault -- that`s endangerment also. So you have aggravated circumstances beyond her injuries.
GRACE: So, Paul, what`s the holdup? What`s the problem? Why isn`t there an arrest? Is he just too rich and to important and too fails for an arrest?
PENZONE: Unfortunately, I`m sure because he`s so high profile the police are making sure they cross their T`s and dot their I`s before they pursue this.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t walk around in tight clothes. I stay at home most of the time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes you (inaudible) do. You look a (inaudible) bitch on heat and if you get raped by a pack of (inaudible) it will be your fault. All right? Because you provoked it. You are provocatively dressed all the tile with your fake boobs you feel you have to show off.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Forensic evidence DNA --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want this guy off the street.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her name is Morgan Dana Harrington.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Has now been connected to a 2005 abduction and sex assault case 100 miles away. Authorities released a sketch from the suspect in the 2005 case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rendering of someone who murdered my daughter and hurt someone else.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Never thought you`d be sitting in this place in 1,000, 1,000 years about.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We now need to find the person who did this and we will not stop until that person is brought to justice.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When I first heard that they had a DNA link to a previous crime, I mean, it`s hard to say that you are happy about such an obscene thing, but we were in fact happy because the likelihood of us getting an arrest and a conviction increased astronomically. It`s no longer merely a matter of testimony. It`s hard evidence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Is there a break in the case of Morgan Harrington? Straight out to Stacey Newman, our producer on the story. Stacey, what do you know?
STACEY NEWMAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER, COVERING STORY: Big breaking news tonight, Nancy. Cops are confirming that a 2005 sex assault is linked by forensic evidence to the murder of Morgan Harrington.
GRACE: What do we know? How do we know that?
NEWMAN: Well, we do know that cops did they gathered evidence from Morgan Harrington`s crime scene and they have matched it to evidence from this attack on a 26-year-old woman about 100 miles away, Nancy, in Fairfax City, Virginia.
GRACE: Joining us right now, Dr. Dan Harrington. This is the father of Morgan Harrington. Also with us Gil Harrington, her mother. Dr. Harrington, thank you for being with us. When did you learn about the DNA match?
DAN HARRINGTON, FATHER OF MURDERED CO-ED, MORGAN HARRINGTON (via telephone): The police told us of the DNA match several weeks prior to the announcement last week. And then of course the DNA was confirmed to the public on Thursday of last week.
GRACE: Gil, this is Morgan`s mother, her mother and father being with us. I have thought about Morgan so many hundreds of times since we first covered this case. What does this mean to you?
GIL HARRINGTON, MOTHER OF MURDERED CO-ED, MORGAN HARRINGTON (via telephone): You know, Nancy, it`s hard. And we`re getting a lot of heat from people that say we should just step down and go away, because this is an ugly scenario.
And it`s too late for my girl. My daughter is dead, but this guy is at the top of his game now. He`s not satisfied with just hurting. Now he hurts and kills and we have to stop him before he does this to another young woman. I can`t go away.
GRACE: Who in their right mind, Ms. Harrington, would tell you, you need to back off?
GIL HARRINGTON: You know, we`re getting a lot of flak. People say it`s -- it`s as if we`re making social gaffes and we need to take our lumps and go away. And I`m not willing to do that because I can`t give up on the next girl and my daughter is dead.
But this guy is out there and from what I understand, people don`t shake off this compulsion. You know, maybe there`s a -- since the last assault that we know he committed five years ago in Fairfax. He did stuff in the interim, you know, a sexual assault is very underreported.
Maybe there`s a woman sitting on the sidelines who didn`t come forward and she can give us the information that would help us. You need three points for GPS. We have two points. We need a third point and then we can locate this man and get him off the street. That`s what I`m trying to do.
GRACE: To Eleanor Odom, sex crimes prosecutor, who has also handled death penalty trials. Eleanor, Ms. Harrington is right. These are not the only two times this guy has struck. He goes from a brutal sex assault in 2005 to the attack and murder of Morgan Harrington.
Now, there`s a lapse in time. I guarantee you there`s another victim in there. And how is it that sex offenders graduate to become murderers, Eleanor? How does that progression occur?
ODOM: It`s a pattern of escalating behavior, Nancy. If they`re not stopped from the very beginning, then you see this escalation and then it`s hard of course to stop at all. It can begin with something as easy as looking at pornography, child pornography and going on from there to the murder. So you have to stop them early.
GRACE: I guarantee you, Eleanor, he`s got things in his history, a criminal history, before that 2005 sex assault. It could be peeping tom. It could be an aggravated assault. There`s something this guy has got a record, I guarantee you.
It could be juvenile or not. This guy has got a record. Look at this composite. The perp six foot tall, medium build, black hair, beard, mustache, 2005 abduction and sex assault case in Fairfax. Forensic connection between that case and Morgan Harrington.
Everybody, take a look at this guy. Liz, please show it in full. There is a $150,000 reward, including 50 grand from the Band Metallica. The tip line, 434-352-3467. To Paul Penzone, VP Prevention Programs at childhelp.org, former sergeant Phoenix PD. Weigh in.
PENZONE: We had a case similar to this in Phoenix, Nancy, where there was a serial rapist who was killing people. First of all, my heart and prayers go out to the family. What they`re doing is the right thing to do, stay committed.
But what law enforcement is doing very well is first of all getting a composite. Even though it`s from the past giving people something to focus on that gives you structural and relative description. But that high reward, although it will bring in an enormous number of tips, weeding through those you`ll find the needle in the haystack.
So they need to keep the community committed. Through that you have to buy exposure through that reward using the media.
GRACE: $150,000 reward. Tip line 434-352-3467. Stacey Newman, what were the details of the sex attack?
NEWMAN: This is a scary attack. A 26-year-old woman minding her business walking a quarter mile from a grocery store when she`s suddenly blindsided by this perp who grabs her, assaults her in the bush. Her life was spared when a passer-by came and the suspect ran off.
GRACE: This should jog everyone`s memory. Anyone that has come in touch with this guy. There`s $150,000 reward.
As we go to break on a happy note, happy birthday to Fayetteville friend Chuck Lynch. After a long career in the printing business, he loves retirement with wife Ann, tending his blueberries, tomatoes and apple tree. Three grown children, six grands. Keeps a close eye on his 98-year-old mother who also has a green thumb. Loves home-made peach ice cream, pound cake and diet coke. Happy birthday, Chuck.
And very quickly, thank you for your support of my first murder mystery, "Eleventh Victim." You made it a "New York Times" best seller. It hit the stands in paperback. Proceeds go to Wesley Glen. It provides a home for mentally handicapped. Again, I would thank you and I hope you like the book.
And now CNN "Heroes."
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Me having cancer, I couldn`t believe it. It. There was two cancers in my head. I lost all my hair. I was sick. I have no car. I can`t work no more.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When a person gets cancer, they have to deal with the stress, the financial part of it. People lose everything. They will stay home and die. And that`s just not acceptable. My name is Kathy Broussard, we provide free air transportation and free ground transportation for medical patients coming in and out of the Houston area.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They had nothing like this down where I lived. I`d have died a long time ago.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There`s probably about 300 people volunteering their car, their gas, time. The volunteers, some of them have had cancer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When I see them, they give me hope.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They stay there with us, fight. And I`ve been doing it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: God has bypassed me in cancer. And if I can help somebody -- and I`m sorry for crying, but if I can help somebody make their life a little better, then that`s what it`s all about. It`s not about me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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GRACE: What a week in America`s courtrooms. Take a look at the stories and, more important, the people who touched our lives.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: An amber alert has been issued for a 4-year-old girl.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A massive search is under way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m here about my granddaughter. She`s a really good girl, always smiling.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Alisa Myer was playing on their front lawn with her brother.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her parents were home when this happened.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When a white male in a dark colored four-door sedan approached and took the little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our goal is to bring her back here to her family.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Alisa has been found alive.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At a gas station car wash.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s not harmed in a way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Massive search is under way. Searching for the man about 30 years old.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A registered sex offender who Missouri police wanted to question in the kidnapping of 4 year old Alisa Maier has committed suicide.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shot dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news in the case of missing 7 year old Portland boy Kyron Horman.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are now learning why the father of missing Kyron Horman got a restraining order against his wife Terri.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A source says that stepmom Terri Horman allegedly tried to hire a hit man to kill her husband.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s the last one to see her missing 7-year-old stepson. The words of Kaine Horman, little Kyron`s dad, he writes in the restraining order. I believe Terri Horman is involved in the disappearance of my son, Kyron.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please cooperate with investigators to help bring Kyron home.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Breaking news about actor Mel Gibson. The LA County Sheriff`s Department is investigating allegations the actor attacked his ex-girlfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She was left bloodied.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He punched her in the face.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her two front teeth were knocked out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yelling obscenities, profanities.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You look like an (inaudible) pig in heat and if you get raped by a pack of n-word, it will be your fault.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t want you to think that I don`t respect you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thirty days in jail on a reckless driving case. Thirty days in jail on the first DUI case, consecutive, and 30 days in jail on the second DUI case.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I wasn`t missing the classes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s 90 days in jail.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: More on that fingernail incident in the courtroom. Was she actually giving the middle finger to the judge?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Allegedly told friends, quote, "I`m not going to jail."
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GRACE: Let`s stop and remember Army Specialist Justin Blackwell, 27, Paris, Tennessee, killed Iraq. On a fourth tour also served Afghanistan. Awarded the bronze star, purple heart, two Army commendation medals, three Army achievement medals. Loved chess, wrestling, time with his children, country music, favorite singer Toby Keith.
Leaves behind grieving parents Steven Sr. and Hazel, brothers, Steve Jr. Vernon, Nathan also serving in the Army. Widow Allison. Children Abigail, McKenzie and Joshua. Justin Blackwell, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially you for being with us. A special good night from the New York control room. Good night, Brett, Liz, Evel. Everyone I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern and until then good night, friend.
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