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American Morning
Gearing Up for Static Kill: How Procedure Will Seal Broken Oil Well; Islamic Center at Ground Zero Sparks Debate; The Successor to al Qaeda: Tracking Fugitive American Cleric Anwar al-Awlaki; Combating High Cholesterol; Price for Sheriff's Head; Shark Week Frenzy
Aired August 03, 2010 - 07:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Thanks for being with us on this Tuesday, it's August 3rd. I'm Kiran Chetry.
JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. I'm John Roberts. Thanks so much for joining us.
CHETRY: We have a lot to talk about, certainly. I feel like we've said this day after day, but today may be the day, fingers crossed, that BP actually gets to go ahead with the static kill operation, the attempt to permanently plug that well.
It was another delay in the Gulf of Mexico yesterday. The company says it postponed a key test that needs to happen before this operation could begin because of a small leak. So now we're live on the Gulf coast with the latest this morning.
ROBERTS: An Islamic center and mosque in the shadows of ground zero, a symbol of tolerance or a slap in the face? While that debate rages, a big vote today could clear the last major hurdle for construction to begin. We're live in lower Manhattan in New York City just ahead.
CHETRY: Also, wanted by the feds and hiding out overseas, radical fugitive cleric Anwar al Awlaki is different from other terrorists. He's an American, uses the Internet to preach his hate, giving sermons in English. Our Deb Feyerick is back with part two of an in-depth CNN investigation into the man that terror experts call "the next bin-Laden."
ROBERTS: But first, new developments in the Gulf of Mexico. We have been told this is the beginning of the end, but this morning we're still waiting for the so-called static kill operation to get underway. The first shot for plugging the well for good could begin sometime later on today.
CHETRY: Meantime the government coming up with a new estimate of just how much oil has leaked from the BP's well, and it is on the high end, higher than BP has ever acknowledged -- almost 206 million gallons, by far the largest accidental oil leak in history.
ROBERTS: Jim Acosta is live for us in New Orleans this morning. Jim, the waiting is the hardest part. They were supposed to begin this injectivity test, as it's called, yesterday. What went wrong? JIM ACOSTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, what went wrong is essentially they discovered a small leak in the hydraulic system in the cap that is on that ruptured well. And that's a pretty darn important cap, right, because it is keeping all of the oil from spewing into the Gulf of Mexico.
We're waiting to find out whether or not this is static kill day or ground hog day. As you mentioned, it is another day of waiting to see if this static kill procedure is going to get underway.
This injectivity test is very important because they're going to try to force oil down into the ruptured well and down into the reservoir. And that's going to tell them a lot not only about the pressure that's in the well but the integrity of the well itself, can it withstand an injection of heavy mud and cement.
And they've got about 8,000 barrels of heavy mud ready to pump into this well as part of that static kill procedure.
And so all of this is going to change hour by hour. We shall get a briefing later today from Thad Allen, the national incident commander. He is going to be able to tell us probably whether or not a static kill is going to happen today, barring some announcement from BP this morning that static kill is underway. So we're still waiting and still hoping down here on the Gulf, John.
CHETRY: Also, we talked about these new figures out about just how much oil is spilling into the Gulf. There has been talk over the past several months since this spill that it was much higher than previously reported by BP. So what is the final analysis, I guess, from the federal government?
ACOSTA: Well, as it turns out all of those experts who were saying that BP was intentionally low-balling how much was going into the Gulf. Those researchers were right. A team of federal scientists came out yesterday and said roughly 4.9 billion barrels of oil that spewed out into the gulf during this crisis. That's roughly 200 million gallons.
And that's a pretty key number because this is going to how much money BP pays in damages and civil penalties to the federal government. If the federal government determines that this was simple mistake on BP's part, which is not likely, it is $1,000 per barrel. If it's gross negligence according to the federal government, it is something in the neighbor of $4,000 per barrel.
So we're talking big bucks here if the government determines gross negligence based on those numbers. That's why those numbers are important.
ROBERTS: A huge number when you think of the amount of oil and the potential damages as well. Jim Acosta in New Orleans this morning, thanks.
In just a few minutes we'll speak with a Doug Van Nieuwenhuise, he's a professor of petroleum geoscience at the University of Houston. We'll talk to him about what goes into the static kill to try to get that oil from back down actually into the reservoir, and what this injectivity test today is all about.
Meantime, just in to CNN -- a failed attack at the largest U.S. military base in southern Afghanistan this morning. A coalition source tells CNN that one suicide bomber blew himself up at the gate. As far as this source knows, the base only received small arms fire. Our Barbara Starr is watching this developing story for us this morning.
CHETRY: Also new this morning, evidence of the brutal and escalating drug trade violence that's ravaging Mexico. Officials say that what you're seeing here in this video is an explosive that was fired at police during a shoot-out in Juarez Sunday night. Investigators say they're not sure if it was a grenade, but they say it is a reminder of the drug cartel's increased sophistication and strength.
ROBERTS: And a Mexican drug cartel has reportedly put a $1 million bounty on the head of Arizona sheriff Joe Arpaio. A spokesman for the sheriff, who's nationally known as an aggressive leader in the fight against illegal immigration, said the death threat was sent by text message.
An FBI agent says the agency is aware of the threat but so far there is no word on any investigation into it.
CHETRY: And we've got a team of reporters working their sources to bring you the newest information on the war next door. In less than 30 minutes we'll be live with our Rafael Romo.
(WEATHER BREAK)
CHETRY: The static kill operation, the ultimate plan to end the Gulf oil disaster is starting to get underway, at least they hope. But what does the procedure involve? We'll show you. It's seven minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: It's nine minutes after the hour. The bid news today, it could be the day that BP attempts to permanently seal its broken well. Right now the oil giant is gearing up for a test that needs to take place before the company goes ahead with a procedure called static kill. That procedure involves injecting heavy drilling mud into the broken well.
Professor Fred Thurber from Louisiana State University and his students demonstrated the procedure for CNN earlier. Look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FRED THURBER, PROFESSOR: As can you see, the well is flowing from the top. When the well is flowing, you can't do a static kill because as soon as you inject mud it is blown out into the ocean. To do the static kill you must have the apparatus at the top to control flowing.
The brown area simulates mud. The blue area simulates the ocean. This is the primary well, and this is a capping stack which for a series of hours will control flow.
This is called a static kill operation because there is no flow of the well. We're going to kill the well by putting mud in it. Mud's density allows us to create pressure on the bottom of the well great enough to stop the flow from the reservoir of hydrocarbons, so the oil and gas.
Go ahead and open the valve. Even when the valve is open, there is no flow. The reason for that is our students have injected drilling mud into the primary well, which increased the weight of the fluid in the well. This increased weight increased the pressure on bottom of this column of fluid and that was enough pressure to overcome the pressure of the reservoir.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: A very simple model to explain what's going on. Of course, actually in the Gulf of Mexico it's on a much larger scale with much larger pressures.
Joining me now to talk about the process, Don Van Nieuwenhuise. He's a professor of petroleum geosciences at the University of Houston. So Don, before any of that takes place, as we said at the very top, we're going to conduct a test there on the well called an injectivity test. What is that and what's that designed to take a look at?
DON VAN NIEUWENHUISE, PROFESSOR, PETROLEUM AND GEOSCIENCE, UNIVERSITY OF HOUSTON: Well, as you saw from the example that was just shown, one of the things that you have is that mud and it pushes down on the pressure that's coming up from the formation. And that's pretty simple to understand.
The more complicated aspect is that you have to push that mud and oil down into the formation and that will seal the formation. So the injectivity part of it is to see that if when they put fluids into that closed systems, the pipe that they have now, the well that's sealed right now, when they put knew fluid in there will it push or inject fluid down into the reservoir and maintain the same pressures.
ROBERTS: Now, when we saw that Louisiana State University demonstration there, there was water flowing up out of the well representing oil. But that was at a very, very low pressure.
When we talk about pressures at the blowout preventer, it is nearly 7,000 pounds per square inch. The question is if you start injecting mud into that whole system, it is going to have to be at higher pressure than right now. So we're above 7,000 pounds per square inch.
And the worry that some people have is, will that well, will that integrity of that well maintain at those higher pressures or could pumping that extra mud in actually damage the wellbore and create an even worse situation than we have now?
NIEUWENHUISE: What they're doing is they're going to be pumping that mud in very slowly so that they don't raise the pressure too much. Of course, it has to be higher pressure than the 6,900 psi, but not much more, so that's not a serious problem.
The issue they're trying to figure out is if they pump additional fluid in there, will the fluid and pressure be transmitted down to the reservoir and inject into the reservoir, because the fluids have to more or less open up the pour throats in the reservoir.
The reservoir is not a cavern. It is a bunch of small spaces between sand grains, and they have to force that oil in what they call pour throats. And that's where there's the friction or hold-up that's actually capillary pressure that's pushing back on it.
ROBERTS: But at this point, Don, you don't see a great danger in the actual well casing itself blowing out from the increase in pressure?
NIEUWENHUISE: As long as they're careful. And that's why they do it slowly so they don't increase the pressure.
Now, if it doesn't inject and pressure just keeps building, they're not going to be able to do this static kill. And that's what they're checking to see if they can actually do it.
ROBERTS: At the same time they go ahead with this static kill operation if the injectivity test indicates they can in fact force that oil back down into the reservoir, they're going ahead with the relief well operation. Bp says sometime between the 11th and the 15th they should have that relief well completed.
And many people might be saying, well, you've got the relief well that's almost finished, why are you even talking about this static kill operation?
NIEUWENHUISE: One reason they want to do the static kill is to make sure they can get control of the pressure early on. It would be convenient to have that pressure under control before they penetrate it. It is not absolutely necessary, but they will have the well pressure under control, if it works, well ahead of the schedule of the relief well.
And that's a good thing, because once they have the mud in, and if the injectivity test works, they get the mud in and control the pressure, they will for all intents and purposes have the pressure and the well under control, and it will basically be in the same condition as any well we're drilling anywhere in the world right now that has not had a blowout.
ROBERTS: And then, of course, the final question is, when it comes to permanently sealing that well, you want to do it with cement and do you do it from the top? You inject the cement from the top or do you inject the cement from the bottom with that relief well, or maybe you do it from both aspects. Where do you think they're going to go with that?
VAN NIEUWENHUISE: Well, it's going to depend on this injectivity test and how well the mud injects into the formation. And one of the concerns I have is that once you have all of the mud in the well, and it starts to seal the formation, it will be harder if you're to look at the animation that BP has presented. It's very hard at that point then to push more mud and cement behind that mud into the formation. The formation cannot receive an infinite amount of mud and cement, and it's critical that they get that cement down near the base and around the formation and seal the pressure at the source and not at the top. And consequently, it seems like it would be much easier for really to do the cement from the top and they could actually vent either into their ship or a little bit into the sea some of that mud as the cement comes in from the bottom.
ROBERTS: And, Don, this question that I have here -- once they get this well killed, everything all sealed up, do they pull up stakes and they move away, or do you think BP will drill another well into that Macondo reservoir?
VAN NIEUWENHUISE: I don't know what their plans are. I don't see why they couldn't do it if they decided to do that. Certainly a lot of eyes would be looking on them and making sure that they had good or properly operating blowout preventers and the rest of their equipment was in good shape just like with the relief wells.
ROBERTS: Well, as we've seen, there's a lot of oil down there. So maybe somebody will go after it. Don Van Nieuwenhuise, good to see you this morning. Thanks for explaining it to us. Appreciate your expertise.
Kiran?
CHETRY: All right. Well, still ahead, an Islamic center and mosque two blocks from Ground Zero and the debate over whether to build it continues to divide New Yorkers as well as the nation. How a big vote today could clear the way for construction and what the reaction will be to that.
Seventeen minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Welcome back to the Most News in the Morning. You know, there's a heated debate going on right now over the building of an Islamic cultural center and mosque. Right now, New York City's Landmark Preservation Commission has a vote scheduled for later this morning.
ROBERTS: It's a vote that could decide the fate of a building near Ground Zero that's slated to become an Islamic center and mosque.
Allan Chernoff is live at Pace University this morning just a few blocks from Ground Zero where the commission is going to vote. And, Allan, there's been lots of opposition to the proposed Islamic center, also support from some very prominent people as well. What's at stake today?
Well, obviously, we're having a technical problem with Allan Chernoff. We'll get that kind of sorted out and we'll get back to him just as soon as we can.
CHETRY: All right. Well, let's just see?
ROBERTS: Oops.
CHETRY: Can Allan hear us now? He looks like he hears us now.
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I hear you.
ROBERTS: Oh, good.
CHETRY: All right. Sorry about that. We had a little technical glitch off the top.
ROBERTS: All right.
CHETRY: Go ahead, Allan.
ROBERTS: So let's go back to asking the question. There's a lot of opposition to this, Allan.
CHERNOFF: OK.
ROBERTS: A lot of support from some prominent people as well. What's at stake in all of this?
CHERNOFF: What's actually at stake today is not the actual use of the building but a decision about the exterior of this building itself. Should the landmark commission actually give this billing landmark status? So if the commission does vote to give that landmark status, it protects the exterior of the building the five-story exterior. And so the owners would pretty much be limited to the building itself but it would not decide what they could actually do with the building.
Now, of course, if they vote no, no landmark status, and the owners are free to knock the building down, do whatever they want with the actual parcel. But the bottom line is -- and people need to understand this is that the building in fact already is being used as a prayer space. Today, people will be praying there. Fridays, the most important day, of course, for Muslims in terms of prayer, hundreds of people already come to that building. So the usage is not really an issue here. It's almost certain that there will be an Islamic center at this building, unless the owners change their minds.
CHETRY: You know, and, Allan, then there's the question, of course, about the building itself, about the debate over landmark status. Explain what's going on there and really what difference it would make if it was given landmark status.
CHERNOFF: Right. Well again, the issue regarding landmark status is really just a historical architectural question. This building was constructed in 1858. It's an example of Italian renaissance, palazzo style. But if you look on the exterior, somebody who's maybe not an architectural expert might just walk right by it. There are so many wonderful buildings in New York City. But that's really what's being decided here, does this really merit architectural or historical level of architectural historical merit that it should be a landmark?
ROBERTS: But as you mentioned, either way, they're still going to build the Islamic center.
CHERNOFF: Absolutely. There is no law that can prevent an Islamic center from being constructed. The only thing that can stop that is a decision by the owners of the property to say, you know what? We won't go forward. Maybe we'll do this elsewhere. But that hasn't happened.
CHETRY: No.
CHERNOFF: And they're not planning to do that.
CHETRY: Right. Despite some of the growing calls for this not to be built, including most recently the Anti-Defamation League coming out against it. And of course, as we said, a lot of big proponents of the building of it like Mayor Bloomberg of New York. All right, Allan, let us know how it goes today. Thanks so much.
Well, coming up, he was born in New Mexico, went to college in Colorado, traveled coast to coast, uses the Internet to reach out to people like him. It all sounds normal except that he's a radical cleric hiding out from the Feds. We're going to meet the man security experts call the next bin Laden.
It's 24 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERTS: Coming up now, 27 minutes after the hour. Your top stories just minutes away. But first an "A.M. Original," something that you'll see only on AMERICAN MORNING.
CNN has been investigating the radical fugitive cleric Anwar al- Awlaki. The Feds want him dead and they think he's hiding out somewhere in Yemen.
CHETRY: Yes. He's issued threats on the U.S. and has been linked to several terror plots, but the difference with al-Awlaki is that he's an American. Yesterday, we told you about his early years growing up in New Mexico, his college years in Colorado.
Well, this morning, we bring our Deb Feyerick back and she's tracking the rise of the man that terror experts call the next bin Laden. And you know, a lot of people wondering, he seemed to have a normal upbringing. How did he get to this point?
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, that's the big question. Why does somebody all of a sudden decide to go in a totally different direction? Al-Awlaki is the only known American on a kill list and if the CIA finds him, he is very likely dead. What makes him such a threat is his ability to recruit angry young men looking to get back at the world. And he does it sanctioning the violence under the guise of religion. When you listen to him, unlike Osama bin Laden, for example, you realize that al-Awlaki is very tapped in to the western way of thinking having lived in the U.S. for a dozen years coast to coast. If you need proof, well, his 5,000 Facebook fans will back it up.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANWAR AL-AWLAKI, RADICAL CLERIC: Be careful. Do not (INAUDIBLE) the enemies of Allah.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FEYERICK (voice-over): When Anwar al-Awlaki speaks, he speaks largely to a western audience, inspiring and recruiting young men to join his lone wolf insurgency using the Internet and his American credentials to do so.
(on camera): How dangerous is he considered on a scale of 1 to 10?
SAJJAN GOHEL, ASIA-PACIFIC FOUNDATION: I would say 10.
FEYERICK (voice-over): Counter terror expert Sajjan Gohel calls radical cleric al-Awlaki Osama bin Laden's heir apparent.
GOHEL: Often, United States is seen as a strategic hub for getting the message out. It's a country that has enormous resources and potential for recruitment is large and significant.
FEYERICK: If anyone knows, it is al-Awlaki. Born in America, he spent his teen years in Yemen before returning to the U.S. at the age of 19 to study engineering at Colorado State University. Though studying engineering, al-Awlaki soon realized a talent for preaching at a mosque near campus where Mumtaz Hussain remembers him as a pious young man.
MUMTAZ HUSSAIN, ISLAMIC CENTER OF FORT COLLINS, COLORADO: He gave few sermons. It was long time ago. But they were really good.
AL-AWLAKI: This is what America refuses --
FEYERICK: Good enough, that without any formal training, al-Awlaki found himself preaching at the Denver Islamic Society. He began recording CDs on Islam and the prophets. Book seller Mohammad Noorzai (ph) says they were best sellers appealing to young Muslims.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They are thirsty for knowledge. And he comes across in a very simple way, you know, to explain to you what Islam is all about.
FEYERICK: From Denver, al-Awlaki moved to San Diego in 1996 when his new wife.
(on camera): Al-Awlaki was finding his voice and building a reputation as an imam when he became a spiritual adviser to this mosque on the edge of San Diego. His sermons were usually in English.
LINCOLN HIGGIE III, FORMER AL-AWLAKI NEIGHBOR: Very friendly, outgoing.
FEYERICK (voice-over): His neighbor, Lincoln Higgie, says they enjoyed talking about things like the orient and Taj Mahal.
HIGGIE III: He loved to go albacore fishing and I love albacore. And he found that out. And his wife was a good cook and so every so often he would bring me some albacore fillets that his wife had cooked up.
FEYERICK: Al-Awlaki was also pursuing a masters in educational leadership at San Diego State University.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He spent a lot of time going through it and learning not only the American society but how people think in the society.
FEYERICK: It was in San Diego that al-Awlaki met an associate of this blind cleric imprisoned for plotting to destroy New York City landmarks. It was also there that these potential two 9/11 hijackers attended his mosque.
SAJJAN GOHEL, ASIA-PACIFIC FOUNDATION: It is too much of a coincidence that the successor to al Qaeda ideologically was also connected to two of the individuals that planned the worst terrorist attacks we've ever seen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, it's not going to happen to us.
FEYERICK: There's no evidence he knew of the 9/11 plot but al- Awlaki's neighbor remembers his ominous good-bye.
(on camera): August 2001 he comes and he says, we're leaving. What was the conversation?
HIGGIE: He said "I'm going back to Virginia." He said, "shortly after that I'll be going back to Yemen." I said well, I said "I do hope you'll be coming back to San Diego soon. He says, "no, I won't be coming back." He said in a little while he said you'll understand why.
FEYERICK (voice-over): Traveling cross-country, al-Awlaki became a prominent imam in a mosque in Falls Church, Virginia. One of the hijackers followed him there, another would soon join. He said about pursuing a Ph.D. in human resources at George Washington University.
LT. COL. ANTHONY SHAFFER, CENTER FOR ADVANCED DEFENSE STUDIES: What makes him most scary, he's actually adapting best business practices to terrorist process.
FEYERICK: Imam Johari Abdul Malik who arrived at the Falls Church mosque after al-Awlaki left says the radical cleric subverts the faith and preys on its followers.
IMAM JOHARI ABDUL MALIK, DAR AL-HIJRAH ISLAMIC CENTER: If you look at the statistics, most of the people who have been so-called radicalized, they know very little about their religion. They have been mobilized by their passions, by their feelings, by their urges, by their insecurities.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FEYERICK: Now, al-Awlaki appears to know nothing of making bombs or flying planes but counter terrorism experts say his message which has been made in America is his most powerful weapon. He has given hatred a distinctly American voice.
ROBERTS: And even if you do believe in your religion though, you can pervert it to your own purposes depending on what you really believe in this your heart. Right?
FEYERICK: That's exactly right. It is his interpretation, the way he is looking at the Koran and looking at the words of the prophet Mohammed and basically saying, well, yes, it is OK to do this. Every mainstream moderate Muslim that I spoke with, many clerics and scholars and leaders say it is just not there. That's not what Islam is about.
CHETRY: I also thought it was interesting. We made a lot about the fact that he's American and that he grew up, was raised and spent his college years here. How do followers of his radical brand of Islam view the fact that is he an American?
FEYERICK: Well, initially it was a problem. It was problematic because he was and they thought "well, who is this guy? Who is this guy?" But now that he seems to coalesce these young men, he is gaining ground, especially in Yemen and al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, they're sort of claiming him as their own.
ROBERTS: Yes, no shortage of people willing to follow.
FEYERICK: That's exactly right. A lot of danger.
ROBERTS: Deb Feyerick, great series. Thanks so much.
CHETRY: We're crossing the half hour right now. Time for a look at our top stories this morning.
Officials in Pakistan now say that the monsoon caused floods may have killed at least 1,500 people. The historic flooding sparking new fears of disease as well. Raging waters complicating the rescue and recovery efforts. In all, 2.5 million people have been affected by the heavy rains.
ROBERTS: Tropical storm Colin is picking up strength in the Atlantic Ocean but is now expected to miss the Gulf of Mexico as well as the East Coast this weekend. The system's about 945 miles east of the Lesser Antilles this morning. It is packing sustained winds of 40 miles an hour, just barely tropical storm strength. The National Hurricane Center says it is picking up strength.
CHETRY: And also BP hoping that the static kill operation is a go today. An operation that could plug the source of the worst oil spill in history for good. The company still has to perform a crucial test on the well before getting started. BP says it postponed it yesterday because of a small leak.
ROBERTS: The raging drug war along the U.S.-Mexico border is now a greater cause for concern for Arizona sheriff Joe Arpaio. A spokesman for the Maricopa County lawman says Mexican drug lords have put a $1 million bounty on his head.
CHETRY: Also, the threat coming at the same time that an FBI web page quotes a senior agent as saying that violent Mexican drug cartels may be more dangerous than al Qaeda. There's also troubling new evidence of the drug cartel's strength.
You're looking at video right now that officials say is an explosive device being launched at police officers on the streets of Juarez, Mexico. Our Rafael Romo is live at the CNN World headquarters. And Rafael, you got a chance to see that video and talk to people, what is the latest situation there?
RAFAEL ROMO, SENIOR LATIN AMERICAN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kiran, we're beginning to see an escalation in the war between the Mexican government and several powerful drug cartels that are terrorizing the country.
On July 15th, there was an attack using what some believed to be the first car bomb in the city of Ciudad Juarez, located across the border from El Paso, Texas that killed a police officer, a doctor and a civilian.
Now we have video of an attack against federal police forces in the same city. Police officers were shot at by heavily armed men believed to belong to a drug cartel who also threw a grenade at them. Such violent incidents prompted an identified senior FBI agent to compare Mexican drug cartels with al Qaeda. The agent based in El Paso says in an FBI report, "we think al Qaeda is bad but they've got nothing on the cartels."
The FBI later explained their remarks saying that the quote is the opinion of one FBI agent who lives and works on border violence every day. The FBI does not believe the cartels are any more dangerous than al Qaeda but in any case, John and Kiran, a lot of people very concerned about this across the border.
ROBERTS: And then Rafael, what, if anything, do we know about this report of a $1 million contract that's out on Joe Arpaio's head?
ROMO: Well, it happens all the time across the border in Mexico, where public officials there are being threatened almost on a daily basis by the drug cartels. The difficult thing is that you can never tell whether it's a legitimate threat, if you can call a threat legitimate, or just a prank by any of the minor gangs operated in cities like Ciudad Juarez. The other thing is that the drug cartels constantly change the chip, the memory cards in their cell phones and so it makes it very difficult to track and to determine whether the call is coming from Mexico or from the United States and definitely very much an impossibility to really track the cell phone that was used for a threat like that, John.
ROBERTS: Yes, we should mention that the threat was sent by text message. Rafael Romo in Atlanta this morning. Rafael, thanks.
CHETRY: Well, shark week continues on the Discovery Channel, and, unfortunately, on the waters off Cape Cod as well. We're going to be speaking to a shark expert, Andy Dehart, coming up next, about exactly how big a threat this really is and whether or not people need to be worried if they're planning a vacation in Massachusetts this summer.
37 minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's only when you go back and review the images that you see the mouth was actually open. All the shark's eyes were actually open when it was actually right above the water flying through the air.
(MUSIC)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's also interesting within a split second how the sharks are able to reject the decoy. They know almost the moment it touches their teeth that it is not the real food item and will spit out the decoy with a tremendous whoosh of water.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTS: Wow. Those are an ambush.
CHETRY: Yes, those are the type of games you don't really think you want to play with a great white shark.
ROBERTS: No. A pretty amazing look at a great white. The clip part of the Discovery Channel's shark week program. We should mention that was not a real seal, it was a seal decoy that was being towed behind the boat.
CHETRY: Right. Well, some are calling this the summer of the sharks. Great whites have been spotted much closer to shore, on Cape Cod, and in New Jersey and other places actually up and down the East Coast. But it's been forcing some beaches to close. Andy Dehart is a marine biologist and shark advisor for the Discovery Channel. He joins us this morning from Baltimore.
Thanks for being with us.
ANDY DEHART, MARINE BIOLOGIST: Good morning. How are you doing? CHETRY: I know you're not terrified of sharks. I personally am terrified of sharks but it is nice to know that they can tell instantaneously that's not the prey they want and spit it back out. Hopefully if I ever encounter a shark they'll know to spit me out.
But what's been going on in Chatham, Massachusetts, right now, where we've seen in some places five miles of beach closed because of how close these great whites are?
DEHART: Certainly the biggest factor here is we've done a great job of saving our seal populations in that area. We really diminished those seal populations over time and they're making a comeback. As they make a comeback, the great whites that feed on those guys are going to start coming back as well. But it certainly makes people very scared but it is not that scary.
ROBERTS: Andy, you say though that the great whites off the coast of Massachusetts could be a little bit more dangerous to humans who go out there and swim in the water than when they're wintering down in Florida because of the type of food that they're eating? How is that?
DEHART: We know that the great whites change their diet pretty regularly. In the United States, in the winter months, they are more on a fish diet. And then in the summer months when the seal population is out, here on the East Coast, that's when they're more feeding on marine mammals and obviously for us swimming at the beach, if you're around marine mammals, it is kind of best to move on to a different beach.
CHETRY: Right. So bottom line, you are saying we look and act more like seals in the water than we do fish.
DEHART: Generally speaking sharks can tell what their normal prey items are. But we believe that most of the attacks that do happen - attacks are very rare, less than about 100 attacks per year, worldwide. Last year, there were only 61 attacks. But we do believe that these attacks are generally cases of mistaken identity where a shark confuses us with their normal prey.
CHETRY: Right. Well, you have shark week going on in the Discovery Channel right now. And it really fascinates so many people. What is it about this animal that most of us will rarely actually see in person unless we are in an aquarium that has us all so riveted?
DEHART: Well, our fascination with sharks began long before "Jaws." If you look at Polynesian cultures they revered shark gods. But "Jaws" certainly exacerbated that. It built kind of a fear of the unknown. A fear of what might be below us and that plays a large part in our fear of sharks. It is not the sharks themselves per se but the fact that there is an animal there that has been known to attack people in the past and it lives in a world that we can't often see or were not very coordinated in.
ROBERTS: So, let me come back to this idea of, you know, whether or not humans actually are a source of food for a shark like a great white. Obviously we're not their normal prey because we only play in the ocean, we don't live in it. But if we go back to the striking video from the Discovery Channel of the shark going after - this is a seal decoy that's being towed behind a boat.
I mean, if you're a swimmer that's out there in the ocean or if you're a surfer, let's say, or a boogie border, does the shark really care whether you're its normal food or not? You know, if you're putting off a signature that's similar to the prey that it usually goes after, are you fair game, in its mind?
DEHART: Absolutely. The sharks do care. Sharks want a very fatty, very high-calorie animal like a seal. They don't want a bony animal like us. Oftentimes when great whites do attack people there is not a secondary attack. They don't come back to finish off the deed because we're not what they're after.
CHETRY: Got you. And you also say and I mean, it is interesting that we fear sharks so much, technically, they have more to be scared of when it comes to human beings. How many, I think you said 73 million a year, 200,000 sharks a day are killed by humans.
DEHART: That's correct. We have very little to fear from sharks. Enjoy your time at the beach.
But the flipside of that equation is we are killing sharks in alarming rate, 73 million a year, and that's mainly in targeted fisheries for their fins. Their fins are extremely valuable. There's a practice called finning where fishermen bring the sharks on board, cut the fins off the still living shark and the shark is dumped living into the ocean to essentially suffocate.
So we're trying to close that practice through an act called the Shark Conservation Act. That's up for review in the Senate right now in the United States.
ROBERTS: Yes. I mean, no question, that's just an unbelievably inhumane practice.
The Discovery Channel Shark Week episode last night, you talked with the survivors of shark attacks. There was another attack yesterday off of Jacksonville, Florida. One woman was in about three to four feet of water, saw a shark - a small shark that's about three or four feet long, coming right at her. She put her arm out and the shark pretty much shredded her arm.
But you - you've got some pointers for folks this morning on what to do if they find themselves in a situation. There - there is a way to try to avoid being attacked.
DEHART: Certainly.
Well, first and foremost, with all my experience with shark attack victims, I would say, overall, they're very great people. They - they understand that they were in the shark's world. The shark's not really at fault here. It's just wrong place, wrong time, wrong conditions. But there are some things we can avoid. Avoid swimming at dusk and dawn. These are peak shark feeding times. If there's a lot of bait fish in the area, we have to understand that the sharks, they're going to come in and feet on those bait fish. So get out of the - get out of the water. Wait on the beach. Wait for that bait ball to go past. If you're on the West Coast of our country, avoid areas where there's lots of marine mammals like seals and sea lions.
CHETRY: And you also say that if you do encounter a shark, you should not flail, which would be your first reaction, especially if you're scared. You do the backstroke and you said slowly, but also maintain eye contact. Why?
DEHART: Biggest thing is making sure that you know where that shark is. If you can see it, keep your eyes on it because, that way, you're going to know where it's coming from and you can present yourself as a larger target or you can fend yourself off.
Obviously, if you have a bite scenario where the shark has bitten you, whack him slightly. You don't want to jab a shark because more times than not people have actually punched the shark in the mouth, complicating the - the attack quite a bit.
CHETRY: So you're going for the snout, and you're saying go for the snout with your elbow.
DEHART: With the - the palm of your - the butt of your fist, right on the snout. All their sensitive arrays are right there on their snout. That's where they pick up electric current. That's where they smell. If you hit that really hard, they really don't like it and they'll swim off in the opposite direction most of the time.
CHETRY: All right. Now we know what to do.
ROBERTS: Let's hope we never get to put that into practice.
CHETRY: Exactly.
All right. Well, Andy Dehart, marine biologist, shark lover and on the Discovery Channel's shark advisor as well. Thanks so much for being with us this morning.
DEHART: Thank you guys.
ROBERTS: Tropical storm Colin forms in the Atlantic Ocean. Where is it headed? Rob Marciano's got the forecast, coming right up.
Forty-eight minutes after the hour.
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ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Welcome back. I'm Rob Marciano. Here's an update on tropical storm Colin.
Temperatures - or temperatures - wind's at 40 miles an hour right now, moving west northwest at about 23 miles an hour, and it is expected to strengthen just a little bit but possibly not get to hurricane strength.
Here's the forecast from the National Hurricane Center. It does make a bit of a right turn towards Bermuda and potentially towards the Carolinas. At this point, that's still almost a week away, so we'll be watching Colin very, very carefully.
The bigger news state side is, of course, the - the heat. Look at these numbers from yesterday. Do you believe this stuff? One-oh- eight in Wichita; Topeka, you got up to 106; Jackson, Mississippi, 105; and there's a whole slew of other records across much of the mid and Deep South.
Some cooling showers and thunderstorms right now across parts of Chicago. These are not severe, but it's certainly dumping some heavy, heavy rain to slow down your morning commute in and around the Chicago land area and just south of Lake Michigan.
Heat indexes or indices, 105 to 115 in these areas. A lot of pink on the map again today. This is dangerous heat, folks, so just try to take it easy as you head out the door in this area. Well above average in these spots, but temperatures will be cooling somewhat as we get towards the weekend.
That's a quick weather check. AMERICAN MORNING is coming right back.
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ROBERTS: Fifty-five minutes now after the hour. Time for your "A.M. House Call", stories about your health.
It's a well-known fact that high cholesterol can cause a heart attack, but what's not so well known is when physicians should start testing for it.
CHETRY: Yes. A new study says the earlier the better, so we're paging Dr. Gupta this morning to find out more. And Sanjay, as always, we talk about obesity being as prevalent as it is today, about possibly testing our kids for high cholesterol?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I mean, you know, this is where we seem to be headed. A couple of large studies out this summer - I find this stuff fascinating. And for a long time the question has been, OK, we know cholesterol over time, high levels of it, can be problematic. The question has been when should you start testing for it? What do the numbers mean at an earlier age and what specifically can you do about it? That - that's what researchers have been focused on.
This was a pretty large study as specifically following younger people along for 20 years, people between the ages of 18 and 30 to start with and following along for some time, getting their cholesterol levels checked every two years, the question being what does it all mean in the end?
What they did was they did this test called a calcium score test. It's a kind of measure the amount of calcium in the blood vessels leading to your heart. And what they found was that people who had higher LDL levels, that's the bad cholesterol to start off with and those levels stayed high over 20 years, they were six times more likely to have an abnormal amount of calcium in their - in their blood vessels. So it starts off high, stays high from a young age that seems to be problematic.
The magic number there, you can see at the bottom, of optimal LDL, less than 100. That's what you want it to start with, that's where you want it to stay. But, again, you know, a couple of tests now showing, even at an early age, if the cholesterol levels are high, it can be problematic.
Now, if you have a high calcium score, it doesn't mean for sure you're going to have a heart attack. Blood pressure, family history, other factors play a role, but this is one of the first concrete tests to show how early some of these changes start to occur.
ROBERTS: And, Doc, what are the guidelines now? How early do doctors measure their patients' cholesterol levels?
GUPTA: You know, John, this is where it's sort of all over the map, and it's admittedly confusion. And I think the medical establishment probably has to do a better job of conveying what is the standard across organizations. You have three different organizations, for example, the American Heart Association, the Preventive Task Force, the American Academy of Pediatrics and they're going to see different numbers.
Take a look there, the American Heart Association says starting around age 20, if you could check, if it's abnormal at that time, then get checked more frequently. If it's normal, it's going to be five years after that. But the Task Force says 35 years of age for men, 45 for women.
And then take a look at the bottom, American Academy of Pediatrics, between ages 2 and 10, so -
CHETRY: Wow.
GUPTA: -- what is someone to do with this information? I think it comes back to what we're talking about earlier - what do the numbers mean and what can you do about it. The American Academy of Pediatrics has - has been - is raising controversy by saying that even at the age of 8 years old, if the cholesterol levels are abnormal, kids should be started on cholesterol-lowering medications. So that - that's not the same as some of the other organizations in terms of what they recommend.
But I could tell you this that if you have an abnormal cholesterol level at an early age, studies have shown that you're more likely to - to eat healthier, to maybe exercise more, to change your lifestyle a bit. So just simply knowing the number, if it's high can have an impact.
CHETRY: Also, when you're talking about 2- to 10-year-olds or - or the young kids, I mean, it really is linked to obesity at that point, right? I mean, if you're an obese child, you're more likely to have a high cholesterol.
GUPTA: That - that's true. You certainly are. But, you know, but also keep in mind that there are people who have hereditary problems with their high cholesterol, so you could look, you know, of normal weight and still have high cholesterol levels. And even though you're not obese, that still puts you at increased risk for what we're talking about, these high calcium scores and possibly heart disease later on.
ROBERTS: All right, Doc, some good tips this morning and you'll be back next hour to talk about what's better, a low-carb or a low-fat diet. Looking forward to that.
GUPTA: Can I answer that? The age-old question, absolutely.
ROBERTS: All right. Thanks, Doc.
Top stories coming your way right after the break. Stay with us.
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