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Joy Behar Page
Interview With Joan Rivers; Interview With Liza Minnelli
Aired September 01, 2010 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOY BEHAR, HOST: Shy, demure, reserved -- three words that don`t come to mind when you think of Joan Rivers. But funny, outrageous, outspoken -- yes.
Joining me now, fabulous Joan Rivers, comedian host of "How Did You Get So Rich?" on TV Land.
JOAN RIVERS, COMEDIAN AND TV HOST: By the way it`s on tomorrow night.
BEHAR: OK.
RIVERS: Wednesday night TV Land, 10:00. Let`s just get that out of the way.
BEHAR: Get it out of the way. Yes.
RIVERS: Because that`s sitting out there in the tape (ph) in my car.
BEHAR: OK.
You`re always around rich people, it seems.
RIVERS: Well, New York, there`s so many rich people.
BEHAR: There are a lot of rich people.
RIVERS: And that`s how the show started. How many times do you go past -- how did they get so rich?
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: So I said let`s do a show and find out.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: And people have the weirdest ways of getting rich.
BEHAR: You`ll tell it on the show, right?
RIVERS: On the show we keep visiting people. We see how they got so rich, how they made it, and then what they do with the money. And that`s just as fascinating.
BEHAR: So like somebody like Bill Gates, was he poor?
RIVERS: No, he`s rich -- he was from a rich family. I deal with people that had no money. People who think they come into the country literally --
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: -- one man had 63 cents in his pocket and now he`s a billionaire. One man --
BEHAR: Wow, what did he do?
RIVERS: He got rich -- he`s Preston Bailey, he`s the world`s largest florist now. He does like the Saudi Arabian weddings where they get married in a football field and builds a crystal cathedral over.
BEHAR: Wow.
RIVERS: And lives -- with all this -- lives in a one -- in a studio apartment --
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: Studio apartment, which but takes $300,000 vacations. People spend their money differently.
BEHAR: He lives in a studio apartment? Why? Did you find out why?
RIVERS: Yes, of course -- Joy.
BEHAR: I know, how could I even think that?
RIVERS: He said he`s around such affluence all the time. He said I like to come home and just get back to my roots. And it`s a beautiful one room, but it`s very simple. And we show it and it`s lovely but he just said I want a simplified life.
BEHAR: Have you found that these people are happy that have a lot of money?
RIVERS: Well they all tell you, money doesn`t make you happy. And you know my answer --
BEHAR: That`s a bunch of baloney.
RIVERS: Give it to me.
BEHAR: Exactly.
RIVERS: And I say, give it to me you S.O.B., I`ll sit in a big house and cry and you can watch me.
BEHAR: Right, but you can be happy if you`re poor too, can`t you?
RIVERS: No.
BEHAR: No.
RIVERS: Of course you can be happy if you`re poor.
BEHAR: Well, you used to be able to be happy if you were poor but not anymore.
RIVERS: I think at a certain age, it isn`t so much fun. You know what I mean?
BEHAR: Oh, no.
RIVERS: I don`t want to at this age have to beg a plastic surgeon. I want to be able to say, how much? That much? Fine.
BEHAR: Do these people give their money to charity at all?
RIVERS: Very charitable.
BEHAR: They are?
RIVERS: First generation money.
BEHAR: First of all, it`s a tax deduction.
RIVERS: Yes but more than that, I think when you`ve been that poor as all of them have been. The guy that invented the --
BEHAR: -- the clapper.
RIVERS: Yes, yes, the clapper. Beyond rich and he lived and was supported by the city of Chicago. You know what I mean? It was on that kind of a thing.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: Very charitable.
BEHAR: I never understand how someone comes up with this idea, let`s say the clapper.
RIVERS: The clapper.
BEHAR: And what does he do to make it happen? To make all the money? That`s what --
RIVERS: They all believed in the idea. And to the point -- well, you know in our business, if you didn`t think you were funny to start, nobody was going to. So these people, who was it -- the man that does Paul Mitchell products?
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: John, he said to me, he used to sell encyclopedias door to door. He said I would get 100 rejections before I got a sale. He said I just said to myself, you`re going to get 100 no`s before you get a yes.
BEHAR: Wow that`s perseverance which is what you have to have in our business, for sure.
RIVERS: Yes, in our business.
BEHAR: For sure -- now the first episode is with Donald Trump.
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: What did you learn from him that we didn`t already know?
RIVERS: Well, first of all, the father, poor as they came. Smart. After World War II, Donald`s father went around and rang doorbells because the GI`s were buying cars. So he would ring a doorbell and say $16, I`ll build you a garage.
BEHAR: Really?
RIVERS: He was building garages for $16. This is how the Trump empire started. And then he was doing well, and then Donald came along and the drive to take that and do -- well, I learned so much from him.
BEHAR: Donald, yes, he`s a smart guy.
RIVERS: Smart, smart, smart.
BEHAR: Now, have you ever dated a guy who isn`t rich?
RIVERS: I`m dating one now.
BEHAR: You have a boyfriend? Tell me everything.
RIVERS: Homeless. Very pure. At the end of the night, he`ll say -- your doorway or mine? That`s sweet.
BEHAR: Oh that`s so sweet.
RIVERS: And, you know, I`ve never seen New York the way I see it when you`re being pushed in a shopping cart. You really --
BEHAR: That particular point of view is so illuminating.
RIVERS: You think.
BEHAR: Now, let`s talk about this documentary about you, which I know is not coming out until what--
RIVERS: It`s June 11th.
BEHAR: And you`ll come back to talk about it.
RIVERS: I beg you.
BEHAR: Yes. I want you back to really talk about it. But I wanted to hit on it because I saw it at the screening --
RIVERS: I got you free tickets.
BEHAR: You did. That was very good of you. Did the homeless guy get them for me?
RIVERS: No, God bless him. You make a joke. You know how nice he is. He has the most beautiful box -- minimalist.
BEHAR: So do I -- but go ahead. Wait a minute. Let`s show a clip of the new documentary.
RIVERS: The new documentary.
BEHAR: The documentary. "Joan Rivers: A Piece Of Work."
RIVERS: June 11th it comes out.
BEHAR: Ok, let`s watch it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RIVERS: I`ll show you fear. That`s fear. If my book ever looked like this, it would mean that nobody wants me, that everything I ever tried to do in life didn`t work, nobody cared and I`ve been totally forgotten.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: I love the music. It`s like -- nothing on the calendar.
RIVERS: That`s my date book, my date book. Men call me up and say how about Tuesday? (INAUDIBLE) How about any day --
BEHAR: Were you having a bad day that day or something?
RIVERS: Well they followed me around -- you know you`re very cruel to me, they followed me around.
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: They followed me around for a year and a half. So they get you know, premenstrual.
BEHAR: Yes, right.
RIVERS: Is she buying it?
BEHAR: Are they buying it? But I mean it made it look like you were so -- like you had to have something to do.
RIVERS: Yes. Yes, don`t you want -- I love the business. If my book had nothing in it, I wouldn`t know what to do.
BEHAR: But you know what, you`re so funny, you`re so talented, you`ll never be with an empty book.
RIVERS: Easy for you to say.
BEHAR: It`s true.
RIVERS: Remember, you have a life. You have a life.
BEHAR: I have a boyfriend.
RIVERS: You have a boyfriend.
BEHAR: That`s true.
RIVERS: I got home at night, I have two dogs and, of course, we are perfect, it`s not the same thing.
BEHAR: I know. I know, you need a boyfriend.
RIVERS: Well, I had one.
BEHAR: What happened?
RIVERS: I was going to say he passed, and I can`t stand when they say he passed.
BEHAR: Did he die?
RIVERS: He died.
BEHAR: But you got another one that didn`t die.
RIVERS: Well, he was dead in bed. It was the same thing.
BEHAR: But no, there was another boyfriend.
RIVERS: Yes, I`ve had three since that guy.
BEHAR: OK.
RIVERS: One rich, one that`s -- only had one leg. I loved him the most. I did. Because there`s more room in the bed, you know what I mean?
BEHAR: There is. It`s much better.
RIVERS: Nobody thinks, you can put your dogs, put your books.
BEHAR: That`s true. That`s a very good point. That`s why Paul McCartney stayed married to Heather Mills.
RIVERS: I got it.
BEHAR: This film maker who made this movie, I was reading that he made a film -- she -- she made a film also about the Rwandan genocide. Is there some connection to you?
RIVERS: I wanted a serious filmmaker. And Annie and Ricky, the filmmakers, they had done one on someone that was electrocuted unjustly, and then they did one on Rwanda. Then they obviously they`ve saw my act and said she`s dying up there, let`s help her.
BEHAR: No, no, come on.
In the next segment, when we come back, I want to talk to you about stand-up, because there`s a scene in this movie. I have to discuss it with you people later. All right, Joanie?
RIVERS: Whatever you want, my angel.
BEHAR: OK, we`re going to come back. Do not leave the seat. We`ll be right back. I have to discuss that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: I`m back with the fabulous Joan Rivers.
Ok, Joan. In the documentary, you`re in Wisconsin, and there`s a lot of gray hair and kind of --
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: They`re a rather conservative group in the audience.
RIVERS: It was very -- we were up Northern Wisconsin.
BEHAR: Ok. And you -- first of all, why did you go there?
RIVERS: Money.
BEHAR: Ok, all right --
RIVERS: And also --
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: I love seeing -- I love to see how beautiful that country was.
BEHAR: Yes, so what?
RIVERS: You`re so New York.
BEHAR: But here`s the thing, I mean, I love Wisconsin, but I`m not going there in the northern part of it.
RIVERS: Yes and cheese. They`ve got cheese.
BEHAR: Oh, get excited. Ok. Wait a minute. So now I have to set the scene for people.
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: You were in -- it was a casino or something I think. Which we`ve both done and we know it`s -- sometimes the audiences are a little slow. But this group, they were laughing, but you did a joke about deafness.
RIVERS: Yes Helen Keller.
BEHAR: A Helen Keller joke, right -- she`s fair game at this point.
RIVERS: And she`s my friend.
BEHAR: Tragedy plus timing is equals comedy.
RIVERS: She had one -- and I said, you want the joke because she has one story.
BEHAR: Yes, exactly.
RIVERS: So I put my hands under the water.
BEHAR: I know.
RIVERS: And it went, whoa, and you will say, Helen I`ve heard this now for 19 years.
BEHAR: Come up with another angle.
RIVERS: For Christ sake, get a different joke, you dumb (EXPLETIVE DELETED). But she can`t hear you, so it`s all right.
BEHAR: She can`t hear you.
So anyway so you do the joke about Helen Keller, something like that, right.
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: And some guy yells out, that`s not funny, I have a deaf son. Well, you laced into this guy. You (EXPLETIVE DELETED). She was out -- out of the --
RIVERS: Yes -- because he was so angry. And you have 2,500 -- 3,000 people there to see the show. And he missed the point.
BEHAR: He did.
RIVERS: -- of comedy which is --
BEHAR: And tell us -- tell us -- tell them what you said to him though.
RIVERS: I said which is true, I said, at the end my mother was deaf. I never do a joke unless I`ve had personal association.
BEHAR: Oh your mother was deaf. Yes.
RIVERS: At the end she lost her hearing. She got -- so don`t tell me about it because I know what that`s like.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: And number two, is if I laugh, I truly believe there`s a comedian -- and you do too, I think, if you make something funny you can deal with it.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: If you don`t talk about it, you`re going to choke. And so I laugh at every -- I laugh at my -- the man with one leg.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: I laugh -- at the end my cousin was blind, I do blind people. When was the last time -- they`re so selfish -- when was the last time a blind person gave you a compliment? When was the last time a blind person said --
BEHAR: That`s great.
RIVERS: Boy, don`t you look good today? Never. So I do it -- now you can deal with this. My cousin used to laugh.
BEHAR: Yes right.
RIVERS: I used to say to her, thank you very much for saying I didn`t lose weight. I also used to say. You have a good view and you don`t appreciate it. She used to laugh.
BEHAR: I mean but the thing about it that`s true is that most comics, I think, like us -- we have, we use comedy as a defense, first of all. And it`s a great defense to use.
RIVERS: And it makes people -- I did jokes right after 9/11. Literally - I was working down the church.
BEHAR: You got into a little trouble for some of that.
RIVERS: And lot of people got offended --
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: And a lot of people said it`s the first time I`ve laughed since 9/11.
BEHAR: Yes, now you went after the wives, didn`t you?
RIVERS: I went after the wives, which turned out to be true. I said there were a couple of wives there that weren`t so upset.
BEHAR: Yes. Well, because they didn`t like their husbands.
RIVERS: A, they got $5 million -- everybody that lost a relative got $5 million.
BEHAR: Really?
RIVERS: Yes and so all of these rich wives now suddenly -- and I said, oh, like it`s not a win-win for some people. And then everybody and I said, next Thanksgiving, look around your table at your relatives. And don`t tell me if it went fast, you wouldn`t think, Uncle Harry, so long.
BEHAR: So when they -- when they criticized you for that, how did you take that?
RIVERS: I said too bad because I was -- because that`s the way I feel. And truly -- and I was getting enough people saying you`re making me laugh.
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: Thank you for making me laugh -- you remember New York, nobody was laughing.
BEHAR: It was very tough after that and very difficult.
RIVERS: Oh and so sad and Melissa lost three friends --
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: -- because they were all middle management stockbrokers in those buildings. That`s where Missy was at that time and her friends.
BEHAR: But do you think that if you`re the -- if the person who lost the person, would you laugh at it, do you think?
RIVERS: I don`t know.
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: I do --
(CROSS TALKING)
BEHAR: But then that`s why -- that`s why you always say, is she here.
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: Because if they`re in the room, you might not do it.
RIVERS: But -- suicide. (INAUDIBLE) destroyed my family with suicide.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: And I did suicide jokes immediately. That`s how I got through it.
BEHAR: Yes. It`s a good defense. It`s great.
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: Ok, now let`s talk about Lindsay Lohan.
RIVERS: Oh, oh -- she has an alcohol problem because the bottle`s empty. I love --
BEHAR: It`s always an issue.
RIVERS: She is doing, did you see the announcement?
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: She`s doing --
BEHAR: Yes, Linda Lovelace.
RIVERS: Linda Lovelace, the announcement and I was like --
BEHAR: Do you think that`s a career move for her to play a porn star like that who did oral sex?
RIVERS: Oral sex -- brought oral sex to our children.
BEHAR: I thought that was -- I thought that was Bill Clinton.
RIVERS: I was going to say long before Bill Clinton did. But --
BEHAR: But I mean, what if Melissa came to you and said Ma, I want to be in a porn movie. Would you let her do it?
RIVERS: I`d say, let me see the contract. Nothing for nothing, don`t you dare unless it`s big bucks.
BEHAR: Now this girl, this Lindsay -- she goes out partying with her mother at 2:00 in the morning.
RIVERS: Yes, I know.
BEHAR: What`s up with that?
RIVERS: Don`t you think -- would you do that with your daughter?
BEHAR: I`m asleep at 11:00.
RIVERS: Well, would you party with your daughter at 7:00?
BEHAR: No, no.
RIVERS: Would you dance on tables with her?
BEHAR: No, she`s embarrassed by everything I do anyway, probably.
RIVERS: Melissa just walks around praying the biggest (INAUDIBLE) she ever had -- when she found out she wasn`t adopted. She cried.
BEHAR: Well you know I was saying that Karl Rove, you know, he found out he was adopted when he was 17. I said, they probably told him that so he`d run away.
RIVERS: Yes exactly.
BEHAR: Right? It`s like, why are you staying here?
Now what about Mother`s Day, isn`t that coming up soon? And what do you do for Mother`s Day?
RIVERS: Well first of all and I think you should be, too, as mothers I think it`s a slap at women. We get a day and pickles get a week.
BEHAR: Really?
RIVERS: This is all really not right.
BEHAR: Oh, I didn`t know that.
RIVERS: What am I doing for Mother`s Day? Well, my -- very little. Mostly I always go on vacation. Last year we went -- have you ever gone swimming with the dolphins? She always takes me on a trip.
BEHAR: No, I`ve never done that.
RIVERS: Oh they`re doing in the bath in the water.
BEHAR: Who, the dolphins?
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: How disgusting.
RIVERS: And you`re swimming and what`s that? And so all -- so this year I`m going to go swimming if it`s dolphins in diapers. I`m not going there.
BEHAR: Ok. Now what`s this I hear you have a new reality show with Melissa?
RIVERS: Yes we`re doing --
BEHAR: Oh, ok, well, sit tight. We`ll come back with -- with more from Joan Rivers.
RIVERS: New season. How long have I know you?
BEHAR: The new season of her show "How Did You Get So Rich" starts tomorrow at 10:00 p.m. on TV Land. But we`re still here with Joanie.
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: So don`t go away. Ok.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: And I`m back with comedy legend Joan Rivers. You know here`s a Twitter question. "You said your approach to comedy is stronger now because you`re angrier. Why are you so angry?"
RIVERS: Because I just think the world is insane. I think what`s going on -- we are living as if we`re in the middle ages. You can`t even walk down 42nd street now. Everyone wants to blow up New York.
BEHAR: I know.
RIVERS: Everybody is angry at Americans and Americans are wonderful people.
BEHAR: Very wonderful.
RIVERS: We are really very nice people.
BEHAR: I know, we saved their ass during World War II. Leave us alone.
RIVERS: And we send money to everybody and then they spit in our face.
BEHAR: Yes, I know.
RIVERS: I`m sick of it.
BEHAR: I am sick of it. You`re angry about the world.
RIVERS: I`m angry at the world, I`m angry about my thighs.
BEHAR: Well that -- we`re always angry about our thighs.
RIVERS: I`m just angry at the cost of a pedicure. I`m angry.
BEHAR: So Joan, we were going to talk about Lynn Redgrave for a minute before we go because -- poor thing --
RIVERS: I loved her.
BEHAR: She was 67 years old, young.
RIVERS: Young.
Well, young, when you`re sitting where I`m sitting everybody looks young at this point. I was very friendly with her in California. We used to have dinner together.
BEHAR: Yes. She`s a doll. She was lovely.
RIVERS: She was darling -- she always said she`s the one they didn`t respect and she was such a good actress.
BEHAR: Right.
RIVERS: Nobody gave her the respect they give Vanessa.
BEHAR: Well, Vanessa -- as you say, it said in the obit, Vanessa was the star --
RIVERS: Yes.
BEHAR: What`s the brother`s name?
RIVERS: The brother is Korin (ph), I think it was.
BEHAR: Korin, Koren, he was the brains.
RIVERS: Right.
BEHAR: And the other one, Lynn was, like --
RIVERS: She was just Lynn -- and she was wonderful.
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: And she used to -- I was very -- remember when she was nursed, the first woman to nurse in public which got me crazy. But it was her choice. The kid was 18. But it was her choice.
BEHAR: She did it in the trailer. In the trailer of a movie and she went bankruptcy suing them because they threw her off the film or something.
RIVERS: Yes. I adore her. Her death is horrible.
BEHAR: You have a sister, don`t you?
RIVERS: I have a sister.
BEHAR: The sibling rivalry thing is interesting. We`re you in a rivalry thing with your sister?
RIVERS: From the time we were born -- do you have a sister?
BEHAR: No, I`m an only child.
RIVERTS: From the time we were born, we both thought, mother loves you better.
BEHAR: So was it worth it to have a sister?
RIVERS: In my case, no. No, it`s great.
BEHAR: You get along with her --
RIVERS: I get along. But we are getting older now, we`re getting closer. Death is so -- I hate when people say -- no one says they died. Three people called me up and said Lynn passed. I said stop passing. That`s the point. They say things like she`s in a better place. I saw her house in Bel-Air. She`s not in a better place.
BEHAR: That`s hilarious.
RIVERS: She`s in a nice place, but did you see her house?
BEHAR: Yes. You know, 70 percent of Americans believe that there`s an afterlife, at least 70 percent.
RIVERS: Yes, but I`m scared. Who are you going to see up there? I know when they say to me, oh, you`re so lucky you`ll see your whole family. I don`t want to see --
BEHAR: I know.
RIVERS: -- Aunt Emily ever again, that old bitch, there`s no way.
BEHAR: My uncle Joe, who loved Mussolini, I need to see him again? Who cares?
RIVERS: Who cares?
BEHAR: But she was a lovely girl.
RIVERS: She was a lovely girl. And somebody else called and said, God -- I don`t want any -- all the nonsense.
BEHAR: Yes.
RIVERS: And all this -- the way they talk. I love the certain things that she passed -- oh, God wanted her. No, no, no, the IRS wanted him. That`s why he jumped --
BEHAR: All right Joanie we have to wrap this up. It`s always a pleasure to sit here and talk.
RIVERS: I love you.
BEHAR: I love you back. And thank you so much for doing this.
I`m wearing your bracelet from QVC. We are plugging everything for you.
Ok. When we come back, the legendary Liza Minnelli will be here.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If you like then you should have put a ring on it. If you like it then you should have put a ring on it, don`t be mad that she wasn`t -
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: Liza Minnelli has an Oscar, an Emmy, a Grammy, and four Tonys. Not only that, she has entertained more gay men than Larry Craig in an airport men`s room.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: That song we just heard was Liza performing Beyonce`s "Single Ladies" from "Sex & The City 2" which opens Thursday. The legendary Liza Minnelli joins me now.
LIZA MINNELLI, SINGER/ACTRESS: Thank you, honey.
BEHAR: Welcome to my show, Liza. I`m so thrilled to have you here. And I have to tell you, you stole that movie with that number.
MINNELLI: Oh, well it wasn`t me. It was a wonderful man called Ron Lewis.
BEHAR: That wasn`t you dancing?
MINNELLI: Well, no. It was because of him. I mean he had the girls looking exactly like me. He tipped his hat to my friend Beyonce, but that number was original. I mean all the things that he did in it that were so hot and sexy.
BEHAR: Yes.
MINNELLI: That`s Ron Lewis.
BEHAR: But you were at the top of your game. I mean you were terrific in that scene.
MINNELLI: Thank you.
BEHAR: Everybody is saying that.
MINNELLI: Thank you.
BEHAR: About how great it is, you know. So was it fun doing this movie?
MINNELLI: Yes!
BEHAR: It was fun?
MINNELLI: It`s great fun. Because, you know, you`re part of something that everybody really likes.
BEHAR: Right.
MINNELLI: You know and that we all watched, whether we admitted it or not.
BEHAR: The movie?
MINNELLI: Yes, we all -- we watched it.
BEHAR: It`s a pleasure, a guilty pleasure.
MINNELLI: Oh, I stayed for the whole movie. I stayed.
BEHAR: I stayed also. I did. I did. Kim Cattrell is very funny in the film.
MINNELLI: She is wonderful.
BEHAR: Yes but was it fun to be in front of the camera? Because you haven`t really made movies lately? Is it fun to do a movie again? Because I know you did a lot of live performance.
MINNELLI: Sure. But I always think like I`m in front of a camera. You know, I think in angles and I think in shots. I guess because of I`m my father`s daughter too.
BEHAR: That`s right. The famous and legendary film director Vincent Minnelli. Vincent Minnelli.
MINNELLI: Vincente Minnelli.
BEHAR: Well he an e at the end of his t.
MINNELLI: I know. Whatever.
BEHAR: Yes whatever. But he was a great movie director of musical comedies.
MINNELLI: He was the only director at MGM that did everything. He did musicals. He did comedies, the long, long trailer. He did, you know, Madam Beauvary.
BEHAR: With Jennifer Jones.
MINNELLI: Yes. He did everything.
BEHAR: You come from an incredible family.
MINNELLI: I do.
BEHAR: I mean between your father and your mother, Jimmy Garland --
MINNELLI: And my grandparents, as far back as I could trace were all in show business.
BEHAR: Really so that`s the whole thing. Knits the genes at this point, isn`t it?
MINNELLI: I guess we`re bred into it, you know. We`re vaudevillians and circus people.
BEHAR: What was the greatest thing about being in that family, do you think?
MINNELLI: The watching.
BEHAR: Watching them perform?
MINNELLI: Yes -- no. Watching how it all worked. Watching like I`m looking now at this set. And I was watching the lighting and this that and the other. And you`re wonderful -- how you`re in control of everything. I just love seeing how things -- how things happen. You know And it keeps everything very in the moment for me.
BEHAR: Have you ever wanted to be a director?
MINNELLI: Well, I kind of worked with Ron Lewis on my own shows.
BEHAR: You do? The live show?
MINNELLI: Oh yes, yes.
BEHAR: But they`re televised like "LIZA WITH A Z." Did you work on that with him as a director too?
MINNELLI: Oh, no, that was Fosse.
BEHAR: Oh, only the best for you.
MINNELLI: No, I think like a camera. I do. I think in close-up and medium shot, at this angle, at that angle. I don`t know. I was bred to I guess, really.
BEHAR: That`s what you were exposed to. I mean that`s a wonderful thing, to be expose to that type of stuff. But in addition to that, you were exposed to your mother -
MINNELLI: Oh yes.
BEHAR: Who was one of the great performers of the 20th century.
MINNELLI: And one of the funniest people I met in my life.
BEHAR: Hilarious, she was very funny when she would be on Johnny Carson or Merv Griffin.
MINNELLI: Oh, please, oh please.
BEHAR: She was really a riot.
MINNELLI: Yes, she was really funny.
BEHAR: Was she the kind of person who was blue? Like her stuff was, you know, like she would do a dirty joke and have everyone cracking?
MINNELLI: Oh she was clever with dirty words, it was witty.
BEHAR: Witty words.
MINNELLI: Yes. It was real wit, which has kind of disappeared now.
BEHAR: Yes.
MINNELLI: And I can`t think of an example. I`ll think of one and tell you later.
BEHAR: OK. Now the other thing about you and your mother is that you`re both gay icons. I mentioned it in my introduction. What do you think that is about? There are very few people in your category, really in the gay community. I can think of Judy Garland, Liza Minnelli, maybe Bette Midler.
MINNELLI: Sure.
BEHAR: I think she is another one.
MINNELLI: Sure.
BEHAR: You know you have Kathy Griffin coming up and Joan Rivers is a gay icon.
MINNELLI: Sure, yes, yes.
BEHAR: But what do you think that is about with you and Judy?
MINNELLI: I think it`s simple. They have good taste.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Well, I agree with that.
MINNELLI: That`s my answer.
BEHAR: I agree with that. It`s not really -- it`s not bragging, it`s just the truth.
MINNELLI: No. They have good taste.
BEHAR: They do have good taste. They know talent and they appreciate talent in the gay community. I noticed that.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: But there must be some other thing because there are many people who have talent.
MINNELLI: You know something? I don`t know, Joy. I honestly don`t know. But I`m grateful.
BEHAR: It is that they identify -- let`s take your mother. Your mother had her ups and downs. She had many difficult years.
MINNELLI: I guess so. I guess you`re right. I think maybe you`re right.
BEHAR: You know something to do with that.
MINNELLI: I honestly -- I honestly don`t know. You would have to ask somebody who is gay. I don`t know.
BEHAR: I have 20 gay guys here. Maybe I should turn around and ask them. Hey Henry! But I think that that`s it. Even for you, you`ve had difficult times in your life, you know. And I think that the gay community identifies with difficult times because they have difficult times.
MINNELLI: Well, you can tell by the press today.
BEHAR: Yes.
MINNELLI: I mean we`ve all been through everything, you know. And people like it when they read about people`s trials and tribulations.
BEHAR: Why do they like it? Is it sadistic or do they identify?
MINNELLI: I think it makes them feel better what they are going through themselves.
BEHAR: That would explain a lot of reality shows.
MINNELLI: I guess so. You know, that`s the way it is. You have to look at what is. And kind of figure out why it is, and then just watch it.
BEHAR: Yes, yes.
MINNELLI: You know.
BEHAR: Right. Now you`re going on tour, I understand, starting June 5th. You`re starting in St. Louis, Missouri.
MINNELLI: Oh yes, yes.
BEHAR: Which is a great town. I`ve been there many times.
MINNELLI: Oh, yes.
BEHAR: It`s a lot of work for you.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s a lot for me. I go on the roads sometimes. It`s exhausting. Why are you doing it?
MINNELLI: I like it!
BEHAR: You like it?
MINNELLI: I like it.
BEHAR: You do.
MINNELLI: Yes, I enjoy it. It`s in my soul.
BEHAR: It`s in your soul, yes. To just get out there and wow them.
MINNELLI: No, it`s a sharing experience. It sounds corny. I don`t know. It`s what I do.
BEHAR: It`s what I do. Right.
MINNELLI: I go out and I learn from Charles Aznavour. There are songs about every experience. You know, I sing a song about a deaf girl who falls in love with a man and she doesn`t know how to talk to him. Things like that. I find -- I find songs about people that don`t have songs written about them.
BEHAR: Well deaf people usually don`t. You`re right.
MINNELLI: No. I have a song about a gay guy.
BEHAR: What`s it called?
MINNELLI: It`s called "What Makes A Man A Man."
BEHAR: That`s nice.
MINNELLI: It`s wonderful. Charles.
BEHAR: Charles Aznavour wrote that?
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: He is great.
MINNELLI: Yes, he is swell.
BEHAR: I once asked Rosemary Clooney the question, you know she passed away a couple of years ago.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: She was a great, great artist in my opinion.
MINNELLI: She was the best.
BEHAR: She should have won 20 Grammies. I don`t know why she did.
MINNELLI: She should have won anything.
BEHAR: I know.
MINNELLI: Anything there was to win she should have won it.
BEHAR: Most brilliant and so touching when she sang. I said to her why do you go on the road. She said it`s what I do, just like what you just said to me.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: It`s what you do. And it`s what we do. We get out there and try to make these people laugh. OK, Liza, stay right there. We`re going to be back with the legendary Liza Minnelli in just a moment. So don`t go away.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AND FEMALE: Money makes the world go around, the world go around money makes the world go around, it makes the world go around it`s all that makes the world go around - that clinking banking sound.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: A great film. I`m back with Liza Minnelli who won an Oscar for her role as Sally Balding in "Cabaret" in 1972. You were a baby. We were all babies in 1972.
MINNELLI: We sure were.
BEHAR: Yes, isn`t it nice that there is a resurgence of older women on television? Look at Betty White. She is 88.
MINNELLI: I know that`s great. Oh, she is wonderful.
BEHAR: Yes.
MINNELLI: Isn`t she wonderful?
BEHAR: She is great. I mean she`s been Joan, you know.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: How old is Joan, 40, 50 now?
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: But you know, I asked you before, what was the best thing about being in a famous family. What was the worst thing? What was hard?
MINNELLI: The lack of privacy. But you learn how`d to deal with it.
BEHAR: How did you deal with it?
MINNELLI: You closed the door. Now it`s hard.
BEHAR: It would be hard now. The paparazzi are everywhere now.
MINNELLI: No, but it`s the machines.
BEHAR: What machines?
MINNELLI: Excuse me?
BEHAR: You mean the Blackberries and things?
MINNELLI: Everything.
BEHAR: Oh, yes, that.
MINNELLI: You look around for cameras and the thing. You know, I find it interesting, but I`m very aware of it all the time. Because I grew up protecting my parents.
BEHAR: Why did you have to protect them? You were the child.
MINNELLI: Because that`s the way it was. You just wanted to. We`re family. You know.
BEHAR: But you were a kid.
MINNELLI: So were we all once. Didn`t you feel responsible when you were a kid?
BEHAR: Are for my parents? Nah, let them hang.
MINNELLI: You`re baiting me something, something I ain`t going to do.
BEHAR: You know, I have to tell you something. And I don`t know if you want to talk about this, but I was at your wedding.
MINNELLI: Which one?
BEHAR: I hope the last one.
MINNELLI: Oh, you bet it was.
BEHAR: I was at that wedding. Everybody in America was at that wedding. Every famous person. There were people I hadn`t seen in 50 years. Jane Wyman.
MINNELLI: I know.
BEHAR: Jane Powell.
MINNELLI: All those poor people.
BEHAR: All the Janes. There was one row, just Janes.
MINNELLI: Yes Janes, I know.
BEHAR: You know?
MINNELLI: And they were so nice to come out for it. And you know something terrible?
BEHAR: Yes?
MINNELLI: I only found out I paid for that.
BEHAR: You paid for that wedding?
MINNELLI: Yes. I only found out about five months ago.
BEHAR: Why? You just got the bill?
MINNELLI: I just found out. No. Because I said to somebody, well, I mean that`s -- I never mention that name again.
BEHAR: We don`t have to say the name.
MINNELLI: Oh, no, no. Ever.
BEHAR: OK.
MINNELLI: And so I said well at least it was pretty. It should be. It cost however much money it cost. I said yes. And they said and you paid for it. I said oh. So what do I have to do today? Thinking OK, I got to go to work because I got the keep working.
BEHAR: So you thought that piece who shall be nameless, you thought he paid for it?
MINNELLI: Oh, sure. I didn`t know.
BEHAR: That was a sneaky thing to do, stick you with the bill. And damn, it was big wedding too.
MINNELLI: No kidding.
BEHAR: It must have cost a fortune. Oh my god. But Elizabeth Taylor was there. What was the story? She lost her shoes or something at the wedding?
MINNELLI: I think she left her shoes at the hotel.
BEHAR: So what was she at the wedding, her slippers?
MINNELLI: No, they went back and got her shoes.
BEHAR: But she was barefoot?
MINNELLI: No, we all waited. You know, it`s Elizabeth.
BEHAR: Elizabeth, oh, yes, queen Elizabeth. And Michael Jackson was -- wasn`t he the best man or an usher there?
MINNELLI: Yes. And I grabbed him.
BEHAR: You were friends with him, right?
MINNELLI: Oh, yes. So I grabbed him when I saw him when I got out of there. And I grabbed him and I said why did you let me marry this idiot? And he said I thought you liked him. You looked so happy. Your dress was so -- I don`t know. Let me go! I said Michael! How could you? He said it`s over. Relax. And then we look at each other and we started to laugh. We really -- then we really started to laugh.
BEHAR: Well, you know, you looked like you were madly in love with him. Or he looked like he was madly in love with you. He threw his tongue down your throat like he was going to kiss your lungs.
MINNELLI: Honey, did you see my face?
BEHAR: Well, you looked a little scared.
MINNELLI: A little scared? I looked like just what you said. What the! I looked like.
BEHAR: I know. Just say wtf. That gets you through everything.
MINNELLI: It was hilarious, well, some of the things I have been through make me laugh so hard when I think back.
BEHAR: You got to laugh.
MINNELLI: Oh my god.
BEHAR: You got to laugh. I mean that`s the thing.
MINNELLI: It is funny. I mean, it`s really funny. Because if you can`t look at it and rewrite it.
BEHAR: Isn`t that what comedy is about?
MINNELLI: Isn`t that what making it through and going forward and surviving is about?
BEHAR: Yes, it is.
MINNELLI: Isn`t that what women are about?
BEHAR: About women in particular.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: Well we have to laugh because we have so much aggravation in the world.
MINNELLI: Agedani (ph)
BEHAR: Did you speak Italian as a kid?
MINNELLI: No.
BEHAR: Your father did?
MINNELLI: No.
BEHAR: Oh nobody really spoke Italian.
MINNELLI: No.
BEHAR: But he was Italian, right?
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: Yes, and mom?
MINNELLI: Irish-French.
BEHAR: Irish-French, uh huh, so you`re a mixed breed.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: Anyway, we were looking at "cabaret" before. And I was thinking, that is one of the great musicals on screen. Along with I think "Chicago" I like of more recent ones, "Chicago." not your father`s were great in his time.
MINNELLI: Yes, yes.
BEHAR: It`s hard to do a musical these days. But they managed to do it in "Chicago." "Dream Girls," turned out well.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: But like "Nine" flopped, "Nine" flopped.
MINNELLI: You have to think from the audience`s point of view, I think. So if I was directing a musical, I would go sit in the theater somewhere and think, OK, if something came on the screen, what would I believe?
BEHAR: Uh huh, right.
MINNELLI: What would hook me and what would I believe?
BEHAR: Right.
MINNELLI: And that`s where you start from. I think.
BEHAR: Yes. Maybe it`s hard to translate that sort of thing on to the screen, which is why your father and Stanley Donen did beautiful work in the old days.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: OK, we`ll be back -
MINNELLI: With Gene Kelly.
BEHAR: With Gene Kelly.
MINNELLI: Yes.
BEHAR: He was a great dancer, right. Who was a better dancer? Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire?
MINNELLI: They were completely different.
BEHAR: I know but if you had to pick, if someone had a gun to your head.
MINNELLI: No, you don`t pick.
BEHAR: Come on.
MINNELLI: They`re completely different.
BEHAR: All right, I like Fred Astaire better, OK, back with more Liza Minnelli after a quick break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEHAR: Liza Minnelli has shared the stage with the greatest entertainers of all time. Charles Aznavour, as she mentioned before, Sammy Davis, Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra, or should I say, they`ve shared the stage with her. I`m back with Liza, that must have been a period -- I really envy that time to be with the rat pack and hang out with Sinatra and Dean and those guys. Tell me something. Give me something.
MINNELLI: It`s like being with the neighbors.
BEHAR: Oh really?
MINNELLI: Well, I grew up with them.
BEHAR: You know, to you it`s nothing because you grew -- to everybody else, we`re like --
MINNELLI: Well they were so nice to me. You know, because I was like the kid. And I had a wonderful time. You know, my drummer, my conductor was there with me. So we would start and after the show we`d go eat with frank then we`d go to sally`s room and we`d, you know, rag on what happened at dinner.
BEHAR: Uh-huh.
MINNELLI: Then, of course, pappy and I would go to our room and -- not our room -- my room and rag on what happened with Sam.
BEHAR: Uh-huh.
MINNELLI: And then we`d go to bed and it was 6:00 in the morning --
BEHAR: Oh boy.
MINNELLI: -- and we`d get up. Now, frank used to like -- uncle Frank -- use the to like to get on a plane, arrive, get to the theater and go from the car to the stage. Sammy and I couldn`t do that.
BEHAR: Why, why not?
MINNELLI: Because we`re vaudevillians. We have to get there, rehearse, two hours, relax, get the makeup on --
BEHAR: Check sound.
MINNELLI: Check sound. Yes, own it.
BEHAR: But not Sinatra. He used to just go right there --
MINNELLI: No. That`s -- is so he did it his way and he was brilliant.
BEHAR: He was brilliant.
MINNELLI: Brilliant. We did it our way, and staging, where he went, we didn`t go.
BEHAR: Uh-huh.
MINNELLI: He went there, we went here and -- you know, we just -- it was fun.
BEHAR: You know, as you`re speaking to me you`re blinding me with your jewels.
MINNELLI: Oh, thank you.
BEHAR: Which happens to be your collection. Is it not? This is very pretty.
MINNELLI: When I had my knee -- I have a new knee. You have to sit still for so long, which I`m not used to.
BEHAR: How long? Months?
MINNELLI: Yes. Couple -- yes. Couple or three months.
BEHAR: Uh-huh.
MINNELLI: So I didn`t have anything to do. So they told me to work with, you know, the balls for the muscles. I thought, while I`m working clay, and then I started just molding things and I started to design stuff.
BEHAR: Those are very pretty.
MINNELLI: I did these and this.
BEHAR: Delightful.
MINNELLI: Again, all the influences that I`ve had. It`s Peruvian influence. It`s, again, my dad. It`s New York City. It`s whatever happens.
BEHAR: It is. It`s beautiful. And I think you`re going to be selling --
MINNELLI: I have a present for you.
BEHAR: You do? You want to give it to me now or later?
MINNELLI: Yes, I do.
(LAUGHTER)
BEHAR: Oh, thank you, that`s beautiful, thank you very much.
MINNELLI: Isn`t that pretty?
BEHAR: Yes. And thank you so much for joining me tonight, Liza do. It`s a pleasure -
MINNELLI: Oh honey.
BEHAR: And a treat to have you here, delightful to have you here. These are good. Love. OK.
MINNELLI: Oh that`s pretty.
BEHAR: Yes now be sure to get tickets for Liza`s upcoming nationwide tour beginning -
MINNELLI: I`ll give to this to you after.
BEHAR: June 5th through December 4th. Also check out the Liza collection debuting on HSN, June 30th and her new album too, "Confessions" is out this September. You are a busy, busy woman. Good night, and good night, Liza. Thank you so much.
MINNELLI: Thanks Joy.
BEHAR: And good night everybody out there.
MINNELLI: Good night everyone.
END
