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Nancy Grace
Ex-Bodyguard Sues Britney Spears
Aired September 09, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Claims of child abuse, erratic behavior, bad parenting and major sexual harassment. It`s not your run-of-the-mill court case, but it`s not your run-of-the-mill suspect. The target of the complaints, music superstar Britney Spears. After an emotional meltdown nearly two years ago, Spears gets her life back on track, her life with her two young boys. She cuts a new album, launches a successful worldwide tour and starts multiple business ventures to secure her and her boys` futures.
Bombshell tonight. Her one-time bodyguard files legal papers claiming she sexually harassed him, repeatedly paraded in front of him naked, semi- dressed and abused her children. So question. Why didn`t he just quit? And if she was abusing her children, why didn`t he call children`s services? Is it all just a big scam to get at Spears`s hard-earned multi- million-dollar empire?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The job of pop princess in America includes being a role model.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t think that she`s ever been, you know, someone that young girls should be looking up to.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it true you`re suing Britney Spears? Do you know how much you`re suing for?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How do you think they`re affected by this?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A former bodyguard is claiming in a lawsuit that Spears sexually harassed him!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And it just gets worse and worse and worse.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s gone on for years.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where`s the party at?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Pop princess drug tests.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s an issue of her driving without a license.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s really going to end up being a detriment to Britney`s career.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, it`ll all play out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you can feel the tension.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can`t talk about it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s about me expressing myself.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thanks a lot, Fernando. Have a great day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, live, Texas. A mom and dad brutally gunned down in cold blood on a warm August afternoon in their own home. Nothing stolen, no sex attack. But then in a dying declaration, Daddy names the killers, the couple`s own 12-year-old girl and her 13-year-old boyfriend. That`s right, feed them, send them to school, raise them the best you can, then they shoot you in the head! Junior predators gun down Mommy and Daddy. Tonight, we want answers!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The girl is just 12.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) my daughter and (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The boy her 13-year-old boyfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Crime scene tape surrounds the small home on Willow (ph) Street, where police found 48-year-old Alan (ph) Nevil bleeding out front.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) surprise me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With his wife, Darlene, shot to death inside, he gave police enough information to make arrests.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`ve taken two people into custody, early teens, a male and a female. And that`s the information we have right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Garcias (ph) live next door.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) boyfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It seems like a nightmare.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Juan (ph) and the wounded man grew up together.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nice person. He cut my yard, I cut his. (INAUDIBLE) you know, went around, watched the house together.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He says the arrested girl was sweet.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) like, when we saw everything, we came over here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For neighbors, it`s all too shocking and too tragic.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anything about this kid that was scary?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, not at all. Nothing that would point to this or anything like this, no.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The suspects will likely be charged as juveniles. At 12 and 13, they are too young to be tried as adults.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Claims of child abuse, erratic behavior, bad parenting and major sexual harassment. Not your run-of-the-mill court case, but not your run-of-the-mill suspect. The target of these complaints, music superstar Britney Spears.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, Britney.
BRITNEY SPEARS, POP SINGER: Hello, everyone.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Britney.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Britney.
SPEARS: Thank you all for coming today.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This latest scandal.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Former bodyguard who says he plans to sue the singer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, Fernando?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She is facing some serious allegations.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you tell us some details about the allegations?
FERNANDO FLORES, FORMER BODYGUARD: No.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know how much you`re suing for?
FLORES: Can`t talk about it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fernando Flores says she`s abusive to her kids.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s amazing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Flores claims he is emotionally scarred by Spears and she sexually harassed him.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) role model.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you feel like there`s a double standard because you`re a man suing a woman?
FLORES: There definitely is a double standard.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t know what`s going on (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That she`s just totally out of control.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) edit it to make yourself (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Out to Mike Walker, senior editor with "The National Enquirer." OK. Funny. I see. You`re reading "Death on the D-List." Thank you, Mike. Put -- put -- put it...
MIKE WALKER, "NATIONAL ENQUIRER": I can`t put it down. This Mike Walker character is fascinating, Nancy.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: Gee, I wonder why you think the Mike Walker in the book is so fascinating, Mike Walker! So Mike, Britney Spears -- you know what? I don`t believe it. I`m just putting it out there at the beginning because this guy, this bodyguard -- why did he wait until he was fired -- my sources say he was fired -- to file this lawsuit?
WALKER: Well, it`s interesting to hear that you don`t believe it for a minute, Nancy, because you are one tough cookie. I`ll tell you how I look at this, OK? If Britney Spears was a child abuser -- and I`m sure you`ve read the voluminous stories, interviews and everything else that we`ve broken on Britney Spears over the years -- if there was even a hint that she was abusive -- I don`t mean in the sense of not strapping the kid into the car seat, but I mean viciously abusive -- we would have known about it. OK, flashing every part of her body to a guy, even acting seductive, that is her MO. Britney Spears to me is, without being insulting to anybody, is -- is literally that sort of trailer park mommy.
GRACE: Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey!
WALKER: In the lawsuit, he says he...
GRACE: Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey!
WALKER: What?
GRACE: Uh-uh.
WALKER: Yes?
GRACE: Uh-uh. You know what?
WALKER: Uh-uh?
GRACE: A lot of people, not only on this show but that are watching this show, may very well live or have lived in a trailer. So just stop the whole trailer park thing. But...
WALKER: That`s right. I come from a background like that. And what I`m saying, I`m not saying that in an insulting way. I`m saying you could say that, if you want to. But in other words, Britney Spears loves her children, OK? She may do things like stick them over here and forget them for five minutes and all of that, as we all do from time to time, but I do not believe that she is an abuser in any sense of the word.
GRACE: Well, here`s what I think, Mike. And I want to hear the whole thing...
WALKER: I just lost my (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: I want to hear everything. OK, are you -- he`s making such outrageous claims about her. And if he was so worried that she was abusing her children, why didn`t he call police? Why didn`t he call DFACS? Why is he waiting until after she fires him to make a complaint?
WALKER: It makes so sense whatsoever. Nancy, if there was even a hint that Britney was abusive or nasty to her children, we would have heard about it. We`ve heard everything. Yes, does she drink around her kids, having sex in the same room? OK, all of those things we`ve heard not just from "The National Enquirer," but from other people who`ve known her, OK? I have heard horrifying stories about how she drinks around the kids. Kevin Federline accused her of having sex in the same room with the children at the Venetian Hotel with a quite well-known TV star some years ago. But her being abusive? Flat-out lie. There is nothing in her records to show that.
GRACE: Hold on. To you, Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer joining us tonight, Mike Walker from "The National Enquirer," Alex Tereszcuk from Radaronline.
To you, Ellie. Look, the husband, the ex, Kevin Federline, put up such a big fight about those children. If he had a whiff that they were being physically abused or mentally tormented...
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right.
GRACE: ... the way that this guy, this former bodyguard is saying, he`d snatch those kids up in a heartbeat. And Ellie, isn`t it true that DFACS, Department of Family and Children`s Services, has been in and out of her home and all those claims have been closed!
JOSTAD: Well, right, Nancy. Both Federline and people connected to Spears claim that DCFS, Department of Children and Family Services there in Los Angeles, thoroughly investigated this, found that these accusations had no merit. They took no action against Britney Spears.
GRACE: OK, Ellie, give me the outline. What are the guy`s charges? And is it true, was he fired, or did he leave on his own?
JOSTAD: Well, that we don`t know, and he doesn`t address it in his lawsuit. He`s alleging...
GRACE: Ellie! Ellie! Ellie!
JOSTAD: Yes?
GRACE: You didn`t just fall off the turnip truck!
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: If he, in this lawsuit, which is -- the papers are voluminous.
JOSTAD: Yes.
GRACE: As Walker just said.
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: Nowhere does he say, I quit I was so disgusted and upset.
JOSTAD: You`re right.
GRACE: What does that mean? He was fired. That`s what I`m deducing.
JOSTAD: Right. Well, and sources connected to Spears say that he was let go in May. It`s not until July 23rd that we`re told that he went to the Department of Children and Family Services. But he`s alleging two things, really here, that he was sexually harassed and that he had intentional infliction of emotional distress because of Britney`s bizarre and disturbing behavior, which includes these allegations of child abuse.
GRACE: OK, tell me what are the claims. What are the sex harassment claims...
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: ... against Britney Spears?
JOSTAD: Well...
GRACE: What does he say happened?
JOSTAD: He...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Ellie, we know Britney Spears has gotten in and out of cars in front of the paparazzi without any underwear on, OK?
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: Maybe we were shocked the first three or four times, OK?
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: What else does he have? What does he -- what`s he putting out there?
JOSTAD: Well, these are the kind of claims that he has here in his lawsuit. He says on one point -- one time, Britney calls him, asks him for some help operating her camera. He says that they`re looking at the camera, trying to figure it out, and her breast becomes exposed and that she makes no effort to cover it in front of him. He says he`s disturbed by that and -- and...
GRACE: Wa-wa-wa-wait!
JOSTAD: Yes.
GRACE: He said he was -- I want to see Jostad`s face, please. He tells the court he`s disturbed and upset...
JOSTAD: He was...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... Britney Spears`s chest?
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: That`s his complaint...
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: ... that he saw her chest?
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: OK, go ahead.
JOSTAD: Right. Well, he also says that on two separate occasions, she comes into the room and she`s wearing a white lace see-through dress, that she purposely dropped her lighter, and then made a point to bend over in front of him and expose her genitals. He says that happened two times. He also said that another time, she summoned him to her room...
GRACE: Well, I want to tell you something, Ellie Jostad. If my boss asked me to help him with his cigarette lighter and bent over without any pants on, let me just say...
JOSTAD: I don`t want to think about it.
GRACE: ... that I would dial 911 immediately, all right?
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: So what did he do?
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: What did he do? Did he quit?
JOSTAD: No, he did not quit. And he also says that at least twice, she summoned him into her room, and when he arrived, she was stark naked. He said at one point, there was this awkward pause. He finally asked her what she wanted, and she said, Could you get me a couple bottles of Sprite?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: We are coming in with breaking news, interrupting our Britney Spears coverage. We are getting information right now that the body of Stacy Wilson, whom we reported on last night, has been discovered. A body was located inside her vehicle, a missing silver Chrysler Sebring. The identification will be made official at the end of the autopsy. The autopsy is scheduled to begin over the weekend.
At this point, they do not suspect foul play, but the investigation goes on. This is the lady we told you about last night who was last seen in a local gas station. Remember, we showed you, with the red hoody, and an acquaintance saw her, then the trail went dead. Cold. There`s the video we showed you last night.
I want you to know Stacy Wilson`s body has just been found in her Chrysler Sebring. As we hear more throughout tonight`s program, I`ll bring it to you. Right now, police are saying they don`t suspect foul play, but autopsy and investigation is pending.
We are taking your calls on the bombshell allegations that Britney Spears not only sexually harassed her bodyguard, but also abused her children. Now, Alex Tereszcuk with Radaronline, joining us out of LA, I`ve read through all the allegations regarding, and I understand them, regarding the children, to be basically two things, that she demanded the belt from her bodyguard and then beat her children with the belt. And number two, they have, apparently, a shellfish allergy. She would intentionally feed them crabmeat to make them vomit?
I don`t believe that. After the big fight she went through to get those children back, to get her life straight, bringing in her father as her conservator over her financial and personal life, I don`t believe it. I can`t see Britney Spears -- maybe she feeds them Cheetos and Milky Ways all night long, but I just don`t see her grabbing the child and beating it to smithereens with a belt or intentionally feeding it shellfish to make it throw up!
ALEXIS TERESZCUK, RADARONLINE.COM: And there`s no way that this would have happened without something -- somebody else finding out. Her children aren`t babies. They both can talk. They are with their father constantly, with Britney`s dad. Somebody would have said something. And as you mentioned, the Department of Children and Family Services did investigate this. They found no merit whatsoever to what he said. It`s just something that (INAUDIBLE) he`s now just filing a suit again, and Britney`s family says he is just trying to get money because she has a lot of money, and he`s mad, and that`s what he`s trying to do with her.
GRACE: Now, how long was he in her employ?
TERESZCUK: Only about four months. He started in February and he was let go in about May or June, and then he filed his first lawsuit in July, and now this one. So the amount of time that he was with her -- he says, you know, he saw repeated instances of this. But I would imagine if somebody saw a parent beating their child, they would immediately have called if not the authorities, at least her dad, who is so involved in her life. I think he`s probably at Britney`s house almost every single day taking care of her. He`s paid to do that. He`s her conservator, and he has a lot of control over here. And he would definitely be looking out for these little kids.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Rhonda in Florida. Hi, Rhonda.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Thank you for taking my call. And I just want to tell you, and this is from the bottom of my heart, I`m being sincere -- thank you for being an advocate for people who cannot talk anymore. And you are blessed for one reason. This is what I believe, is because you help other people. You -- you are an advocate. And of course, you were a victim. You are being blessed now. It came around to you.
GRACE: Thank you. Thank you. You know, you`re right. I look at those twins every day and I think God heard my prayers and answered them ten thousand times over. And I`m thinking about Britney Spears, Rhonda, all she went through to get those children back after her emotional meltdown. I just don`t see her abusing them. What do you think?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t see because (INAUDIBLE) she went through before. I really don`t think that she would have the nerve to do it again. I think he`s -- I think it`s "he said, she said," first of all. And I think he`s an opportunist, a bottom feeder, and he`s just angry because she rejected him. That`s how I feel, that this is -- he found the golden egg. That`s how I feel.
GRACE: You know what? What about it? I want to go back out to Mike Walker. The goose that laid the golden egg -- so this guy only worked for her for four months?
WALKER: That`s right. And you notice that in the lawsuit, Nancy, he mentions about how the children told him all the time that they loved him. Why did we have to read that in a lawsuit, OK? We don`t care about whether they loved him. He`s been there four months and they love him? This guy is really -- Fernando Flores, you disgust me.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The wild allegations against pop star Britney Spears.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, Fernando. Is it true you`re suing Britney Spears?
FLORES: What?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Taking a cue from her hit song, "Toxic," a former bodyguard is claiming in a lawsuit that Spears is just that, toxic.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you know how much you`re suing for?
FLORES: Can`t talk about it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fernando Flores says she`s abusive to her kids and she sexually harassed him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you feel like there`s a double standard because you`re a man suing a woman??
FLORES: No, there definitely is a double standard. But you know, it`ll all play out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. To Melissa in Tennessee. Hi, Melissa.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How are you? How`s your foot?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. Well, it`s still broken. But as I always say, better my foot than my neck. What`s your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, first, thank you to your continuous dedication. It`s so good talking to you again. And thank you...
GRACE: Likewise.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... for your justice. And thank you sharing your life with us, and your twins. And I can`t wait to read your book. I think Nicole Kidman, personally, would be perfect for that role.
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My thing is about Britney Spears, to me, sitting at home, watching the news, reading the magazines, she has -- it seems to us at home, to me at home, she has really tried to do the right thing these last couple years. And it seems like she`s trying to stay clean. She`s trying to be on the up and up. She`s got a conservator looking over her, very touchy situation with the visitation, very -- it just seems like everything is so controlled. And I think if anything out of the ordinary would have happened, as much as she has been, you know, eyed under the paparazzi and so much scrutiny, that something -- you know, something would have came up sooner or been reported. I just think it seems like this guy is really trying to get some money from her and some paparazzi attention.
GRACE: You know what? I agree. I agree with you. And I know that`s a shock for a lot of the viewers. But I don`t believe this. Now, do I believe Britney Spears is walking around her house without her clothes on? Yes, I do. Do I believe she abused her children? No, I really do not.
Let`s go out to Dr. Mwata Dyson, medical expert joining us out of New York at wwwdr -- .drmwatason.com (ph) What do you think, Doctor?
MWATA DYSON, HEALTH AND WELLNESS EXPERT: Close enough, Nancy. Mwata Dyson.
GRACE: Thank you.
DYSON: Yes?
GRACE: Do you think that if she had really beaten these boys with a belt the way this bodyguard says, that it would be evident when their father picked them up for visitation?
DYSON: It would be extremely difficult if there`s no visible signs, Nancy. But if that belt buckle was to break an arm or break a leg, then we could do some X-rays to see if there was any type of damage, either new or old.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The job description of pop princess in America includes being a role model.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t think that she`s ever been -- you know, someone that young girls should be looking up to.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Is it true you`re seeing Britney Spears? Do you know how much you`re suing for?
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: How do you think they`re affected by this?
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A former body guard is claiming in a lawsuit that Spears sexually harassed him.
FERNANDO FLORES, BRITNEY SPEARS` FORMER BODYGUARD: What? No, I can`t about it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And it just gets worse and worse and worse.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It has gone on for years.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where is the party at?
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Pop princess, drug tests.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There is an issue of her driving without a license.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s really going to end up being a detriment to Britney`s career.
FLORES: Yes. It will all play out.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you can feel the tension.
FLORES: I can`t talk about that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s about me expressing myself.
FLORES: Thanks, guys. Got to go. Thanks a lot.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Great. Thanks a lot, Fernando. Have a great day.
FLORES: Likewise.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
NANCY GRACE, HOST: We are taking your calls live. Out to Yolanda in Delaware. Hi, Yolanda.
YOLANDA, CALLER FROM DELAWARE: Hi, how are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
YOLANDA: OK. First I want to thank you. You are the greatest there is. You`re my hero. And --
GRACE: I don`t deserve that. But I`m going to replay that for the children when they turn 13 by the time -- by then they`ll probably hate me for some reason. Thank you. What`s your question, love?
YOLANDA: They are beautiful babies. Beautiful babies. Not enough pictures. And what I want to know is, he`s probably just upset because she didn`t give in. But --
(LAUGHTER)
YOLANDA: But, I mean why are they -- after all this time of being good, keeping everything straight and together and then all of a sudden back on her again?
GRACE: You know, I don`t know. I guess either the allegations are true or he is an opportunist trying to make a quick buck.
Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, felony prosecutor, death penalty qualified Eleanor Odom. Mickey Sherman, criminal defense attorney, author of "How Can You Defend Those People" out of New York. Peter Odom, defense attorney, Atlanta.
What about, Eleanor?
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Really it doesn`t have a true ring to it. Especially the part that followed all of this. He didn`t call the police. He called no one when he allegedly saw children being abused.
If they were that horribly abused he would have reported it and not come up with it in some lawsuit.
GRACE: And another thing, Eleanor, your specialty is crimes on women and children. If Britney Spears had beaten these children with a belt they way this guy claimed she did, wouldn`t there have been evidence and if so - - whoa, whoa, whoa.
Brett. Put up the control room cam. I want to see Liz right now.
Elizabeth, I don`t know what Britney Spears in a leather bikini top has to do with this but please don`t show it again. And you may wipe that -- yes. That one. Take it down. Take it down. Thank you.
Go ahead, Eleanor.
E. ODOM: Well, Nancy, yes. Not only do you have the chance that the children would disclose, say mommy hit me, mommy made me eat something. But also you would expect to see marks.
There is nothing and there is no change in behavior either. You might expect to see behavioral changes them acting out. None of it, Nancy.
GRACE: What about it, Mickey Sherman?
MICKEY SHERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY, AUTHOR OF "HOW CAN YOU DEFEND THOSE PEOPLE?": That`s what the lawsuit is about. The lawsuit is about whether or not she created a hostile work environment. The talking about her being abusive to the kids, that`s a DCF issue.
He`s not going to get any money from her if she was mean to her kids. What he is looking for is money. And I`m not saying that I agree or disagree, but what`s -- you know -- let`s ask that question that`s on everyone`s mind.
Would it be the same attitude, the same joking manner that we all have if it was a man exposing himself to a woman this way? It wouldn`t be. You`d be screaming for him to be hung.
GRACE: Well, part of it, Mickey, is you`re right. There is often a double standard when a man makes this kind of claim because people don`t believe it. And one of the reasons I don`t believe it is because you said it`s not about the claims about the children.
But he throws that in.
SHERMAN: Right.
GRACE: It`s like potluck.
SHERMAN: Right.
GRACE: If I don`t believe him about that claim, then to me --
SHERMAN: It is character assassination window dressing. I totally agree. But that doesn`t necessarily mean --
GRACE: That`s not what I was saying.
SHERMAN: Yes.
GRACE: What I was saying is, you have heard in court many, many times when judges charge the jury, if you disbelieve all or even a portion of a witness`s testimony you are entitled to throw out the entire testimony of that witness.
So if I don`t believe what he is saying, which I consider the most serious charge -- beating her children, Britney Spears beating her children. If I don`t believe that claim that he`s making, why should I believe the rest of it?
What about it, Odom?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, I don`t know why everybody is so quick to dismiss the second half of the lawsuit having to do with child abuse but everyone accepts because -- at face value because we know about Britney Spears.
The first half of the lawsuit, alleging all the sexual behavior. Now maybe it`s true, maybe it`s not true. At least this -- the first half of the lawsuit is we know is true and maybe that lends some credence to the second part and at least let this guy have his day in court.
GRACE: Put him up. You know, you`re so cavalier, Peter Odom.
P. ODOM: I don`t consider myself cavalier at all.
GRACE: Maybe it is true, maybe it`s not true. Then why did you say that? Maybe it`s true, maybe it`s not.
P. ODOM: He got -- at least gets his day in court. And certainly that behavior --
GRACE: You know, that`s not even the issue. I don`t know what you`re talking about. Of course he gets his day in court. This is America. Of course you can go to court whether you`ve got a claim or not. Nobody said he`s not having a day in court.
P. ODOM: Nancy, I think the second part of the lawsuit is the part that people don`t want to believe and so they dismiss it. The first part is the part that we know is true about Britney Spears and so people accept it.
GRACE: I`m not accepting anything this guy says because if he is lying or fabricating about one part of it, why should I believe the rest of it?
What about it? Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Dealbreakers," weigh in.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": I am very concerned that he says that the children told him that they loved him. That seems so exaggerated. And if they were being abused he should have called 911.
I think what he did is he is preying on Britney because of her psychological vulnerabilities. The things that she was hospitalized for which I understand might have been bipolar illness does cause poor judgment and irritability and hypersexuality and all those things that he`s naming in the lawsuit.
But I think that he targeted her and he`s trying to humiliate her and to take money off of her for those things that he is so offended at the sight of a naked woman, then why go work in the most intimate of settings, a person`s home and a pop princess who has been hospitalized for drug abuse and bipolar illness?
GRACE: And another thing, Bethany?
MARSHALL: That is what where this person should be.
GRACE: Bethany, if he is offended by Britney Spears being naked, I mean -- the entire country has seen everything Britney Spears has to show. Remember when she was flashing everybody without her underwear on?
OK. We`ve seen it. What did he think was going to happen when he goes into the home?
MARSHALL: There`s only one reason that a man would be traumatized at the sight of a naked woman. That is if he has a history of sexual abuse and trauma in his own life. And if he has that, that`s not her fault. That`s his history. That`s not her problem.
GRACE: To Paul Penzone, VP of Prevention Programs, Childhelp.org, former sergeant with Phoenix PD.
Paul, is there any way to prove what he is saying happened really happened?
PAUL PENZONE, DIRECT OF PREVENTION PROGRAMS, CHILDHELP.ORG, FMR. SERGEANT, PHOENIX PD: Absolutely. And I think you can separate the two issues as some of the other, you know, guests have stated.
His allegations, if you are going to work in an intimate setting with a person of that stature, in that type of background, you know that you`re going to be exposed to those types of things.
He doesn`t really work for her, from what I understand. I think he works for the company where she -- he was hired to act in that setting. He can report that to his direct employer.
Now on the child side is where I`m concerned.
GRACE: Me, too.
PENZONE: But those things can easily be investigated. You`re going to go to other people that have worked for her, have been in that setting, and see if any of those statements are consistent. The children do have to come first but you can alleviate that without going direct to the children initially.
GRACE: To Mike Walker, senior editor with the "National Enquirer."
Mike, why do you think he was fired? First of all, do you believe he was fired or did he quit? And second, if he was fired, do we know why?
MIKE WALKER, SENIOR EDITOR, NATIONAL ENQUIRER: I believe he was fired. First of all in the lawsuit he himself says when he went to his superior and told him about these things the guy said -- you know, and I can see a guy saying this, oh, come on, you know you liked it.
I think this guy just became a big pain in the butt and he was fired because he was a pain. And he seems, just from the way he has couched his lawsuit, with all the stuff about how the children loved him, this guy seems a little cuckoo himself.
And I think that he was let go for reasons --
GRACE: But, you know, Mike Walker --
WALKER: Also, why couldn`t the kids tell Kevin Federline about this abuse?
GRACE: Yes, he certainly sees them.
WALKER: They would have told Kevin.
GRACE: And also if he -- if Federline is with them as much as we`re led to believe he is, he would have seen any bruises or markings on those children.
WALKER: He loves those kids.
GRACE: And another thing, Mike Walker.
WALKER: Kevin loves those kids.
GRACE: If the child -- the children did say to the bodyguard, I love you, I wouldn`t be surprised like you and Bethany Marshall are, because really if you spend time with the child and you love the child, play with it, feed it, take care of it, a child is going to love who takes care of it.
And I would not be surprised if the child said to the bodyguard I love you. That doesn`t shock me at all.
WALKER: It doesn`t shock me either. But if that -- if he cares about things like that, why didn`t he, when he saw this abuse, go and report it to the authorities?
GRACE: Exactly. OK, now I get it.
WALKER: Instead of being fired.
GRACE: Now I get it, Mike Walker. What about it, Alexis Tereszcuk?
ALEXIS TERESZCUK, REPORTER, RADAROLINE.COM: I think that this bodyguard has an ax to grind with Britney. He was obviously knew her past, her history, but wanted the job anyway, and decided to take it. And then it didn`t work out for him so he`s going to try to get money any way that he can. He is not going to stop until he humiliates her.
GRACE: One word to Britney Spears. Britney, if you are walking around the house without your clothes on, if you have another bodyguard, please put on some pants.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The girl is just 12. The boy her 13-year-old boyfriend. Crime scene tape surrounds a small home on Willow Street where police found 38-year-old Alan Nevil bleeding out front. With his wife, Darlene, shot to death inside he gave police enough information to make arrests.
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFICER: We`ve taken to people into custody, early teens, a male and a female. And that`s the information we have right now.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The Garcias live next door.
JUAN GARCIA, NEIGHBOR: This is like a nightmare.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Juan and the wounded man grew up together.
GARCIA: He is a nice person. He used to cut my yard, I cut his, when we, you know, went around, watch the house together.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: He says the arrested girl was sweet.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When we saw everything, we came over here.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The neighbor says it`s all too shocking and too tragic.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Anything about these kids ever scare you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. Not at all. Nothing that would point to this or anything like this. No.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The suspects will likely be charged as juveniles. At 12 and 13, they are too young to be tried as adults.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Mommy and daddy gunned down in their own home on a warm August afternoon. In a dying declaration, daddy tells police the 12-year-old daughter and her 13-year-old little boyfriend are the killers.
Out to Michael Board, WOAI Newsradio. Michael, it`s almost too much to take in. Take it from the start.
MICHAEL BOARD, REPORTER, WOAI NEWSRADIO: This happened earlier this month. There was some sort of a fight between the mother and her 12-year- old daughter. She had come home for lunch.
About 2:00 in the afternoon, there`s some sort of a fight between her, her 12-year-old daughter and her 12-year-old daughter`s 13-year-old boyfriend. Somewhere in there a gun was pulled. She was shot in the head.
We don`t know if the 12-year-old or the 13-year-old pulled the trigger. Police are not releasing that much information. But we -- we know is that the mom was dead, the dad, the stepfather was shot. He crawled through a window trying to escape. The gunman hear. He finally passed out on the lawn. He was taken to a hospital. Died here.
Police releasing very little information about a motive in this shooting. What we know is that there was a rocky relationship between the 12-year-old and her mom. There was a divorce. She had moved to Texas. The 12-year-old thought her mom was too strict.
At one point she had ran away from her mom. So we knew there was troubles there but what exactly happened inside this home to spark a gunfire, we don`t know.
GRACE: Well, another thing, to Robin Schneider, joining us exclusively tonight, a friend of the victim, Darlene Nevil, even if the 12- year-old have been having an argument with the mother, which I have been told happens with every 12-year-old girl and her mother, why shoot the father?
Tell me, Robin, what was going on in that home?
ROBIN SCHNEIDER, FRIEND OF VICTIM, DARLENE NEVIL: At the time I talked to Darlene a few days prior to this shooting. And as they said, it was just basically, you know, a mother/daughter basic argument. Being strict, the daughter not liking the rules, mother grounding, and not like being grounded.
GRACE: Grounded for what reason, Robin?
SCHNEIDER: Just not liking rules. You know, you can`t go out. You have to be home at this time. Little things like that.
GRACE: Rules like you can`t go out. You have to be home at a certain time?
We are taking your calls. But to you, Eleanor Odom, not only are you a felony prosecutor, but you have raised a young lady, now about 21 years old. What is wrong with telling your daughter you can`t go out at age 12? Of course you can`t go out.
E. ODOM: Of course you can`t, Nancy. And I see cases like this all the time. And unfortunately, children do rebel.
GRACE: Didn`t you just see the 14-year-old cheerleader, Alicia Debolt, her mother let her go out at 11:00 at night?
E. ODOM: Exactly.
GRACE: Down -- just down the block to a party. She`s dead.
E. ODOM: I know. And juvenile court also handles these types of cases or they will -- you know, hold the parents accountable and responsible for their children actually leaving the home and not setting rules and also put some of these children on probation through juvenile court to make sure they follow the rules.
And unfortunately, this is a prevalent problem.
GRACE: To the lines, Gina in New York. Hi, Gina.
GINA, CALLER FROM NEW YORK: Yes, hi. Do we know if possibly she was being abused by the stepfather?
GRACE: OK. Out to Michael Board, WOAI Newsradio. You know, when children kill everyone always looks for a reason such as abuse. I have not heard a breath of that alleged in this case. What do you know?
BOARD: No. No abuse. There has never been a call to the house for child protective services. Police have never been out to this house for child abuse.
We know that she did run away. That`s probably why she was grounded. Now, Nancy, the police will not tell you this, but chances are when she ran away she went to be with this 13-year-old boyfriend.
We know she wrote on her MySpace page that she loved this guy more than any boyfriend she had had before.
Nancy, she was 12 years old. How many boyfriends has she had before?
GRACE: You know, I want to go back to Robin Schneider, a dear friend of the murder victim, Darlene Nevil.
Robin, what about this question from Gina? It`s a legitimate question. Was there any claims of abuse by them -- physical or sexual -- on the little girl?
SCHNEIDER: Alan and the daughter had a wonderful relationship. They -- there are pictures that have been posted on Facebook and MySpace that just shows the loving relationship those two have.
GRACE: OK.
SCHNEIDER: I mean, absolutely just caring and this whole thing is just unbelievable. The remarks and accusations that are being made towards this family.
GRACE: You know, to Dr. Bethany Marshall. Very quickly, Bethany, I want to get the rest of the facts out, but when we see, for instance, a mother kill her children or children kill their parents, we immediately look for why? Why?
What aberration could have gone on in the home to cause this? But I think we do that because we can`t accept that happening. We can`t look at our children and think, that could never happen to me. But a lot of times, many times there is no aberration.
Look at the Menendez children. They had everything the world that could ever want.
MARSHALL: That`s right.
GRACE: And they murdered their parents for even more money.
MARSHALL: We want something concrete and tangible like sexual abuse. But I don`t think we`ll find that here. Because what really happens when a child kills a parent most often it`s that the child is really a monster.
And by that I mean has a severe personality disorder like anti-social personality disorder. She wrote on her MySpace page, to her own dad, that she didn`t love him. I used to love you. I don`t anymore. She didn`t want to follow rules. That`s more anti-social.
GRACE: Back to the lawyers, Peter Odom, how is this going to play out in court? Is there any way they`re going to be treated as adults in this jurisdiction?
P. ODOM: No. Not in this jurisdiction, Nancy. The law simply doesn`t allow it. The law is not going to change just for this case. And we may not know much about this proceeding because it`s a juvenile proceeding. Much of it will be sealed, as it should be with children of this age.
GRACE: You`re right about that, Peter. What about it, Mickey?
SHERMAN: I call it bad kid syndrome, evil kid syndrome. I`ve seen the nicest parents have the most evil kids. Like the Menendez kids, no question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED POLICE OFFER: We have taken two people into custody, early teens, a male and a female.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The girl is just 12. The boy, her 13-year-old boyfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The suspects will likely be charged as juveniles. At 12 and 13 they are too young to be tried as adults.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Our to Angel in West Virginia. Hi, Angel.
ANGEL, CALLER FROM WEST VIRGINIA: Hi, Nancy. First of all, may I just say, may God continue to bless you and your beautiful children?
GRACE: Thank you.
ANGEL: My question is, is what do we know about the 13-year-old boy`s family?
GRACE: Good question.
Out to Michael Board, what do we know about the 13-year-old or his family?
BOARD: We don`t know a whole lot about him at all. We know that he is being represented by an ad litem guardian in the course. That means there`s no family stepping up there.
He does not have a private lawyer in this case. That was all determined at a pretrial hearing this week.
GRACE: OK.
BOARD: But really little was known about him.
GRACE: To Dr. Mwata Dyson at www.drmwatadyson.com. Dr. Dyson, if there had been any abuse in the home, isn`t it a teacher`s duty if they suspect to report it?
DR. MWATA DYSON, M.D., HEALTH AND WELLNESS EXPERT: Well, Nancy, you`re right. Normally the teachers or sometimes the coach are the first ones to notice it. But if there`s no physical signs that are there, you know, it becomes extremely hard to determine whether or not the child suffered any physical abuse or damage in the home.
GRACE: Everyone, the tip line, 972-272-TIPS.
Let`s stop and remember Army Specialist Donovan Witham, 20, (INAUDIBLE), Arkansas. Killed, Iraq. Awarded the Bronze Star, Purple Heart. Loved God, outdoors, golf, video games, sports. Making others laugh with a smile that lit up a room.
Leaves behind parents Martha and Richard, sisters Virginia, Jamie and Amber. Fiancee, Julie. Served the Army Reserves.
Donovan Witham, American hero.
Thanks to our guests, but especially to you for being with us tonight. And a special good night from Georgia friends of the show, from Tennessee friends and South Carolina friends, Reverend William Oliver, John, Steve, Melanie, Lydia, Morris, Sandra, Kathy and Martha.
Many of them tonight from Wesley Glen. Wesley Glen, home for the handicapped, receiving the proceeds from my book, "Death on the D-List." They were here to wave to you and thank you for supporting the book.
I`ll see you tomorrow night. 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
