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Jane Velez-Mitchell
Kaine Horman Drops Motion Against Wife; Home Invasion Suspect`s Trial Begins
Aired September 13, 2010 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST (voice-over): Tonight, bizarre new twists and turns in the desperate search for Kyron Horman. Kyron`s stepmother is the last person to see this little boy alive. She`s also accused of hiring a hit man to kill Kyron`s father. Tonight, why in the world is Kyron`s dad dropping charges against his estranged wife?
And Casey Anthony`s attorney lashes out, slamming the lead detectives. This cop claims Casey`s car smelled like a dead body. Tonight Jose Baez and his dream team fires back, claiming if this cop`s nose is that good, maybe he should be in the K-9 unit.
Also, reliving a hellish nightmare. A beautiful family in an exclusive community held hostage and tortured inside their own home. The mother raped and strangled, the two daughters tortured and burned alive. Cops say this affluent family was picked at random. Tonight, the monsters accused of this horrifying crime finally face justice.
Plus, celebrity children out of control. Tonight, new reports say Laurence Fishburne`s daughter Montana wants help, and she`s checking herself in for anger management. Tonight, did anger or mental illness push her into porn?
ISSUES starts now.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, stunning new developments in the Kyron Horman drama. It seems the missing boy`s dad cannot get divorced fast enough. His wife Terri Horman was watching the child when he vanished. Kaine Horman wants to streamline the divorce process in a bad way, so he has dropped the contempt motion against his estranged wife, Terri.
What does this all mean? Could he be holding out on olive branch? And if so, why?
After all, he has publicly said he believes his estranged wife is involved in the disappearance of his precious son. Does Kaine Horman has a secret strategy up his sleeve?
Terri Horman was in charge of Kyron when he vanished from his school four months ago. Kyron`s parents just celebrated their son`s eighth birthday yesterday without him, and it was heart-wrenching. There wasn`t a dry eye in the house. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAINE HORMAN, FATHER OF KYRON: We`re hoping that he sees this and he sees where we are, and he`ll know what we were doing. And hopefully, he can`t wait to get back, to get back to doing this with us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Despite the intense scrutiny, Terri Horman has not been named a suspect in little Kyron`s disappearance. And she`s apparently in no hurry to divorce Kyron`s dad. In fact, Terri wants to put any discussion about property or child custody on ice indefinitely.
I want to know, by speeding up the divorce process, is Kaine setting the stage for a much bigger legal battle for justice for his missing son? This is wild stuff tonight.
I`m taking your calls on this: 1-877-JVM-SAYS. That`s 1-877-586-7297.
Straight out to my fantastic expert panel. But first to investigative reporter Michelle Sigona.
Michelle, what is the very latest?
MICHELLE SIGONA, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: I spoke with the Multnomah County Courthouse earlier today, Jane, and they did confirm to me that Kaine did, in fact, drop that motion against Terri.
Now, that -- that was the motion that she allegedly shared sealed restraining order contents with a man, Michael Cook, whom she allegedly had some sort of sexual relationship, possibly, text messages, sexting going back and forth with that man. That is the specific motion that was dropped.
There are other motions that Kaine Horman will move forward with, and those will be heard at an October 7 hearing. Also...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: That`s the next time they`re going to be in court? The next time they`re going to be in court?
SIGONA: Yes. The next time that they will be on court, Jane, is October 7.
Also I just read right before coming into the studio that the Hormans will be on Oprah this week, later on this week, that she will be profiling this case. So that will possibly be -- it may either be airing or taped this Thursday. So that`s something else to look out for.
Also in this case, Carol and Judy, they are two volunteers that run the Kyron Horman Facebook page. They do an excellent job. There are more than 80,000 fans on that page. If you go there all the time, there`s always new nuggets of information.
They helped to plan yesterday`s birthday party/fund-raiser. And all the money that was raised there yesterday, Jane -- hundreds of people were there -- all go towards the Kyron Horman Foundation to help aid search efforts, buy T-shirts, to help with the wristbands. Anything to help find this child.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. A lot of good information there. I want to get into it in a little bit, what`s going to happen on October 7. If he drops the contempt motion, what is going to happen?
But first I`ve got to ask, why did Kyron`s dad drop his effort to hold Terri in contempt of court? That`s complicated. After Kyron disappeared, he says cops tell him, "Terri [SIC], hey, guess what? Your wife had earlier allegedly tried to hire a hit man to have you killed."
So of course he flees the home with their baby, gets a restraining order against her, which contains his new secret address, and therefore it`s sealed. You`re not allowed to show it to anybody. But Terri allegedly shows that retraining order to one of Kaine`s high school buddies, this guy named Michael Cook right there, whom Terri was allegedly sexting. That`s right, sending X-rated photos of herself on her cell phone soon after her husband leaves the house. Hence the claim that she was in contempt of court.
Now I`ve got to go to Bruce McCain on this. You`re a retired captain with the sheriff`s office investigating Kyron`s disappearance. What is your theory as to why Kaine suddenly decides, "Never mind. I don`t want to go to court and try to hold my wife in contempt of court"?
BRUCE MCCAIN, RETIRED CAPTAIN OF MULTNOMAH COUNTY SHERIFF`S OFFICE: I`m also looking at this as a practicing lawyer here in Portland. And I really think, believe it or not, maybe a little different than your other guests, but I really think this is not going to turn out well for Kaine or the investigators.
This contempt of court is actually going to be nothing more than what`s called remedial sanctions, meaning a monetary fine if that, at all. She would not be going to jail. Terri Horman would make another dramatic court appearance with all the media following her. She`d walk out virtually unscathed. And that`s something Kaine and Desiree do not want to see happen.
There`s another problem here...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK. Let me -- let me get to that, because this is complicated, but it`s really significant. Cops in this case have been criticized for leaking damaging information about this woman with the red hair right here, Terri Horman, to Kyron`s biological mother and dad, Kaine, and using the parents essentially as mouth pieces.
Now most of the shockers in this case have come from Kyron`s parents. Back in July, reporters actually voiced their frustration with the sheriff`s office being so mum.
Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why was your news conference called? We got nothing but history and a reward.
LT. MARY LINDSTRAND, MULTNOMAH COUNTY SHERIFF`S OFFICE: Well, it`s an ongoing investigation, and it is what our press release said it would be: following up on the questions and an update on the case. And we did bring the family in also.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, I`ve got to ask Mike Brooks: if Kyron`s dad had insisted on a contempt hearing, then couldn`t Terri`s lawyers have called the detectives that leaked all this incriminating information about Terri to the stand and grilled them about the missing child case of which she is the focus? Couldn`t that have turned the tables on the cops?
MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, OK. We call it a leak. Are we with just calling them updates that they`re giving to people, the parents of the victim? You know, are these leaks? Maybe not. I mean, I don`t have a problem with that.
You know, if I`m Kaine Horman, Jane, I`d want to get her the farthest away from me, get rid of her, be done with her. And just like Bruce said, it would just be remedial basically a slap on the hand if she was found in contempt. So I don`t think it`s that big of a deal.
Now, because Kaine, look, if I was in his shoes, I`d want to get her out of my life, period. And maybe just put a little -- put this to the side for maybe some bigger and better charges, hopefully in the future against her, if they do find her involved in the case.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Let me go to Vikki Ziegler, family law attorney.
This is the theory, and we got it from Bruce McCain. We were talking to him earlier today. And he said, you know, it`s quite possible that, if they had gone to court with this context of court motion, the detectives who may have told them that, "Hey, your wife allegedly tried to hire a hit man to kill you, and she`s sexting one of your old high-school buddies," that -- that they could have grilled her. Terri`s attorneys could have grilled these detectives about this.
VIKKI ZIEGLER, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: This is what I think is happening. Yes, Jane. Can you hear me?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes.
ZIEGLER: Jane, this is what I think is happening. There`s two different court systems here. We have the criminal court system that`s doing the investigation with Terri Horman regarding Kyron`s disappearance, and then we have the family court.
Remember a restraining order is still under the civil matter. It`s under the family court. I think that Mr. Horman`s team decided to legally prioritize this issue. I don`t think the removal of the restraining order, the contempt charge, is the priority here.
It`s about making sure that this gentleman Cook, Terri Horman, all of these individuals will be -- will be able to testify in the criminal matter if, in fact, charges do come down the pike. I think it was a total legal strategic move, and I hope that it works on his behalf, because at this point she`s not a suspect, as you said. She has not -- there is no charges formally filed.
BROOKS: So what if they got the detectives on the stand? If in fact, there was some possible criminality involved in this case, they`re letting a potential victim, i.e., Kaine Horman, know that there was something going on. So is there a big issue with that? I don`t think so.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I`m just saying, she could start with that and then go into any number of areas surrounding this case. I mean, look, she`s not a suspect or a person of interest. We want to stress that, Casey Jordan, but she is clearly the focus of the investigation and, if you put her in court, you know, it`s a wildcard. You don`t know what the heck is going to happen, Casey.
CASEY JORDAN, CRIMINOLOGIST: Well, absolutely. And what you have to understand also is that everybody believes she`s a person of interest in the disappearance of the child.
But don`t forget the whole issue with why are he left her was because she allegedly hired a landscaper to kill him. He got a new address, took the child and left for his own protection. That new address was part of the sealed address.
She let her new boyfriend take pictures of the document that showed the new address. This is of interest. He doesn`t want her new boyfriend being her next alleged hit man. So at the time it seemed like a really good idea to bring her up on context charges just to put her on notice.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Coming up next, we`re going to talk about what their next courtroom confrontation will be. And oh, there`s so much going on here. Everybody stay right where you are.
More on the desperate search for Kyron. Where are all the leads? What`s happened? Has the case hit a dead end?
We`re taking your calls on this: 1-877-JVM-SAYS, 1-877-586-7297.
Plus, sparks fly in the Casey Anthony case. Tonight, why is Jose Baez bashing the lead detective, saying he should join the K-9 unit?
But first, new reports say Kyron`s dad is dropping charges against his estranged wife. Why?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DESIREE YOUNG, MOTHER OF KYRON: They can`t let him come home. It makes me sick that there`s somebody that horrible in this world that -- that he`s missing his birthday because they`re so selfish that they can`t let him come home. That makes me very angry.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HORMAN: We`re hoping that he sees this and he sees where we are and he`ll know what we`re doing and hopefully he can`t wait to get back to be back to doing this with us.
YOUNG: We`re not going to sit by and pretend like it`s not here and, yes, it`s painful, but I think that it`s important that he sees that we still love him and that we still want him home and that we still want to do everything for him, that he has a chocolate cake to come home to.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Kyron Horman`s heartbroken parents celebrate his eighth birthday without him.
And now Kyron`s dad is trying to end his marriage to Terri Horman as fast as humanly possible. How? By letting Terri off the hook on a contempt of court motion so they won`t be going to court on that.
But Bruce McCain, they are back in court October 7. What are they going to be fighting about on October 7?
MCCAIN: Jane, that actually is the far more important date. October 7, there`s two motions. One of them is Kaine wanted to know where Terri Horman got this money to pay her defense lawyer. But the far more important motion is actually coming from Terri, where she`s now playing offense. And that`s for the motion to abate or motion to set aside the divorce for up to two years while this criminal investigation works its way through.
Terri will be at that one. That`s going to be a far more important motion. That`s October 7. You`re going to hear about where the money came from for her lawyers. And the more critical deal is whether this divorce will be set aside.
The key to that, Jane, is that, if the divorce is set aside for two years, it stops all motion practice. So you won`t have any more of these motions by Kaine trying to harass or annoy Terri and drag her into court.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Kaine isn`t trying to harass or annoy Terri. Kaine is a dad who lost his son and who was told by cops that this woman allegedly tried to hire a hit man to kill him months before his son disappeared.
I mean, that`s not harassment. That`s a guy who -- I can`t believe how calm he is, frankly. I`ve got to tell you -- oh, let me throw that out to Casey Jordan. You`re the criminologist. If I were him, I`d be pulling my hair out in tufts.
JORDAN: Well, I think he has a really good game face, and he is doing what he has to do, which is keeping the faith and keeping hope. And really, this birthday party they had for Kyron is touching. And you think about the fact that so few children are found, but then you hear about these cases like Jaycee Dugard. You think about the Steven Stener`s (ph) of the world. Elizabeth Smart, found after nine months. They have to hold out hope. And him getting emotional is not going to solve anything.
So I think he`s just a very strong, brave individual doing what he has to do to keep Desiree and the rest of the family together.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, you know, Mike Brooks, Casey raises a very important point. In this birthday party and every time they speak vocally, the parents always seem to be behaving as if the child is alive, he`s watching television, that he`s seeing all of this.
Do they know something we don`t know, because we had heard that witnesses had claimed that there were other people seen, perhaps, in that white truck the day that she took Kyron to school?
BROOKS: There`s a good possibility they could know more than what they`re letting on and more than what we know, Jane.
But we`ve also always heard them say, there is no evidence to show that he is dead. So you always have to hold out hope, and why not? And they believe that maybe someone else is holding Kyron. Why not go ahead with the eighth birthday? Why not do what they`re doing and getting in front of the cameras as they always do?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: John, California, your question or thought.
CALLER: Yes, how you doing, Jane? I was wondering, maybe Mr. Horman, by divorcing Terri, he`s protecting his assets from her attorneys if she should be prosecuted in the future, you know, so he`s not paying actually for her defense; for the murder of his son.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, you know, you bring me to my big issue, which is, are they living in limbo? I`ve got to ask this of Vikki Ziegler. I mean, if they can`t get divorced or settle the property or the custody issues with their baby daughter, et cetera, until this case of Kyron Horman is resolved -- and God forbid if Kyron`s case is never resolved -- is this poor man going to live in limbo for the rest of his life?
ZIEGLER: Absolutely not, Jane. And it would be remiss for any judge to put a pause button on a divorce case based upon a possible criminal investigation. This divorce needs to go forward. It needs to be expedited.
Remember, they have a small daughter together. There is going to be custody issues. They have financial issues, property together. Your caller said perhaps debts that may have to be paid out, life insurance. These are all real, live sensitive issues that have to be addressed now. And to wait and have a motion in abatement, or abeyance as we call it, would be silly.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What the heck is going on, Bruce McCain, with the grand jury? And you know, what about all these reports that Terri was upset because her husband had said her 16-year-old son had to leave the house?
MCCAIN: Well, again, Jane, the grand jury has been surprisingly quiet. It`s been watched by the media almost every day here in Multnomah County. The 30-day session has already come and gone. We saw the usual suspects of detectives and school employees but none of the big players. The family wasn`t there. DeDe Spicher, who we haven`t talked about in a while, she hasn`t showed up yet. So right now this investigation seems...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Got to leave it right there. We`re going to stay on top of it. Thank you, panel.
Jose Baez lashes out at the lead detective in the Casey Anthony case. You won`t believe this one.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, a father comes face-to-face with the monster who allegedly slaughtered his wife and two young daughters.
Breaking news. Steven Hayes` long-awaited trial began today. This sicko accused of viciously beating prominent Connecticut doctor William Petit, raping and murdering his wife and savagely setting the couple`s two daughters on fire. He faces the death penalty.
This innocent family was allegedly terrorized and tortured for seven hellish hours by Hayes and another ex-con. Hayes eventually took the doctor`s wife, Jennifer Petit, to the bank and forced her to withdraw 15 grand.
Tonight jurors heard spine-chilling testimony from the two bank employees who helped Jennifer. She bravely, courageously, with shaking hands, told the teller her family was being held hostage. The bank manager called 911. Tragically, the police arrived moments too late to save the three female victims. Was there a 911 blunder? We`re going to talk about that in a moment. You won`t believe it.
Jennifer was dead, 11-year-old Michaela had been sexually assaulted, allegedly by Hayes` accomplice, Joshua Komisarjevsky. She and her sister, 17-year-old Haley, were tied to their beds. The house was drenched in gasoline and set on fire. Both girls died of smoke inhalation.
The father, William, bound and bloody, was the only one who made it out alive.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM PETIT, SURVIVOR OF HOME INVASION: I still turn to ask Jennifer if she remembers the date, but she`s not there. I turn to ask Haley how her French class went and how crew practice was, and she`s not there. I turn to hug K.K. Rosebud and ask her if they finally served something that she likes for lunch and if the boys behaved in gym class that day, but she`s not there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: That man you just heard from has been through sheer, utter hell, unimaginable.
Straight out to my expert panel. I want to begin with Laurie Perez, reporter with WTIC in Hartford, Connecticut.
Laurie, you were in the courtroom today. What a dramatic scene it must have been. Tell us all about this doctor, this courageous doctor, coming face-to-face with the monster who destroyed his family.
LAURIE PEREZ, REPORTER, WTIC: Jane, all of that that he went through, it`s just day one, and all of that came out. It was a very active scene in the courtroom. It was very emotional.
You know, the entire half of the courtroom was packed with members of Dr. Petit`s family and also Jennifer Hawk-Petit`s family, as well. And as soon as we got into that courtroom, you could really feel the anxiety and the nerves, particularly on Dr. Petit, particularly when Steven Hayes walked into the room.
I did notice that Dr. Petit did not spend a lot of time looking in that direction, but, of course, when he first walked in. And it was just, you know, palpable throughout the whole day, was the tension of the room. I think as people anticipate what it is exactly that they`re going to hear.
And really the attorneys, as you mentioned, got right into it, all the details, excruciating and very uncomfortable details coming out.
The defense attorney right off the bat telling the jurors that much of what they were about to see and hear, in his words, would shake them to their inner core. He also told them, we`re going to concede to much of what you hear but not all of it. And he said, you know, that he and the other defense attorneys were, of course, very heartbroken.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Fantastic report, Laurie. More on the other...
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HANNA CHAPMAN, VICTIM`S SISTER: After waiting more than three years, the Petit and Hawk families are ready for this process to finally begin and are hopeful in the end that justice will prevail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: That was the Petit family issuing a statement after court today. Tonight, the trial is finally under way for an ex-con accused of a horrific triple murder. Steven Hayes and an accomplice allegedly broke into the home of a prominent Connecticut doctor, beat him with a bat, tied him up, then raped and murdered his wife and two young daughters.
The Petit family gave this statement today outside the courtroom. You just heard it. The father, Dr. William Petit, is the sole survivor of the attack. He managed to escape after the men set fire to his house. He was in court today and came face-to-face with the man accused of brutally murdering his wife and two daughters, torturing and destroying an entire family.
Michael Christian, you`re a field producer for "In Session"; you were in court. I want to hear from you what it was like when Dr. Petit met eyes with this sicko in court. What did you see?
MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, FIELD PRODUCER, "IN SESSION": Well, you have to remember, Jane, that he`s seen him before. I mean, jury selection in this case took 48 days, and I think Dr. Petit was there for all but four of them. It isn`t like they haven`t encountered each other during this three- year period.
But the Dr. Petit I saw seemed very calm on the surface. There were moments I saw him with his eyes closed and his hand up to his forehead just as if he was thinking. I saw him looking down quite a bit. But there were with other times I saw his foot just kind of frantically tapping away, sort of discharging nervous energy.
I think there`s a dichotomy there, I think he`s trying to be calm. I think he`s trying to put on a good face for everyone. But I think at the same time, obviously, this is an incredibly, incredibly stressful situation for him.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I want to go through very briefly, Laurie, tell us what happened up to the point of the bank, because we`re going to get to the bank in a second. Just tell us the basic nutshell of what these sickos allegedly did.
LAURIE PEREZ, REPORTER, WTIC: Up to the point of the bank?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes.
PEREZ: It it`s alleged that they had broken into the house sometime at around 2:30 in the morning and abducted the entire family. They actually noticed apparently allegedly Mrs. Petit and one with of her daughters at a nearby Stop n Shop grocery store a little bit earlier in the evening, followed, made a plan, followed them home, went to their home, abducted them, tied at least one of them up, if not two. Beat Dr. Petit with a bat. He was sick that day and had been sleeping in a sunroom downstairs. They came up on him unexpectedly, beat him with a bat and threw him in the basement so he was out of the picture for them. Then the rest of the night really kept the two girls and their mother hostage, although it was interesting --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And they raped them.
(CROSSTALK)
PEREZ: And raped -- they sexually assaulted one of the girls and the mother, yes. And then that they -- it was interesting, though, today one of the tellers said that Mrs. Petit said that the --
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to get to that in a second. Hold on a second. My big issue tonight, 911 blunder. Employees from the bank testified today that after realizing Jennifer and her family were in danger, the bank manager immediately called 911.
They forced her to go to the bank and withdraw $15,000. Her hands are shaking and she`s saying, my family is being held hostage. The "New York Post" reports the 911 operator actually placed the bank manager on hold and then said, you need to call the police headquarters directly.
The back-and-forth phone call wasted just enough time so that by the time police arrived at the Petit home the killers had strangled Jennifer and set the house on fire with the girls tied to their beds.
Casey Jordan, blunder?
CASEY JORDAN, CRIMINOLOGIST: This is a tough one, Jane. It`s really too easy to Monday morning quarterback. These guys, if you believe they did it, these are acts of pure evil.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: They are.
JORDAN: You really can`t go and -- but would 20 minutes have made a difference after an entire night of torture this family had gone through?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. It may have made a difference.
JORDAN: When they got there -- Jane when the police got there -- they caught them as they were leaving in the Petit car.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You`re proving my point.
JORDAN: The house was already on fire and the girls were probably already gone due to smoke inhalation. I really don`t want to beat up on the 911 operators here.
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Listen, how many times -- anybody answer this question -- I have called 911 and been put on hold many times in Los Angeles when I lived there, driving down, I`d see some kind of a head-on collision, I call 911. Oh, my God, I don`t know if they play music, but I know I was on hold. Ok?
Michael Christian, just give us a time line. Could it have made a difference?
CHRISTIAN: It could have made a difference. We`ll never know for sure. It didn`t happen.
But I can tell you, Jane, there`s one moment in that 911 call because they played it in court, at least some of it, there was with one moment in that call that would absolutely break your heart. That`s when the bank manager says to the 911 dispatcher about what Mrs. Petit has told them and she says, quote, they told her, meaning Mrs. Petit, they told will her they wouldn`t hurt anybody if she came back with the money. I think she believes them. She said they have been very nice and she knows they`ll leave after she gets back with money.
Well, we all know that didn`t happen; within half an hour of that statement, Mrs. Petit had been raped and strangled.
Irma, Texas, your question or thought.
IRMA, TEXAS (via telephone): Thank you Jane. Please answer this question, somebody. Whatever happened to the mental institutions -- you know these people are walking around on the streets like -- they`re crazy, just living under bridges, they`re all over like bats out of hell. You see them everywhere.
Why can`t they put -- you know, I`m 62 years old. We used to have what they call have forced committed if we think they`re crazy.
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think you`re right. Irma, you make a very good point. These two were both --
(CROSSTALK)
MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Jane, let me tell you where the blunder is. You want to talk about 911 blunder? Ok. Where was the blunder here with the probation and parole system?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely.
BROOKS: These guys have been locked up over 20 times apiece. But the criminal justice system because it was only for burglary for most of the time, they -- even everywhere else around the country burglary is only a property crime.
You know what? That`s a crock. That is a total crock. Look what happened in this case. That`s where the real blunder lies.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I agree with you.
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on one second. 96 hours after one of these creeps had his bracelet removed, his GPS tracking bracelet -- each of these guys have done at least 20 burglaries -- they were in the Petit home; 96 hours after.
BROOKS: There you go.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And let me say something else, Darren Kavinoky. You`re a criminal defense attorney but you`re also an interventionist. I was reading all the research. As soon as I saw the words crystal meth, it all became clear because it`s always about drugs.
DARREN KAVINOKY, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: And it`s -- I was just in a conversation with a retired police sergeant last night about this very issue, about the number of burglaries and property crimes that are really drug crimes.
It breaks my heart to hear this story and as a father it makes me feel like Nancy Grace is a moderate when I hear this. But how long are we as a society going to be alone in this and just tolerate that people are walking around with profound mental illness, addiction, behavioral disorders and we`re just hands-off? We`re not addressing it?
The fact of the matter is, if my finger hurts, my whole hand hurts. These people are hurt fingers. They have to be addressed. We have to wake up and deal with it.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. And Nancy Grace is a crusader for justice. She`s on the good side.
KAVINOKY: I get it.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: When I talk about drugs, what I`m talking about here, Michael Christian -- and you can give us the scoop on this -- these guys basically made a crime pact when they met at a halfway drug house and they have a history of doing crystal meth and cocaine. And one thing I know as a recovering alcoholic myself is that there`s one thing that can destroy all morals and make you capable of incredible evil. And that is drugs. Crystal meth is the big winner on that.
CHRISTIAN: That was particularly true with Steven Hayes, the defendant who`s being tried now. He had been arrested at least 22, 23 times, and pretty much they were all drug-related. They were drug-alerted arrests or petty burglars to get money to buy drugs. Drugs were absolutely the root of Steven Hayes` problem.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I have to tell you we`re going to stay on top of this story. Laurie Perez, are you back in court tomorrow? What can we expect tomorrow -- very briefly?
PEREZ: Well, I think everyone, the big day that everyone is anticipating is the testimony of Dr. Petit, which we understand might happen tomorrow afternoon or Wednesday morning. So we will certainly be there.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok. I`ll tell will you what, ISSUES will cover that. We want to hear from this man. What amazing grace in the face of a horror.
Thank you fantastic panel.
Draped in death -- why did Lady Gag, I call her Lady Gag Me, cover herself in a dead, bloody animal. What does her bloody dress have to say about our twisted culture? That`s right. She`s wearing meat.
Plus, Casey Anthony`s attorneys call out the cops. Tonight, why does Jose Baez think the lead detective should actually join the K-9 unit?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CASEY ANTHONY, ACCUSED OF KILLING DAUGHTER: Come on.
CINDY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF CASEY ANTHONY: Casey, hold on, sweetheart. Settle down, baby.
CASEY ANTHONY: Nobody is letting me speak. You want me to talk then give me three seconds to say something. I`m not in control.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Celebrity offspring turned porn star checks in to an in-patient facility, that in a moment.
But first, tonight`s "Top of the Block."
Last night Lady Gaga picked up eight Video Music Awards, but the singer`s wardrobe totally overshadowed her accomplishments during the MTV VMAs. Gaga wore head-to-toe meat claiming she was sending some sort of message to stand up to what we believe in or pretty soon we`re going to have as much rights as the meat on our bones. What`s she`s talking about?
PETA asks a good question, what`s next, the family cat? As one viewer tweeted to me today, "It`s revolting, she is draped in death." Following the awards the controversial performer sat down with Ellen DeGeneres and told her she means no respect to vegans or vegetarians, but what about respecting the animals?
On her Warner Brothers show, Ellen who is a vegan and eats no meat offered Lady Gaga a better suggestion for the next time. Check this out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ELLEN DEGENERES, TALK SHOW HOST: That`s the skirt and that`s a bikini. This was made for you.
How`s that?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I really hope Lady Gaga takes the tip because right now I am calling her Lady Gag Me. Her cruel stunt makes me sick to my stomach. And you know it`s so sad because I used to be a fan. And that`s tonight "Top of the Block".
Also tonight, breaking news in the Casey Anthony case, moments ago the defense team announced they will hold a 9:00 a.m. news conference tomorrow at the office of -- who else -- Jose Baez. So far, no word on what development could possibly be that urgent to hold a sudden news conference.
Are we going to get a bombshell tomorrow? I think so. This as sparks fly when Casey Anthony`s defense team, the "Dream Team", lashes out at what could become the prosecution`s star witness.
We are just are now finding out what went on behind closed doors during Friday`s deposition where lead detective Yuri Melich was grilled by Casey`s lawyers. They are trying to prove the detective had blinders on; that his sights were set on Casey Anthony as Caylee`s killer from the very start.
Now, this is the same cop who said his two years as a homicide detective made him confident that he smelled death in Casey`s car.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YURI MELICH, LEAD DETECTIVE ON ANTHONY CASE: I actually went to the car to smell what the smell smelled like, briefly just before I came in to the child services (ph), I was a homicide detective for two years at Lawrence County Sheriff`s office.
And in my experience, the smell that I smelled inside that car was the smell of decomposition.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What do Casey`s lawyers have to say about that? They say if his nose is that good, he should transfer to the K-9 unit. Ouch.
Meantime, brace yourself for another giant document dump coming soon. The defense says it`s chockfull of crucial information it claims prosecutors have held back. The new details? Well, here`s a hint. It`s all about vital cell phone pings and new witnesses. But that`s the defense talking. Maybe that`s something to do with that news conference tomorrow morning.
And wait until you hear what John Walsh, the host of "America`s Most Wanted" is saying about this case.
I am taking your calls, 1-877-586-7297.
Straight out to Florida defense attorney Jayne Weintraub who leads off our expert panel. Jayne let`s talk about -- well, this news conference tomorrow. What could it possibly be about?
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, FLORIDA CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it`s either something that they discovered in the depositions that they started, of the lead detective or it will be something that came in the discovery, which I understand was from 2008, that they have been holding on to and not releasing until today.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, it could be --
WEINTRAUB: Or this week.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: -- I would think. We were hearing about the defense saying, well, we`re just getting new information about cell phone pings and new witnesses. You`ve been known to chat with those lawyers down there in Florida. What could those new cell phone pings or witnesses be?
WEINTRAUB: Well, what -- what it could reveal is who was being called and on what telephones. And I think that would be very important for the defense. I have not been privy to what -- what the evidence is, but I do know that it was just given to them after having it since 2008.
And that`s a huge violation of discovery rules, and it just begs the question -- everybody always thinks it`s the defense that`s causing the delay, but it`s the prosecution that has been doling this out in drips and drabs instead of letting them thoroughly prepare as they should, both sides, get ready, go to war and then have your trial.
That`s what it`s about.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right, anybody have -- any predictions about tomorrow`s big news conference which we will cover here tomorrow night on ISSUES is going to be about?
WEINTRAUB: Maybe somebody else is coming aboard.
MIKE BROOKS, HLN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Maybe a new attorney. Yes, possibly.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: No I don`t think it`s -- you think -- they just hired a new attorney just the other day. How many new attorneys can they have?
BROOKS: And who knows -- who know what Baez is going to say.
KAVINOKY: Yes.
BROOKS: First of all, I just want to -- I just want to say I think it was very unprofessional of Mr. Baez to come out and talk about the lead detective like that. I really do.
WEINTRAUB: Oh, my gosh. It was just a flip remark. Come on this lead detective is lying --
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold it, hold it -- hold it.
BROOKS: -- they`ve got a battle --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Come on.
BROOKS: -- they`ve got a battle for the hearts and minds of those prospective jurors.
KAVINOKY: Exactly.
BROOKS: And that`s got to start with these kinds of press conferences. So that --
WEINTRAUB: Mike, one thing I do know --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hey, guys, I have to bring out the big gavel if you all talk over each other. The viewers have told me they don`t like that at all. Ok and then they yell at me. And I don`t want to yell -- I have sign here that, "don`t yell", here. Let me see. Right here, "Try not to yell." Ok, so guys don`t talk over each other all right?
WEINTRAUB: In the deposition --
KAVINOKY: Well, my point.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Go ahead, Darren.
KAVINOKY: My point is simply this, that the battle for the hearts and minds of those prospective jurors started a long time ago. And we`ve got to be mindful that, yes, this is ultimately going to play out in a court of law, but first we`re dealing with the court of public opinion.
And of course this -- this whole bit about the discovery coming out in drips and drabs, this is really troublesome and could bite the prosecution because ultimately as a prosecutor you only want to try a case once. And if they are sandbagging and holding on to evidence and material that was available in 2008, all that does is it paves the road for a successful appeal later.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well --
BROOKS: Right. And Judge Perry is not going to like that at all if, in fact, that is the case. I mean, you can deal with the attorneys, but you don`t want to deal with Judge Perry that`s for sure.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you`re --
(CROSSTALK)
WEINTRAUB: Mike, as a detective, would -- would you ever be blogging about your testimony and your findings and your role in your case?
BROOKS: Of course not.
WEINTRAUB: Would you be blogging about that right now?
BROOKS: Of course not. Of course not.
WEINTRAUB: Oh of course not. So what would you say --
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mike Brooks is objecting -- Mike Brooks is objecting to the fact that Jose Baez said -- reportedly, I didn`t hear it out of his mouth -- but reportedly said, if you -- if you`ve got such a good nose, why don`t you join the K-9 unit? Do you think that`s appropriate, Jayne?
JORDAN: And Jane to be -- Jane, you`ve got -- wait you`ve got to remember that it was Casey`s mother who initially said the back of the car smelled like death. And he isn`t saying anything negative about her and saying she should go join the K-9 unit.
Brooks: Or George.
JORDAN: It really is a low blow to the cops, really unnecessary.
(CROSSTALK)
WEINTRAUB: It was just a flip remark.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It doesn`t sound like Jose Baez. I mean, I`ve talked to him many, many times. And he`s a charming guy. I don`t understand why -- why he would suddenly say something like that. I think it`s because the stress, the stress of this trial, it reminds me of the O.J. Simpson case. Remember how down and dirty that got?
Mike Brooks, you`ve covered it, by -- by the time they went to court they hated each other so much. They we`re talking about each other`s hair and their outfits and knocking each other. Same thing happened with the Michael Jackson case, they draw a line down between the prosecution and the defense because they hated each other so much that if they walked across the line and approached the other`s table, there would be a huge uproar.
BROOKS: No. I think Darren and Jayne you`ll agree, there`s no love lost here between the prosecution and defense team in this case.
WEINTRAUB: Oh, no.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Tonight, from porn set to anger management class. What is going on with Lawrence Fishburne`s daughter? TMZ is reporting the actor`s daughter Montana is checking herself into a mental health facility. TMZ says she will spend 30 days at a southern California that specializes in anger management and mental illness. Vivid entertainment released the first porn flick just last month and she appeared exclusively right here with me on ISSUES.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MONTANA FISHBURNE, LAWRENCE FISHBURNE`S DAUGHTER: I`m interested in sex and the porn world and all of the different things that it has to offer. I mean, I can explore bondage, girl on girl, different guys, everything and get paid for it and have fun.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: We were a little shocked by her interview. Montana is awaiting trial for battery for allegedly beating up her boyfriend`s ex.
Is this just another case of an out of control celebrity offspring? Mike Walters, assignment editor at TMZ joins me now. You just broke this latest story Mike over TMZ. What is the very latest?
MIKE WALTERS, ASSIGNMENT MANAGER, TMZ: Well, you said it, Jane. Montana Fishburne, Lawrence Fishburne`s daughter, checking her into in- patient, 30-day mental health facility. Now we`re told the reason she`s going is because she thinks or at least her lawyers think she has anger management problems along with possibly some behavioral -- something to have to do with the way she grew up, how she acted as a child.
Remember, Lawrence Fishburne is her father and in this case what she is trying to do legally could be possibly to get off from the assault charges she is facing. But I think a lot of people around Lawrence Fishburne think that there`s an issue there because she decided to do porn instead of following in her father`s footsteps.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Well, I`m going to get to that. In fact it`s my big issue?
Is Montana using porn to act out her anger? When I interviewed her there was really just something that didn`t add up about her explanation. My question is, is she using x-rated films to hurt her dad because she`s angry at him?
Here`s what she told me. Check this out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FISHBURNE: This has nothing to do with him. This is my own, you know, goal and aspiration. So --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Have you heard from your dad about this?
FISHBURNE: No.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: What would you say to your dad right now if you could say one thing to your dad about this decision to go into porn?
FISHBURNE: That I love him and I didn`t do it to hurt him.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know, it`s going to hurt him, though. You know that.
FISHBURNE: I understand that, yes.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, well, how do you feel about the fact you`re going to hurt your dad?
FISHBURNE: I feel bad about it but, like I said, I`m not going to let hurting his feelings stop me from living my dream.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Mike, she is a child of divorce. Her dad is remarried, has another child with his new wife. Could she be angry at him and acting out with this whole porn saga?
WALTERS: Well, I think so. I mean, you know, Lawrence Fishburne is a very famous actor and obviously the children of celebrity have a hard time coming up in this world in Hollywood and being as good or trying to live up to their parents.
That being said, Lawrence has acted like he`s very upset at Montana and estranged from her although I can tell you a bunch of his friends, these famous, rich Hollywood types put together a million dollars to try to buy back Montana`s porn footage from Vivid. Of course, at the time it had already been shipped out, the DVDs.
But if you look at that situation he`s got all these rich, you know, celebrity friends but their issue is can their kids actually come up in a world and be as famous as their parents. And that`s a hard thing to do.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: We have to leave it right there. Mike, thank you.
A 19-year-old girl vanishes without a trace and her family prays she will be found alive. Nancy Grace has the very latest next.
You are watching ISSUES on HLN.
END
