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Nancy Grace
Was Natalee`s Mother Just Arrested at Joran`s Prison?
Aired September 16, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing from her high school senior trip, Aruba. Aruban police refuse to make a case against judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot, even after he admits he hid the body. Van Der Sloot kills again! Another girl who meets him at a resort casino found beaten, bloody, neck broken, partially clothed on his hotel room floor. Spine-chilling video of Van Der Sloot with 21-year-old Stephany just before she`s found dead, bloody clothes from the murder found with Van Der Sloot on the run.
After beating her to a pulp, he kicks back with a cup of coffee and a Danish inches from the dead body, blood drenching the crime scene, the floor, the bathroom, the bed, the hallway. DNA under the dead girl`s nails, proving a death, a death match with the hulking Dutchman.
Bombshell tonight. In the last hours, was Natalee Holloway`s mother, Beth Holloway, just arrested in that Peruvian jail, there behind prison walls at Castro Castro, deliberately making her way toward double killer Joran Van Der Sloot, the man America believes murdered her daughter, Natalee?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We start with breaking news.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very tense, very chaotic situation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s been five years.
BETH HOLLOWAY, NATALEE`S MOTHER: You know, the not knowing is the sheer hell.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Natalee Holloway`s mom, Beth Holloway, has reportedly spoken to Joran Van Der Sloot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Joran Van Der Sloot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Joran Van Der Sloot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Joran Van Der Sloot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In person inside the high-security Castro Castro jail.
HOLLOWAY: The knowing, even though it`s difficult, it gives you that ability to have peace and comfort.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did she get in?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re getting really close to Castro Castro.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And just what did Van Der Sloot say to Natalee Holloway`s mother?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He thought he was off the hook.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is where he lives day in and day out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He considered himself as a winner.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s tried to avoid this justice system.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, two beautiful young women suddenly attacked by strangers, acid thrown into their faces, leaving them both scarred with severe burns. Tonight, in a bizarre twist, cops announce they`ve caught the prime suspect in the first acid attack. Perp, the victim herself!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Breaking news about that recent acid victim in Vancouver, Washington.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She is extremely upset.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In time, I`m going to forgive her because if I don`t, then it`s hard to move on with my life.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was self-inflicted. It was a hoax.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They found out that this was self-inflicted by the splash pattern on her face.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s very remorseful. In many ways, this is something that just got bigger than what she expected.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s the biggest -- (INAUDIBLE) last night. It really is the biggest weapon for me to have is to forgive her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My goodness. What would make a young girl do this? What is going on in her mind?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. In the last hours, was Natalee Holloway`s mother, Beth, just arrested behind prison walls at Castro Castro, deliberately making her way toward double killer Joran Van Der Sloot, the man America believes murdered her daughter, Natalee?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Breaking news tonight in the Natalee Holloway case.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Holloway`s mom, Beth Twitty.
HOLLOWAY: We can bring it full circle.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Got inside of Castro Castro prison.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You see dogs running free. You see people in prison.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The prison that holds Joran Van Der Sloot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`ve never been to any place like this before.
HOLLOWAY: It makes me sick.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s one of the most notorious prisons in the world, they say.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Beth Holloway reportedly speaks to Van Der Sloot himself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right there at the prison.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did Beth Holloway get inside?
HOLLOWAY: When I hear Joran talking about her like that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Joran Van Der Sloot says he was with Natalee Holloway when she died.
HOLLOWAY: You know, first you want to come through the TV and I want to kill him.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She got sick and passed out.
HOLLOWAY: (INAUDIBLE) the skin off his face.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Claiming the 18-year-old high school student died suddenly.
HOLLOWAY: I think of the utter disregard he had for Natalee.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Took her body out in a boat and dumped it in the ocean.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Like an old rag.
HOLLOWAY: It`s just despicable.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Victoria Macchi, journalist covering the Joran Van Der Sloot story, joining us out of Peru. Victoria, what happened?
VICTORIA MACCHI, FREELANCE JOURNALIST (via telephone): Nancy, rumors have been flying since this morning in the Van Der Sloot case down here. What we were hearing was that Beth Holloway had actually snuck into Castro Castro and gotten face to face with Joran. We heard this from sources close to Natalee`s mother, as well as Dutch media reports, who reported this incident. The Peruvian media reported it and aired alleged video from this, as well.
But what we`re hearing from judiciary and prison sources down here is that the incident didn`t actually occur. We have to keep in mind that these people have told us before that Joran didn`t have visitors, when we know for a fact that he did. So a lot of confusion as to what exactly happened.
GRACE: We obviously cannot trust the prison officials there at Castro Castro. They have lied to us from the get-go.
Out to Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session." Jean is the one who first got behind prison walls at Castro Castro. What do we know? Number one, was Beth Holloway, Natalee`s mother, at Castro Castro today?
JEAN CASAREZ, "IN SESSION": Let`s look at the facts. Number one, we can confirm that Beth Holloway is in Lima, Peru. We see video from (INAUDIBLE) Americana (ph) that is the hotel van from the hotel I stayed at -- I recognize the van -- pulling up to the front gates of the massive Castro Castro. We see a Dutch reporter there, Peter De Vries. We see a lot of people putting their hands over the camera because they don`t want anyone shown. And we can confirm with you tonight that Beth Holloway has met with Enrique Flores, who is the brother of Stephany Flores, back at that Sheraton hotel.
GRACE: So what does it all mean? Literally, as we go to air, we get the word that Natalee Holloway`s mother, Beth, has been arrested at Castro Castro prison in Peru making her way toward Joran Van Der Sloot, the man many people -- most of America believes murdered her daughter in Aruba?
To Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer. Ellie, what`s happening?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, the things that we`re trying to find out right now is how long was she face to face with Joran Van Der Sloot? There are multiple reports that she did get into that prison. But is this on camera? Did she have a hidden camera with her there? Also, multiple reports coming out of Peru and the Netherlands that she did have a camera with her. So are we going to see this video? What did they talk about? What was his demeanor as he confronted Natalee Holloway`s mother?
GRACE: So Jean Casarez, we know she`s in Peru. We know she`s met with Stephany Tatiana`s family, his latest victim. How could get in to Castro Castro? What was she doing there?
CASAREZ: She would have to be invited in there. It is one of the highest security prisons in the world, Nancy, because I know. I was there. And the video shows that hotel van pulling up. "De Telegraf" is reporting that she met face to face with Joran Van Der Sloot only for a few minutes. He refused to talk, saying, My attorney is not there. "De Telegraf" is saying that she got a small camera into the prison. But Nancy, there are searches of everything you have, a full body scan of your body, to go inside that prison.
GRACE: But there are other ways to get into that prison. We are taking your calls live. We know that people can bribe the guards. We know that Joran Van Der Sloot has been having conjugal visits there at the jail. In other words, women have been coming behind bars and having sex with Joran Van Der Sloot. We saw this party picture just a few days ago of, apparently, a party going down behind prison walls. We know if you want to get to Joran Van Der Sloot, you can.
Out to the lines. Kimberly in Arizona. Hi, Kimberly.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. So obviously, you must have pretty much answered my question regarding how she got past the guards.
GRACE: But we can`t confirm anything right now. And my question is, why was Beth Holloway trying to get to Joran Van Der Sloot? OK, does that answer your question, Kimberly in Arizona? Yes, you can get behind bars at Castro Castro.
Out to Sharon in Alabama. Hi, Sharon.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, hi, Nancy.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just felt that -- I don`t think that Beth Holloway would intentionally break into that prison, knowing that, you know, she would end up there, as well. I think -- I`m thinking she may have an appointment, and this jail is just making up, you know, a bunch of booha (ph) out of nothing.
GRACE: But what appointment could she possibly have in a Peruvian jail that is housing the man believed to have killed her daughter?
Back out to you, Victoria Macchi. Every one of you just joining us, we are getting word just as we go to air that Natalee Holloway, the young girl who was murdered in Aruba off her high school senior trip -- Natalee Holloway, the 18-year-old Alabama girl`s mother may have been arrested in Castro Castro prison in Peru, where Natalee`s killer is housed. Why was she there? Was she arrested? What did she want? Why was she making her way toward Van Der Sloot? Did she make it to him? That`s what we`re trying to find out.
Back to Jean Casarez. Jean, we know she met with Stephany Tatiana`s family, what was her purpose of being in Peru? Certainly, she didn`t fly all the way to Peru just to meet with the girl`s family.
CASAREZ: OK, let`s look at the facts. Here`s what we know. We know that Enrique Flores told your producers that she was with some reporters. They were around her. Who do we see in that video? We see Peter De Vries in that photo. Who is that? That`s the Dutch reporter that has interviewed Joran Van Der Sloot before, who has interviewed him several times, right, Nancy? So could that be an impact there? Could that be a reason to have gone, because of an interview situation?
GRACE: We are taking your calls. I want to go out to Marc Klaas, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation. You had your daughter taken away from you, brutally.
MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Yes.
GRACE: What do you think -- just like Beth Holloway. What do you think she`s doing over in that jail, making her way toward Van Der Sloot?
KLAAS: I know exactly what she`s doing there. She`s trying to find out what happened to her daughter, nothing more and nothing less. Now, she may have been brought in by these other people, but she needs to find out. She has been told lie after lie after lie after lie for five years now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joran Van Der Sloot broke down in tears when he made the confession.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He said Flores found something on his laptop tying him to Natalee Holloway`s disappearance. Then, cops say, he went into a rage and beat her to death.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "Did you think about hiding the body?"
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: "I thought about it for a moment, but I couldn`t stay any more on the scene. There was too much blood in the room."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Graphic new details.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A confession in a high-profiling killing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Van Der Sloot told investigators he was in Peru for a poker tournament, that he`d met Stephany Flores while he was gambling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joran Van Der Sloot`s murder confession.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) when they were at the casino that she wanted to go play on-line poker. They decided his hotel room, so they went there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In transcripts released by Peruvian police.
VAN DER SLOOT: "When we arrived at the hotel, we arrived at my room and played poker on my laptop. At that moment, I opened my e-mail and saw a message that said, I`m going to kill you, mongoloid, referring to the Holloway case."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He gave a detailed account of how he killed Stephany Flores Ramirez and why.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Van Der Sloot says he elbowed Stephany Flores in the face.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stephany Flores.
GRACE: Brutally beaten.
VAN DER SLOOT: "I hit her in the face exactly on top of the nose. There was blood everywhere. I think she started to faint. It affected me, so that I grabbed her from the neck and strangled her for a minute."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Suffocating her with his own shirt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This occurred five years to the day after Natalee Holloway disappeared.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He said, I murdered Stephany Flores, and all I wanted to do was get out of Lima. I wanted to flee.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. For those of you just joining us, as we go to air, we get word that Natalee`s mother, Beth Holloway, has been arrested behind prison walls there at Castro Castro in Peru, where the man believed to have murdered her daughter, Joran Van Der Sloot, is housed.
Unleash the lawyers. Joining us, felony prosecutor, death-penalty- qualified, Eleanor Odom, Atlanta, international law attorney, criminal defense attorney Michael Griffith, who has handled cases there in Peru, Peter Odom, defense attorney, Atlanta, Renee Rockwell, defense attorney, Atlanta.
Out to you, Michael Griffith. What do you make of it?
MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY (via telephone): Nancy, I`m speechless. You`ve broken a very big story. You know, I`ve been in prisons there in Peru, and let me tell you something. Bribes are common. For two cigarettes, I got myself out of Lurigancho when they said the doors were closed.
But let me tell you why I`m speechless. Do you realize that Beth Holloway is a complainant in a criminal proceeding in Alabama? She`s a witness in Aruba. And for her to go into a prison where this man is being represented by counsel, she could considered to be, you know, tampering with a defendant. I don`t know why she would do this. This is very, very bad judgment, particularly, if she tried to bring a camera in. I`m speechless that this is going on.
GRACE: Well, did you ever think that she believes she could get a confession out of him, or some kind of direction as to where her daughter`s body is?
GRIFFITH: Well, it`s not for her to get the confession. Remember, she`s a complainant and a witness in other proceedings. And for her to sneak into a prison and possibly subject herself to arrest, this is going to muddy up other criminal proceedings.
GRACE: Well, Michael Griffith, I beg to disagree with you. But the government of Aruba is the only jurisdiction that can do anything about the murder of Natalee, and they obviously are doing nothing! So why shouldn`t she?
GRIFFITH: My dear -- my dear friend, Nancy Grace, do you realize that she is complainant in an extortion proceeding brought by the U.S. attorney out of Birmingham for the money that...
GRACE: Yes, I do.
GRIFFITH: ... that Joran Van Der Sloot extorted from them? This could help -- if there were any conversations between them, this could help mess up that case. Why would she do this?
GRACE: I don`t think that case can be messed up. I think that case is air-tight. He`s caught on video, on audio. And long story short, some things take precedence over a federal extortion case, Michael Griffith, like finding out where your daughter`s body is buried!
GRIFFITH: My dear...
GRACE: Weigh in, Eleanor!
GRIFFITH: My dear Nancy, the O.J. Simpson case was airtight, too, until the lawyers got the case, OK?
GRACE: What about it, Eleanor?
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Well, Nancy, I mean, I agree with you. She desperately wants to find out what happened to her daughter. But we`ve heard time and again how difficult this prison is, how dangerous it is. So it scares me that she went in there, almost taking her life into her own hands, in order to find out what happened to her daughter. Just that slim margin of hope, Nancy, is all she wanted.
GRACE: You know, Renee, it breaks my heart, if this is all true. We still can`t get confirmation out of Peru. They give us all these different stories. But to think that she would risk everything to get in there, to get at Joran Van Der Sloot?
RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: And Nancy, all she wants actually is a confession. But why would she believe one thing that he says? How many lies has he told? Without physical evidence or a skeleton...
GRACE: But you know what?
ROCKWELL: ... she`s not going to believe him.
GRACE: You know what, Peter Odom? Renee`s right. But sometimes you feel like, when all else fails, you`ve got to try yourself!
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, her act really does speak to the depth of her desperation. She didn`t care about the legalities. She needs closure, and no matter how unlikely it is to come from someone like Joran Van Der Sloot.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VAN DER SLOOT: "I didn`t want to do it. The girl intruded into my private life."
"I was explaining to her that five years ago, I was accused in a case of a missing girl."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Van Der Sloot`s mother, Anita, says he`s mentally ill.
VAN DER SLOOT: "All of a sudden, she hit me. I don`t know why."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She says her son was supposed to be committed to a psych hospital but fled instead to Peru.
VAN DER SLOOT: "Then I threw her to the floor, but she was still breathing. So I took the shirt I was still wearing and put it on her face, pressing."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She said her son suffered severe psychological problems.
VAN DER SLOOT: "I can`t remember how much time, but she stopped breathing, and I think that`s how I killed her."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Lynne in West Virginia. Hi, Lynne.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. Nancy Grace, we love your show.
GRACE: Thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`d just -- I`d like to ask -- I -- I lost my son July 4th, and I would love to find his murderer and just ask him why. And I believe that`s what Beth was over there for. Why? Why did you kill my daughter?
GRACE: You know what, Lynne in West Virginia? So many tangential victims of murder, the wives, the husbands, the children, the families left behind want the answer to that very same question. And I got to tell you, as a crime victim myself, my heart goes out to you.
To you, Eleanor Odom. That`s one thing no prosecutor can ever give a victim`s family, the answer why.
ELEANOR ODOM: You`re right, Nancy. And the sad thing is, you might find a motive, like they want money, or it`s a sex crime, whatever the reason. But that never fully answers why for the families.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. In the last hours, as we go to air, we learn Natalee Holloway`s mother, Beth Holloway, reported to be arrested in Peru in Castro Castro, the jailhouse housing the man who killed her daughter, Natalee Holloway. That case has gone unavenged, unprosecuted by the Aruban government.
Back to Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session." So Jean, according to what Michael Griffith says, you can get in and out, no matter who you are, for two cigarettes in Castro Castro. What do you think?
CASAREZ: No, I disagree. I`m going to stick up for Castro Castro, OK? Officials are there when you walk in -- do you know what you have to go through to get into Castro Castro? Let me tell you, Nancy, you walk through the front door only if you`re invited. Number one, your picture is taken. Number two, you hand them your passport. You don`t have your passport on you when you`re in there. They have it. And they can keep it, if they want to. Then you have to go through a full body scan, and then they take your possessions. They keep your possessions while you`re in there. You`re lucky to be in there, and they`re going to follow the rules, the officials are. They don`t want bad press.
GRACE: Well, then, how is it Joran Van Der Sloot`s been having conjugal visits, sex visits from women?
CASAREZ: Because that is done, is done with others, not the officials.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The Aruban and Peruvian authorities have agreed to, quote, "help each other," in the murder investigation of Stephany Flores.
JEAN CASAREZ, LEGAL CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": Aruban officials can help. Joran Van Der Sloot started his trip from Aruba through Colombia to here in Lima.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER (Through translator): Do you know why you are being detained?
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT, SUSPECT IN THE MURDER OF STEPHANY FLORES (Through Translator): I`ve been told it`s because of the homicide of Stephany Flores.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A very dramatic confession here in Lima, Peru.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: It`s official now. Joran Van Der Sloot, as you know, the prime suspect in that murder case in Peru.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Why you kill her?
DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: He`s got an account to settle and I hope he settles it on this earth.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: And the suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway five years ago in Aruba.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER (Through translator): What was the real reason why you victimized Stephany?
VAN DER SLOOT (Through Translator): I don`t know. But at that moment Stephany hit me in the head. I lost control of my actions.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: In this alleged confession we hear that he says that he would like to help bring some sort of closure -- conclusion to the Natalee Holloway case.
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S MOTHER: I never I`d see this time come.
VAN DER SLOOT (Through Translator): I would like to talk about the case of Natalee Holloway five years ago. There is a possibility to close the case. I will be willing to solve the case.
TWITTY: With such absolutely amazing revelations and information, you know, coming from Joran himself.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
NANCY GRACE, HOST: We are taking your calls. As we go to air we learn the mother of Natalee Holloway, the Alabama girl killed, murdered in Aruba on her high school senior trip, has been apparently arrested in Castro-Castro prison there in Peru, the jailhouse where Joran Van Der Sloot, who is believed to have murdered Natalee is housed.
Back to Victoria Macchi, journalist covering the Van Der Sloot story, joining us out of Lima. Who was with Beth Holloway?
VICTORIA MACCHI, FREELANCE JOURNALIST, COVERING VAN DER SLOOT STORY: Nancy, what we`ve learned is that Beth Holloway was with Peter De Vries. Now he`s a journalist from the Netherlands who has previously gotten Joran on tape confessing to what happened to Natalee Holloway on the beach in Aruba five years ago.
GRACE: To Ellie Jostad. Ellie, I do not see this as any kind of a stunt for PR purposes. I think that Holloway -- Beth Holloway thought she could get answers, and Peter De Vries knew how to get her in the jail.
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Right. I think you`re right, Nancy. Remember way back when this case first started, and the Calpoe brothers were arrested. Remember after they got out, Beth Holloway went to that Internet cafe where Deepak Calpoe worked.
She tried to get some answers out of him. She obviously wants to try to get some answers herself hoping that maybe they`ll give a mother some answers about what really happened.
GRACE: To CW Jensen, retired Portland police captain. Captain, thank you for being with us. But my question is, arrested for what? What`s the crime? What would stop her from going in the jail? What did she do wrong?
CW JENSEN, RETIRED PORTLAND POLICE CAPTAIN: Well, many times most prisons have prohibitions against alcohol, drugs, cameras.
GRACE: Mothers?
JENSEN: Weapons, all those kinds of things.
GRACE: What`s wrong with mothers?
JENSEN: Mothers -- well, if she`s bringing in contraband that might be it. And I think --
GRACE: Wait, wait, put Jensen up. Jensen?
JENSEN: Yes.
GRACE: This woman is not bringing Joran Van Der Sloot booze, cigarettes or anything else. All right? So that`s not it. So why would she possibly be arrested?
JENSEN: Well, I think that probably -- here`s what I think, and I`m just -- this is just my thoughts. I think this woman is desperate, just like you said. I think this journalist came to her and said, I can get you into this establishment.
I don`t know if she told the truth of who she was, but at some point this plan all went south and this may be just one way for the Peruvian officials to make it look it`s not their fault. And can they arrest her for anything? Absolutely.
GRACE: OK. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Dealbreakers." Weigh-in, Bethany. What is she thinking?
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": I hope we hear something that makes this whole story make sense. Because if not, I am extremely concerned about Beth Holloway.
Because She knows Joran Van Der Sloot is a liar, so why would she think she could get a sliver of truth unless she is in that bargaining stage of grief when you feel that some magic thing will happen, and you will be allieved (ph) of your grief because you will hear something magical.
But that is not going to happen at this point. So somehow that would tell me she has crossed the line from hoping for justice to obsessing about justice, which is what we see with people who like vigilante justice. It`s not a good place to be. She has to make peace with this loss, grief.
She knows what happened. She knows her daughter is dead. She knows it`s similar to what happened to Stephany Flores. She knows all she needs to know. And if she were my patient I would impress that on her and help her to grieve.
GRACE: I know, Marc Klaas, it`s so easy for other people to say I know Dr. Bethany is right, but when it happens to you, it`s not so cut and dried. It`s not.
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Nothing is cut and dry. And, in fact, I think that Beth has trusted in the justice system for five years, and I think this latest picture of this smirking little sadist Van Der Sloot in prison living the high life yet again, probably drove her to want to try to get some answers by herself.
She is in no sense of the word a vigilante. She is a fierce mother who wants to find out what happened to her daughter and has demonstrated time and time again she`s not going to let obstacles get in the way of her finding the truth.
GRACE: You just saw the picture Marc Klaas is referring to. And Van Der Sloot is smirking. It`s some kind of a party behind prison wall there at Castro-Castro.
I can understand why Natalee Holloway`s mother went over the edge and went to Peru to try to confront Joran Van Der Sloot.
Was she arrested? Those are the reports we are getting. They have not been confirmed.
To Jean Casarez, tell me again, you said all the stuff about to go through, the checks, the double checks, the checkpoint trolleys to get in. But as we were going to break, you said there are other ways around it.
That`s how Van Der Sloot gets women in to have conjugal or sex visits. How do they do that? That`s certainly illegal.
CASAREZ: You know, Nancy, when I was in Peru, I heard all those rumors about the prostitutes coming into Castro-Castro. I could never confirm it. But if your name is on a visitor`s list, you will be able to get in, period.
And then it`s the lower level employees that may turn their heads so the pictures is taken for instance or the conjugal visits are done.
GRACE: So, back to you, Michael Griffiths, you`ve practiced law there, you`ve handled cases in and out of Castro-Castro. How would it have happened? How would it have gone down? How to get in?
MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY/CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY (via phone): You know, to tell you the truth, I don`t know how she got in. But I will tell you this, Nancy.
GRACE: Look. If you can get a hooker in there, you can get Natalee Holloway`s mother in there. Now how do they do it?
GRIFFITH: Well, look, I told you, I got out of Lurigancho for two cigarettes. I`m sure -- I`m sure she could get herself in there. But here`s what I`m concerned about. I`m concerned about the fact that if she walks in, if she`s been ripped off by this guy, you know, he`s not going to walk himself into a murder case into Aruba and now tell her -- and now tell here where the body is.
Similarly, the minute she walks in with Peter Van De Vries who already tricked him once and (INAUDIBLE) with him once, even if she were inclined to speak to him, the minute that he saw Van De Vries, he would probably keep his mouth shut knowing that this was a setup.
GRACE: But what could they have possibly arrested her for, Michael Griffith?
GRIFFITH: They could have arrested her, number one, for bringing in contraband, which could be a camera. Number two, to bribe a guard or possibly number three for putting the wrong name down on the -- on the guest list getting in there.
GRACE: OK. OK. Out to the lines, Faye in South Carolina, hi, Faye.
FAYE, CALLER FROM SOUTH CAROLINA: hi, Nancy. I am so thrilled at the way the Lord has blessed you in your life and --
GRACE: You know what, so am I. Thank you.
FAYE: I know, and I wish that your husband got more credit.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: Well, you know what?
FAYE: Bless his heart.
GRACE: He had a little bit to do with it. Now what`s your question, dear?
FAYE: Absolutely. What do you think about this? The Dutch reporter has been so involved in all of this. And I think the two of them were working together. Natalee`s mom and the Dutch reporter.
And I wanted to get your opinion about that. I think they met there, and they may be doing a program or an interview or something, and Natalee`s mom has been so proactive because no one else has. And I think that they`re just trying to do what they can do to find out some information.
GRACE: I think you`re right. I don`t know about a program, but I think you`re right. She obviously has teamed up with Peter De Vries who has gotten the most evidence on Natalee`s death than anybody through undercover secret cameras inside a vehicle.
We`re showing you part of it right now. That may have been Beth Holloway`s only hope at getting answers.
For those of you just joining us, the mother of Natalee Holloway, the 18-year-old Alabama girl who lost her life in Aruba, has reportedly been arrested behind jailhouse walls, Peru. In the same jailhouse housing the man who killed her daughter Natalee.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A young woman was found dead in his hotel room.
CASAREZ: Such a gruesome homicide case.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Breaking news.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The surveillance tape, it shows him walking past the front desk, picking up his keys, going into his room with Stephany Flores.
GRACE: His dad is not around to protect him.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Prosecutors will seek the maximum sentence for Van Der Sloot if he convicted.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: In a bizarre twist, cops announced they`ve caught the prime suspect in the first acid attack.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Miss Storro admitted that her injuries were self- inflicted. The attack itself did not occur as she had previously reported. The victim, herself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s all made up. She threw acid on her own face.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Unfortunately, for whatever reason, that Miss Storro may have had for making this false report it has had an impact on our community. It`s brought negative attention to our community that`s undeserved.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I don`t understand. She threw acid on her own face? She`s got severe burn across her face, her neck, her chest.
To Lou Brancaccio, editor of "The Columbian", joining us from Vancouver.
Lou, what happened?
LOU BRANCACCIO, EDITOR, THE COLUMBIAN: Boy, that`s a great question. No one really knows why she did it. The police are not saying. But, boy, what a twist, she did it to herself.
GRACE: To Jean Casarez, take it from the beginning. What happened?
CASAREZ: Well, she`s 28 years old. First of all, you see her right there. Bethany Storro. She claims that on August 30th, she was standing outside of a Starbucks and somebody came along, it was an African-American woman, said hey, pretty little girl, you want something to drink?
And she turned around and boom. All of that acid went on her face. But, Nancy, she has just bought a pair of sunglasses and she didn`t wear sunglasses. Furthermore, the acid didn`t get in her nose or on her lips. Just designated areas on her face.
GRACE: Now how did they piece all that together, Jean Casarez, that she just bought the sunglasses and it only got on designated areas? How did she do that?
CASAREZ: Well, I truly think that it`s the media that actually looked at this and said, something just doesn`t add up. But she has now confessed to police that she made it all up.
GRACE: To Lou Brancaccio. Lou, you were talking about attention focused on your community. What did you mean by that?
BRANCACCIO: Well, there was a number of people, both locally and nationally, who were saying that this wasn`t as nice a place as we know it is to be because we have random people throwing acid on people`s faces.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Debbie in Michigan, hi, Debbie. I think I`ve lost Debbie. Do I have Debbie on the line?
Let`s try Andrea in Canada. Hi, Andrea. Andrea, are you there, dear? OK, apparently we got Debbie back.
DEBBIE, CALLER FROM MICHIGAN: Nancy? Right.
GRACE: Debbie in Michigan?
DEBBIE: Yes, yes. Sorry about that.
GRACE: You`re on.
DEBBIE: OK.
GRACE: What`s your question, dear?
DEBBIE: My question is, do they know yet if she has a history of any kind of psychological, mental issues?
GRACE: Good question. What about it, Jean?
CASAREZ: It`s just breaking, Nancy. But here`s what we understand. She was going to be on that "Oprah Winfrey Show," but cancelled. But what your producers are hearing is that she wanted to profess the word of God on Oprah Winfrey`s show because she had the acid attack so that could have been a motivating factor.
GRACE: I`m going to go to Dr. Titus Duncan, general surgeon, Atlanta Medical Center.
Dr. Duncan, what would this have been like for her to have acid put on her own face?
DR. TITUS DUNCAN, M.D., GENERAL SURGERY, ATLANTA MEDICAL CENTER: Well, it depends upon the concentration of the acid. You have sulfuric acid and you have hydrochloric acid. The less concentrated it is the less damage it`s going to do.
And looking at her there, she didn`t do a whole lot of damage. She didn`t go down deep into the dermis or down to the muscle. So she may have actually known how much dilution that -- to put the acid, too, so that it would only give her superficial burns.
She looks like she has superficial burns and those will heal OK. She may have a little bit of scarring later on. But from the looks of them, those will heal just fine over a period of time.
GRACE: OK. Back to Jean Casarez. What were the severity of the burns?
CASAREZ: Second degree burns, but here`s something else. There were no burns inside her mouth. And Nancy, let`s use common sense. If somebody is hurling acid at you, you`re going to go, no or something. There was no acid in the mouth or on the tongue.
GRACE: You are seeing shots of Bethany Storro. Age 28. It launched an outbreak of fear across the country after not one, but two ladies were attacked with acid to the face. And this was the first.
What about the second victim? What do we know about that, Jean Casarez?
CASAREZ: Well, they thought that was a copycat victim in Arizona. And it was a similar situation, another acid in the face. Now was it copycat from the first that was just a faker to begin with? I think a lot is left to be known. But we do know that there were two circumstances.
GRACE: So, bottom line, what I`m deducing is, after this woman, Bethany Storro, douses her own face with acid, a copycat then throws acid on another woman.
So Bethany Storro, you can you consider yourself responsible for the other woman being scarred for life in the face.
Unleash the lawyers, Eleanor Odom, Renee Rockwell, Peter Odom.
Eleanor, is there anyway this woman`s going to be prosecuted?
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Well, I think so. For false report of a crime like that. It`s apparently a misdemeanor there. But yes, she`s going to be prosecuted.
But, Nancy, if you look at the picture you`re showing, you can there are no splash marks. It doesn`t look like that acid has splashed on her face. It almost looks like it`s carefully applied. And people who study these types of things where you`re burned by a liquid, where it splashed, you can tell.
GRACE: So, Renee Rockwell, she would have had to put it on partially, feel the pain of putting on, and continue to put it on her face?
RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It sounds like she might have known what she`s doing, Nancy. But I can also perceive potentially some legal complications feebly.
For example, if she`s outside of a Starbucks and they`ve been -- their business has failed because of it, or if the police department wants to sue her for the amount of time they put into the investigation, you could potentially see that forthcoming.
GRACE: What about it, Peter Odom? What about a runaway bride scenario where Jennifer Wilbanks was prosecuted for all the money and time she cost everybody and her ruse?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t see it, Nancy. Just the nature of doing something like that to yourself really speaks to mental illness and I think that that`s what prosecutors are going to look at first.
Are they really going to prosecute someone with this kind of a deep delusion for a misdemeanor? It`s not worth it.
GRACE: What about it, Dr. Bethany?
MARSHALL: It`s not mental illness. She did this to get attention like when someone malingers or makes up a fictitious illness like cancer. They want love, letters from fans, sympathy, donations to go on the "Oprah Winfrey Show," and pretend she is the voice piece of God. That`s what she wanted.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What was her demeanor today during the search warrant and the interview?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She is extremely upset. She`s very remorseful. In many ways this is something that just got bigger than what she expected and so she has shown that this is affecting her a great deal.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Andrea in Canada, hi, Andrea.
ANDREA, CALLER FROM CANADA: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: What`s your question, dear?
ANDREA: Love your show, love what you do. I just want to let you know that.
GRACE: Thank you. Thank you, Andrea.
ANDREA: You`re very welcome. I just wondered if she was going to be charged with anything.
GRACE: That`s what I`m wondering. Eleanor, a lot of people think it`s a long shot. What about you?
E. ODOM: I don`t. I think this is a clear case of a false report of a crime. I mean there -- she said there`s a crime. It didn`t happen. She`s lied. I think clearly she needs to be charged.
GRACE: Back to the lines. Diane, Illinois. Hi, Diane.
DIANE, CALLER FROM ILLINOIS: Hi. Oh, I just love you so much. You`re so precious. I just --
GRACE: Thank you.
(CROSSTALK)
DIANE: OK. This lady, I worked in mental health for about eight years. I had residents that bit themselves, burned themselves with cigarettes, drank things. They all did it for attention. And they were, quote, as normal as you could possibly get.
And number three, hasn`t anyone come forward? Doesn`t anybody recognize this woman on TV? Like relatives or friends or anyone?
GRACE: Well, I think -- I think you`re right, Diane. I think as it filters out we`re just learning tonight she self-inflicted the acid attack on her own face. I think we`re going to hear a lot more in the days to come.
Everybody, let`s stop and remember Army Sergeant Michael Bordelon, 37, Morgan City, Louisiana, served Iraq, lost his life at Texas Brook Army Medical Center from explosion injuries. Awarded the Bronze Star, Purple Heart. Also served National Guard.
Never met a stranger, with a contagious smile, loved classic cars, antiques, played football, sharing Girl Scout cookies with Iraqi children. Leaves behind parents Bruce and Dolores, sister Doreen. Widow, Milalona, children, Michael, Jacob, and Johana.
Michael Bordelon, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you and a special good night from Indiana friend, Laura.
And tonight KlaasKids Foundation teams up with 2010 Fireball Run and Race to recover America`s missing children. Begins September 23, Nevada, ends October 2, Illinois. Go to KlaasKids.org and FireballRun.com.
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
