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Nancy Grace
Search for Missing N.C. Girl Now Homicide Investigation
Aired October 12, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live, North Carolina. A 10-year-old little girl snatched from her own bedroom in the dark of night. The little girl, Zahra, completely dependent on two hearing aids and can only walk using a prosthetic leg after losing her left leg to childhood bone cancer. This little girl, facing so much hardship, now vanishes into thin air, her bedroom empty, her prosthetic leg missing, hearing aids left behind. The last person to see Zahra alive, stepmommy.
Investigators zero in on a ransom note found. K9s reportedly hit around family cars, as search teams scouring densely wooded areas, combing grainy surveillance video from nearby businesses. In a stunning twist, stepmommy arrested on bad checks as Zahra`s dad says he`s learning his whole marriage has been a lie. Investigators seizing items from the Baker home including gas cans, two samples of possible blood taken from the family car.
Bombshell tonight. Did stepmommy confess to the phony million-dollar ransom note? Police dogs now hit on a woodchipper used by Zahra`s dad, a tree trimmer. Is the search for Zahra now moving into a homicide? Police can`t even track Zahra for the whole last month. No one has seen the 10- year-old for weeks. And now a day late and a dollar short, friends, relatives come forward to say the stepmom made the little girl`s life hell. Tonight, where is Zahra?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Amber Alert.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Amber Alert.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Called off.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was canceled today.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The disappearance of little Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Cancer patient.
GRACE: Hearing aids.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Lost her leg.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is now being investigated as a homicide.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Homicide.
GRACE: Murder case.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police say.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stepmom.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Admitted she wrote a ransom mode.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It said Mr. Coffey.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Coffey.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Easily got frustrated with the little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Apparent history of cruelty. She called her -- called her a dark child.
GRACE: You like being in control.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cadaver dogs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Possible blood stains.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now who`s in control?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Items taken from the home.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Scent of human remains.
GRACE: We have your daughter.
ZAHRA BAKER, MISSING 10-YEAR-OLD: I can actually hear most things without my hearing aids.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Unless you do what is asked.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Inconsistency.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Inconsistency.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Inconsistencies in her statement.
GRACE: One million unmarked.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Will be in touch.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What if she doesn`t crack?
ELISA BAKER, STEPMOTHER: A lot of people don`t understand that treatment does tend to take other things away from you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, Anaheim. Two little brothers, just 2 and 4, go outside with Mommy to take out the trash when suddenly, they`re snatched, literally out of Mommy`s arms. We go live to find out where -- where are Justin and Jacob?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Two young boys.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Four-year-old Jacob Quinones (ph) and 2-year-old Justin Quinones.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Snatched.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Abducted.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The toddlers were kidnapped.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re out there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Around 8:00 o`clock here, while she was putting trash out in this alley.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very reminiscent of something you see on television.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The men pulled up in a silver van and snatched the brothers.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Vehicle drives into this darkened driveway. People get out of the van.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Grabbed the children.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Driving a silver Dodge Caravan similar to this one.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They grabbed the kids, quickly escaped out of there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And now they believe.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have altered their appearance, so we`re hoping that the public will come forward and let us know if they see them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But for now, top priority, find those two missing boys.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just want my children back.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jacob and Justin`s 23-year-old mom just wants them home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are headed straight out, everyone, regarding the Zahra case. Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. And I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Live, North Carolina. A 10-year-old little girl completely dependent on two hearing aids, losing her left leg to childhood bone cancer, snatched from her own bedroom in the dark of night. Did mommy confess to that phony million-dollar ransom note? Police dogs now hitting on a woodchipper used by Zahra`s dad, a tree trimmer.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A 10-year-old girl.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cancer survivor.
GRACE: Snatched from her own bedroom.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police have called off an Amber Alert.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is now being investigated.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As a homicide investigation.
GRACE: Last person to see Zahra alive.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her dad, Adam Baker, is said to be cooperating.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police say Zahra`s stepmom has not been truthful.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has not been truthful.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Truthful.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Truthful with us.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Here she is.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lisa Baker admitted she wrote a ransom note.
GRACE: Stepmother being the last one with her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The ransom note was found on a vehicle.
GRACE: Lie upon lie.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Doused in gasoline.
GRACE: This lady`s got a lot of explaining to do!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Authorities have charged her with felony obstruction of justice.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker requested an attorney.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They want to find out where Zahra is.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Cops cannot find anybody other than the dad or stepmom that has seen her recently.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We cannot confirm that anyone has seen Zahra within the last month.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I knew this day was going to come. Everybody that knew Zahra knew the way -- how she was being treated. This was going to happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I`m hearing in my ear right now we are going live to Jason Stoogenke, WSOC reporter there on the scene. Jason, what can you tell us? What`s happening?
JASON STOOGENKE, WSOC CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Well, right now, there`s a lot of action going on. We can only get so close at this point (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: OK. Let me know, Dana, when I get Stoogenke back. Jason, are you with me?
STOOGENKE: I`m here. Can you hear me?
GRACE: Yes. Repeat. Go ahead.
STOOGENKE: We`re here in Burke (ph) County. And there`s a deputy actually blocking how far we can go down this gravel road. But we see lots of police cars, deputies` cars, patrol cars going down this road (INAUDIBLE) around the bend (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Guys, I`m on with Jason Stoogenke. He`s with WSOC, a reporter. And the search is happening right now. We`re going to try to get him back so we can find out exactly what`s happening.
But in the last 24 hours, the search may have turned into a homicide investigation. Straight off the top, I want to go to John Miller, editor with "The Hickory Daily Record." John, it`s getting worse and worse literally as each hour goes by. First of all, tell me -- Jason is joining us from the scene of the search. I know you`re in front of the home. Tell me what you know. what`s going on with the search right now? Where are they?
JOHN MILLER, "HICKORY DAILY RECORD": They are in Burke County, which is about an hour from Hickory. They are at the site of the job of Adam Baker. We had a reporter and a photographer there today. Police had already searched that site. They`re there searching it again today because, apparently, they have found some more information, probably today after talking to Elisa Baker. But we know they`ve searched that site before, didn`t find anything. They`re back now, so there must be something they`re going to bring out of there tonight.
GRACE: OK. With me there at the home, at the family home, the last place that we know the little girl had been seen -- we`re talking about 10- year-old Zahra Baker, a white female, only 85 pounds, brown hair, beautiful blue eyes. This little girl you`re looking at right there is completely dependent on two hearing aids and a prosthetic leg after bravely, valiantly fighting child bone cancer. And now out of the blue, she is reported missing from her own bed.
We are taking your calls. I want to go back to John Miller with "The Hickory Daily Record." John, so much has happened. First of all, I understand that the K9s -- you`re seeing aerial shots right now. Everybody, the search is going on into the night -- that the K9s have hit on one of the father`s woodchippers?
MILLER: Yes, they hit on a woodchipper in the family`s back yard several days ago, and apparently, they did the same at a woodchipper at the location they`re searching again tonight. What we understand, though, is that they have brought in some additional equipment, maybe to move some things around that they might not have moved around before. But as I said, they`ve searched this site before. I think, based upon the fact that Baker was charged this morning, they might have got some additional information that led them back to that site. She is charged with obstruction of justice. Now she`s in jail, $72,000 bond.
GRACE: OK, to Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer. Ellie, I know the mom is behind bars, the stepmother. Her own mother hasn`t seen her since she was 8 months old. She lives in Australia. Haven`t heard hide nor hair of the biological mother. Ellie, the stepmother is behind bars on bad checks, a whole string of fraudulent incidents...
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right.
GRACE: ... a no-show in court. But what can you tell me, Ellie, about this bogus, this phony, this fake million-dollar ransom note left at the home?
JOSTAD: Well, right, Nancy. Yesterday in that search warrant, we learned that when officers arrived at the house, they found what they believed to be a ransom note on one of the family vehicles. It was actually addressed to the guy who owns the house, who actually is also Zahra`s father`s boss. At any rate, police said today -- and this note was asking for a million dollars or you`ll never see your daughter again. The guy`s daughter was fine. They couldn`t understand where this note came from, didn`t think it was legitimate. Today, police announced that the stepmother, Elisa Baker, admitted writing that note, and they have now charged her with obstruction of justice.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Vickie in North Carolina. Hi, Vickie.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I had one about the father. He had said he had seen the child on Thursday, and now they say no one has seen the child since Thursday but -- or for a month. So now I`m beginning to understand, since the woodchipper has come in. So now I`ve only got one comment.
GRACE: OK, Vickie, hold -- Vickie, hold on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.
GRACE: Hold on. Dana, keep Vickie because now I`ve got Jason Stoogenke back, WSOC reporter. He`s there on the scene. Jason, tell me while I can communicate with you -- everybody, Jason is there at the scene where a search is going down. Jason, what`s happening?
STOOGENKE: Well, picture this. You have this gravel road that kind of goes back into the woods and the brush. There are a couple little old houses there with some maybe some old vehicles. There`s a bend in the road, so it`s hard to see past that because there`s a deputies` car parked right here, keeping the media back at the top of the road so we can`t see too far down.
But before they got all these cars in place, we were able to go down a little bit farther, so I know that there are a number of patrol cars lined up around that bend. We`re told that it`s a bunch of farmland back there, that there are some trees, maybe a couple other little houses. One person walking by says there`s a bunch of, like, farm equipment that maybe is stored back there. We haven`t heard that from investigators. But someone who says he has some knowledge of the area passed that along to us.
Now, let`s say, within the last hour, hour-and-a-half or so, we did see some construction vehicles go in, a grapple (ph) truck, which, of course, is used to grab mulch and earth. We also saw emergency vehicles pulling in with the heavy-duty floodlights. So it looks like, by all indications, they plan to continue this search for a while, even though it`s already gotten dark out here. So that`s pretty much what we`re seeing at the moment. Obviously, patrol cars and other investigators...
GRACE: Jason, Jason...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... WSOC reporter, is with us at the scene. Jason, what is the scene? Where are you?
STOOGENKE: We are actually, let`s say, maybe about 15 miles or so north of Morganton, North Carolina, which is Burke County. It`s pretty rural out here. Morganton itself is -- you know, has some things going on. But if you leave that area and you head north for a little while...
GRACE: OK, Jason, Jason -- why are you there? What`s the significance of the scene? What is it?
STOOGENKE: We don`t know at this point. The investigators aren`t saying any -- saying what led them to this spot or what the connection is here. We`ve asked a number of neighbors to tell us about the ownership and all that kind of stuff so we could see if there is a connection that we can make. But so far...
GRACE: OK...
STOOGENKE: ... we have not had any luck with that.
GRACE: With me there at the scene of the search, Jason Stoogenke, WSOC. And very quickly, John Miller, why are they there? Why is this spot significant to us?
MILLER: The spot is significant because this is the business where Adam Baker worked. They have previously investigated this site before. On Sunday, they investigated it. They wrapped up their investigation and left, but they`re back again. We were there this afternoon. There was nobody there. The owner thought (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Everyone, is there...
MILLER: Now they`re back.
GRACE: ... a break in the search for 10-year-old Zahra Baker? The little girl has fought cancer, but now is missing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anyone that has seen this girl in the last week, the last month, anything that they feel is important for us to know, we need the public to call us.
STOOGENKE: Police in Hickory say they`re not ruling anything out in the disappearance of a 10-year-old girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are following all leads. We`re not ruling out any possibilities at this time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Amber Alert on Zahra Baker was canceled today, and the decision to focus this investigation from a missing child or abducted child will turn into a homicide investigation.
GRACE: The search is happening right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They hit on a woodchipper in the family`s back yard several days ago, and apparently, they did the same at a woodchipper at the location they`re searching again tonight.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Huge turn of events here in the case of missing 10-year-old Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigated as a homicide.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Positive alert for the presence of human remains.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Scent of human remains in two cars.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra was last seen sleeping in her bed early Saturday morning.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her dad reported her missing 12 hours later.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "Mr. Coffey, you like being in control. Now who`s in control? We have your daughter, and your pot-smoking redhead son is next unless you do what is asked, $1 million unmarked. We`ll be in touch."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker admitted to writing the ransom note.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) I knew this day was going to come.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Amber Alert on Zahra Baker we`ve canceled today, and the decision to focus this investigation from a missing child or abducted child will turn into a homicide investigation. With that status change, information related to this case will be limited to only breaking developments. I want to thank the media for getting this information out about the Zahra Baker case. And again, we need the public to come forward to help solve her case.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I`ve got to tell you what I`ve learned today about the life this little girl was leading behind closed doors. It`s very disturbing. We are taking your calls live.
And right now, I want to go to Kayla Rotenberry, former friend and neighbor of the Baker family, joining us in Hickory, North Carolina. I believe I`ve got Kayla with me now. Kayla, can you hear me?
KAYLA ROTENBERRY, FORMER NEIGHBOR: Yes.
GRACE: Kayla, thank you for being with us. Kayla, what did you observe about the little girl, Zahra? How was she treated?
ROTENBERRY: Not so great. There was...
GRACE: Please be specific.
ROTENBERRY: ... a couple of incidents -- she used to get made to walk all the time on her prosthetic. And if she wouldn`t walk right, she would get punished. And it`s just different things, like her mother, you know, broke her hand by spanking her when she hit her prosthetic.
GRACE: Isn`t that the time, Brittany (SIC), that -- was it you that observed the stepmother`s hand was red and it was hurting her, and at first, she made up a story, then later, she said she was trying to beat Zahra and instead hit the little girl`s prophetic leg?
ROTENBERRY: Yes.
GRACE: Did you ever observe Zahra with a black eye or bruises?
ROTENBERRY: I did one time, but I was told that it was where she was going through her -- she had went through her chemo and stuff that her eyes got like that.
GRACE: Tonight, we are learning stories of this little girl being locked in her room for days on end, only allowed out five minutes at a time to eat, going to school with black eyes and bruises, stories we`re trying to confirm tonight of the father, the biological father, sitting by while the stepmother, let me just say, disciplined her. And now the little girl is gone. Where were all the friends and relatives when there was a chance to speak out and do the right thing? That chance is gone!
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Amber Alert for this cute little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has been canceled.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This investigation will turn into a homicide investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zahra is a cancer patient who has a prosthetic leg and hearing aids.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra just 10 years old, and she`s been through a lot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She was reported missing Saturday afternoon.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We cannot confirm with any confidence how long Zahra has been missing.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The last time they can prove the girl was seen was a month ago.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police say Zahra`s stepmom has not been truthful.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker admitted to writing the ransom note.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cadaver dogs have reportedly found the scent of human remains in two cars at Zahra`s home.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: In the last 24 hours, so many developments in the search for little Zahra. As you all know now, Zahra`s suffering can be -- mobile only through the use of a prosthetic leg, her left leg amputated from the knee down. But still so brave. Hearing aids used day in, day out. This is as a result of her battling child bone cancer.
Dana, let me see the new photos that we have of Zahra, including the ones taken off of MySpace, please.
I want to go out to Jennifer Moxley joining us from CNN affiliate News 14 Carolina. Jennifer is joining us there at the home in Hickory. Jennifer, give me the latest update.
JENNIFER MOXLEY, NEWS 14 CAROLINA CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, the search is still going on in Morganton, which is not far from where we are in Hickory, at the family`s home. We`ve also seen some family members of the Bakers showing up in the past few minutes. They`re holding a candlelight vigil in the front yard. They weren`t very friendly and did not want to talk with us, but they certainly are here organizing, whether it`s for Elisa or for Zahra or for both. They`re in the front yard now. And that search is continuing, again, not far from here, in a very wooded area down a dirt road in Morganton. That`s in Burke County, a neighboring county. And investigators aren`t stopping. They have the K9s out. They have emergency officials out. And they`re looking for anything they can find Zahra with.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The disappearance of little Zahra Baker.
ZAHRA BAKER, MISSING 10-YEAR OLD: I can actually hear more than without my hearing aid.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Is now being investigated as a homicide.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I knew this day was going to come.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Cadaver dogs found the scent of human remains in two cars at her home.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Last person to see Zahra alive, step mommy.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She`s described just a great little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Last night in a jailhouse interview police say --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Elisa Baker admitted she wrote a ransom note found at the family`s home.
GRACE: Here she is. This is who we`re going to have home-school our child?
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Little Zahra was often beaten, locked in a room.
GRACE: The stepmother would make her walk long distances on her prosthetic leg and then punish her when she could walk no longer.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zahra is a sweet, smart little girl.
BRITTANY BENTLEY, RELATIVE OF MISSING GIRL`S STEPMOTHER, ELISA BAKER: Everybody that knew Zahra, how she`d been treated, this was going to happen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hickory police and agents from the North Carolina State Bureau of Investigation interviewed Elisa Baker at the (INAUDIBLE) County detention facility.
During that interview Elisa Baker admitted to writing the ransom note left on the vehicle at the fire scene at Zahra`s home on Saturday morning. After admitting to writing the note, Elisa Baker requested an attorney.
This morning Hickory Police obtained a warrant for Elisa Baker for felony obstruction of justice.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Where is this little girl? Joining me right now, a special guest, Brittany Bentley, relative of Elisa Baker, Zahra`s stepmom.
Brittany, thank you for being with us.
Brittany, what can you tell us about the Department of Family and Children Services visiting the home before?
BENTLEY: Yes, I had -- I got a phone call from Brittany -- Britney, Britney (INAUDIBLE) is what she is. Lisa`s daughter. And told me to have my mother look at Zahra`s eye and see if it was black.
Zahra had my mother for the weekend. And they were at the park. And I called my mother. And she examined the eye. And she said that yes, (INAUDIBLE), like it`s faint but there was a bruise under her eye.
I called Britney, her daughter, back, and DFS was called, she called DFS. About a week later I believe DFS came. My mother saw them there. She was dropping Zahra off and they were already there.
She said that when she was in there they didn`t really ask Zahra any questions. They said just put on a really good act and then she left.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Everybody, you`re seeing -- Dana, put that shot back up again, please. You`re seeing the shot of little Zahra right now. and notice her left leg, that`s off of the MySpace Web site.
Her left leg, that is how she would appear with that prosthetic leg. This little girl is battling so much, braving so much. And if you noticed in every single picture this little girl is smiling. She`s got a big smile on her face.
Brittany Bentley, relative of the family joining us out of Granite Falls, North Carolina.
What do you know about the little girl`s living conditions, Brittany?
BENTLEY: I know when I would go over there, I was -- I remember Lisa coming out of the bedroom one day saying her hands hurt from spanking Zahra so much. I -- you know, I know she spanked way too hard, what I`ll consider beating.
I know about letting her out five minutes just to eat and that was it and go back. You know, DFS was informed about all of this stuff. Especially I know the black eye. She wasn`t in very good living conditions, not at all for a 10-year-old.
GRACE: Is it true -- Brittany, is it true that when the little girl would go and she would visit a neighbor or a relative, when it got time to go back home, she would run to the back of the house and try not to have to go home?
BENTLEY: Yes. My mother would keep her on the weekends. And I know whenever she was packing and time to go home she would scream, you know, mother, I hate you, slam doors which is just a whole different side of Zahra.
GRACE: But she would have to go back home?
BENTLEY: Yes.
GRACE: To Pat Brown, criminal profiler. You know, Pat, hearing all this I feel like -- just wrenching my insides out, because it seems like everybody knew, everybody knew how this girl was living and what this stepmother was doing. Now the girl`s dead.
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER, AUTHOR OF "THE PROFILER": Everybody seems to know pieces. And I`m guaranteeing you the reason that child was supposedly home schooled was because the mother didn`t want her going back to the school and having any of this evidence come up.
So I don`t think she was getting much of a schooling but she was being kept from everybody else.
I`d also -- but I don`t think the actual crime went down to exactly when that woman said the last time she saw Zahra was 2:30 in the morning. I believe everything sounded crazy after that. They`re racing around doing all kinds of stuff. And one of the worst cover-ups of a crime scene I`ve ever seen so --
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: To Paul Penzone, former sergeant, Phoenix PD, child advocate out of Phoenix, where is everybody when the girl`s alive? At least you`ve got Brittany Bentley. They called family services. They tried.
Isn`t it a law, Paul Penzone, that when a schoolteacher sees bruises and black eyes they are to report it?
PAUL PENZONE, DIRECT OF PREVENTION PROGRAMS, CHILDHELP.ORG, FMR. SERGEANT, PHOENIX PD: Mandatory reporters are required by law to report --
GRACE: Yes, well, a lot of good that law`s doing me right now. This little girl is either missing or dead. And nobody did a thing. They let it all happen.
PENZONE: You`re exactly right. You know you said two things that stand out to me. So many people failed her. And we see the pictures of her, that beautiful smile, that light inside of her. People should have been fighting for her.
She went from neglected to abused and now possibly dead. And there were too many people in her life that did not fight hr her and they should have.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Atlanta defense attorney, Raymond Giudice. New York defense attorney, Remi Spencer.
You know, in my book they`ve got the mom right now, the stepmother. I think the father is just as involved. Either he sat by and let it happen, or he was part of it. You cannot not know what`s going on in your home, Ray Giudice.
RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t disagree with that, Nancy. I think it`s all or none at all. I think that no crime has been shown. There`s nobody named a suspect. But if I was --
GRACE: Put him up.
GIUDICE: If I was --
GRACE: Put him up. Didn`t you hear the canine dogs hit on a wood chipper, Ray?
GIUDICE: Are you calling her a suspect tonight? Because I`m not. And what I`m saying is --
GRACE: I`m saying you`re not answering the question. As usual.
GIUDICE: I`m about to. No, I`m about to.
GRACE: Well then do it.
GIUDICE: What I`m saying is that she`s not a suspect and if I was advising her I would not make any statements unless she could give me information that leads to the safe return of that child. Otherwise zip.
GRACE: Yes, well, you know what, Ray, she`s already admitted she wrote the phony ransom note.
Now, Remi Spencer, you`ve got a pretty good reputation as a defense lawyer. Give me your best shot, Remi. How can this stepmother have written the fake ransom note for $1 million and not be implicated in the child`s disappearance?
REMI SPENCER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: How could --
GRACE: OK. Hold on. I want to hear this. Everybody, be quiet.
SPENCER: I think the real question is, how could they get --
GRACE: No, answer that question.
SPENCER: How did they get that statement? She was in jail. She was in custody.
GRACE: Thanks, Remi.
SPENCER: And police were --
GRACE: You lived down to all of my expectations.
SPENCER: Well, if you want to hear the answer, if she is in fact responsible for writing that letter then yes, of course there will be a connection to the kidnapping, but we don`t know that that is true, and that`s the point. She was in jail on felony charges. You know, Nancy, just as well as the rest of us --
GRACE: Put her up.
SPENCER: -- police can`t talk to her without her lawyer. So --
GRACE: Oh, really? Well, what if she doesn`t have a lawyer yet and she volunteers the statement, Remi? What about that? Think quick. Think back. You know, because the Constitution does allow a voluntary statement made to police to come in at trial. Do you disagree with that?
SPENCER: The question is, was it voluntary? And it`s almost never voluntary when somebody is in jail.
GRACE: I`ll tell you what`s not voluntary. I`ll tell you what`s not voluntary, Remi, and you`re right on the law. You`re right.
SPENCER: Thank you.
GRACE: But here I`ve seen no evidence that this was a coerced statement. But I`ll tell you what`s not voluntary.
SPENCER: Well, we don`t know that yet.
GRACE: What`s not voluntary is being locked in your room, 24 hours a time. As being beaten when you can`t walk fast enough on your prosthetic leg.
What`s not fair, Remi, is being a 10-year-old child living in a home with a terrorist that beats you and leaves you with black eyes and then suddenly with your daddy standing by twiddling his thumbs you end up missing and a canine cadaver dog hits on a wood chipper.
That`s what`s not fair to me tonight.
Out to you, Vicki, North Carolina, what was your question?
VICKI, CALLER FROM NORTH CAROLINA: Well, I wanted to know about the father, but now I know. And I agree totally with you, they need to take both of these people and they need to just --
GRACE: They`ve got a two for one, Vicki. They got two for one.
VICKI: There you go.
GRACE: Two tickets for one. Straight to hell.
VICKI: That`s exactly right. Don`t keep them --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: With lips quivering and tears in his eyes Hickory Police Chief Tom Atkins said Tuesday what everyone fears, that 10- year-old Zahra Baker, a little girl who battled cancer, probably isn`t alive.
CHIEF TOM ATKINS, HICKORY POLICE: The decision to focus this investigation from a missing child or abducted child will turn into a homicide investigation.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ATKINS: An Amber Alert was issued at the time of her disappearance because of possible danger. The Amber Alert for Zahra Baker was canceled today.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: This is now a homicide investigation.
ATKINS: Will turn into a homicide investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She was reported missing Saturday afternoon, but it`s starting to appear like she may have been missing much longer.
ATKINS: We cannot confirm that anyone has seen Zahra within the last month.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police say Zahra`s stepmom has not been truthful.
ATKINS: Inconsistencies developed over the course of this investigation has not eliminated her as a person of interest.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You don`t have a lot of evidence --
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We`re being joined right now by Alvin Webb. He is at the property being searched right now. He lives next door.
Mr. Webb, thank you for being with us.
ALVIN WEBB, AT PROPERTY BEING SEARCH FOR EVIDENCE OF MISSING GIRL ZAHRA BAKER: Yes, ma`am.
GRACE: Mr. Webb, what`s going on out there?
WEBB: Well, they`ve come back. They`ve been gone, and they might be over by the (INAUDIBLE).
GRACE: Everyone, Mr. Webb is having some difficulty breathing. He is on oxygen right now.
Mr. Webb, do you know what they`re looking for?
OK. We`re going to go back to Mr. Webb when he can address us a little bit better. He is there right now next door to where the property that is being searched for little Zahra, or evidence in her disappearance.
I want go to Dr. Michael Arnall, board certified forensic pathology. Dr. Arnall joining us out of Denver.
Doctor, how and why would the little girl have lost her leg and her hearing during cancer treatment?
DR. MICHAEL ARNALL, BOARD CERTIFIED FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Bone cancers are commonly treated with two methods. They did surgery to remove the bulk of the tumor and then followed with chemotherapy to take care of any possible metastasis.
Both the chemotherapeutic agents as well as possibly antibiotics that they would have used during her therapy could have caused her to lose her hearing.
GRACE: Everyone, with us, a real expert in his field, Dr. Michael Arnall, forensic pathologist out of Denver.
Dr. Arnall, some people are coming forward to talk about now the bruises that they saw on the little girl in life. At the time would it have been easy for a doctor to determine if there had been physical abuse on the little girl?
ARNALL: Yes. The size, shape and location of the bruises will give the doctor an idea about the potential cause of the bruises. If the child had been slapped or hit, as has been described, in areas of the body that you usually don`t get bruises when you fall down, that would be evidence to a physician that these bruises were not accidental but a consequence of non-accidental trauma, child abuse.
GRACE: She was in such a fragile state of health. How would daily abuse have affected her, Dr. Arnall?
ARNALL: Well, the chemotherapy may have affected the bone marrow so that she may have had easy bruising, but the constant abuse is going to have both physical and mental effects on this child.
GRACE: Very quickly, to Paula Bloom, clinical psychologist.
Paula, weigh in, please.
PAULA BLOOM, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST, BLOGGER, HUFFINGTON POST: Boy, it`s amazing to me. It`s so easy for us to sit back here and say, why didn`t anyone do anything? And I`m a psychologist and a mom and somebody who`s one of those mandatory reporters, and I know it`s a really hard thing to do sometimes.
It`s scary. It`s scary. And in this country we really value autonomy and people don`t want to step on toes. But this shows us that we`ve got to speak up.
Thank God for this show, Nancy.
GRACE: You know, I really don`t understand where you`re coming from, Paula, because when I have observed, for instance, in grocery stores and parking lots, restaurants, malls, if I have observed an adult mistreating a child, I don`t have a problem at all.
BLOOM: Right.
GRACE: Reprimanding them in open and calling 911 from my cell phone. So what`s the problem?
BLOOM: What`s -- well, Nancy, you`re somebody who you`ve taken your own pain and transformed it into power. You`re somebody who`s really strong.
A lot of people are scared to do that. They don`t trust their own instincts. That`s the big thing here. All of these people had good instincts that`s something was going. Some people acted on them, some people didn`t.
GRACE: With me, Paula bloom, Atlanta, clinical psychologist.
And now back to Mr. Webb, his wife, Nancy, is with us. He`s having a really hard time breathing right now and he was called outside by police.
Nancy Webb, what`s going on?
NANCY WEBB, AT PROPERTY BEING SEARCH FOR EVIDENCE OF MISSING GIRL ZAHRA BAKER: Well, they`ve got a lot of lights out back of the house. It looks like they are doing a search around a brush pile, and that`s all that I can see from the house here.
GRACE: Do you know how many police are out there and what they`re --
N. WEBB: Yesterday they were out here and they searched then they come back this afternoon and that`s it. They`re just looking under some brush piles that`s in the back of the property.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: Nancy, Nancy, is that an area where the father had worked?
N. WEBB: The father -- the people who own the property out here, the father worked with him.
GRACE: Oh, I see.
N. WEBB: And they worked in some kind of a mulching place and the yard work. And evidently the child`s father brought loads of limbs and different debris out here and dumped it and they had a -- they had a chipper and they chipped up a bunch of wooden stuff, too.
GRACE: Got it.
N. WEBB: So they found blood, the dogs found blood on the chipper and blood in the wood pile out there. So --
GRACE: With me is Nancy Webb, who is right next door to the property being searched.
Miss Webb, you just cleared up a lot for me. Thank you.
Everybody, I can`t go to break without telling you about another story. Two little lives could be saved tonight. I`m talking about 2-year- old Justin Quinones and 4-year-old Jacob Quinones.
Straight out to Debra Mark, joining us from L.A. Debra with Talkradio 790 KABC.
Debra, what can you tell me about Justin and Jacob?
DEBRA MARK, ANCHOR, TALKRADIO 790 KABC: Nancy, nobody has heard from them at all. They`ve been missing since last Thursday. And we haven`t heard from the father or the paternal grandfather, who are suspected of taking these two little boys right from their mother.
GRACE: How did it go down, Debra? What happened?
MARK: Last week the mom was taking the trash out in an alley in her Anaheim apartment complex. Two boys, 4-year-old and 2-year-old boys were with her. And the car comes screaming down the alley. A man jumps out, grabs one of the boys, brings the boy back into the car, the van.
Turns out that was the grandfather. And then the father did the same thing with the 2-year-old baby right out of the mother`s arms.
GRACE: We know in many cases in domestic kidnappings it`s very often the fathers believe that the children would be better off dead than with the mother. Please help us. 714-765-1434.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The mother of 2-year-old Justin and 4-year-old Jacob.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She was putting trash out.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Vehicle drives into this darkened driveway. People get out of the van.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The men grab the children.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Toddlers were kidnapped. She said she saw it. Police believe her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: God is going to help me to bring them back.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Rupa Mikkilineni on the story.
Rupa, what more can you tell me about the disappearance of 2-year-old Justin and 4-year-old Jacob?
RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Nancy, we know the police think that they could be headed towards Texas. Houston, Texas is where this family is from. And it`s actually where the mom left the husband -- not the husband, sorry, the father of the children behind about a year ago and moved to Anaheim with the children.
We also know that there is a co-conspirator, David Nicholas, who was arrested and charged just in the last two days and he was the individual that helped hide out the grandfather and the father in his home along with his wife who`s a cousin to the father. And he has been charged with conspiracy to kidnap and child abduction as well.
GRACE: To the lines. Teresa, Ohio. Hi, Teresa. What`s your question?
TERESA, CALLER FROM OHIO: I`m just wondering why he would do this.
GRACE: You know, Paul Penzone, former sergeant, Phoenix PD and child advocate, whenever there is violence on a child, people go, why? There is no good motive. Obviously revenge against the mother.
PENZONE: Yes, and you know what? Not everyone is --
GRACE: And these things can turn on a dime, Paul, and go bad.
PENZONE: The potential for violence is extreme. There is a lot of emotion involved. There`s a lot of bitterness or spite. If she left and he wasn`t happy with it you have no idea what he is capable of doing if he doesn`t get his way.
So those children, their safety is the most important thing first. And once that`s established then deal with the other issues.
GRACE: Everybody, please help us. Look at these two little boys, tip line 714-765-1434. 2-year-old and 4-year-old Justin and Jacob Quinones.
Let`s stop and remember Marine Corporal Chad Powell, 22, West Monroe, Louisiana killed Iraq. On a third tour also served Afghanistan and Haiti. From the family of Marines, awarded the Purple Heart, National Defense Service medal, Global War on Terrorism service medal.
Loved his southern roots, hunting, fishing. Dreamed of being a wildlife and fisheries agent. Leaves behind grieving parents Jerry and Brenda, brothers Jesse and Christopher, serving the army, widow Danielle, son Elijah.
Chad Powell, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you.
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp, Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
