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Nancy Grace
Stepmother`s Jailhouse Letters May Give Clues to Zahra Case
Aired November 02, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live, North Carolina. A 10-year-old little girl snatched from her own bedroom in the dark of night. The little girl, Zahra, completely dependent on two hearing aids, can only walk with a prosthetic leg after losing her left leg to bone cancer. She vanishes into thin air, her bedroom empty, prosthetic leg missing, hearing aids left behind.
Last person to see Zahra alive, stepmommy. Did stepmommy confess to writing a phony million-dollar ransom note? We learn stepmommy gets rid of Zahra`s mattress just 48 hours before she finally reports Zahra gone. A mattress, believed to be Zahra`s spattered with DNA, uncovered by landfill workers. Is it the blood of 10-year-old Zahra? Little Zahra`s prosthetic leg found discarded in overgrown brush off a county back road. K9s, police, backhoes, search teams, swarm the Baker home and start the digging. About half a dozen FBI enter the home, covering the windows so we can`t see inside. The search goes into the night.
In the last 24 hours, a secret grand jury charges stepmommy in Zahra`s disappearance, while across town investigators rip out sheetrock and drywall from Zahra`s bedroom, seizing furniture from the Baker home.
Bombshell tonight. As we go to air, we obtain exclusive letters reportedly written by stepmommy from behind jailhouse walls. Stepmommy says what Adam Baker did to Zahra was, quote, "horrifying," admits she`s a pagan worshiper, obsessed with Halloween, vampires and the dark arts, blames Zahra for beating cancer, goes on to complain about photos of her seen in the media and about having to cover her tattoos and body piercings. Stepmommy admits she wants to become a media star, saying her favorite song is "Living Dead Girl," and whines incessantly about missing her quote, "warm waterbed." Not one mention of missing or loving little Zahra. And is the daddy, Adam Baker, about to be rearrested? Tonight, where is 10- year-old Zahra?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: Hickory police 911. What is your emergency?
ADAM BAKER, ZAHRA`S FATHER: Yes, my daughter`s been taken.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: New twist for a missing North Carolina girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: AOLNews has obtained letters allegedly written by stepmom Elisa Baker, where Baker discusses Zahra`s disappearance and claims Zahra`s father, Adam Baker, did something horrifying after Zahra died.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What happened to her?
911 OPERATOR: Your daughter`s missing?
BAKER: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra`s stepmother, Elisa Baker, she describes how she will divorce Adam Baker because she`s afraid of him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you think happened to Zahra?
BAKER: I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re not looking for a body.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These letters, sent to a murder-abilia Web site, go on to describe how cops allegedly knows where Zahra is and what he has done.
BAKER: I appreciate everyone -- everyone doing what they`re doing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He seems concerned.
BAKER: I just hope they just keep looking.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know how sincere his concern is.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s no desperation in his voice.
BAKER: My name is Adam Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s no urgency.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It appears they may have taken my daughter.
GRACE: Did you hear the father laugh?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s hitting that broody stage.
GRACE: You judge them for yourself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight: Are her parents right, has a precious 16-year-old girl, Shelby Ellis (ph), been kidnapped by a vampire cult? Tonight, where is high school sophomore Shelby Ellis?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Missing kid.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The 16-year-old sophomore.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A Goth lifestyle.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s happened to Shelby Ellis?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: An obsession with vampires.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m truly afraid that she`s not alive.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her 16-year-old daughter, Shelby, missing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What flashes through my brain every day is, Is the girl laying in a ditch on the side of the road?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The last known activity on the Internet was logging on to this Web the site, Vampirefreaks.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pentagrams and candles, the crazy things that you see on TV that are associated with the darker cult lifestyle.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s either being coerced to not have contact with her family, or she`s not able to.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does her involvement on a dark Web site hold the key?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. A 10-year-old little girl snatched from her own bedroom in the dark of night. As we go to air, we obtain exclusive letters reportedly written by stepmommy from behind jailhouse walls. Where is 10-year-old Zahra?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She cannot answer these questions.
GRACE: Where is Zahra?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because the answers could be devastating.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: AOLNews has obtained letters allegedly written by stepmom Elisa Baker, where Baker (INAUDIBLE) Zahra`s father, Adam Baker, did something horrifying after Zahra died.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whether he had an active role in disappearing this little girl.
GRACE: K9s hit on Daddy`s industrial wood chipper.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Or whether it`s simply through turning a blind eye.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These letters, allegedly written by Baker from behind bars, detail the events surrounding Zahra`s disappearance and the stepmom`s arrest.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did she ever do anything, Adam?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would make fun of the child.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Admitted to writing the ransom note.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra`s stepmom.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would taunt her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s absolutely complicit.
GRACE: If the stepmommy did do it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker allegedly writes that cops not only where Zahra`s body is, but they allegedly know what he has done.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) her body?
BAKER: I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) concerned about their own daughter.
BAKER: I don`t know.
GRACE: The father sat by and let it happen.
BAKER: It appears they might have taken my daughter.
GRACE: They can all get a one-way ticket to hell!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. For those of you just joining us, we have obtained exclusively for TV use letters written from stepmommy from behind jailhouse walls. And I got to tell you, I`ve got an earful. Aside from saying what her husband, Adam Baker, Zahra`s natural father, did to her was, quote, "horrifying," she signs it like this -- "Some girls want to be princesses when they grow up. I want to be a vampire." She signs everything "Dark love," "Vampires rule," "You`re my dark heart."
What she says about Zahra is that she blames the child. All this -- in other words, the attention focused on Zahra`s disappearance -- wouldn`t have happened if Zahra had not been a cancer survivor from Australia. She actually blames Zahra for beating cancer. She goes on to whine about having to cover up her tattoos and body piercings, and how much she loves them, how she misses her warm waterbed. It goes on and on.
And out of all these pages I`m looking at, not once does she say, Where is Zahra? I love her. I want to hold her in my arms. I want to put her to sleep at night. How -- what has become of her? Why was her leg thrown away? I can`t stand to think that she`s suffering. Not once does she exhibit one ounce of love or human kindness for this little girl! Can you imagine your mommy figure wanting to grow up to be a vampire, admitting her favorite holiday is Halloween because she`s a pagan worshiper?
Out to David Lohr joining us exclusively tonight. He is the crime reporter of AOLNews.com. He is the one responsible for getting his mitts on these letters and sharing them with us tonight.
Enough from me, David. How did you get these letters? And what did you learn?
DAVID LOHR, AOLNEWS.COM: Well, the letters were actually sent to Eric Geen (ph). He runs a murder-abilia Web site on the Internet called SerialkillersInc (ph). He had received letters from Ms. Baker last week, provided us copies of them. Obviously, the revelations in them are quite shocking, and that`s why we moved forward and published them.
GRACE: You know, David, the interest in Zahra is incredible, and what happened to her. And after you`ve read these letters -- everyone, joining us is David Lohr, crime reporter with AOLNews.com, who is sharing the letters with us. What were your impressions of her? I mean, she comes out and says Zahra`s dead, she`s not missing. And the only thing she says about anything that happened to her specifically is that it was, quote, "horrifying."
LOHR: Yes. She says, We didn`t kill her, but what he did afterwards was quite horrifying, to paraphrase, so suggesting after she was dead, something horrific was done to her. So it`s quite a startling revelation, and it goes along the lines with everything else in the letter. She claims Zahra`s not missing, the police know where she`s at, and you know, basically wants to direct a lot of pity towards herself and her current conditions.
GRACE: You know, that`s something I noticed, David. And after I -- when I go to commercial break, I probably won`t even have enough time to do it then because it`s so -- such a huge number -- I`m going to count how many times she said I, I, I, I, throughout the entire -- all the letters that you`ve obtained. It`s all about me, how she`s being misjudged, how people don`t understand her, how people want her to be normal but she can`t be because she wants to be a vampire.
Joining us right now, Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session." I know you`ve combed over these with a finetoothed comb. Thanks to crime reporter David Lohr, what have you learned, Jean Casarez?
JEAN CASAREZ, "IN SESSION": You know, legally, you see her state of mind. You see her knowledge. When she says, we really didn`t kill her, she places herself at the point of time that that all happened. She talks about that she is a party to a crime, and then she talks about what he did afterwards is horrifying, after the fact. That`s not the murder. That`s the cover-up. And so legally, she puts herself in the midst of it.
On another point, she talks about Halloween. This is such a recent letter. She just wrote this. She said she`s so concerned she has to miss Halloween. It`s her favorite holiday. She`s only 42 years old, and the camera really doesn`t put her in the best light possible when she`s been on television.
GRACE: And you know, Jean, she goes on to state that she wants to be in the media. She wants to be a media star, but her lawyer won`t let her, Jean.
CASAREZ: That`s right. She wants to tell her story, she said.
GRACE: Joining me right now is a very special guest, along with Marc Klaas out of San Francisco, Andy Kahan, the director of the Houston mayor`s crime victims` office. He monitors murder-abilia sites. I met him years ago while crusading for victims` rights, and he showed me his extensive research of people that make blood money off murder.
Well, Andy Kahan, in a sad way, I hate to say, we meet again. What do you think, Andy?
ANDY KAHAN, HOUSTON MAYOR`S CRIME VICTIMS` OFFICE: Yes, Nancy. Thanks for having me back. You know, it`s really sad. And the reality is, they`re exploiting, you know, Zahra, her disappearance and presumed death. And you`re right, this is blood money, plain and simple. And this is just the beginning of the merchandising and marketing of Zahra, as well. You`re just seeing the tip of the iceberg right now.
GRACE: Marc Klaas, joining us out of San Francisco. Weigh in, Marc.
MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: I am apoplectic. I first met Andy on this very issue. He introduced me to this murder-abilia business. This is nothing more than serial killers, rapists and murderers and their agents profiteering off of their crimes. It`s blood money. They`ve done it to my daughter. They do it to all of these crime victims. And apparently and unfortunately, it`s perfectly legal.
The people that deal in this, whether they`re selling it, whether they`re agents for it, whether they create it, are doing nothing more than exploiting death, death and destruction.
GRACE: You know what, Marc?
KLAAS: Listen, Nancy, they`re selling the fingernail clippings, for God`s sake, of these characters. There somehow is some kind of an audience there that wants to participate in this and own this garbage, this horrible, terrible stuff.
GRACE: You know, Marc Klaas, you and Andy Kahan out of Houston are completely correct. Marc, what I`m focusing on is what I`m learning from these letters about what happened to Zahra. And Marc Klaas, there is no doubt about it. She is clearly inferring that Zahra is dead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What happened to 10-year-old Zahra Baker?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Who fought cancer.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zahra Clare Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Lost her leg.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zahra.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And her hearing.
ZAHRA BAKER, CANCER SURVIVOR: I can actually hear most things without my hearing aids.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police in Hickory, North Carolina, believe she is dead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What can you tell us about Zahra?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Zahra`s stepmother, Elisa baker, has allegedly written letters to a murder-abilia site claiming they didn`t kill Zahra but says Zahra`s father, Adam Baker, did something kind of horrifying after the fact.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why is she so special?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A North Carolina landfill.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Charged.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Charged with a class H.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Felony obstruction of justice.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has reportedly been brought out to a new search area.
BAKER: Nothing ever upset her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From the jail.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Less than a mile.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From where Elisa Baker used to live.
BAKER: Wanted to do everything for everyone.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You don`t believe him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All of this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Adam, did you have any involvement in her disappearance?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As Zahra`s father, Adam Baker, sits in jail.
BAKER: No.
GRACE: You judge them for yourself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) father.
GRACE: This little girl is either missing or dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Father is cooperating at this time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He seems concerned.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At such time that we need to serve those processes, we will.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know how sincere his concern is.
BAKER: I appreciate everyone -- everyone doing what they`re doing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: If you read these letters, it would make you sick to your stomach. We got the number of I`s in the first letter. She says "I" 47 times. The second letter, she says it 68 times.
To David Lohr, crime reporter, AOLNews.com. David, are these posted on AOL right now?
LOHR: No. We just have excerpts of the letters up on the site right now.
GRACE: Excerpts?
LOHR: Yes.
GRACE: Man! OK, we`re taking your calls. Jessica in Maryland. Hi, Jessica.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I hate to say this. This is sick. The stepmother knows something. She`s writing letters saying stuff. And the father supposedly shows up at the airport at 3:00 o`clock in the morning? They know a little bit more than what they`re saying.
GRACE: A little bit? Jessica, in this letter -- in this letter, she says what Adam Baker did to Zahra is, quote, "horrifying." She goes, We didn`t really kill her, but what he did was horrifying, as she distances herself from him.
Unleash the lawyers, Doug Burns, defense attorney, New York, Hugo Rodriguez, defense attorney, former fed with the FBI, out of Miami. Hugo, come on! You and I talked about it. It was just a matter of time before stepmommy turns on Daddy, and here`s the beginning.
HUGO RODRIGUEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Previous -- the last couple weeks, we`ve seen extensive searches being done by law enforcement. They had had to receive information. I`m speculating that she gave them that information, because she`s insinuating that she`s cooperated with them. She`s still in. He`s out.
GRACE: You know, another thing in this, Doug Burns -- she keeps blaming him, but she`s the one behind bars. She also says she`s going to be "debriefed" at the end of the week and that daddy, Adam Baker, is going to get rearrested.
DOUG BURNS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. Working off of Hugo`s point, the obvious thing is they got to put pressure on her, Nancy, a lot of pressure because she may have obstructed justice by lying. But if she knows what really happened on the murder, that`s what they need to pressure her on.
GRACE: She says, "He knows what happened to Zahra. Yet I`m the one in here, at least for now. If I hadn`t admitted to the stupid ransom note, I`d be out. But no, they kept pushing me. And he did that, too."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Adam, did you have any involvement in her disappearance?
BAKER: The police were out here last night over a fire and a ransom note for my boss`s daughter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This guy is reading a script.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Simply not checking on your own daughter.
911 OPERATOR: Prosthetic leg was taken with her?
BAKER: Yes, ma`am.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her parents said they last saw her at 2:30 Saturday morning.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You think your wife might have had some involvement in all this?
BAKER: I don`t know.
911 OPERATOR: She has one leg?
BAKER: One leg, yes.
911 OPERATOR: Partially amputated?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You don`t believe him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Straight out to the lines. To Dolores in North Carolina. Hi, Dolores.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have the police considered asking the father if he has in any way sexually abused Zahra? Because some of his stories are just not adding up, by him saying she was in her puberty, and he never saw her, but yet he knew this? Just things aren`t adding up about this man.
GRACE: You know, Dolores, you`re right. Nothing he says adds up, absolutely nothing, and starting with that bogus 911 call. But there`s no way that he is going to admit to anything, be it molestation or murder. Again, he has not been named a suspect or a defendant in this case.
But Dolores, the other problem is, the reality is, is that he is a target, whether police want to admit it or not. So if they try to question him, he will use his lawyer and they will invoke their 5th Amendment right to remain silent. You`re not going to get a word out of him.
Back to Jean Casarez and David Lohr. David Lohr, crime reporter, AOLNews.com, that got his hands on these letters, exclusive letters by Elisa Baker, written from behind jailhouse walls. "I never had a drug problem and people think paganism is devil worshipping." OK. David, she talks about herself non-stop. At any point, did you see her or read where she worried about Zahra and what happened to Zahra?
LOHR: No, she`s more concerned about herself. She complains she`s in solitary confinement, that she only receives hate mail, even from her own kids. And you know, it`s like you said at the beginning, it`s all Me, me, me. She says nothing about the little girl.
GRACE: And she says the photos that have been used on the air, quote, "suckses (ph)." "This whole situation suckses. I`ve never been so angry as I have been til now."
And Jean Casarez, what about this? "I don`t want to be normal. I`ve tried, but it`s hard covering all my tattoos, and I love my piercings." Now, how`d you like to call that your mommy?
CASAREZ: Well, remember, she`s writing a letter to a man that has written to her, somebody that she appears to be interested in.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Hickory Police, 911. Where`s your emergency?
ADAM BAKER, FATHER OF MISSING 10-YEAR-OLD GIRL ZAHRA BAKER: Yes, my daughter`s missing.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Ten-year-old Zahra Baker --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Presumed murdered.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Homicide investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s no body yet.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Catawba County, 911.
A. BAKER: Hey, how you doing?
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: I`m good.
A. BAKER: I need police.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What an incriminating 911 call.
A. BAKER: I get up a little while ago and it appears that they took my daughter instead of my boss` daughter.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casual disconnected father and stepmother.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Stepmother Elisa Baker has reportedly been brought out to a new search area today.
A. BAKER: My daughter is I think coming into puberty. She`s hitting that broody stage.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What 10-year-old broods?
NANCY GRACE, HOST: He even laughs.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What do you think happened to Zahra?
A. BAKER: I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need somebody outside the immediate family.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: No one has seen your daughter since 2:30 this morning?
A. BAKER: No.
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: He seems very lackadaisical about it.
A. BAKER: Everybody knows more than I do.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I`m looking at the lyrics of her favorite song that you hear as soon as you log on to her MySpace. It`s called "Living Dead Girl." "Crawl on me, sink into me, die for me, living dead girl. Blood on her skin, dripping with sin, do it again, living dead girl."
It goes on and on and on.
OK. Dr. Janet Taylor, psychiatrist, joining us out of New York, help me out, Janet.
DR. JANET TAYLOR, PSYCHIATRIST: She`s just a psychopath. Stepmommy is too good for her. She is a stepmonster. She has no remorse. It`s all about herself. She`s blaming other people.
Poor Zahra, just to live in that house of horrors must have been terrible.
GRACE: You know I want to go back to Marc Klaas.
Marc, what can we learn other than an in-depth look at who this woman really is, but what can we learn about the life Zahra was leading?
KLAAS: Well, I think the doctor just said it. I mean this woman is just evil through and through. Her favorite song seemed to fantasize about what she wanted to do to this poor little child.
She seemed to have the perfect foil in the husband, the perfect foil or the perfect partner, and together, they`ve managed to destroy a precious little life and now all this woman seems to be able to do is to think about herself.
What they need to do is they need to find a reason to re-arrest him. They have to separate them, they have to divide and conquer them, and that can best be done with an expert interrogator.
It shouldn`t take long. These are not smart people. They have misstepped every way -- every step of the way through this, and it won`t be long, I believe, until the truth comes out.
GRACE: To Paul Penzone, former sergeant, Phoenix PD, child advocate.
Paul, I thought that when the prosthetic leg, Zahra`s prosthetic leg, was found discarded on a county road in some overgrown brush, that that would crack the case. What`s the holdup, Paul?
PAUL PENZONE, DIRECT OF PREVENTION PROGRAMS, CHILDHELP.ORG, FMR. SERGEANT, PHOENIX PD: I don`t know. You know, when I saw that on your show I felt the same way. I think what they have to do is go back to the beginning. Something that went on early in the investigation, they did a lot of investigating talking to people who had been around Zahra and his family prior to this incident.
That`s going to be critical to establishing if they`re not able to find this poor little girl, her body, and prove how the murder occurred from that aspect. They have to show the abuse and behavior that went on prior to her missing, because they`re going to have to try them possibly without a body.
That would be a very difficult circumstance. So that`s the part of the investigation that`s so critical right now.
GRACE: Joining us also is Dr. Leigh Vinocur, University of Maryland School of Medicine, joining us out of Maryland.
Doctor Vinocur, thank you for being with us.
DR. LEIGH VINOCUR, M.D., UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: My pleasure.
GRACE: Doctor, the leg, the prosthetic leg, how difficult would it be to have destroyed it?
VINOCUR: Well, it depends the material that it was made of. I`m assuming it was one of those composite plastic legs and they`re pretty tough, but obviously, you could probably put it through a chipper, hack it up. I mean they are pretty tough, but there are ways to destroy it.
It sounds like they just tried to discard it, and they all have serial numbers, whether they`re hidden inside the leg or on the outside. So you can always trace it back and every patient that gets one, the serial number`s put on their chart so.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Jennifer in Minnesota. Hi, Jennifer.
JENNIFER, CALLER FROM MINNESOTA: Hi, Nancy.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
JENNIFER: I want to know if Adam Baker has a criminal record in Australia. And I also want to say that I think that he and Elisa are extremely selfish for bringing her over here.
GRACE: I agree. She was so happy in Australia with her grandmother.
To Natisha Lance, what do we know about his history, if any?
NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: We don`t know about him having a criminal history in Australia but we do know about him having a criminal history in the States. And he was arrested on some of those charges for passing bad checks and things of that nature.
But also, Nancy, Adam Baker was back at his home today. He was there with his attorney taking pictures in the backyard. He was there for about two hours, and his attorney says that this is all just part of the process.
Now when he was there also, there were people in the neighborhood who were yelling at him, shouting at him, saying that now he is the one who should also be in jail.
GRACE: Back to the lawyers. Doug Burns, New York. Hugo Rodriguez, also joining us out of Miami.
Hugo, what compels these people to write long letters? Of course I`m thrilled that they do -- from behind bars?
HUGO RODRIGUEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, FMR. FBI AGENT: They`re not doing themselves any service. You know, we have her writing the threatening kidnap letter and now she`s writing this. Either she`s very smart or she`s very stupid. One or the other.
GRACE: What about it, Doug Burns?
DOUG BURNS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it`s more psychiatric than it is legal. It`s totally an ill-advised legal course. It creates all kinds of state of mind issues, as Jean and others explained it throughout the show.
And there`s just no way you want to be writing letters that indicate you know what happened, you know chronologies, you know the father knows specifically. It`s terrible and it`s mostly psychiatric.
GRACE: But you know, Jean Casarez, what`s interesting to me is the point that you brought out. She`s placing herself there at the time of the killing. And you know, based on this and finding the prosthetic leg, and if that matches, turns up with Zahra`s DNA on it in the form of blood, they`ve got a murder case.
JEAN CASAREZ, LEGAL CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": That`s right. And for somebody that says they haven`t found the body, well, that prosthetic leg was her body. That was her leg. That`s what she used every day to walk.
GRACE: And also, David Lord, crime reporter, AOLNews.com, who got ahold of these letters that have been extremely revealing. How much do you think these letters are going to go for online?
DAVID LORD, CRIME REPORTER, AOLNEWS.COM: You know, it`s really hard to say. There`s actually a lot of people out there that collect this type of thing. And one thing I`d like to add is when we talked to the sheriff`s department or the Hickory Police Department today to try and confirm that she had sent these letters, they said basically what`s in them is the same thing she is sending out to other people. They`re getting photocopies of everything.
GRACE: I don`t understand what the holdup is in the arrest.
Out to the lines. Vicky, North Carolina. Hi, Vicky.
VICKY, CALLER FROM NORTH CAROLINA: Hi, Nancy. I`m just wondering, the father, could he be arrested also for obstruction of justice since he made the 911 call?
GRACE: Jean Casarez, what about it?
CASAREZ: Sure.
GRACE: She`s right. She`s right. They --
CASAREZ: Sure.
GRACE: In that the ransom note was written by the stepmother, the phone call, they`re saying that`s obstruction but why not on Adam Baker?
CASAREZ: Well, I think he definitely could be charged with that. You know, Nancy, these letters really change the course of things because all fingers have been pointed at her. She`s now pointing all fingers at him so we have to look at party to a crime, a conspiracy. We have to look at both of them participating.
GRACE: Back to the lines. Valerie in Georgia. Hi, Valerie.
VALERIE, CALLER FROM GEORGIA: hi, Nancy.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
VALERIA: Well, I want to thank you for everything that you do, and my question is when the dad called 911 and stated that his daughter was missing and that it was supposed to be his boss` daughter instead of his daughter, was the boss` daughter spending the night at their house and has anybody spoke to his boss?
GRACE: What about it, Natisha Lance? I don`t believe anyone was spending the night there.
LANCE: They were not spending the night, Nancy. The boss was called. They did appear with the daughter, the boss and the daughter did show up at the home to prove to police that it was not his daughter who was abducted.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: So no one has seen your daughter since 2:30 this morning?
A. BAKER: No. Like I said we had all that drama last night and me and my wife went back to bed. And my daughter is, I think, coming into puberty so she`s hitting that brooding stage. So we only see her when she comes out when she wants something, and that`s about it.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: And did you say that she was handicapped?
A. BAKER: Yes, ma`am. She has above-the-knee amputation.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: OK. She has one leg?
A. BAKER: One leg. Yes, ma`am.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: That`s partially amputated?
A. BAKER: Yes. She has a prosthetic leg which apparently they`ve taken with her.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Prosthetic leg was taken with her?
A. BAKER: Yes, ma`am.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: You don`t have any idea at all?
A. BAKER: No. Like I said, it was all addressed to him. And it was all taken out on him. And I guess they thought he lives in this house.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: OK. Did you talk to your boss about it?
A. BAKER: I`ve just spoken to him and he told me he`s going to be here shortly.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: OK. So did you think that he knows?
A. BAKER: We had an officer out here last night and he ran through who he thought it may have been, like an ex-employee or something.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Catawba County, 911.
A. BAKER: Hey, how you doing?
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: I`m good.
A. BAKER: I need police.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Hickory Police 911. Where`s your emergency?
A. BAKER: Yes, my daughter is missing.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: I`m sorry?
A. BAKER: My daughter --
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Your daughter`s missing?
A. BAKER: Yes, ma`am.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: OK. What`s your address?
A. BAKER: 2121st Avenue Northwest. The police were out here last night, over a fire and a ransom note for my boss` daughter. And I got up a little while ago and it appears that they took my daughter instead of my boss` daughter.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: I`m not familiar with what happened last night. What happened last night?
A. BAKER: Last night we were woken, my dog woke me up and I had a fire in the backyard. And somebody had poured gas in my company vehicle that I drive for work. They left a ransom note on the company vehicle to my boss saying they had his daughter, and his son was next, and his daughter`s fine. His daughter came with him here last night when I called him. And it appears they may have taken my daughter instead of his daughter.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: OK. Do you know who this was?
A. BAKER: I don`t know who --
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: That may have taken her?
A. BAKER: No, ma`am.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: Do you have any idea why they were threatening to take his daughter?
A. BAKER: I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: OK. What`s your name?
A. BAKER: My name is Adam. Baker?
UNIDENTIFIED 911 DISPATCHER: So no one has seen your daughter since 2:30 --
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. For those of you just joining us, obtained by David Lord, crime reporter at AOLNews.com. Letters written by stepmommy in the last days, from behind jailhouse walls, where she whines about missing her warm water bed. How people are judging her, how she wants to be a vampire, how she is a pagan worshipper, and is a freak. She says what happened to Zahra was horrifying.
With us, David Lord, crime reporter, AOL, Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session."
David, does she admit that Zahra is dead?
LORD: Well, you know, she kind of hints around to it, suggests that. She said she`s not missing, you know, she should just -- said Adam did something to her afterwards. I mean she doesn`t come out and specifically say that she`s dead but you know in a roundabout way, she hints at it.
GRACE: You`re right. Jean Casarez, interpret.
CASAREZ: I think she definitely says that she`s dead. Zahra isn`t missing, the cops know where she is, he did it all, he did it all.
GRACE: "And we really didn`t kill her, but what he did to her after is horrifying." That is what she says.
Out to the lines. Dana in Mississippi. Hi, Dana.
DANA, CALLER FROM MISSISSIPPI: Greetings to you, Miss Nancy and the panel.
GRACE: Thank you, dear. What`s your question?
DANA: Quick question and comment. Has either the stepmother or father indicated that they are willing to take a lie detector test? And --
GRACE: Fat chance. Go ahead.
DANA: And the stepmother`s mug shot, it looks to me that she has like an evil smirk on her face. That`s all. Thank you.
GRACE: Let me see that mug shot, Liz. Let me see her mug shot. You know, it will be a cold day in H-E-L-L before these two sign up for a polygraph.
What about it, Rodriguez?
RODRIGUEZ: It`s a very good question but I doubt very seriously that either one of them will subject themselves to a test.
GRACE: Doug?
BURNS: I agree. And also, that mug shot is interesting because if you look at 99 percent of mug shots, you don`t see somebody smiling or smirking in that fashion. Seriously.
GRACE: Gee, I sure would like to see it, Liz. How about that mug shot?
OK. Back to the lines. Deborah in Arkansas. Hi, Deborah.
DEBORAH, CALLER FROM ARKANSAS: Hi.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
DEBORAH: What I wanted to know, have they found anything else in the house? Are the police saying --
GRACE: Oops, you know what, Deborah, I couldn`t hear you. Would you start over, please?
DEBORAH: Yes, ma`am. Have they found anything else? Have the police gave any indication of anything else in the house that they have been tearing apart?
GRACE: Good question. What do you know, Natisha Lance?
LANCE: When we spoke to police today, they did say that evidence was taken from the home. We know that drywall was taken down from the home. They are not going into specifics about what they are taking out of the home and using as evidence, though.
GRACE: There you go. That mug shot.
Everybody, I got to switch gears. I want to tell you about a missing 16-year-old and her parents firmly believe she has been kidnapped by a vampire cult.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Her parents fear she may be involved with some type of vampire cult.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: 16-year-old Shelby Ellis --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This dark, let`s be different, let`s been gothic, let`s suck blood. I mean just all kinds of dark stuff.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Missing.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Fascinated with vampires and the dark side of life.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Vanished.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: May be an underground cult.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Her parents say she hung out on a Web site called Vampirefreaks.com
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Shelby took the bus to school and she never came home.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She may have gotten --
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight to Nicole Partin, investigative reporter.
Nicole, what do you know about Shelby?
NICOLE PARTIN, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: Good evening, Nancy. We know that Shelby Ellis, 16 years old, left home October 11th with about $160 and a cell phone. She boarded the bus to school and hasn`t been seen since.
This after logging on to and gaining access to a Web site, Vampirefreaks. We`re being told she was not allowed to get on this Web site at home. Her parents had banned her from. But she was accessing this Web site from school.
Nancy, I`ve been on this site this evening, repulsive language, nude photos, pictures of people claiming to be vampires, drinking blood.
I`m in the field of mortuary science, forensic medicine. This is nothing to play around with. Vampires drinking blood. There are blood- borne pathogen diseases that are serious life threatening. This is not a game.
GRACE: Joining me right now special guest, Wendy Ellis. This is Shelby`s stepmom.
Wendy, thank you for being with us. Wendy, what do you believe has become of Shelby? Why do you think she may be somehow tangled up in this cult?
WENDY ELLIS, STEPMOM OF 16-YEAR-OLD MISSING GIRL, SHELBY ELLIS: I don`t have any significant evidence that she`s into a cult per se. However, she claimed and showed pictures of an Internet boyfriend at school on this Vampirefreaks.com Web site.
I do know that she spoke to him the day that she disappeared. And she always gets on that site somehow whether it`s at school, at friends` houses, wherever she can get on it at.
GRACE: Do you believe she is in danger right now?
ELLIE: I`m afraid that she can be, yes, ma`am.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ELLIS: Nothing has been heard from Shelby and I`m truly afraid that she`s not alive.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The last known activity on the Internet was logging on to this Web site, Vampirefreaks.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: It includes list of pictures of members in full Goth clothing.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The details about Goth and vampire themes. Gatherings all over the world. Many in the Atlanta area.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The crazy things that you see on TV that are associated with the darker cult lifestyle.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And this is by far not first time someone may have been tangled up in a vampire cult.
Roderick Ferrell, member of a gang of teens. That was Vampire Clan. Double slaying of Naomi Ruth and Richard Wendorf. Then there`s (INAUDIBLE), bank teller, (INAUDIBLE), murdered by him.
It goes on and on. Your fears are well put.
Rupa Mikkilineni, what more can you tell us? Wendy Ellis, Shelby`s stepmom, with us now.
Rupa, go ahead.
RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right. We also know, Nancy, that two other classmates of the same high school that Shelby goes to also vanished. One was one of her best friends who she just perhaps had a falling out with about a week before Shelby vanished.
Then she vanished a week later after Shelby vanished. And then another girl vanished the week after that. Now both of those girls had been found, are safe and sound. However Shelby --
GRACE: Back to Wendy Ellis, Shelby`s stepmother.
Wendy, obviously there`s a connection with Shelby`s disappearance and these other girls.
ELLIS: I believe there`s a connection in that. I know that they all dabble in the Gothic lifestyle. Try to live that kind of life if you see these girls out. One I`ve never met personally. The one of the two that have been found recently, I believe Saturday night, I have had some dealings with. Always had some concerns about her and her activities as well as Shelby`s.
GRACE: Let me give you the Web site, the tip line. 770-499-4563. 770-499-4563. Help us bring Shelby home.
Let`s stop and remember Marine Corporal Jeffrey Boskovitch, 25, Seven Hills, Ohio, killed Iraq. Awarded the Purple Heart, Marine Corps Reserve medal, Iraq Campaign medal, Armed Forces medal.
Lost his life before his dream wedding. Never met a stranger. Loved God, family, football, his dog Bing. He got an exchange for jelly beans in Iraq. Dreamed of college and being a cop. Accepted in Ohio state`s Highway Patrol but never got to live that dream. Leaves behind parents Kathy and Jim, brother Brian, sister Kim, fiancee Shelly.
Jeffrey Boskovitch, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being us with. See you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
