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Nancy Grace
Search Uncovers Bone That May Be Zahra`s
Aired November 03, 2010 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live, North Carolina. A 10-year-old little girl snatched from her own bedroom in the dark of night. The little girl, Zahra, completely dependent on two hearing aids, can only walk with a prosthetic leg after losing her left leg to bone cancer. She vanishes into thin air, her bedroom empty, prosthetic leg missing, hearing aids left behind.
Last person to see Zahra alive, stepmommy. Did stepmommy confess to writing a phony million-dollar ransom note? Stepmommy gets rid of Zahra`s mattress just 48 hours before she finally reports Zahra gone. A mattress believed to be Zahra`s spattered with DNA uncovered by landfill workers. Is it the blood of 10-year-old Zahra? Little Zahra`s prosthetic leg found discarded in overgrown brush off a county back road. K9s, police, search teams, backhoes swarm the Baker home and start digging. Half a dozen FBI enter the home, searching into the night.
A secret grand jury charges stepmommy in Zahra`s disappearance, while investigators rip out sheetrock from Zahra`s bedroom, seizing her furniture. We obtain exclusive letters written by stepmommy from behind jailhouse walls, saying what Adam Baker did to Zahra was, quote, "horrifying," admits she`s a pagan worshiper, obsessed with Halloween, vampires and the dark arts, blames Zahra for beating cancer, complains about photos of herself seen on TV and about having to cover up her tattoos and body piercings. Stepmommy admits she wants to become a TV star and whines about missing her own waterbed. Not one mention of missing Zahra.
Bombshell tonight. As we go to air, in a densely wooded area, investigators uncover a little bone believed to be Zahra`s. Also at this hour, investigators draining the pond next to where 10-year-old Zahra`s prosthetic leg found. This as we uncover even more jailhouse letters from stepmommy tonight. What happened to 10-year-old Zahra?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A shocking discovery.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They`re getting closer and closer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A bone that could be related to the Zahra Baker case.
GRACE: K9s, police, backhoes, search teams.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police believe it`s human.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All fingers have been pointing at her. She wants to tell her story, she said.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa, do you have anything to say?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She wants to be in the media.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A lot of people don`t understand that treatment does tend to take other things away from you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s all me, me, me.
GRACE: I, I, I, I, I.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) ma`am (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She pushed herself in the midst of it.
911 OPERATOR: Your what`s on fire?
ELISA BAKER, ZAHRA`S STEPMOTHER: The back yard. We`ve got big mulch piles and wood piles.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`ve seen her state of mind.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "My family has turned pretty much against me and everyone is telling so many lies."
GRACE: You judge them for yourself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "Ninety-eight percent of the media stuff is lies."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s more concerned about herself.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you miss your stepdaughter?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She has no remorse.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "My picture they`re using on TV sucks."
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think she`s a psychopath.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "I have told the cops everything I know about what`s happened to Zahra."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. As we go to air, there in a densely wooded area, investigators uncover a little bone believed to be Zahra`s.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "I heard I have even made it to the NANCY GRACE show."
GRACE: Bombshell tonight!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "They keep calling my lawyers and wanting an interview with me."
GRACE: A 10-year-old little girl snatched from her own bedroom in the dark of night.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have investigators found Zahra Baker?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "There are so many missing kids, but Zahra isn`t missing."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) this child has been murdered.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police reveal moments ago that they have recovered a bone.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The child is dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A bone that may be related to the Zahra Baker investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a little girl.
ZAHRA BAKER, CANCER SURVIVOR: I can actually hear more than without my hearing aids.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who has been discarded piece by piece.
ADAM BAKER, ZAHRA`S FATHER: It appears they may have taken my daughter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They discarded her mattress.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: DNA evidence on the mattress is now at a lab being tested.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They discarded her prosthetic leg.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigators have discovered a prosthetic leg.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are not smart people.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Adam, did you have any involvement in the disappearance?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have misstepped every step of the way through this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker admitted to writing the ransom note.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It won`t be long until the truth comes out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. For those of you just joining us, at this hour, investigators draining a pond next to the spot where Zahra`s prosthetic leg found abandoned in a densely wooded area. And have Zahra`s remains been found? A tiny bone has been uncovered. Is it Zahra`s?
Straight out to Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer. Ellie, what do we know?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Nancy, police announced today just before we went to air that they have recovered a bone. They believe it could be connected to the Zahra Baker disappearance. It`s undergoing testing right now. They won`t tell us exactly where they found it. But two major searches are going on today. You alluded to them. There was one of Caldwell County area, wooded area. In that area also a pond. Now, this is roughly that same location where they found the prosthetic leg. They are both draining a pond and searching a wooded area.
GRACE: This leads me to believe, although they are not pinpointing where the bone has been found, that it is found in that area.
Let`s go straight out to Melissa Mahlenbrock. She is there at the search site. She lives across the street. She joined us when the prosthetic leg was first found. Melissa, thank you for being with us. Melissa, what do you see? What`s been going on there all day?
MELISSA MAHLENBROCK, LIVES ACROSS THE STREET FROM SEARCH AREA: Yes, hello, Nancy. Thank you for having me. Today, the cops barricaded off Pine Mountain Road to Christie, and at the end of Christie again, the two to three-mile strip going down, the same as before. They also had about roughly 15 to 20 cop cars, both marked and unmarked, outside of the gated area. And they also have the lovely (ph) rescue special operations truck out there. I don`t know what they were doing with the special operations truck, but they were going inside the wooded area behind the gate.
All about 20 people had shovels and they had anything that you could use to dig. I know that the pond that you were talking about is behind the gate and more towards the right. You can`t see it from the street, but it is back there.
GRACE: Joining us is Melissa Mahlenbrock. She is there at the search site. She lives just across the street. Melissa, I know that you joined us the night that her prosthetic leg was found discarded in that overgrown brush. They are draining the pond not far from where you were standing. But it seems to me that they believe that they`re going to find more in this area. We don`t know of any other wooded searches going on right now. This makes me think that that`s the area where the bone was found. What do you believe, Melissa?
MAHLENBROCK: You know, I noticed when they first came out here, they did remove quite a bit of brush and trees, anything that was overgrown, including the trash that they had put there behind the gated area. I know that when they found the prosthetic leg, it was somewhere behind that gate and inside that trash and the brushed area. The fact that they found a bone tonight, I can`t say whether or not they were looking outside of their original area, or honestly, if -- when it was placed there.
After the cops left, they did not come back. They left Friday and have not been back until today. So for those days, from Friday to Wednesday, no one has been over that area. No one`s gone to that area. No one`s been around it. So where they`re finding it, I`m not sure. Why they missed it the first day, I don`t know, either.
GRACE: Melissa, did people begin to drive around the area after it was reported her prosthetic leg was found there?
MAHLENBROCK: Yes, Nancy. People were driving around the area, stopping at the area. I actually drove past and saw an elderly couple stopped there and taking pictures in front of the gated area, as if it was, I don`t know, a spot to remember for anything other than a poor little girl went missing and her leg was found there.
GRACE: Standing by is Melissa Mahlenbrock. She is there on the scene where, at this hour, investigators are working into the night, draining a pond. Have bones of little 10-year-old Zahra Baker been found in the densely wooded area?
To Natisha Lance, our producer on the story. Natisha, what are you hearing? What bone of the body do we believe it is?
NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, that is something that they are not revealing at this point. The most they will say is that it was in Caldwell County. The only location that police told me today that they were searching was this area on Christie Road where the prosthetic leg was found.
Now, that road is about three miles long. They couldn`t give me an exact acreage amount as to how far the area was. They were doing a line search with about 12 searchers in that area, also bringing in other searchers from other areas. And as Ellie had said, they were also draining that pond.
Now, we do know that the bone was not found in the pond, so it was found somewhere in that wooded area. From our aerials, we are able to see that they were using chainsaws to cut down trees and remove as much brush as possible.
GRACE: Out to the lines. Leslie in North Carolina. Hi, Leslie. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. And thank you for taking my call. A quick comment. This is a sick, sick case, and these two people are just despicable. But my question is this. I think that they would know when they saw the bone whether it was human or animal. And don`t you -- for goodness sake, don`t you think they`ll be making an arrest soon?
GRACE: You know, I was stunned, Leslie in North Carolina, when an arrest was not made after the prosthetic leg was found. Everybody, we are talking about this little 10-year-old girl`s prosthetic leg. She lost her leg. It was amputated above the knee after she fought and survived childhood bone cancer and lung cancer. After surviving all that, she goes missing. Focus on her stepmother and her biological father.
I want to go out now to Captain Robert Tumlin, commander of the underwater search and recovery team, Clayton County police. Captain, what do you make of them draining the pond?
CAPT. ROBERT TUMLIN, CLAYTON COUNTY POLICE DEPARTMENT: Yes, ma`am. Miss Grace, having saw the coverage there, good indication, with a pond in that close proximity, of what they suspect to be a bone that`s found would give good cause to drain that pond, especially looking for evidence of possibly more bones and such as that. Underwater is a very good place to conceal evidence if you`re not wanting to be found. I certainly would, in that close proximity, drain that pond, as well.
GRACE: And Brad Dennis, director of search operations, Klaas Kids Foundation, we see the water flowing out, almost like it`s coming out of a fire hydrant. They are draining the pond as quickly as you can. How do you do this? How long will it take?
BRAD DENNIS, DIR. OF SEARCH OPS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, my understanding, Nancy, is that they were able to get through that pond fairly quickly today, being able to pump it out. The bigger question is, is how dense is the debris in the bottom of that pond? How dense is the mud, and you know, probably years worth of leaf debris in there, for them to be able to go through that to see if there`s any other type of evidence down at the bottom of that pond?
GRACE: And to Dr. Howard Oliver, former deputy medical examiner out of LA. In answer to Leslie`s question out of North Carolina, Dr. Oliver, how can they tell if it is a child`s bone?
HOWARD OLIVER, FMR. DEPUTY MEDICAL EXAMINER: Well, a long bone, for instance, from one of the limbs -- the legs or the arms -- or the pelvis would be fairly easy to tell. But smaller bones would be very difficult. It would take the -- it would take an anthropologist, forensic anthropologist to make that decision.
GRACE: For those of you just joining us, a pond being drained into the night. A bone has just been discovered, believed to be that of 10- year-old little Zahra.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: `We really didn`t kill her, but what he did after the fact is kind of horrifying. Makes me scared of him. So I probably am going to go ahead and file. I`ve lost my whole life anyway. I have been filtered a little of what the media is saying about me, from drug problems to witchcraft. I`ve never had a drug problem. And people think paganism is devil worshipping. Own (ph) world is so full of hypocrites."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Breaking news for you right now in the Zahra Baker case.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A heart-breaking, horrific story.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a homicide investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hickory Police Department is telling us a bone has been found in Caldwell County.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ten-year-old Zahra Baker.
GRACE: But she`s dead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Presumed murdered.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Homicide investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "Like I said, my lawyers don`t tell me all the world is saying, but if it is anything like these letters, OMG."
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They found her prosthetic leg.
GRACE: They knew where to go find that leg.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Based on a tip.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That bone is being sent to the medical examiner`s office right now in Chapel Hill for further examination.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Elisa Baker did take authorities through that area.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "I mean, I never thought it would be this way. My lawyers get death threats every day, too. This is so crazy."
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Elisa Baker, the stepmother, used to reside in that area.
GRACE: They`re sifting through very, very carefully.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A bone has been found, and Hickory police believe it may be connected to her case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They appeared to be looking for something small.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where did they discard her body?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Authorities still want to find Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "I just wonder if Zahra hadn`t survived cancer and been from Australia, if it would be truly like this. There are so many missing kids, but Zahra isn`t missing. The cops know where she is and what he has done. That`s right, what he has done. If I hadn`t admitted that stupid note, I`d be out in three weeks. But no, they kept pushing. And he did that, too."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls live. For those of you just joining us, a bone, a child`s bone, has just been discovered, believed to be the remains of little Zahra. At this hour, a nearby pond is being drained. The pond is being drained near where Zahra`s prosthetic leg was found. Cops are not telling us where the bone was found, but we have reason to believe it`s there in the same densely wooded area.
This as even more jailhouse letters have been uncovered. To David Lohr, crime reporter at AOLNews.com. David, now that you`ve had a chance to drink it all in and reread the letters, what do you make of what she says, the stepmommy behind bars, about Zahra`s disappearance?
DAVID LOHR, AOLNEWS.COM: Well, you know, I think the letters are very telling. It`s kind of like a puzzle when you read between the lines and put all the pieces together. But you know, if you look at the facts in the case, we have blood swabs they think were taken from the vehicles. We have dogs allegedly hitting on tree chippers and mulch piles. And then we have, you know, her saying something horrific happened. So you know, it all seems to point that something very terrible happened to a little girl.
GRACE: Well, with us, David Lohr, crime reporter at AOLNews.com. He is the one that first obtained the letters by stepmommy from behind bars. And after reading them very carefully, the letters leave no doubt that 10- year-old Zahra is dead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "Halloween is almost here. I`ve done nothing but cry. I want out of at least solitary confinement. I`m on suicide watch. Why, I have no idea. But I feel like I have nothing to live for now. I have heard I have even made it to the NANCY GRACE show. They keep calling my lawyers and wanting an interview with me. Everyone does. Sometimes I think my lawyers shouldn`t keep me out of the media. I want a chance to tell the truth and defend myself. No one else is. But I keep getting told say nothing is best.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: "Hope all is well with you since I heard from you. I wrote you and still haven`t heard back. Hopefully, you`re not believing the media. You`re the only friend I have at this point. Hopefully, you send some pictures so I get an idea of who I`m writing. I will be so glad to get out and go back to being myself, put my hair back like I normally wear it and be myself. This just ain`t me. I am not happy with some of my lawyers` decisions. They want to keep continuing cases that lowers my bond to a reasonable amount. And I ask about getting the superior case on docket quick, he says it could take six to eight months. I don`t want to be in here that long yet again because cause of something I didn`t do."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: For those of you just joining us, I am reading straight from a wire. Hickory police recover a bone that may be connected to the Zahra Baker case. Police refuse to confirm where the bone was recovered. However, they spent the majority of the day searching along Christie Road off Pine Mountain Road, the same area where Zahra`s prosthetic leg was found last week. They will not comment on what part of the bone -- body the bone appears to be from.
Unleash the lawyers, Lauren Lake, Alan Ripka, defense attorneys out of New York. First of all, to you, Lauren Lake. Even more letters surfacing, written behind jailhouse walls from stepmommy. This as a bone and the child`s prosthetic leg is found? Doesn`t look good. What`s your defense, Lauren Lake?
LAUREN LAKE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I`ll tell you what, Nancy. It`s ugly. And I look like Satan`s sidekick even defending this woman. However, in the letter, she talks about the fact that the father did it, that she was horrified, that he did all of this...
GRACE: Put up Lauren Lake!
LAKE: ... that she`s scared of him. So these are some facts that if these letters come in under state of mind exception, something happen...
GRACE: Guess what?
LAKE: ... we`re going to have to for these facts and work with them.
GRACE: Guess what, Lauren Lake?
LAKE: Yes, Nancy?
GRACE: In her next set of letters that go out, she says Adam Baker had nothing to do with it.
LAKE: Well...
GRACE: Ruh-roh!
LAKE: ... I tell you what...
GRACE: What about it, Alan Ripka?
LAKE: She`s horrified, remember?
ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Those letters are not coming in. They can`t be authenticated. They`ll never be used against her. And because you`re playing them now, they`re prejudicial to her case.
GRACE: Hey, that didn`t even make any sense, Ripka! They can be authenticated by any handwriting expert you want to bring in!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your own daughter, your flesh and blood.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m angry, extremely angry. He deserves to be locked up. He deserves to be in jail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you ever been in jail?
JEAN CASAREZ, LEGAL CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": Was the little girl actually locked in a tiny attic?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It ain`t a fun place to be.
SHIRLEY MIMS, BAKERS` FORMER NEIGHBORS, BELIEVE MISSING 10-YEAR-OLD ZAHRA KEPT IN ATTIC: We would hear noises up in the attic.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I sure miss my warm waterbed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think she was sleeping up there on a piece of sheet rock laid out across the rafters.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m on the floor at the moment in solitary confinement.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There was a bruise under her eye.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m climbing the walls literally.
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: History of cruelty.
CASAREZ: I just wonder if Zahra hadn`t survived cancer and been from Australia if it would be truly like this.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Elisa Baker --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She had nothing to do with this.
CHIEF TOM ATKINS, HICKORY POLICE: We`re not focusing on one person.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Adam, can we talk to you?
ATKINS: Anything is a possibility.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I`ve paid enough.
Hi, Damien. Sorry it took me so long to get back to you, but I had to wait until my lawyers put a little money on my account. Thanks for your moral support. I need it. Although I`m not sure I deserve it at this point.
As you probably know, my family has turned pretty much against me and everyone is telling so many lies. Yes, I had my lawyers shut my MySpace down because of the bad publicity.
But I know once I`m out, I will redo it. My birthday is 6-6-68 so people was reading too much into that and my opening song.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: She said it, not me. Her birthday is 6-6-68. All right?
We are taking your calls. But first straight out to Marc Klaas, president and founder of KlaasKids Foundation.
Marc, in light of the prosthetic leg being discovered off this county back road, a bone now found nearby, believed to have been Zahra`s, these letters surfacing, found by David Lohr on AOLNews.com. Weigh in.
KLAAS: The letters are fascinating. I think that the narcissistic psycho babble that she expresses most definitely puts her at the scene of the crime and that they will be verified very soon.
The thing I don`t agree with, though, Nancy, is making too much out of this bone or bone fragment or whatever it is. And I`ll tell you exactly why. Remember some months back, Misty Croslin was standing on the dock by the St. John River as they were pulling deer bones out of the water. And there was a lot of speculation at that time.
But even closer to home for me, is during the last days of Polly`s crime, I remember being on the floor, incapacitated, watching television, and every time a dog bone would show up, a reporter would breathlessly go on the air and say that the remains of Polly Klaas had been found.
And it was just absolutely excruciating. I did not believe it for a minute but I couldn`t really be very certain. And I know that there are people out there that are in Zahra`s family who are listening to this kind of speculation and they must be just going through complete and total agony right now, wondering whether or not it truly is her bone.
I think we need to wait until it`s verified.
GRACE: Good point. Marc Klaas, joining us from San Francisco.
We are taking your calls. Out to Kim in Iowa. Hi, Kim.
KIM, CALLER FROM IOWA: Hi, Nancy. So glad to get through. One thing I just have to tell you that`s disgusting to me that this is going on and this mother has this -- the audacity to make these letters and act all crazy.
But anyway, my question is, was CPS ever contacted and you know, like, when she was like taunting her going up the hill and pulling her hair and slapping her?
And one more thing, my birthday is 6-6-69 and I am not -- I mean it`s not -- I couldn`t pick that date. And it`s disgusting. I share the same birthday with this woman.
GRACE: Kim in Iowa, I`ve got a feeling that you have absolutely no similarity to her whatsoever.
Ellie Jostad, CPS was called, many times.
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Yes, that`s right, Nancy. I mean DFS won`t tell us exactly what their contact was with this family. But there are numerous people who claimed they did call DFS to report this alleged abuse.
GRACE: Out to the phones. Dee in Illinois. Hi, Dee.
DEE, CALLER FROM ILLINOIS: Hi. I just want to thank you, Nancy, for giving victims and missing children voices.
GRACE: Thank you.
DEE: That have been so violently shut up. My one question is, has the biological -- or the stepbrother, biological son of the stepmother, been questioned concerning this? And number two --
GRACE: You know, that is a -- go ahead.
DEE: Number two, while I do believe Zahra`s own father knew what was going on, I don`t think he disposed of that body by himself.
GRACE: Straight out to Natisha Lance. What do we know about the stepbrother, who is the stepmom`s natural son?
Remember when he was first questioned about his mom publicly, he would not defend her.
NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right, Nancy. Well, what we know is that he had an estranged relationship with his mother. He said that he didn`t have much contact with her. He`d only met Zahra a handful of times, even that.
I do believe that he has been questioned by police as well as other members of the family.
GRACE: I want to go to Sergeant Scott Haines, sheriff`s officer, Santa Rosa County, Florida.
Haines, don`t you believe that now would be a great time to re- question the defendants if their lawyers would allow it?
SGT. SCOTT HAINES, SHERIFF`S OFFICER, SANTA ROSA COUNTY, FL.: Absolutely. And the woman in this case, she keeps referring that she`s not allowed to talk. She has every right to talk. She can go against what her attorneys tell her to. So if she thinks it`s beneficial to her to do that, she has every option to do that.
It`s just that she knows that she is better off not talking to them because she knows what`s involved in.
GRACE: What about it, Dr. Patricia Saunders? Patricia, clinic psychologist joining us out of New York?
PATRICIA SAUNDERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: I think that Marc said it. This woman is narcissistic, psycho babble but it is malignant. These folks are truly what`s the old common law malignant and abandoned hearts.
GRACE: Out to the lines. Linda in Arkansas. Hi, Linda.
LINDA, CALLER FROM ARKANSAS: Hi, Nancy. I love those twins. Keep the pics coming.
GRACE: I`ve got some for you tonight.
LINDA: I have a friend, some of hers were twins. My question is, as I was watching these channel, and there was a tornado that hit Hickory last week and they showed a newspaper from Hickory and it showed the tornado on one side and picture of Zahra on the other.
And I`m was just wondering, a tornado will pick up things and move it or set it down someplace else, and I`m just wondering if that might not have happened with this bone in her body.
GRACE: What about it? What do you think, Ellie Jostad?
JOSTAD: Well, she`s exactly right, Linda is. There was terrible weather in that area. However, when you look at those aerials, you don`t see a lot of damage in that surrounding area. The trees appear to be intact. But remember in the Casey Anthony case, flooding in that area -- and I don`t know if this pond floods or if that area floods, but Caylee`s remains were spread due to flooding. So we could have a similar scenario here.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Trish in Arizona, hi, Trish.
TRISH, CALLER FROM ARIZONA: Hi.
GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?
TRISH: I`m just wondering, do they know if she -- if Zahra had any contact with her real mother or any of the family? And if she did have contact with her mother where she is?
GRACE: What do we know, Natisha Lance?
LANCE: The mother is still in Australia. Police have been in contact with her. They were making it a possibility that the mother could come to the United States during the course of this investigation.
But as far as reports have told us, Zahra had not seen her mother since she was about 8 months old and then there`s some reports out there that the mother had been looking for Zahra for about the past five years. So it`s not clear on what the relationship was between them.
GRACE: I find that really hard to believe that it`s taken five years and she couldn`t find her daughter.
We are taking your calls. But for those of you just joining us, a bone believed to be that of 10-year-old Zahra has been discovered.
I want to go back to Melissa Mahlenbrock. She is at the search site. She lives across the street from where the prosthetic leg was found.
Melissa, what is happening? Again, how long have cops been out there?
MELISSA MAHLENBROCK, LIVES ACROSS STREET FROM ZAHRA SEARCH AREA: The cops have been out some time in the morning. I would say after 7:30, the cops arrived. And the only cops that are left in the area are the ones that are by the barricades at the beginning of Pine Mountain and -- end of Christie. They`re no longer any cops near the gated area at all.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hope all is well with you since I heard from you. I wrote you and still haven`t heard back. Hopefully, you`re not believing the media. You`re the only friend I have at this point. Hopefully, you send some pictures so I get an idea of who I`m writing.
I would be so glad to get out and go back to being myself, put my hair back like I normally wear it and be myself. This just ain`t me. I am not happy with some of my lawyers` decisions. They want to keep continuing cases that lowers my bond to a reasonable amount and I ask about getting the superior case on docket quick. He says it could take six to eight months.
I don`t want to be in here that long. Yet again cause of something I didn`t do. He did all this.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Concern about Zahra spreads.
ADAM BAKER, FATHER OF MISSING 10-YEAR-OLD GIRL ZAHRA BAKER: Just keep looking.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Now being accused by his wife.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The cop knows where she is and what he has done.
KLAAS: Every move these people make --
A. BAKER: I don`t know. I don`t know. I don`t know.
KLAAS: -- incriminates them more.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Breaking news in the search for Zahra Baker.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Zahra is a cancer patient who has a prosthetic leg and hearing aids.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Investigators say they found a bone that may be related to the 10-year-old`s disappearance.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We really didn`t kill her, but what he did after the fact is kind of horrifying.
ATKINS: This outcome will not be positive.
DR. JOSHUA PERPER, MEDICAL EXAMINER, AUTHOR OF "WHEN TO CALL THE DOCTOR": Indicate that this child has been murdered.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A shocking discovery. Search teams say they`ve recovered a bone.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nothing has went the way it was supposed to, not yet so far. Ninety-eight percent of the media stuff is lies. That`s why everyone wants me dead, but I have two of the best lawyers in the country and my own private investigator.
I am 42, have been told I don`t look my age, even though my picture they are using on TV sucks. If you have read my MySpace, you know quite a bit about me but normally my hair is black and red and I have lost way too much weight.
I never knew I was to look and act like everyone else in this stupid world. I don`t want to be normal. I have tried but it`s hard covering all my tattoos and I love my piercings.
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GRACE: These letters are disgusting. Nowhere does she mention loving Zahra, missing Zahra, wondering what happened to Zahra. Is Zahra dead? Is Zahra in heaven? What became of her? What has she suffered? What was her life like as a cancer survivor?
Nothing. Not one thing. It`s all about me, my waterbed, my body piercings, my tattoos, my pictures on TV. I want to be on -- that`s all she talks about in all these letters. And it`s not just these.
Straight out to Ellie Jostad. There are other letters, are there not? And what do they reveal?
JOSTAD: Yes. That`s right, Nancy. Actually we spoke to somebody who got a letter from Elisa Baker. However, that woman says that Elisa claimed that Adam Baker was not involved.
But what`s more, she said that this was all her daughter`s, meaning Elisa Baker`s daughter`s fault. She said if the daughter had never called DFS on her, none of this would have ever happened.
GRACE: Also, claiming to exonerate Adam Baker, which is -- contrary to what she says in the other letters.
To Natisha Lance, we know that at the same time the grand jury is handing an indictment down on to Elisa Baker, they were ripping sheet rock out of the walls of Zahra`s bedroom but now we learn tonight that they have gone into other areas of the home as well.
LANCE: That`s right, Nancy. Adam Baker now has been evicted from that home. And what the landlord says is that the home is inhabitable at this point. The floorboards have been ripped up. Plumbing has been taken out of the home.
The walls, as you`ve said, have been taken out. Also parts of the ceiling have been taken out of this home. So it`s not able for anyone to live in there. Police have gone through this home, searching under the floor, above -- close to the roof, above the ceiling and also in the walls.
GRACE: Back to Dr. Howard Oliver, former deputy medical examiner joining us out of L.A.
Doctor Oliver, can you get DNA out of bones?
HOWARD OLIVER, FMR. DEPUTY MEDICAL EXAMINER, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Yes, you can. You can get DNA from the bone marrow itself.
GRACE: And it seems to me -- let`s go to the defense lawyers, Lauren Lake, Alan Ripka, both of you have handled plenty of homicides. It seems to me that they would be able to get a doctor on the spot to say yes, this is a human bone or not. But they have sent it away for analysis.
Obviously, Alan Ripka, it`s to get a DNA analysis.
ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: That`s right. They want to be certain what they have, they want to be certain that they can use it in court. And there are no defense tactics to keep it out like they`re spoiling it or something like that.
GRACE: What about it, Lauren Lake?
LAUREN LAKE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it`s exactly what he said, Nancy. And believe me, the defense is looking at this with a hawk eye, making sure everything goes the way it planned. Because you know we`re looking for the holes in the case at all times to make sure justice is served.
GRACE: Lauren Lake. Lauren Lake.
LAKE: Yes.
GRACE: They might as well not look at the bone because there`s nothing they can do about that. What they need to look at, as Elisa Baker behind bars, writing all these crazy jailhouse letters about Zahra being dead. Basically putting herself at the scene when the child is killed.
She`s admitted to writing that phony ransom note and now she`s saying what happened to Zahra was horrifying.
For those of you just joining us, a bone has been discovered in a densely wooded area, believed to belong to 10-year-old little Zahra.
I want to go back to Brad Dennis, director of Search Operations at KlaasKids Foundation.
Brad, what do they need to be doing regarding drain this pond? Why do you think they`re draining the pond? Does it suggest to you that the bone was found near the pond which is across the street, basically from Melissa`s home, there where the prosthetic leg was found?
BRAD DENNIS, DIRECTOR OF SEARCH OPERATIONS, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Well, Nancy, I think it does suggest at least that the bone was in that general area. I think they`re being thorough and searching all of those areas specifically those ponds because it`s a known dumping area.
There`s possibly a lot of debris in there that could be holding up anything that might be in there. But I think tomorrow you`re going to see them really tightening up their grid searches, their line searches and becoming a whole lot more meticulous in going through --
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa. Brad Dennis, Brad Dennis. We`re just lawyers here. What do you mean grid searches? What`s the other thing you said? Line searches?
DENNIS: Well, the grids -- yes, that`s what they were doing today and from, you know, everything that we could read and be able to pick up from the reporters that`s probably how they found the bone in the first place.
So tomorrow they`ll probably tighten up those searchers, instead of having a lot of space in them between them. They`ll tighten those up and then really start going through there with a fine toothed comb looking for any other possible fragments.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I swear I`m going to launch a campaign for people like us, the freaks of the world, I guess. I`m sick of being ridiculed for being me. I am 42 years old, and damn it, I am proud to say I am not a clone, like the Stepford wives. LOL.
Funny the so-called Christians are the first to judge me. You wouldn`t believe all the hate mail. People actually want to kill me. I will have to go into hiding and move across the country when I do get out of here. That`s scary.
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GRACE: A bone to be believed is little Zahra`s has been found.
To Captain Robert Timlin, commander, Underwater Search and Recovery Team, Clayton County Police Department.
Captain, is it -- would it be worth diving, doing a dive search?
CAPT. ROBERT TIMLIN, COMMANDER, UNDERWATER SEARCH AND RECOVERY TEAM, CLAYTON COUNTY POLICE DEPT.: What they`ve decided, Nancy, probably would be the best thing to do at this time is to drain this lake down. Obviously bring it into view from top-side. Committing a diver into that certainly is an option, and could evidence be located, certainly, but to be able to drain it to where they can have -- work from the topside is more reasonable now that they have the ability to do that.
What you`ll see happen, if an interest does turn to the pond after draining it, you`ll see the search slow. It will be done in a pattern, a grid pattern but it will be slow and methodical because you don`t want to risk wading out into there or destroying any evidence or pushing it further down into the soil.
GRACE: And very quickly, Melissa Mahlenbrock, yes/no, were dogs out there today?
MAHLENBROCK: No, Nancy. Dogs were not out there today. The only thing I saw were the people with the shovels and any kind of digging tools, and the Love Lady`s Rescue Special Operations truck, but I didn`t see any dogs.
GRACE: Which means, Natisha Lance, that this bone was found by the human eye. It must have been big enough to find by the human eye and not by cadaver dogs.
LANCE: You`re right, Nancy. Remember they were doing that line searching out there today and there were not dogs out there according to what police told me earlier, which means yes, it would have been to have been found by the human eye.
GRACE: Everyone, let`s stop and remember Army Sgt. 1st Class Charles Warren, 36, Duluth, Georgia, killed Iraq. Awarded Bronze Star, Purple Heart. Dying words sad over never meeting his baby girl. Fellow soldiers nicknamed him Spaz.
A pediatric nurse, loved taking care of sick children, playing cards and games, adventures with his little boy. Leaves behind parents, Stephen and Veronica, five sisters, four brothers, widow Carol, son Jackson, daughter Maddie.
Charles Warren, American hero.
Thanks to our guest but especially to you. And at your request, Here`s John David and Lucy on Halloween. The sneaky witch and policy-man scaring our neighbor, Miss Mary Ellen, our first stop every year.
And on special days and every day, thank you for your prayers for the twins. As you can see they were answered.
Happy 10th birthday to little Georgia honor roll fourth grader Arlington, and prayers to the family of Florida sheriff`s deputy Jerry Cassady in the fight of his life, gunned down rescuing a Pensacola woman.
Everyone, until tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern, good night, friend.
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