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American Morning
CIA in Libya: Obama Secretly Authorized Covert Operation; Radiation Levels Dangerously High Beyond Daiichi Plant Evacuation Zone; ABC's of Finance; Return of the Dust Bowl; Scrapping The Entire Plant?; NATO In Command Of Libya Mission
Aired March 31, 2011 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR: Ahead on AMERICAN MORNING, the latest from Libya, where rebel forces are now retreating, outgunned and outmanned by Moammar Gadhafi's forces. Meantime, reports are that our president has OK'd a covert operation. It has CIA operatives on the ground in Libya.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: Radiation from Japan's crippled nuclear plant turning up now in milk in two U.S. states. The levels are considered too low to cause health concerns here, but the discovery has the EPA ramping up testing.
CHETRY: Also, he's back. The terminator who became governor, now he is the governator. We'll tell you about Arnold Schwarzenegger's new gig.
ROMANS: Plus, a spike in chocolate prices. Will it hit by Easter? That's ahead on this AMERICAN MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: A lot of news happening overnight. I'm Kiran Chetry. We want to get you up to date this morning.
NATO now officially in charge of all military operations in Libya. Meantime, teams of CIA operatives are reportedly on the ground in Libya in what could be the first sign of Moammar Gadhafi's regime beginning to crumble.
ROMANS: I'm Christine Romans. State workers losing the battle in the Rust Belt. Ohio passes a bill even tougher than the one in Wisconsin. Police officers and firefighters among the 350,000 workers who will lose their spot at the bargaining table on this AMERICAN MORNING.
CHETRY: Well, good morning to you. Welcome. It is Thursday, March 31st. Ali Velshi is on assignment today. Glad you're with us though.
ROMANS: That's right. Good morning. We have an awful lot to talk to you about this morning. The big developments in Libya overnight where CIA operatives are said to be on the ground right now. President Obama reportedly OK'd a covert operation to assist opposition forces and NATO officially took command of the Libya mission overnight. All of this comes as rebel fighters are in full retreat from Moammar Gadhafi's troops on the battlefield. Nic Robertson is live in Tripoli.
Hi, Nic.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, good morning.
ROMANS: What's the latest on the ground there about the position for the rebels, the direction the rebels are moving at this hour and this report that the president may be actually putting people on the ground right now, with the covert operation with the CIA on the ground. What are you hearing there?
ROBERTSON: Well, it does seem like the rebels have stopped in Ajdabiya, which is the sort of almost where they started from five days ago before they started pushing east. They don't seem to be falling back from there at the moment. But the fact that there are now or appear to be now CIA operatives on the ground gathering political and military information will be critical to sort of further giving assistance to the rebels and understanding what they need and also what the dangers may be of equipping them in a fight that may not be over quickly, that may last a long time and lead to sort of unforeseen events on the battlefield. Possibility of weapons ending up with Al Qaeda, possibility of splits within the rebel groups, what are the limitations of the rebels and what can they realistically achieve and how quickly. All this sort of information is going to be critical to the administration right now, Christine.
ROMANS: And we know, Nic, this morning, there are some in Congress who are concerned about that possibility of arming the rebels for exactly the reasons you point out. Because, you know, in the past, the United States has found itself sometimes on the wrong side of a -- the wrong side of a conflict and not really knowing who they are arming or how that will come back as you pointed out in unintended consequences.
Let me ask you about another development this morning. The Libyan foreign minister defecting. What is the latest on this and what is coming from Gadhafi's camp about this loss of the foreign minister?
ROBERTSON: You know, that's what's really interesting right now. There is really no latest from here in Tripoli because the leadership here has said nothing. The foreign ministry has said nothing. The government spokesman has said nothing. When we were talking to officials last night, they were struggling even to confirm these details were true. The deputy foreign minister when I met him the night before last insisted the foreign minister was coming back. They seem to have been caught completely by surprise.
This is a man who headed intelligence here for 15 years, headed secret negotiations for Gadhafi, was one of his main political and security allies in the country. Will others follow him? Will other senior figures in the leadership here follow him? And also, this is a man who would have perhaps provided some restraining influence on Gadhafi's excesses. Now, he's gone. That seems to leave the way open for Gadhafi to follow his own course and his own thoughts. And we know that what could lead to, Christine. ROMANS: All right. Nic Robertson in Tripoli. Thank you, Nic. We'll check with you again later.
And coming up at 6:30 Eastern, we're going to talk with a former CIA counterterrorism analyst, Michael Scheuer.
CHETRY: Well, we now want to give you the latest on Japan following the nuclear disaster. And today, again, some more unfortunate news to report.
Dangerous levels of radiation are now being reported well beyond the government-ordered evacuation zone by that nuclear power plant. Right now, everyone within 13 miles of the Daiichi nuclear power station, everyone has been ordered to leave within that 13-mile radius. But now, according to the International Atomic Energy Agency, radiation has exceeded evacuation levels in the village of Itate (ph). Now, that's about 25 miles northwest of the plant. The 7,000 people who live in Itate (ph) have been ordered to leave. They have not been ordered to leave, but the IAEA is now advising the Japanese government to, quote, "carefully assess the situation there."
Meantime, two states on the West Coast of the United States are now reporting low levels of radiation showing up in the milk. Health officials in San Luis Obispo, California, and Spokane, Washington, say that those levels are 5,000 times lower than the legal limit. So they're saying it's not a significant threat but it's still there. And not a surprise though, says Blair Thompson of the Washington Dairy Commission. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLAIR THOMPSON, WASHINGTON DAIRY COMMISSION: Traveled across the jet stream across the Pacific Ocean and landed on our shores. It's hardly a surprise that that happened. It was expected. Radiation can be a scary word, but I think it's important to remember that actually we live surrounded by radiation every single day. It comes from the sun. It comes from our televisions. It comes from our cell phone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: Well, the Environmental Protection Agency is now saying it's stepping up radiation monitoring throughout the nation not only in milk but in rain and drinking water as well.
Also, the United States sending radiation proof robots to Japan as they will help with the nuclear crisis. They're being shipped by the Energy Department. Operators are also headed to Japan to teach Japanese engineers how to use those robots. Officials hope that these devices can replace humans who are working in areas where the radiation has reached potentially deadly levels.
ROMANS: Meantime back here, teachers, officers, nurses and a lot of other state workers about to take a huge hit this time in Ohio. The state Senate in a 17-16 vote passed a bill that takes away their rights to negotiate health care, sick time or pension benefits. Republican Governor John Kasich is expected to sign it by the end of the week. Democrats are already fighting to overturn it with a referendum in November.
The next battleground, New Hampshire. Thousands of union members expected at a rally today in Concord after the state House approved a measure that may give the state the upper hand in contract talks. The Republican who backed that bill says the state may have to fire 350 workers, that the union doesn't make $50 million in concessions. Democrats say it will completely cripple the union's collective bargaining rights.
CHETRY: Well, federal safety officials now say it was speeding that was the likely cause of that tragic bus accident, that charter bus crash that killed 15 people in New York earlier this month. The bus was headed back to New York City from a Connecticut casino when it veered off the highway and struck a roadside barrier. The driver claimed that a tractor-trailer clipped him and caused the accident. But investigators from the National Transportation Safety Board now say there was no evidence of any collision and based on witness accounts they believe the driver was traveling at 78 miles per hour in a 50 mile-an hour zone.
Well, some scary moments for the space shuttle Endeavour. It was in the path of a hail storm yesterday. Hail battered the launch pad at Kennedy Space Center in Orlando. Today, NASA crews are serving the shuttle to see if there was any damage caused by that. The Endeavour is set to blast off for its final flight on April 19th.
Meantime, parts of central Florida are still reeling from those same storms yesterday. High winds and heavy rains destroyed homes and knocked power out for thousands.
ROMANS: We are talking about a whole different kind of storm for the northeast today. And Rob Marciano joins us in our house for the weather headlines.
Welcome to the Big Apple.
CHETRY: It has nothing to do with opening day at Yankees Stadium.
ROB MARCIANO, AMS METEOROLOGIST: No, not at all.
CHETRY: You just happen to be here.
MARCIANO: Not at all. You know, we'll have that full report tomorrow.
Good morning, guys. Great to be here. You have some storms that rolled through parts of Florida. As a matter of fact, some of the towers across Kennedy Space Center saw winds gusting over 80 miles an hour with this system. It's got some energy with it and it's going to combine with the system that's rolling up the east coast now. And this is going to be a bit of a mess. I know we're heading towards April 1st now. It's no April Fools but we're looking at significant snow event for parts of the northeast all the way. I think the larger cities will be spared from this.
All right. Let's go to the radar and show you what I'm talking about here. By the way, there's going to be another threat of thunderstorms across Florida. They do need the rain but obviously don't need all that wind energy like they saw yesterday across parts of central Florida.
All right. Here's a piece of energy. Number one, it will head across the southeast. But look what's going on across the northeast, already seeing some snow mix in. We do have temperatures in spots that are conducive for that. But by Boston and New York, we're above freezing at this point. I think snow will mix in at times towards the end of this event as things start to wind up. But upstate New York, what kind of totals do you think we're going to see? Anywhere from five to 10 inches. You go north of, say Poughkeepsie, 10 to 15 inches of snow potentially across parts of northern New England. So that is a significant snow event for -- well, any time for year, or in the first of April. That's pretty impressive stuff.
CHETRY: And you were saying basically that they could be seeing snow at opening day in Yankee Stadium.
MARCIANO: Well, yes.
CHETRY: Kind of a little weird.
MARCIANO: Yes. Looks like some warm air will move in now. I was kind of hoping maybe, you know, they would say something like now batting for the Yankees, number eight, frosty the snowman. But I don't think it's going to be that fast. But there's going to be some moisture that works its way into New York so hopefully we'll get the game off.
ROMANS: Not enough to pitch snowballs, just fastballs.
MARCIANO: But that's nothing new in New York.
ROMANS: All right. Thanks, Rob.
CHETRY: Thanks, Rob.
ROMANS: As for baseball fans everywhere today, of course, is New Year's Day. There are six season opening games in Major League Baseball. President Obama will not be there to throw out the first pitch at the Nationals game in Washington. Uniformed troops from each branch of the military will do the honors instead.
At Chicago's Wrigley Field, movie star, Robert Redford, will be there to throw out the first pitch for the Cubs. Play the Pirates. Redford plays, of course, Roy Hobbs in the baseball movie "The Natural."
CHETRY: And also two of baseball's biggest fans already know it's going to be a dream season. Contest winners Mike O'Hara and Ryan Wagner will get to watch every game of the 2011 baseball season in a brand-new MLB fan cave here in New York City. This was a pretty sweet gig. You're getting a look inside of what that fan cave will be like.
OK, they're hunkered down for -- actually now that I think about it, I don't know. Would you want to watch every second of all 2,430 regular season games plus the entire post-game season?
MARCIANO: Did you see that la-z-boy? I mean, that's a question that I can't answer.
CHETRY: Well, I know but you can't fall asleep. You have to be there for every moment and action. They're going to be sharing the experience with other fans on Facebook, Twitter. They're going to be blogging about it on mlb.com. So, O'Hara and Wagner will be our guests tomorrow on AMERICAN MORNING.
ROMANS: Maybe that job wanted ad look like -- you know, we want to hire someone who can watch every game in baseball, eat chicken wings and tweet.
CHETRY: Exactly.
MARCIANO: My guess is there were thousands of applicants.
ROMANS: I know.
CHETRY: Apparently, there were.
ROMANS: I'm sure.
All right. Up next on AMERICAN MORNING, new studies suggest more and more kids are spending money like it grows on trees. How can you raise financially savvy kids who aren't just there for a takeout?
CHETRY: I bought mine a cash register. Does that help?
ROMANS: We're "Minding Your Business."
CHETRY: Also, this is a lot better than, so you want to go to prom?
A high school senior strikes a romantic note in front of the entire class, ruining it for boys everywhere after that show.
Twelve minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Fifteen minutes past the hour right now.
It looks like taxpayers - and you had brought up this possibility and got sort of batted down about it, right?
ROMANS: Well, yes. Ali and I many times have said, you know, taxpayers could make a profit on TRAP, and people would get so angry, they'd say, oh, this bank bailout is terrible, terrible for taxpayers. There's nothing good about it.
But it looks like taxpayers are going to make a profit.
CHETRY: Yes. So we're talking about the $ 245 billion -- with a B - lifeline that the banks got that was known as TARP, though it had many different, right, incarnations along the way. But the Treasury Department announced that the bank portion of the bailout is now $6 billion in the black and that profit - and that profit, according to the Treasury, might ultimately rise to $20 billion. But those gains could take a hit because the Congressional Budget Office is predicting that the bailouts - and this - this is the part that gets hairy - of the auto industry and AIG, the huge insurer, could ultimately cost taxpayers $19 billion.
ROMANS: That's right. Some of those bailouts are money that is out the door and is never coming back.
When it comes to teaching our kids the ABC's of finance, a new study suggests many parents are not teaching their kids about the importance of budgeting and saving.
Carmen Wong-Ulrich is "Minding Your Business."
This - moms and dads, this is so important. This is so important.
CARMEN WONG-ULRICH, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: I know. We're such suckers (ph).
Well, listen, next - tomorrow starts one of my favorite months, Financial Literacy Month.
ROMANS: You are such a geek (INAUDIBLE).
ULRICH: That's April.
I know. I'm such a nerd.
Listen, a new Northwestern Mutual Foundation survey found that parents today, in honor of this month, are much more likely to give in to requests for more money beyond your allotted allowance.
Here are some of the survey findings, really interesting. So they asked kids 17 and under, how often did your parents say, "All right. No problem," when you asked for extra money beyond your allowance? Add up these numbers, almost 90 percent of kids were successful. Really?
And they asked all ages - now, this is all Americans of all different ages, the different generations, I always got extra money beyond an allowance from my parents when I asked. Well, as you can see, the youth today are having a lot more success than we are, ladies, or we did, when we were kids. A real generational divide here.
An allowance, you - it's your first experience with a budget. So here's a little bit of advice here on what to do, because the number one reason that kids got the extra money was to pay for concerts.
CHETRY: Really?
ULRICH: That - right. Which - which, if you remember, concerts are really expensive, right? So what is the expectation, here's where the - your allowance should go? Like I would think that that would be separate.
ROMANS: You should be budgeting for that concern.
ULRICH: That you should - you should budget or you should earn the money -
ROMANS: Right.
ULRICH: -- so get a job, baby-sit to pay for the concert tickets.
So set up expectations, and understand that giving more money to your kids sets them up to think about, I can get credit. It's like getting extra credit. So that's the key difference.
And the kids today who have parents younger than 40, of course, they had such great access to credit that, in their minds, it's OK.
CHETRY: Right. That's - and the thing is, I feel really strongly about this, because I - I really believe that the way that you view money and the way that you view spending and saving is forged very early in your - in your life.
ROMANS: Yes.
ULRICH: Absolutely. Absolutely.
CHETRY: I mean, my parents were extremely frugal, and they have passed that on.
And they also said to me, forget allowance. I mean, by the time I was old enough, I'd - they were like, get a job.
(CROSSTALK)
ULRICH: Well, I - I worked, OK? For 12 - from 12 on.
ROMANS: Me, too.
ULRICH: If I wanted to go to a concert, I had to earn that money separately.
CHETRY: Right.
ROMANS: Well, you mentioned babysitting, and some -
ULRICH: Yes.
ROMANS: -- but a lot of parents, they say, no, I want my kids to focus on getting ready for college, the experiences and the extracurriculars, studying at school. I don't want them working at the pizza place.
ULRICH: (INAUDIBLE). And we worked.
ROMANS: I know. I know.
ULRICH: And I think we're doing OK.
ROMANS: OK. Thank you, (INAUDIBLE).
CHETRY: It's important, though. It really is. Thanks so much.
ULRICH: Very important. Thank you.
ROMANS: This ruined it for every other high school guy in the country. This kid on California, he asked a girl to the prom in one of the sweetest, most noble and gutsiest ways possible, and now it's blown up on YouTube. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(BOYS SINGING "LIANNA, YOU'RE SO BEAUTIFUL)
ROMANS (voice-over): That last line's, "I'd like to ask you to prom."
Jason Pitts walked into third period at Santa Monica High School with a guitar and just started singing. He wrote the lyrics and the music himself. He even got his boys to sing background for him, and she said yes.
LIANNA COHEN, RECEIVED MUSICAL PROM PROPOSAL: He started singing, I didn't know what he was doing until he started singing and looking right at me.
I was just really surprised and - and flattered and honored.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROMANS: And every boy in the school is like, "Thanks, buddy."
CHETRY: I know.
ULRICH: Yes. But, you know what?
ROMANS: How are you going to top that, boy?
ULRICH: He got - he got not only the date, I bet you now he's going to get a record deal.
CHETRY: That's what I going to say. I wondered - a little cynical, but I wondered how much of that was for the date and how much of that was to get, you know, a little bit of YouTube -
ROMANS: I loved the guys singing backup. I loved the guys singing backup. They're so cute.
ULRICH: They're going to be the coolest couple there.
ROMANS: Chivalry is not dead, America. Chivalry is not dead.
CHETRY: You want to choose (ph) to believe that? It's not about the record, right?
ROMANS: It's chivalry, Kiran. I'm sure.
CHETRY: All right. Well, up next, the return of the dust bowl. Farmers say that it is a crisis that could wipe out their crops and shut them down for good.
Rob Marciano has a story that you'll see only on CNN.
ROMANS: Plus, a machine sent back in time to fight the evil forces and the girly men. Details of Arnold Schwarzenegger's first project since leaving office.
It's 20 minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Here's a little history lesson for you. Back in the 1930s, farmers took a devastating hit when dust storms destroyed most of their crops, and those storms were caused by severe drought conditions.
ROMANS: The era was then known as the Dirty Thirties, and today, for many American farmers, the Dust Bowl making a comeback.
Rob Marciano joins us this morning. Rob, parts of Texas, it - it might just put some farmers out of business.
ROB MARCIANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, a lot - a lot of farmers have actually have moved on. You know, nowadays, it's - this is kind of like a modern day gold rush, except now the - the gold is actually water.
Already dry climates are experiencing long term drought, and the once abundant supply of well water is dwindling, not a good combination for those who make their living off the land.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARRY EVANS, OWNER, EVANS GRAINS, INC.: You check for - for irrigation well.
MARCIANO (voice-over): For Barry Evans, Texas farming is a family tradition.
B. EVANS: My great-uncle farmed this place from the Dust Bowl, and then my dad farmed it, and then - then I farmed it.
MARCIANO: Grain and cotton are the big crops here, much of irrigation water coming from an underground aquifer.
B. EVANS: This deposit (ph) water from about 300 feet in the ground, which the aquifer varies quite a bit along the Ogallala, but these are right at 300 feet.
MARCIANO: Trapped underground for millions of years and now being tapped by thousands of farmers, the Ogallala Aquifer is a fixed water supply, most shallow in Texas, where it could run dry. B. EVANS: Really, what I'm doing is trying to figure out, OK, as the aquifer dries up, how am I going to farm this land?
MARCIANO: Better farming techniques, drought resistant seeds and extreme conservation is the plan.
MARCIANO (on camera): The reality is when the underground wells dry up, so does business.
Grain elevators in this area stand empty, and the economies in towns like Happy, Texas are depressed.
MARCIANO (voice-over): Originally named for its oasis-like source for water, Main Street now resembles a Western ghost town.
MARCIANO (on camera): This is the other big source for water at the area - Lake Meredith. It feeds 11 cities, including Lubbock and Amarillo, and, right now, it's 50 feet below where it should be.
DAVID BRAUER, USDA, OGALLALA AQUIFER PROGRAM MANAGER: If there is not conservation, then we are going to run out of water sooner. The average loss of water from Lake Meredith is 100 inches.
MARCIANO: Just from evaporation?
BRAUER: Just from evaporation.
MARCIANO (voice-over): David Brauer helps farmers navigate through the low water.
MARCIANO (on camera): What's the long term forecast, you know, 10, 20, 50 years from now for this area? Or is there going to be water to tap into to farm this area?
BRAUER: There may not be.
MARCIANO (voice-over): Not good news for Eric Evans, hoping to carry on the family business.
ERIC EVANS, FUTURE WEST TEXAS FARMER: Out here on the farm, you really get to see the - the fruits of your labor embodied in your crop (INAUDIBLE) end of the year, and you sell that crop at the end of the year, you know that you're - you're helping to feed and clothe people around the world.
MARCIANO: And they'll be using every drop of water to do it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MARCIANO: There are many farmers who had to give it up and move on, but Barry Evans and his son remain hopeful that the - the latest well that they drilled will last 50 years. And, you know, they say those new farming techniques -
ROMANS: Yes. MARCIANO: These guys are - are really optimistic, and it's - I learned a lot with them, that the - the farming techniques and the type of seeds they use, really, they - they're hoping that it limits them from getting back to the dust bowl.
ROMANS: They even used - they even used GPS technology to deliver irrigation exactly where to where they planted corn or planted grain, in some cases. I mean, there's some - the interesting things they're trying, but not on a very wide scale.
One thing that's interesting, that we saw some cotton there in. Cotton prices are at all-time highs.
MARCIANO: Right.
ROMANS: I've heard farmers talking about trying to figure out how to switch to cotton because they could - they could make more money. Farmers have never farmed cotton ever before.
You see, it's pretty drought resistant.
MARCIANO: Yes, so the - a lot of guys are planting cotton, one because the prices are high and, two, because it is fairly drought resistant. So, in drier climates, drought - the cotton plants work well.
And as far as the water efficiency goes, Barry says they're about 98 percent efficient as far as the cotton - the amount of water they -
ROMANS: Wow.
MARCIANO: -- they use and - and put back into the ground. So they're pretty optimistic that -
ROMANS: Amazing.
MARCIANO: -- what they know now versus what they knew in the '30s will help prevent what was a dust bowl.
CHETRY: Amazing stuff. I mean, they're trying to outsmart Mother Nature -
MARCIANO: Yes. It's tough.
CHETRY: -- and, at the end of the day, you know, you still - you need her.
Rob, good stuff. Thanks so much.
MARCIANO: You bet.
ROMANS: OK, next up on AMERICAN MORNING, the precise role isn't clear here, but teams of CIA operatives are on the ground in Libya. We'll talk with former CIA counterterrorism analyst Michael Scheuer about it.
It's 27 minutes past the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Thirty minutes past the hour right now.
We want to get you caught up on the top stories this morning.
Command and control of the military mission is now officially in NATO hands. NATO took charge of operations overnight.
Meantime, there's been a major defection from Moammar Gadhafi's inner circle. Foreign Minister Moussa Koussa has quit and is now in London. British Foreign Secretary William Hague says that the U.K. encourages those around Gadhafi to abandon him. He also said that Koussa is not being offered immunity.
ROMANS: Two states in the West Coast are finding low levels of radiation from Japan in their milk. But health official in San Luis Obispo, California, and, Spokane, Washington, say these levels are 5,000 times lower than the legal limit. But the Environmental Protection Agency says it has taken steps to increase the level of nationwide monitoring of milk and rain and drinking water.
CHETRY: This is one of those tough stories. I mean, we can only report what we know, that levels they found radiation, but that it's still considered low. I don't know if that, you know, helps anybody to hear that.
ROMANS: But knowing also that the EPA is monitoring the situation, I think, just sort of rounds it out.
CHETRY: Yes.
Well, also state workers are losing the battle in Ohio. The state Senate, by a single vote, passing a vote that takes away their rights to negotiate health care, sick time, and strip pension benefits. The bill is stronger in some ways than the one in Wisconsin. It also includes police and firefighters. Republican Governor John Kasich is expected to sign it by the end of the week. Democrats are already fighting to overturn it with a referendum in November.
ROMANS: Now, help for Libyan rebels from the CIA -- President Obama reportedly signing off on this. Sources say CIA operatives are on the ground in Libya, and in contact with the opposition.
CHETRY: And joining us to talk more about the CIA's possible role in Libya, from Washington, former CIA counterterrorism analyst, Michael Scheuer.
Michael, thanks for being with us this morning.
MICHAEL SCHEUER, FORMER CIA COUNTERTERRORISM ANALYST: You're welcome.
CHETRY: So, there are reports out again that the CIA is on the ground in Libya, contacting and vetting the rebels. Is this setting the stage to arm them? SCHEUER: I don't think there's any other possible reason for it. And the president clearly has sent the agency in to find out who he is supporting and to see what kind of material -- human material we would have to work with if we decided to -- if the president decided to arm and train these people over the longer term.
CHETRY: Yes. And you're concerned about this prospect. You think it could become another Taliban situation for the U.S. What, in your mind, is the worst case scenario here?
SCHEUER: Well, Libya has been very strong in sending your men or having its young men go overseas to fight in Islamic insurgencies, in the Balkans, in Chechnya, Afghanistan, especially Iraq, when the height of the fighting was there. Those that don't get killed, of course, go home. And I think the core of the resistance, whatever little military ability they have, is probably made up by people elsewhere we would call mujahedeen.
And so, it's a dicey proposition to be getting involved with this. I'm not sure that the opposition, if it takes power, is going to be much better than was Gadhafi.
ROMANS: That's why you need to have the CIA, I presume, in there vetting, as we said, who are these people? Who are the elements that are funding them or supporting them? Who are politically the most palatable and least palatable among them?
The White House is saying that no decision has been made.
I have a question for you as a CIA veteran, I guess. I mean, the fact that we even know about this, is that -- is that unusual? I mean, should we just assume that the CIA in this sort of situation would, of course, be in there on the ground?
SCHEUER: Well, you have to assume the president wants the best information that he can get. And if he wants to have that information, he has to have somebody on the ground. And so, yes, I think you assume wherever there's trouble, you will find the agency.
The other point I would make here is that vetting the people who are in the opposition, of course, is only -- you're only able to do that to the extent that they're willing to talk to you. I think the agency will find a lot of people who are pro-democracy and westernized happy to talk to them. The more Islamic-oriented people aren't going to talk to them because that would bring into question our air support for them.
So, this is -- this is a mission that's very difficult one. And the chances of success are really probably not better than 50-50.
CHETRY: What's the alternative? If we don't arm the rebels and they're clearly outmanned and outgunned by Gadhafi's forces, what's the better solution here?
SCHEUER: The better solution was, as Mr. Paul said, never go at all. This was none of our business. But I think we're seeing, as the string is playing out, we threatened Gadhafi, and that didn't work. There's an arms embargo, and an economic embargo, that didn't work. There was a U.N. resolution, and that didn't work. Aerial bombing has continued and has impact, but it hasn't defeated him.
Now, we're at the stage where we're going to try to apparently try to train and arm the resistance. That takes a long time. I don't know if we have that time against Gadhafi. What we're seeing is the president being -- he's putting himself into a corner where his only option is ground troops.
ROMANS: But that's something that is not -- that's something no one says that they want to do in this administration. I mean, they simply don't want to do that. They want to --
SCHEUER: Well, the choice may come down to admitting that it was a mistake and being defeated in the sense that Gadhafi survives or putting ground troops in. Nations are a lot like people. They don't like making -- admitting to mistakes. And maybe they don't want to put them in, but when it comes down to looking defeat in the face, I wonder.
CHETRY: You know, you led the CIA unit that track Osama bin Laden in 1996 to 1999, and you believe that much like that situation, America's involvement in Libya, could prove to be a recruiting tool for extremists. Why?
SCHEUER: Oh, it's absolutely a recruiting tool. It's the American- led West attacking a Muslim country that has oil.
CHETRY: But they're very careful to say it's the American-led West. That NATO is now fully taking over the operation.
SCHEUER: Well, that --
CHETRY: Yes, our firepower was used in the beginning, but that this is a coalition that includes Arab states.
SCHEUER: That may fool some Americans. It's not going to fool the people who sympathize with bin Laden and other Islamists. This is really a U.S.-led operation.
And you talk about Arab states that are involved -- the Arab states are tyrannies that are hated by their own people. This is -- this is a piece of theater set up by Mrs. Clinton and Mr. McCain and the bipartisan group that loves to intervene abroad.
In the Muslim world, this is Americans killing Muslims again and it looks like it's for oil.
CHETRY: I just want to ask. Are you trying to have both ways in saying that, OK, these are tyrannies that hate their own people, well, that's why we're helping because in Libya, it was the people that wanted Gadhafi out, that they were tired of it. So, weren't we then supporting Islamic democracy, I guess you could say, in these countries where they're tired of totalitarian rule? SCHEUER: If we were supporting Islamic democracy, that would be one thing. But if you listen to Mrs. Clinton and especially rather crazed Ms. Rice at the U.N., this is all about democracy in a world where democracy is not going to take hold.
ROMANS: I think it's very clear, Michael Scheuer, that you are no fan of this policy and this administration. I think calling Ambassador Rice crazed is certainly a significant charge.
SCHEUER: Well, I don't know. I've just listened to her. You know, that's only my impression.
And I have to say, this is not a Democratic problem, this is a Republican problem, too. Both parties love to intervene in other people's business where there are no U.S. interests at stake and where we spend enormous amounts of money that when we're nearly bankrupt. That doesn't seem to be a wise practice of American statesmanship.
ROMANS: And that's another story, to call the United States bankrupt. The United States is running huge deficits, yes, but the economy and this mission in Libya are two separate issues.
SCHEUER: They're not separate issues, ma'am. You're just carrying the water for Mr. Obama.
ROMANS: I'm certainly not carrying anyone's water. And I will assure you of that.
Michael Scheuer, thank you so much for your time. You know, we had a very long exhaustive interview. You had plenty of time to give your point on that.
We're going to be right back at 38 minutes past the hour.
CHETRY: Thanks, Michael.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHETRY: Forty-one minutes past the hour right now.
Electricity, one day -- could one day end up replacing water they use to fight fires.
ROMANS: Harvard scientists recently tested an electric wand able to separate flames from their fuel source.
CHETRY: This is fascinating.
ROMANS: I think it's really neat.
CHETRY: Zain Verjee is here in London for us to tell us more about it.
ROMANS: Good morning, Zain.
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, guys. Yes, it's very cool. Imagine just waving a wand one day that has an electric field and basically what it's apparently doing is it's cutting off the fuel source for methane flame in this one particular experiment and it gets rid of fires. So, it can, eventually, one day maybe a substitute for water or for chemicals.
Now, if f you look at this picture, if you see on the bottom left, there's this kind of an amplifier there. It's connected to a metal wire. And it was pointed at the bottom of that flame that you see on the right hand side of your screen. And once you turn the amplifier on -- which is something like 600 watts -- it creates this electric field that extinguishes the flame.
It's a study that was done by Harvard scientists. They say this could be what the future looks like. They're experimenting. But it would be kind of cool, huh?
CHETRY: Yes. It would be really neat, especially when they have trouble getting water to these sources, to these fires.
VERJEE: Yes.
CHETRY: I can imagine that being put to use in incredible places like southern California.
VERJEE: Exactly.
CHETRY: Also, these pictures. I guess in these pictures if you're not a fan of cricket, you're really missing something, OK?
(CROSSTALK)
CHETRY: I know. It's so interesting, but these great pictures of these fans celebrating the big world cup cricket match. It's India and Pakistan, of course, archrivals. So, it's the Super Bowl in steroids.
VERJEE: It is. You know, that's exactly right. I mean, most people in those countries didn't even show up to work. This was a huge deal. I mean, think of everyone who likes basketball, football, baseball, hockey in the United States. Everyone got together and just was focused on this match.
It's a huge deal, India versus Pakistan. Pakistan lost by 29 runs. So, you're obviously looking at pictures from India. Everyone went completely nuts, cheering on the streets, dancing, they were so happy.
I don't know how much you know about cricket. You know, I don't really watch to be honest. I know I sound like I may love cricket. But it's definitely one of those sports that everybody tunes into.
CHETRY: So, I love -- we love baseball, and the rest of the world loves cricket. We love football, the rest of the world love soccer.
Are we missing something here? VERJEE: Well, you know what? You guys can think of it like baseball, too, because in cricket, you know, one team has got to get the other one out, everyone is trying to score a run. In cricket, you have 300 bowls. It's the same kind of thing as a pitch. And if you get a home run, similar if someone whacks the ball with the bat and gets it out of the large circle that you're supposed to play in and gets six points. So, it's a lot of similarities, sort of.
CHETRY: You explained it pretty well.
(LAUGHTER)
ROMANS: Thanks, Zain.
You can watch Zain every morning at 5:00 a.m. Eastern on "WORLD ONE," easy for you to say so early in the morning, right here on CNN.
And, by the way, Zain and our colleague, Tim Lister, have written a story about the West hinting a deal for immunity from prosecution could be on the table if Moammar Gadhafi steps down and leaves Libya. You can read all about it at CNN.com/International.
CHETRY: Sounds good.
All right. Well, it's 45 minutes past the hour. Rob is going to be back in a minute. He has our travel forecast. He's looking at any delays across the country. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROMANS: All right. We're getting more spectacular pictures of the planet Mercury this morning. This is courtesy of NASA's Messenger spacecraft. Temperatures can hit 800 degrees Fahrenheit during the day on Mercury, and then, they can drop to 300 below zero at night. These latest pictures are particularly intriguing to scientists because of the shadows in the craters near Mercury's polls.
CHETRY: What's that blue spot?
ROMANS: I know. I know. The sun never shines on them, in these craters. And some experts suspect there may actually be some ice on the closest planet.
CHETRY: See, I know Rob Marciano is happy about this because we complain, ooh, it's 45. Now, it's 800 degrees, and then, it's negative 300 degrees, so --
MARCIANO: You would think a planet that close to the sun wouldn't get that cold, but their day is actually longer than their year. So, it rotates very, very, very slowly.
CHETRY: So, you're saying the part that's not facing the sun is just always freezing?
MARCIANO: For a long, long time, and then, there's no atmosphere. So, it's like the moon. So, without an atmosphere, tough to get things too toasty for too long.
CHETRY: So you -- what's that blue spot in there?
MARCIANO: I don't know, but hopefully, the Messenger will find that out. You asked me that, I have no idea, but there's a lot --
(CROSSTALK)
MARCIANO: There are guys a lot smarter than I am that are working out right now to see that. Hey, I want to talk about weather. We got some rough weather that's moving through Tampa right now and just north of Tampa across Pasco County. Tornado warning in effect, and there's tornado watch that was just posted now for parts of Central Florida after rough weather last night.
Let's get to map, so we'll show you what we're talking about. Here you go. It's lit up here in the pink polygon -- the purple polygon. That's your tornado warning just north of Tampa, and that cell is moving easterly pretty rapidly. This is a radar indicated tornado. Certainly, you want to take cover if you're in this area. You had a rough weather moved through Tampa last night.
As a matter of fact, one guy got injured because he didn't get out of his swimming pool when lightning was in the area, and he got zapped. So, you know that, when mom tells you to get out of the water when lightning comes, listen to her. So, here you go. There's a tornado watch. It's in effect to one o'clock this afternoon. They do need the rain, obviously, don't want the rough weather with it.
So, this is a bit of double-edged sword that cluster that's moving just north of St. Petersburg area right now. It's got some punch to it, and it's going to roll right over Orlando and the lakes region which got hit pretty hard last night. All right. This piece of energy is kind of combing with some juice that's getting itself together across the northeast.
We're heading towards April 1st, and we do get snow in April, at least, in cross Northern New England. That's what I think is going to happen here. New York to Boston temperatures right now, cold enough for maybe some wet snow to mix in, but not cold enough for any sort of significant accumulation here, but what we expect to see throughout the day today as watches and warnings go into effect and colder air begins to come in and low begins to get wound up, 5-10 inches of snow potentially just north of New York City.
10-15 across parts of Northern New England. How about that for snow totals there? This is, obviously, going to cause some travel delays as well across parts of New York. We will see some breezy conditions. It will be wet, of course. And, well, yes, opening day for Yankee Stadium, so --
ROMANS: So, it sounds like the after Christmas sales. When you look at that, it's like, oh, yes, I know. This is like January.
MARCIANO: The hits that just keep on giving or the gift that keeps on giving. CHETRY: Yes. We get blizzards in March, but April, now, we're pushing the envelope.
MARCIANO: Almost in the middle of April and snow like 18 inches of snow around here. So, it does happen. So, just be thankful that it's just a cold, you know, rain with a little bit of wet snow mixing.
CHETRY: You're right. It can be negative 300. It can be negative 300 if we're on Mercury. All right.
MARCIANO: Good point.
CHETRY: Trying to look at the bright side. Thanks, Rob.
This morning's top stories minutes away, including gas prices are surging, and of course, the unrest in the Arab world. President Obama coming out with his energy fix. Just how hooked are we on oil and what are the alternatives? We're going to show you when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROMANS: This takes baby talk to the next level. A couple of babbling brothers have taken the internet by storm.
CHETRY: So cute. The question is, these YouTube twins, what are they really saying? Here's Jeanne Moos.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): If you haven't heard the talking twin babies by now, you haven't been listening.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: Their mom put the video on her blog and ended up on YouTube, and now, these two boys have raised baby talk to an art. But now, talk has turned to what they're saying.
PROF. HARRIET KLEIN, NYU DEPT. OF COMM. SCIENCES & DISORDERS: They're not really saying anything, they're just babbling.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba.
KLEIN: They're imitating each other. So, one is perpetuating the babbling in the other.
MOOS: Dr. Harriet Klein is an expert in speech development, but those who aren't have been supplying their own subtitles.
MOOS (on-camera): Most people say they think the kids were talking about socks.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: Or maybe they were talking about current events, a certain snake escape. UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: Others bees seem disturbed by the babbling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whoo.
MOOS: There have been cases of twins who really did seem to develop their own private lingo.
MOOS (voice-over): There was a documentary made about twins in California who spoke their own language until the age of eight or so. The two didn't have much adult interaction and picked up a combo of English spoken by their dad in German and spoken by their grandmother. The parents of the YouTube twins have shied away from too much publicity.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: Actually, it's more like millions, if you count TV and web views.
ELLEN DEGENERES, HOST: I think they were talking about Libya, I think.
MOOS: Someone else had the same idea in this matchup with Dutch subtitles.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba.
(SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
MOOS: These two don't just imitate each other's babbling, they do simultaneous head stands, and we can only imagine what they'd do if they found that escaped cobra.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba. Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: As one person posted, nominee for best foreign language film.
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: Jeanne Moos, CNN --
UNIDENTIFIED KID: Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba.
MOOS: New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROMANS: One sock kills me.
CHETRY: I know. Double trouble. They're really cute. God bless their parents. Your top stories coming up after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
