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American Morning
President to Stop By "Pride of Midtown" Later Today; The Osama Files; Bin Laden Death Photos Won't Be Made Public; Sony: Hacker Group Behind Breach; I-40 Under Water, Closed for Miles; Bracing for the Worst; Report: First Body Recovered from Air France Wreckage; Syria Claims its Pulling Back Forces; Workers Enter Damaged Reactor; SEALS are Back Home; Teachers Salary: Should they Earn More?; Justice Department Questioning NCAA
Aired May 05, 2011 - 07:58 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KIRAN CHETRY, CNN ANCHOR: Eight o'clock here in New York.
I'm Kiran Chetry.
President Obama heading to lower Manhattan today, where he'll meet with dozens of 9/11 families and also visit fire house that lost so many after the attacks.
More on that daring mission, as well, that killed bin Laden.
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Ali Velshi.
He was a moving target. New information about Osama bin Laden's final moments and the FBI now going through all of his files in Quantico.
CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Christine Romans.
You can cross off number one. So now who is the most wanted terrorist in the world? He was actually born in the USA on this AMERICAN MORNING.
CHETRY: Welcome to AMERICAN MORNING. It is Thursday. It's May 5th. It's Cinco de Mayo. So, welcome.
VELSHI: Thank you. Happy Cinco de Mayo to both of you.
ROMANS: And you, too.
VELSHI: President Obama is going to be at Ground Zero, as you said, a little later today. But first, it was a site of a celebration when the world found out bin Laden was dead. And down at Ground Zero, the healing continues. Today, President Obama heading from the White House to lower Manhattan this morning, to lay a wreath at the World Trade Center and to meet with 9/11 families.
ROMANS: The president will also stop by a fire house where reminders of the attacks are everywhere.
CHETRY: Absolutely. They lost 15 of their own on 9/11. The Pride of Midtown, as it's known as, Engine 54, Ladder 4 in New York City.
And that's where Mary Snow is this morning.
How are they anticipating the president's visit today?
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Kiran. Well, you know, they're saying, some of them are telling us they are appreciative of the president's visit, that they want to thank him for, in their words, a job well done. As you might know, firemen are very good cooks and we hear that they may be preparing lunch for the president.
And this comes after some emotional days for this firehouse. You mentioned they lost 15 fire fighters on the morning of September 11th. It has also been a very somber time reflected.
We were here on Monday, one day after the news broke. And some of the firefighters indicated that, you know, their thoughts while they appreciated all the well-wishes, their thoughts really were with members of the military.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN FILA, NEW YORK FIREFIGHTER: We have a pretty strong relationship with all the military people that come through our doors here. We support the wounded warriors in this country. And these guys are coming here are the biggest inspiration for us, because immediately after September 11th, they all came in and they all said, you know, we joined the military because of this and we want to serve our country. And, you know, those guys are heroes to us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SNOW: But there were some moments of celebration that, Kiran, there is one photograph that really stands out. It was "New York Times" photographs of members of Engine 54, Ladder 4, in Times Square shortly after the news broke that Osama bin Laden had been killed. And you see these firefighters looking at that news, crossing the ticker and taking in the scene.
One of them who was there, Captain Thomas Venditto, tell us, you know, it really brought a tear to his eye. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAPT. THOMAS VENDITTO, NYPD: I have to tell you, I worked New Year's Eve this year. It was more exciting than working New Year's Eve. In New Year's Eve, people are standing in the fence and they're kind of mellow.
When the ticker tape went around and people started shouting and reading it out loud and cheering, and then everyone -- people from other countries, as you know, this is a tourist area. People from England and Australia and Germany and Japan, they came up, took photos with us. They were hugging us and kissing us. It was fantastic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SNOW: That celebration really was very short-lived. The members here say that they are on constant guard looking for, you know, what's next. It's a very busy firehouse, Kiran. In fact, one of the engines just went out. It's one of the busiest here in New York -- Kiran.
ROMANS: You know, Mary, that picture of the firefighters watching the ticker at Times Square, it brings tears to my eye, you know?
CHETRY: It is iconic. It certainly is.
ROMANS: It is such a good picture. You just -- I can't get enough of that one.
SNOW: And, you know, Captain Venditto said, you know, he was so happy, he said not because Osama bin Laden was dead, but he said he was happy to watch people really be proud of their country. And that's what brought tears to his eyes that night, he said.
CHETRY: All right. Mary Snow for us this morning, I know you'll be out there all day. Thanks so much.
ROMANS: Another image, Ali, that we are watching, too, right now -- a different image all together.
VELSHI: This is the compound we have been talking so much about. This is a live picture of Osama bin Laden's compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan. You can see there's people moving in there, courtesy of "Reuters." They are -- there are still a whole lot of people.
It's very unusual, this compound. I mean, you've heard it before. But it's eight times the size of the average house in the neighborhood. It certainly stood out. So, that continues to fuel those questions about who knew what? I mean, what were the neighbors thinking about who lived there?
(CROSSTALK)
ROMANS: Investigators want to figure out, when it was bought, who paid for it --
VELSHI: Right.
ROMANS: -- who made these improvements to it, when did the family move in. These are things we're going to continue to find out, I think, in this intelligence trove.
CHETRY: Also some questions about exactly how much it was worth. I mean, you may remember when this first happened -- the administration was referring to it as a $1 million compound. They said some who were sort of assessing property values, I guess, and saying probably it would top out at $250,000, including, you know, the 48 grand for the house and also for the property surrounding it.
ROMANS: I would say to the Navy SEALs, it was priceless.
VELSHI: Yes. By the way, they're back on U.S. soil right now, that team of elite Navy SEALs, Team Six, that took out bin Laden, they are home this morning.
ROMANS: They are. And so-called "treasure trove," intel they recovered that's being analyzed right this minute. So many different pieces of data.
CHETRY: Yes. This is all happening in Quantico, at the labs in Quantico, FBI laboratory and headquarters there. There are new details about those final moments as well of bin Laden's life.
Our Barbara Starr is live from the Pentagon with exclusive information on bin Laden's last moments.
Hi, Barbara.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to all of you.
Well, what did those Navy SEALs see when they burst through the door in that upstairs room where Osama bin Laden was hiding, we now know that Osama bin Laden was moving at the time he was initially shot. In fact, there were weapon ns in that room. Congress has been informed of that. And he was apparently moving possibly towards those weapons.
We know that the first shot struck Osama bin Laden in the chest. And as he reacted to that shot in the chest, a second shot quickly struck him in the forehead, just above the left eye. Bin Laden was dead within seconds of the SEAL team entering the room.
That's really how they operate. The photograph that two of our sources have seen of a dead bin Laden, in fact, shows that gunshot wound above the eye on the left side with the skull partially blown away.
Navy SEALs are trained to do this sort of double-tap shoot, two nearly simultaneous shots. That's how they bring down the dangerous targets. So, the first shot to the chest, the second shot to the left side of the head.
VELSHI: Barbara, we talked about the stuff that they found in the compound that they have moved over to FBI headquarters in Quantico, Virginia. Tell us about what that stuff is.
STARR: Well, let's run through some of that. It is now in FBI possession. Of course, for evidentiary purposes, that they have a law enforcement case. They want to be able to prove chain of custody. What are they looking at? At Quantico, 10 hard drives, five computers, more than 100 storage devices, you know, the disks, the DVDs, the thumb drives. They also, of course, found cell phones, audio and video equipment, AK-47 weapons, documents, all sorts of things.
And, in fact, Osama bin Laden had two phone numbers sewn into his clothes and some money on him, about 500 euros. The suspicion is, that was his get-away plan. But I don't know that 500 euros these days takes you very far.
ROMANS: You know, taking him his first safe house. And maybe investigators are finding out where that first safe house is.
VELSHI: Those two numbers.
CHETRY: All right. Well, Barbara, we also have some new pictures of the chopper in the yard of the compound. And this is actually the first time that we are getting a closer look at this machine that probably our Defense Department didn't really want us to be getting such a close look at.
STARR: Nobody can tell us what exactly it is, what type of helicopter. This is not a helicopter that is familiar to anyone we've talked to. The theory is that it is some sort of stealth helicopter, perhaps designed to avoid those Pakistani air defense radars as the assault team was coming through, designed to have very low observable profile, something you can't see on a radar, low noise perhaps, because the tail assembly is different, the rotor blades are different than any typical helicopter we've seen.
It's being referred to as a stealth Black Hawk helicopter. The Black Hawks are very common helicopter in used. But it doesn't really look like a Black Hawk.
This is the one that went down, had a mechanical problem, clip something. So, the SEALs set it on fire before they left. That's why you see the wreckage.
But the entire thing, of course, was not destroyed. And, now, the world is beginning to see something maybe the SEALs didn't want us to see.
CHETRY: Barbara Starr for us this morning -- thanks so much for all those new details.
VELSHI: All right. Right now, there's reportedly a custody battle going on for Osama bin Laden's wounded wife. U.S. officials now say bin Laden's youngest wife was shot in the leg after she charged Navy SEALs during the raid. They wanted to take her back and interrogate her. But they didn't have room apparently because they've lost that chopper.
CHETRY: Also now, Pakistan has her and the intelligence officials there are telling "Reuters" that they will question her and they will return her to her country of origin, not the U.S. which, they say, is in line with Pakistani law.
ROMANS: OK. Osama bin Laden has long topped the FBI's most wanted terrorist list for more than 10 years now, right?
Now, he's marked down as deceased. We want to take a look at who might become the FBI's new number one most wanted.
Number two on this list is Adam Gadahn. He is an American who was born in California and moved to Pakistan in 1998 at the age of 20. He is charged with treason and providing material support to al Qaeda. The FBI is offering $1 million for information leading to his arrest.
Number three on the list right now is Daniel San Diego, also, an American. He is wanted for his alleged involvement with the bombing two office buildings in California back in 2003.
Number four currently on the list is Ayman al-Zawahiri. He's been al Qaeda's number two. He said to be the intellectual and the ideological force behind the terror group. He is, as you recall, a trained physician. He was bin Laden's personal doctor.
Zawahiri is wanted in connection with both the 1998 U.S. embassy bombings in Africa and also the 9/11 attacks. He is charged with murder. And for him, there's a $25 million reward on his head for information leading to his arrest.
Number five is Fahd Mohammed Ahmed al-Quso. He is wanted in connection with the bombing of the USS Cole -- Ali and Kiran.
VELSHI: All right. Christine, thanks so much.
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is talking about the riveting moments inside the Situation Room on Sunday. The already famous photo you're seeing here, it shows Hillary Clinton with her hand over her mouth, concerned, maybe shocked, can't tell, as the White House monitors the operation to get bin Laden.
CHETRY: Yes. But she admits that the photo of her may actually be a bit misleading. Here she is in her own words.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON, SECRETARY OF STATE: Those were 38 of the most intense minutes, I have no idea what any of us were looking at at that particular millisecond when the picture was taken. I'm somewhat sheepishly concerned that it was my preventing one of my early spring allergic coughs. So, it may have no great meaning whatsoever.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: There she is.
(CROSSTALK)
VELSHI: I mean, it is going to be -- it's going to be one of those pictures that is -- it's definitely a historic picture, right? We continue to get uncertain information as to exactly what they were looking at or listening to.
But there's one thing on the faces -- I don't know if we have the picture again. We can see it. There's one thing on the faces of everybody in there. It's not like somebody is laughing. They are all expressing some degree of concern.
ROMANS: You know, it's not so much the hand. It's the eyes to me.
VELSHI: Right.
ROMANS: I mean, the eyes of all these people are so intense and they are all looking at the same thing with such a -- I don't know, we keep saying this is going to be a picture for the history books. It truly will.
CHETRY: It sure will.
All right. Well, still ahead, we're going to be talking Senator Claire McCaskill. She's from Missouri, member of the Armed Services Committee, as well as the Homeland Security Committee, on her take on the decision by the White House not to release these photos and also, some misinformation, including from some of her own colleagues who thought they were looking at the picture.
VELSHI: Yes.
CHETRY: We're going to join her, coming up.
VELSHI: All right. And beware of cyber scams, the urge to see a photo of Osama bin Laden, which, by the way, has not been released, may risk giving you a computer virus. So, just understand something. No matter what anybody tells you, we'll tell you when the photo is released. It has not been released.
If somebody sends you a link to say this is the photo, you could be infecting your computer.
ROMANS: And this morning, as you pull the cereal box out of the cabinet to pour it into the bowl, I'm going to tell you which big serial maker is raising prices. Hang on to your spoon.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROMANS: Welcome back.
They thought they were seeing pictures of bin Laden after he was shot. But several U.S. senators now say they may have been misled by those fake photos floating around of a deceased bin laden that are circulating on the Internet.
Georgia Republican Saxby Chambliss was one of them. He's a top Republican on the Intelligence Committee and wants the real photos released. Massachusetts senator, Scott Brown, was also duped seeing a fake was enough for him to argue against releasing them. New Hampshire senator, Kelly Ayotte, a freshman Republican also reported seeing a photo of Bin Laden dead.
VELSHI And the FBI are warning folks to be on the lookout for websites or Facebook pages, like the one we're showing you here, claiming to offer images or videos of Bin Laden's death. These sites could contain harmful computer viruses. (END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: Well, this morning, President Obama is standing by his decision to keep the Bin Laden photos sealed, out of the public eye. He said that making those gristly pictures public will incite anti- American attacks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We've done DNA sampling and testing, and so, there is no doubt that we killed Osama Bin Laden. It is important for us to make sure that very graphic photos of somebody who was shot in the head are not floating around as an incitement to additional violence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHETRY: So, there's the president saying that it's no time for gloating. Joining us now from Washington, Senator Claire McCaskill, Democrat of Missouri. Thanks so much for joining us this morning, Senator.
SEN. CLAIRE MCCASKILL, (D) MISSOURI: Thank you.
CHETRY: So, do you agree with the decision not to release those photos?
MCCASKILL: I do. I think people need to keep in mind, the only reason the photos were taken was to prove that he was dead. And also, there were other things done in order to prove that, including multiple DNA samples. And I think there was worry that the international community would somehow question whether or not we actually had killed him.
So, now that there has been no pushback on whether or not he has died, and his own family has acknowledged his death, there is really no purpose to be gained by releasing the photos.
CHETRY: What about people who say, it's the right of the public to know. We've gone to war over this. We've lost thousands of American lives. People who want to be able to know that justice was done want to see it for themselves.
MCCASKILL: I think those folks need to be reminded that we're trying to save lives. This would be a recruiting tool. This would be used among terrorist cells all across the world to try to play on people's emotions and their anti-west, their anti-American sentiments. Why would we give the terrorists a recruiting tool if we don't need to? And I think that is a much stronger argument than people -- just people's curiosity that they want to see the pictures.
CHETRY: Was -- I remember there was a debate when we were deciding -- the U.S. government was deciding whether or not to release the photos of Uday and Qusay Hussein, and they were pretty gruesome as well, and ultimately, that decision was made. What is the difference here? MCCASKILL: I think the difference here is that there is no question that Osama Bin Laden is dead. We didn't know at the time the photographs were taken whether or not al Qaeda or Taliban or any of the other terrorist organizations out there would try to push back and say, you know, they're not telling the truth. Of course, he's not dead. That hasn't occurred. In fact, there's been very little noise out there.
CHETRY: Right. And do you think if it does occur, if people do start to question this that this is a decision for now, and perhaps, later down the road, when things have calmed down, maybe these pictures will come out?
MCCASKILL: I don't think there's going to be any credible attempt to question his death, especially with his family confirming his death. I think the only thing that might be considered down the line, and I don't know if this has even been talked about is maybe the photograph showing that his burial at sea was done according to the Muslim tradition, out of respect to all those peace-loving Muslims across the world.
CHETRY: I got you. One of the things I was wondering, and people are asking whether or not there's a rift or perhaps a little bit of a miscommunication within the administration, and that Leon Panetta, CIA director, said he felt these pictures would come out, and perhaps, should come out, and so, that the White House not seeing it that way this morning.
MCCASKILL: Oh, I think you need to understand the decisions that were made on how to go forward in terms of this operation, a lot of the decisions were made about whether or not we could prove that Osama Bin Laden was killed, and I think that was a focus. And so, I think that, perhaps, Director Panetta was worried in the early hours after the attack and after the operation was successfully completed that there would be questions about whether or not he died.
Clearly, those questions have not arisen. And so, there is no reason for us to pass these photos around and cause the kind of anti- American sentiment that surely they would cause in some parts of the world, unfortunately.
CHETRY: I just want to ask you quickly about the situation in your home state of Missouri, the Mississippi river, so swollen. We're hearing that in some of the tributaries, it's actually flowing backwards. We're talking about, you know, the loss of millions of dollars of homes, lives, jobs.
And I know that there was a lot of debate over whether or not the army corps of engineers should intentionally blast opened that levee. Are you with hope that they would reconsider that plan? It was, obviously, a very tough choice. What are your thoughts today as this continues to get worse?
MCCASKILL: Well, clearly, this is an epic flood. And the army corps of engineers had a difficult decision. I continue to maintain that a natural breach would be something that could not be avoided, obviously. The man-made breach, I think, they were thinking about the bigger picture. It remains to be seen whether or not it is going to be effective in light of this flooding down river.
But I knew that there was over a hundred thousand acres, 133,000 acres to be exact that were going to be taken out of agricultural production. That's an economic devastation to that part of my state. And so, we were all together fighting to try to save that farmland and those homes because what it means to our economy in the state of Missouri.
CHETRY: Yes, and not only that, these are food prices that will likely be passed along to all Americans.
MCCASKILL: Absolutely.
CHETRY: At a very tough time.
MCCASKILL: No, we feed the world in Missouri.
CHETRY: You're right. Senator Claire McCaskill, thanks so much for joining us this morning. Great to get a chance to talk to you.
MCCASKILL: Thank you so much.
VELSHI: And back to the topic about the photographs and the president's decision not to release them. We want to know and we've been soliciting your thoughts on what you think about this. You can e-mail us, you can Facebook us, you can tweet us.
ROMANS: Yes, that's right. @CNNAM is how you get to us or any of us. We have some Facebook and Twitter account. We've got some really fascinating ones and some angles I haven't thought it before. So, we're really enjoying what your feedback is.
VELSHI: We're going to be reading your comments a little later.
Also, we're getting a little closer to understanding this Sony Playstation pack attack and finding out who might be to blame for this. There'd be some tough questions asked and a few answers elicited. It's 22 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: It is 25 minutes after the hour. "Minding Your Business" this morning. Sony says it has uncovered a file that could link the well-known hacker group called anonymous to Sony security breach last month. Millions of users may have had their personal information stolen.
Gas prices are just up penny shy of a dubious milestone according to the AAA. The national average, now $3.99 a gallon. Right now, we are just 12 cents from the all-time high setback in July of 2008.
Your next trip down the cereal aisle is going to cost you more. Kellogg's announcing it plans to raise prices on its cereals and other snacks by 4 percent to offset higher cost for transportation and ingredients like wheat and sugar.
GM's Corvette factory about to get more muscle as it prepares to roll out the next generation of the sports car. The automaker says it will invest $131 million and add about 250 jobs at the Kentucky plant.
And for the second year in a row, Wal-Mart tops the Fortune 500, the largest companies in America. Exxon remains number two, but it was the real moneymaker with $35.6 billion in profits.
AMERICAN MORNING is back after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROMANS: Happening now, bracing for unprecedented flooding. Police say 23 miles of I-40 in Eastern Arkansas is now closed between the towns of Hazen and Brinkly because of the flood. It's the first time an interstate route through the state has been closed because of such high water. Water backed up covering the roadway. Drivers are taking detours this morning. More than 30,000 drivers pass through this area on typical day.
CHETRY: The Mississippi River is buckling under the water pressure. In fact, in Tennessee, they say some of the tributaries are actually flowing backwards. The backup, a huge problem for nearby neighborhoods, homes, businesses, factories, all in danger of taking on water.
VELSHI: Joining us now, Melissa Moon of CNN affiliate, WREG. She is in Memphis where they are monitoring the situation. What's it like in Memphis, Melissa?
MELISSA MOON, WREG CORRESPODNENT: We are in one of the tributaries you were talking about. We were on the Wolf River on Mud Island in downtown Memphis. Along with the river, it is rising. You can see here just how close it is getting to some of those homes here.
People in these homes have been told to be ready to evacuate. We know that some people have already been getting their belongings out of their homes in preparation. They have been told they will get some sort of water inside their homes.
The Mississippi is expected to go up to 48 feet next week. That's near the record of 48.7 setback in 1937. During that flood, it was again the tributaries that were causing all the problems. Floodwaters are affecting around 2,800 properties. That is down from 5,300 that was once predicted.
People who live in about 19 zip codes have been told to take precautions to be ready to go out, that they will be affected in some way by the flooding, whether it is water in their homes or some of their roads that will be closed because of all the flooding. We have also been told that at least six schools will be affected.
That includes one here on Mud Island, a daycare and all day yesterday, they were sandbagging that school and moving the kids to the second floor of that building. Also over the last week, they have been putting up flood gates along the Mississippi in downtown Memphis.
As well as sandbagging as extra precautions and we have been told that at 48 feet, the river will cross over Riverside Drive, which is the main road that goes along the Mississippi in downtown Memphis. Reporting live in Memphis, back to you.
VELSHI: Melissa, thanks very much. We'll stay on top of this, but you're remarkable that everything you are seeing is still going to get worse.
ROMANS: And playing out in dozens, dozens, I would say hundreds of little towns up and down the Mississippi River and other river basins too. I mean, this is happening throughout the Midwest. We know you are all praying that it doesn't rain for the next couple days.
CHETRY: Claire McCaskill said, the senator in Missouri, Missouri feeds the world.
VELSHI: Yes, that's absolutely right.
Well, let's bring you up to speed on some of our top stories right now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI (voice-over): French police have reportedly retrieved the first body from the wreckage of that Air France flight that crashed into the Atlantic nearly two years ago.
The airbus A-330 was traveling from Rio de Janeiro to Paris with 228 people on board when it went down. The wreckage was found last month, 13,000 feet down.
Syrian security forces have been battling protesters for the last month and a half have according to state TV they have gun pulling out of Tehran, a rebel stronghold.
The government claims it has restored security and calm after confiscating weapons and arresting scores of people. A human rights group says more than 500 people have been killed in that fighting. This is new video that has just been released that appears to show a number of protesters scattering after gunshots are heard.
In Japan, workers have gone back inside the reactor building of unit one at the Daiichi nuclear power station, the first time anyone has been in there since the tsunami hit nearly two months ago.
Monitoring devices show radiation levels in the building are higher than anyone thought. Workers are going to spend the next four or five days installing six ventilation machines that are designed to absorb radiation from the air.
The radiation levels in the reactor have got to be reduced before new cooling systems can actually be installed to try and continue to fix this problem.
The men who got Bin Laden are back on U.S. soil. The elite U.S. Navy SEAL team that stormed his compound in Pakistan is home this morning. U.S. officials now say Bin Laden was unarmed, but going for a gun when he was shot dead.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ROMANS: President Obama is visiting the World Trade Center site today as the news sinks in that Osama Bin Laden is dead. Obama is going down to the site. It has become such an important image in the U.S. and around the world of what happened here.
CHETRY: Yes, here is a live look at the White House where the president will leave for Ground Zero from the White House in about an hour to meet with 9/11 families and also to lay a wreath.
VELSHI: He will visit a fire house that lost 15 men in the attacks of September 11th. Many families are saying Bin Laden's death is a milestone, but they are still struggling to find closure to it.
ROMANS: You know, and there is mixed reaction really to the decision by the president not to go public with the Bin Laden's death photos. We want to know what you think about the president's decision. Here are some of your responses.
Lady Big Mac wrote us on Tweeter, the president is right. We do not need to see pics of OBL. The tin hat people won't believe no matter what so why pander to them.
VELSHI: And on Facebook, Ron says a little photo has gobbled up the media for the last two days. Seriously, he is dead. Enough said, can you put your focus back on more pressing issues like economy, jobs and U.S. debt.
CHETRY: And again, these are the ones who don't want it released by Thomas Howard also by not showing the photo, we are showing al Qaeda and the world that we are above being barbaric.
We did the right thing by ridding the world of someone who stood in the way of peace between cultures. Obama's decision shows that he wants to put this behind us and move towards unity.
ROMANS: But here's what Angela Macarthur told us on Facebook. She said, show them, so that people can have proof. I don't need to see them, but the discussion will never end unless they show these pictures.
I agree with President Obama, that these photos should not be used as a trophy. But people can't trust word of mouth. I think they will eventually show them. When they do, people that don't want to see them, they can walk away. But people need that proof.
VELSHI: Leigh on our blog says, we don't need no stinging photos. He is dead, but I do like this part. If people don't believe him, let them just wait for him to show up. Period, move on. CHETRY: And Dale Gilxes on Facebook writes, I think it was a bad decision. Obama needs to look at the Americans that jumped for their lives during 9/11. If they showed those images on TV, then he and the government should have no problem showing is Osama's photos. To have a strong and put-together America, you have to be honest and up front with the American people.
So a lot of very thoughtful answers this morning. We appreciate everybody's comments.
ROMANS: But two big strains, we need to move on or people will never stop talking about it unless you do. We have seen a lot of really horrible stuff. Why stop here.
VELSHI: I saw very few comments from people who said themselves that they need to see it to believe it, but we did get a few.
ROMANS: All right, we're going to talk paychecks now, paychecks for teachers, are they not rewarded well enough in the classroom? Is that part of our education problem? We are going to have Steve Perry next on this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROMANS: The issue of teachers' salaries keeps coming up, specifically, are they underpaid? Also, why are teachers blamed so often for poor student performance? Should administrators be held accountable?
Joining me now to discuss some of these questions, CNN education contributor and founder of the Capital Prep Magnet School in Connecticut, Steve Perry.
Steve, welcome to the program. You know, nothing inflames people who are really excited and concerned about education more than teachers' salaries. You hear from teachers that they are not paid enough to attract some people from industry, from career, to get science and technology into the classroom.
You hear from others who say, teachers are paid just fine. I want to talk to you about a recent op ed in "The New York Times" saying, yet, again, the teachers are taking a lot of blame for the failing education system. It makes interesting analogy, Steve, to the military.
This op ed says we don't blame soldiers for a failing operation, so why do we blame teachers for a failing system? Do you think that's an appropriate analogy?
STEVE PERRY, CNN EDUCATION CONTRIBUTOR: Absolutely not. It is faulty analysis. The basic premise of it is that these people are all the same. In fact, what -- the second part of the analogy that is often put forward is that teachers should be seen as the highest professionals.
The highest professionals typically have the highest accountability. Listen, there are teachers who are amazing, worth their weight in gold. I meet them all the time. I work with them every day and those people should be paid what they are worth.
But the problem is - the problem here is that we have collective bargaining, which says that every teacher is exactly the same. The reason why the teachers are not being paid more first is because their own organizations, the unions and those people that support those organizations say that everyone should be paid exactly the same, regardless of their capacity.
ROMANS: When I do stories about these programs from some big companies like IBM and others where they allow mid-career scientists to take a sabbatical for example and go and see if they want to work in a classroom.
What you hear a lot is why would somebody trade in $100,000 salary in a private sector to be a teacher where parents maybe aren't engage in their trial. The children aren't paying attention.
You've got a big bureaucracy, the administrator maybe who is disengaged. How do you attract people who have the skills we need into classroom if you are not going to pay them more?
PERRY: Because people don't get into education for money. If you got an education for money then - you get in education because you love children. You want to do some meaningful, which you like. You want to make an impact on the world.
In fact, what's interesting about the article itself, it is written by two people that run a virtually volunteer organization. I've visited it -- Ventura in San Francisco. Most of their people who worked with the children, most of their tutors are volunteers, which goes to show that many people will do it for free.
In fact, let's take it one step further. The Department of Labor says in 2009 that the mean teacher salary was $55,000, $55,000 will make you comfortably middle class, but let's take that one step further.
The teachers are working -- have 14 weeks of the year off where the rest of us have two, 14 weeks a year off and they are still making average salary, meaning they are middle class. We have to begin to see that this is not about salary.
This is about quality. The quality is not driven by how much you pay somebody because if that were the case, everybody who is paid a lot of money would be great at their job.
ROMANS: A starting-out teacher in more than 30 metropolitan areas according to a couple different reports would not be able to afford home ownership, even with the declining prices of a home if you were a one-worker household. I mean, you're not going to get rich being a teacher.
PERRY: How many 21-year-olds do you know could buy a house? They're saying starting salary is typically what you make at 21 years old when you decide to be a teacher. If these organizations like the teachers union and other would take a step back and allow people.
I believe that a person should be able to transfer from another career and make about what they would have made in the other career. It's not the principles we're against at. Do you think I'm against that? I'm not against that. We don't want these rules either.
In fact, many teachers don't want it. These organizations want to collectively bargain and speak on behalf of these professionals. These professionals can speak for themselves. Let the teachers come and negotiate their own contract with their own principals.
Sit down, woman to woman, man to man and have a conversation and say, man, I am a science teacher. I don't want to make what other people make. I'm amazing science teacher. Let them come in and argue their own case, but they cannot.
In fact, one of the things that I wanted to do when I became a principal because people don't realize I'm a public school principal. I wanted to take a 20 percent pay cut because I felt like I wasn't deserving of it because I hadn't proven anything.
But when I became one of the best, I wanted to make sure I got all that money back. The -- the HR laughed at me and said, what are you talking about dude, you can't do that. You can't argue -- you can't put your own contract together. You've got to wait to work at CNN to do that.
ROMANS: Yes. We have to leave it there, Steve Perry. Of course, a teacher's salary is one part of a very big, big debate about how to improve education in this country and we tackle all of them. But that's just one part of it. Thanks, Steve Perry.
To you guys.
VELSHI: Christine, after the show, we'll talk about this. But I think you need to work harder on bringing Steve out of his shell.
ROMANS: I know, you know, we keep telling him he's got to try to be a little bit more opinionated.
VELSHI: Yes.
ROMANS: But yes, we'll work on that.
VELSHI: Kiran, remember and Christine remember back when the Madoff stuff broke, one of the things that we all thought was that their -- the victims unfortunately are not going to get much back. They are now going to finally start getting some of the money that's been recovered, more of it than many of us expected.
CHETRY: Not bad. All right.
Well, also talk about a debate -- what goes on with the system that's in play now for college football? At the end of the year, do the two best teams play each other?
VELSHI: We will find out.
CHETRY: No. No, the answer is, no, they don't.
VELSHI: Oh well, that's not a very good tease. Why would somebody need to come back to find out more?
CHETRY: Because it looks like now the Justice Department is getting involved in this.
VELSHI: All right. We'll talk about it on the other side. It's 46 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: A lot going on this morning and here's what you need to know to start your day.
French police have reportedly retrieved the first body from the wreckage of that Air France flight that crashed into the Atlantic nearly two years ago. The Airbus A330 was traveling from Rio De Janeiro to Paris with 228 people on board when it went down.
President Obama leaving Washington for Ground Zero in about an hour from now; he will lay a wreath and meet with families and visit a firehouse that lost 15 men on 9/11.
Parts of the Midwest, many of them struggling to stay dry this morning, meteorologist say flood relief isn't expected until at least another few weeks. Government engineers are expected to breach a third section of the Mississippi River today to ease up water pressure but that's going to flood some more farms.
For the 44th straight day, gas prices are up. According to AAA, the national average is now $3.99 a gallon.
And victims of Bernie Madoff may finally get some money back. The trustee in charge of recovering the stolen funds is asking a federal bankruptcy judge to allow him to put more than $2.5 billion into a fund which would be used to make the first payments.
The markets open in 45 minutes right now -- right now, futures are down after the number of people filing for first time unemployment claims surged to 474,000 last week. That is the highest total in eight months.
And just in to CNN, the royal family says Prince William and his new bride, Catherine Middleton, are going to California in July. It's Prince William's first official visit to the United States and it's Catherine's first-ever visit to the U.S.
You're caught up on the day's headlines. AMERICAN MORNING is back after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) ROMANS: All right.
The Justice Department is now asking the NCAA the same question fans have been asking and my husband has been screaming about for years. Why doesn't college football have a playoff system?
CHETRY: Why doesn't it?
Well, Assistant Attorney General, Christine Barney, has written a letter to the president of the NCAA. It says, quote, "Serious questions continue to arise suggesting that the current BCS system may not be conducted consistent with the competition principles expressed in federal antitrust laws."
ROMANS: That sounds serious.
Joining us to discuss the BCS Goal System and the possibility of an anti-trust case against the NCAA is Stewart Mandel, senior writer for "Sports Illustrated".
It's an interesting intersection of sports and politics. It starts kind of -- in 2008 where the (INAUDIBLE) of Utah were snubbed after it succeeded.
STEWART MANDEL, SENIOR WRITER, "SPORTS ILLUSTRATED": Right.
ROMANS: So here to -- to a casual sports fan, the two best teams should be playing in the end but that's not what happens here.
MANDEL: The two best teams play as determined by voters in the poll, writers and coaches and obviously some years there is a lot of debate over who those two teams should be. And because of that, fans for -- for years and decades have been pleading for some sort of playoff, a four-team playoff, an eight-team playoff. Something that resembles all the other sports out there but college football has this goal system.
ROMANS: Why? Why?
MANDEL: Oh how are we going to explain that quickly? You know, you have the Rose Bowl and the Sugar Bowl and the -- but some of these games have been around for 70 to 80 years and the conferences are very loyal to them partly because they have been going to these games for however many years.
Also because they control the money; they -- they get to decide --
(CROSSTALK)
ROMANS: Right.
MANDEL: -- which conferences get how much money from this. Whereas if it were an NCAA-sponsored event, like "March Madness" you know, the NCAA would determine that and some of those conferences. We wouldn't get to keep the loot. CHETRY: Right. And what you're saying here, well, first of all, when we say the best teams, I mean, because it is subjective, this is a problem a lot of people have. As Christine was saying, the Utah had a perfect season. But that wasn't good enough.
ROMANS: Yes.
MANDEL: Yes.
CHETRY: So it's not who wins the most, it's who is determined to be the best.
MANDEL: Well, at that time Utah played in the Mountain West conference which is not --
(CROSSTALK)
CHETRY: Right. So they -- they were saying it's not a hard conference to win.
MANDEL: It's -- yes, it's not --
(CROSSTALK)
CHETRY: Just because they had a perfect season that doesn't mean they are the best team.
MANDEL: Exactly and so the voters voted for -- for Oklahoma -- they voted Oklahoma and Florida.
(CROSSTALK)
CHETRY: Right.
MANDEL: Who play in tougher conferences; who weren't undefeated. That really what set off Orrin Hatch, the senator from Utah and has begun this crusade that now seems to finally be getting somewhere.
CHETRY: Is anything really going to change because there is -- I mean there was an enormous amount of clout behind these huge conferences, the money that they bring in, the money they are expected to be paid. So really, how would you go about unraveling this and maybe change it?
MANDEL: Well, at the end of the day, no judge can sit there and bang a gavel and say you have to start a playoff.
ROMANS: Right.
MANDEL: You can't force schools to be in a playoff if they don't want to be in it. But I think a lot of people out there who have been hoping for all these years for a playoff are hoping that just the Department of Justice's involvement, you know, as some sort of prolonged investigation that causes them to give depositions and have to open their books and things like that might wear them down and cause them to dissolve the BCS. ROMANS: Well, the sports fan-in-chief has actually weighed in on this himself --
MANDEL: Yes, he has.
ROMANS: -- you know, and said he would use his position perhaps to nudge it along. But aside from the Justice Department sending a letter, I mean what can really happen?
MANDEL: You know, they would have to actually launch a formal inquiry. This letter to the NCAA, we don't really understand why it went to the NCAA. They're not really the ones that are responsible for this like the BCS is. But it was the first sign in the 2 1/2 years since Orrin Hatch first mentioned this. It is the first public sign that they are taking this seriously and are considering, you know, pursuing some sort of formal inquiry.
CHETRY: And could it work this way, Stewart -- I mean because the NCAA has said it is willing to do a playoff. The schools want it. The problem is schools get a certain amount of money to send their teams to the specific bowl games.
MANDEL: Specifically the major conferences.
CHETRY: Right. The major conferences --
MANDEL: They get to control how much money comes in and who gets a share of this.
CHETRY: So could they do it this way? Could they go ahead with the Fiesta Bowl and with the Rose Bowl and with all of those bowls but then have an actual championship series that then happens after those bowl games.
MANDEL: The bowl games would tell you they would go out of business. Fans wouldn't want to travel to those games anymore because they would be more concerned about the playoffs.
ROMANS: This is a business story, isn't it? This is a business story at its core instead of -- you know, you think of it as a sports story but this really --
MANDEL: College sports is big business; it's non-profit which is what has caused a lot of the uproar over this. Our state-funded institutions being deprived of the chance to earn more revenue, like Utah. But yes, at the end of the day, college sports is a huge business. It's a cutthroat business.
CHETRY: Business and bragging -- you can't forget bragging rights. Bragging rights as well.
ROMANS: True.
MANDEL: Yes.
CHETRY: But yes. All right. Stewart Mandel for us, senior writer with "Sports Illustrated" and the discussion goes on. Thanks so much.
MANDEL: Thank you.
ROMANS: 55 minutes after the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: Look at that. Look at that. It is sunny and 52 degrees in New York City. I need to get out. Could we end this show?
ROMANS: You know the biggest breaking news of the morning is that the new Duke and Duchess of Cambridge are coming to the United States but they will not be in Central Park. They are going to California instead.
CHETRY: Well, you know --
(CROSSTALK)
VELSHI: It's her first official visit. It's her first visit of all.
CHETRY: I know. It's her first visit; I can't wait. I think they are going to make it a great trip. They may say right now, they are going to Cali; they are going to come by.
VELSHI: It's getting up to 61 degrees and sunny in New York City. If you need to find me this afternoon, I will be sun bathing in Central Park.
CHETRY: That's right. But the beauty of it is because of --
VELSHI: That was a joke.
CHETRY: Oh, ok. Then I won't say anything.
VELSHI: The first lady has let her "Let's Move" campaign -- she has launched it and she is leading by example. Check this out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(FIRST LADY MICHELLE OBAMA DOING THE DOUGIE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: She can move.
CHETRY: She looks great with the Dougie, the Running Man. That's a hard one. The Running Man's hard. I think that's a Bobby Brown. It is not easy for the average person.
VELSHI: I like that she does it.
CHETRY: She looks amazing.
VELSHI: Showed off all the moves. CHETRY: She looks great.
VELSHI: This, by the way, the middle school of Washington where students are performing a dance routine that Beyonce choreographed for Michelle Obama's health --
(CROSSTALK)
VELSHI: I love it.
(CROSSTALK)
ROMANS: That's her signature initiative. They move, you eat well.
(CROSSTALK)
CHETRY: I mean (INAUDIBLE) exciting was for those kids. She said the first lady was there and that she was cool and that she actually danced with them.
ROMANS: All right. That's going to wrap it up for us. We're going to be doing the Dougie right after here but we're going to hand it off to Carol Costello first.
CHETRY: Yes, because you don't want to see that.
"NEWSROOM" starts now. Hey, Carol.
