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Nancy Grace
Anthony Jury Selection Nears End
Aired May 19, 2011 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the case of 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee. Six months of searching culminates when skeletal remains found in a heavily wooded area just 15 houses from the Anthony home confirmed to be Caylee. A utility meter reader stumbles on a tiny human skeleton, including a skull covered in light-colored hair, the killer duct- taping, placing a heart-shaped sticker directly over the mouth, then triple-bagging little Caylee like she`s trash.
The murder trial of tot mom Casey Anthony under way after jury selection screeches to a halt. Bombshell tonight. There is no plea deal. That`s right, no guilty plea, After lead defense Baez disappears from court and tot mom bursts into tears over a rumored plea, tonight, we are headed to a jury trial.
And the feud between tot mom and her lead defense attorney back on. Today, tot mom and Baez get back into it. Tot mom throws up her hands and walks out of court. It`s all caught on video. As one juror breaks down in tears, barely able to speak, describing the duct tape binding 2-year-old Caylee`s mouth and nose, tot mom just looks on as the juror breaks down and cries. But she, tot mom, shows no emotion, no reaction, nothing. And tonight, will another juror be arrested?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m about to read you what is known as an indictment, first degree murder, child abuse.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The corpse was wrapped up in duct tape with a heart on it. There was tape on the baby`s mouth and nose.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: False information to a law enforcement officer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you cause any injury to your child, Caylee?
CASEY ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S MOTHER: No, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I believe she is guilty.
CASEY ANTHONY: Yes, it`s getting physical right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you lay aside that opinion?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel very strongly about this.
CASEY ANTHONY: They got all of their information from me.
CINDY ANTHONY, CASEY`S MOTHER: We are helpless.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To look at another human being and to say to them that you should die.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know I would have a very hard time sentencing someone to death.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. There is no plea deal. That`s right, no guilty plea. After lead defense attorney Jose Baez disappears from court, tot mom bursts into tears over a rumored plea, we are headed to a jury trial.
Straight out to Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session," in court all day. Jean, I was amazed at the way tot mom could sit and stare on when that juror broke down in tears on the stand. The juror was describing what she had heard about the case. She could barely speak. Her voice was trembling. The juror couldn`t keep speaking. She broke into tears. And tot mom sat there and watched as if she were watching NASDAQ.
JEAN CASAREZ, "IN SESSION": You know, Nancy, it was amazing the emotion from this juror. I watched it also from the courtroom. And this is the first juror that literally was brought to tears as she describes the facts she knew about the case.
GRACE: Let`s take a look, Liz. Let`s see that video of what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From June of 2008 up until you came to court, had you heard anything about this case in the news?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I had, yes. I do remember the baby was found near the house, I believe, down in a field or a lot or something.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, ma`am.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do remember that there was tape on the baby`s mouth and nose and that there were various people involved in the case. It was just hard for me to listen to. I didn`t follow it intently, other than hoping the child would be found.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And it only went down from there, the juror visibly crying, sobbing, barely able to speak. And the tot mom -- Jean, I was sitting right behind you. Tot mom sat there looking on, as if they were talking about somebody else. I swear it looked like she was watching the NASDAQ ticker go across the bottom of the screen, like it had nothing to do with her.
CASAREZ: And Nancy, I saw that juror look at Casey. She looked at he, not with eyes of hatred but with eyes of sorrow. She looked at Casey Anthony when she was talking about the remains. Not that reaction, though, back to the juror.
GRACE: And today in court, another fight between tot mom and her lead defense attorney, Baez, Jose Baez mysteriously disappearing from court yesterday, fueling rumors that a plea deal was on the table. Court screeched to a halt. But today, everyone was back in place. If there had been a plea deal on the table, it`s off now, and we are headed to a jury trial.
Liz, let`s see the video of tot mom and Jose Baez back at it in court again today, not a good look between a death penalty defendant and the lead defense attorney. Here you see she went on to throw her hand up at Baez, like, What? And walked out of the courtroom. Baez made some response back. Let`s see the other two arguments that we have observed of them in the courtroom.
Now, one of these occurred, Jean Casarez, as you recall, when the mikes at the defense table were still hooked up. That caused quite a brouhaha. Describe.
CASAREZ: Well, it was when the mikes were up. It went over the Internet. And what that did was it turned -- the attorneys now have the mikes off at their desks. So sometimes, we can`t hear what they`re saying in open court on the record.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Mary in Oklahoma. Hi, Mary.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would like to know why there is no one in court for Caylee.
GRACE: You know, that`s a good question. To Robyn Walensky, reporter, WDBO. Robyn, once again, George, Cindy and Lee Anthony no-shows in the courtroom. I guess it could be construed that the state is there to represent Caylee. But what do you make of the fact that no one really is there representing Caylee in court?
ROBYN WALENSKY, WDBO: There`s only one word, Nancy, that comes to mind, and the word is heartbreaking. This beautiful little girl captured the attention of the entire nation, and there is no one in there representing her interests. It is so, so sad. I think at, the end of the day, when we do see the parents going forward, hopefully, Monday at trial in Orange County, I think that then she will be properly represented by her very loving grandparents.
GRACE: Back to Robyn Walensky. Describe what happened in court today. How far have we gotten with the jury selection? In fact, I think we`re headed to a jury being sworn in.
WALENSKY: Yes, it was really amazing, Nancy. All the reporters, we staked -- I was in the stakeout this morning in the parking lot looking for Jose Baez to see if he was showing up. So about a dozen of us were out there. People are shouting questions at him -- Did you have a stomachache? Well, apparently, he really did have a stomachache and wasn`t well.
P.S., we get in to the court and nothing is mentioned about the antics of yesterday. And then they plowed forward straight ahead. Four jurors the judge dismissed right out of the gate for financial hardship. And then they had the woman that you were just talking about, who cried on the stand. This is a juror who had been sick for a couple of days. And the reason she was really so upset is that she`s in her late 50s. She`s a baby-sitter herself. And she was very upset. She used the word "smokescreen." She was very upset that Casey had used her baby-sitter as a smokescreen in the case.
And then they plowed ahead with some other jurors. They got two alternates. So before the break, the lunchtime break, there was a total of 14.
GRACE: Everyone, we are live here in Florida covering the tot mom Casey Anthony murder one death penalty trial. Jury selection still under way, but we expect a jury to be sworn at least by tomorrow, with opening statements following that. It has been an uphill battle to get jurors that are unfamiliar with the case and jurors that can undergo being in a death penalty trial for so many days.
We are all taking your calls right now. Unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, Pilar Prinz, defense attorney, family law attorney. Eleanor Odom, senior attorney with the National District Attorneys Association, death penalty-qualified, out of Washington, D.C. And Peter Odom, defense attorney, Atlanta.
You know, at the rate this is going, it looks like we may even have another juror that could get arrested, Eleanor. What do you make of it?
ELEANOR ODOM, NATIONAL DISTRICT ATTORNEYS ASSOC.: Well, Nancy, you know, jurors have to respond to their summons. They have to answer the questions in court. They have to do what the judge says. And no juror can get away with that. And you can`t lie on the stand or lie when you`re being asked questions during the jury selection process.
GRACE: OK. Weigh in, Peter Odom.
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It`s particularly true what Eleanor says in a death penalty case, where a woman`s life hangs in the balance. The integrity of the process is so important here, Nancy.
GRACE: OK. You know what? I appreciate what you`re saying. Let me see Odom. The integrity of the process.
PETER ODOM: Yes.
GRACE: OK. We`ve got tot mom having fights with her defense attorney sitting at the table in plain view. We`ve got her throwing her hands up and walking out of the courtroom. We`ve got the lead defense attorney telling her, Pilar, that she`s acting like a 2-year-old, and she says, Really? And he goes, Really. And it goes on and on and on, Baez leaving in the middle of the day yesterday.
I don`t -- what integrity?
PILAR PRINZ, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy...
GRACE: The jury should not be seeing what is going on behind the curtain, so to speak, with this defense team, but we are.
PRINZ: You`re absolutely right, Nancy, and it`s the job of the defense team to make sure that that doesn`t happen. They need to be making sure the mike`s off. They need to be making sure that they`re not saying anything that`s getting anywhere except for the defense table.
GRACE: And what do you believe, Pilar, regarding the rift between tot mom and her lead defense attorney, Jose Baez? Now they`re sitting on opposite ends of the table and visibly fighting.
PRINZ: Well, Nancy, it`s very apparent to us watching. And the question is, are they going to continue this once the jury`s been sworn in and the trial actually starts? I think it could be damaging for them if they do.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The mother said the baby was originally with a baby-sitter, which turned out not to be the case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I still believe there`s a Zanny out there. I do.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She said she dropped the baby off at the foot of the stairs and left.
CASEY ANTHONY: (INAUDIBLE) stairs. That`s where I`ve dropped her off a bunch of other times, not just that day.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There was no such woman that lived there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is there any other person besides your daughter that has told you that they have met or seen Zanny?
CINDY ANTHONY: No, but Caylee talked about Zanny`s dog.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, we`ll get to that in a second...
CINDY ANTHONY: She`s another person, OK?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And I appreciate...
CINDY ANTHONY: Well, if there`s a dog that belongs to Zanny, then there must be a Zanny.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m a former day care giver myself. It was very chilling to me to see the baby-sitter pulled into this as kind of a smokescreen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. And we are live here in Florida, there the Clearwater, Florida, courthouse where the jury is being selected for the trial of Casey Anthony, tot mom, in the murder of her 2-year-old little girl, Caylee. Many jurors in tears today as they describe what they know about the case. But one by one, it is being whittled down to a jury of 12 with, hopefully, four alternates.
Out to Steve Helling, in court today, writer with "People" magazine. Steve, we`ve got another juror who the judge was considering arresting today. Why?
STEVE HELLING, "PEOPLE": Well, he actually didn`t show up. They brought in 30 new jurors, and actually, only 29 of them showed up in the courtroom. The one that was missing -- get this, Nancy -- is actually an attorney in his 40s, and he just didn`t show up for court. From what I understand, the judge has decided retroactively to excuse him from jury duty. But it was strange that the one person who wouldn`t show up is the person who should know better.
GRACE: And of course, Ellie Jostad, they`ve had to bring in an entire new batch of jurors to augment what they already had. These jurors were called in to hear other cases. They`re really trolling the courthouse to get enough jurors to make up this jury. What happened, Ellie?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER (via telephone): Well, he`s operating a little differently this time. He`s doing hardship questioning with these jurors, but what he did is he let them all remain in the courtroom when he started asking them questions about whether they could afford to be off work, if they would still get paid. And we were starting to get concerned because then he started asking them -- and he said only answer yes or no, but he started asking them if they`d heard about the case and if they`d formed an opinion.
GRACE: Out to Leonard Padilla, bounty hunter who first bailed tot mom out of jail on bad checks and forgery. So Leonard, so apparently, no plea deal. Wasn`t that your prediction last night, there was going to be a plea and she`d get 10 years? Not happening, Padilla!
LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER: Yes, that`s off the table, is my understanding, as of this morning. But there was talk about it three days ago, that there was a 10-year lid on a guilty plea being resurrected from back in -- I believe it was in the latter part of November when it first came up. When I checked again this morning, there was some confusion as to whether it had been re-offered or had been requested again. And that`s where it ended up this morning.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, death penalty-qualified, Pilar Prinz out of Atlanta, Peter Odom, defense attorney.
Eleanor, the whole point of a plea for the state is to save the weeks, the months, sometimes years, as in this case, of preparation to take a death penalty case to trial. That`s the whole reason you enter a plea. So why would they do it now?
ELEANOR ODOM: I don`t think they did, Nancy. And 10 years? That doesn`t sound right, on a murder case, a death penalty case? I think this is mere speculation. I bet 10 years was never on the table. And as a prosecutor, I would not plead this case out. Let the jury make that decision.
GRACE: Absolutely right. Now that they have declared a death penalty case, Pilar, come on, the reality is you don`t go from a death penalty announcement, that you consider the case so serious, you`re seeking the death penalty, to a 10-year plea deal where she`ll walk in five to seven years? That doesn`t happen.
PRINZ: Nancy, absolutely not, not now that they`ve gotten to this point that they found the body and they have as much information and evidence as they have. I don`t see it happening.
GRACE: What about it, Peter Odom?
PETER ODOM: Nancy, the state has another motivation to put some kind of a plea deal back on the table, and that is to get finality to the case, certainty to a resolution of the case, and to prevent all those years...
GRACE: Put Odom up!
PETER ODOM: ... and that`s a great motivation...
GRACE: Put Odom up!
PETER ODOM: Put me up.
GRACE: Hey, here`s a little word to the wise. Believe me, a death penalty is final.
PETER ODOM: Maybe after 12 years, when the appeals are done, Nancy. And until then...
GRACE: But it`s final, Peter!
PETER ODOM: ... everybody suffers. And until then, everybody suffers.
GRACE: That`s finality you never have with a plea deal.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t usually make snap judgments, but...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A rich social life for Casey Anthony not long after her daughter was lost from the picture.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The actions that I have heard did not portray an innocent mother distraught (ph) for her child.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So many text messages who she wanted to have sex with, drinking and smoking pot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That for me was very telling.
CASEY ANTHONY: You`re not telling me anything that I don`t know!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I believe she is guilty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. And we are live right now out of Florida, camped outside the Clearwater and Orlando courthouses right now. Jury selection has been going down all day in a Clearwater courtroom. That trial will be tried, however, in Orange County, Orlando, where the murder occurred.
We are taking your calls. Out to Sue in Georgia. Hi, Sue. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, Nancy. I -- my TV went off today and I was trying to -- what I wanted to ask you, have they been able to get a complete jury yet?
GRACE: They`re very, very close, but -- exactly how far away do you believe they are, Steve Helling?
HELLING: Well, you know, right now, there are still some back strikes that are available to both the prosecution and the defense. But right now, we have more than 12 people in place. So there is a chance that the jury has already been chosen, although there`s -- they`re asking some more questions of more jurors. I think that we will definitely see a jury that will be picked by the end of the day tomorrow. I mean, hope springs eternal.
GRACE: And Steve...
HELLING: Maybe it could happen earlier, but -- yes, Nancy?
GRACE: What is this business about giving everybody another day off before we get opening statements? They`ve had three years to get ready for opening statements. Why do we need another day off?
HELLING: Well, that`s not just for the attorneys. That`s for the jurors, who are going to be uprooted and moved. You know, they really do need a day to put their affairs in order, to kiss their wives and kids good-bye before they go away for eight weeks. So that`s really the reason why they`re doing it.
GRACE: That`s a good point. That`s a very good point.
I want to go back out to Robyn Walensky, Robyn joining us from WDBO, in court today. I`m sure you saw, just as I did, the tension between tot mom and her lead defense attorney is palpable in the courtroom. Not so on the side of the prosecution. They`re fitting together like a hand and glove. What did you observe with tot mom and her defense attorneys? They`re flanking her on all sides, but she refuses to sit near Baez.
WALENSKY: It`s amazing, Nancy. Today -- yesterday I was in the second row. Today I was in the first row. Like you say, the prosecution is really a cohesive team. But on the defense table, Casey is all the way over here, and Jose Baez is all the way over there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The first prospective juror to be questioned this morning --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Had the whole courtroom on edge.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Continued to cry --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: As she described what she knew about the victim in this case.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do remember that there was tape on the baby`s mouth and nose.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Caylee was almost 3 when she died.
CINDY ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S MOTHER: There`s no evidence that Casey has ever done any harm to her child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put duct tape over her nose and her mouth.
CINDY ANTHONY: We`re talking about a 3-year-old little girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The first one.
CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t know what your involvement is, sweetheart.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Then two. Then three.
GEORGE ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S FATHER: There was an overpowering smell. I`ll admit that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So that no breath was possible.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean it`s an unfortunate result of actions.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls.
I want to go to Susan Constantine, jury consultant, body language expert. As I was watching tot mom in court this morning as she kept this pose throughout the entire jury selection procedure, she never turns around to look at anybody sitting behind her in the well.
As you can see the two -- there were two or three seats behind her that are roped off. That are marked no one can sit directly behind her for several seats. People can only sit on the other side the courtroom but still in close proximity.
Everyone, I guess I was maybe 30 or 40 feet from her and I observed her very carefully for a long period of time. She always sits just like that. Never turns around and looks at the well. She very rarely turns completely to one side or the other. Almost obstructing a full-on view of her from behind.
What do you make after watching her for all of these days, along with her outright arguments with her lead defense counsel?
SUSAN CONSTANTINE, JURY CONSULTANT AND BODY LANGUAGE EXPERT: Well, Nancy, I`d like to share with you, I`ve been in the courtroom an awful lot. And I`ve sat right behind Casey Anthony. And, remember, at the very beginning her mom and her dad were there and she did turn around every now and then just to kind of make sure that they were there. But they`re not there anymore. There is no one there that she feels that is supporting her.
Now when we`re talking about Jose Baez and there`s this distance now between the two of them, and I know we remember when they were flirting along and there was a lot of question about at the very beginning. But now the proxemics, the distance between the two of them is telling me that there`s really something that`s going on.
But you know what? They need to take it outside that courtroom and take it into a private area because there is some friction that`s going on between the two of them and you can see them in their -- you can see it in their body language.
GRACE: Out to the lines, Debbie in Tennessee. Hi, Debbie. What`s your question, dear?
DEBBIE, CALLER FROM TENNESSEE: Yes, I was just wondering what went on with the defense attorney.
GRACE: You know what? That`s still a mystery. Have we gotten Jean Casarez back up yet?
OK, Jean Casarez, number one, your colleague, our colleague Michael Christian spoke with him just as he was leaving yesterday. He was fit as a fiddle. All right. He comes back in this morning. Our show meets briefly with him. He`s fit as a fiddle first thing this morning. There he says there`s not a plea deal where -- I`m fine. We`re going to start jury selection. And he looked fine.
So was he sick or was this a delay tactic, Jean Casarez?
JEAN CASAREZ, LEGAL CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": You know, the speculation either way, Nancy. He said it`s a private matter. Local people here are speculating that he was not feeling well, but you saw it as I did. He looked great this morning in the room. Very well, very able. And, obviously, right there as he does every day to zealously defend Casey.
GRACE: And Jean, what were your observations in court? Did you see another -- yet another tiff between tot mom and her defense attorney today?
CASAREZ: No. What I see is really a warming up to Cheney Mason. You know Cheney told me that he feels like she`s a granddaughter to him. And he wants to protect her. And I feel a bonding that`s taking place between the two of them. That`s what I see. And also with her female lawyers.
GRACE: Out to Howard Oliver, former deputy medical examiner, forensic pathologist. Dr. Oliver joining us out of L.A.
Dr. Oliver, there are a lot of jurors that seem to have a soft spot that seem to me to be very ambivalent toward the death penalty and I think when you are in court in that position as a juror, you are looking at a live tot mom who is sitting there looking pitiful, crying.
And there`s no Caylee in court. No Caylee. No one`s voice is echoing what Caylee went through and the moments that she died trapped in her mother`s trunk, according to the state, with duct tape on her nose and her mouth.
But when the medical examiner takes the stand, Dr. Oliver, what do you expect the testimony to be?
HOWARD OLIVER, FMR. DEPUTY MEDICAL EXAMINER, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Well, from what I`ve been able to glean, it`s going to be devastating testimony. The medical examiner is going to give objective evidence. It`s not going to be theorized or emotional. It`s going to be totally objective. And from what I can understand, it`s going to be devastating evidence.
GRACE: To Marc Klaas, president and founder of KlaasKids Foundation who endured the kidnap and murder of his little girl Polly. Was there throughout the trial of the killer.
Marc, it just seems to me that -- and I don`t know a way the state can really do it in jury selection. So this is not about them not doing anything they should or doing anything wrong. I just don`t think and our jurisprudence system there`s a way at this point in the -- in the selection for Caylee`s voice to be heard.
It`s all about tot mom. And she`s sitting there crying, and looking - - I watched her all, you know, pitiful, pale, you know, dabbing at her eyes, breaking down crying every once in a while. Only when it`s talking about the charges against her.
But nobody is hearing anything about Caylee. Nothing about what she went through. Nothing about the stench of death in that car. Nothing about the torture before her death and her body rotting out in a field.
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Well, of course all of that information will come out during the trial itself. But in reality, in my mind, the trial is about the state giving the accused the opportunity to excuse and to justify the horrible crimes that they committed against the victim in this case.
In this case it will be Caylee. If Caylee is going to have any representation, it`s not going to be the prosecutor. The prosecutor represents the state. It`s going to be her family. And they are going to have to sit there stoically just as a simple reminder that there are people that are suffering because this young girl was murdered.
But as a contradiction, obviously, and ironically, those same people are going to be there sitting for the defendant in this case, Casey. So it`s a real mixed bag. But there will be an opportunity for them to just express themselves as members of Caylee`s family.
And then, of course if there is a guilty verdict at the end, they will be given an opportunity to make a victim impact statement prior to the sentencing.
GRACE: Bottom line, to Brian Russell, forensic psychologist, her voice is really not being heard now. There`s no emphasis at all in jury selection on Caylee. Nothing whatsoever.
When will she be brought to the forefront, and how will it happen, Brian?
BRIAN RUSSELL, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Well, I think we`ll see that all throughout the trial, Nancy. I think this emptiness that we`re feeling right now for a voice for Caylee in the courtroom is due to the unique fact, as Marc Klaas mentioned, that the victim`s family and the defendant`s family in this case are one and the same.
But I think that we will actually have weeks where the focus will be on Caylee and so I think we just have to get through this stage where we actually would not want to have people who were overcome with such sympathy and empathy for the victim that they couldn`t give the defendant a fair trial because then we might end up doing this all over again.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Standing trial for her life.
CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF CAYLEE ANTHONY: I`m trying to help them, and they`re not letting me help them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do not talk about this particular case with anyone.
CASEY ANTHONY: I`m going to hang up. I just want to walk away right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you consider sexual abuse, physical abuse, verbal abuse?
CASEY ANTHONY: I would not let anything happen to my daughter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Either death or life imprisonment.
CASEY ANTHONY: Come on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Guilty.
LEE ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S BROTHER: She said, Lee, do you want to know the truth?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think my dad used to do the same thing to me, but when I was much younger.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Failed to protect her as a child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think I`d use the word diabolical to describe the way she lies.
CHIEF JUDGE BELVIN PERRY, CIRCUIT JUDGE, ORANGE COUNTY: Would you also lay aside your own personal feelings?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, sir.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back. We are live here in Orlando and in Clearwater just outside the courthouse behind me. We`ve been in jury selection all day long bringing you the latest in the trial of Casey Anthony, tot mom, in the alleged murder of her 2-year-old little girl.
Caylee`s body nearly completely skeletonized was found just 15 houses from the Anthony home in a wooded area where her mother Casey Anthony that you are observing in court right now once played as a child herself. In fact, it had been a pet cemetery when tot mom was growing up.
And coincidentally, her own little girl ended up being buried there. Her skull found with duct tape wrapped around the mouth and the nose with a heart shaped sticker placed directly over the mouth. Then Caylee triple bagged like she`s trash.
Out to Eleanor Odom, longtime prosecutor now with the National District Attorney`s Association.
Eleanor, you have tried death penalty cases. How hard is it to get a jury? You seem to do it very easily.
ELEANOR ODOM, FELONY PROSECUTOR, DEATH PENALTY QUALIFIED: Well, Nancy, it takes time because you want to make sure you`re getting a fair and impartial jury who hasn`t heard about the case. Death penalty cases tend to be higher profile. So you really want to make sure your jurors can consider all punishment options -- death, life without parole or life in prison.
So you`re really working to get that fair jury. And both the state and the defense should want that.
GRACE: And what do you make about these fights between tot mom and her lead defense attorney?
E. ODOM: Well, I think it`s great for the state because they are concentrating on each other and fighting when they should be concentrating on the defense. So the state can just walk in there with its evidence. They are working together and the jurors will see that and that will make a difference.
GRACE: One thing I`ve observed, Eleanor, is there seems to be absolutely no dissention, no split whatsoever amongst the prosecution. They all sit there together. You don`t see any back and forth. It seems like it`s all well practiced. They are ready to go. And we are headed into opening statements.
To you, Pilar Prinz. Just how important are opening statements in a case like this?
PILAR PRINZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Nancy, they are critically important. It`s the first time that both sides are going to get to really tell this jury their version of what happened. And the jury is going to be listening to every word. They`re critical.
GRACE: What about it -- what about it, Peter Odom?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, studies show that 85 percent of jury verdicts are consistent with what the jurors believe after opening statement. I think it`s the most important part of the trial because then the jurors if they believe your opening statement, if they`re compelled by it, then they will view all the evidence through the prism of the opening statement. So critical importance as Pilar says.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Back to Jean Casarez.
Jean, explain to me the order of opening statements quickly.
CASAREZ: The prosecution first and we don`t know. I asked. They won`t tell me who`s doing it. Defense second. It`s Jose Baez. And in the first few minutes he`ll explain why she didn`t report her daughter missing.
GRACE: OK. To you, Ellie Jostad. What`s the likelihood -- let`s look at statistics. Even if the state puts up a perfect case that tot mom will get the death penalty, let`s talk about women on Florida`s death row.
Liz, please pull up what we know about it.
OK. Ellie, in general, the number of men on death row versus women is staggering. Lot, lot, lot more men than women. But what are the statistics? What do we know about women on death row in Florida?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, there are only two women on Florida`s death row and it`s these two women right here. Both in their 20s. That Tiffany Ann Cole on the left, she and her accomplices abducted a couple, bound them with tape, drove them out to a remote area, forced them to give up their bank account numbers, then buried them alive in an open grave, Nancy.
Emelia Carr, on the right, she and her lover who was a married man, took his wife, tied her up in a storage trailer, smothered her to death with a plastic bag.
GRACE: OK. Just the type you want to take home to meet mom. There you see them. Tiffany Ann Cole and Emilia Carr. Possible cell mates for tot mom.
And how is it set up on death row in Florida?
Robyn Walensky, WDBO, explain to me what we know about Florida`s death row accommodations.
ROBYN WALENSKY, REPORTER, WDBO NEWSRADIO: You know, that`s really a great question, Nancy. You know, I am not 100 percent sure, but I would most likely think that she is going to be kept away from other prisoners. She is such a high-profile --
GRACE: Yes, you know what? You`re right about that.
WALENSKY: Nationally known defendant.
GRACE: You`re right about that. I don`t believe you have cell mates on death row. Is that correct, Jean Casarez?
CASAREZ: No, I think you`re right. The main thing I remember about Florida`s death row because I`ve done many death penalty cases here, there is no air conditioning.
GRACE: Ellie, what do we know about the Florida death row?
JOSTAD: Well, Jean is right. No air conditioning. No cable TV, although they are allowed a small 13-inch TV. They are allowed a radio. They are allowed to shower every other day. And they are at the Lowell Correctional Facility. That`s where Florida`s female death row is housed.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Phyllis in Florida. Hi, Phyllis.
PHYLLIS, CALLER FROM FLORIDA: Hi. How are you?
GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?
PHYLLIS: Got a question. Question is -- I got two. Did they ever find out who Caylee`s father is so that he would be involved in this whole thing? And number two, why is Casey not wearing an orange jump suit? I`m sick of those dressed-for-success looks that she keeps putting together.
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: Well, Peter Odom, the reality is that at trial, it`s been determined through interpreting the Constitution that very rarely do you see an inmate in a prison jumpsuit.
Explain, Peter.
P. ODOM: Well, the jurors are really not allowed, under our system, to see defendants in their prison clothes. And it`s quite an accepted practice. And so we take great pains as defense attorneys to make sure that our clients are dressed appropriately. There is just a certain presumption --
GRACE: What about it, Eleanor?
P. ODOM: -- that goes along with being dressed in prison clothes.
E. ODOM: Well, you know, he`s right. The defendants have the right to wear their clothes. They can choose not to. But you know what? That`s just the wolf in sheep`s clothing, Nancy.
GRACE: Yes, her look has been very carefully orchestrated by the defense. And it is a far cry from the way she dressed before she went in to jail, before she began making regular appearances in court. This is a completely different look.
One thing that I need to be reminded of, Jean Casarez, thinking about appearances, how is it that tot mom convinced even her own family? Didn`t she convince them she had a job? She convinced Tony Lazzaro, her boyfriend, and all of his roommates that she was working for Universal? All she did was sit on the sofa and tap on a computer.
CASAREZ: Yes, yes. Lying is going to be a big part of this case. No question about it. And the credibility is secondly important in this case.
GRACE: But how did she do it, Jean? How did she convince them all she had a job?
CASAREZ: I think by going away from home. Leaving in the morning. Coming back later. Staying with boyfriends. Away so much. The family thought she had a job. And taking money from the family, that was her pay.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Another hearing in the Casey Anthony case in this saga.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do remember that there was tape on the baby`s mouth and nose.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The duct tape was placed there to, in fact, stop breathing.
CASEY ANTHONY: I wish that, like I said, that none of this would have happened.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It would be very difficult for me to sentence death. But I know it`s something I would have to consider.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Everyone, just in, we are confirming the judge is not going to have that juror arrested. We reported it earlier. Now we confirm it. That juror will not be arrested. Safe again. OK. Don`t know if he`ll end up on the jury or not.
Back to Steve Helling, with "People" magazine.
So bottom line, Steve, we`re this close to a jury. Can I expect opening statements, say, in the next two business days?
STEVE HELLING, STAFF WRITER, PEOPLE MAGAZINE: Well, we`re hoping that they`ll happen on Monday. And that`s what the target is right now. Obviously anything could happen, anything could change, but really Judge Perry is holding everybody`s feet to the fire to make sure that that will happen.
It`s gone on for a very long time. And now it`s time to go to trial.
GRACE: Marc Klaas, do you recall the opening statements? Do you recall the trial of the man that murdered your little girl?
KLAAS: I recall it vividly. Absolutely. And the opening statements were riveting. I was astounded by the detail that was presented by the prosecution in the case, and they gave me forewarning that there would be information that I would not want to listen to. And the only time I ever left during the course of the trial was when some of that information was subsequently presented.
The defense, on the other hand, had a very loose -- a very loose kind of an opening statement.
GRACE: Yes, because they want to wait and see what the state`s facts are so they can tailor their defense to those facts. They don`t want to commit an opening.
Let`s stop and remember Army Master Sergeant Robert West, 37, (INAUDIBLE), Ohio, killed Iraq. Awarded Purple Heart, Bronze Star. Loved golf, family, friends. A great leader who would make other laugh. Leaves behind mother Mary, sister Lisa, widow Jeanine, daughter, Shelby.
Robert West, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us.
And a special happy birthday to Illinois friend, Audrey. Retired elementary school teacher. Loves delivering meals to seniors. Play piano. She loves her two cats. Grandmother of three, mother of four including our superstar, "In Session" producer, Michael Christian.
Happy birthday, Audrey.
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night live from Florida. And until then, good night, friend.
END
