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Nancy Grace

Casey Anthony Jury Seated

Aired May 20, 2011 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the case of 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee. Six months of searching culminate when skeletal remains found in a heavily wooded area just 15 houses from the Anthony home confirmed to be Caylee. A utility meter reader stumbles on a tiny human skeleton, including a skull covered in light-colored hair, the killer duct- taping, placing a heart-shaped sticker directly over the mouth, then triple-bagging little Caylee like she`s trash. The murder trial of tot mom, Casey Anthony, under way.

Bombshell tonight. Chaos in the courtroom. A screaming spectator attacks tot mom in court, shrieking, quote, "She killed somebody." Sheriffs spring into action, and the judge steps in. This as more jurors arrested. And the trial heads to Orlando now that the jury is sworn in.

The defense tries to force the state to hand over secret files. The judge says no. Even though we confirm tot mom under 24/7 suicide surveillance at the jail, tot mom laughs her way through jury selection today. Didn`t anybody tell her she`s in the middle of a murder trial, her murder trial!

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have any opinions concerning the death penalty?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would have to say I have no opinion whatsoever because I think you`re talking about someone`s life and...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Keep her outside of the courtroom for a minute.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) excuse this witness now based on her presence during that outrageous outburst.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`ll take a brief recess.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m mentally challenged! I`m being (INAUDIBLE) Don`t punish me!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I will find that you are in contempt of court, sentence you to two days in the Pinellas County jail.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ma`am, I`m going to excuse you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. A screaming spectator attacks tot mom in court, shrieking quote, "She killed somebody."

Straight out to Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session." What happened?

JEAN CASAREZ, "IN SESSION": Nancy, this woman was sitting exactly where you and I were sitting yesterday, and all of a sudden, she stands up and she screams, "She killed somebody anyway!" And it was right when the juror was being questioned on the death penalty. The deputies came to her. She was escorted out of the courtroom. And Nancy, she had a pair of shoes tied together in her hands.

GRACE: OK. So my question is, how did she get in to start with, Jean? Who is this lady? And what`s her axe to grind against tot mom?

Everyone, for those of you just joining us -- number one, a screaming spectator attacks tot mom in the courtroom in the middle of jury selection. But that doesn`t stop the judge. We have a jury. A jury is sworn in, and we are headed to the Orlando Orange County courthouse for the very first witness in the case against tot mom, Casey Anthony, in the alleged murder of her 2-year-old little girl, Caylee.

So who is this woman, and how did she get into the courtroom? And what`s her beef with tot mom?

CASAREZ: Her name is Elizabeth Rogers. And there is security to go into the courthouse, not the courtroom. But Nancy, all the security in the world wouldn`t stop her from yelling out the way she did today.

GRACE: And how close did she get to tot mom?

CASAREZ: She didn`t get any farther than standing up where you and I were. We were on the side of the prosecution, a few rows back. She didn`t get any farther because the deputies absolutely ran for her when she yelled out those words.

GRACE: So the sheriffs spring into action. The judge even steps in. Let`s take a listen what we have so far of what happened in court.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would have to say I have no opinion whatsoever because I think you`re talking about someone`s life and...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She killed somebody anyway!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just a second. Keep her outside of the courtroom for a minute. Ma`am, would you step out of the room? You shouted out...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: So Jean, what is she doing in court holding her shoes? And I`m relieved to see now she`s in prison blues heading to the jailhouse herself for her attack on tot mom in court! So she`s sitting in court. Didn`t anybody notice she took her shoes off?

CASAREZ: I guess not. I guess -- she said she was here because her boyfriend`s in jail and she decided she just wanted to come to court to see what it was all about, to see what was going on. She said, Look, I`m bipolar. I`m sick. I`m mentally ill. And because of that, she...

GRACE: Hold on.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Look at this, Jean. Look at all these mugshots. Take a look at these mugshots. And speaking of arrests, to Robyn Walensky, WDBO, also joining us at the courthouse.

Everybody, we are live here outside of the courthouse. We are stationed outside not only the Orlando courthouse but the Clearwater courthouse, as well, where this attack by a spectator on tot mom has just gone down in the courtroom.

Speaking of arrests, Robyn Walensky, you know, I hate to start a question like that, but there was a woman in the jury panel today that had bad check charges.

There`s all the arrests of this spectator who attacks tot mom in court today.

But that`s especially sensitive in this case since tot mom got charges of bad check, writing fake checks, fraudulent checks. After little Caylee goes missing, she grabs -- allegedly grabs her friend`s checks and writes all kind of checks.

Liz, pull up the video of tot mom buying the push-up bras and the booze at Target, I think it was, on somebody else`s checks. So that kind of hits home in this case, Robyn.

ROBYN WALENSKY, WDBO: Yes, Nancy, you know, these two have something in common with the bad checks. But let me tell you something. This spectator, this nut, she has a record longer than the Lincoln Tunnel in New York -- DUI, all sorts of arrests for the bad checks, all sorts of stuff, a criminal background. It reads -- her rap sheet is unbelievable!

GRACE: And we`re showing you video right now of tot mom using somebody else`s checks to buy lingerie, food, cases of beer for a big party and dinner she`s throwing at her live-in`s house. And this is in the hours, the days, the weeks right after little Caylee goes missing.

OK, Ellie Jostad, we`ve got a jury. A jury is sworn in. Tell me who`s on the jury, Ell?

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, we have got, you`re right, 12 jurors, 5 alternates. I think we`re pretty lucky to get to that number. We`ve got a white female 48, surgical technician. You`ve got another white male alternate. He`s in his 50s. He`s got an adult son and grandchildren...

GRACE: Hold on! Hold on, Ellie! Hold on just a moment! Play that back for me, Liz. What is that I`m seeing, Jean Casarez, tot mom laughing her way through jury selection today?

CASAREZ: You know, she was in a better mood today. There was a light-heartedness with her. Really, she is bonding with her female attorneys today. Definitely. But a far different demeanor than when jury selection started.

GRACE: Whoa! A light -- did you say a light-hearted mood? She`s in the middle of a jury trial. It`s her jury trial for the murder of her 2- year-old little girl, and she`s in a light-hearted mood, laughing and joking in court today? Why?

CASAREZ: I can`t tell you why. I can just tell you from looking in that demeanor is different. But she`s bonding. She`s talking with her female attorneys like she never has before.

GRACE: You know, that brings me to another question. And we`re about to start taking your calls, everybody. We are live here at the Orlando courthouse and also here at the Clearwater courthouse.

Jean, when this spectator attacks to mom in court, what did tot mom do? Did she turn around, or did she just keep writing notes and keep her nose down?

CASAREZ: No, she was definitely startled. I think she was scared. But she just started to talk, and she spoke to either attorney on either side, just sort of like excited utterances out of her mouth. I didn`t see her look around, but I saw her very concerned.

GRACE: So generally speaking, no matter what`s going to go on behind her, she keeps her head down and facing forward, is that correct?

CASAREZ: I`ve never seen her look in the gallery, truly.

GRACE: Out to the lines. Suzanne in Nebraska. Hi, Suzanne.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. Actually, I`m in Las Vegas, Nevada.

GRACE: Hi, dear.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello.

GRACE: Oh, Nevada.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. My question is, do you think Casey will be taking the stand?

GRACE: OK, you know what? That`s a great question. I would put money on it absolutely not, but we are hearing from within the defense camp that she is taking the stand.

Unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight a special guest, you know her well, renowned attorney Linda Kenney Baden...

LINDA KENNEY BADEN, FMR. ATTORNEY FOR CASEY ANTHONY: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: ... former attorney for tot mom Casey Anthony. But she became a famous lawyer long before she signed on to tot mom`s defense team -- former member of the defense team. She chose to come off the defense team. Also with us, Mark Nejame, former lawyer for George and Cindy Anthony, a renowned defense attorney throughout the Florida area.

OK, Linda Kenney Baden, any chance? I say this is like a snowball`s chance in hell that she`s going to take the stand. She would be destroyed on cross. But we`re hearing rumblings out of the defense camp that she is taking the stand.

BADEN: Well, you know, Nancy, before I answer that, I just want to say thank you for having me on your show. It`s my first time. And you and I have been friends for a long time, and I know we respect each other tremendously, even though we do different things. And it`s wonderful seeing you.

GRACE: I do. I do.

BADEN: And congratulations. But you know, taking the stand is something that a defense attorney decides not at the beginning of the trial but during the trial. You never make that decision if you`re a good defense attorney until and unless you have to make that decision. It may be different in a death penalty case for a penalty stage. There generally, you try to put your client on the stand if you want to save their lives. But not a decision that`s going to be made right now.

GRACE: So yes, no, Linda. Do you think she`s going to take the stand?

BADEN: I can`t tell you until we get to that point in the trial where that decision`s made. I wouldn`t make it, and I hope no one else has.

GRACE: OK, Mark, do you believe she`ll take the stand? Yes, no.

MARK NEJAME, FMR. ATTORNEY FOR CINDY AND GEORGE ANTHONY: Yes, she`s going to take the stand.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You shouted out the following. "She killed somebody anyway." Can you give me any reason why you should not be held in contempt of court?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I came here to see -- I`m mentally challenged! I never been in a courtroom like this! I had no idea I was going to say that. I just wanted to see for myself. I have a 3-year-old son, and I wanted to see why. I never meant anything! It`s not like me to say that! I`m very sorry. I`m so sorry! I just had to come to court because my fiance is in jail for domestic. Otherwise, I would have never came. And I apologize to everybody. I will never do it again!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Yes, you`re not going to do it again, lady, because you`re going to jail. You wanted to see why? What, what, if you could throw a wrench in the jury selection in a case that the state and others have been waiting nearly three years to present to a jury panel?

Well, a spectator -- for those of you just joining us -- attacks tot mom in the courtroom. The deputies spring into action. The judge steps in and sends the spectator to jail. That`s right, to jail!

I don`t understand it. Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Dealbreakers," what do you mean, I just wanted to see why? Why? Why what? Why I`m going to throw a wrench in the works and nearly lose a juror?

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: ... jury panel?

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: I think she`s minimizing that she`s a bit of a stalker. And forget the fact that she said she has bipolar, ADHD, she`s going to a methadone clinic. All those things don`t matter. What matters is she has probably been following this case, is obsessed with it, went straight to that courtroom to cause trouble.

And we can see with this woman that she has a long history of very bad behavior, of run-ins with the law. She`s aggressive. She`s agitated. She`s paranoid. And she wanted to insert herself into the notoriety of this case. It`s not because her fiance was there, it`s because she wanted to put herself into the thick of it.

GRACE: And she did. But now, after nearly three years, tot mom Casey Anthony will stand trial for the murder of her 2-year-old little daughter, Caylee. We all remember when this case first started and little Caylee went missing. The search ensued. Months later, little Caylee`s skeletonized body is found just 15 houses from the Anthony home, duct tape wrapped across her nose and mouth.

We are taking your calls. To Suzanne in Connecticut. Hi, Suzanne.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. It`s wonderful to talk to you.

GRACE: Likewise.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is -- Jose Baez has said within the first minute or two of opening argument, he`s going explain the reason that Casey didn`t tell about the -- why she reported her missing. If that`s so key to her defense, why didn`t they tell the police that so that...

GRACE: You know, Suzanne in Connecticut. You are so right on.

Let`s go out to Jean Casarez, standing by at the courthouse. Jean, Baez`s, the lead defense attorney`s, quote was, "We will explain three years of questions about tot mom`s bizarre behavior following the disappearance of her daughter -- we`ll explain three years of questions in three minutes." He`s got a lot of explaining to do, Jean Casarez.

CASAREZ: And he`s got to explain the whys, exactly as the caller said. And also, remember, the opening statement is what the evidence will show. If Casey`s going to take the stand, I`ve heard promises in opening statements of that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY, CAYLEE`S MOTHER: Just a random question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shoot.

CINDY ANTHONY: Are there cameras in all of the rooms?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) no friggin` clue.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She killed somebody anyway!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In the center of this media frenzy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m mentally challenged! I never been in a courtroom like this.

CASEY ANTHONY: I`m not in control over any of this because I don`t know what the hell`s going on!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls. We are live here in Orlando, and here in Clearwater, Florida. There is a jury, and it was in the nick of time, nearly a whole panel nearly thrown out after a spectator in court attacks tot mom.

Back to Linda Kenney Baden, former attorney for Casey Anthony, the renowned defense attorney. Linda, a question.

BADEN: Flattery will get you everywhere, Nancy.

(LAUGHTER)

GRACE: I feel the same way, Linda! Linda, you once told "48 Hours" that tot mom`s own actions are her worst enemy. And I could not agree with you more because a large bulk of the state`s case is circumstantial evidence about her behavior in the weeks, the days, even the hours after Caylee goes missing. Take a listen to what Linda had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So she lied...

BADEN: She lied.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... when she said the nanny kidnapped the baby.

BADEN: Sure. I think everyone knows that that was a lie. Her actions have been her own worst enemy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: What did you mean by that, Linda?

BADEN: Well, you know, Nancy, before I got into the case, I was a member of the public, and I felt that that was a lie. And what I was concerned with is why. And hopefully, that`s what we`re going to find out at trial. But the public now has three years of the partying pictures and all this kind of stuff, and that really has made it very difficult for anyone really to come forward and say, Oh, listen to me. It`s going to be a very, very hard case for Jose Baez and the defense team, even though they`re not supposed to have to prove anything. They`re supposed to be able to sit back. But times, they are changed.

GRACE: Well, you know what? And under the law, the defense does not have a burden to prove anything. There`s no affirmative defense going on here. But you`re right, practically speaking, she`s got to explain somehow her behavior. I mean, take a look at this, Linda. These photos are coming in. This is after her daughter goes missing. Linda...

BADEN: Yes, ma`am?

GRACE: The photos. Is this what you`re talking about she`s got to explain?

BADEN: Yes. These are the photos that I think are going to have to be explained. And I don`t mean explained away, I mean explained because the public wants to hear it, and I`m sure members of the jury that are acquainted with the case, even though they said they could decide it on the evidence, you can`t get rid of those opinions you have, no matter how hard you try.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a court proceeding.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She shouted out "she killed somebody anyway!"

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is outrageous.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I came to see.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For your own good, please stop.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) (expletive deleted)!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seemed very upset today.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you completely block out of your mind that you`ve ever seen Judge Perry?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seeing what has happened to the neighborhood because of this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Casey, do you ever plan to say anything?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have her (INAUDIBLE) the witching hour.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on, back up!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My head is going to explode.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Back to the lead defense attorney`s claim that he`s going to explain three years of tot mom`s bizarre behavior following little Caylee`s disappearance in three minutes of his opening statement.

A jury has been sworn in, in the last hours, and now that jury is headed to Orlando for opening statements. They will start next week. But this amidst chaos in the courtroom as a spectator attacks tot mom in open court. Deputies spring into action. The judge steps in. And that spectator now behind bars. I`m going to go to Mark Klaas, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation.

Once again, all the focus on tot mom in court today. Nothing about Caylee. The only time they come close to even mentioning her is when formal charges are read. That`s it. No more mention about who is raising children, do you have children, have you raised children. Nothing. Nothing at all. No questioning about children. Nothing. It`s as if Caylee doesn`t even exist.

MARK KLAAS, PRES. & FOUNDER, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: No, you`re absolutely right. And I`ll tell you what, this remind me of another situation in Florida a few years ago with Terry Schiavo, where there`s this horrible tragedy in the middle of all of this clowning around, this bad behavior by absolutely everybody, and a whole circus atmosphere ensues.

And I would hope that the judge and the other officers of the court will be able to get enough of a handle on this situation so that it can come back to the basics. Not about this bad behavior that`s going on now, but about the fact that there was a precious little girl who was murdered and stuffed in a bag and wrapped up in duct tape. It`s just unbelievable.

GRACE: Out to the lines. I believe I have got Janice in Utah -- Jamie (ph), Jamie in Utah. Hi, Jamie. What`s your question, dear?

CALLER: Hi, Nancy. Thank you for taking my call. I love your show. I watch you every night. And I just wanted to know how you felt about Jose Baez calling the Nancy Grace entertainment show and how today he compared your show to watching wrestling. To me I take great offense to that because I think what you do.

GRACE: Oh, you know.

CALLER: I think what you do to find all of these missing children is incredible.

GRACE: Well, you know what, Jamie? I think Mr. Baez is thinking about me a whole lot more than I`m thinking about him.

CALLER: It sure sounds like it.

GRACE: But that aside, he needs be focused on his client and what`s going on in the courtroom instead of mocking and throwing stones at every program that has ever critiqued or criticized or analyzed his trial strategy or his client in the courtroom. That will probably benefit him a lot more.

But what do I think about it? Nothing. I take it with a box of salt, Jamie. And what I keep thinking about in that courtroom is not what Baez is saying about me or our program, but about Caylee. And I`m thinking about the weeds and the grass growing up between her skeleton.

I`m thinking about that duct tape wrapped across her mouth and her nose. I`m thinking about the stench in the back of tot mom`s car. I`m thinking about while that stench was being created in her car, her going into one of the movie rentals and renting movies and out buying cases of beer and having a good time with her live-in boyfriend. That`s what I`m thinking about.

So Baez can say whatever he wants to about me or this program, but what I`m interested in is what is he going to say come opening statements to explain away tot mom`s behavior. That`s what I`m thinking about.

So, Natisha Lance, when did he make this promise that he would explain three years of tot mom`s behavior in three minutes of opening statement?

NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: This is just a few weeks ago, Nancy, and before that they said that it would be explained within one minute in their opening statements and then it went on to three minute within their opening statements.

But one other thing that has come up into court is that the defense wants to know the witnesses that the state is going to call so that they have time to prep, the defense says that there`s 300 witnesses, they have so many files that they want to know who are they going to be calling so that they can be properly prepared for it.

Now the judge said that he denied that. He can`t force the state to tell them which witnesses are going to call at which time and he says that they need to work it out between the two of them. So hopefully they will.

GRACE: Well, that`s ridiculous. To Linda Kenney Baden and Mark NeJame.

Mark, you can`t force the other side, either side to give you the order of the witnesses. That is trial strategy. Neither side has to give the other. The state has already forked over a witness list complete with addresses, of phone numbers, sometimes even summaries of what the witness is going to say. They`ve handed over nearly all of their files to the defense. Come on now, they want to know the order of the witnesses? Hello? They`ve had three years to get ready for this Mark NeJame.

MARK NEJAME, FORMER ATTORNEY FOR GEORGE & CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, that`s exactly what I was going to say. It`s a ridiculous request. I don`t know why they make requests that are patently going to be denied and they are patently wrong. You continue to lose credibility by doing that. If you have a meritorious position, make your point, where you`re going to occasionally maybe win something because you`re being listened to.

But when you do this shotgun approach, you`re going to lose these things. And you lose your credibility. It`s ridiculous.

GRACE: Mark, you`re the former attorney for George and Cindy Anthony, who, outside of Caylee herself, I think, have suffered the most in all of this. A lot of people have thrown mud, slung mud at them because they are -- have been trying to defend their daughter. I really believe in my layman`s understanding that they don`t want to face the facts that their daughter may have committed murder and I understand that. What parent would?

Do you believe that they will come and sit in the courtroom from beginning to end, soup to nuts, once opening statements start next week?

NEJAME: I really don`t want to speculate about that. I think that the bigger issue is, is why Casey didn`t want them in the courtroom. And I think that all leads to the issue, very simply, that she`s going to take the stand and she`s going to villain-ize them in order to create a defense.

GRACE: I`ve got to tell you something. What George Anthony has exhibited so far, I mean, the man nearly committed suicide over the death of his grandchild. Some woman jumps up and said that they had an affair. Not true. That was put in all the tabloids. Cindy Anthony has been villain-ized. I mean, it goes on and on and on.

I don`t necessarily agree with some of their actions, but why sling mud at them, Linda? I mean, do you think tot ma`am may actually try to say George Anthony molested her? I wouldn`t come to court either if I were him.

LINDA KENNEY BADEN, FORMER ATTORNEY FOR CASEY ANTHONY: Yes, you know, I can`t get into it one way or another, Nancy. All I`ve got to say is that I`m interested in Ann Finnell`s questions to the jurors about emotional and sexual abuse. But that doesn`t mean -- that could also be a red herring. You simply don`t know. We`re going to have to wait and see.

GRACE: But, Linda, Linda, why would you throw a red herring like that, that stink bomb in the middle of the courtroom if you weren`t going to use it?

BADEN: You know, sometimes you`re eliciting questions from the jurors because you know the letters are out there, you may want to see what they respond to. There are a lot of reasons. I just can`t comment on that, Nancy. I`m waiting, like you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Totally a positive opinion, I feel like she`s guilty.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you lay aside that opinion?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It would be difficult.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. What degree of difficulty?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe I could do it without killing myself.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. All right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hearing the opinions of everyone that has been sitting around jibber-jabbering, it was in the jury room. There was a lot of speculation.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lot of opinions in the favor of her being guilty. None of the opinions that I`ve heard from other people have been positive.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They were all negative.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s OK to smile. Nobody ever died from being questioned.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: We are taking your calls. Straight out to Robert Hirschhorn, jury consultant, joining us out of Dallas, high-profile jury consultant on a lot of high-profile cases.

Robert, what do you make of tot mom`s behavior in court?

ROBERT HIRSCHHORN, JURY CONSULTANT: She`s facing the death penalty. What she has got to do is some way try to humanize herself, because the reality is, Nancy, shows on TV, including you, my dear friend, who I`ve known for a long time, has villain-ized her.

The idea is that if she`s going to have any shot with this jury either on the guilty or not guilty phase or the punishment phase, she has got to appear to be human to them. And I`ll tell you one thing, Nancy, I`m predicting she will not testify at the first phase of the trial, because if she testifies and the jury finds her guilty, she has got nothing left for punishment because they`ve already chosen not to believe her.

I believe that this is -- because it`s a circumstantial evidence case, the lawyers are going to pick it apart. If she does testify it will come at the second phase, if there is one, because everybody out there, she is still presumed to be not guilty. We want to make sure she gets a fair trial, not a rigged trial.

If she`s convicted, then I think she`ll testify.

GRACE: To Mark NeJame, you said, as we went to break, that you firmly believe she will take the stand. At what phase and why would she take the stand and undergo cross-exam?

NEJAME: I think it`s her best defense. The reality of it is there`s no other way to explain her actions other than from her own mouth. The reality of it is those 31 days are damning. The prosecution is going to bring out the lies, they`re going to bring out her history if she doesn`t take the stand.

They are going to bring it out regardless. But as soon as she says, yes, I lied, and then gives her reason each and every time, that is going to in some ways gut and neutralize the prosecution`s otherwise very effective cross-examination. I think it`s their best defense. I think it`s the direction they are going. And I think if you follow the breadcrumbs and you read the tea leaves, that`s what the defense has been laying out throughout.

So we`ve been saying that for a while, and it appears all the more that`s coming...

GRACE: You know what, I believe you`re right.

NEJAME: . that way.

GRACE: I believe that you may be right. I mean, usually everyone advises against a defendant taking the stand. It usually ends disastrously. To, Leonard Padilla, the bounty hunter who first bailed tot mom out of jail, who has really been around her quite a bit, between him and his team, what do you think? Do you think she could undergo and withstand a cross-examination?

LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER: Nancy, I hate to agree with Mark. But he has got it. It`s a situation where, let me tell you, she can hold her own against the best. There`s no doubt in my mind if she`s going to take the stand and she is going to have some explanations that are going to leave the prosecution spinning.

And when Mark said that that`s the only shot she has got, he`s absolutely correct. And he has been around the game long enough to know that if she takes the stand, she can explain some of those things and people are going to be left with that thing called reasonable doubt.

And one thing I disagree with, Nancy, I don`t know that Linda hasn`t given the defense an appeal somewhere down the road that they might need by a defendant`s attorney making statements like she`s making.

GRACE: Well, remember, a lot of these statements were before she was on the team. So that`s a whole `nother animal, Leonard Padilla. To.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: You know what, I`ll let Linda speak for herself. Go ahead, Linda.

BADEN: Mr. Padilla, I said my client was innocent, OK? And I said that she`s going have a hard time picking a jury, and the judge was ridiculous to think about a week of picking a jury selection because of the media, and all that has come out.

So believe me or not, you know, I have been around the block a bit.

GRACE: I want to go to Patty Wood, body language expert joining us out of Atlanta.

Patty, I want to get your opinion on tot mom in court. This is -- if she doesn`t take the stand, this is the only communication the jury is going to have with her is looking at her.

PATTY WOOD, BODY LANGUAGE EXPERT: Right. And there was significant interesting set of occurrences today in the courtroom. When she was verbally attacked by the spectator, I want you to notice when you look at that tape, she is not fearful. She`s not scared.

Her hands remain in front of her. She doesn`t go into the normal fearful startle response. She continues to tap her pen. Then very slowly she looks towards the spectator. She`s a cool customer underneath that circumstance.

GRACE: She really is and she certainly took the police on a wild goose chase for days and days when they were investigating the disappearance of Caylee.

To Dr. Bill Manion, medical examiner, Burlington County. Dr. Manion, thank you for being with us. The jury is going to hear extremely gruesome details about the discovery of Caylee`s body. What do you expect them to hear? And in your profession, you have to explain this to lay people, civilians all the time. What will their reaction be?

DR. BILL MANION, MEDICAL EXAMINER, BURLINGTON COUNTY, N.J.: Well, if the photographs of the skull and the bones come in, I`m sure the defense is going to protest that as being inflammatory. There`s no question that these are the bones of this young girl, nobody is disputing that. And if I were the prosecution, I may try to present that in as calm a manner as possible.

But very objective, very matter of ,fact and not try to make it sensationalized with color photographs or gruesome photographs. I don`t think there`s any question. Nobody is fighting the fact that these are the bones of the little girl. And the expert, Dr. G., I guess, the expert for the prosecution, will just have to be cool and calm and matter of fact.

GRACE: Everyone, we`re taking your calls live. We`re live here in Orlando and in Clearwater bringing you the latest in the trial of tot mom Casey Anthony in the murder of her 2-year-old little girl Caylee.

And now "CNN Heroes."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BECKY FAWCETT, "COMMUNITY CRUSADER": I don`t care how you become a mother, it`s a miracle. One of them making the other one laugh is just the greatest noise ever. I waited for a long time for that kind of noise. Jake and Brooke (ph) are both adopted. To adopt our two children it was over $100,000 in after-tax money paid in full, paid up front.

An adoption in this country can cost between $30,000 and $50,000 depending on the situation. There are plenty of loving homes out there. And the only obstacle is this cost of adoption.

My name is Becky Fawcett, and I started an organization that helps people complete the cost of their adoption by awarding financial grants.

I mean, it`s always the same. As a little girl I dreamed of being a mother. Our applicants are hard-working, educated Americans.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) is the light of my life, she`s everything to me. The expenses were insurmountable and scary. The money that I received from helpusadopt.org took a lot of weight off of my shoulders.

FAWCETT: We`ve helped to build 43 families since 2007. We`re helping people bring their children home. We`re helping all types of families. We believe in family, period. We believe in loving a child, period. Where`s Brooke-y? My journey to adoption, it`s the best thing that ever happened to me.

You my muffin?

Those seeking adoption, there is a happy moment at the end of your story. It takes us all a long time to get there, but it`s worth the wait.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: The murder trial of tot mom Casey Anthony under way, finally. Reality hits. The consequences of murder. And the brutal death of 2-year- old Caylee Marie Anthony.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This court will be in recess at 8:30 tomorrow morning.

Time is sort of the essence.

This court will be in recess 8:30 tomorrow morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why is she crying already?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Abrupt halt.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Any comment at all, Cheney (ph), on what caused the delay?

GRACE: Thousands of dollars roll into other people`s pockets. Using baby Caylee`s name and photo.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s some individuals out there that are selling T-shirts, cups, even underwear that have pictures of Casey and Caylee. For instance, one of them, there`s a shirt that shows Casey that says "Casey meet Sparky." There`s a picture of the electric chair.

GRACE: Not a good look between a death penalty defendant and the lead defense attorney. Here you see, she went on to throw her hand up at Baez, like, what? And walked out of the courtroom.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s typical of Casey. If you disagree with her on an issue, no matter how minor or major it is, she`s going to be just turned off at you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you look at her demeanor, it goes from robotic to mad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What opinions, if any, have you formed?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come on.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She just runs her life 10, 15 minutes at a time. Never longer than that. And that`s just how Casey is.

GRACE: Lady Justice is marching forward. Let the evidence begin.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: Let`s stop and remember Army Staff Sergeant Rickey Scott, 30, Columbus, Georgia, killed, Iraq. Awarded Bronze Star, Purple Heart, Army Commendation, Army Achievement. Loved basketball, football. Favorite team, Georgia Bulldogs. Would give you the shirt off his back. Leaves behind parents Cynthia (ph) and Rickey (ph). Step parents Lin (ph) and Dolly (ph). Sister, (INAUDIBLE). Widow, Nikki (ph). Two daughters, one son. Rickey Scott, American hero.

Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. And tonight happy birthday to California friend Barbara, mother of one of our superstars, "In Session" correspondent Jean Casarez. Now isn`t Barbara beautiful? Now we see where Jean gets her good looks and brains. Happy birthday, Barbara.

Everyone, I`ll see you live here in Orlando on Monday night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END