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CNN Sunday Morning

Power Transfer in Yemen; Israel Faces Down Pro-Palestinian Protests; No Welfare for Drug Users

Aired June 05, 2011 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

T.J. HOLMES, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everybody. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, Georgia, this is your CNN SUNDAY MORNING. I'm T.J. Holmes here.

Eight a.m. here in Atlanta, 3:00 p.m. in Syria and Israel -- and that is where we do have some breaking news this morning where pro- Palestinian demonstrators are trying to cross the border into Israel. They're trying this at several points, including at Golan Heights.

Not only is the Israeli army waiting for them, they're firing warning shots in the air. Firing warning shots on the ground. There are reports of people being killed.

We will take you there live, straight ahead.

Also, if you're receiving welfare benefits in Florida -- well, you could be drug-tested for illegal drugs. Yes. We'll be talking about a new law and we'll be talking about it with a man who signed it into law. The governor of Florida, Rick Scott, here with me live in just a couple of minutes.

But let's start with this tense situation that is developing right now in the Golan Heights along Israel's border with Syria. Also, the border at the West Bank. Take a look.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

Now, Israeli troops have fired, at points, tear gas and warning shots at these pro-Palestinian protesters that are threatening to breach Israel's borders. Syrian television says four protesters were killed, 13 others wounded -- CNN not able to independently confirm that at this point. Also, we're not getting any confirmation of that just yet from Israeli forces.

We do have a crew on the scene in the West Bank for now. We've been watching this scene for the past several hours as this has developed. And you see in some of these pictures what appears to be some people who have been injured -- but they're doing all this to mark what is the anniversary of the Arab defeat in the 1967 Mideast war.

That is when Israel's borders changed. That's when Israel seized the Golan Heights. That's at the border in Syria. Also, Gaza from Egypt, also seized the West Bank from Jordan. So, they are commemorating this event. Now this is not the first or last time lately we have seen this. It was just about a month ago, similar protests took place. People were doing that, trying to cross the border, the same type of scene. A number of people were killed then. That was to commemorate the anniversary of Israel being founded back in the 1940s.

So, a similar scene playing out right now. Right now, Israel forces are trying to keep those people back, but we do have a crew at the West Bank. We will get to them live in just a moment.

Also, turn to Yemen, where huge crowds of people are there dancing, cheering and chanting in the streets. Look at this.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

HOLMES: What they' are chanting here is "Ali Saleh has escaped." That is President Saleh. He is no longer in charge and he is no longer in the country.

A transfer of power went from President Saleh to his vice president. Saleh is hospitalized in neighboring Saudi Arabia after a rocket attack on his presidential palace.

CNN's Mohammed Jamjoom live for us in nearby Abu Dhabi.

Mohammed, everybody is wondering -- this is what the people wanted. They seem to have gotten what they wanted. He gave up power. But is this permanent?

MOHAMMED JAMJOOM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's the big question right now, T.J. And even though there's tens of thousands of people celebrating throughout different cities of Yemen, including Sanaa, and they're very happy that President Saleh has left, I'm hearing from more and more outspoken members of the youth revolution movement there that are saying, you know what, it's still too early to celebrate. Right now, we still don't know what's going to happen with the transfer of power. Yes, the vice president is technically in charge. But we have to remember that in Yemen, President Ali Abdullah Saleh's son basically runs the republican guard there and his nephew runs the central security forces. That's the anti-terrorism forces.

So, still a lot of power held within the hands of the direct family members of President Ali Abdullah Saleh. They're not sure how exactly this is going to shake out and if President Saleh will remain outside of the country.

Now, one very interesting developments to report -- we've heard from two Yemeni government officials in the past 10 minutes who have told us that now, al Qaeda is one of the primary suspects in the attack on the presidential palace on Friday that injured President Saleh. So, how that's going to play out? We're not sure either. But it's certainly increasing worries that al Qaeda will be trying to take more advantage of the political strife and turmoil and chaos throughout that country -- T.J.

HOLMES: Mohammed, one more thing here, quickly, what do we know about the condition of President Saleh at this time? "Reuters" is reporting that, in fact, he is in surgery there in Saudi Arabia. But how much do we know about the extent of his injuries?

JAMJOOM: Well, we're still trying to find out exactly the extent of President Saleh's injuries. The Yemeni officials maintain that he's OK, that he's just getting a checkup, and that he's going to be back in Yemen soon.

But we've heard from other officials who've said that he's in surgery. And there's a lot of speculation in Yemen that the injuries sustained by President Saleh are far more dire than initially reported by the Yemeni media. The fact that nobody's seen him on camera, there had been no pictures of him released since this attack really adding to the speculation. And many wondering how tenuous not just his grip on power but how fragile his health is at this moment -- T.J.

HOLMES: Mohammed Jamjoom, we appreciate you as always. Thanks so much.

To our viewers, I want to get back to what we are watching along the borders of Israel this morning. It's been a breaking situation for the past several hours where a number of people, pro-Palestinian demonstrators, are trying to cross the border on this day into Israel.

This is happening in a number of places. This is happening at the Golan Heights at the Syrian border. Also happening at the West Bank.

Our chief Jerusalem bureau chief, Kevin Flower, is in the West Bank right now. You have been watching this scene as we have play out for the past several hours. What is happening right now?

KEVIN FLOWER, CNN CHIEF JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: Well, what's going on here at checkpoint is there have been basically pro- Palestinian protesters that have been trying to make their way from this West Bank area to the checkpoint, which is called (INAUDIBLE) checkpoint. They've been coming in groups of several hundreds.

And what happens basically is they are being pushed back by Israeli security personnel, firing teargas, stun grenades and rubber bullets. And just a short while ago, we saw quite a scene where a handful of activists basically standing in front of a water cannon truck, an Israel cannon truck, trying to stop it -- three of them standing in front of it. They are being sprayed with a very foul smelling sort of crowd control repellant agent. And it was quite a dramatic picture.

But these sorts of things are playing out in places around the West Bank and obviously on the Golan-Syrian border where several dozen pro-Palestinian protesters approached the border fence with the Israeli-controlled Golan Heights. And what Syrian TV is reporting at this point is that four people have been killed during those -- you know, during that altercation, during those clashes. We have not gotten any confirmation from the Israeli army about those deaths.

But this is what a spokesperson had to say to us earlier about what was going on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LT. COL. AVITAL LEIBOVICH, IDF SPOKESMAN: One of the most difficult areas were the area of (INAUDIBLE) in which we were facing with the angered mob of a few hundred, trying to reach the Israeli- Syrian border fence. We warned them verbally with warning shots into the air. And with these two options failing, we had to open fire.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FLOWER: Now, all of these protests are going on to mark what is the 44th anniversary of the Six-Day War -- the 1967 war in which Israel captured various territories from its Arab neighbors, including the Gaza Strip, the West Bank and Golan Heights. And this is basically -- this is the second time in a month that mass protests like these have taken place and they're expecting more of these to take place as we get closer to September when the U.N. is expected to hold a vote on the recognition of an independent Palestinian state.

HOLMES: All right, Kevin Flower today for us from the West Bank -- Kevin, we appreciate you, as always.

You heard him talking about the Six-Day War there, and this is really these demonstrations are to commemorate that war. Take a look at what we are talking about here -- the borders of Israel before 1967.

You might recall it wasn't too long ago that President Obama caused quite a stir -- few weeks ago -- when he said that the region should start negotiations for peace with those 1967 borders.

Now, here is what the borders look like today -- 44 years after the Six-Day War in 1967. Israel forces captured all of Jerusalem and the West Bank from Jordan, as well as the Golan Heights from Syria, also the Sinai Peninsula, and Gaza from Egypt.

The outgoing U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates delivered news pleasing both Afghan President Hamid Karzai and U.S. troops stationed there. The secretary arrived in Kabul yesterday, his farewell tour of sorts as he retires later this month, coincides with the proposed drawdown of NATO troops in Afghanistan.

President Karzai thanked Gates for his years of service. Gates had this to say about that planned drawdown.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT GATES, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: It seems to me that between the successes that we've already enjoyed and the increased capacity of the Afghan forces, we are in a position, based on conditions on the ground, as the president has said, to consider some modest drawdowns beginning in July.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HOLMES: Secretary Gates' visit was marred by another roadside bomb attack that killed four NATO troops. Those victims have yet to be identified.

Well, there is a showdown brewing over airport security screening in Texas. This is going on between the state of Texas and the Department of Justice. And you might be caught in the middle, you, the traveler.

The Texas House of Representatives passed legislation last month prohibiting TSA screeners from conducting invasive searches. The Justice Department warning against passage now by the Senate that the lawmaker who introduced that bill and demonstrators at the Capitol yesterday in Austin are urging passage.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We shouldn't have to have people put their hands all over our bodies because it is invasive, it is sexual assault. We're not asking to be touched in that way and it's really inappropriate.

REP. DAVID SIMPSON (R), TEXAS STATE HOUSE: There is no federal law we're contravening. There was no federal law that requires that they touch us in our private parts as a condition of travel. That's outrageous. Police officers can't even do that.

(END VIDEO CLIPS)

HOLMES: Now, the Justice Department contends the ban on searches would conflicts with federal law, says if the law is enacted, the Justice Department would order the cancellation possibly of flights into and out of Texas.

Now, we're talking about one state here. But certainly, Texas is not the first state to introduce such a bill. In March, New Hampshire introduced a bill that would make those intimate pat-downs, touching or viewing people's private parts make that a sexual assault.

Our affiliate WMUR tells us those convicted would be required to register as sex offenders. New Jersey, Alaska, Hawaii, Idaho, Pennsylvania, they are all considering similar legislation. And in Utah, one lawmaker plans to introduce a similar bill that would limit pat-downs and he says Utah needs to stand with Texas.

Well, at 11 minutes past the hour, let me turn to our good friend, Reynolds Wolf, keeping an eye on all things weather-wise.

Severe weather this weekend was heat related, but also keep an eye on that mess in Arizona right now.

REYNOLDS WOLF, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes, I know. Isn't it amazing, watching the flooding, watching, of course, the heat and, of course, the fires in Arizona?

The four corners really under the gun right now in terms of rough fire conditions. In fact, 260,000 acres burned in Arizona alone. You see the video, you see those images. Please know that there are many firefighters battling not only the rough topography, but also, of course, the intense heat, the flames, zero contained at this time. Over 200,000 acres burned and, unfortunately, the weather is not going to cooperate.

They can expect very low humidity. At the same time, wind picking up this afternoon which will help fan the flames. And there is plenty of fine chaparral and other foliage to cause those flames to continue to burn, a lot of fuel out there.

We're going to have some sound coming up fairly soon, give us an idea of what these guys are dealing it on the front lines of the blaze. That's moments away.

Plus, we're going to take a look at those flooding conditions in parts of the northern plains, along the Missouri River, T.J.

HOLMES: All right. Reynolds, we appreciate, buddy. We will see you here in just a second.

Well, at 12 minutes past the hour now.

Florida has a new standard for people on welfare. Beginning July 1st, if you want welfare benefits, then you have to undergo drug testing.

Governor Rick Scott signed that legislation on Tuesday. It requires welfare recipients to pay for the drug screenings up front. However, if they pass, they will get a refund for it. But if they fail it, they don't get the refund and they don they don't get the welfare.

Governor Rick Scott taking some time out with us here this weekend on this CNN SUNDAY MORNING to join me live.

Sir, it's good to see you once again. We do appreciate you being here. This is certainly a topic that's gotten a lot of attention across the country. So, we appreciate you talking about it.

Also, we'll be talking with the executive director from the ACLU, which, of course, as you know, is suing you over some of the changes you've made down there. We'll get that reaction in a second.

But, I think, Governor, everyone could agree that state taxpayer funds should not be going to fund someone's drug use. I think a lot of people would agree with that. However, do you believe that a great number, significant number of welfare recipients in your state are drug users?

GOV. RICK SCOTT (R), FLORIDA: You know, T.J., I don't know. But I know it's not right for taxpayer money to be paying for somebody's drug addiction. On top of that, you know, this is -- this is going to increase personal responsibility, personal accountability. We shouldn't be subsidizing people's drug addiction. And you have to remember, welfare is for the benefit of our children and they shouldn't be -- the money should be going to take care of them, not for somebody's drug addiction.

HOLMES: OK. I guess -- I guess that's one of the points that people have and one of the problems they have. You just said that you don't know if they're using drugs, if welfare users or welfare recipients are using drugs.

So, if you don't know, why treat them like you suspect that they are?

SCOTT: I'm not at all. I just want to make sure our taxpayers are not interested in subsidizing drug addiction. I mean, it's no different than -- think about it, if you apply for a job, they're not saying you use drugs. They're just saying, in that work environment, they don't want you to use drugs.

In this case, we do not want to subsidize drug addiction. We want to give everybody an increased incentive not to use drugs. It's better for our families. It's better for the individual, and it doesn't waste taxpayer money.

HOLMES: And like you said, you don't want to subsidize drug addiction, but I keep going back to this point because this is one people are getting on. You don't want to subsidize it, but what evidence do you have that you are now or you have been? What evidence is there that there are people in your state who are drug users?

I mean, it's OK if you just say you believe that plenty of people on welfare are drug users but it doesn't sound like you want to say that.

SCOTT: Sure, T.J. Studies show that people that are on welfare are higher users of drugs than people not on welfare. But the bottom line is this --

HOLMES: Sir, to that point, a lot -- that would stop people in their tracks. And I don't have whatever study you are referring to, but you're saying that people out there who need this assistance, lost jobs, are on welfare have a higher tendency to use drugs.

SCOTT: Absolutely. Studies show that people on welfare are using drugs much higher than other people in the population. But the bottom line is, if they're not using drugs, it's not an issue. Our taxpayers don't want to subsidize somebody's drug addiction. It's going to increase personal responsibility. It's the right thing to do for Floridians.

HOLMES: Sir, do you think this is going to cost your state -- which a lot of states are having all kinds of budget issues and you've certainly gotten some flack in your state for the sacrifices you proposed making there. Do you have the money to pay for this? How much is it going to cost if you have to pay for these drug screenings?

SCOTT: It's an insignificant cost, T.J. The bottom line is -- HOLMES: How much?

SCOTT: -- we're not going to use taxpayer money -- we'll see how many people fail the test, and how many people pass the test. But we have the money to pay for that.

But the bottom line, we're not going to subsidize somebody's drug addiction. We want more personal accountability. We want the money to be spent on our children.

HOLMES: Another question here, and you've answered this to some degree there. There is a firm or clinic there or a company that runs a number of clinics in your state of Florida. And those folks do drug screenings called Solantic. Now, you transferred your interest over to your wife, still in the family even though it's some would say it is or is not a conflict of interest.

But can you tell us here that Solantic, the company that your wife now has that interest in that does drug screenings will not be receiving any state funds to pay for any of these drug tests?

SCOTT: T.J., you must not have heard. But I agreed to sell that back in April so that's -- we're just waiting on licensure and it will get sold in the next couple of weeks.

So, I will have no involvement. My family won't have any involvement.

But this bill, T.J., is the right thing for Floridians. This is a bill that's going to make sure our taxpayers are not subsidizing drug abusers.

HOLMES: Now again, the sale and all that will go through but again, even though, will Solantic be used at all -- that company be used at all for any of these drug screenings?

SCOTT: I won't be involved. I won't be part of making any of those decisions. They don't have contracts as far as I know now with the state. So, I have no idea.

HOLMES: But would you say that they should not? It looks like a conflict of interest even though the interest or the company is in your -- would be in your wife's name though. Sounds like or a lot of people have suggested you're making policies there, you're testing state employees now and the welfare workers or welfare recipients as well to get drug testing and the biggest -- one of the biggest in the state that does drug testing is your old company.

SCOTT: T.J., I'm in the process of selling it. My wife won't have an interest. We contract to sell it back in April. We're just waiting for state licensure right now to sell it.

HOLMES: All right. Well, Governor Scott --

SCOTT: There won't be any conflict. HOLMES: Won't be. All right. And I know that there is a panel there that ruled there wasn't a conflict of interest on this. Need to say that as well, they ruled as well.

Governor Scott, we appreciate you. You've been generous with your time this weekend and also last weekend discussing this. It has the attention of a lot of people all over this country. Other states are keeping an eye on seeing what's happening in your state as well.

But, Governor, we appreciate you. You enjoy the rest of your Sunday.

SCOTT: All right. Have a great day, T.J.

HOLMES: All right. We're at 18 minutes past the hour. Not done with this topic just yet. After the break, we'll talk to the executive director of the ACLU in Florida about the impact of this new law and also a lawsuit that they are getting now -- getting ready to take on Governor Rick Scott. That conversation, right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: Twenty-one minutes past the hour now.

Just before the break, we were talking here to the Florida governor, Rick Scott. He's just signed a controversial law that affects people on welfare. Starting on July 1st, if you want welfare benefits, you have to be drug-tested first.

The measure requires the welfare recipients to pay for the screening. If they pass it they do get a refund for it. But if they fail, they don't get a refund, they also don't get benefits.

The ACLU wasted no time in attacking this new law. Also attacked the governor on another initiative he signed in, a directive, that also requires many state employees to have to get random drug tests.

The ACLU has now filed suit in that case and expects to file suit as well on the law now that requires welfare recipients to be drug- tested.

Joining me this morning is Mr. Howard Simon, the executive director of the ACLU of Florida. He is joining us.

Sir, thank you so much for being here. I will let just quickly here of the top, react to what you heard from Governor Scott.

HOWARD SIMON, EXEC. DIR., ACLU OF FLORIDA: Well, our governor and we're only into five months of his term, you heard him say -- repeat the same things over and over again. We want to prevent the abuse of -- misuse of state funds. We don't want to subsidize drug addiction. We want to support personal responsibility.

Of course, all of that is true, that we want to make sure that state monies, welfare monies, go to the families and especially the children who are in need of that.

But is there any evidence of abuse? What is the problem that this addresses?

He said he didn't know. But, in fact, he does know. Or he should know, because the state did a study just a couple of years ago in the Jacksonville area and they abandoned it because the study showed that there wasn't a drug abuse amongst the welfare recipients.

What he is doing is giving ugly legitimacy to an unfortunate stereotype that has been in this country for a couple of decades that all welfare recipients are a bunch of drug abusers.

HOLMES: Mr. Simon, let me ask you this though -- do you see any upside to what he is doing? A lot of people -- aside from -- I mean, the drug testing, maybe treats people like suspects who are already down on their luck. That is one part of it.

But what about the part the governor argues, that you know what? This kind of encourages that kind of accountability in families. Do you see no up side to making sure that state taxpayer funds are not using or going towards subsidizing somebody's drug use?

SIMON: T.J., I work for the ACLU and it's our job to prevent the trampling on the constitutional rights of the people of Florida. I don't see an upside of violating people's constitutional rights, namely, subjecting people to an intrusive, invasive, humiliating search when there's no evidence that they're doing anything wrong. I'm also --

HOLMES: Well, Mr. Simon

(CROSSTALK)

HOLMES: Well, I'm sorry, just in terms of principle. In terms of principle, do you think state taxpayers do have a right to know whether or not their funds are being used to subsidize somebody's drug use? Just on principle here.

SIMON: Of course -- of course, they do. But why are we treating welfare recipients like criminals?

Students get scholarships. There are vendors that get contracts. There are people in the state that get grants.

Why has the governor focused on welfare recipients only and treating people who are down on their luck, lost their job, exhausted their unemployment benefits, as if they were criminals? This -- what he's doing is giving legitimacy, legal legitimacy to an ugly stereotype.

HOLMES: Is there another way you would suggest the governor go about doing this? Would you like him to include like you said, students that get scholarships, contractors who maybe do work with the state, even state lawmakers? Would you prefer that he included everybody? And do you see another way to make sure that people that get state funds aren't using drugs?

SIMON: Yes, there is another way and the way is to respect the Constitution. You would think that a governor that affiliates with the Tea Party would have some understanding that government does not engage in searches without suspicion or probable cause. The way that I would suggest is that he respect the Constitution and only engage in searches where he has reason to suspect that people are spending their money on drugs.

HOLMES: What argument that the government makes -- and I'll wrap it up here -- and a lot of people make, they say -- again, you all are suing over the governor's directive that he signed that said that state federal employees had to be randomly drug-tested or people who wanted a job. Now, you all are using, have filed suit over that already. But a lot of people out there in the country will look and say, "Hey, well, when I started my job at this place, I had to be drug-tested," or, "I started over here, I had to be drug tested."

What's wrong with state employees doing it? I guess, what is the problem with the state employee having to be drug-tested?

SIMON: T.J., I hear that a lot.

HOLMES: Yes?

SIMON: Yes, it is true that widespread abuse of privacy rights of workers in this country has spread for several decades. But people who are employed by the government -- city governments, county governments, state governments, the federal governments, they are protected by the Constitution. And the Constitution prohibits the government from requiring intrusive urine testing, drug testing, drug screens, tests of your bodily fluids, without any reasonable suspicion or probable cause. That's the difference.

Private employees are only protected by a labor union contract or by state law. But public employees are protected by our Constitution. You would think that a governor who affiliates himself with the Tea Party would understand the basic American principle that dates from our revolution that searches don't take place by government in the absence of suspicion.

HOLMES: Well again, it sounds like everyone is in agreement that money should not be going towards subsidizing drug use, but I guess disagreement on how we should go about it.

Mr. Simon, we appreciate you taking time out here. We hope to check in with you and the governor again. This issue is not going away. The law is supposed to go into effect on welfare recipients July 1st. But then you have a lawsuit that is probably coming in that case as well. So, sir, we appreciate you and hope we can call on you again.

SIMON: Thank you very much.

HOLMES: All right. We're getting close to the bottom of the hour here on this CNN SUNDAY MORNING. China known as being on top in table tennis. Well, now, just throw in regular tennis. We'll tell you about a historic happening at the French Open this weekend. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: All right, joined now by Ray D'Alessio from HLN Sports. Good to see you.

RAY D'ALESSIO, HLN SPORTS: Good to see you too. French open. History --

HOLMES: being made.

D'ALESSIO: Yes. We're talking about 29-year-old Li Na becoming the first Asian-born tennis player to win a singles match; others have won doubles matches in majors but she's the first Asian-born to win a singles match in tennis. And she is now a hero in her homeland of China.

She -- in fact, they were saying today in the state media that she has overtaken Yao Ming as the most popular athlete in that nation.

T.J., she is such a great story; has overcome so much. She lost her father at the age of 14. Her father was the one that got her involved in tennis because he wanted her to become a better badminton player. She took up the game of tennis because of that. She lost her father at 14.

At 20 she actually gave up the game of tennis for a few years to study media in college, returned and now she's this icon in China.

And of course, at the Australian Open she lost in the finals, came back and as you see, won the French Open. Now they're saying she's basically opening the doors for the future of tennis in Asia.

HOLMES: And she is -- I mean no offense -- that's old for a tennis player --

D'ALESSIO: Absolutely.

HOLMES: 29 years old.

D'ALESSIO: Absolutely. But now -- and like I said, they're saying that she is a pioneer in the sport because for so many years people really haven't taken, you know, China or anybody in Asia seriously as a tennis contender. And now they're saying, hey, we're out here, you know, we're making our move, we're coming forward now. Look out for Asia as a powerhouse in tennis.

HOLMES: It has been table tennis and badminton, as you said, they have dominated. But this was a great moment. Good to see -- she has a great personality.

D'ALESSIO: Absolutely.

HOLMES: So this is cool.

I'm glad you can get her. Thanks for coming up.

(CROSSTALK)

D'ALESSIO: All right, man. Good to see you.

HOLMES: Right back at you. Good to see you as always, buddy.

Coming up, our exclusive interview with one of Nelson Mandela's granddaughters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NADIA BILCHIK, CNN EDITORIAL PRODUCER: All those years in prison, and then coming out in terms of saying he's very careful about what he eats.

ZAMASWAZI DLAMINI, NELSON MANDELA'S GRANDDAUGHTER: I think it just goes into the whole thing of just being healthy, mind, body and spirit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: So what is it like to grow up Mandela?

Also, something the world never knew about the South African icon. Stay with us for that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: Well, 36 minutes past the hour now.

Syrian state television reporting four people have been killed by Israeli forces that were trying to prevent pro-Palestinian protesters in the Golan Heights from breaching Israel's borders. CNN not able to independently confirm that; also no confirmation coming from Israeli forces either. An Internet campaign called for protests today to mark the anniversary of the Six-Day War.

Turn to some severe weather and weather is certainly playing a role out in Arizona, in particular the northeast part of that state. On alert -- people being told to pack up and get out of there. A wildfire is closing in being called one of the largest in the state's history. Some 2,200 people already have had to evacuate. The fire has burned 144,000 acres and has come within five miles of the resort town of Greer.

Reynolds Wolf here with me now. You talked to one of the guys out there in Arizona. It was one of the questions you had about, how worried are you about this fire moving to more populated areas.

REYNOLDS WOLF, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Absolutely. I mean it is an uphill struggle for them. It is brutal out there now dealing with of course, the fire itself, very rough conditions; very hot out there as you imagine parts of Arizona. We did speak with Brad Pitassi, he's the spokesperson. He said conditions there are very grim.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRAD PITASSI, MARICOPA FIRE DEPARTMENT (via telephone): Fortunately we've had some successful burnout operations that have been occurring during the night and we'll hopefully get those containments up in the next couple of days. We are faced with some weather conditions that don't get us too excited; we're considering potential for some dry lightning which with these dry fuels and the winds, any potential lightning strike can turn into a significant incident on this fire.

WOLF: Brad, can you give us an idea of what kind of conditions these guys happen to be fighting in? What I mean is we've seen wildfires in parts of Oklahoma and parts of Texas -- they are battling mainly on like prairie conditions, if you will. The topography here is a bit more dramatic. Isn't it?

PITASSI: It is. It's very dramatic, very rugged terrain and also very diverse terrain. So this fire covers approximately 225 square miles or 144,000 acres and we have some crews within the city doing structure protection and we have some crews in very rugged mountainous terrain in that Arizona forest.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF: What's insane about a situation like this is when you have widespread wildfires you get the air that's super heated. It goes up, hits higher elevations, gets higher aloft and when it does it can actually form some thunder heads. Yes, these fires can re-spawn other blazes across this mountain side.

It can get plenty of fuel up there. You've got a lot of pine, a lot of (INAUDIBLE), a lot of foliage so the situation is far from over.

Let's show you something else. If we go back to the magic wall, you're going to notice that that is not the only place where you have the threat of fires. You have fire watches that extend into parts of Utah, back into Colorado, even into Mexico, Farmington, right along the Sangre de Cristo Mountains.

You have the same dry conditions, winds that will be topping up at 30 to possibly gusts up to 40, maybe 50 miles-an-hour into the afternoon as things progress; so, certainly dire situation there.

Another place we have some fairly dire situations will be back into the northern plains where we have the Missouri River still overflowing its banks in many spots. Every place where you happen to see the bright green is where you have the flood warning, including spots like Pierre and back to Mobridge; it is a place where the last thing we need is rain in those spots.

And thankfully the rain will be again, moving a bit farther to the east and into portions of the Ohio Valley. You can see it here; the chance for severe storms is mostly into the afternoon and early evening hours.

For the southeast into the central and south Texas it's going to be hazy, it will hot. It's going to be very humid at the same time. You can expect your temperatures in many locations especially in spots like Atlanta going to 96 degrees to feel much warmer. In fact it's going to feel like 100.

Forget about the humidity, the air itself in Houston will be up in the triple digits. 93 in St. Louis; 95 in Kansas City; 89 in Denver; 59 in San Francisco, 71 in Los Angeles, 105 in Phoenix. And back to Chicago and New York and Boston mainly into the 70s.

All right T.J. That is a full wrap on your forecast. Let's get back to you.

HOLMES: Reynolds, appreciate you as always buddy. Thank you so much.

It's 20 to the top of the hour now. The President's point man on the economy is talking to CNN this morning; in particular, talking to Candy Crowley but I'm talking to her right after the break. See you in a second Candy.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: I know it's Sunday morning but it is always a perfect time for Candy. Right? Let's join Candy Crowley live from Washington this morning getting ready for her show at the top of the hour, "STATE OF THE UNION". Candy, good morning. How are you, first of all?

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN HOST, "STATE OF THE UNION": Good morning. I am very good, and you?

HOLMES: We are doing all right this morning. This is our favorite time of the morning for a lot of reasons.

CROWLEY: Also because you know you're almost done. Tell the truth.

HOLMES: No, that's not it at all. It is just good to see you Candy.

Of course, Friday, disappointing economic numbers; Americans hear -- all they hear is that the unemployment rate went up and that shakes confidence. Then you go into the numbers, jobs were created but a disappointing number. You're getting into that this morning with an important man on the economy.

CROWLEY: Austan Goolsbee is the President's top economic advisor at the White House. Listen there is not a lot of ways to pretty this up and so far the White House has said it is a bump, you can't just look at one month at a time.

True enough. But 9.1 percent unemployment after the trillion dollars or so that's been spent trying to get the economy pumped up is worth questioning the President's top economic advisor about, along with, you know, whether or not they've got anything else they want to, you know, throw out there to try to pump up the job market.

HOLMES: You're also talking -- of course, you're always talking presidential politics. I can't keep up sometimes who's in, who's out. Ron Paul is officially in. Right?

CROWLEY: Officially in. He is officially in. As you and I were talking, he is always such an interesting guy. This is his third run at the White House. His first was as a libertarian, that I'm sure doesn't surprise you. Now he's a Republican congressman.

But I tell, this is man, who for more than 20 years has been preaching lower taxes and spending cuts. So he's kind of a guy whose message time has come. We are seeing some increasing power that he has inside the primary process. He has very passionate followers. They're willing to give him money and so he can move the conversation. Even if you look at him and say, oh, gosh, he can't possibly win. Well, maybe not, but I have to tell you, we have some polls of likely people to get in and people that are already in that he places second in.

Now whether or not he can win at this point is less the question than can he move the conversation. And he certainly is one of those who intends to try.

HOLMES: Do some do that as I let you go, do some get in really not believing they can win but they really just want to have an influence on the conversation the country's having?

CROWLEY: I have never, ever had a presidential candidate say to me, yes, I actually don't think I can win. But I think someplace in their hearts they know the odds. Ron Paul is one of those, who understand the odds; nonetheless, he has something to say, it is a good platform to say it in.

HOLMES: Yes. That probably would make him a good candidate if they said they didn't think they could win.

CROWLEY: Right.

HOLMES: Candy, good to see you as always.

CROWLEY: Thanks. Thanks.

HOLMES: And to our viewers, you of course, are just a few minutes away from seeing more Candy Crowley. "STATE OF THE UNION" starts in 15 minutes at 9:00 Eastern, 6:00 Pacific right here on CNN.

Now, some video we have been showing you this morning of a fight that broke out at an airport in Houston. Not just any fight. It was between a West Point cadet and Patti Labelle -- well, kind of - sort of. I'll explain the situation here in just a second. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN RALEY, LABELLE ACCUSER'S ATTORNEY: He was completely taken by surprise. No one would have seen this coming. Even watching the videotape now for how many times we've watched it, it is still surprising; the violence and the suddenness and the brutality of this attack.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Well, one side calling it an attack; the other side saying, not so much. What we're seeing here is a young man being -- what appears to be -- beat up, pushed around a little bit by bodyguards, who worked for singer Patti Labelle. It is actually a West Point candidate in the yellow shirt there; his name is Richard King, telling our Houston affiliate KTRK that her bodyguards beat him up at the airport.

He's suing the performer now. Again, he's the one in the yellow shirt on the ground. He says he did nothing wrong and the attack was completely unprovoked.

However, Houston police reporting that King was intoxicated and harassing Labelle's group as they were getting into their limo.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD KING, WEST POINT CADET: I pretty much got jumped and I really don't even know why and on top of that, it's causing a lot of trouble up here because of the false police report that they had reported.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Were you drunk?

KING: No, ma'am.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: Now, King's attorney says his client has been disciplined now by West Point over the incident. Says King is being busted to private and deployed to active duty.

Also, questions over how Houston police handled the confrontation since no charges were filed, and also Patti Labelle took photos with at least one officer on the scene. We did reach out to Patti Labelle's representatives. We have done it a number of times. We have not yet received comment.

Well, coming up in just a moment, exclusive interview with one of Nelson Mandela's granddaughters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILCHIK: All those years in prison and then coming out into terms of saying he's very careful about what he eats.

DLAMINI: I think it just goes into the whole thing of just being healthy, mind, body and spirit.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: We say good morning once again to Nadia Bilchik with our "Morning Passport". We really enjoy hearing from Winnie Mandela and also the granddaughter now of Nelson Mandela. You don't know -- she was invited over to South African to the home of Winnie Mandela.

BILCHIK: Yes. And we're hearing now from her granddaughter, Zamaswazi Dlamini. And I started off by asking her what does she remember of the time that her grandfather was in prison? So let's hear what Swazi -- that's her nickname -- her real name is Zamaswazi but otherwise Swazi Dlamini -- had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DLAMINI: Being raided early hours of the morning, you know, my grandmother being arrested, taken off. My mom's not there, she's perhaps out of the country and so what about us? Who's going to take care of us, what are we going to do? Are we going to go to school tomorrow? That's just a little of the types of things that we did experience.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HOLMES: It is amazing to hear. We all have memories of our grandparents and things we did. She says she remembers being raided.

BILCHIK: Absolutely. I mean to have -- and to have this legend and this icon Nelson Mandela but as a child what that was like, quite horrific. And being the granddaughter of Winnie Mandela, there's all the Winnie Mandela interviews on your blog, T.J. -- CNN.com/TJ.

HOLMES: Well, the two of us. The two of us need to know that.

BILCHIK: CNN.com/TJ because it's is really interesting --

HOLMES: A lot of stuff there.

BILCHIK: -- hearing what it was like for Winnie. But, you know, getting on to Nelson Mandela, how he's managed to stay health for so long. He's going to be 93. So it's interesting to hear what Swazi had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DLAMINI: He's very particular about what he eats. And I think -- but I think it just goes into the whole thing of just being health, mind, body and spirit and taking very good care of yourself.

I think he's lived so long because he takes very good care of himself and the same thing goes to my grandmother. She's very particular about what she puts into her body and how she takes care of herself. I think those are some of the things that they've passed on to us. It's to be mindful about what you put into your body and how you take care of yourself. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BILCHIK: You may be surprised what Nelson Mandela says to his granddaughter about her weight.

HOLMES: Oh. What does he say? Because grandparents can say what they want to say.

BILCHIK: Yes. Let's hear.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DLAMINI: With my mother, with my grandmother, with (INAUDIBLE); with every single one of us, he's very particular about image, extremely particular.

BILCHIK: So he's very aesthetic.

DLAMINI: Extremely aesthetic. I mean his shirt is always crisp and he -- his watch is always on correctly and everything is always proper. So when you come into the room, he'll size you up and he'll look you up and down and he'll say, ok, you look decent. Or, if you've put on a little bit of weight, he'll say, you know, maybe you could go to the gym a little bit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BILCHIK: And for more, CNN.com/TJ.

HOLMES: All right. Let me make sure I'm presenting myself here correctly.

Nadia Bilchik, thank you so much.

We're getting close to the top of the hour here.

Stay with us.

Of course Candy coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HOLMES: All right folks. I want to thank you all for spending some time with us here on this CNN SATURDAY and SUNDAY MORNING. We certainly appreciate you being with us. Hope to see you back here next weekend as well.

But right now, coming to the top of the hour, it is time for Candy.