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JOY BEHAR SHOW
Cult Leader Faces Life Sentence; Michael Jackson`s Doctor: Dr. Death?; Interview With Kate Gosselin; Interview With Jimmy Fallon
Aired August 8, 2011 - 22:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Coming up on THE JOY BEHAR SHOW, Joy has the latest on the day`s biggest legal stories.
Warren Jeffs was found guilty of sexual assault. Joy wants to know if jurors will give him life in prison.
And how are both sides in the Conrad Murray/Michael Jackson death case preparing for the blockbuster trial?
Then Kate Gosselin opens up to Joy about raising eight kids on her own all while trying to date and starring in a hit show.
Plus, late night wunderkind Jimmy Fallon is here to talk pop culture, the late night wars and sample his Ben and Jerry`s ice cream flavor.
That and more starting right now.
JOY BEHAR, HLN HOST: Two major trials in the news are generating a lot of interest. In California, the stage is being set to try Dr. Conrad Murray on involuntary manslaughter charges in the death of Michael Jackson. And in Texas, polygamist Warren Jeffs has been found guilty of two counts of sexual abuse against a minor.
Joining me to talk about these trials is legal analyst and former prosecutor, Susan Filan and Mark Geragos, the defense attorney, who once represented the late Michael Jackson. How do you do, people; how are you?
SUSAN FILAN, LEGAL ANALYST: Hi Joy.
MARK GERAGOS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Hi Joy.
BEHAR: Ok. Mark let`s start with the Jeffs trial. Ok. There was very emotional testimony this weekend from Warren Jeffs` niece and nephew. The nephew said he was only 5 years old when this pervert sodomized him. Ok? The rapist said nothing. Is that an admission of guilt?
GERAGOS: I don`t know if it`s an admission of guilt but at this stage in the proceedings it is not helpful. He hasn`t done anything to help himself during this case; from firing his lawyer and standing there mute or doing anything else. It is like a kamikaze mission on his part. I think that it`s part of his perception of martyrdom but it`s that old expression, a lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client.
BEHAR: Yes. But I mean, you know, doesn`t this prove, both of you, that the guy is a pervert and a pedophile and this whole big facade of being with Jesus and God and all these other lies that he puts out there is just a smoke screen so that he could do the dirty deeds that he has done?
FILAN: Yes. I mean I think for him to claim that he was doing this in the name of his religion, that he was disseminating his message; let me tell you, I don`t want to be on the other end of that message.
I mean, Mark, you`ve been here -- because I talk to people about this case for weeks now. And people actually believe, some people say, "Oh he believes this. He believes that it`s a calling, some religious calling. I don`t believe it. I do not believe it. I think he is just a pig and a perv and this is what he uses as an excuse to do his thing -- Mark.
GERAGOS: I don`t know Joy. I`m not so sure that he doesn`t believe it. People, you know, believe crazy things before in the name religion. And I just don`t know. And obviously, I don`t know that anybody does, unless they`ve kind of lived around him and seen it on a day-in, day-out.
Obviously it is troubling. The whole thing was troubling. But now, whether he believes it or not, that`s above my pay grade.
BEHAR: And it`s irrelevant, too, really. But I mean, you know, he`s rationalizing the young brides, the young brides and Jesus. But then when you sodomize a 5-year-old child, what does that have to do with your delusion?
FILAN: And his nephew, too and a young boy.
BEHAR: And the girl, too, the niece who was by the way, the jurors were crying when they heard his testimony.
FILAN: I can`t understand him taping it. That`s what I was trying to figure. Let`s say he does believe this and this is his religious motivation, what does taping it do? A record before God? That`s where I thought that was really just child porn. That`s where it crossed the line to me from prophecy to perversion.
BEHAR: Why do you think he taped it, Mark?
GERAGOS: Well, I think you`re absolutely right. It is that definition of child porn. Generally you will see in cases like this, where somebody does have a fetish or that they do tend to keep trophies, so to speak. I mean that`s a whole When you listen to the experts testify, that`s part of their mantra is that there is always a trophy or pictures or taping or some article of clothing. I`ve heard that many times in a courtroom of experts. So that fits with a certain profile.
BEHAR: Ok. You`re a lawyer, both of you are lawyers. 24 of his 78 wives were under the age of 17. Why did the prosecutors only go after two counts of sexual abuse against a child? Either one of you.
FILAN: The only thing I could think of is there might have been a legal marriage age in Texas and perhaps parents gave consent.
BEHAR: Well, yes, the legal age to get married in Texas is 18 or as young as 14 with parental consent.
FILAN: With parental consent.
GERAGOS: With parental consent --
FILAN: But a parent in the cult.
BEHAR: Yes, I know.
GERAGON: You know, Joy -- right, there is a lot of states in the United States where it is as low as 14, in some states without parental consent. So the United States is not exactly as progressive on this issue -- some people might think that`s progressive -- as you might think. So I don`t know. Maybe some of these wives did not want to cooperate. That`s another issue as well.
BEHAR: Well, they are brainwashed. They`re brainwashed, these women.
FILAN: But I think even if they didn`t want to cooperate --
GERAGOS: A lot of wives are.
BEHAR: A lot of wives are? What do you mean? Is your wife --
GERAGOS: She puts up with me. So --
FILAN: God help Mrs. Geragos.
GERAGOS: There is a special place in heaven for her.
BEHAR: How long are you married, Mark? How long are you married?
GERAGOS: 23 years last week.
BEHAR: Well, congratulations.
GERAGOS: That`s like a first-degree murder plus use.
BEHAR: That`s a funny one.
Let`s talk about this other bargain, Conrad Murray. Now, you know all about this case, don`t you, Mark? Because you were -- Michael Jackson case.
GERAGOS: As Michael`s lawyer and my ex-associate is now also one on the defense team. So I`m coming and going on this case.
BEHAR: Ok. Well, the prosecution wants to use the medical records of other Murray patients to show Murray`s prescription practices. Now, isn`t that a violation of privacy laws? You use somebody else`s prescriptions to make your point?
GERAGOS: It probably is. But I believe the Judge Pastor will let that in and he`ll probably say, "I`m going to redact the names" unless the prosecutor went to the person and got some kind of a release.
FILAN: Got their consent.
If they waived that and they said you can use me because this will be my three seconds of fame.
BEHAR: Really. It`s almost like. Isn`t that like, some kind of form of hearsay?
FILAN: No. Not the name on the prescription.
GERAGOS: Yes, but --
BEHAR: It is, right, Mark?
GERAGOS: It is hearsay when you`re trying to bring it in. But there are exceptions and then they`re trying to get it in under an exception. In this case, they`re going to bring it in under a California evidence code section that says that it shows his motive or opportunity or intent. And then the record themselves, if it is a business record, they can bring it under that. If it is what`s called -- hey, Joy, this will be like our little legal analysis.
FILAN: This is like a bad bar exam.
GERAGOS: Present sense impression, then it comes in as well.
BEHAR: Ok, whatever.
GERAGOS: I knew I would get that reaction. You asked the question.
BEHAR: I know. What an idiot I am.
FILAN: She didn`t want the answer though.
BEHAR: Ok. Now this is interesting. These prospective jurors were given 117-question document to answer. Why do they need to know that much about these jurors?
FILAN: So they can try to get the best jury for each side. And they`re trying to weed out the nuts from the normal.
BEHAR: Well, some of them lie. They`re going to lie.
FILAN: I`ve never heard of anybody lying in a court proceeding.
BEHAR: Really. You call yourself a lawyer?
FILAN: Cindy Anthony told the truth during her trial.
FILAN: Cindy Anthony. She was telling the truth on the witness stand, Casey`s mother.
BEHAR: No, she wasn`t.
FILAN: Oh, really?
BEHAR: She`s being sarcastic.
Mark, what about that? Some of them will want to lie just to get on the jury.
GERAGOS: I always say the only people who lie more than the defendants are the jurors. So they want to get on that jury. I remember doing a questionnaire -- a very likely questionnaire like this in the Scott Peterson case. And some of the people who were illiterate could still find the question that asked an opinion and said he is guiti -- g-u-i-t-i.
FILAN: They lie to get on, they lie to get off.
GERAGOS: They lie to get off -- exactly.
BEHAR: I can see lying to get off. But to lie to get on -- that`s crazy.
GERAGOS: No, if they`re lying to get on, it is usually because they`re what I call a stealth juror. They think that that`s going to be -- they`ll get a book deal or they`re going to be interviewed afterwards. I remember after the Robert Blake case, one of the jurors was hawking his CD right after the "not guilty" on the air as he was being interviewed.
BEHAR: Ok. Now you know, Michael Jackson, not for nothing, Mark, but he was a willing drug user. Does that make the case against Dr. Murray harder to prove?
GERAGOS: No. The biggest obstacle they have in this case is that they`re going to be hard pressed to find anybody who`s going to say that this drug should have been administered anywhere outside of a hospital. That`s the big --
BEHAR: The Propofol.
GERAGOS: That is the bogeyman of that guy. Yes. That`s a real problem.
BEHAR: I mean, who does that?
BEHAR: Nobody does that.
FILAN: You don`t have your own anesthesiologist at home because you`re going to your doctor and say I don`t want to dream?
That`s what he said. I don`t want to dream. Not that "I`m having trouble sleeping. I don`t even want to dream."
BEHAR: So induce a coma?
FILAN: I`m not going to go for Valium. I want anesthesia at home in my own bed.
BEHAR: And then the doctor says "Ok. I just happen to have some on me."
FILAN: "How much would you like?" And I don`t you can blame the victim here. I don`t think you can blame the patient for asking for it. It`s the doctor who should say "no".
BEHAR: Is that -- will you agree with that Mark? You don`t blame the victim at all here?
MARK GERAGOS: One of the -- one of the problems in blaming the victim, the victim here is somebody who is beloved.
BEHAR: Right. So that`s not going to fly. Ok, thank you, guys very much. We`ll be right back.
BEHAR: Kate Gosselin is raising eight kids, filming a reality show and trying to find a man. Good luck with that one.
Ok, here`s a clip from the new season of "Kate plus 8".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And you guys decorate all the cupcakes you want in all the colors. And then we`re going to attach them on the head bands.
KATE GOSSELIN, STAR, "KATE PLUS 8": These cute adorable precious little cupcakes that I swear have zero calories in them. Sophie and Katherine decided to attach them to head bands.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We put cupcakes on to head bands. It didn`t really work.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh you have no idea what`s happening on top of your head, child.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Ok, I`m happy the welcome back to my show Kate Gosselin. Hello Kate.
BEHAR: Why can`t they wear barrettes like other children?
GOSSELIN: What? What are you --
BEHAR: Cupcakes on their heads?
GOSSELIN: I know, seriously. Sophie and Katherine came up with that. I was very disturbed because I was thinking someone would going to end up with sticky hair but --
BEHAR: Remind me again how many kids you have.
GOSSELIN: What am I at now? 800? Oh, I mean eight.
BEHAR: You have eight.
GOSSELIN: Yes, right.
BEHAR: You had -- you had -- do you had them all -- no you didn`t have them all at once.
GOSSELIN: Twins and then six.
BEHAR: Twins and six. That`s it, I get you mix up with the octomom - -
GOSSELIN: No, no.
BEHAR: Ok. People are critical of her, you know, the octomom. I had her on the show. And she`s -- she`s kind of in a tough spot, I think, don`t you think? You don`t care.
GOSSELIN: I`m -- well, I don`t know her. I don`t know.
BEHAR: Well, we don`t know her.
GOSSELIN: I mean I think all moms with kids are in a tough spot. But --
But no, she has eight children and she had another. What does she have, four more there?
GOSSELIN: No, I think, didn`t she have six and then eight?
BEHAR: Something like that. But see -- she says that she`s asked to do a reality show but she won`t do it because she exploits the children. Does that insult you when you hear something like that?
GOSSELIN: I just -- if -- if that`s what your opinion is, it`s clearly because you`ve never done it and I control it quite nicely and the kids are enjoying it. And so she just doesn`t know what she`s talking about just like most anybody else who has never done a reality show.
BEHAR: Right, who is looking at it from the outside? So how is the show going?
GOSSELIN: It`s going great.
GOSSELIN: We`re still having fun. We have some pretty interesting things coming up. A little bit of stress and drama.
BEHAR: As always.
GOSSELIN: Yes -- some organizational nightmares.
BEHAR: Like what?
GOSSELIN: Murphy`s Law applied and --
BEHAR: How -- what is Murphy`s Law again?
GOSSELIN: You know, whatever can go wrong will.
BEHAR: Will go wrong.
GOSSELIN: Yes. So --
BEHAR: With all those different people. I mean, they`re adorable children though. They`re so cute.
GOSSELIN: I love them.
BEHAR: Of course you do. They`re your baby. But do you have say to yourself, oh what did I do? Do you ever think of that?
GOSSELIN: Every day. But -- why are you asking?
BEHAR: Because I think you look so great. You`ve been running and running. And where are you running to, Kate?
GOSSELIN: You know, I`m not sure but I know what I`m running from. So that`s good.
BEHAR: Like the delusion of cupcakes maybe right? So -- no -- but the reason I asked you about the show is because it`s not on the fall line- up for TLC. Is there -- is there a danger that it could be canceled?
GOSSELIN: I know, everybody is saying that.
BEHAR: Oh they are?
GOSSELIN: But I don`t control TLC`s programming and I don`t understand. All I need to do is do my thing on camera and then when it leaves me, I don`t know what happens.
BEHAR: You can always switch to "Hoarders". Do you know what I`m saying?
GOSSELIN: Yes, not so much about collecting.
BEHAR: You don`t collect.
BEHAR: Just kids. But no --
GOSSELIN: Yes. Pretty much that`s it.
GOSSELIN: That collection is finished though.
BEHAR: Are you a purger or a hoarder? Because I`m a purger.
GOSSELIN: I`m a purger. Oh my gosh, it feels so good.
BEHAR: Isn`t it the greatest?
GOSSELIN: And just pitch stuff. Yes.
BEHAR: I know, I would go over to people`s houses and clear their stuff out and just get rid of it. People hold on to stuff.
GOSSELIN: I know, I can`t even stand -- I can`t even like watch those hoarding shows. Because it`s like -- I feel like --
BEHAR: Yes, especially with the dead cats all over the place.
BEHAR: Oh yes, some people just have dead cats. I won`t go there. I`m sorry I brought that up.
So how are the kids adjusting now? You know, you were in the news last year. The divorce, da, da, da. How are they doing now?
GOSSELIN: They are doing wonderfully. I mean honestly, at this point, I feel like we are all just settled into this really good sort of normal.
GOSSELIN: And it feels like regular that I`m the only parent there running the whole thing. Of course I`m really running around all the time and I`m quite stressed out and probably --
BEHAR: It`s hard.
GOSSELIN: Yes it is really hard. I mean, it is just hard to be a single mom, period. Let alone having eight kids and all of the responsibilities that go with that.
BEHAR: But you know, truthfully, I was a single mother for a while. And I liked it because you don`t have somebody telling -- disagreeing with your child-rearing techniques.
GOSSELIN: Well, but that bites you, too, because you don`t have somebody to back you up that says, "Did you just hear what your mother said? Go do it."
BEHAR: Yes that`s true.
GOSSELIN: I need that.
GOSSELIN: And I don`t have that but I do -- I mean, there is nobody, I forget what the first project I did to the house. And I was like, yes, I think I`m going to do that. Shall I, I don`t know have anybody to ask. Yes. I`m going to do it.
BEHAR: Oh yes.
GOSSELIN: And I -- I did really like that. But I mean, now I`m to the point where it is getting sort of lonely. The kids are asking a lot. You know, when --
BEHAR: You`re looking -- you want a new guy? You would like a new man.
GOSSELIN: Well, they were listing qualifications the other day and unsolicited. I was driving along and my 7-year-old is just saying, we want a daddy that lives with us and he has to play Barbies with us. And they like went down this whole list.
BEHAR: Oh. Well, Arnold Schwarzenegger is available. He plays with Barbies.
BEHAR: But you know, we have -- we have a clip of you flirting with a guy in Washington, D.C. Can we see that? Want to watch this?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOSSELIN: At one point I looked up and there was a guy across the street. And he had like really awesome sunglasses on. He had like speckly hair that was like good hair.
Seriously? It`s like I don`t do this.
I saw you from across the street and I decided to make a cupcake for you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ok, thank you. I was watching for you.
GOSSELIN: There you are. What`s up?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are these gluten-free cupcakes?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: Oh, my God. Is it gluten free? Who would date a guy who is gluten free?
GOSSELIN: Well, watch -- watch further.
BEHAR: What happens after that?
GOSSELIN: I don`t know. You`ll to have watch. But I did make a comment to that effect.
BEHAR: About the gluten-free?
BEHAR: If it causes sterilization that might help you.
GOSSELIN: I love to tease her. We`ll have more with Kate Gosselin after a quick break.
Stay right there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Still ahead, Jimmy Fallon serves up some late night dish and some ice cream, too.
BEHAR: All right. I`m back with Kate Gosselin.
We were talking about hooking a guy. Now, this is going to be hard because what guy -- most guys when they see you with one kind run the other way. What about all the eight children? That`s tough. Where are you looking? The Friars Club.
GOSSELIN: I`m not really -- I mean I`m not out and about anywhere where I can look. But I mean you`re right. We have trouble keeping baby sitters.
BEHAR: Even the baby -- how many baby sitters?
GOSSELIN: We go through them, you know. It`s all right.
BEHAR: But do you go out to meet guys? Anybody try to fix you up? Anything. Because you look great and I think you`ll find a guy. But a guy who is really devoted to you and your children -- that`s tough.
GOSSELIN: It is tough. It is tough because they`re my kids and it`s tough. To bring somebody else in, all I can say is if he sticks around, he`ll have to be super tough.
BEHAR: He will have to be super tough. Have you met anybody in the ballpark like that yet?
GOSSELIN: Not really. I`m open to it, obviously, but it is -- it is a daunting task. I mean I can`t really do the usual routes of finding somebody. I don`t --
BEHAR: I think you would be better off going with lesbianism because a woman would be probably easier.
GOSSELIN: Oh, my gosh.
BEHAR: More maternal. Do you know what I mean? Try it. You never know.
GOSSELIN: Yes. Not so much for me. Thanks though.
BEHAR: Not your thing. Just a suggestion.
I read that you were -- you`ve been cautioning prospective parents against fertility treatments. Why is that now? Are you anti-fertility treatments now?
GOSSELIN: I don`t think I`ve been -- this must have come out of a tweet from a viewer or a Twitter fan.
BEHAR: No, no, no. This is you. "I will say fertility is not a perfected science. I`m a perfect example of the doctor had it under control and we ended up with sextuplets. We were shocked to death so I tell everyone to be extra super, super cautious."
GOSSELIN: Yes. I`m definitely not against it. I mean my whole thing is if you have diabetes, you receive the treatment. If you have cancer, you receive the treatment. If you have fertility issues, it is in the same ballpark for me. I just remind people to be careful because it is not perfected, clearly. I mean they said we had three to four possibilities and we ended up with seven originally.
BEHAR: Why? Don`t they know what`s in there? They`re sonogramming up the Wazoo these days.
GOSSELIN: Yes. But they missed -- obviously missed them. That`s why I`m telling people like I was shocked, obviously to find out that I was carrying so many. Had they told me here`s the risk, you could have seven. I wouldn`t have gone through with it. But we weren`t hearing seven. We were hearing three to four which is about half takes. But that was a great thing.
So going through what I went through, I`m just telling people, I was not aware of what could happen. So sort of slow down, think and be extra cautious.
BEHAR: Yes. I think that`s true. Before you go, I want to ask you, you have some kind of a reaction to the Casey Anthony trial. People were telling me. You tweeted about that? Was it the verdict that upset you?
GOSSELIN: I forget what I said.
BEHAR: You said this mama`s heart is hurting along with many mama`s hearts everywhere.
GOSSELIN: Yes. It`s just -- I mean it`s a hard situation. I remember when it first happened. I saw it on one of those shows and I thought, oh, my gosh. And I think that I was shocked along with everybody else. And I just feel, that little girl, we`ve all seen her picture.
BEHAR: Once you have a child, it breaks your heart to see something like that. I know.
Well, your kids are just adorable. And I wish all the luck and thanks for coming on and subjecting yourself to my abuse.
GOSSELIN: Any time.
BEHAR: She likes it. And you can catch "Kate plus Eight" Mondays at 9:00 on TLC. We`ll be right back.
BEHAR: He`s a former cast member of "Saturday Night Live" as well as the host of his own Emmy-nominated late night talk show. His new book is called "Thank-you Notes." So let me thank you, Jimmy Fallon, for doing my show and saving me from having to talk about J.Lo`s break-up and the debt ceiling.
JIMMY FALLON, TALK SHOW HOST: Oh my God. Wait, we`re not getting on that topic.
FALLON: Thank you for having me.
BEHAR: Thank you.
FALLON: I think we`ve had it up to here with those topics.
BEHAR: We`re sick of it. I mean, J. Lo`s married. Who cares.
FALLON: They weren`t that interesting. Yeah, I mean, the debt ceiling was like, please.
BEHAR: The debt ceiling is really boring.
FALLON: Get to the end already. And now it`s all over with and now we can talk about enjoying the summer.
BEHAR: Exactly. Now your show, an Emmy nomination.
BEHAR: Leno didn`t get it. Letterman did not get an Emmy nomination. Just you.
FALLON: No, it was freaky. It was a crazy thing. We thought we were going to get zero nominations, because if you look at it, oh, well, the Daily Show will get one, and Colbert will get one, and you know, and Letterman.
BEHAR: And Maher.
FALLON: And Bill Maher. So it`s like they`re all taken up. And "Saturday Night Live." So we just go like, well, whatever. Either way we`re proud of our show, we`re happy to be doing what we`re doing. It`s fine.
BEHAR: Well, you have a lot of competition. But of all of them, I would say you are the most amiable.
FALLON: I like that.
FALLON: I`ll take that.
BEHAR: Meaning you`re funny and amiable. So therefore the committee might say, hey, we like him. He`s good looking, he`s funny, he`s sweet.
FALLON: I like this. So maybe, so you think we have a shot at maybe something.
BEHAR: You do, you do.
FALLON: See, you just ruined the whole night for me now. I was just going just to get drunk and just not remember what happened. And either way I was going to run on stage when "Modern Family" wins. And just go, hey guys, I just want to give a shout out to -- no. But no, last time--
BEHAR: You can thank Jesus. That`s always a pleasure.
FALLON: But I don`t think -- people don`t thank Jesus when they lose. They don`t go, hey, thanks a lot, Jesus. Could have helped that a little bit more, huh? Could have -- so I think we`re just going to go with the idea. I mean, I guess one in six nominees, so one in six chances of winning.
BEHAR: Yes, you got a chance.
FALLON: So you should actually think about what we`re going to say. I hate it when people get up there and go, I didn`t think we were going to win. It`s like, you had a better shot than I did. I was sitting at home, I didn`t even get nominated. So one in six chances of winning, yes.
BEHAR: Yes, exactly.
FALLON: So at least have something prepared. But we`re just going to go, we`re already having a party out there. It is going to be fun. And honestly, we didn`t even stress. When we first found out the nominations, I said to everybody, like, look, it doesn`t matter if we get nominated or not, we`re happy. So proud of our show. We have great people who work really hard. Then when it came in, everyone was like crying and hugging and screaming. Oh, my God!
BEHAR: Everybody`s excited.
FALLON: A bunch of mushes. Yeah, (inaudible), oh, my God, I hugged like 30 people before I made it to my office.
BEHAR: I love it when people cry. It`s just a statue, get over yourself. Let`s talk about the Jersey Shore for a second, because this premiered on Thursday and I know you love to spoof them. So let`s take a look at some of your work here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FALLON: The Jersey Floor is all about the lifestyle.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Back on the Jersey Floor, baby, whew!
FALLON: It`s like freaking paradise. I feel like I`m home here, I can be myself, I can dress the way I want to dress. You know, I do shots, I tan and I drink. STDs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FALLON: Shots, tan and drink. Yes.
BEHAR: That`s hysterical. That hairdo, though.
FALLON: That`s pretty awesome. Paulie D -- we have the best hair and make-up on our show. We work so hard. We do different like sketches, which is a lot of the other shows don`t do it. You don`t have to. We`re a talk show, really, so we don`t just have to. But we do things besides talk. We do sketches--
BEHAR: But that`s your thing.
FALLON: Yes. That`s what we -- I mean, from Saturday Night Live and all that stuff. Like Jersey Shore, I`m obsessed with that show. I think it is fantastic.
BEHAR: What do you like about it?
FALLON: They`re just so unlike me. It`s like watching sometimes going, I would never do that, I would never make those choices. I would never like -- you know, they drive by a club and it`s packed. And they go, that place is packed, we`ve got to go there. I`m like that`s the opposite of me. If I drive by a deli and I go, that has too many people in that deli. I want to go to a place where no one is. I don`t want to go to a bar and talk to anyone. I don`t want to -- so that`s the opposite of me. But I love them, I`m obsessed with them. We had a couple of them on the show, you know, Paulie D and Snooki and those guys. And I think they actually have good attitudes. I like Paulie D.
BEHAR: You like him?
FALLON: I like him. I think he`s got a good attitude, like look, everything might go away in like ten minutes from now. I don`t know. I`m just making all the money I can make now, you know?
BEHAR: He`s smart.
FALLON: Yes. It could all go away.
BEHAR: Doesn`t The Situation, or whatever his name is, doesn`t he say the same thing? They copy each other.
FALLON: A lot of people say that Paulie D`s abs are better than The Situation`s abs.
BEHAR: Stop it.
FALLON: That`s the real situation.
FALLON: I know, the end of the world. One of the four horsemen of the Apocalypse.
BEHAR: Now they want to Italy, to Florence, and you know, the Italians are like, get the hell out.
FALLON: I`m obsessed with it. It was great. Did you watch it? You don`t watch it.
BEHAR: I don`t really like the show that much.
FALLON: You don`t, no.
BEHAR: I grew up with kids like that, and they tried to beat me up, so I don`t like to watch them.
FALLON: It is like, it`s like watching -- but it`s interesting to see them on, in Italy. I think what MTV should do is just keep them for two months for the rest of their lives just going on some show, either on Jersey Shore or something, just see how they age and who they become. It`s like an experiment, like a social experiment. Remember that movie "Seven- Up?"
BEHAR: Yeah. "Seven-Up?"
FALLON: It was like some guy did -- it was almost like these little kids were 7 years old, and every seven years he would interview them again.
BEHAR: Oh, yes.
FALLON: And he kept doing it until one of them passed away recently. I mean, he`s running out of -- he`s getting to the end of their run.
BEHAR: It`s going to be called seven down.
FALLON: Fascinating, yes. Once it`s seven down, the movies are over with. No, yes, it`s all retrospect. It is a fascinating documentary to see how these kids grow up, who they ended up being. They kind of blamed the fame of these movies on how their lives ended up.
BEHAR: Wait a second, that`s a great sketch for you. Like do like 30 years from now all bloated and fat.
FALLON: Here`s The Situation. Like I got a real situation now.
BEHAR: That`s a great sketch for you. I love the fact that you can do sketches, because Letterman and Leno, to name but two, are just, they are stand-up comics. They are not like -- you have your whole experience as a sketch comic.
FALLON: Yes. I mean, yes -- Saturday Night Live and--
BEHAR: And yet you`re very charming and you can do monologues, so you really have a leg up.
FALLON: Well, I think it`s like even like Carson did sketches, too. Good or bad. He did you know--
BEHAR: His were hilarious.
FALLON: Yes, I mean, I loved them, so that`s -- have a thing like -- you have so much time to fill at night. So it`s like -- do you ever see when Ed Ames throws the tomahawk on Carson and he goes to pull -- the tomahawk lands between the cowboy`s legs. And Carson -- Ed goes to grab it, and Carson grabs him, like, oh, no, we`ve got an hour to kill, buddy. We`re going to milk this, we`re going to milk this for a long time. Oh, yes, yes. We`re going to look at that for a long time. He`s so smart. You have so much time to fill. So you think of these different weird things just to keep people awake. And I have great, great crew writers. Like we`ve been doing a lot of musical -- I do musical impressions. I used to do that in my standup act.
BEHAR: Like what?
FALLON: Well, I used to do, like say -- I do a Neil Young impression which a lot of people do.
BEHAR: You happen to have a guitar here.
BEHAR: I have a guitar. Yes. I can just show you the difference between like a Neil Young and a Bob Dylan impression.
BEHAR: OK. Oh, Neil Young is kind of like a depressant.
FALLON: Well, they`re -- Neil Young also it`s like, his harmonica is different too. Neil Young could be like, so say I`ll do the theme song of Fresh Prince of Bel Air as Neil Young.
BEHAR: Sure. Why not. As Neil Young. OK.
JIMMY FALLON (singing as Neil Young): This is a story all about how my life got flip-turned upside down. Like to take a minute just sit right there, tell you all how I became a prince of a town called Bel Air.
Now Bob Dylan, he just takes the highest part of the harmonica and just screeches it. And just keep blowing out. That`s all he does, that`s how he plays harmonica. So here is Bob Dylan doing a different theme song.
(singing as Bob Dylan): New boy in my neighborhood lives upstairs and it`s understood, he is just there to take good care of me like he`s one of the family. Charles in charge of our days and our nights, Charles in charge of our wrongs and our rights, Charles in charge -- (inaudible) -- Charles in charge, (inaudible). I want Charles in charge of me.
That`s the difference right there.
BEHAR: Very funny.
FALLON: So like, you know, I have got to give it to the writers on that. Like Mike DeSanto (ph) is the writer that wrote those ideas. Because I`ve done those impressions of those people. I can do impressions of a bunch of other people. But it`s the idea of--
BEHAR: You need a concept.
FALLON: You need a great concept. Where do you put them? It`s like, so he was like, what if Neil Young sang Will Smith, you end up -- or if I sang Willow Smith. I sang "Whip my Hair Back and Forth" as Neil Young. And then we got Bruce Springsteen to come on and put on a beard and wig and do that -- he used to go like, I was Neil and I`m going like, Whip my hair back and forth. He goes, you`ve got to whip your hair, got to whip your hair. Whip your hair!
And he was -- it was the most bizarre thing ever to get Bruce Springsteen to put a wig on. Or anything like -- I ended up using -- we did "Born to Run," I hosted the Emmies and we did a spoof of "Born to Run," like a Glee version.
BEHAR: Oh, really?
FALLON: Yes. It was fun. It was written by Amy Olsos (ph), a great writer. And so we did this bit. And it was a success for us. And then Bruce saw that and he was like, I want to come on Jimmy` show and we`ll do a little thing. What he wants to do, a bit or something? And then it was about 12 hours later, he is still talking. And then my dad -- he used to call me on the phone--
FALLON: To tell you he did an encore on the phone. And so then he said, he goes, I`ll bring like a, just get me like a floppy hat -- I used to wear a floppy hat in the `70s. And I`ll bring my own sunglasses. We`ll do that and it will be fun. So he came on the show and he brought his actual sunglasses from the "Born to Run" tour. And then we got him a floppy hat and he did it. And it was--
BEHAR: He`s the best. The Boss is the best.
FALLON: It was one of the most amazing --
BEHAR: OK. We`ll have more with Jimmy Fallon on the way. Sit tight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FALLON: It`s glamour time.
FALLON: I sound like MC Hammer. (inaudible). I`m having a ball right now. Can`t touch these. Or this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEHAR: You`re a stunning female.
FALLON: Yes, right.
BEHAR: Some guys put a wig on and they are really such a brute, but you are so gorgeous.
FALLON: It`s tough. Let me just say, just dressing up as a woman, I never had to do it on Saturday Night Live. It is so tough. I feel for you.
BEHAR: I know, believe me.
FALLON: The fake eyelashes and--
BEHAR: Holding the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) up is a -- is a major production.
FALLON: I mean, just the bra, I mean, you have got to put it on backwards and then turn it around. And then it`s all sorts of ways to get in your outfits. It`s like secrets. The whole thing is an absolute nightmare. Earrings are pressing against your earlobes. That has got to be some kind of acupuncture problem. I don`t know what it is, but I had flats, it`s like walking on cardboard with a gold medallion on the front. I go, this is nothing, I`m not getting any support here. It was a -- honestly, spanx. I mean, it was the whole thing. This was just to perform a comedy sketch. This is like--
BEHAR: This is just to go to bed.
FALLON: Not even going out anywhere. Exactly. I feel for my wife, my mother. I feel for everybody, my sister.
BEHAR: You know, before we talk about the book, which I think is hilarious, "Thank You Notes." I love this book. It is so funny. They were reading it beforehand and laughing out loud. It`s a wonderful, funny concept too. But before we go there, I want to talk about the late night situation, because George Lopez was on -- what was he on, "Piers Morgan" the other night or something, yes? And he was bashing Leno mercilessly. He put your name in there too, that you don`t like him, that Craig doesn`t like him. And nobody likes him. What is up with George Lopez attacking Jay Leno? Why?
FALLON: I don`t know. I like Leno a lot.
BEHAR: Of course you do.
FALLON: Leno`s great.
BEHAR: There seems to be -- ever since that whole thing with Conan, there has been a war against Leno, I perceive. What do you think?
FALLON: I don`t know, you know, I kind of jumped out of it. Because I`m just like--
FALLON: Yes. Exactly. I don`t know what it is going to do. I think everyone ended up --
BEHAR: Let the old guys fight with each other.
FALLON: Everyone ended up -- they have got great jobs, everyone is happy. I think they should be happy. They`re all working. Everyone is doing stuff. It`s like I -- I just kind of pulled out of that. It wasn`t -- it is sad that they had to fight in the first place, but again, it wasn`t my fight to fight.
BEHAR: So there is no competitiveness going on backstage between all the late night hosts?
FALLON: Maybe there is. Not with me. I`m not competitive at all. I`m friends with -- we`re playing kickball against the Daily Show tonight.
BEHAR: And you hope they win?
FALLON: I don`t hope they win. I hope to beat them at something. Yes.
BEHAR: How is it that you`re so non-competitive? What kind of mother did you have?
FALLON: I don`t know. I think I wasn`t -- I do like have a competitive spirit, but I feel like when it comes to ratings and show and all that stuff, you just do the best show you can do.
BEHAR: What else can you do?
FALLON: There`s nothing else I can do. Really, I can`t -- it`s all about -- it`s about your lead-in too, I feel like, I feel it goes from your lead-in. So I feel like people are gradually just falling asleep. So that`s like -- they put on NBC, they watch whatever they watch, then they watch Leno, then they start drifting, and I just happen to be on by the time you wake up for the Today Show. They go, hey, what? Where was I for the past 12 hours? So the ratings go down. I feel like it is gradual. That`s just the way it`s going to be. Our ratings have been great and all that stuff.
BEHAR: But you`re a hit. You`re a success.
FALLON: Yes. Things are working. Which was tricky for us, because when you`re replacing someone who has been around for 16 years, Conan was on for 16 years.
FALLON: Isn`t that crazy?
BEHAR: My God.
FALLON: So if you were used to that face on their television at that time of night, to have a new face in there, it`s like, I don`t know if I like this guy.
BEHAR: But they like you enough to keep you there so people can get used to your face.
FALLON: Yes. The Internet helped out a lot with that.
BEHAR: Oh yes?
FALLON: We did a lot of stuff because you know, Conan had to say goodbye, his farewell month. And all that stuff. And we`re just kind of waiting to go on and do stuff. So I don`t know how to practice. I don`t know how to do a talk show unless I practice. So I went on the Internet. Lorne Michaels and I were actually talking. He said you should go on the Internet. And I said, yes, and he actually sent it to the press, so that means we had to go on the Internet. So we went on the Internet. I had a video camera. We had two writers. And I would just talk to the video camera just like kids can do it right now from their house.
BEHAR: That`s a great idea.
FALLON: Live and just talk, hey, everybody. Today we`re setting up - - we are hiring writers. So here are the four packets, here`s one idea we thought was funny. You know, and just talk to my audience.
BEHAR: How did you get people to know -- to find you?
FALLON: Twitter, which was growing at the time. We said, hey, you guys, we`re going to go online. At 12:35.
BEHAR: So the fans came.
FALLON: Yes, the fans started coming, and then they were commenting. They were saying, like, hey, you know what, I don`t like the way your hair looks there. Or I don`t like this -- or I wouldn`t do that bit if I were you. And it`s like, and we took what they said. You don`t like my hair like that? I`ll put my hair like this. No, wait, that`s worse, go back to the old hair. OK, I`ll do that. So you know what, but then they will say like, you know, you should lose a few pounds. Or whatever -- but they can say whatever, but it`s like they can get harsh but whatever. It`s like, that`s what you get when you go into that world.
BEHAR: Well, they never get really that mean until you express your political positions. Then they turn on you.
FALLON: That`s a weird thing. Because I sent out -- we sent out jokes for the monologue. And we hit everybody. We hit Sarah Palin, we hit President Obama, we hit Joe Biden, we hit--
BEHAR: You have to go across the board when you`re a good comedian. Otherwise they turn. Now, listen, we`ll have more with Jimmy Fallon in just a minute.
BEHAR: I`m back with the host of late night, Mr. Jimmy Fallon. Let`s talk about this lovely book of yours. First of all, what made you decide to write a book that had thank you notes? Where did that come from?
FALLON: Every Friday, we do thank you notes. Where I write these sarcastic thank you notes. We did it as a one-off, and I just write these sarcastic thank you notes about mundane stuff in life that bothered me. And the audience loved it, and Twitter loved it, and FaceBook, they were like, you`ve got to do thank you notes again. So I was like, you guys, I think we have a hit, we have something, it`s wild. So we started writing--
BEHAR: How long have you been on the air?
FALLON: Two and a half years.
BEHAR: So it took you that long to come up with the bit.
BEHAR: It takes a while.
FALLON: It`s not easy, yes.
BEHAR: So tell me a couple.
FALLON: Sure. I`ll give you a couple. I brought--
BEHAR: Now, these are different ones from what you said on "The View," right?
FALLON: Yes. Of course. Yes. I brought some. You get exclusive ones here, Joy.
BEHAR: I want exclusives.
FALLON: Do you have any music? Or no, no music? Thank you.
BEHAR: There`s the music.
FALLON: Fantastic. Thank you very much.
Thank you microbreweries for making my alcoholism seem like a neat hobby. You got pumpkin ale.
Thank you, Real Housewives of New Jersey, for defending the one truism of the universe, that idiots like me will always watch idiots like you fight on TV. You will forever be on my Tivo. Thank you.
Thank you, guy with the $10,000 sound system in his $800 car for driving down Broadway this afternoon. You`re loud, you`re proud. You`re in a `93 Tercel. Thank you.
I have one more.
Thank you, dad, for discovering text messaging. I really like that text you sent with the smiley face, but not as much as the 27 blank text messages you sent right after. Kept me awake all night. Thank you so much, dad. Really appreciate it.
BEHAR: Oh, very funny. And you know something, Jimmy, the thing that`s funny about you is that when you deliver it on camera, you actually pretend you`re writing it.
FALLON: Am I faking anyone out?
BEHAR: The audience thinks you`re actually writing it.
FALLON: Yeah, come on. I know it. I think it`s all show business, right? Come on.
BEHAR: OK. Ben & Jerry`s I understand has named an ice cream, made an ice cream for you.
BEHAR: So we have it here.
FALLON: You want to try it? Be honest.
BEHAR: Let`s test this.
FALLON: So, here we go, this is -- guess what`s in it first. Have you eat it and guess what`s in it and then I`ll tell you what`s in it. It`s really good.
BEHAR: I see a nut. I see a nut. Not just --
FALLON: Ah, beat me to it.
BEHAR: That`s good. It`s not a nut.
FALLON: No. That`s the best part. You can play this game at your house. Is it a nut or not a nut? That`s the name of the game.
BEHAR: We play naked charades at my house, OK?
FALLON: Again, is it a nut or not a nut? You know--
FALLON: It`s a potato chip crushed up and covered in fudge so it doesn`t get soggy. And then a salty caramel swirl.
BEHAR: What`s it called?
FALLON: It`s called Late Night Snack. It`s by Ben & Jerry`s.
BEHAR: That is fabulous.
FALLON: And then the money, the proceeds that I was going to get for this is all going to Fair Trade Universities, because the fudge in this, the ice cream and the vanilla bean is fair trade. So it`s good for like developing countries that can`t hack it with the giant farms.
BEHAR: Very good. His book is called "Thank You Notes," and of course see Jimmy every night on "Late Night With Jimmy Fallon" on NBC. Thank you.
FALLON: Love you, Joy.
BEHAR: Thank you for watching. Good night, everybody.
FALLON: Good night, everybody.