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Nancy Grace
Aruban Police Detain Missing Woman`s Companion
Aired August 10, 2011 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Bombshell tonight. Another American girl goes missing, Aruba. After Aruba police refuse to make a case against judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot in the disappearance of American girl Natalee Holloway, Maryland tourist Robyn Gardner disappears without a trace from the very same resort town as Natalee Holloway.
As we go to air, reports American girl Robyn Gardner snorkeling just off Baby Beach, known for warm water and no waves, then, quote, "drifts out to sea." It`s incredible how American girls just drift out to sea in Aruba!
But in the last hours, we confirm not a single witness places Gardner at Baby Beach in the water or even snorkeling with snorkel gear. In fact, Robyn apparently one of the hair and makeup sort of girls who hates to even put her head under water in the pool.
Tonight, according to Gardner`s mother who travels to Aruba to find her daughter, Robyn`s so-called companion seems far from concerned and even tries to hop a plane out of Aruba. Tonight, we are live in Aruba.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A frantic search is on for Robyn Gardner.
GRACE: Another American girl vanishes!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is the same island that Natalee Holloway vanished six years ago from a beach.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gardner left with 50-year-old Gary Giordano.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A traveling companion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They went to Baby Beach.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very populated area.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) bring their diving equipment in, their snorkeling equipment.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This whole snorkeling story may not be true.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Apparently, the sea got rough. He couldn`t stand anymore.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They must know that this story is probably a lie.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s no proof and there`s no motive. I don`t see any motive here.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s a checkered past.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Domestic violence charges.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was, like, following me or stalking me, and it freaked me out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. We go live to Aruba as yet another American girl goes missing off Aruban shores.
Straight out to CNN correspondent Martin Savidge. Martin, what`s the latest?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Nancy, right now, authorities continue to question the prime suspect in this case, who is Gary Giordano. And here`s the issue they`re trying to get at.
As you have already pointed out, there were no witnesses that show the couple snorkeling, as he claims was the accident that took place in which Robyn Gardner vanished. So that`s what authorities are honing in at this particular point.
There was a meeting that just took place inside of the prosecutor`s office, this building very familiar to Americans because it`s been one that`s been seen over and over over the years for the Natalee Holloway case.
We also know that they have confiscated computers and smartphones. They`re being sent off the island. They`ll either go to Curacao, depending on the complexity that is needed to do an autopsy on those electronically, they may have to send them off to the Netherlands. They`ve also confiscated and impounded the rental car that the couple had. They plan in the next couple of days to do a forensic sweep of that vehicle to see if there`s any information. They`ve already looked into their hotel room, which was at the Marriott to the northern part of the island.
So that`s what the investigation stands right now. Clearly, authorities are doubtful of the story they`ve been told by their primary, as they call him, person of interest -- Nancy.
GRACE: Joining us live in Aruba is CNN correspondent Martin Savidge. Martin, we also learned that Robyn`s mother travels to Aruba, and she actually speaks with the traveling companion, Giordano, and he seems anything but concerned.
SAVIDGE: And this is a problem that authorities have noted and other people have noted, that he did not appear to be a man who was overly concerned about his traveling companion lost at sea. Why was he wanting to leave the country, when you would think that this person would be spearheading trying to find the young lady he was with, obviously that he would be very worried about whether she`s dead or alive? And yet he seemed to be more interested in leaving the country.
GRACE: With us, CNN correspondent Martin Savidge live in Aruba. We are taking your calls live from Aruba. Another American girl goes missing in Aruba off Baby Beach, known for warm water and no waves. Everybody knows snorkeling is done typically in shallow water. How could a ripcord drag this woman`s body out to sea?
Also, bombshell. In the last minutes before we go to air tonight, we learn not a single witness can corroborate seeing Robyn Gardner at Baby Beach in snorkeling gear or even in the water. Also, another bombshell. We learned from a local dive center right there at Baby Beach, typically where everyone rents their snorkeling gear or buys their snorkeling and dive gear -- it`s called Jads -- J-A-D-S -- Dive Center -- Robyn Gardner and her companion come into the dive center just before she`s reported missing.
To Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer. What do we know, Ellie?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right, Nancy. Well, they said that they did not rent dive equipment from them. They really only sell dive equipment, not snorkeling gear. They said they didn`t get any of that gear from them. From the looks of it, they didn`t have the right kind of gear to go snorkeling. And in addition, the dive team or dive store people say that the area they went is not an area where people would typically go snorkeling. They thought it was odd that they went into that area.
GRACE: Also, it`s my understanding that they came in, they go toward the restaurant area of the dive center, they eat, and they leave without buying or renting scuba or snorkeling equipment. That`s the day she disappears. So if she`s having lunch, Ellie, at Jads Dive Center, at or around Jads Dive Center at lunchtime, how is she supposed to go change clothes, get into snorkeling gear, go snorkeling, drift out to sea, and get reported at 6:30 PM?
JOSTAD: Right. And they were adamant about that at the dive center that they did not get any equipment from them. They said they saw them, but they didn`t rent anything from them.
GRACE: Joining me right now, Mark-Benson Denz from "The Aruba Herald." He is the CEO there. Mark, thank you for being with us again tonight. Weigh in, Mark. What are you learning there? We`re learning a lot on our end.
MARK-BENSON DENZ, "ARUBA HERALD" CEO (via telephone): Well, good evening, Nancy, and to your viewers. Well, we are learning that it`s a bit strange, that there are reports that they wanted to go snorkeling, which is what Gary says, the first day after their arrival, which was Monday. And they said they went to Baby Beach, but they did not go to snorkel. And so they returned the second day.
So it was as if Gary wanted to see the area first and then go into the water, as he says. But as you said, there are no persons that confirm seeing them in the water. There are persons confirming to seeing them on the beach, in the area, but not in the water.
GRACE: Joining us right now is a special guest out of Washington, Richard Forester. This is Robyn`s boyfriend. They had known each other for several years and had become romantic in the year preceding her going to Aruba on a trip. Richard, thank you for being with us.
RICHARD FORESTER, MISSING WOMAN`S BOYFRIEND: Thank you, Nancy. I`m glad to be here.
GRACE: Richard, I`ve read very carefully all the statements that you have made. And you seem to doubt whether she would have ever gone snorkeling to start with.
FORESTER: I`m 100 percent sure that she wouldn`t have gone snorkeling.
GRACE: Explain.
FORESTER: She is -- she`s -- as you mentioned earlier, she`s somebody that`s concerned about getting her hair messed up, getting her makeup messed up. At that time of night, she`s -- I would imagine, being in Aruba, she`s had a couple of drinks, going to be getting ready to go out for dinner at that point, go out for the night. She typically goes to bed quite early, 9:30, 10:00, 10:30 at night.
So it`s just not her. It`s just not here to go out and snorkel. I can`t see her snorkeling. I can`t see her going in the water much more above her waist. You know, she prefers to sit by the pool, have a drink from a waitress, when she gets hot, take a dip into the pool, cool off and come back out.
Now, being in Aruba, certainly, it`s beautiful there. The beaches are beautiful. She might go into the water for a dip in the water. But I know for a fact she`s not going out into deeper water. She`s just not that comfortable. She was a swimmer...
GRACE: Well, you know, Richard, that is not unusual. I mean, we all know people that we absolutely cannot picture diving or snorkeling. It`s just not...
FORESTER: I`ve lost you.
GRACE: Tell me when I get Richard back. There are people that are very much creatures of habit.
FORESTER: I lost you, Nancy.
GRACE: OK, Dana, let me know when he can hear me. In the -- oh, wait. Great, great, great. Hold on. When you get Richard Forester`s satellite back up, let me know.
Right now, I`m going to Martin Savidge, joining us again from Aruba. Martin, we`re getting a ton of information on Robyn`s habits, really, from her long-time friend and boyfriend, Richard Forester. He says she`s the type that would love to sit by the pool, have a drink when the waitress goes by, if she gets hot, take a little dip in the pool, maybe, you know, from the waist or the chest down.
Our sources tell us that she got her hair done, extensions, every other week, with glue. Let me tell you something, Martin. You`re not going to go snorkeling with glued-in extensions. That`s not going to happen, all right?
SAVIDGE: I take your word for it, Nancy. But it`s true, all the people we have spoken to will tell us that this is not typical for her, that she is not this sort of outgoing adventure woman. She likes going to vacation places, but as you say, she likes to look nice when she does it. So this is all taken into account, especially by investigators, when they hear a different take on this coming from the man who they have in custody at this point, Nancy.
GRACE: You know, Martin, a lot of information coming in even as we`re on the air. I understand that they`ve got the smartphones, they`ve got the computers. But apparently, there`s new evidentiary developments. One thing I`d like to find out, Martin, is when he comes to shore, some reports have been that he was already dried off. Now, from our police sources, we`re hearing that`s not true. Other sources are saying he`s dry.
Also, Martin, 6:30 PM is when he calls 911? It`s nearly 7:00 o`clock at night, and that`s when he says he first notices she`s not with him?
SAVIDGE: That`s raised a lot of eyebrows, Nancy, no doubt, the timing of which that phone call came in to 911, 6:29. It`s a resort island. Many people love to go to the beach. They`re here all day. But by 4:00 o`clock, 5:00 o`clock in the afternoon, typically, they`re wrapping up. They`re heading back to their hotels and getting ready to go out. Getting a phone call like that, police say, is another indicator the story just doesn`t seem right.
GRACE: Here`s the tip line, 407-237-2295. Another American beauty missing in Aruba.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Maryland tourist Robyn Gardner disappears without a trace.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She was with a traveling companion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her boyfriend, Richard Forester, realizes now Gardner jumped at a free vacation with a man she met on line. This woman ran into him.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was, like, following me or stalking me, and it freaked me out.
GRACE: This traveling companion says they were snorkeling as she floats out to sea.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, that would be very difficult to get swept out to sea snorkeling.
GRACE: It is incredibly ironic that this is the same resort area where Natalee Holloway went missing so long ago.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back. I`m Nancy Grace. Thank you for being with us. Joining us now is a special guest, Beth Holloway. We all know Beth, who went through so much in her effort to find her daughter, Natalee, not only a beauty but an honor student, beautiful on the inside, as well, Natalee missing all these years, the case still not put to rest. Beth Holloway joining us.
Beth, question. Do you believe that Aruban authorities will actually do what it takes to solve this case?
BETH HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S MOTHER (via telephone): I certainly hope so, Nancy. We think about all the hard lessons that I`ve learned. Surely, they`ve learned a few, as well, and will understand, and you know, act in an expeditious manner as possible in helping the family have a resolution into what happened to Robyn.
And you know, just listening to Richard describe her typical habits, and when you pair that with the timing of the call that came in from Gary and no eyewitnesses to place them there, I mean, it sure adds up to something not good was transpiring for Robyn.
GRACE: You know, Beth, as always, you`re such a lady and you put such a positive spin on everything. When you say that you hope Aruban authorities will do the right thing, and certainly, they have learned a lesson -- to this day, there are still no formal Aruban charges against Joran Van Der Sloot in the disappearance of Natalee.
HOLLOWAY: Well, I mean, you`re exactly right. But like I said, hopefully, you know, now they`ll understand, you know, how they have to respond to and handle cases and persons of interest and act with, you know, professionalism and really pull this together.
GRACE: You know, Beth, I pray that you`re right. Everyone, as you know now, Beth is at the helm of the Natalee Holloway Resource Center. They became involved in the case when Robyn goes missing. You know, Beth Holloway was just talking about what they need to do to find Robyn Gardner.
Everyone, another American girl missing in Aruba. It`s like history`s happening all over again, hopefully, without the same tragic result.
But what we have learned since last night, Rupa Mikkilineni, there is no active search even going on for Robyn now. Police have just packed it up! Now they claim it`s a passive search. What`s a passive search? I`ve never heard of that, a passive search for a missing person.
RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right, Nancy. The day that she went missing, police were out there in the water searching, divers, rescue teams, search and rescue teams, boats. But the search, the active search that we`re talking about, ended Saturday. And since then, they`ve been doing a passive search, meaning they think they`ve got their man that has the information as to what might have happened to Robyn Gardner. They are questioning him and they are interrogating him, and that`s what they mean by passive search.
GRACE: OK. Well, you know what? That is not encouraging because to this day, they still mistreat Natalee Holloway`s family. Beth won`t say that. I`ll say it for her. They still don`t give her straight answers. They still are not helping Natalee`s family. So you really till think that the Aruban authorities are out there trying to find Robyn Gardner? Yes, I don`t think so!
We are taking your calls. Out to Katie in Illinois. Hi, Katie. What`s your question.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Thank you for taking my call. My question is, did the boyfriend have any snorkeling equipment, or -- wouldn`t there be evidence that he went snorkeling?
GRACE: Good question. To Martin Savidge, CNN correspondent, joining us live in Aruba. What do we know, Martin?
SAVIDGE: Well, authorities here say that he had his own personal snorkeling gear, and that -- they`ve confirmed he didn`t have to rent it on the island. Apparently, he travels with it, brings it with him. And that they know. They have not found any snorkeling gear related to Robyn Gardner.
GRACE: And there is no indication she rented snorkeling gear, as well.
Take a look at Robyn Gardner, another American girl now missing in Aruba.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Robyn Gardner goes missing from the same resort town in Aruba where Natalee Holloway vanishes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Her boyfriend fears 35-year-old Robyn Gardner is dead.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Another American woman missing in the paradise island nation of Aruba.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A vivacious woman, full of life.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-five-year-old Robyn Gardner was reported missing on August 2nd.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But nobody reports that they were snorkeling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just don`t think that she was snorkeling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Forester originally thought Gardner went with a friend. Now he believes it was a romantic rival.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the story that the current supposedly carried her away, at least according to her companion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I feel in my heart that something happened at this person`s hand.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is so calm, so tranquil. Baby Beach is named Baby Beach because of the fact that you could take your baby there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Welcome back. We are taking your calls. And live in Aruba, another American girl missing off Aruban shores. According to them, she drifted out to sea. It`s amazing how that current seems to grab American girls and take them out to sea whenever they go to vacation in Aruba.
I want to go back to Richard Forester, Robyn`s boyfriend here in The states, joining us tonight from Washington. Richard, you were describing before we lost you on satellite that she`s not the kind of person to go snorkeling at all. She`s not a water person. She`s not into that at all. She likes to sit by the pool and chill. What more can you tell us about this trip? What happened?
FORESTER: You know, I wish I knew. I wish I knew. I can maybe understand, you know, being in a beach like that, where she might go into the water up to her waist or so, but that`s about it. The sand was beautiful. You know, she could enjoy the beach. But she`s definitely more of somebody who would, you know, stay by the pool and enjoy that and not get salty, not get sandy. That`s just how she is.
She likes to run. She likes to play tennis. And she likes the beach, sure, but I just don`t see her going into the ocean that much. You know, from what I understand from somebody who I spoke to in Aruba, this location is pretty much on the other side of the island. It`s a very remote area, where there weren`t -- you know, where most people don`t go. I`ve got serious reservations about Mr. Giordano`s story. From what I...
GRACE: Well, let`s take a look at Giordano. Ellie Jostad, what do we know about Giordano? What did I hear about a woman on a first date with him and that he suddenly gets rough with her and throws her down...
JOSTAD: Right.
GRACE: ... on the ground?
JOSTAD: Right. That`s right, Nancy. This is a woman who met him on a dating site. She told one of our affiliates in D.C. that she met him on line. They go on a date. She says she thought he was physically aggressive. At one point, they were just strolling along, looking at some horses, I guess in a pasture or something. And she says he threw her on the ground. She also said later, when she tried to touch his hair, he yanked her arm away very hard. And she found his behavior just completely bizarre.
GRACE: And this is on top of complaints from two separate women who sought court orders against him to protect themselves.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Robyn Gardner was on vacation in Aruba with a male companion, Gary Giordano.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The last message I got from her was, We`ll talk and sort things out when I get back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIFENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: In the mystery surrounding her disappearance. A frantic search is on for Robyn Gardner, a Maryland woman who disappeared in Aruba.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Now, another blonde beauty goes missing from the same resort town.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The same island that Natalee Holloway vanished six years ago.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gardner left with 50-year-old Gary Giordano. Suspect in Robyn Gardner`s disappearance.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The A checkered past.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Domestic violence charges, a restraining order and numerous complaints to the online dating services.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Following me or stalking me. And it freaked me out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My client has been detained as a suspect in a murder investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Baby beach is named baby beach because of the fact that you can take your baby there. It is so calm, so tranquil.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just don`t think they were snorkeling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Went swimming and the sea got rough.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Something happened at this person`s hand.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was nowhere to be seen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This story just doesn`t ring true at this point.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRACE: We are live in Aruba and taking your calls. Another American girl goes missing off the shore in Aruba according to sources. But as we go to air tonight, not one single witness can even place this girl in the water with snorkeling gear anywhere around the area where she was allegedly last seen.
I want to go back out to Ellie Jostad. I want to focus for a moment on the man that was snorkeling with her, Gary Giordano, an American. I know his divorce. I know he`s got three teen boys, two younger, one older. What else do we know?
ELLIE JOSTAD, EDITORIAL PRODUCER, THE NANCY GRACE SHOW: Right, Nancy. As you mentioned, he has had two different women, one and ex-girlfriend, one and ex-wife, requests what they call peace orders in Maryland, eventually a protective order. The girlfriend, and this was just filed last year, Nancy, she says that he threatened to terminate her. He also told her that the world would be a better place without her in it and that he could help with that.
But even more disturbing, Nancy, she claims in court documents that he was under investigation for multiple acts of stalking and threatening women. She claims as well that he was taking, without her knowledge, pornographic images of her and posting them online.
GRACE: And this is the guy that somehow Robyn Gardner meets up with and goes snorkeling with?
Richard Forester, you know her better than practically anyone outside of her own family. How did this happen?
RICHARD FORESTER, BOYFRIED OF ROBYN GARDNER: I can`t even say. I don`t know. It is mind blowing to me. Obviously, it is a huge shock. I can`t understand it myself. My biggest concern is that you know we find her, we find her safe, and deal with that afterwards. I just want her back here. I would love to have the opportunity to have that discussion with her. That`s the only thing that I`m concerned about. Yes, sure, I`m angry that she`s off with another man, unbeknownst to me, but that`s the least of my worries right now.
GRACE: But you know Richard Forester, everything is not always as it appears, right?
FORESTER: Correct.
GRACE: We don`t note circumstances around this. We don`t know why she went, why she suddenly got wild here and decided to go snorkeling or went to Aruba. We don`t know what she was thinking.
FORESTER: She`s an adult. She`s not married. She`s free to do what she wants. I`m not her captor. I don`t own her. She`s free to do what she wants. You would think with the relationship we have that that wouldn`t happen, but -
GRACE: Richard, did you ever think this guy, in her mind, was just a friend, and that she maybe didn`t want to tell you about it because she thought you wouldn`t believe that and, she thinks hey, there`s nothing wrong with me going to Aruba, it is a free trip, I want to get out of town. I`m going to go.
And then, isn`t it true that right after she really gets out of town, she puts on her Facebook, "this sucks". Then writes you and says, hey, I love you, I want to work everything out with you when I get home. And that was the last posting that we know of, right?
FORESTER: She had put that "this sucks" posting on my wall at 2:00 in the morning on Tuesday morning and I didn`t know what that meant. So I was trying to figure it out. I didn`t get it until I got to work in the morning. So I was trying to e-mail her and the message I got later on in the day at about somewhere between 2:00 and 3:00 in the afternoon was, "yes, let`s work this out, we`ll talk when I get back" and that was the last I heard from her.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers, Sue Moss, family law attorney, New York. Daniel Horowitz, defense attorney, San Francisco, Bradford Cohen, defense attorney, Miami.
Weigh in, Susan Moss.
SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY AND CHILD ADVOCATE: One question is this older coot related to Van Der Sloot as the very similar and very similar and his story doesn`t add up.
What do you mean he didn`t report her missing until 6:30 p.m.? What was he waiting for low tide? You got to be kidding me. This is not a woman who owns her own snorkel gear. His story is not going to hold up and they are going to arrest him.
GRACE: You know, it is interesting, Daniel Horowitz, in all the times I`ve dived, by 6:30, you`re coming back in except for one dive trip I took, a night dive, and I`ll never do that again. Why are they just coming back at 6:30 from being out in the water?
According to her, he, quote, "taps Robyn`s foot to tell her, you`re going back in, then gets back in and looks up and goes, whoops, she`s gone". What about it, Daniel?
DAN HOWORITZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, you know, I`ve been in the water at all hours of the day and night and you see different things. If it is night, you bring a flashlight. What really bothers me, Nancy -?
GRACE: Back it up. You just can`t throw out a line like that and get by me, Horowitz. If it is at night, you bring out a flashlight.
HOROWITZ: Right. I`ll bring a flashlight.
GRACE: And she just got to pull it out of her ear?
HOROWITZ: Come on. Nancy, this is a guy that has snorkel gear. He could bring a flashlight.
GRACE: No, you come on. There was no indication he had a flashlight. I can`t believe you even said that. Try to get serious.
HOROWITZ: Let me tell you something, when it comes to Martin Savidge, I`ll believe it. If it is coming from the Aruban authorities, they covered up the Holloway case, they would be very happy to have an American responsible for this and not one of their own. So don`t trust what comes from Aruba. If Martin says it is true, I believe it. Otherwise, don`t buy it.
GRACE: Hey, did anybody tell you I trusted Aruba police? I don`t trust anything they say after what they did with Natalee Holloway`s case.
HOROWITZ: All right. And who`s giving me this information, is it Martin Savidge?
GRACE: No, actually we`re getting it from a plethora of reporters, of - behind her family, her boyfriend, many, many people are giving us the same information, including information that we just got as we go to air from JADS Dive Center that they were there just before she goes missing. They didn`t get snorkel equipment, dive equipment. In fact, they didn`t even go into that area. They went over to the restaurant area and ate.
Weigh in, Cohen?
BRADFORD COHEN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Here is the thing. Number one, the flashlight thing, I don`t know about the flashlight thing. It is 6:30 at night, even in south Florida the sun doesn`t go down. People dive late. That, to me, is not that questionable. The sun doesn`t go down until 7:30, quarter to eight and people dive late. And sometimes they prefer to dive at that time. That`s number one. Number two is -
GRACE: Cohen, let me ask you a question, Bradford.
COHEN: Sure, you can ask me anything, Nancy.
GRACE: Hold on. Have you ever dived that late?
COHEN: Yes.
GRACE: Where?
COHEN: I have.
GRACE: Where?
COHEN: In fact, I prefer to dive later because there is not that many people out.
GRACE: Where?
COHEN: In South Florida.
GRACE: Where?
COHEN: In South Florida. And in -
GRACE: No, no, no, no. When? When were you out diving as it approached 7:00 p.m.? And what dive outfit allowed that? Were you equipped for night diving? Is that what you`re saying?
COHEN: No, it was snorkeling. Snorkeling, you don`t need a dive outfit. You have your snorkel gear on and you have fins on and you go out. It is not that big of a deal.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 35-year-old Robyn Gardner recently lost her job, a live-in relationship grew sour.
FORESTER: An issue I have to deal with.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Forester reads his final e-mails from Gardner over and over the day she disappears. It haunts him, cryptic, this sucks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 35-year-old Maryland woman Robyn Gardner.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In Aruba, the search for Gardner continues.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: This is the same area where Natalee Holloway went missing so long ago. We`re taking your calls. Another American girl missing in Aruba?
I want to go straight to Dr. Marty McCarry, Physician and Professor of public health at Johns Hopkins.
Let me ask you this, Marty. If she drowned, and her body is found this many days later, she goes missing, we believe August 2, would you be able to tell whether she drowned in saltwater or tap water?
DR. MARTY MCCARRY, M.D., PHSYCIAN PROFESSOR OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS: She would, actually. An autopsy would give a lot of information. You know if somebody struggles underwater, the epiglottis or the valve in the back of the mouth will be spasm and you can tell a lot from the air in the lungs and the type of water that still retained inside the lungs.
In addition, you can look at lacerations and other signs of struggles. But let`s remember, it is very rare for anybody to die during a snorkeling event. Snorkeling is shallow. The first instinct of any person is to go immediately to the surface of the water and though there is some basic precautions somebody should take, it is very rare for anything to go wrong.
GRACE: Now, it is interesting you say that, Dr. Marty, how rare it is for someone to drown snorkeling. Could you explain the reasoning behind that statement?
MCCARRY: Well, there are very few hazards within, say, five to ten feet below the surface. And we caution all people not to touch marine life, to avoid rip currents and if they feel a rip current immediately go to the surface and always go with a partner. And, of course, this situation may be a good lesson that you need to go with a partner that you trust.
GRACE: You know Marty; in this case, the baby beach area is extremely mild, hardly even in any waves. I see Martin Savidge.
Martin Savidge, I want to hone in on where it was he says they were snorkeling? Describe the area.
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, baby beach, popular beach, public beach, so it is frequented by a lot of people, many locals. And as you already explained, it is known because of the fact that it is a very safe place to go.
But they were actually behind them, Dan Key Country Club. This is a little bit separate from Baby Beach. The question mark here is were they looking for something a little more secluded, did they want to get away from the public and if so, who was saying we should get away? That is still uncertain at this particular time. So they were about a short walk away from the main Baby Beach.
GRACE: With me, in Aruba is Martin Savidge, CNN correspondent.
To Woodrow Tripp, former police commander. Woody, I want to hear your analysis of what we`re hearing tonight, the fact that no witness places her with even having snorkeling gear, going into the water into the ocean water. And we managed to track down JADS Dive Center and discover they had been in the dive center, right before she goes missing, but they didn`t get any snorkel equipment, in dive equipment. But all they did was eat.
WOODROW TRIPP, FMR. POLICE COMMANDER: Nancy, it is obvious at this point, snorkeling is out of the question here, one. Two, there are so many unanswered questions now about this companion. Three, I would be looking at right now all of the electronic surveillance that these hotels and this one in particular has to have.
GRACE: It is a casino, Woody. A casino.
TRIPP: Absolutely. There is surveillance equipment.
GRACE: Cameras, yes. Go ahead.
TRIPP: And that`s what I would be looking at. I would want to see, when did they leave? Did they leave together? Did he come back by himself? What exactly went on with that? It is obvious that he invited her there. And with that being the case, then he set this up.
My next question is, who else, who else is he associated with there? You know how did this trip come about? There are a lot of questions there that have not been answered, but it is obvious apparently to all of us other than the Aruban police is that she wasn`t swept out to sea.
So the whole facade and wild goose chase is just a waste of time. We know she didn`t get swept out. Why didn`t he get swept out? Nancy, I grew up in Florida. The ocean, one person doesn`t get swept out and another doesn`t. That`s ludicrous.
GRACE: To Michael Gast, the founder of the national academy of police diving. Michael is joining us tonight out of Miami.
Michael, if she washed away, drifted out to sea as Aruban authorities are saying on August 2, wouldn`t her body have washed back in by now?
MICHAEL GAST, FOUNDER, NATIONAL ACADEMY OF POLICE DIVING: It is most likely it would have depending how the currents and the prevailing winds would be, how the waves are hitting the shore? It got long shore currents that could move them up and down the shore.
GRACE: But still, back to shore?
GAST: That`s correct.
GRACE: Michael, what do you make of the story of someone dying or drifting out to sea when they`re snorkeling?
GAST: That`s just so unlikely. First of all, that late in the afternoon, they would have lost a lot of the light to see anything deeper than 10 or 15 feet. So they would have been snorkeling in shallower water, instead of the deeper water. That would be a max. And snorkeling is usually done where you`re not going to be working, if you got a current, you have to stay close and not go somewhere and try you know to overpower yourself to where you`re going to get tired.
GRACE: To Dr. Leslie Suppinni, Clinical Psychologist joining us out of L.A.
Dr. Leslie, I`ve been listening to a lot of discussion about this case. And it seems a lot of people are making her, Robyn, out to be the bad guy because she has a boyfriend, who loves her, and she went on this trip.
You know what? We don`t know a darn thing about this. We don`t know if he didn`t say, "Hey, I got a free trip. I got my Marriott points and I can take somebody with me. You want to go, as friends? You want to go diving, you want to go snorkeling? You want to go sit by the pool and just take a break?"
How do we know that`s not what happened? How do we know he did want more than she could get? She writes her boyfriend and says, "Hey, I love you, I`m coming home, let`s work everything out". Why is she, somehow painted as the bad person in this scenario? I`m not buying that.
DR. LESLIE SUPPINNI, PSY.D, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: You know, it is human nature in relationships to, especially they have had a history of arguing recently, her and her boyfriend, and then a little tentative breakup prior to that, it is normal for people to go on social media and talk to somebody, reach out to somebody, see what else is out there, see if it is any better than what we have now, that`s normal, normal behavior in this situation.
GRACE: I mean, Leslie, can`t you just see her getting down there and taking a look at this guy, Giordano and going, what was I thinking? I got to get home.
SUPPINNI: Right. Here`s the issue. Obviously she felt that way or she wouldn`t have been writing at 2:00 in the morning this sucks. OK. So she obviously went out, check it out, maybe a free vacation that happens all the time. You don`t tell your spouse everything and you wind up going off.
The issue here is his backgrounds. My concern is his background of having two court orders, the first with his first wife in which she claimed domestic violence and she got custody of the children. Then he had two other girlfriends who have come forward and said, hey, look, we were afraid of him too, domestic violence issues there, one of these girlfriends who also had a court order. Then we have another person saying, hey, look, I had a first date with this guy and he threw me down and smacked my hand away when I went to touch him.
So we`re looking at somebody who has been building over time a history of violence. He started off with emotional abuse with his wife and now physical abuse with girlfriends and other people as they went along. And that`s dangerous.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Sue Moss, Daniel Horowitz, Bradford Cohen.
Daniel, I`m not saying he`s guilty of anything. Let me see the lawyers, please.
But what I am saying is when you don`t know a horse, look at his track record. Don`t know a horse, look at his track record.
HOROWITZ: Well, Nancy, you`re right to the extent that it makes him a suspect. I give you that. But then again, there are no actual acts of severe violence.
GRACE: Daniel, why am I even asking you anything when you say she pulled out a flashlight? She pulled out a flashlight out in the middle of the Aruban Ocean.
Everybody, take a look at this girl. Robyn Gardner, from Frederick, Maryland. What a beauty yet another American girl missing off the shores of Aruba.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPOFRTER: According to report, Gary Giordano says the two were snorkeling.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He said a current pulled her out to sea.
FORESTER: All I can imagine is she was screaming for me, and I wasn`t there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: Welcome back. We are live in Aruba. Another American missing off Aruban shores. To Mark Benson Denz, CEO of Aruba Herald.
Mark, isn`t it true that a car has been seized, the car they were traveling in, the I pad? What else can you tell us about the investigation if what steps are being taken?
MARK BENSON DENZ, CEO, ARUBA HERALD (via telephone): That is correct, Nancy. The car, the rental car that they were driving has been impounded, which they are searching, and also a computer device has been impounded also. And they hope to get some more clues from this information.
As the lawyer from Gary, decided to recommend him to keep quiet, and not to talk much.
From the investigation, we understand that Gary is saying to the police and to the investigators and his client that he is completely innocent, and he wants this thing to be cleared up as soon as possible because he wants to go home. That is something very strange as he is very eager to just go home.
Also, we understand from very, very good sources that yesterday the FBI was contacted. We do not have the information as to how they will be involved in this case, but this case has been a very high priority from everyone in Aruba to be solved as soon as possible, and that`s why I am informed that the FBI has also been informed of this case.
GRACE: Special thank you to Mark Benson Denz and Martin Savidge.
Let`s stop and remember Marine Private First Class Shelby J. Feniello, twenty five, Connellsville, Pennsylvania, killed in Iraq, lost his life on a mission to rescue other marines injured under fire.
Awarded the Purple Heart Navy and Marine for achievement medal, National Defense service medal. Loved outdoors, skiing, club, fishing. Lit up a room when he walked in, with a big heart. Leaves behind grieving parents Richard and Kim, stepfather Bill.
Shelby Feniello, American hero.
Thanks for our guest lists, especially to you.
And happy birthday to New Jersey friend Joan. Loves the New York Yankees, baking and playing her family version of "survivor" on Easter and cooking a huge Christmas meal for her big Italian family.
True love? Grandchildren Katie, Jenny, and Michelle. Happy birthday.
Also happy birthday to Kristen, a writer who loves her three children, Jack, Caroline, and Alexa.
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night. 8:00 sharp Eastern.
And until then, good night, friend.
END
