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Nancy Grace
2nd Search Finds Blood in Bashara Family Garage
Aired February 09, 2012 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Wife and mother Jane Bashara laid to rest as residents in one of America`s wealthiest towns pour into the local funeral home. Jane`s body found heavily bruised, fingernails missing, dressed in black slacks, green shirt, bedroom shoes, her body wedged down between the front and back seat of her 2004 Mercedes SUV. Tonight, after an alleged girlfriend and a so-called sex dominatrix emerge, Jane`s husband, the president of the local Rotary Club, says he`s innocent and goes to the funeral.
Bombshell tonight. In the last hours, human blood found in the family`s garage. A handyman comes forward, implicating Jane`s husband, "big Bob" Bashara, as his attorney claims openly Bob and Jane had a, quote, "open marriage," and Jane, now dead, was, quote, "OK with that."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bob Bashara.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Man at the center of his wife, Jane`s, murder investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was he involved?
BOB BASHARA, HUSBAND OF MURDERED WOMAN: Absolutely not. Had nothing to do with it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you hire someone to kill your wife, Jane?
BASHARA: No, I did not.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is there any motive that you could have had to kill your wife?
BASHARA: None whatsoever. We had a very good, open relationship.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The term "open marriage" comes to mind.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you having an affair?
BASHARA: No, I was not.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you involved in S&M?
BASHARA: No.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) or slave (INAUDIBLE) been to his parties.
BASHARA: I did nothing wrong.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`ve made some major progress.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The significant discovery there at the home.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What they found in the garage, human blood.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) guy.
BASHARA: No (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He says he was paid to kill your wife.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have a good afternoon.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In a bizarre twist, Bob Bashara`s handyman has confessed to the crime.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joe killed Jane Bashara while Bob Bashara held a gun to his head. How much sense does that make?
BASHARA: I don`t own a firearm. That is a sick assessment on his part.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, an 18-year-old teen disappears from a local coffee shop. Was the girl`s kidnap caught on video?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where is Samantha Koenig? Authorities are frantically searching for an 18-year-old girl.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One terrifying clue. She was last seen on a surveillance camera being marched away from work by an armed man.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Cops say surveillance video shows an armed man, wearing a dark hooded sweatshirt and possibly a baseball cap, abducting her and taking her away.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They left on foot. We know that much. But beyond that, her disappearance became a complete mystery.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There`s been no sign of her since. Reports are Samantha filed for an order of protection against a man last November. Police are now trying to determine if that`s connected to this case.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Surveillance video has police saying she has been kidnapped by a man she didn`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know if my daughter`s being fed, taken care of, if she`s still alive, if she`s getting any sleep!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. In the last hours, human blood found in the Bashara garage. A handyman comes forward implicating Jane Bashara`s husband, "big Bob," as his lawyer claims openly Bob and Jane had an open marriage and Jane, now dead, was, quote, "OK with that." Not only does an alleged mistress emerge, but so does an alleged sex dominatrix who claims that Bashara hired her to run a sex den in one of his rental properties.
We are taking your calls. I want to go out to George Hunter, crime reporter with "The Detroit News." You know, all of the drama aside, what I`m hearing, as former prosecutor -- I`m thinking nuts-and-bolts prosecution -- the big news is that there is allegedly a finding in the Bashara garage of not only blood but hair.
GEORGE HUNTER, "DETROIT NEWS" (via telephone): Yes. Supposedly, Nancy, blood and hair were taken during the second search, which occurred yesterday. And that`s what the case is going to hinge on because the police that I spoke with said that they don`t believe Joe Gentz`s confession, the handyman`s confession...
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa! George, hold on! Hold on!
HUNTER: OK.
GRACE: Let`s don`t put the cart before the horse.
HUNTER: All right.
GRACE: I know all about Gentz, a handyman that emerges, implicating Bob Bashara, the husband. I also know he`s got the mind of a 3rd grader. And I know this. I know that will cops let him out after 72 hours. Now, what does that say? That they don`t believe he pulled the trigger. I guarantee you, if they thought he pulled the trigger, he`d be behind bars tonight.
So George, let me get back to the blood and the hair, and then I`m going to hear about the handyman.
HUNTER: Right. They tie together...
GRACE: Blood and hair.
HUNTER: ... Nancy. The blood is what is going to -- the police tell me they`re waiting on the serology tests because they don`t believe the confession is enough, that Mr. Gentz`s confession is enough. He went in there and told them that he was hired to do this, and the police they`re waiting on lab results because that`s not enough, that he told some bizarre stories in addition to the main story.
So they went in yesterday. It was the second time they searched, and they focused this search on the garage. The first search, a lot of the focus was on an upstairs den, and they were shuffling through papers. They took computer hard drives out of the house.
This time, it focused more on the attached garage, where the -- you know, my sources told me the killing actually took place. And they took out a bunch of stuff, including, I`m told, two-week-old blood, reportedly, and some hair. And it`s been sent to an out-of-state lab to be tested because here in Michigan, the forensic lab is so backed up, sometimes murder cases have to wait up to six, seven months before the...
GRACE: OK, hold on. Let me ask you some specific cross-examination questions. With me, George Hunter from "The Detroit News." George, blood was found in the Bashara garage. Yes or no.
HUNTER: Yes.
GRACE: Do we know where in the garage?
HUNTER: I don`t, no.
GRACE: Are any sources telling us, confirmed or not confirmed, where? Was it on the floor? Was it on the walls? Was it on the doorstep? Was it on the garage door? Any idea where it was in the garage? And that`s a very critical question.
HUNTER: Again, no.
GRACE: OK. Hair. Sources are telling us that hair was also found in the garage. Do we know that? Yes or no, George.
HUNTER: Yes, it`s been reported, yes...
GRACE: OK...
HUNTER: ... that hair was found. But I don`t know where.
GRACE: All right. What about the length of the hair. Any idea?
HUNTER: All I can tell you is that hair was purportedly found. Beyond that, I don`t have any clue as far as where and length or color or anything.
GRACE: OK, with me, George Hunter from "The Detroit News." The bombshell tonight, not only does an alleged girlfriend and sex dominatrix emerge in connection with "big Bob" Bashara, Jane`s husband, but also, and more critically to a case, allegedly, blood and hair found in the Bashara garage.
Out to Joe Gomez, senior investigative reporter, KTRH news. Joe, what can you tell me?
JOE GOMEZ, KTRH: Yes, it`s very strange, Nancy, because, of course, we know that Jane was found viciously murdered in the back seat of her Mercedes SUV six miles away from her home in a Detroit alleyway. She had, apparently, a foot mark on her neck. She was viciously strangled, bruises all across her body...
GRACE: Wait a minute.
GOMEZ: ... and her fingernails...
GRACE: Wait a minute!
GOMEZ: ... chipped off.
GRACE: Gomez, when you say...
GOMEZ: Chipped off, Nancy!
GRACE: ... a foot mark, are you saying dirt or mud, evidence of a foot mark, or was she bruised with a foot mark?
GOMEZ: I`m telling you that she was bruised with a foot mark, Nancy. It`s kind of like -- she was strangled, so somebody -- somebody viciously attacked this beautiful mother of two...
GRACE: Well, Gomez, you see that with a foot mark to the neck, that absolutely proves she was not killed in the Mercedes 2004 unless somebody swooped in from Cirque du Soleil and contortioned into that position. There`s no way you can get a foot mark on her neck in this car.
So what I`m telling you is the scene was staged. If there was a foot mark on her neck, she was not killed in the 2004 SUV. She was not killed in the SUV at all. It was staged.
And another thing about the staging -- I`m sure you`re familiar with Eight Mile (ph) with Eminem? All right, somebody took this woman to be what they perceived as a bad area and dumped the car, OK? It didn`t happen there. Nobody from that area killed Jane Bashara. They would have dumped the car somewhere out of their area. Hello! So somebody moved her car to what they thought or perceived was a bad area. She was not killed in that car.
All right, Gomez, what more do you know?
GOMEZ: We know that she had chips on her fingernails, Nancy, implying that she was in a desperate fight for her life. Now, furthermore, her husband, Bob, apparently denies having anything to do with the murder, but we also know that he is admitting that they had an open relationship, Nancy, some sort of an open marriage, and that they...
GRACE: Well, Gomez, I don`t want you`re saying he admitted it, like it`s a crime. In this country, you can sleep with whoever you want to, and typically, it`s not a crime. So what I find very interesting, though, is I don`t know if Jane Bashara knew she was in an open marriage.
And what you can tell me about this alleged girlfriend? Did Bashara - - and I`m getting a little ahead of myself here. Did Bashara offer to buy or put down a down payment for a home for another woman?
GOMEZ: Now, those are what the reports indicate, Nancy, but Bashara says that that`s not true at all. And he actually refuses to even talk about the woman.
GRACE: I guess so. OK, Gomez, if George Hunter doesn`t know this, I`m sure nobody does, except the police. Gomez, do you know where in the garage the blood and the hair was found? Because, I mean, it is her garage. If she ever slipped and fell and bled -- there are a million reasons why hair could be found there in the garage, and blood. So I`m trying to get a handle on, was it blood spatter, was it a drop from a nosebleed, was it part of a slip and fall.
Where was the blood? What was the pattern of the blood? And where was the hair? Do you have any idea, Gomez?
GOMEZ: That`s a crucial piece of information. Police are staying tight-lipped on that.
GRACE: OK. To Natisha Lance, also on the story. Natisha, what more do you know?
NATISHA LANCE, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, as far as this hair that you were talking about, in the search, the previous search at the home, cadaver dogs were taken through that home. So Bob Bashara is saying her finds it fishy that two weeks later, that then police would find blood in the garage.
GRACE: Well, let`s talk about that just one moment. To Dr. Bill Lloyd, board-certified forensic pathologist. Dr. Lloyd, about the cadaver dogs. If she were living at the time of the blood spill, wouldn`t the cadaver dogs still hit on that blood?
DR. BILL LLOYD, SURGEON AND PATHOLOGIST: The cadaver dogs, Nancy, would only recognize decomposed cells. So no, it would be premature for that. It`s not sure whether she died in the garage, died someplace else. But it appears that the body itself was dumped into the Mercedes and then taken to a distant location.
GRACE: Even if cadaver dogs may not have hit on it, although they do hit on, for instance, Band-Aids in a trash dump, if there`s blood on them. They`ll hit on that. So I`m trying to determine, to work out the scenario in my mind -- a scent dog, a bloodhound, would have hit on the blood, I`m sure. What about that, either a cadaver or a bloodhound would have hit on the blood, right, Dr. Lloyd?
LLOYD: (INAUDIBLE) DNA evidence.
GRACE: Absolutely. OK, unleash the lawyers, Eleanor Odom, Jason Oshins, Penny Douglas Furr. Jason Oshins, weigh in. Where does the whole open marriage fit in with the blood and the hair in the garage?
JASON OSHINS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t know that there`s a connection between -- the open marriage is certainly a sexy topic of conversation. It certainly throws in the other woman, and that`s always going to be a heavy-duty topic. I don`t know that it ties into anything.
GRACE: You know what? I didn`t ask you about heavy-duty topics. I don`t care. I`m not writing a novel. I want to find out who killed Jane Bashara. And right now, nobody`s under arrest, and I want to know why.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He has not been running. He has not been hiding. He`s been answering the tough questions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you kill your wife, Jane?
BASHARA: Absolutely not. I had nothing to do with it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bob, can you tell us about the polygraph? Bob?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know Joe, Bob.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have a good afternoon. That`s our statement.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police will not comment on what was in the bags or the boxes. But both agencies were handling the Jane Bashara murder.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you kill your wife, Jane?
BASHARA: Absolutely not. Had nothing to do with it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Both our families grieve.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you hire someone on kill your wife, Jane?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And in the light of this horrific event, ask for your continued prayers.
BASHARA: No, I did not.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As we deal with this heartbreak.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the guy`s not telling you everything he knows.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And tonight, emerging not only an alleged girlfriend, Bashara, reports say, financed a home purchase with, but a so-called sex dominatrix with connections to Bashara.
More concerning to me is the handyman that comes forward that claims he was forced to take part in Bashara`s murder.
Joining me right now is the ex-wife of the handyman, Joseph Gentz, who allegedly confesses to killing Jane Bashara, a beloved mother and high- level executive. With me is Lorrie VanMeter. Lorrie, thank you for being with us.
LORRIE VANMETER, EX-WIFE OF JOSEPH GENTZ (via telephone): Thank you.
GRACE: You were married to Joseph Gentz. What do you make of him coming forward and volunteering that he was part of the murder and cops letting him go?
VANMETER: I was struck by the fact that he confessed to the murder in the first place, and then I was even more shocked when the cops let him go.
GRACE: What do you make of it? We`ve heard reports that he has the mind of a 3rd grader. Is that true?
VANMETER: He`s slow. He`s not -- I wouldn`t say it`s the mind of a 3rd grader, but he is developmentally challenged.
GRACE: Why would he come forward in a case like this if it were not true?
VANMETER: I can only assume that he was coerced into doing it.
GRACE: And what do you mean by that?
VANMETER: If somebody told him they would give them a lot of money or he would get a big reward out of doing it, then he would say he did it. He would do it for the attention.
GRACE: Lorrie, how long were you guys married?
VANMETER: Two-and-a-half years.
GRACE: Did he ever display a violent temper during that time?
VANMETER: Never.
GRACE: Never. But you think he may connect himself to this in the hopes of a financial reward?
VANMETER: Yes, or attention.
GRACE: For attention?
VANMETER: Yes.
GRACE: Why?
VANMETER: He just -- he likes being the center of attention. He likes having all eyes upon him. And he likes to have -- for everybody to notice him.
GRACE: Do you know the cause of his learning disability?
VANMETER: From the way it was explained to me, his mother had abused him severely when he was a child, and that may be part of the reason that he is learning-disabled.
GRACE: Do you think he has the capability to fabricate a story like this and hold up under police questioning?
VANMETER: Only if somebody told him exactly how to do it, step by step by step how to do it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What the administrator told me was that it is in his opinion Bob Bashara did not kill his wife.
BASHARA: I thought she was running an errand, and when the time elapsed, it got to be 9:00, 9:30, I became -- and she wasn`t answering her phone, I became very concerned.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The sudden and tragic loss.
BASHARA: I feel her every day. And I miss her terribly.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wife and mother was strangled to death.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Killed Jane Bashara.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bob Bashara had nothing to do with his wife`s death.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bob, did you kill your wife, Jane?
BASHARA: Absolutely not, had nothing to do with it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Looks like he`s hiding something.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What happened to Jane Bashara, and who may have killed her?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Tonight, a major development in solving the murder of a beloved mother and high-level executive, Jane Bashara. Tonight, we learn blood and hair found in the Bashara garage. Not only that, a handyman comes forward claiming to be part of the murder, implicating the husband, the husband now saying through his lawyer he and his wife had an open marriage and Jane was, quote, "OK with that." And an alleged girlfriend and sex dominatrix come forward with connections.
What I don`t quite understand -- and joining us is Lady Geanna, a professional dominatrix who claims Bashara called her to host S&M parties. What I don`t quite understand is her connection to this case. But let`s talk to Lady Geanna now.
Ma`am, thank you for being with us.
LADY GEANNA, PROFESSIONAL DOMINATRIX (via telephone): Hi. How`re you doing, Nancy? I`m a big fan of you and the twins.
GRACE: Well, I appreciate that, and I`ll pass that on to the twins after they`re 21, and I`m sure you know why.
LADY GEANNA: OK.
GRACE: You know, Lady Geanna, let me ask you this. What is this business about Bashara asking you to host S&M parties? What did he want you to do exactly?
LADY GEANNA: Well, basically, he called me -- it was before Halloween of -- October of `10, and asked me if I`d be interested in hosting his Halloween S&M party. And at the time, I declined due to health reasons. I wasn`t able to. But I told him...
GRACE: Now, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Lady Geanna, do you mean, like, everybody dresses up...
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: ... costume party, or do you mean actual deviant sex activity party?
LADY GEANNA: OK, it`s really not sex-related. That`s (INAUDIBLE) for what I do. I`m a professional dominatrix, so I do not have sex with my slaves, or my clients, whatever you want to call them. Basically...
GRACE: OK, what did he want you to do? I`m just a lawyer, OK? So explain to me what you were supposed to do and how much was he willing to pay you?
LADY GEANNA: Basically, we didn`t talk about the price, but my sessions start at $200 an hour and up. We -- basically, I would go there, bring a couple of my slaves, and would get the party going, dressed in leather. Everybody would be dressed in leather at a party like this. And then there`d be, like, demonstration booths (ph) where I would spank or whip or do some bondage or candle wax.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BOB BASHARA, HUSBAND OF MISSING MOM JANE BASHARA: And the focus needs to be on finding Jane`s killer.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Questions are actually increasing about her husband`s side of the story.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you dabbed your eyes. But we didn`t see tears.
BASHARA: I just dabbed my eyes because I thought there was a tear. I don`t know. It`s just a natural kneejerk reaction.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And now about a handyman who worked for him.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Joe Gentz having implicated himself in the murder of Jane Bashara.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Gentz told WDIV, I have a heart of gold and I`m honest. I just want the truth to come out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And now a dominatrix has entered into the fray and said that he`s a regular at S&M clubs.
BASHARA: Don`t believe what you hear. This has been sensationalized.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Then there`s a mistress who`s now been added to the mix.
BASHARA: She was a good friend. That`s it.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Tonight there`s still no charges.
BASHARA: I loved my wife. She meant everything to me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That remains to be seen.
With me now and taking your calls, a professional dominatrix who claims Bashara called her to host his S&M party. Lady Geanna out of Detroit is with us.
Lady Geanna, you were approached by him to host this party. Now, your fee is 200 bucks an hour. And what were you supposed to do for Bob Bashara?
LADY GEANNA, PRO DOMINATRIX WHO CLAIMS MURDERED MOM`S HUBBY CALLED HER TO HOST S&M PARTY: Basically, Nancy, I would bring a couple of my slaves to participate, some gentlemen who were open to the scene. And what I would do is do some demonstrations of bondage and discipline, whipping, spanking, using candle wax, doing things like that.
Basically when you have a party, you just -- anything kind of goes. As far as the S&M, people participate on the slave. They can spank them, tie them up, whip them, that type of stuff. You know he basically just wanted me to bring my name into it because I`ve been an active player in the underground world for over 20 years. So I would definitely brought a response to people. People would have came there to see and participate in playing with me. But it didn`t go that far. We didn`t get to that point.
GRACE: Can I ask you what the cage is for?
LADY GEANNA: To put the people in. I put my slaves in there and I tie them up.
GRACE: And do what?
LADY GEANNA: Just leave them in there by the side to keep them overnight or just let them sit there. I keep them tied up in there and bound and gagged, just -- they like the silent time and the bondage, and the sensory, deprivation. I just -- I create --
GRACE: And you get paid for putting them in a cage and letting them sit there?
LADY GEANNA: Oh, yes. Yes. I also get paid for people to -- that want to come in and do a flip worship session --
GRACE: OK. All right. All right. This is not an infomercial. Question. Did you have any connection or any conversations at all with Jane Bashara?
LADY GEANNA: None at all, Nancy.
GRACE: Was Jane going to be at this party?
LADY GEANNA: As far as I know, yes. It would have been a big party, so they -- he was an active player at his parties.
GRACE: How do you know that?
LADY GEANNA: Through some clients that have contacted me and that have experienced parties with Bob.
GRACE: What do you mean by that, experienced parties with Bob?
LADY GEANNA: They`ve been -- they`ve been to the parties.
GRACE: Was Jane at the parties?
LADY GEANNA: Yes, from what I understand, she was at some parties. Yes.
GRACE: And this is coming from your clients?
LADY GEANNA: This is coming from some of my clients that have been --
GRACE: OK. I`m going to take that with a box of salt.
All right. Lady Geanna, with us.
Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, prosecutor, death penalty qualified, Jason Oshins, defense attorney, New York, Penny Douglass Furr, defense attorney, Atlanta.
All right, Eleanor, I`m more concerned about the blood and the hair. Everything else is tangential. You and I both know from trying a lot of cases you don`t have to give a jury a motive as to murder. That`s not the state`s duty to crawl in some killer`s head. But I think that between Lady Geanna and the good friend he was helping buy a home by plunking down a down payment, all of these are reports yet to be proven in a court of law could provide a motive.
ELEANOR ODOM, FELONY PROSECUTOR, DEATH PENALTY QUALIFIED: Oh, Nancy, it provides motive all over the place which is what the jury wants to hear. And when we hear the term open marriage, come on, Jason Oshins, you only heard that after this murder happened. And they bring this up and they start trashing the victim. Putting the blame on her rather than looking at who we should arrest for this murder.
GRACE: You know, that`s an important point. But first to you, respond, Oshins.
JASON OSHINS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Listen, it`s always convenient for law enforcement to look at a sexy -- no pun intended, a sexy scene with a dominatrix. And you know kitty in the box.
GRACE: I don`t think blood and hair is that sexy, Oshins.
OSHINS: We don`t know whose blood or hair that is. That`s a garage, an entrance. That`s a common walkway. They went --
GRACE: No, no, no. It`s not a common walkway. Look at the screen.
OSHINS: Yes, but, Nancy --
GRACE: It`s inside the Bashara home.
OSHINS: I understand.
GRACE: People aren`t walking in off the street and falling down in the garage.
OSHINS: No, but certainly Mr. Gentz and any workman or anyone for that matter coming in. And they searched this 11 days ago. That scene has been contaminated. I don`t care what they find at this point.
GRACE: You know what?
OSHINS: This is a defense dream.
GRACE: Don`t start up with me, Johnny Cochran.
All right, Penny Douglass Furr, I heard the word contamination. Weigh in, Penny.
PENNY DOUGLASS FURR, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, I bet you would probably find my hair and my blood in my house and I`m not everyone dead. So I just don`t know since it`s where she lived, she`s there every day. I don`t know that that`s going to be strong enough.
GRACE: Yes, really?
DOUGLASS FURR: For them to arrest him.
GRACE: And your husband, Ed, probably doesn`t believe in an open marriage and isn`t contacting Lady Geanna and putting down a down payment for a home for a female good friend either, Penny.
DOUGLASS FURR: But Nancy, it was a Halloween party in 2010. It`s not like he`s doing it every weekend.
GRACE: You know what, put her up. Put her up.
Penny.
DOUGLASS FURR: Yes.
GRACE: Yes, a Halloween party, but what Halloween party have you been to where you personally take out a whip and start beating people?
OSHINS: Don`t answer it, Penny.
(LAUGHTER)
OSHINS: I`m not into S&M, so I will --
GRACE: So I will take that as none.
You know, to Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Dealbreakers." It`s easy to focus on, for instance, Lady Geanna, or the alleged girlfriend. But Jane Bashara is a mother of two. She`s dead. And I don`t care how old you are, whether you`re a 4-year-old little boy or girl like my children, or whether you`re a grown up like me, nobody wants to lose their mother. So it`s fun for everyone to make fun of the S&M and the girlfriend and all that.
We`re talking about murder. And murder is not like what you see on TV, they glamorized version of murder. It`s horrible. Now I want to hear you weigh in, Dr. Bethany.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": Well, what I think we`re really talking about is the way in which a perpetrator contemplates and obsesses about homicide prior to the act. When I think about Big Bob`s sex party, it`s as if he was already trolling for sexual and romantic partners. When I hear about the other woman he had an affair with, he was probably already on some level scheming and planning as to how to get the money to put the down payment on her house without having to go through a divorce. Without having to the --
GRACE: Yes, which is a problem for him, Bethany. Because not only was she bringing home the bacon, she was frying it up in the pan.
MARSHALL: Right.
GRACE: She was doing it all. She funded the home, not him.
MARSHALL: And he was throwing parties in the basement of his business. I would be interested in asking the sex slaves, did he have a particular fondness for cruelty? I mean Lady Geanna just leaves her slaves in a cage with sensory deprivation. What did Big Bob do? Did he love to spank and hit?
You know perpetrators of homicide often are very sadistic and at that party, did it fill over into biting, hitting, putting clothespins on people. I mean, I think the cruelty could be an important clue into this for possible alleged perpetrator`s mindset.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What happened to Jane Bashara and who may have killed her?
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Did you kill your wife Jane?
BASHARA: Absolutely not. Had nothing to do with it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the guy`s not telling everything he knows.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Did you hire someone to kill your wife, Jane?
BASHARA: No, I did not.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Gentz turned himself in to police, afraid that he would be Bob`s fall guy for Jane`s murder.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Frankly at this point we don`t know what Mr. Gentz is capable of.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joe killed Jane Bashara while Bob Bashara held a gun to his head. How much sense does that make?
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Changed his story now at least --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: He`s right, that scenario does not make sense. This handyman Gentz comes forward, Joseph Gentz, 48 years old, Bashara`s handyman allegedly confessed. He was Bashara`s accomplice.
To Dr. Bill Lloyd, Bill, as a forensic pathologist, you have seen hundreds of murders as have I. What`s your assessment?
DR. BILL LLOYD, FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: This is what I know, Nancy. Murder is untidy. When two healthy people go at it, there`s going to be a struggle. There will be evidence and clues throughout the death scene. And Nancy, when it`s amateur murder, it becomes especially untidy.
GRACE: What do you mean by that, Lloyd, amateur murder? I mean I know this woman put up a fight. I can tell that by the autopsy reports where she was actually missing fingernails.
LLOYD: Exactly. In a professional murder, a murder for hire, with somebody who really knew what they were doing, there`d be very little evidence and a very thorough clean up. Not here. There was a real struggle. Maybe an element of surprise. And enormous bruises across her body. It was -- the attacker was directly on top of her and trying to strangle or trying to choke her. Her voice box was crushed and of course as we heard earlier there was a stamp of a boot directly on her throat creating a bruise. It was a horrendous struggle and as you mentioned it did not happen inside of the Mercedes.
GRACE: To Jack Harris, former Phoenix police chief.
Jack, the handyman Gentz coming forward claiming that Bashara held a gun to him and made him kill his wife. They may let him walk? He`s only behind bars 72 hours and he walks free? That doesn`t compute, Jack.
JACK HARRIS, RETIRED PHOENIX POLICE CHIEF: Well, in cases like this that are very high profile with a lot of media attention, it`s not terribly unusual to have a suspect come forward and say that I committed the murder, I played part in the murder when they really didn`t. So that -- all of the information that is passed along to them has to be proven to the detectives.
GRACE: And what this all mean at trial is it`s not good for the state.
Eleanor Odom, Jason Oshins, Penny Douglass Furr.
Jason, because now if they don`t believe the handyman, the defense has the perfect -- the perfect beard. They`re going to go, my guy didn`t do it, the handyman did it. He tried to confess.
OSHINS: Absolutely. And here you have this -- Mr. Gentz, a man with diminished capacity, admittedly so, seeking the limelight. It`s not a good case either way, Nancy.
GRACE: Eleanor?
ODOM: Well, Nancy, let`s think of one clue that`s been left behind. And that`s a print of the foot. I bet the cops are working right now to try to match that. And Nancy, think about that. That body had to have been on a hard surface to get that deep of an impression. You couldn`t get that if the person was standing and just kicking them. So to me that`s going to be one of the key pieces of evidence.
GRACE: Penny.
DOUGLASS FURR: You can find the surface and you can find the murder scene, I think they`ve got a much better case. If not, I think they can almost forget it with this other guy admitting to the crime.
GRACE: I`m frankly wondering if the murder didn`t take place somewhere else, the fact that she had bedroom shoes on her clearly shows she came home from work, we`ve got her at work at 4:00 documented. By 8:00, it`s all over. She came home, got bedroom shoes. They didn`t find blood or hair evidence in the home to my knowledge.
Out to you, George Hunter, with the Detroit News, it could very well be that the murder scene is somewhere else, but she was put into the SUV in the garage because with a struggle like this, George, you would think there may be even more blood.
GEORGE HUNTER, CRIME REPORTER, THE DETROIT NEWS: Well, this was a choking, so you know, I mean, it wasn`t a -- she wasn`t shot. The blood may have -- investigators I spoke with speculated the blood may come from the struggle. She was scratching him. It might be whoever choked hers blood. The key piece of evidence that investigators I spoke with are weighing on is possible DNA under her fingernails. Her fingernails were broken, so if there`s skin under the fingernail, then that would pretty much implicate whoever did this.
GRACE: So Joe Gomez, senior investigator, KTRH, has Bob Bashara been named a suspect or a person of interest?
JOE GOMEZ, REPORTER, KTRH RADIO: As far as I understand, Bob Bashara has been named a person of interest. His attorneys believe that he`s about to be arrested any minute, in fact Bob says he`s afraid he may spend the rest of his life in jail, Nancy.
GRACE: The tip line, 313-822-7400.
Right now, a teenaged girl abducted from a local coffee shop. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police and volunteers are braving subfreezing temperatures in an all-out search for 18-year-old Samantha Koenig.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Eighteen-year-old Samantha Koenig was closing up the coffee stand where she worked when cops say surveillance video --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Surveillance video --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: -- shows an armed man abducting her and taking her away.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: One terrifying clue. She was last seen on a surveillance camera being marched away from work by an armed man.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A teenage girl abducted by an armed man who was robbing the drive-through coffee shop where she works.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: There`s been no sign of her since.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police saying she has been kidnapped.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Where is Samantha Koenig?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The longer we go without knowing where Samantha is, the more difficult the case becomes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Samantha`s father, James Koenig. Mr. Koenig, what are the cops telling you tonight?
JAMES KOENIG, FATHER OF MISSING TEEN GIRL, ABDUCTED FROM COFFEE SHOP: So far they`re saying they have made significant progress. They`re starting to get better leads. Other than that, that`s about all they`re giving me.
GRACE: To Lieutenant Dave Parker from the Anchorage Police Department.
Lt. Parker, thank you for being with us. What is your theory as to what happened to Samantha?
LT. DAVE PARKER, PIO, ANCHORAGE POLICE DEPT.: Right now we know that Samantha was abducted from that little coffee shop. And we know that her abductor came into the coffee shop and that he took her out against her will. We`re operating on that theory and getting a lot of leads in and things like that that are helping us investigate the case.
GRACE: Well, obviously it is someone that either knows her personally or frequents the coffee shop.
To Lt. Parker, what time of the day or night did the abduction take place?
PARKER: The abduction took place about 8:00 p.m. on last Wednesday night.
GRACE: Was it dark?
PARKER: Beg your pardon?
GRACE: Was it dark at the time?
PARKER: It was dark but it`s a lighted parking lot.
GRACE: Is -- to Matt Zarrell. Matt, is there surveillance video and isn`t it true that the guy was wearing a hood?
MATT ZARRELL, NANCY GRACE STAFFER, COVERING STORY: Yes, Nancy, there is surveillance video. The guy was wearing a hood. They believe he was armed. He had something in his hand. They`re trying to determine if it was a gun or a knife, what type of weapon it was.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police and volunteers are braving sub-freezing temperatures in an all-out search of 18-year-old Samantha Koenig.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Eighteen-year-old Samantha Koenig was closing up the coffee stand where she worked when cops say surveillance video --
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: New surveillance.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: -- shows an armed man abducting her and taking her away.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: One terrifying clue, she was last seen on a surveillance camera being marched away from work by an armed man.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A teenage girl abducted by an armed man who was robbing the drive-thru coffee shop where she works.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: There has been no sign of her since.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police saying she has been kidnapped.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Where is Samantha Koenig?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The longer we go without knowing where Samantha is, the more difficult the case becomes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: A beautiful 18-year-old girl goes missing from a local coffee shop.
Straight out to Matt Zarrell on the story.
You know there`s only about 280,000 people in the entire area. I mean, clearly this is somebody connected to her. I know in November she took out a TRO against the guy. Any connection, has that been investigated, Matt?
ZARRELL: Yes, there are reports that police are looking into whether this man that she filed the civil restraining order against back in November is connected to the case. I know that Samantha`s father has said he believes that the attacker possibly knew Samantha or likely knew Samantha.
Police have reportedly spoken to the guy. They`re still trying to determine if there`s any connection. This is not her current boyfriend, though, I just wanted to make that clear. And they`re still working to determine the suspect.
One thing we know about him, dark-hooded sweatshirt, possibly a baseball cap. They`re also just trying to determine if he acted alone, if he had help. Maybe someone else was waiting for him to take the girl back wherever they were going, Nancy.
GRACE: Back to Samantha`s father, James Koenig.
James, it`s my understanding that at one point you could see the skin on the hand and we know it is a white male, is that correct, James?
JAMES KOENIG, FATHER OF MISSING TEEN GIRL ABDUCTED FROM COFFEE SHOP: No, Nancy, that is not correct. I have not seen the video. I was not anywhere near to give visual on the perpetrator.
GRACE: Could you --
KOENIG: And let it be known as well as the TRO, that was not a former boyfriend, that was an acquaintance.
GRACE: OK. Good to know. Mr. Koenig, what is your theory as to what happened to Samantha?
KOENIG: I believe that she was abducted, the person that had taken her out of the coffee shack, I don`t believe she knew the person.
GRACE: Do you think it was a customer?
KOENIG: No, I do not. I believe they came their specifically for her. I believe the person was connected with somebody she knew.
GRACE: There is a $60,000 reward in the case. Please help us find Samantha. Tip line. 907-786-8900.
Let`s stop and remember Army Staff Sergeant Jessie Clowers, Jr., 27, Herndon, Virginia, killed Afghanistan. Bronze Star, Purple Heart, Meritorious Service Medal, NATO Medal. A Virginia Tech grad, loved adventures, friends, family. Leaves behind mother, Joyce, and sisters Christy and Nikki, widow Katherine, son Jessie. Daughter Danielle, whom he never got to meet.
Jessie Clowers, Jr., American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you. And happy birthday to a little New Jersey crime fighter, Patti.
Happy birthday, Patti.
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
