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Nancy Grace
Untreated Seizure Disorder Causes Car Crash Killing Family of Five
Aired June 14, 2012 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight, live, Colorado suburbs. A 33-year-old mom, with two children in tow, careens her Ford SUV across a cement median, flips into the air to crash land onto a family of five, including three little children, ages 12, 9 and just 7 years old, leaving all five, the entire family, dead. After killing five, Mommy then plows into a local mattress store.
Bombshell tonight. Prosecutors say this was, quote, "no accident." The deadly crash wiping out an entire family is all because Mommy refuses to follow doctor`s orders. That`s right, our investigation reveals Mommy had at least five seizure episodes, that we know of, one only six months before the deadly crash. She was told point-blank, Don`t drive.
Listen, we`ve already got drunk drivers. We`ve got high-speed chases on the roadways. Now we got to worry about Monica Chavez landing on top of our mini-vans!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She plowed her SUV into this car, killing an entire family.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-three-year-old mother of two Monica Chavez.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She apparently had a seizure, her SUV suddenly speeding out of control.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She reportedly suffers some sort of seizure-like activity.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She hit the median and went airborne, killing Randy and Crystaldawn Stollsteimer and their three children.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Prosecutors say Chavez should never have been behind the wheel. A doctor...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He allegedly told her to go see a neurologist.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He says he verbally told Chavez to refrain from driving until cleared by a neurologist.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The mom never sees one.
GRACE: Under our constitution, you don`t have to go to the doctor, but driving on the street, on the road, is a privilege, not a right. And she`s risking my life and my children`s life. And that`s not OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why was she even behind the wheel?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is negligent homicide.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A doctor was so worried about Monica Chavez`s possible seizure...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Based on the history and my findings, the likelihood was that this was probably a seizure.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, prosecutors portray Chavez`s failure to see a neurologist as negligence that contributed to a fatal accident.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening, I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. Live, to the Colorado suburbs. Prosecutors say this crash was, quote, "no accident," the deadly crash wiping out an entire family all because Mommy refuses to follow doctor`s orders. Our investigation reveals Mommy has had at least five seizure episodes, that we know of, and one of these episodes was just six months before the fatal crash.
Very simply put, she was told point-blank, Don`t drive. And now it has cost the lives of an entire family of five, including three children ages 12, 9 and 7 years old.
We are taking your calls. But right now, straight out to Nia Bender, Clear Channel reporter in Denver. Nia, what happened?
NIA BENDER, CLEAR CHANNEL DENVER (via telephone): Well, Monica Chavez was headed southbound on a very busy road and came to a stop light, apparently. Her daughter reported that her mom began shaking and that she was having trouble breathing. And then Monica Chavez claims that her foot got stuck on the gas and she ended up putting the gas pedal all the way down.
She was doing, oh, somewhere right around 75 miles an hour at that point, hit a car, and then ended up hitting the median, ended up going airborne and then came down on top of a small Chevy S-10 pickup truck that contained the family.
GRACE: Nia, right now, we`re showing photos of the family members, the mom, Crystaldawn, the father, Randy, the little children, Sebastian, Darrian and Cyrus.
Describe to me, Nia Bender, joining us from Denver Clear Channel, what happened in the crash? I understand that she careened across a -- two lanes, across a cement median, up into the air and landing on top of the family`s vehicle?
BENDER: Directly on top of the family`s vehicle. And what had happened is, she gained enough speed -- and this will tell you how fast she was going there. She hit a car, and then hit the median. The median had a slant to it, so that helped launch her vehicle airborne. And it did come down directly on top of the family`s truck, and then she rolled into the front of a mattress store -- her vehicle.
GRACE: You are seeing video from KDVR of the fatal crash. And again, prosecutors say, Don`t call this an accident. This was no accident. This is a multiple homicide, according to local prosecutors.
So Ellie Jostad, if somebody passes out at the wheel, typically, that is deemed an act of God, that they couldn`t help it. But that`s not what prosecutors are alleging.
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right, Nancy. They say that this could have been prevented if Monica Chavez had followed doctor`s orders back in 2006. Then, she had another episode where she actually lost consciousness.
She was treated by a doctor. That doctor told her on the written forms that he sent with her when she was dismissed from the ER, he said, No driving until cleared by neuro, meaning neurologist. She, according to prosecutors, did not go to a neurologist, kept on driving.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, Eleanor Odom, prosecutor out of Atlanta, Seema Iyer, defense attorney, New York, Peter Odom, defense attorney, Atlanta.
All right, Peter Odom, give me your best shot.
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, first of all, the prosecutors have to prove that she was having some kind of a seizure. If she acknowledged that, then it might be easy to prove.
But you know, unless she was directly ordered by the doctors not to drive, then even that might not even lead to criminal liability. She might have been negligent...
GRACE: OK...
PETER ODOM: ... it might lead to a lawsuit, but that`s not the same as criminal recklessness.
GRACE: All right, Peter, let`s just go through the facts that you just outlined because all of your facts are wrong. Number one, the doctor, as I have already told the viewers -- and I believe you`ve got an IFB in your ear -- she was ordered point-blank, Do not drive, by doctors and nurses, number one.
PETER ODOM: How long before? How long before? And that makes a difference. If she can show that it was months before, years before, then she might have felt that it was OK to drive...
GRACE: So now...
PETER ODOM: ... and that might not amount to criminal recklessness.
GRACE: Now your -- now your argument is backsliding. You`re going, Oh, well, OK -- now you`re saying she was ordered not to drive, but maybe it was so long ago, it didn`t matter. Now, let me go...
PETER ODOM: Nancy, I`m dealing with the -- I`m dealing with the facts.
GRACE: ... the rest of your original argument -- as am I dealing with the facts. You also say unless she agrees or admits she had a seizure -- well, her daughter described, as a state`s witness, the seizure that her mother had.
Not only that, Eleanor, she had no drugs or alcohol in her system that I know of, and her last seizure-type episode was just six months before this crash.
She had one seizure at a grocery store, where everyone saw it and that was documented. She had another seizure at McDonald`s as she was leaving to go rent a video. She had a seizure in her kitchen. She had another seizure at her home that her daughter describes and then this seizure, where she kills a family of five.
And Eleanor, you and I -- I as a former prosecutor, you as a current prosecutor -- when I first heard these facts, I went, Look, you can`t hold this woman liable for having a seizure and a crash. As sad as that may be, it`s nobody`s fault.
But when I started reading the facts, Eleanor, that`s not all the facts. A nurse comes on for the state and says, point-blank, I told her to see a neurologist, I told her not to drive.
ELEANOR ODOM, PROSECUTOR: Exactly, Nancy. It`s just like -- it`s as bad as going to the bar, having a bunch of drinks and getting behind the wheel! She is that dangerous with her history of seizure and with her knowledge of this. And she knew she wasn`t supposed to drive, or she was to have a complete medical check before she got behind the wheel. She`s guilty of homicide.
GRACE: OK, now, back to you, Peter, before I go to you, Seema Iyer. As he`s talking, Liz, let`s see the footage of the crash. And I want to see the family of five, including the little boy age 7 years old.
Now, Peter, that you are hearing another rendition of the facts, what did you say your defense would be?
PETER ODOM: Nancy, my defense is the same as it was when you originally asked me. There may be civil negligence here. This is a horrible tragedy. But it is not criminal negligence. Not every tragedy can result in someone going to jail. I`m sorry.
GRACE: That`s not what you said originally. Seema Iyer, what he said originally was the mom would have to admit she had seizures. And let`s see, what was the other one -- there was some other -- oh, and how long had it been since her last seizure. It`s been, that we know of, as recently as six months.
SEEMA IYER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, you keep misstating the evidence, and that is they are alleged seizures. So now you`re telling your viewers that there were five seizures. That is incorrect. That is not proof beyond a reasonable doubt.
And furthermore, you opened the show saying "doctor`s orders." Well, Nancy, again, with all due respect, that`s misstating the evidence. These are not doctor`s orders. Doctor Brian Williams had in his notes issues about the neurologist, not conveying that to a prescription, to a patient and saying, This is an order.
It is not an order. And you cannot expect your patients to be as clinically and medically aware as you are as a physician. So again, misstating the evidence. This is not proof beyond a reasonable doubt. And in fact, I don`t think it`s a homicide.
GRACE: All right, let`s keep Seema Iyer up. And could you bring in a three-box?
Ellie Jostad, I`m reading straight from court documents, Ms. Iyer, as you are alleging I`m misstating the facts. Here are the facts from the court documents.
You know what? I don`t see Seema Iyer or Ellie Jostad. There you go. All right, because I want to make sure I can see Seema as I read from official documents.
The discharge papers to Chavez that she signed indicate, Do not drive until you are cleared by a neurologist. Also, nurse states, "I told her repeatedly, Do not drive." Dr. Williams has stated he was almost positive this was a seizure. If there had been another seizure, he would be completely positive.
And the reality is, Seema Iyer, is that she, the defendant, knew about all these other episodes and point-blank would not follow doctor`s directions. Now, I`m reading directly from court documents. Are you suggesting the court is wrong, that these people under oath are lying, Ms. Iyer?
IYER: I`m suggesting, Nancy, that you`re exaggerating the magnitude of these statements. I mean, you`re talking about Dr. Brian Williams...
GRACE: I`m reading -- no, no, no! No, no! I`m reading them point- blank. How is that exaggerating?
IYER: Because number one, the discharge summary is not the same as a prescription written by a...
GRACE: No, no, no, no! No, no!
IYER: ... doctor, an order...
GRACE: No! You answer me!
IYER: Got it. I`m looking (ph)
GRACE: Point-blank, you answer me! How is reading sworn testimony an exaggeration? Do not claim that these witnesses -- and I`m reading from what they say -- is perjury. Now, how is their testimony exaggeration?
IYER: Because the nurse now is saying that she repeatedly told Ms. Chavez to see a neurologist. Those are statements made years later. We don`t know that the nurse actually did that.
GRACE: But how are you saying...
IYER: That is why it`s an exaggeration.
GRACE: ... me reading sworn testimony is an exaggeration?
IYER: I`m saying that the sworn testimony is an exaggeration. We cannot be sure of any of these facts.
GRACE: Ms. Iyer...
IYER: Yes, Nancy?
GRACE: ... if you dare to suggest that these witnesses, a neurologist and a hospital nurse, are lying under oath -- is that what you`re saying?
IYER: Well, think about it, Nancy. They`re probably going to be sued for malpractice at some point...
GRACE: No, I`m asking you, are you saying they`re lying. Because first of all, you said I had...
(CROSSTALK)
IYER: I said exaggerating.
GRACE: First of all, you said I had a misstatement of facts. Those were your words.
(CROSSTALK)
IYER: It is a misstatement of facts. Your screen that comes up on your show says "alleged seizures." So factually, they are not seizures. You`re putting them forth as...
GRACE: Are you...
IYER: ... alleged seizures.
GRACE: Are you an MD or a JD?
IYER: A JD.
GRACE: Right. OK...
IYER: But I am a forensic science specialist, so -- with that, I`m listening.
GRACE: Right. Now, back to what we were saying. First you said that my rendition was a misstatement of facts. Now I have read to you from official court documents. Now you`re saying, OK, that`s not a misstatement, that`s an exaggeration. So who`s exaggerating? I`m reading from a court document. You`re claiming that`s an exaggeration, that all of these people...
IYER: I think the relevance...
GRACE: ... including a neurologist, is exaggerating.
IYER: Yes. The neurologist said that he`s 80 percent sure it was a seizure. So he`s even not sure.
GRACE: And then, Ellie, isn`t it true that he goes on to say, Had there been a history of seizures, if I had known about a history of seizures, I would have been 100 percent sure.
JOSTAD: Yes, you`re right, Nancy. And you`re talking about the heart of the case right here. Did the doctor say she shouldn`t drive?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dr. Brian Williams told the court he was 80 percent sure in February of 2006 that Monica Chavez suffered a seizure.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A doctor was so worried about Monica Chavez`s possible seizure, he allegedly told her to go see a neurologist.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And it was not just a fainting spell when she collapsed at an Albertson`s store. He says he verbally told Chavez to see a neurologist in five days.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Discharge papers even allegedly say, Do not drive until cleared by a neurologist. But the mom never sees one. And after at least two more alleged incidents, she ultimately plows her vehicle into a family of five, killing them all. But many asking, could it have been prevented if she had just followed doctor`s orders?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are back and taking your calls. Straight out to Charlene in Florida. Hi, Charlene. What`s your question?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. First I`d like to say I don`t know how you do it because if I had to talk to Peter Odom and Seema Iyer, I`d probably shoot myself.
GRACE: Yes, that`s why I don`t even own a weapon. I don`t even want to be tempted, OK? Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t blame you. I would like to say that I am almost disgusted being on this planet anymore. What happened to personal accountability?
If you are suspected of seizures and the doctor`s notes tell you, Do not drive until you are cleared by a neurologist -- Seema Iyer, maybe you need to go back and get some more education because plain English, written on paper -- my father suffers from seizures. He`s 79 years old. He also was also told not to drive verbally. He does not drive because of what could happen to him or someone else.
And Peter Odom and Seema Iyer should be ashamed of themselves, and I hope you have a horrible night`s sleep tonight!
(LAUGHTER)
GRACE: You know what, Charlene in Florida? I want to tell you something. My little girl is named after my grandmother Lucy, and I can`t tell you how awful it was when we told her she could not drive anymore. It`s a horrible thing.
And what everybody`s forgetting, Eleanor, is that there are five dead bodies, including a 7-year-old. You know, Eleanor, you know my babies. They`re almost 5 years old. What, they`ve got two years before they got to worry about this woman plowing into them, landing on top of my mini-van?
ELEANOR ODOM: Well, Nancy, it`s not just this woman. It`s other people who might think, Oh, I can drive, even though I`ve had a history of seizures. Again, it`s almost like putting a loaded gun to someone`s head, what she did. It`s that bad.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He allegedly told her to go see a neurologist.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It looked like she was having a seizure.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chavez`s SUV hit the median and went airborne before slamming into two cars and killing Randy and Crystaldawn Stollsteimer and their three children.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. A mom with two children in tow careens across lanes of traffic, crashes across a cement median, flips in the air, lands on a family car, killing all five, wiping out a family instantly. That was not meant to be. Then Mommy plows into a mattress store all the way on the other side of the street.
Now we learn it`s all because Mommy refused to follow doctor`s orders, Don`t drive. We are now learning, based on our investigation, of a history of at least five seizure episodes, that we know of.
We are taking your calls. I want to go out now to a specialist, Michael Dobbs, Dr. Dobbs, neurologist and vice chair of the department of neurology at the University of Kentucky.
Dr. Dobbs, thank you for being with us. Shed some light on this. What could be causing these seizures?
DR. MICHAEL DOBBS, NEUROLOGIST (via telephone): Well, seizures occur when brain cells fire uncontrollably, spreading throughout the brain. It can cause loss of control of the whole body, abnormal movements such as shaking and twitching.
Common causes include, first of all, that some people just have about abnormal brain wiring, where they are at high risk of having seizures. Other people can have seizures due to brain damage, such as from stroke, brain tumors. And drugs and other substances can also -- can also cause seizures.
GRACE: Dr. Dobbs, can anti-seizure medication essentially stop the seizures?
DOBBS: Yes. It can in many patients. And many patients with epilepsy, which means more than one seizure, can have normal lives and can drive safely with excellent control of seizures while under a doctor`s care. But the key is getting it evaluated.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And she plowed her SUV into this car, killing an entire family.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-three-year-old mother of two Monica Chavez.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She apparently had a seizure, her SUV suddenly speeding out of control.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She reportedly suffers some sort of seizure-like activity.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She hit the median and went airborne, killing Randy and Crystaldawn Stollsteimer and their three children.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Prosecutors say Chavez should never have been behind the wheel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A doctor allegedly told her to go see a neurologist.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He says he verbally told Chavez to refrain from driving until cleared by a neurologist.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But the mom never sees one.
GRACE: Under our constitution, you don`t have to go to the doctor, but driving on the street, on the road, is a privilege, not a right. And she`s risking my life and my children`s life. And that`s not OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why was she even behind the wheel?
GRACE: This is negligent homicide.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are live and taking your calls. A mom with her own two children in tow, careens across traffic, over a cement median, flips onto a car, killing five instantly before she plows into a store front. Now we learn it could have all been avoided if she had followed doctor`s orders and not driven. There are claims that she has a history of seizures, five, that we can document ourselves.
We are taking your calls. I want to go out to Victoria Taft, radio talk show host at KPAM.
Weigh in, Victoria.
VICTORIA TAFT, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST, KPAM: Well, you know, you have a mother getting into her mom-mobile, in this case, her large Ford Expedition. She puts her own kids in those -- in that car and then behind the wheel has a seizure.
Nancy, it`s horrific. She goes like 100 miles an hour potentially, that`s what they originally thought. And then of course she hits one car, she careens over the barrier, lands on top of the family, killing all five members of that family, and then crashes into the mattress store.
Now, look, you do have to take under consideration, if she really thought that she had these seizures that were going to cause problems, why would she put her own kids in the car? It`s a subject that needs to be discussed and comes up, but if you`ve had that many seizures in your own life, do you put your own kids in the car?
GRACE: And to Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst, author of "Dealbreakers."
Bethany, it`s not like we`re talking about great grandma over in a rest home that`s not taking her medication. Just before this incident, she pled guilty to assault with a knife on a woman, all right? This woman, if she could pick up a knife and scare some other woman with it, she can take her anti-seizure medication.
And I got to be completely honest, Bethany. You know why I mentioned my grandmother Lucy, I named my Lucy after.
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": Yes.
GRACE: Because I love her so much, well, I didn`t have the guts to go tell her myself that she couldn`t drive anymore. Our family actually got the Georgia State Patrol to go tell her and her husband they couldn`t drive anymore because I thought the whole house would explode. So it`s not an easy thing to take away someone`s freedom.
MARSHALL: No.
GRACE: You know, she was like 84 at the time. But -- and tell them you can`t drive. But the reality is, all this woman, based on what Dr. Michael Dobbs is saying, and I`m going to go back to the neurologist in just a moment, is she should just take anti-seizure medication, Bethany.
MARSHALL: But, Nancy, when you tell me about the assault with a knife, this woman was quite aggressive in getting her way. She disobeyed the doctor`s orders, and I have to say, an order is much more serious than a prescription. You can choose to not fill a prescription, but a doctor`s order, which she signed, then she engaged in massive acts of deception with her own primary care physician.
She went in and presumably, I -- from the reading of the report, she told the story in such a way that she minimized the seizure disorder, causing him to say, well, maybe you really don`t have one, perhaps you should see a specialist. So twice she ignored doctor`s orders, at the E.R. and with her primary care physician. This woman was deceiving her own family members. She had seizures in public, I`m sure in front of her husband, in front of her children. Was she coercibly getting them to agree with her that she did not have a seizure disorder, just like she got her doctor to agree with her, just like she waved that knife?
Sadly, it`s not uncommon for some patients with seizure disorder to hide it from their doctors, from their family members. They don`t want to lose their disability, their life insurance, they`re afraid, their health insurance will become attached. And it is a profound act of selfishness.
Nancy, they`ll even go into their primary care physician and they`ll create a false medical record by going to the doctor for a disorder that has nothing to do with seizure disorders so they can create a record that doesn`t include the epilepsy. So I think thee is -- as this story comes out, we`re going to learn more about this woman and how well thought-out the deception was.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Eleanor Odom, Seema Iyer, Peter Odom.
All right, Peter, have at it.
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, the more recently she was told about this seizure disorder, the worse it looks for her. And I don`t mean to minimize the tragedy here. What I do mean to say is that criminal recklessness and criminal negligence are very, very high standards. You know, maybe the jury will find that this just does not amount to criminal recklessness or criminal negligence, no matter how horrible the tragedy is.
GRACE: OK, you know, Peter, for what you just said, you could have told me to go flip a coin. Because you said, well, maybe a jury will do this. I`m asking you to address the facts and the law as we know them tonight.
P. ODOM: Right. The next --
GRACE: As we have learned. Especially from Michael Dobbs, Dr. Dobbs, the vice chair of neurology, University of Kentucky, who`s saying that typically this can be controlled with an anti-seizure medication.
I can tell you the last seizure that I know of occurred six months before the crash. Occurred in August and the crash was in the end of August, the crash, beginning of February. So, just six months before, Peter.
P. ODOM: Right, so, you know, what I`m telling you is, what I think her best defense is. They`re really bad facts, Nancy.
GRACE: OK. They are.
P. ODOM: And I think her best defense is really to demonstrate that maybe this wasn`t criminal negligence. They are ugly facts. It`s a difficult case. Especially with that doctor`s order.
GRACE: All right, Seema.
SEEMA IYER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, OK, now there`s even more evidence that would support the defense in that. You just had a radio host on and that young lady said that why would Miss Chavez put her kids in danger? I say to you, this is evidence that she was not aware that she suffered from seizures.
Whatever disorder she may have suffered from, my point is, she was unaware because she was not instructed properly by the doctors in her life, and Dr. Dobbs just told us that, yes, there is this anti-seizure medication. Well, Miss Chavez was not prescribed this medication. So, again, my point is, she is unaware. She is not -- she doesn`t have the state of mind to act recklessly. To make this a homicide.
GRACE: Eleanor Odom, let`s address what Seema is saying. The reason that she never got the medication -- I don`t see Eleanor -- is because she lied to the doctors, all right? The doctor stated very plainly, if there had been a second seizure, it would absolutely have been categorized as a seizure illness. All right? She lied to them. She had her own husband say, oh, I thought she was just dehydrated. On another incident, I thought she was just tired.
You don`t fall out at McDonald`s, or at the grocery store, on the way to the video, in your kitchen, in your home, then while you`re driving, because of dehydration. You don`t lock up and your arms and your legs stiffen up, and your head is going back and forth. Another driver said it looked like she was rolling up or down a crank window. And so -- electric window. That is not passing out from dehydration.
And, again, Eleanor, it took me about five years of prosecuting, looking over at the defendant, going, why, why would he or she have done this horrible thing and cost so much pain? You know, there you`ve got Seema Iyer going, why would she put her two children at risk? You know what? Why ask why? She did it, Eleanor.
ELEANOR ODOM, FELONY PROSECUTOR, DEATH PENALTY QUALIFIED: And Nancy, I don`t buy either of these two defense attorneys, I mean, they`re just ludicrous. Because what she has is really a true disregard for human life, including that of her own children. She`s putting them at risk, she`s putting everybody else on the road at risk.
GRACE: We are taking your calls. Kathy in Pennsylvania. Hi, Kathy, what`s your question?
KATHY, CALLER FROM PENNSYLVANIA: Well, I guess I have to go to the fact that a lot of individuals who go to their family physician or a specialist and they get diagnosed, my doctor calls a neurologist, would have, makes an appointment and follow up on what that appointment showed.
If we`re talking 2006, 2007, Nancy, I forget the actual date it was actually diagnosed, there`s negligence here, harshly on the fault of the medical industry. Her doctor. Not only that, is she able to afford co- pays? Is she able to afford medicine? Do I believe that she would put her children in the car? No. Is this a heartache for the loss of those -- that other family, definitely. How many people have been diagnosed with heart trouble who go and get into their vehicle and they drive their car and they have a heart attack and they cause an accident? Are these people --
GRACE: Well, the difference, Kathy in Pennsylvania, very simply is, that she was told, point-blank, you are a menace, do not drive, and she did and now five people are dead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A doctor was so worried about Monica Chavez`s possible seizure.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Based on the history and my findings, the likelihood was this was probably a seizure.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Now prosecutors portray Chavez`s failure to see a neurologist as negligence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: We are taking your calls. A family of five, including a 7- year-old little boy, dead, all because mommy refused to go to the doctor for anti-seizure medication.
Back to Dr. Michael Dobbs, neurologist, and vice-chair, Department of Neurology, University of Kentucky.
Dr. Dobbs, you have heard all of us going back and forth, reporters, lawyers, shrinks. I want to hear your analysis, Dr. Dobbs.
DR. MICHAEL DOBBS, NEUROLOGIST, VICE-CHAIR, DEPARTMENT OF NEUROLOGY, UNIVERSITY OF KENTUCKY: My analysis is this. If someone has a loss of consciousness, especially if it`s a loss of consciousness that`s repeated, you must get clearance from a physician. That clearance may include an extensive medical workup. But it`s not safe to drive. It`s not safe, for that matter, to place yourself at risk, doing things such as swimming alone or climbing ladders, if you are at risk of loss of consciousness.
GRACE: Dr. Dobbs, we just heard a caller suggest that maybe the defendant couldn`t afford the doctor -- you know what? I don`t believe that. Because everywhere in this country, there are clinics at hospitals that treat those that cannot afford medical care.
DOBBS: Yes. That`s right.
GRACE: To Rusty Haight, accident reconstruction expert, joining us out of Boston.
Rusty, you have examined the evidence here. As an accident reconstructionist, what strikes you?
RUSTY HAIGHT, ACCIDENT RECONSTRUCTION EXPERT: Well, Nancy, there`s a lot of interesting stuff here. The fact that you can leap over a concrete center median with a 5.000 pound vehicle landing on top of another car tells me this car has got to be going really fast. But that really doesn`t, you know, address the issue whether or not she`s had a seizure. I would be looking at things in the car, like, you know, bent gas pedals and things under the hood that would suggest that, you know, maybe there was some, you know, hard application of the accelerator, that -- like her leg stiffened up in a seizure.
But moreover, I think a lot of folks are missing the idea that when you sign up to get your driver`s license, you sign up and say, I`m not going to drive drunk, I`m not going to drive -- you know, any kind of impaired. And if I have a seizure, if my doctor tells me not to drive, I`m not going to.
That`s part of getting your driver`s license. I don`t care if whether, you know, she had a specific note or something like that. If she`s brought in and been treated for a seizure, she`s supposed to know that, just like you`re supposed to know you don`t drive drunk. And there`s a lot of parts to this that just don`t make sense.
GRACE: To Marjay in Georgia. Hi, Marjay, what`s your question?
MARJAY, CALLER FROM GEORGIA: Hey, Nancy. I have two. First, I wanted to know if she ever got a second opinion, maybe from another doctor that they said it was OK for her to drive? For her to drive?
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: No, did not. Go ahead. No, she did not. Go ahead.
MARJAY: OK. And, so, the second one, just maybe a point, too, I think it was Dr. Dobbs . And, you know this as well as me because I`m in health care, just because someone takes anti-seizure medication, that does not guarantee that the person`s never going to have a seizure. So the same scenario, she could have been taking her medications and still have the same accident.
GRACE: Yes, well, of course, that`s absolutely true. And, you know what else? Little green men from Mars could land on my roof tonight and eat my house. But I bet it doesn`t happen. Bottom line is, they told her not to drive, she did it, they told her to go to a neurologist, she didn`t do it. All she had to take was anti-seizure medication. That`s the end of the story. I don`t care what these defense attorneys are saying.
Everyone, I want to remind you about Wesley Glenn. It`s a Methodist mission that provides a loving home, allowing handicap residents to live happy lives. And they are desperately trying to raise funds tonight to keep residents in the home that can no longer afford to stay there. The alternative? Putting handicapped residents out on the street.
In honor of your father, and my father, let`s help them on this Father`s Day. Go to wesleyglenministries.com, and click on capital campaign.
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UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The defendant`s daughter, who was in the SUV, tearfully told the court that moments before the crash, her mom told her she couldn`t breathe and then started shaking.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Nia Bender, reporter with Denver Clear Channel.
Nia, again, thank you for being with us. What is the public reaction in the area? Which way are they leaning?
NIA BENDER, REPORTER, DENVER CLEAR CHANNEL: You know, I think that this case is confusing for a lot of our listeners in this case or our viewers. And, you know, first, there`s outrage over the fact that she was told to go see a neurologist and not drive and then there`s some confusion over the fact that the doctor at north suburban medical center said that, you know, he hadn`t written things down necessarily on her paperwork but for the records for the hospital it may have been written down.
So I think that part of it is right now people are just trying to figure out exactly what happened. Everybody feels crushed for this family because it was a horrendous accident. But right now I think everybody is waiting to kind of see what happens.
GRACE: Yes.
BENDER: Because there is some confusion as to, you know, the fact that she did go to her own doctor and that nothing more came of this so, yes, it`s kind of mixed right now.
GRACE: To the Lisa Lockwood, former police detective.
Lisa, the reality is that a car is deemed a lethal weapon in many cases, like a gun or a knife.
LISA LOCKWOOD, FORMER POLICE DETECTIVE, AUTHOR OF "UNDERCOVER ANGEL": That`s right. That`s right. And in this case, an absolute preventable atrocity. This was a woman who decided to play Russian roulette. It is as clear as that. You have five episodes leading up to that event. She decided that she was going to get behind a wheel knowing that she had the propensity to have another seizure, an absolute case of complete disregard for her entire family and for the public out there.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Investigators say Chavez`s SUV hit the median and went airborne before slamming into two cars and killing Randy and Crystal Stollsteimer and their three children.
Dr. Brian Williams told the court he was 80 percent sure in February 2006 that Monica Chavez suffered a seizure and it was not just a fainting spell when she collapsed at an Albertson`s store. He says he verbally told Chavez to see a neurologist in five days.
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GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Barbara in Virginia. Hi, Barbara, what is your question?
BARBARA, CALLER FROM VIRGINIA: Hi, Nancy. Yes, I was just wondering, I didn`t -- basically I have been sitting here reading and listening to a lot of it and I evidently missed a whole lot of things because I was basically coming up, trying to figure out if you want to get in a car, OK, and take the chance knowing you`re having these seizures, that`s fine and dandy, but don`t put your kids in that position and then you totally, you know, I`m trying to understand, did she have to get in her car? Did she have to go somewhere? But why did she have to put her children in the car? And it`s just --
GRACE: Well, you know what, Barbara in Virginia, we have parents that abuse their children. Every day. In very heinous circumstances. And I don`t believe there ever is a reason why, a motive for child abuse.
You know, Eleanor Odom, not only are you death penalty-qualified prosecutor but you specialize in crimes on children. There is no why, why adults abuse, why they beat, why they torture, why they starve, why they neglect their children.
E. ODOM: There is never an answer to it Nancy and what makes it heart-wrenching when you see these cases. But here we see a classic case of child endangerment, you know, putting that child at risk.
GRACE: Everyone, as it develops, we will bring you the latest in the trial of Monica Chavez.
Let`s stop and remember Air Force Senior Airman Jonathan Antonio Vega Yelner, 24, Lafayette, California, killed, Afghanistan. Bronze Star, Purple Heart, loved rock music, golf, lacrosse, his Ford Mustang, campus ministry, theater company, Boy Scouts, was an Eagle Scout. Leaves behind parents, Bruce and Yolanda, stepfather, Bill, brother, Matthew.
Jonathan Yelner, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you and good night from Georgia, friends. Nancy Jo and Mark, aren`t they a beautiful couple? They are the winners of the crossroads community mission`s charity auction.
Thank you for being with us tonight.
Everyone, Dr. Drew coming up next. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
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