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Happy Early Election Day; Arab-Israeli Conflict Front & Center at UN Today; Over 700,000 Syrians Fleeing For Their Lives; With Obama Ahead, Romney Casts Doubts on Polls; Florida Prosecutor Wants Boy, 13, Tried as Adult
Aired September 27, 2012 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Carol Costello, thank you so much.
Hi, everybody. Nice to have you with us. It's 11:00 on the East Coast. It's 8:00 on the West Coast and happy Election Day to you. I'm not kidding. It is Election Day.
Everybody else has been counting town the days for weeks now, right? You've been hearing it. Technically, November 6th is 40 days from today, but guess what? Election Day has already started in some states. Absentee ballots are going out and, in other states, coming back.
Look at this map. Thirty-two states and the District of Columbia let their voters vote early. I'm talking to you today, Iowa, because, oh, happy day, you become the very first of the so-called battleground states today to let your voters show up, do the in-person voting, make your choices and put this election behind you.
And if you don't live in Oregon or Washington state, I bet you don't know this. The voting there is done exclusively by mail. No one goes to a polling place on any kind of Election Day.
Ohioans can go to the polls next Tuesday. Polls on Tuesday. And this is not a fact that is lost on our president, Mr. Obama, stumping there yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I still believe in you and, if you keep on believing in me, I want you to register to vote by October 9th. I want you to start voting next Tuesday, October 2nd.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: So CNN's political editor, Paul Steinhauser, joins me now from Washington, D.C.
Paul, let's go right back to Iowa. Everything begins in Iowa and we've got a recent poll that shows President Obama has a seven point lead in Iowa. So here's the guess. He wants to gets a many early votes in the bank in that state as possible and then move on with his person and his money. PAUL STEINHAUSER, CNN POLITICAL EDITOR: Exactly. Everybody knows Iowa's that first state that votes in the primary and caucus calendar and it's famous for that.
It was the state that gave President Obama -- then-Senator Obama -- his first victory, the Iowa caucuses. And he won Iowa four years ago in the general election. It's considered a swing state, a battleground state, both campaigns really going after it.
Ashleigh, four years ago, 545,000 Iowans cast ballots early, before Election Day. That was about 30 percent of the vote and that was almost double what they did eight years prior.
So early voting is important in Iowa as it is in a bunch of these other states and that's why you're seeing the campaigns really press the flesh there, not just in October, but now and in August because they knew that a lot of these voters are already going to be casting ballots before the debates, Ashleigh.
BANFIELD: Well, when I was a kid, early voting was because you couldn't vote on Election Day and I know a lot of things have changed. We have cell phones now.
But here's the bigger thing. We have some really important days coming up on the calendar and I'm speaking of the presidential debates. We learn so much about these candidates and, if you vote early, they don't matter at all.
STEINHAUSER: Exactly. The presidential debate, the first one is going to be in Denver, Colorado, next Wednesday, but look at this. By next Wednesday, 10 states will be voting early and, as you mentioned, Iowa and Ohio, two crucial battleground states. You can see them there in yellow.
Those state will have already had early voting underway in one form or another, just traditional voting -- go in and cast a ballot or early, in-person, absentee voting.
So that is why the debates, while they're important for a lot of Americans, guess what? Some Americans will have already cast their ballots by the time these debates begin, Ashleigh.
BANFIELD: It's amazing when you look at the map of those states and you see where the polls are today. They can always change, especially with those debates.
And yet those early voting numbers calcify at this time, right away. How many people, Paul, are we talking about? What percentage of the electorate is calcifying those results today and in these early days?
STEINHAUSER: Well, four years ago, about a third of the country, about a third of the people who cast ballots cast them before Election Day, either early voting or absentee voting or some other kind of early voting. And that was the number and we think the number could be pretty comparable this time around. And, as you mentioned, you bring up a good point. What if there is a big development at one of these debates or maybe a development outside of the debates, but could impact the race not White House?
For a lot of people, they would have already voted and they can't react. Those developments may affect their vote, but it's too late. Their ballot is already cast, Ashleigh.
BANFIELD: Happy Iowa Election Day to you, Paul.
STEINHAUSER: Thanks.
BANFIELD: Thanks for joining us.
Okay, so for all their differences, the President and his Republican opponent certainly do find a lot of common ground, particularly this week and I am speaking literally.
On Tuesday, both of these men gave grand speeches in New York City. Their they are. Both looking presidential, I might add. Yesterday they both campaigned in Ohio. Remember, Ohio, Ohio, Ohio. It's critical.
And today, in fact at this very hour as we speak, they are in the state of Virginia and that's why Brianna Keilar is there, watching very closely what goes on with both these candidates. She's in Virginia Beach, in fact.
Hello, Brianna. Let's talk about the President. He's due to speak in about -- let's see -- about 45 minutes from now, Eastern time. That's 11:50. And, actually, I think Mitt Romney is due to speak in Springfield on the D.C. outskirts at the very same time.
So if the election comes down to these particular key states, is this where we're going to see them and this is it?
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: These are the states where we're going to see them, Ohio yesterday, Virginia today. And there's a couple things going on here today, Ashleigh.
You mentioned early voting. Well, early voting, both absentee mail-in and absentee in-person voting begins in Virginia today, so it's no coincidence that you have Barack Obama and Mitt Romney campaigning in the state.
But the other thing they're doing is they're trying to cut into each other's base. Where is Mitt Romney today? Springfield, Virginia right outside of Washington, D.C. Northern Virginia, that area, is really Obama territory and here we are in Virginia Beach.
This is not Obama territory and I think one thing that kind of really shows that is actually we're here at a amphitheater at the Farm Bureau Live. The band that will be performing next here because this is a music venue is the Zac Brown Band which performed at the Republican National Convention, something that struck me. But they're trying to cut into each other's margins. President Obama did pretty well in Virginia Beach, narrowly losing Virginia Beach County to John McCain. This is a strong veteran area which normally goes for Republicans.
Mitt Romney has to win here, Ashleigh, and President Obama is here trying to make sure that it and Virginia are out of his reach, Ashleigh.
BANFIELD: So when you say Mitt Romney has to win here, Brianna, what do the numbers say so far? How have the polls been looking and where do the polls stand, at least today?
KEILAR: Well, right now what we're looking at, according to our latest CNN Poll of Polls, which is considering a lot of polls and averaging them, 50-44, Barack Obama in the lead, so he has a single digit lead.
Obviously, that's something that the Obama campaign is happy about, but that isn't really a comfortable enough lead where they would be saying, you know, this is in the bag or something like this.
The other thing you have to consider is that Virginia is where you've got a marquee Senate race taking place. Tim Kaine, Democrat, former governor, former DNC chair, facing off against Republican George Allen, former governor, former senator.
And this is a race -- remember Virginia, 2006, determined that Democrats would have the majority in the Senate. When you look at that Senate race, Tim McCain -- pardon me -- Tim Kaine is leading by single digits.
So right now, President Obama is trying to kind of widen the gap for himself and also in the Senate rate.
BANFIELD: Interesting numbers and we should also mention, Brianna, if you can even hear me with all the cheering behind you, that that Poll of Polls does not have a margin of error, so those numbers are those numbers.
Brianna Keilar, thank you. I'll let you get back to your very busy day of tracking both of those candidates.
In the meantime, I should let you know, as well, that the President and Mitt Romney are soon going to be face-to-face themselves as American voters decide how they are going to mark their ballots.
First presidential debate starts on Wednesday night. You can watch it live, right here, 7:00 Eastern on CNN, and you can also watch it on CNN.com.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BANFIELD: The Palestinians, Israel, Iran and the United States and our place within those names, that's a bit of the Arab-Israeli conflict in a nutshell and it's all about to be front-and-center at the United Nations today.
Have some live pictures for you right now from inside the United Nations General Assembly, world leaders all taking their turns at the lectern. Ours has been there as has a number of other top leaders and today no exception.
Both Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Palestinian leader, Mahmoud Abbas, are going to be taking the stage and all of this is coming in just the next hour.
Mr. Abbas will be up first. He's expected to ask the United Nations to give his people, the Palestinian Authority, non-member observer status. That's an expanded kind of status than he has right now, this after last year's failed bid to win U.N. recognition of a Palestinian state, an even bigger request last year.
Now, shortly after he speaks, Israel's prime minister is going to take the podium and Mr. Netanyahu is expected to focus on Iran rather than on Palestinians. He's likely going to warn the United Nations about the threat that Israel faces from Iran's controversial nuclear program.
But his warnings take on a new sense of urgency after making it clear that Israel would preemptively attack Iran if diplomacy fails. Mr. Netanyahu's threats have put a -- I suppose you could call a significant strain on relations with the United States and President Obama, in particular, who the prime minister of Israel says is pushing to establish a clear red line.
You've heard those words before and it is quite possible you will hear about the red line again when he addresses the assembly.
And I do have breaking news for you, as well, that concerns our president. In fact, CNN has learned that President Obama has a plan to have a follow-up phone call with Prime Minister Netanyahu tomorrow, all of this after the flap about the Israeli government confirming that there was outreach, an effort to put a meeting on the books when Prime Minister Netanyahu was here in the United States, particularly for the U.N. General Assembly, and that he was rebuffed to have this face-to-face, bilateral meeting with our president.
Well, for its part, the White House said, we've got phones, we're in constant contact and now we hear word that they will be in contact tomorrow.
We're going to take you live to the United Nations, as well, when Mr. Abbas and Mr. Netanyahu begin to address that world body.
In the meantime, there's this. As if it couldn't get worse for the people of Syria who are staggering beneath the burden of a relentless civil war, much of it brought on by their very own president, the United Nations has just come out with some pretty staggering new numbers.
By the end of this year, the number of Syrians who are literally running for their lives from the bombs and the mortars falling on their homes, the number could surpass 700,000. That is seven times more than the U.N. estimated just back in March.
These people and their kids are making a mad dash for the countries next door and tens of thousands of them have already made it into Turkey. But this overwhelming flow of humanity is causing a huge problem for Turkey, not to mention all the other states that are trying to feed and clothe and shelter the onslaught of these desperate people.
Turkey has been now forced to shut the door, just shut it, refuse entry to these tired, poor and huddled masses. So now these people have literally been stopped in their tracks on the Syrian side of the border in the mud, in the mess, in the sickness.
CNN's Ivan Watson got a firsthand look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IVAN WATSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: They live almost hidden in the olive groves, Syrian families sleeping in the dirt.
Over the last month, a makeshift camp of more than 5,000 people has sprung up on the northern edge of Syria, families made homeless by war. There are no toilets here. Residents (INAUDIBLE). Water that's hard to even swallow. Water that Youssef Dabul has gotten used to drinking.
YOUSSEF DABUL, SYRIAN REFUGEE: I've been here from one month ago, one month, five days.
WATSON: Living ...
DABUL: Yeah, here.
WATSON: ... here.
DABUL: Under the olive trees. It's not nice. It's not healthy, also.
WATSON: Why did you come here?
DABUL: I come here because my house is destroyed. There is no house for me.
WATSON (voice-over): Everyone tells stories of rockets and air strikes, artillery and explosions.
Assam a-Hamdu (ph) fled here from the battleground city of Aleppo. His 2-year-old daughter, Maram (ph), was badly burned when a bomb blew up his house last month.
I try to ask her how are you.
She's deaf now?
Maram (ph) can't hear. The little girl's been deaf ever since the explosion. We see far too many children here covered in insect bites suffering from fever and diarrhea.
WATSON (on-camera): Fever, she has a fever.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hot, too hot. Yeah. That's what is hot.
WATSON: Is there a doctor?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There is no doctor.
WATSON (voice-over): This filthy camp sits less than 100 yards from the Turkish border.
(on-camera): And you just want to go to Turkey?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we want just to go there to keep ourselves, to save ourselves, our children, our relatives.
WATSON (voice-over): For more than a year, Turkey welcomed fleeing Syrians, caring for them in well-organized camps, but the Syrian refugee population in Turkey recently swelled to more than 87,000 and now Turkey appears to have partially shut what it once called its open-door policies for Syrians.
These desperate people are stuck, waiting at the border. Under the eyes of a Turkish border post, they hold a futile protest, begging the Turkish government to let them in.
Some of the children here look dazed, overwhelmed by their surroundings, the faces of what could be a lost generation. They are victims of a conflict that's tearing Syria apart.
At sunset, the families get ready for another night under the olive trees, hoping that tomorrow their Turkish neighbors will finally let them in.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BANFIELD: Ivan Watson joins us live now on the Turkish side of the border with Syria.
Ivan, it is absolutely heart-wrenching to see those conditions and not to see any evidence of an NGO or a world body that's at least overseeing the rudimentary medical needs of these people.
How long is this expected to go on? Is anybody trying to respond to these people and open the doors and let them in?
WATSON: Well, you know, I talked to Turkish officials and asked them about this because this right next to a pretty significant Turkish military base.
They said they simply can't allow all these refugees in right now because they don't have enough camps like the one behind me to house them. They already have 87,000-plus refugees living in camps like this.
They're building more camps, but as a spokesman for the Turkish government told me, he said we can't build camps enough, fast enough to match the pace of the violence of the Syrian regime against its own people. That was the words of the Turkish government official.
He insisted that the Turks were providing some food and aid across the border to this very camp, but it's definitely not enough for those 5,000-plus people there.
There were not international aid agencies on the ground there. They didn't have blankets or normal tents and they're only the fraction of the displaced people we saw.
In a nearby village, there were hundreds of families, Ashleigh, in schools and mosques, as well, and the fear is, with the United Nations predicting that the number could surge to 700,000 in the next three months, those numbers will swell will dramatically and probably see similar conditions along the frontier.
Ashleigh?
BANFIELD: So Ivan, if they can't respond humanitarianly to these people, does it at least force the Turks and the other surrounding nations to start thinking more politically that they've got to do something about Bashar al-Assad and force his hand to stop the disaster coming their way?
WATSON: Well, you certainly hear the Turks, for example, behind closed doors, urging Americans to take a more active roll, calling on the international community to help.
Part of this is the Turk's own fault. They insisted from the beginning they were going to take part of the refugees themselves and now that the number has grown so fast so quickly, they're kind of in a quandary, in a bind.
They don't have groups like the United Nations high commissioner for refugees on the ground to help them deal with all these masses of people and the consequence is you get these pathetic scenes, like the ones we saw just across the border where children -- I mean some of them, we fear might not survive a matter of days longer than we saw them.
The conditions were really that rough and ordinary Syrians were trying to get support, trying to give some kind of food to these people, but it's simply not enough.
And, from the indications we were hearing from these refugees, they were being bombed in towns and villages that I visited just last month that seemed apparently safe.
It seems like the Syrian government has intensified its collective punishment on some of these towns and that is driving these additional numbers of refugees, refugees who previously hid in neighboring towns and villages. And now they've decided this has too dangerous, too violent. We have no choice but to go across the border.
So expect to see, Ashleigh, more awful scenes like the one we showed you underneath those olive trees in the weeks and months ahead, especially as the weather gets colder here.
BANFIELD: Oh, dear God. It's not as though we don't have history that tells us this happens. Every single war results in this kind of tragedy.
Ivan, excellent work and thank you for enlightening us as to that side of the battle. Thank you.
Of course, the fighting does continue in Syria. The killing continues, as well. The opposition saying that at least 36 people have died in fighting just today. And if you want to know another stat that will blow you away, 343 dead yesterday and that is the highest, one-day death toll since the war started 18 months ago.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BANFIELD: If you are having a tough time deciding how you're going to vote with Issues 2012, heavy on your plate, maybe big government is one of those things that just gets stuck in your craw.
If it is, our Tom Foreman is going to lay out the positions of both of the candidates right now for you on the size of government.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Here are three reasons why the federal government has grown bigger in the past few years. Because the economy has crashed, forcing more people to rely on government programs like unemployment and food stamps. Because the baby boomers started retiring, collecting Social Security and Medicare.
And maybe because Barack Obama is president.
OBAMA: The question we ask today is not whether our government is too big or too small, but whether it works.
FOREMAN: From the start, Mr. Obama has clearly believed government is a positive force, that expansion is not bad and that it serves to control what many consider the excesses of the free market.
OBAMA: And without the leavening hand of wise policy, markets can crash. Monopolies can stifle competition. The vulnerable can be exploited.
FOREMAN: He frequently cautions against unwarranted government growth, yet through the economic stimulus, health care reform and the auto bailout, he has sounded like another Democratic president, Franklin Roosevelt, who insisted that government must protect economic rights. PRESIDENT FRANKLIN ROOSEVELT: The right of every family to a decent home, the right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health.
FOREMAN: Flash forward four decades and here comes another president with a very different view.
PRESIDENT RONALD REAGAN: Government is not the solution to our problem. Government is the problem.
FOREMAN: Ronald Reagan's perspective has dominated Republican thoughts on this matter for years, including Mitt Romney's opposition to Barack Obama.
MITT ROMNEY, (R) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We have a different approach, the President and I, between a government-dominated society and a society driven by free people pursuing their dreams.
FOREMAN: Romney insists the federal government should be smaller and less intrusive in terms of regulations and taxes. It should expand only when absolutely necessary and that, largely, it should keep out of the free market.
ROMNEY: I line up with a smaller government, a less intrusive government, regulations being paired back.
FOREMAN: Such views on both sides, of course, can make a difference, but here is the catch.
For the past century, with a few exceptions, the government has been expanding, no matter which party has held the White House.
More cabinet positions, more agencies, more spending per citizen and much of that is driven by things like we mentioned at the start, population growth, economic trends and entitlements.
Meaning the question is probably not whether the government will keep growing under Mr. Obama or Mr. Romney, but, rather, how fast.
Tom Foreman, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BANFIELD: Thank you very much, Tom Foreman.
And just a quick note for you. If you you're heading out the door, you can continue to watch CNN from your mobile phone, which is very cool, and you can also watch CNN from your desktop when you get to where you're going.
Just go to CNN.com/TV. All the instructions are there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BANFIELD: America's Choice 2012, and both campaigns know that this election will really come down to a few key states. And the polls in those states right now are looking solidly in Obama's column. So what is team Romney to do? How about this? Work hard, spend money, spend time, bang that shoe leather to the sidewalk, and maybe even cast some doubt on polls that are unfavorable.
CNN's Wolf Blitzer joining me live from Washington, D.C.
Wolf, the Romney camp and their allies are suggesting that a lot of those so-called mainstream polls are skewed in some way, that they're not accurate. I want to play a short clip from Mr. Romney's political director, Rich Beeson.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICH BEESON, POLITICAL DIRECTOR, ROMNEY CAMPAIGN: We trust our internal polls. I don't make any campaign decisions based off what I read in the "Washington Post." So I'm not going to get into the specifics of what our polls say or don't say. I trust our numbers and that's what we're basing our decisions off of.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: But he won't give us those numbers.
So, Wolf, here's how it goes. Every time bad numbers come out, I hear campaigns saying, we don't use those numbers, we use our own. But I never hear that when the numbers are good. Am I wrong?
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST, "THE SITUATION ROOM": You're not wrong, but the fundamental fact of what's going on right now is the numbers in these key battleground states, according to almost all of the reputable national polls out there, show that Obama is ahead in most of these key battleground states. That's obviously disconcerting to a lot of Republicans. Some of them, like Karl Rove, for example, have repeatedly gone out there and suggested that these polls are biased against the Republicans because they're oversampling Democrats, for example, as opposed to Republicans. And as a result, don't trust these polls, they're not reliable. So it's sort of convenient for a lot of these Republicans, like Karl Rove, to go after the NBC poll or the ABC poll or CNN polls.
But what they don't say is that the FOX News polls are showing almost exactly the same thing. FOX has some good polls. For example, their most recent battleground states, Ashleigh, in Ohio and Virginia, show Obama ahead of Romney by seven points. In Florida, the FOX News poll shows the President ahead of Romney by five points. Very similar to all these other so-called mainstream poll numbers. You don't hear them complaining about the FOX News polls. They're complaining about the others, so there is an imbalance there.
If you take a look at all these polls, and we at CNN did a poll of polls, you show -- it clearly shows that the President is ahead slightly in almost all of these key battleground states. And I think that's pretty significant.
BANFIELD: We were just showing Virginia, and now here is Florida, and they're saying exactly what you just said, Wolf. And here is the thing. Yes, we're 40 days out. But early voting -- we started the program talking about the significance of early voting and the volumes of people who do early voting. Which brings me to my next question, regardless of what the Romney camp is saying about their internal polls, is it entirely possible they are seeing these polls that are now, as I said, solidifying with early voters and saying it may be time to spend the money on down-ballot contenders and go for the House and go for the Senate because we've lost those states at this point?
BLITZER: Yes, I think it's way too premature to say they've lost those states. It's early. I've seen polls turn around the final 40 days of an election. They certainly can turn around in this election. And let's not forget --
(CROSSTALK)
BANFIELD: But even with the early voting numbers, Wolf?
BLITZER: Even with the early voting numbers. This is not over by any means, Ashleigh. There's three presidential debates, one vice presidential debate. And I remember very vividly -- you probably were too young to remember -- the 1980 race.
BANFIELD: Of course.
BLITZER: At this point, in 1980, Jimmy Carter was actually ahead in the polls over Ronald Reagan, and Reagan won decisively. So there's still plenty of opportunity for Romney to come back.
The only point I'm trying to make is, right now -- and remember polls are a snapshot of what's happening right now. Right now, Obama clearly is ahead in these key battleground states. That's very significant. It can have a demoralizing impact on a lot of Republicans and a lot of Republican money from that perspective, as you point out. But at the same time, it can make the Democrats overconfident. They may decide, you know what, he doesn't need anymore money, he's doing just fine. Or I don't have to show up and vote because the President's going to win. So there's a two-edged sword to being ahead or behind at this point in the polls. This race is continuing. It's by no means over. Anybody who says it's over is being ridiculous.
BANFIELD: We still have jobs. And by the way, speaking of the '80s, I actually started my career in the '80s, although I love that compliment from you and I have it on tape.
Wolf Blitzer, thank you so much.
BLITZER: You look much younger than that. You look --
BANFIELD: You can be on every day, every day, twice a day.
Thank you, Wolf Blitzer.
His show is on at 4:00. Make sure you watch, everybody. It's the best thing in the biz. The election's close. Debates are even closer. Here's another tease for our programming. The first debate is next Wednesday night. CNN special coverage starts 7:00 p.m. Eastern, 4:00 Pacific, October 3rd, debate night and date night. Make it date night, folks. Live on CNN and CNN.com.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BANFIELD: International woman of wonder, Zain Verjee. Mystery woman of wonder.
(LAUGHTER)
Does your business card say international bonzi bonds (ph)?
ZAIN VERJEE, CNN ANCHOR, "WORLD REPORT": It does. And you can't imagine the kind of people that call it and get in touch with me.
BANFIELD: So normally, I have to talk to you about all sorts of awful things all over the world and you're in your London post. And today, you're here with me in New York and we actually get to talk about something fun, something you can do.
(CROSSTALK)
VERJEE: They let us out of our cages a little bit and have fun.
BANFIELD: I know, and bounce around. So if I were to come and meet you in London and we were going to have an afternoon out, what would be the best thing for us to do?
VERJEE: I would take you out, first of all, for fish and chips. Right, mate?
BANFIELD: You can actually say this in your American accent?
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
VERJEE: Ashleigh!
(LAUGHTER)
BANFIELD: Go for it.
VERJEE: I'll only do it if do you the respond and you do the rest of the show in an English accent.
BANFIELD: Would it be the Queen's English and would it be blimey, mate.
VERJEE: Right. If you were coming to London, I would take you to have fish and chips, then tea. And you have to put your pinkie out a little bit, okay? Because that's how you drink tea.
(CROSSTALK)
VERJEE: And then I would put you on horses. Do you ride?
BANFIELD: I did.
VERJEE: Okay.
(CROSSTALK)
BANFIELD: This is like Brooklyn and Texas.
VERJEE: Coming out of the gate looking for eight.
BANFIELD: You are hilarious. Riding in Hyde Park?
VERJEE: Riding in Hyde Park is what I do for fun. And a lot of people go and relax and clippity-clop around the park.
BANFIELD: Check this out as Zain shows --
(CROSSTALK))
BANFIELD: -- us Hyde Park on horseback.
(LAUGHTER)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(MUSIC)
VERJEE: I'm going to take you to one of London's biggest tourist spot, but I won't take you there by boat or buggy or by bus or by bike. I'm going to take you by Ben. This -- ooh -- is not Big Ben, just Ben. And Ben will take us for a little stroll around town. Come on.
(MUSIC)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I love this bit because this doesn't feel like --
(MUSIC)
VERJEE: This is the beautiful Serpentine in Hyde Park. It was created about 300 years or so ago, and it's actually fake. So Ben and Thomas over here won't really want to drink from that water. But the tourists are having a good time.
(MUSIC)
VERJEE: Hyde Park is 350 acres. We're actually on a bit called Rotten Row. This used to be a very fashionable place where society would come to see and be seen.
(MUSIC)
(LAUGHTER) VERJEE: No, it's not time to eat. Stop eating, Ben.
(LAUGHTER)
(MUSIC)
VERJEE: So if ever you're in London, come check it out. Come for a ride in Hyde Park stables.
Zain Verjee and Ben, CNN --
(LAUGHTER)
-- Hyde Park.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
BANFIELD: So we cut the tape early for you.
Just quickly, is it only the tourists -- like if we go to Hyde Park, are we the tourists, or does everybody do that?
VERJEE: The tourists do that, but there's actually a few training rings there. So people like me, who live there, and who want to learn more do a little dressage, which is what I'm doing.
BANFIELD: English style.
VERJEE: Darling, of course. So I go into Hyde Park and do it. It's just tourists and locals. And you just need to know where to go.
BANFIELD: You can stay for tea and crumpets after the show?
VERJEE: Of course, darling. Totally.
BANFIELD: Vain Verjee, come visit any day. And you're on for the date in London, just you and me, two girls.
VERJEE: All right. All right.
BANFIELD: CNN.com, by the way, has all these fabulous travel tips. Make sure you have a look. And thank you for coming in.
VERJEE: Thank you for having me. Are you buying me lunch?
BANFIELD: I didn't say that.
(LAUGHTER)
Back after this, while we discuss.
(LAUGHING) (CROSSTALK)
BANFIELD: If a prosecutor in Florida gets her way, a 13-year-old boy is going to be sent to an adult prison for the rest of his life. No chance of seeing his mother in the free world again. That's a fact.
The boy's name is Christian Fernandez. There he is. Look closely. Make no mistake, his alleged crime could not be more serious -- first- degree murder. And the victim? His own baby half-brother, just two years old. He has also been charged with sexually abusing his 5-year- old brother, but that child apparently recanted the story. The charge still stands.
Christian's story is so much more complex than just these charges. Let's start with this. He was born to a mom who was just 12 years old. 12 years old. She got pregnant after she was raped. So his father's in prison for it. As a toddler, Christian was found filthy and naked and wandering the streets at 4:00 in the morning near a motel where his drug-addicted grandmother was getting high. Both Christian and that now 14-year-old mommy were packed off to foster care when Christian was just a little kid. At 8 years old, he was sexually abused by a relative. Some years later, he was beaten so badly by his mom's new husband that the school sent him to the hospital with a damaged retina. That man shot himself dead in front of the other sibling before police could even charge him with the crime.
In 2011, Christian was left home alone with a 2.5 year-old brother and another brother. And that toddler was mortally injured after being allegedly thrown against a book case. But when Christian's mother returned home, she reportedly waited eight hours to get help for that injured toddler. Instead, she was Googling things like "unconsciousness" and was texting with her friends. And now she's been charged for that crime, and she's pled to it.
So there's Christian's life for you in a nutshell. And now at the tender age of 13, he is facing a very adult system, a system that itself can't even decide if it's legal to subject him to this kind of trial.
Randy Zelin joins me now.
You and I have talked at length many times, Randy, about legal cases. I always say they can't get worse and then I see something like this. Do prosecutors take into -- simple question -- do prosecutors take into account a background like this before charging like that?
RANDY ZELIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Great question. Typically, no, because everything that you just discussed is usually an issue for sentencing. But since the prosecution solely, nobody else, determines whether or not a juvenile should be tried as an adult or kept in the juvenile system, all of those things do come into consideration and a prosecutor is duty bund to look at all of this stuff that happens in a child's life. Why? Because can this child be rehabilitated as opposed to simply punished? If the answer is, the child can be rehabilitated, the answer is keep him in the juvenile system where he'll get the help. If not, then try him as an adult. So yes, the prosecutor should be looking at everything you just spoke of and try him as a kid.
BANFIELD: Look closely. That's the kid we're talking about. He looks like he's at take-your-kid-to-work today, not a kid who should be wearing an orange jump suit. During the break, contemplate this. When asked if he wants his Miranda rights, do you think he could understand, at 11 years old, what Miranda rights are?
We're back with that in a moment.
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BANFIELD: So before the break I asked the question, an 11-year-old given Miranda rights, can they possibly understand?
It turns out, the judge, Randy Zelin, said, no, you can't use any of that evidence that that kid gave you just because you thought he waived his Miranda rights. What about all the stuff he gave before Miranda?
ZELIN: That's the fascinating part of what's going on. While the prosecution withdrew their appeal of, "Judge, how can you toss this out," there were statements Christian made prior to being entitled to being read his rights, you have a right to keep your mouth shut. The judge is letting that in. By withdrawing the appeal now, the defense can appeal the judge's ruling, which says certain statements can come in. It's unbelievable that a child, who isn't old enough or big enough to sit in the front seat of a car, can understand "I have a right to keep my mouth shut and not do it."
BANFIELD: We always talk about people going into a courtroom and whether they're competent to stand trial. Do they understand the charges against them and can they assist in their defense? Is that kid competent according to those standards?
ZELIN: According to the standards, the judge found that probably -- probably what the judge found was he didn't have to be told and there wasn't a determination that needed to be made whether or not he understood he had a right to keep his mouth shut because he either wasn't in custody yet or wasn't being interrogated. Are you in custody, and are you being asked a question that, if you answer it, it would incriminate you.
BANFIELD: I can't understand how a child can understand the process. You have to understand the process to be in a courtroom to start with. Clearly this thing has been moving along the pipeline. Once it gets to trial, if it ever does, you get to the jury. And there are a lot of people in the state of Florida who are not happy about this. The prosecutor is Angela Cory, by the way, the same one in the Zimmerman case. They are not happy about this.
So ultimately, would a jury look at a little kid and say first degree murder, life in prison without parole? Not on my watch.
ZELIN: It's fascinating. Apparently, 190,000 people have signed petitions saying, how do you try this kid as an adult. He needs to be rehabilitated. He can be rehabilitated. Straight-A student. Has had a horrific life. That's unfair to people who have had horrific lives, what this kid has gone through. You know something? With supervision, treatment, all the stuff you get as a juvenile, maybe he comes out okay. How this prosecutor has decided that eight years isn't enough to decide whether this can be straightened out, what's worse, to err on the side of caution here, to throw this kid away in the garbage or to give him a chance?
BANFIELD: That's often what they'll say, these are damaged goods. As bad as he is, we can't let him out into society because who will be next on the list. It is tragic all around.
Randy Zelin, thank you.
ZELIN: Good to be here.
BANFIELD: Thank you for your insights. Good to see you again.
I want to remind you, tomorrow, there's action on this case. A hearing scheduled tomorrow. We could see some movement. We could see more continuances. I don't know. We'll watch it for you and bring you the details as soon as we get them as well.
Back in a moment.
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BANFIELD: Another day, another campaign battleground for President Obama and his challenger, Mitt Romney -- on screen. Yesterday, it was Ohio. Today, it's the swing state of Virginia.
Right now, Governor Romney is at an event in Springfield, Virginia, a suburb near the nation's capital, and he's focusing not only on foreign affairs, but also trade and energy. Let's listen in.
