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Arias Back on Stand; Casey Anthony Back in Court; Menendez Accuser Recants Story; Surrogate Mother versus the Parents.

Aired March 05, 2013 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: In about an hour, Jodi Arias will return to the witness stand in the murder trial of her boyfriend, Travis Alexander. Her defense attorneys are in the middle of their redirect questioning, if you're keeping track, and she's been on the stand a long time.

Randi Kaye will recap Monday's fireworks.

And I have a quick warning for you, some of this testimony is pretty darn graphic.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): After damaging week on cross-examination, the first order of business for Jodi Arias's defense team was knocking down any hint at premeditation.

KIRK NURMI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Did you go to Mr. Alexander see home on June 4th with the intent of killing him?

JODY ARIAS, ON TRIAL FOR MURDER: No, I didn't.

KAYE: Another attempt to convince the jury she murdered Travis Alexander in self defense, even though she's changed her story three times.

Testimony quickly turned to Arias' broken finger on her left hand. The prosecution has tried to prove she hurt her finger while stabbing her ex-boyfriend dozens of times. And dragging his bloody body around the house. To dispute that, Arias' defense lawyer offered a show and tell.

NURMI: And that is the injury you incurred when you testified to having received when Mr. Alexander was kicking you in the ribs and he ended up kicking your hand, correct?

ARIAS: That's correct.

KAYE: Arias says Alexander broke her finger six months before the murder, the day after she caught him allegedly masturbating to a photo of a little boy. She claims he became increasingly violent after that. (on camera): Even though the couple had broken up, Arias says she and Alexander continued to have sex. But she wasn't the only one Alexander was seeing. Now the state has painted her as jealous and obsessive. But here in court, Arias portrayed herself as unfazed by this other woman. She even asked Alexander about her.

ARIAS: I didn't want to be confrontational. I wanted to just throw it out will there and let him know it's OK if you're dating someone, you can let me know. I'll be cool about that.

KAYE (voice-over): Again, the couple's sex life was on full display. The defense worked to convince the jury it was Alexander, not Arias, who was the more experienced sexually. Listen to will recording of the couple's phone sex played in court.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

TRAVIS ALEXANDER, VICTIM: You cannot say I don't work that booty. We've had two and three hour sessions many times.

(END AUDIO FEED)

KAYE: There was also in question about an encounter of oral sex in the car.

NURMI: Did he do anything to make you believe that this wasn't his first encounter of this nature?

ARIAS: Yes, he flipped the visor down and angled the mirror so he could have an additional visual vantage point.

KAYE: But what about the text message Arias sent Alexander saying she wanted to dress up like a horny little school girl?

NURMI: Was that the idea of the school girl and the outfit, was that something that you were interested in it or was it something you were doing to please him?

ARIAS: It would be more for his pleasure because just being with him was enough for me. But he enjoyed that kind of stuff.

KAYE: All along, the prosecutor has painted Arias as the one who unleashed Alexander's sexual appetite. The defense tried to counter that.

NURMI: So based on what you've told us in your testimony, before you met Travis in your sexual history, you would have had anal sex no more than four times, is that accurate?

ARIAS: That's accurate.

KAYE: And what to make of Arias' strange behavior at Alexander's memorial service? She left him a note, shown in court, telling him she loved him. Remember, this was less than two weeks after she slit his throat, nearly cutting his head off.

ARIAS: Well, I still had love for him, yes. And I was thinking now more in terms of eternity.

KAYE: Arias told the court she still had deep love for Alexander on June 4th, 2008, the day she killed him.

Randi kayo, CNN, Phoenix, Arizona.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: And there are just so many issues to discuss in this case.

This is the A-team, Ryan Smith and Vinnie Politan, and they are with HLN, following every moment of this case.

You ready?

RYAN SMITH, "EVENING EXPRESS" HOST: Yes.

BANFIELD: Taking a break. Back right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Just day 15, if you're counting. Jodi Arias on the stand. And let me tell you, 15 days of dirty, dirty details in this case.

Let me start with you on the most significant part of all of this, Vinnie, and that is when, you're on the stand that long, it can't be helpful to your case.

VINNIE POLITAN, HLN HOST & "IN SESSION" CONTRIBUTOR: It can't be. But she seems pretty comfortable. She's chatty. She likes to talk.

BANFIELD: It's creepy.

POLITAN: Yes. But she likes to talk about herself and she likes to talk about her relationship with Travis Alexander. So I think that gives her a sense of contract on the stand because she's talking about what she loves to talk about.

BANFIELD: Yes, but she has a smirk on her face, Ryan. Maybe it's just me and maybe I'm the cynic in the room --

(CROSSTALK)

(LAUGHER)

BANFIELD: -- but I find it so displeasing to see matter-of-fact discussion. And I get it. These are facts. She's in court. She's trying to save her life. But there doesn't seem to be much contrition about much on that stand.

SMITH: Well, not when the defense questions her, then the attitude changes. You see the sort of snippy was with the prosecutor. Now we see the emotion coming out more. That's why she's on the stand so much. The more she talks, the more she explains, she thinks the more they will connect with her and it only takes one. BANFIELD: There's a diary in this case, almost like a gift from God. You have a defendant with a diary detailing all the things she went through. How much she loved him. Sometimes he was troubling. Never was he violent in her own private thoughts. This has to be a horrible fact.

POLITAN: It's really bad for the defense. And the prosecution points out on cross-examination, you talk about that he mangled your finger, that he beat you, that you walked in on him pleasuring himself to images of little boy, yet no mention of it in your journal?

BANFIELD: It's awfully convenient we're hearing about it now in a death penalty case as a defense.

POLITAN: And the bottom line is the best facts in her favor are uncorroborated. They just come from her mouth.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: -- that has lied and lied and lied admittedly.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: -- like Casey Anthony lied. I don't like liars.

(CROSSTALK)

SMITH: It's hard, too, right, because the only uncorroborated evidence is things like alleging that he's a pedophile and all these kinds of things that are way beyond what she needs to get an acquittal or get the jury to see her self defense.

BANFIELD: Beating up the victim.

SMITH: Exactly. But let me say this about the journal. Yesterday on the stand, her defense brings out that there are ripped up pages. She took some out. Who took the rest out? And she said Travis also read the journal.

BANFIELD: How about that?

Real quickly, jurors get to ask questions. Almost unheard of. Some states very rare. This is magic.

POLITAN: It is. It's important. But lawyers hate it, because they can't control it. All of a sudden, the witness is being asked questions and we have no control. So both sides are a little wary. But when it's over, they get to ask.

BANFIELD: I said the "C" word, Casey Anthony, coming up after the break.

(LAUGHTER)

Don't go anywhere.

(LAUGHTER)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Back in black. You don't know how much I wanted to sing that. But this is a broken flustered Casey Anthony. She was forced out of hiding, by all things, her creditors. It was her first public appearance since her acquittal in the murder of her 2-year-old daughter, Caylee, back in 2011. And as usual, the scene was nuts. And if what this woman is saying is true -- let's not forget how she lies -- she has about $1,000 to her name and she is in debt for about $800,000, most of it legal fees. The jobless 26-year-old says that she lives rent free and that she's supported by, quote, "the kindness of others."

Ryan Smith and Vinnie Politan back with me now.

SMITH: Isn't that special?

BANFIELD: Isn't that.

You know, I didn't think that we would be joined again together to talk Casey Anthony, and here we go.

SMITH: Here we are.

BANFIELD: Is it because she hasn't given an interview to tell her side of story without being on a witness stand?

POLITAN: This is what's going on --

(CROSSTALK)

POLITAN: Go ahead, Ryan.

SMITH: No, no. Look, she's there -- if you believe her claims and if that judge says this is the kind of money you have, she's going to get that bankruptcy. And the big repercussion is she has three or four different lawsuits against her including that Zenaida Gonzalez lawsuit.

BANFIELD: Who was the only one to show up, by the way.

SMITH: Exactly. And that might go away.

(CROSSTALK)

POLITAN: I spoke to Matt Morgan this morning about it.

BANFIELD: He likes the publicity.

POLITAN: Well, the publicity, and they'll keep going forward and -- here's what going on, really, here is what I think the bankruptcy is all about. And I think you're right. It's about Casey Anthony telling her story without getting paid.

BANFIELD: Yes. POLITAN: If the civil suits go forward, like the Zenaida Gonzalez suit, she has to sit down in a deposition and answer questions without getting paid. And she doesn't want to do that. That's why she appealed her criminal convictions, which she's already served her time for. That's why she's filed bankruptcy, hoping it all goes away so she can get paid to talk, because she doesn't want to tell her story and answer qui questions without getting paid.

BANFIELD: Let me ask you this. And I won't suggest for a minute that she's been doing this, but if she's been secretly talking to the Dr. Phil's of the word and forging a $3 million to $10 million deal for that first interview, if she gets the bankruptcy proceeding her way, and she's declared bankrupt, and then, in a six month period, magically comes up with a $5 million deal, can she keep all that money?

SMITH: Oh, no. She won't be able to keep it all. It depends on what the bankruptcy court decides. But would you rather, let's say, get that money in, maybe you got to pay off Jose Baez and others, or you get that money and you still got to pay or millions to the possible creditors that could you have through those lawsuits. What they want to happen is make the lawsuits go away, the civil suits, with the Zenaida Gonzalez's and everybody else. Therefore, all I just have to worry about the $750,000 that I owe and maybe I'll make some off the top.

BANFIELD: I still don't understand why it's a defamation case for Zenaida because you have to have some kind of malice, and she didn't even know who she was. She just picked the name out of --

(CROSSTALK)

POLITAN: She's a member of the private sector and not a public figure.

BANFIELD: Right. A public figure.

POLITAN: If I defame Ashleigh ban field, you have to show malice. But I would never do that.

(LAUGHTER)

BANFIELD: That's why you're my guest today, baby.

All right, coming up, there is a Senator so angry he will tell anyone that will listen that the press got it wrong and that he needs to be corrected on a story about prostitution, and there is a prostitute saying she lied. It is not pretty.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Sex, lies, videotape and money. Remember the allegations Senator made Menendez parties with prostitutes? He denied those claims to Dana Bash last month, and it is looking like it just might have been a big made up story. The conservative web site "The Daily Caller" first reported all of these allegations, running video from a nameless woman who said that -- or several women that said that they had sex with Menendez and, in fact, were paid. But according to new court documents, an affidavit, 23-year-old Nexis de los Santos said she was, instead, paid to read a script, just read the story scripted. For its part, "The Daily Caller" says that Santos is not one of the two prostitutes that it interviewed for its big expose.

Our chief Congressional correspondent is live in Washington.

Dana Bash, it gets more complicated by the moment. But what we have is someone who has gone on record legally with an affidavit saying this was a lie, I was paid to lie. This has to be causing serious problems and a big investigation.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. As you can imagine, Senator Menendez, who told us last month it was not true, was eager to say, effectively, I told you so.

Let's listen to what he said a couple of hours ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ROBERT MENENDEZ, (D), NEW JERSEY: I don't know more than what I've read. But I do know that, from the very beginning, I said that nameless, faceless anonymous sources took the name, from right wing blogs, took the story, which were just false smears, right before an election cycle, attempted to do it then, and drove it into the mainstream press. But they were never anything other than false smears.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Now, the obvious question at this point is, who was behind this, if it was in fact false smears or instigated by a lawyer who apparently who is in the D.R., Dominican Republic, who organized this. The response from Senator Menendez was, your guess is as good as mine, but I hope they find out.

One twist is that ABC News is reporting its web site that that organization, along with "The Daily Caller" were given the opportunity to interview these women by Republican operatives. They say that they are protecting these operatives' anonymity, but they're Republican operatives. That adds another dimension into this, one that does play into Senator Menendez's allegations this is a political smear. But it's just the surface and difficult to get answers.

Our Drew Griffin has been in the Dominican Republic trying to find the lawyer. He didn't show up for an interview.

One other thing I should point out, Ashleigh, that is that this the salacious part of the story, talking about prostitutes. FBI is still investigating Senator Menendez in influence pedaling to help one of his major donors, and that is ongoing.

BANFIELD: So the plot thickens in the prostitutes, and the investigation continues in that secondary issue, which is, by no means, a small issue. Dana Bash, thank you for that.

A want to tap into my legal team of experts.

Joining me now is defense attorney, Joey Jackson, who is also "In Session's" contributor on our sister network, TruTV, and former Florida circuit court judge, David Young.

Let me start with this new report.

David, I want to get you to jump in on this.

Dana Bash said that ABC News has said that it was, quote, "Republican operatives that provided them with these names of prostitutes to interview." That is troublesome. Is it possible we could see reporters or media executives on the stand being asked for their sources?

DAVID YOUNG, FORMER FLORIDA CIRCUIT COURT JUDGE: Well, that's a definite possibility. It's amazing to me that a credible news organize like ABC News would rely on a right-wing blog and Republican political hacks.

You know, you expect certain news organizations to rely on that type of garbage, and they report on it all the time. But ABC, CBS, CNN, they should have known better. They really could cause a ripple effect, and it concerns me about the anonymity issue with these sources.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: Well, I'll stand up for them, and here's why. Sometimes you're dealt the hand you get. As a prosecutor, sometimes you use rats from jail cells to make your case. Sometimes news organizations gets tips from yucky people and take tips to other people, interview them, get the story and it sounds like this may have been what happened here.

Joey Jackson, weigh in on this.

I still want to know if we're going to have one of those moments where the media has to cough up your source in this criminal investigation or you, yourself, are going to go to jail.

JOEY JACKSON, ATTORNEY & CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Boy, it remains to be seen. Two things I think about offhand. Number one, poor Senator Menendez. The impact this had on him, and is having on him, until now. And then the second thing is, politics is a nasty business, thank goodness I decided not to go into it.

But ultimately, yes, I think there will be a full and fair investigation into the case. I think it could come to the point where we get into privileges, and that is media protecting sources which rightfully, and historically they have done for the integrity of the process. So stand by on this one because the investigation continues for sure. BANFIELD: Let me make sure that our viewers know. If you're Googling away trying to find ABC's story, you're not going find it. They have not published this. This was Dana Bash's reporting, and she's got lots of sources on Capitol Hill that.

But let me tell you this. I think it's got some legs, and if I were a betting person, I would guess this is going to be a big issue for an investigation.

Can you two stick around?

JACKSON: Huge.

Of course. For you Ashleigh, anything.

Anything, of course.

(LAUGHTER)

BANFIELD: I have another interesting story. If you find a surrogate mother to carry your child, who has the legal right to abort that child? And can you offer money to have that surrogate do so morally, legally? Answers next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: In most cases where a surrogate helps a couple to have a baby, it's a pretty happy ending, but not so for a couple in Connecticut and their surrogate. This storey's more like a nightmare. Halfway through the pregnancy, the parents offered the surrogate, named Crystal Kelly, $10,000 to have an abortion. Apparently, things weren't going well in the pregnancy and that's when things really started to spin off the tracks.

Here more aspects of that medical case, Elizabeth Cohen.

Elizabeth, this story -- the headline sounds like it not real, but it's very real.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: It's very real. It's very real. The woman we saw in the video offered $10,000 to have an abortion. When you see the baby, you can figure out why. This baby, at 20 weeks, in the middle of the pregnancy, they saw that she had a cleft lip, cleft pallet, and that was the least of it, a problem with her brain and very complex problems with her heart. And the parents who hired her said we want to abort this child.

Let's hear from Crystal herself because she can tell us what happened when they had that discussion.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRYSTAL KELLY, SURROGATE MOTHER: They said that I should try to be God-like and have mercy on the child and let her go.

COHEN: What did you say? KELLY: I told them it wasn't their decision to play God.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: So Crystal said, I'm not having an abortion. And the next thing that happened was the parents couldn't force her. You can't force someone to have an abortion. She didn't have one. They said, all right, this is our baby, when she's born, we're abandoning her.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: Legally.

(CROSSTALK)

COHEN: Legally, to the state of Connecticut, which you can do in Connecticut and many other states. And Crystal Kelly said I don't want that, the child will end up in foster care. She fled to Michigan, drove halfway across the country with her owner children, and she had the baby there. She was considered the legal mother in Michigan, because they're laws are different than Connecticut, and she found a family to adopt the baby. The baby's now living in a family with other children with special needs.

BANFIELD: I have 10 seconds left. But what will the child's life be like?

COHEN: We don't know. There's a 50/50 chance she'll walk, talk, be able to use her hands the way other children can. But she is, I will tell you, a happy baby. I met her.

BANFIELD: The pictures are amazing.

Elizabeth, thank you.

I could talk to this case for so long. I'm flat out of time.

Thank you so much.

And thank you, everyone, for watching.

AROUND THE WORLD is next.