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Dentist Infected Patients with HIV; Chain Store Family Extortion Plot; Prosecutors Blast Holmes Defense Team.

Aired March 29, 2013 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: And the fact that this dentist did treat a high population of people with diseases, that happens all over the country. But the fact that they just weren't doing what they were supposed to do in terms of the conditions within which they practiced dentistry is just --

(CROSSTALK)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Have you read this thing? It's disgusting. The complaint is unbelievable. I'm not a doctor and I know that you can't leave schedule a medications open and share vials between patients and reinsert needles. Just sounded like it was Frankenstein in there.

Paul, is there one of those cases where people can wheel their wheelbarrows to that office and sue for -- you name it?

PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR: A lot of people think that, but I was checking the Oklahoma medical malpractice statute and there are limitations of damages in Oklahoma. $300,000 cap on what they call non-economic loss, which is pain and suffering.

The hard part about this case, you go to this guy, you know you've been treated with a contaminated instrument and you're afraid you develop hepatitis or AIDS, but you never do. Should you be compensated for that fear that may haunt you for years?

HOSTIN: Absolutely.

BANFIELD: I wonder.

CALLAN: Very hard to prove that. They place limits in Oklahoma. So these won't be easy medical malpractice cases. So leave the wheelbarrow at home. Somebody who has actually developed hepatitis and we can tie it back to that dentist, that's a good case. But the other case is not such a great case.

BANFIELD: How about this, Sunny, I'll go one further. Paul said somebody who has developed hepatitis and can tie that hepatitis directly back to the clinic. What if that person walked freely among us with a dormant disease for years and years, affecting other people?

HOSTIN: Exactly.

(CROSSTALK) BANFIELD: -- who never came within a foot of that dentist's office?

HOSTIN: Isn't that something? It's as if it could never end. I mean, I suspect that they could possibly sue also. But again, I mean, this is everyone's worst nightmare. Right now we're hearing 7,000 patients. To your point, there could be so many others affected.

BANFIELD: It's mind boggling.

Paul, tell me about the practice of having dental assistants, who are not doctors, inserting a needle and an I.V. In fact, I want to hear straight from the head of the state dentistry board, what she said this morning about what they may have been up to. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUSAN ROGERS, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, OKLAHOMA BOARD OF DENTISTRY: The thing that was most upsetting to us because we take a very dim view of this from our board's perspective is he was allowing unauthorized unlicensed personnel to do I.V. sedation. And that is completely unacceptable and illegal in Oklahoma.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: And the complaint goes on, Paul Callan, to say that not only were they doing it, they were doing it while he wasn't even in the room. They were sedating these patients and choosing the levels of medication to sedate these patients before the dentist even arrived.

(CROSSTALK)

CALLAN: Shocking.

BANFIELD: Shocking, but what kind of crime? It show as recklessness, a negligence, but is an attempted manslaughter? If someone might have died later, what could this be?

CALLAN: It's clearly practicing medicine or dentistry without a license. There are statutes that criminalize that. That will be the lowest level of crime. It's very hard to reach the higher level. As shocking as this is, unless a patient actually died, it would be hard to prove that it was manslaughter or some kind of an attempted homicide or something. It's gross negligence and violation of practice statutes, but in the end, I think that's probably all it is.

(CROSSTALK)

HOSTIN: And there is still exposure there. Still criminal exposure. And we want this type of behavior criminalized I think.

BANFIELD: Sets an example for everyone else out there who is not properly use being their autoclave and not properly assigning their dental assistants.

Sunny Hostin, Paul Callan, thank you both. Family secrets, a fired housekeeper, a multimillion-dollar blackmail plot, and, yes, all of it caught on tape, and you'll hear it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: There is big money in trinkets and earrings for teens and tweens. And the disgruntled daughter of a fired housekeeper in Florida allegedly wanted a lot of that money. And she allegedly thought a pile of dirty laundry was going to help her get it. Are you confused?

Sarah Ganim has the story.

SARAH GANIM, CNN CONTRIBUTOR (voice-over): You probably haven't heard of this family of multi-millionaires, but likely you've seen, shopped or maybe got your ears pierced at one of the accessory stores they created. Now police say they're the victims of a blackmail plot all caught on audiotape.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: $3 million?

CAMILLE BROWN, CHARGED WITH EXTORTION: That's the minimum.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

BROWN: I can go higher, but that's the minimum.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, they're not going to agree to $3 million.

(END AUDIO FEED)

GANIM: The woman on that tape is Camille Brown, the daughter of the long-time housekeeper for Roland Schaefer, the man who first opened Claire's accessory stores.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

BROWN: I feel that the family should -- shouldn't even think twice about paying that amount to get this material back.

(END AUDIO FEED)

GANIM: The material? Brown says she has embarrassing letters and journals details domestic abuse in the Schaefer home.

(on camera): These documents say Camille Brown came to this hotel thinking she'd be meeting with a family representative. Instead, she met with an undercover officer who recorded their conversation.

(BEGIN AUDIO FEED)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't doubt that you have the documents. What we're saying is we want the documents back so they're not going a threat to be released anymore. BROWN: Right. You'll have them as soon as I have my payments.

(END AUDIO FEED)

GANIM: Brown was arrested in the parking lot, charged with extortion.

Police say the blackmail began just days after Brown's mom was fired. In an e-mail, Brown's attorney denies any extortion and says Brown was given the letters by Roland Schaefer's own wife. Not true, the family attorney, William Shepherd, told us, adding this is about taking advantage of an elderly couple.

WILLIAM SHEPHERD, SCHAEFER FAMILY ATTORNEY: Many family members rely and trust on the help of trained professionals who will look after both medical needs and day to day needs of elderly parents, and this was one of those situations. Unfortunately, it ended the way it did with trust betrayed.

GANIM: And they want their journals and letters back.

Brown isn't talking. But in the court file, a draft agreement she signed, she promises if she gets the $3 million, all efforts to coerce, control, blackmail or extort the Schaefer family will end.

Sarah Ganim, CNN, West Palm Beach, Florida.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: And perhaps the lesson would be, which my two very smart attorneys will tell you, don't blackmail people.

(LAUGHTER)

Hey, I want you to both weigh in and tell me a lot of things about it. A, when does blackmail start? B, what can you get for it? Do you end up in the clink? Do you have to pay? Lots of questions, coming up in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Want to get back to the legal briefs with my excellent attorneys, Sunny Hostin and Paul Callan, both still with me.

So I said before the break, lesson, don't ever blackmail people.

(LAUGHTER)

But the bigger question here is -- and I'll start with you, Sunny, because you're laughing -- a lot of elderly people are at risk for this very same thing. You don't have to be a big jewelry store chain or big celebrity. A lot of elderly people get targeted this way.

HOSTIN: Absolutely. It's one of the things that I think people specialize in elder law have to deal with. Extortion is a serious crime. Punishment varies, but you're talking about generally a felony. It's a federal offense, as well. And you could spend up to 15 years in prison for doing something like that. And I find it fairly easy to prove. I mean, in some states, just by making the threat, if you're trying to get money and threatening to reveal damaging information, just making the threat, it could be verbal, nonverbal, that could be considered a crime. So it's unbelievable that our elderly and others are oftentimes targeted like this.

(CROSSTALK)

HOSTIN: And we talk about dumb criminals -- wow. It's in writing and also on tape.

BANFIELD: So many of them are.

Let me ask you this, Paul. Do you have to have a good, you know, on- camera setup to do the catch them in the act in order to prevail if you want to go to the police and stop these blackmailers from doing this kind of thing or could you prevail in a "their word against mine"? How much do you have to have before you know you'll be OK legally?

CALLAN: In a normal case, if you go to the police when this starts, they will come into the picture and they will wire you or they will set up your phone and they'll tape record it for you. What I found to be interesting, in this case, the defendant in the case prepared a release that said basically --

(LAUGHTER)

CALLAN: -- if you give me the money, we won't blackmail you. So I would say she needs better legal advice. You generally don't want to admit to the crime in the release.

BANFIELD: Paul, I haven't seen the case file, but are you kidding me? Did the contract really --

(CROSSTALK)

CALLAN: Yes, Exactly.

SUNNY: That's what I was giggling about.

No criminal case is a slam dunk, but that one comes kind of close.

CALLAN: Yes, exactly.

You don't have to be wired to win that case. That's the way it is.

BANFIELD: Dumb with a capital "D."

CALLAN: Yes, for elderly people, always a threat. Florida, they see a lot of elderly people, a lot of rich elderly people, they're at risk. And go to the police when this happens.

BANFIELD: And they can help.

(CROSSTALK) BANFIELD: Paul Callan, Sunny Hostin, thank you.

Paul, stay with me for a moment, because you and I had a big conversation off camera about the death penalty. And it turns out the James Holmes case, in Colorado, prosecutors are pretty upset that the defense has leaked information about a possible plea deal. And I need you to explain why the deal needs to be considered but how it could end up effecting generations down the road.

First, though, before we do that, Paul, take a break, think about it for a moment.

I just have to tell you something. All the talk around the office is March Madness. This is the holy grail of men's college basketball. I have tried, I have tried so hard to get invested in this. I am a hockey fan. But you know if you filled out a bracket it is not an easy thing to do. There's 63 games and this tournament has been so unpredictable. Already witnessed bracket busting moments. For instance, the number-one seed, Indiana, lost last night to the number- four seed, Syracuse. And Ohio State dropped a big three-pointer -- that's what I'm told they're called -- late in the final seconds against Arizona to secure the win.

And then, of course, we have some big winners and big losers in our very own CNN anchor bracket challenge. I don't want to brag. But looky, looky who is at number one.

(LAUGHTER)

You know what's so funny? I know nothing about basketball. I'm tied in first place with Christine Romans. And to my knowledge, Christine doesn't know that much either. This means we beat out some heavy hitters in the world of basketball-loving, like Wolf Blitzer and Brooke Baldwin and Chris Cuomo and Kate Bolduan and John Berman. Yes, it's enough to get the control room of this program going. Because Omar Butcher, in the yellow, finest producer ever, you did my bracket, my man. I'm so thankful. Because I still wonder when they get their goals, how they score, how they put those baskets in the net. Number one, Omar, thank you.

You can follow my bracket, you can rate yours against Omar's bracket. Find out where you stand against Omar, my team and me. Go to CNN.com/brackets.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Prosecutors in the Colorado movie theater shooting trial are pretty darn angry it seems with the suspect's defense team, James Holmes' defense team. They are talking a lot about a plea deal, the defense team saying they offered one. That it might take that off the table. The prosecutors saying, there was no formal offer. Don't go there and don't make that public because that wrecks the process. A lot of questions about all of this and of course it does lead to the question, what about a plea deal? What about avoiding a trial? What about saying, OK, we will take death off the table? Let's just put you away forever. No chance for parole. I want to bring Paul Callan back into this conversation.

You had and I had a lengthy conversation about the way that could go this week. We had another conversation after the show. That's why I wanted to bring you back. Let's say they get past this bitter dispute and let's say the prosecutors pursue a death penalty trial and prevail and in subsequent appeals, getting way ahead of myself, prevail. There is still the chance of execution that at the time of execution in decades, they won't prevail.

CALLAN: Imposition of the death penalty in the United States takes at least 10 years of appeals is generally the rule. We're kind of looking at what will the Supreme Court be saying 10 years from now about the death penalty? There tends to be a trend towards reducing imposing it. Prosecutors, being realists that they are, are going to be looking at that, saying, why are we going through the huge battle when, in the end, he is going to end up with life anyway.

BANFIELD: And not just a huge battle. Look, you said, it takes somewhere between 10-20 years to get to an execution and millions of dollars.

CALLAN: This is very true. But I have to say, Ashleigh, there is a flip side to this. The voters enacted the death penalty in Colorado. This case is the poster boy for that. He is mentally ill. But is he legally insane? OK?

BANFIELD: Big difference.

CALLAN: He did meticulous planning and bought the weapons and booby trapped his apartment. He killed 12, injured 58. If you go and pose the death penalty, Holmes is the kind of guy who gets the death penalty.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: If you are not going to carry it out, what is the point of spending the money --

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: -- and dragging these families through these trials and appeals?

CALLAN: Maybe some of the family support the death penalty and some don't. I don't know what the polling comes out on that. But the prosecutor is walking a tight rope. He is looking at exactly what you are saying, which is the realistic view of the world, which is, even if I get the death penalty, it will probably never be imposed. But on the other hand, people are going to be furious if he lets Holmes walk after such a brutal crime. So this is why you make the big bucks as the head guy.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: I appreciate you sending me some Supreme Court decisions that gave the obvious wording you need. If you are going to put the needle in someone's arm, they have to be, number one, they can't be mentally retarded with an I.Q. of low 70. He is not. He's fine. And they have to be competent, aware of the punishment they are about to suffer and why they are going to suffer it and have a rational understanding of the reason for the execution. I think 20 years locked up in a box, I could see someone that sick not being competent after all those expensive appeals.

CALLAN: You know what people may be surprised about, too? A lot of case law where somebody is not competent, and they medicate him so they wheel him in and put the needle in.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: Can you come back and talk about that later?

Paul Callan, he is so smart, it kills me.

Back in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: For some kids, growing up in Camden, New Jersey, it is hard. It is considered one of the most violent cities in the country. 42 percent of its population is below the poverty line. It has one of the lowest high school graduation rates in the state. That's the bad news. But there is one woman that believes that you can dance your way out of those ugly statistics and she is doing it. Meet "CNN Hero," Tawanda Jones.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TAWANDA JONES, CNN HERO: Who are we?

(SHOUTING)

(MUSIC)

JONES: It is very hard for children growing up here today. It is dangerous. You can hear gunshots almost every other night. These kids want more. They don't want to be dodging bullets for the rest of their life.

(SHOUTING)

JONES: My name is Tawanda Jones. My mission is to empower the youth of Camden, New Jersey, through this structured drill team.

(SHOUTING)

JONES: What I try to do for them to go to the right path. It's simple. You instill discipline.

(SHOUTING)

JONES: Drill team is really just a facade to bring these children in, because it is something they love to do. Once I have them, I introduce them to the college life.

(MUSIC)

UNIDENTIFIED GIRL: CSS changed me a whole lot. My dad was shot and killed. When my dad passed, I stopped going to class. I started hanging with the wrong people.

JONES: Did you complete your homework? Let me check it.

UNIDENTIFIED GIRL: She is my second mom. Without her, I don't know where I would be right now.

JONES: In Camden, the high school graduation rate is 49 percent. In my program, it is 100 graduate. We have never had a drop-out.

UNIDENTIFIED GIRL: My grades now, I have a GPA of a 3.0. I want to be a sports manager.

JONES: We need to take back our city and, most importantly, take back our youth. Let them know we really care about them.

(MUSIC)

(SHOUTING)

JONES: I don't think people really understand how important it is to have these children succeed. When you do this, you get great rewards, better than money.

(MUSIC)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: Of the 4,000 kids who have been through Tawanda's program, about 80 percent, 80, have gone on to college. And you can learn more about Tawanda's work and also nominate somebody that's doing his or her part to make the world a better place for all of us. Just go to CNNheros.com. You can do that any time, like now, or you should wait --