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Jane Velez-Mitchell
Jodi`s Secret Strategy? Defense Demands a Mistrial; Tornado Devastates Oklahoma City Suburb
Aired May 20, 2013 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The power flashes, power flashes. It looks like at this time, it`s tracking right for us, Mike.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a very intense tornado now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is it is! I just said it, "This is it! We`re done." We thought we were gone.
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, HOST: Good evening. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, coming to you live.
Breaking news, utter devastation. A massive -- and I mean massive -- tornado has hit the Oklahoma City area. Parts of greater metropolitan Oklahoma City appear to have been destroyed.
We do not have all the information. Information coming in fast and furious. We`ve just been told that there are six deaths confirmed. The tornado, estimated to have been at least two miles wide in parts, destroying virtually everything in its path.
Reports now of the tornado hitting an elementary school. Word of people pulling out children from a classroom. No word yet on the condition of those children.
An extraordinary tornado with upwards of 200,000 people in its path. Houses leveled. We do not know how many houses have been leveled. But we are being told, it is a considerable number.
And as one person described, it was as if a whole bunch of houses were put in a blender. They turned the blender on, and then they spat all those houses out. We will have a live report for you in a moment.
But first, chaos and confusion and heartbreak of a different kind here in Phoenix, Arizona. We are here outside the Maricopa County Courthouse. And take a look at all this police tape. We`re going to give you a roundabout view.
The police, sheriff`s department set up a whole bunch of tape, expecting, expecting a huge crowd, because there was a good possibility that today the jury would decide whether or not to give Jodi Arias the death penalty. Instead, another shocker: chaos in the courtroom as the defense demanded a mistrial.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JUAN MARTINEZ, PROSECUTOR: You`re the one that did this, right?
JODI ARIAS, CONVICTED OF MURDER: Yes.
KIRK NURMI, JODI`S DEFENSE ATTORNEY: When this intimidation began, almost the very day that Miss Arias started her case.
MARTINEZ: Were you crying when you were stabbing him?
NURMI: Convicted of first-degree murder or not...
MARTINEZ: Was he screaming?
ARIAS (singing): It might change my memory.
MARTINEZ: And he`s feeling like he`s having a heart attack?
NURMI: This cannot be a modern-day version of a stoning or a witch trial.
MARTINEZ: All the way until he died, until she put him into another life.
NURMI: The state attacked expert witnesses. We will not be calling witnesses in the defense case.
ARIAS (singing): O, night divine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: It was a jaw-dropper in court. What the heck was going on?
First the defense demanded a mistrial. Then they were denied that. They said, "We want off the case." Jodi`s attorneys said, "We want off the case. Get us off the case." The judge said no.
OK, HLN legal correspondent, Jean Casarez. You were there. Extraordinary. I`ve never seen -- honestly, I have never seen anything this crazy in court.
JEAN CASAREZ, HLN LEGAL CORRESPONDENT: No. And especially from the defense. I mean, they`ve been calm, cool, and collected, mounting their argument, but they were absolutely livid. You could see it.
The prosecutor was pretty calm, but the defense stood up and said, "Your honor, we are asking for a mistrial," and they started from the beginning. The cameras in the courtroom. The judge disallowed sequestration of the jury. Because of that, they said it created an atmosphere so that now witnesses won`t even take the stand to defend Jodi Arias in her penalty phase. Of course, there`s another...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Because they said they were scared. I mean, they`re -- the bottom line here is that the defense said, "Oh, we have nobody who`s going to sit in that chair and defend Jodi Arias, because they`re scared." And particularly, they pointed out this woman, Patti, threats to her life.
CASAREZ: Yes. And it`s in a sealed letter, so we don`t know everything, but there were threats to her life, so that she felt she couldn`t testify to try to save Jodi`s life.
And even with the judge saying, "She doesn`t have to be videotaped and no audio of her testimony." And we learned that the judge even had allowed, we could have a sealed proceeding. So the jury would have to be present, but it would be sealed. Nobody would ever know what the testimony was, and she still is refusing to testify.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. But the prosecutor, Juan Martinez says, "Not so fast." This really isn`t about her feeling that her life is in danger. It`s that she`s got some legal problems. We`re going to tell you about that in a little bit. And he essentially says that, when he talked to her, she took the fifth on some things, because she had legal problems. So that there was a completely different reason for this, a good friend of Jodi Arias`s not taking the stand and speaking in Jodi`s defense.
Now, imagine the jury, how many weeks -- it`s been since January 2. It`s now, just to give you a hint, something like, what, 98 degrees out here? So, OK, so the jury must be going mad. I mean, this has got to be incredible.
Selin Darkalstanian, you`re our senior producer. What is this jury going through? They came in today thinking that they were going to make a very important decision, and they basically said, go home.
SELIN DARKALSTANIAN, HLN PRODUCER: The judge told the jury to be here and ready to go at 10 a.m. today. But you have to understand that, by the time they brought the jury in, it was an hour to an hour and a half later. So the jury is just sitting in a room...
(AUDIO GAP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SAMANTHA ALEXANDER, SISTER OF TRAVIS: Our childhood made us strong and able to conquer anything.
This was the last time I saw Travis. He talked me into taking this picture, even though I was in PJs. It makes me cry every time I look at it. I am so glad he talked me into taking this picture. I will cherish it for the rest of my life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. On our show, we believe in full disclosure. Here is how it works, ladies and gentlemen.
I was live outside the courtroom, and the courthouse behind me, about a block away, our camera guy, and so if I sound out of breath, I ran down the block into a studio that we have set up here, a mobile studio, so we can continue our show.
I want to debate it. Let`s debate it. Are we alienating this jury? This courageous jury has been here since January 2, doing their duty. And still they walk in day after day after day, and there is delay after delay after delay. Let`s debate it, starting with Jon Leiberman. Is this a slap in the face to these jurors?
JON LEIBERMAN, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, it is, but, you know, Jane, I don`t think it`s going to have any impact. And the reason being that, you know, this jury is so invested right now, they have been here for the better part of four months. They don`t like Jodi Arias; they don`t believe Jodi Arias.
And, you know, this jury knows they have a job to do and, despite the delays, despite Jodi being on the stand for 18 days, they are here to finish their job. And I expect that`s exactly what they`ll do when we come back tomorrow and we hear from Jodi Arias.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Evangeline Gomez, for the defense, I think there can be a boomerang effect. If all these people walk in and their valuable time, they sit there and then they`re told to go home, could they take it out on the defendant?
EVANGELINE GOMEZ, ATTORNEY: Well, of course -- of course, they could take it out on the defendant. But the issue here is that you have a defense who made two wonderful motions today, to make sure that their client, if on appeal, is entitled to a fair trial. And I think those motions cannot be ignored. They were a great tactic. We have to remember...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are you kidding me?!
GOMEZ: We don`t have trials to protect the rights of juries. We have trials to protect the right so defendants.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Are you kidding me? You think it`s a great tactic for the defense to say, "I want off the case"? I mean, what kind of confidence does that give...
GOMEZ: They said they wanted off the case under Strickland [SIC] -- they said they wanted off the case under Strickland [SIC], because they felt the judge was not allowing them to put forth a case where they could put forth an adequate defense for Miss Jodi Arias. And that`s why asked for the motion to withdraw. Because they couldn`t serve as effective counsel.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Stacey Honowitz, please, bring some sense to these proceedings.
STACEY HONOWITZ, FLORIDA PROSECUTOR: Well, first of all, you know, juries, you know, are used to the delays, unfortunately. I don`t think it`s going to weigh against the defense.
I mean, being in trial is the most unpredictable type of theater you could ever have, because you never know what`s going to happen. You can never predict what`s going to go on in a day.
As far as them making these motions, I`m not surprised that they made these motions. I`m not surprised that they tried to withdraw, but the judge said no. Denied both of them.
Listen, you had adequate -- we can make room. We can seal the courtroom. They can testify by videotape. We`ll put in the safeguards that need to be put in. You are the lawyers on this case. Move forward. And the judge did the right thing by denying the motions.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jon Leiberman.
LEIBERMAN: Well, and it almost felt like Mr. Nurmi was throwing a pseudo-temper tantrum when the judge didn`t immediately grant the motion for a mistrial. He sort of struck by with, "Well, fine, then. We`re not going to have any mitigation witness." Almost like that was supposed to, you know, bother -- bother the judge ...
GOMEZ: No, it had to do with -- it had to do with intimidation. Just so we clarify.
LEIBERMAN: But what I said was, it was as if Mr. Nurmi was throwing a tantrum.
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on a second. Let me ask everybody a question. We`re going to go around the panel.
How many people feel that the reason that Patti Womack did not testify -- this is Jodi Arias`s good friend from the sixth grade. This is the one who went to her wedding, Jodi was a bridesmaid at Patti`s wedding. How many think that she did not testify because she was in fear for her life? Answer that. Raise your hands, panel.
OK, nobody thinks, nobody -- nobody believes that she was in fear for her life. Not even the people on the defense?
GOMEZ: Oh, I believe -- yes, my hands up! I believe, I believe.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK, there we go. We see the hand.
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Hello?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Jayne Weintraub, do you really feel, given that she had the opportunity to testify in a sealed situation, where there wouldn`t be cameras, where nobody would see her go in and out, that she`s really so scared to death that she would not take the stand for her friend, Jodi?
WEINTRAUB: Yes, because here`s what wasn`t being sealed. It is like a stoning atmosphere out there. Just like with Casey Anthony. I mean, what`s up with these strangers coming from hundreds of miles to get a glimpse of this woman? I mean, this is not entertainment; this is somebody`s life or death. She`s a human being; she is a defendant in a criminal case.
But does she think that she can escape the threats with her name being released, her address. The transcript is still going to be part of the trial.
The intimidation that Juan Martinez has utilized in this case throughout to the defense lawyer, to the witnesses, to the experts is disgraceful.
LEIBERMAN: Oh, come on.
WEINTRAUB: It`s -- his demeanor -- oh, you come on, Jon. How many death cases have you tried? I`ve tried a lot more than you have. I`ve tried over 100 trials. I`ve never seen a prosecutor so out of control and disrespectful to everybody, and you know what? I blame the judge. The judge has lost control here.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Let`s talk about the other witness who failed to appear today, and his name is Darryl Brewer. And he was the ex-boyfriend of Jodi Arias. They lived together for four years. And he had already testified that they had a nice relationship, that he trusted Jodi with his young son. And let`s listen to some of what he said previously.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NURMI: Do you know this lady here in the blue shirt?
DARRYL BREWER, FORMER BOYFRIEND OF JODI ARIAS: Yes.
NURMI: How do you know her?
BREWER: I know Jodi because we were in love.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Let`s debate it. Why? Why did we not hear from this guy?
Now, I know for a fact that he was in a hotel right a block away, because I`m staying at the same hotel, as are my producers, and he was standing right there. And we talked to him, and my producer, Selin Darkalstanian, talked to him. He was sitting there waiting for a call. He was willing to go over to the courtroom and, courageously, despite whatever intimidation might be there, speak on behalf of his ex-girlfriend, Jodi Arias. The only one in the end of the day who was willing to do so. They did not call him.
Why did they not call him? And I`ll throw it to somebody on the defense, Jayne Weintraub.
WEINTRAUB: I think that he was intimidated; I think that he was scared. I think that Martinez must have something on him or potentially enough to threaten him, maybe his boss, maybe where he works, who knows? And the reality is...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: No, no, no, no, no. He was there! You have to understand something, he was there. He was ready and willing to go over. We saw him sitting there.
WEINTRAUB: Jane! Jane, Jane, Jane...
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on. The reason he didn`t go over there is that the defense said, "We`re not putting on any witnesses in our mitigation."
LEIBERMAN: Right.
(CROSSTALK)
WEINTRAUB: Based on this ruling...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: He wasn`t called to go over there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Do me a favor. Pan out to a two-shot. Let`s get Jordan Rose in on this.
Jordan, it`s nice to have you. You`re part of our debate panel. And again, full disclosure, she`s supposed to be in a little box, but since the camera out there died, now we`re in a two-shot. So value added.
Jordan, why do you think Darryl Brewer came all the way down here, was sitting in a hotel a block away, where we`re staying -- we saw him -- and they didn`t call him to come over to testify?
JORDAN ROSE, ATTORNEY: Well, really, what I think is that Jodi is going to throw us all for a bit of a loop tomorrow. And she`s going to get up, and she`s going to ask that she be given the death penalty, just as she said in that jailhouse interview.
And I think that her defense attorneys are in a bit of conflict. Because if they put up any witnesses, those witnesses are going to be pleading to save her, because she`s a good person or what have you. Where`s her mom? Where`s Darryl? Where`s this other woman? And if they put those people up, that`s directly contrary to what their client may say tomorrow. And that`s a problem for them. They can`t do that.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, sure they can. I think they can say -- here`s what I`d say, OK? I`d say, "Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, our client is sick in the head. She is very ill. We`ve heard many different diagnoses over the course of this very long-running trial, from PTSD to battered women`s syndrome to borderline personality disorder to bipolar, and you know what? There`s a lot of overlapping symptoms. But the bottom line is ever since she was a kid, she was very sick.
"We learned more about this as the case progressed and we got to know our client. We cannot control our client, just like her mother couldn`t control her. And you know, she is sick."
But this mitigator never got out there. I`m not saying it justifies her behavior, but it could cause someone to say, "Well, maybe she`s not in entire control of the horrific things she`s done." I don`t know why they haven`t done that.
And we`re going to debate it on the other side. Is there a missing mitigator? Did they throw in the towel on this case by basically saying today, "We want off the case. And well, you won`t let us off the case, so no mitigation, no defense of Jodi Arias." Unheard of!
Now, on the other side of the break, we`re also going to talk more about this horror story unfolding in the Oklahoma City area, this tornado that has reached untold, unimaginable devastation. Look at this thing. Two miles wide, houses destroyed, children being pulled out of their classrooms as we speak. We`ll have the very latest.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re in sixth grade, there at the school. When you left the school, can you tell me what it looked like when you walked outside after that storm hit? What was left?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was just debris. There was just cars beat up. My mom was flipping out about her car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you doing all right, bud? I know this is pretty wild to take all in at one time. Have you had a chance to talk to your mom?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, she was on top of me. She was able to be with me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is she a teacher?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, she`s a sixth grade teacher, as well. She was my fourth hour.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOB VAN DILLEN, HLN METEOROLOGIST (via phone): Wow, unbelievable stuff, Jane.
All right. So right now I`m looking at the coverage, of the footage we have outside of Oklahoma City. This is Moore, and you can see right now, the debris still out there from the school that got hit. From the preliminary estimates, we`re looking at an EF-4 tornado. And that has a threshold similar between 166- and 200-mile-per-hour winds. I mean, that is just utter destruction.
And this is the school right here. And if you look at some of the wind categories, we see destruction of a well-engineered school like this. And you see part of the building totally wiped out and destroyed. I mean, that`s 150- to 200-mile-per-hour winds right here.
Some of the other video we have, also -- and it`s not just the school. There are third graders trapped right here. You can see the rescue line right there, trying to free the third graders. No -- no details on how many have survived yet.
But we see other footage too. It`s not just the school. There`s houses all around the neighborhood that are just absolutely flattened. And we`re looking at houses that are completely swept off their foundations, right off their slab. And that would put the wind near 200 miles per hour. That could put the pressure of the wind over 200, and that could make it an EF-5 tornado.
And the problem with this is, that it was only on the ground for about 30 minutes or so. It started out as a weak thunderstorm, and then within about 5 to 10 minutes, the funnel formed. It gained strength very rapidly. People had about a 10- to 15-minute notice before they knew they had to get underground. And after that, you can see what`s left. It is unbelievable.
You can see right here, that school in Moore, Oklahoma, the rescue line continues. You can see people in the yellow hats, trying to pull the kids out. We`ll have more after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARTINEZ: You`re the one that did this, right?
ARIAS: Yes.
NURMI: When this intimidation began, almost the very day that Miss Arias started her case.
MARTINEZ: Were you crying when you were stabbing him?
NURMI: Convicted of first-degree murder or not...
MARTINEZ: Was he screaming?
ARIAS (singing): It might change my memory
MARTINEZ: And he`s feeling like he`s having a heart attack.
NURMI: This cannot be a modern-day version of a stoning or a witch trial.
MARTINEZ: All the way until he died. Until she put him into another life.
NURMI: The state attacked expert witnesses. We will not be calling witnesses in the defense case.
ARIAS (singing): O, night divine...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Just a crazy, chaotic day in court, as the defense says, "Hey, there`s a witness who`s too scared to testify in Jodi`s defense on her behalf, in the mitigation phase. She`s been intimidated; it`s a witch hunt mentality here. It`s like Jodi is going to be stoned to death." And then he says, "I want a mistrial." And the judge says, no. And then he says, "Well, I want off the case, then. Get us off the case. We don`t want to represent Jodi Arias anymore." The judge said no.
So then what happened, Jean Casarez? What is going to happen tomorrow?
CASAREZ: Well, we`ll believe it when we see it, but it is supposed to be Jodi Arias giving a statement to the judge and the jury, right in this courthouse, tomorrow morning, first thing.
But my question is, they had all day. I mean, why wasn`t it done today? You can`t tell me the two mitigation witnesses were going to take all day. Jodi would have been giving her statement. It`s before closing arguments.
So for some reason -- and there was an issue. I saw that between the attorneys. Then the judge, though, just dismissed court for the entire day.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: There is something going on, as per usual this case, some kind of mystery, and I think it might have something to do with what Jodi Arias plans to say tomorrow.
Remember the infamous interview she gave after she was found guilty of murder one, when she talked to KSAZ, and she said, "I want death." Let`s play it, and then we`re going to hear from our own Dr. Drew.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ARIAS: I said years ago that I would rather get death than life, and that still is true today. I believe death is the ultimate freedom, so I`d rather just have my freedom as soon as I can get it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you`re saying you actually prefer getting the death penalty to being in prison for life?
ARIAS: Yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Dr. Drew, thank you so much for joining us. I was talking to you last night, I believe, or a couple of nights ago, about what Jodi is up to, psychologically. Why she would give that interview and say, "Give me death." What is she doing? And could she do the same thing again tomorrow, Dr. Drew?
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN ANCHOR: Absolutely. Because we know that she has psychological testing that documents, in fact, that she has a borderline personality disorder.
And Jane, you and I talked off-camera and off-mike the other night, and I think I sort of surprised you with this mechanism that borderlines very commonly use, called projection of identification, where they disavow their own feelings and put them into other people.
So what she is saying, when she says, "I want the death penalty," she`s saying, "I have murderous rage inside of me." Of course, we all know that, because we`ve seen the product of that murderous rage. "But I can`t -- I disavow it. You are going to kill me and then be guilty of my rage." Isn`t that nice? And then you see duper`s delight on her face, a little bit of glee when she says that. "Yes, get me out of here fast. You kill me, and then I`ll have made you guilty for acting out my rage."
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, so you`re saying, essentially, that she wants to play the martyr. That her borderline personality disorder has her wanting to get up there and have her moment, where she plays the martyr, and in a sense says, "Yes, kill me." And that this is killing their -- her attorneys psychologically.
I mean, Jean Casarez, I`ve got to bring you back in. You`ve covered so many trials. Have you ever heard? We`re on the eve of something even more extraordinary, as crazy as today was, that Jodi Arias might get up there -- might, might, might -- and say what she said, which is, "Kill me!" She might tell the jury. Have you ever heard of such a thing?
CASAREZ: She definitely might. You know, with this case and with Jodi, once she starts talking, she can say whatever she wants. Right? I mean, there can be objections, and her attorney can call for a side bar, but she`s going to say what she wants to say.
And that`s what I think is the amazing aspect, because her life hangs in balance with this jury.
And remember, Martinez is going to get to have closing arguments. And although he can`t cross-examine her, he`s going to hear, as the jury is, what she says, and they`re going to be fair comment of what his ears have just heard in court, what Jodi has just said.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, you`re going to experience a little backlash from the intense sun here, but we`re going to turn around and we`re going to show you something that should make Jodi Arias think twice, think a lot.
Jacqui (inaudible), my producer, you`re going to stand in here and take a look at this. This is the cell, the size of the cell -- see that white? You can see the white, you can actually walk around it and give us a sense. This is the size of the cell that she will live in, ok, if she gets the death sentence. Now, if you do this, if you take this and say, this is the bunk right here, ok, this is the bunk, so then look at this, she has even less. This is a giant coffin, essentially, she would be living in what amounts to a large coffin. This is extraordinary.
I wonder, and I don`t know where Dr. Drew, we`ll bring in Dr. Drew -- I wonder if she really understands what she`s saying, when she says, give me the death penalty. I wonder, Dr. Drew, if she understands that she`s going to be in something the size of a very large coffin for approximately 12 years. That`s how long the average prisoner sits in that box before they go to get the actual lethal injection, Dr. Drew.
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST: Remember, Jane, her version of reality sort of begs no alternative, as she sees it. In her mind, she`s going to use the secret, she`s going to wish for something, and she`s going to get her freedom through death very quickly, much quicker than other people, so she doesn`t have to live in that cell. She may -- you may see her appealing for something like that tomorrow. That`s something that certainly could happen.
But I can tell you for sure, people with borderline disorders, and I don`t want to cast aspersions on them, because they don`t deserve to be even in the same category as Jodi, even though they have the same disorder, but they can be very frustrating and unsatisfying to deal with. So whatever she tells us tomorrow, I predict we`re all going to be very frustrated when it`s done.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, remember, her dear friend, Patty Womack, Jodi was the bridesmaid at Patty`s wedding, Jodi took photographs for Patty, Patty knew her since the sixth grade, they were dear friends. Here`s what Patty had to say about Jodi, but what she did not say in court, because she claims she was too terrified of the backlash. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PATTY WOMACK, FRIEND OF JODI ARIAS: She was a kind person. She was funny. Like everybody knows, she`s a beautiful artist and photographer. She was athletic, actually. She`s extremely funny and just everybody loved her. In fact, everybody just wanted -- she was a great person. Everybody wanted to be Jodi`s friend.
KIRK NURMI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Now we`re in a situation, judge, where a key mitigation witness, someone who knew miss Arias long before Mr. Alexander came along and came into her life, has been intimidated --
JUAN MARTINEZ, PROSECUTOR: When I started to talk about her drug use as it involved the witness and the defendant. At that point, she deferred and chose not to answer. And she indicated that it was her belief that she should assert her Fifth Amendment rights.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to go out to my very special guest, Clancy Talbot, a dear friend of Travis Alexander, the victim -- Clancy, thank you so much for joining us. I`m certainly sure that you`ve heard about all of the bizarre developments in court today. Jodi Arias, her attorneys basically saying, we don`t want to represent her, after losing their bid for a mistrial, and now Jodi coming back tomorrow.
You knew Jodi. Do you think she`s going to stand up there tomorrow and say, "kill me", or do you think she`s going to plead for her life?
CLANCY TALBOT, FRIEND OF TRAVIS ALEXANDER: Who knows with Jodi? My personal feeling about her interview about saying she wants the death penalty is just kind of like a manipulation. I don`t think she wants the death penalty, because that would be ultimate torture for her, to keep her in a cell, secluded from everyone else. So I think that that`s, you know, kind of her reverse psychology, if you will, about that part of her interview.
Who knows what she`ll do tomorrow. I don`t know. Today when I heard there was a mistrial, the first thing I thought of was they`re going to say that --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: There wasn`t mistrial. There wasn`t a mistrial. It was a request for a mistrial that was denied.
TALBOT: When they asked -- when they asked for a mistrial. Right.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Yes.
TALBOT: When they requested the mistrial, I figured it was probably about the witness and, you know, there would be something there about her not wanting to testify and I think that they kind of had everything set to play out how it did, if things were denied and went the way they did.
And I agree, I don`t remember who said it, but it was like Kirk Nurmi was throwing a tantrum saying, well, if you`re not going to give us what we want, then we`re not going to represent her, we`re not going to call any witnesses. And it`s amazing, you know, you never know what`s going to happen with this case. And that`s Jodi -- you never know what`s going to happen next.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, absolutely. Her ex-boyfriend, Darryl Brewer (ph), the man she dated before she met Travis, with whom she had a four- year relationship. He was -- and my producer, senior booker, Selin Darkalstanian actually talked to him -- where was he and was he ready to take the stand, even though they decided not to call him? The defense decided not to call him at the 11th hour.
TALBOT: Jane, I saw him 15 minutes before court started today, in the lobby of our hotel. And he was just hanging out, talking on the phone. And I approached him and he was sitting there waiting for the call to go upstairs to testify. So we went into court, the defense said, they`re not going to call any witnesses.
And when I came back out of court, he was still sitting in the lobby, waiting to find out what he was going to do. He was still talking to the defense attorney. So he was here and ready to go. That was the original plan and they decided not to call him last minute.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I just don`t understand that. I have to wonder, and I`ll posit this to Jayne Weintraub because you`re a defense attorney and you`ve been around the block. Could it be part of a strategy? Hey, we`re not getting Patty Womack, who we really want, so let`s not call anybody, because then it will be a better chance for an appeal. Then, if we have no mitigation case, if the defense puts zero people up to say nice things on the Jodi Arias that will look better on appeal. Do you think that could be their strategy?
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it could be part of a strategy, but it would be, as Kirk Nurmi said, it would be because the judge was not permitting them to do his job. In other words, because of the intimidation, they weren`t allowed to do what they thought was the right thing.
I will also say, as part of an appeals strategy, if their client is going to get up there tomorrow in allocution and say, I want the death penalty, I don`t think there`s going to be an appeal. I think she will waive an appeal, and I don`t think there`ll be a 12-year wait to get a lethal injection.
But I do question, where`s the rest of the mitigation? Where`s a jail guard to say that, you know, she`s good behavior and cooperative and compliant. Where is a social worker that`s been working on the case with Jodi for four years? Where`s her mother falling on the sword and saying, you know, almost like in Casey Anthony`s case, the mother. How about, you know, "I love her, maybe I did abuse her, I didn`t think it was abuse, but she didn`t have a good childhood." Somebody to fall on the sword for her so that she could get there up there and do the right thing tomorrow -- to be remorseful. That`s what I don`t get.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: On the other side of the break, we`re going to discuss why Jodi Arias` mother is not part of this process, is not part of the mitigation process. We know she supports her daughter in the sense that she has been here every single day, practically. And she was here today. And the whole family was here today.
We`re going to show you that and debate it on the other side.
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MARTINEZ: Once she began stabbing him, it`s not a situation where she stopped. She killed him three times over.
I`m asking you who`s making the money, aren`t I? Nothing here is to make the prosecutor happy. Do you understand that? Why don`t you want to answer my question? So when was the third time you met her?
Sir, am I asking you about the evening? I`m not, am I?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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SANDRA ARIAS, MOTHER OF JODI ARIAS: Jodi has mental problems. Jodi would freak out all the time. I`ve had quite a few of her friends call me and tell me that I needed to get her some help. I had one call me in the middle of the night and tell me that she needed help.
And she would call me in the morning all happy, and call me an hour or two later in tears, crying and sobbing about something she didn`t want to talk about and that happened constantly. And her friends saw it too. And I had one friend call me in the middle of the night and he had to call the hotline for bipolar people. Said Jodi is bipolar and she needs help.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Let`s debate it. Where are the missing mitigators? Starting with Stacey Honowitz, I mean, this is almost unheard of. It`s a death penalty case and the defense says, well, we`re not going to put on anybody to speak on behalf of this woman whose life is on the line. Love her or hate her, is that crazy? I mean could they have found a way to include Jodi`s mother?
STACEY HONOWITZ, FLORIDA PROSECUTOR: Well, of course they could have, but you know what, Jane, there`s a very deep analysis that`s got to go on with this case, because you don`t know who`s running the show. You don`t know if Jodi is telling them things or they`re tell telling Jodi, this is the way we`re going to do it, and we feel like we`re in conflict.
So you`re looking at several different factors in this case. You`re looking at ineffective assistance of a counsel because they`re not putting on mitigation people. I mean how do you go on a death penalty case and not have a mitigator? You keep asking about this personality disorder, this borderline. Why aren`t they talking about it?
It`s very hard to have any credibility in front of a jury when you`ve argued against personality disorder and now you`re in the death phase and you`re asking them to find that she has this disorder. So the idea that they didn`t have a mitigation specialist, that they didn`t have a third person sitting there that was out of the loop of the trial and that they`re not calling any mitigation people is really preposterous in a death penalty case.
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Evangeline Gomez.
EVANGELINE GOMEZ, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, the issue is that, one, the defense never asserted that they were going to use mental incapacity as one of the mitigating factors. Therefore, they wouldn`t have put forth anything about a mental disorder. Number one, in regard to her mother testifying, remember when Jodi testified, she said that there were incidents of child abuse that she suffered with her parent, while living with them. Juan Martinez, the prosecutor, never refuted it. In fact, what I thought was interesting, while looking at this was, as a prosecutor, he could have subpoenaed the mother and the father to serve as impeachment witnesses after she made those statements. He didn`t.
HONOWITZ: What do they need it for?
GOMEZ: So it leads me to believe that he may have though --
(CROSSTALK)
HONOWITZ: This is not --
GOMEZ: Stacey --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on a second. One at a time. One at a time. Jon Leiberman. Jon Leiberman, I --
GOMEZ: -- is because she could face criminal penalties. She gets up there. Juan Martinez can ask her anything. We don`t know if the statute of limitations had been --
JON LEIBERMAN, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: Here`s what I think --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok, wait. Jon Leiberman. Stop, everybody. Go ahead.
LEIBERMAN: Two important points. One is I think it`s clear that Jodi Arias is calling the shots. If you heard Mr. Nurmi in his opening to this phase, he laid out the mitigating factors that he was then going to prove. And you notice a lot has changed since then. Now he`s not calling any mitigating witnesses. I think Jodi Arias has made it clear to her attorneys that she wants to call the shots. That`s the first thing.
GOMEZ: He`s not calling any mitigating witnesses --
(CROSSTALK)
LEIBERMAN: Let me finish.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Hold on, hold on.
LEIBERMAN: To the fact that Womack was intimidated, I believe that she was only intimidated by the wrath of Juan Martinez, because he has so much on her. That`s why she didn`t want to come in and testify.
JORDAN ROSE, ATTORNEY: Criminal charges. That`s one reason why she didn`t come, civil and criminal penalties, the specter of them.
(CROSSTALK)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: The thing is -- let`s get back to the mother. Let me get back to the mother. Let me say this about the mother and stop talking for a second, because I really want to say this about the mother.
Jodi Arias, in a way, sabotaged the opportunity for her mother to take her stand in her defense because she threw her mother under the bus. During the trial she threw her dad under the bus. She said mother beat her with a wooden spoon and dad pushed her into furniture. So if that`s a lie, and given that she`s a big liar, I would suspect that that`s a lie, then they get on the stand and she`s put them in the position that they`re going to have to lie and pretend that they abused her when they didn`t? That`s crazy. And I think that`s another reason Jordan Rose that her parents aren`t taking stand.
ROSE: Well, and I think, you could very well be right. I think her defense team wanted to put on the traditional mitigating defense, which is, you know, mom and dad say, oh, I`m sorry, it`s my fault. Best friend comes up, old boyfriend, that`s really interesting and sort of a script that`s been played out before, to some success in other trials.
But all of a sudden, they do that. So now what do they have to do tomorrow? They`re going to have to get up and say, whoa, Jodi`s asking for death, that`s exhibit "A" of why this woman is crazy, and she shouldn`t get death. That`s mitigating in and of itself. You know why they don`t put the mom up --
VELEZ-MITCHELL: You know what`s funny, it`s funny, Clancy Talbot, in ten seconds, Jodi Arias with all her manipulation has manipulated herself into a little tiny closet, where if she`s lucky, she will spend the rest of her life. Where did that manipulation get her -- Clancy?
TALBOT: I`m not sure exactly where it`s going to get her. I think the reason that they`re not putting her mother on the stand is because it might do more harm than good, because then she will be subject to cross from Mr. Martinez and I think she might know a lot more and Mr. Martinez knows a lot more than they want to come out in court. So I think that`s why I don`t know whether her manipulation is going to get her.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I think you`re very right, Clancy Talbot. That was an excellent point. I would say best point of the evening.
There is a lot of secrets buried in this case. Jodi Arias didn`t just become a monstrous killer overnight. It started in childhood. She showed signs of very bizarre behavior in childhood. Had the mother taken the stand, all of that dirty laundry, even more dirty laundry, might have had to have come out. Fascinating point. excellent. Thank you, Clancy.
More on the devastating tornado in Oklahoma City -- it`s bad.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m feeling cheated, to be honest. Like, it`s just all gone. Like, I can`t -- I can`t muster it in my head. Like, I can`t -- like my mind is like blown completely, blown. I don`t know how to -- like -- I don`t know.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`ve never seen anything like this in my 18 years covering tornadoes here in Oklahoma City. This is without question the most horrific --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Ok.
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VELEZ-MITCHELL: Breaking news, new information coming in about that devastating, massive tornado that hit Oklahoma City. We are now being told the death toll has climbed to ten.
Let`s go straight out to meteorologist Bob Van Dillen, who has the latest. What do you know Bob.
BOB VAN DILLEN, HLN METEOROLOGIST: Hello Jane. Good to see you this evening. I`ll tell you this. This is one of the strongest storms that I have ever seen on video and we just tracked it. It was a long track, strong tornado. National Weather Service came out already with a preliminary report that it was an EF-4. That brings it with the range, 166 and 200 miles per hour.
But I`ll tell you what I`ve seen and I`ve been watching the footage for over three hours now and some of the destruction of the houses. Some of these houses -- and they`re well built structures -- just the slabs picked clean. In other words, nothing but the basement, not a basement just a slab, with no wood, no anything left -- just totally taken off. And if you look around it and you keep on watching some of the footage, you`re looking at the grass peeled up -- nothing but mud, stripped peeled up.
I just saw one report from the National Weather Service out of Tulsa. They reported this picture from Moore, Oklahoma was found in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma. That`s 125 miles away. I mean that is unbelievable, Jane.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Unbelievable. Unbelievable devastation. Thank you for that update.
And of course, here on HLN, we will keep you updated continuously on that tragedy, that horror still unfolding in the Oklahoma City area.
Up next, we`ve got new information just happened in the Jodi Arias case. Stay right there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can hate this woman as much you want for the rest of your lives. You don`t have to forgive. I personally believe that that forgiveness is far overrated in our society. And quite frankly, the only person that should be able to forgive Jodi Arias would be Travis and unfortunately, she slaughtered Travis.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JODI ARIAS, CONVICTED OF MURDER: -- the foot of his bed, he said don`t act like that hurts. He called me a bitch and kicked me in the ribs. He (inaudible) to kick me again and I put my hands out -- and to block his foot, and it clipped my hand, hit my finger.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELEZ-MITCHELL: As we wait to hear what the Jodi Arias will say tomorrow when she may or may not beg for her life, one thing is for sure she better not continue to trash Travis Alexander. There is so much outrage over that.
Travis was one of eight siblings and I got this really beautiful letter from this lady right here, Indrani (ph) and you spoke of "I am from a very large family. Grew up with eight siblings and one of my brothers was killed in the line of duty 25 years ago and it still hurts." Why did you come here to be in the court for this momentous event and why is it so emotional for you?
INDRANI DE SILVA, TRIAL WATCHER: Because I watched Stephen and Samantha give the -- this is why I don`t talk about it Jane -- I watched them give the impact statement and it just touched me to the core and I just needed to be here. Justice for my brother -- I couldn`t have it. So justice for Travis and they talked about their brother so lovingly, gorgeous, fun loving, life of the party. That was my brother, too, so I just want him to know that millions of people are for them and I want, I want the killer brought to justice.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you are going to be here at 3:00 in the morning to get a seat as well.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s right because just like my friend here, we want to see justice done for Travis. What she did to him was a heinous crime. He was tortured and if she does get the death penalty, I think that`s an easy way out.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Well, some of the sentiments here, very strong emotions. We`ll bring it to you all tomorrow right here.
Nancy, next.
END
