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Newtown Parents Fight Records Release; Special Election in New Jersey

Aired June 04, 2013 - 14:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, it was the queen's celebration, but all eyes on this one. Plenty of attention focused here on the Duchess of Cambridge looking lovely, might I add, this morning at Westminster Abbey. You can see it. Right there, you can't miss the baby bump at the service, commemorating the 60th anniversary of Queen Elizabeth's coronation.

They have been celebrating the diamond jubilee for the whole year. Today was the day marking the 60th -- the first child of the duchess and her husband, Prince William is due next month. Is it a boy? Is it a girl? Just imagine being in London right now, you know there are those people on baby bump watch. Stay tuned.

A U.S. Marine reservist kidnapped, he goes to visit family in Mexico and then things go horribly wrong and now the FBI is involved. I'm Brooke Baldwin. The news is now.

(voice-over): The mighty Mississippi overflowing its banks. A levee breach forces rushing water into nearby towns. Hundreds are forced to evacuate. We have a correspondent on the scene and in the water.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That is the Mississippi River racing over this road, heading right into town.

BALDWIN: Plus, more than 100 students from New York kicked off a flight. Was it for passenger safety or an overreaction by flight attendants?

Plus, a U.S. senator plays "Survivor" complete with a deserted island, spearfishing and sharks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I had to dive down about 20 feet to retrieve the spear with the fish on the end of it. By that time, four sharks had closed in.

BALDWIN: He traveled with two sons to the middle of nowhere and documented the whole thing. You want your own survivalist vacation? We will show you how.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Top of the hour here. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Six months, six months after their children were shot and killed, the parents of those lost at Sandy Hook Elementary School are still fighting to protect their kids. About 20 parents are pushing for a state bill that would block crime scene photos and video and portions of 911 calls responding to that scene in December.

They don't want the public to see them, to hear them, unless, that is, victim family members or survivors give written consent.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN PINTO, FATHER OF VICTIM: Releasing these photos of murdered teachers and children will in no way help us learn from or prevent another tragedy. Instead, if these are released to the public, the only person who will learn from them is the next Adam Lanza.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy appears to be on board and he is no doubt under pressure to act here. Connecticut's legislative session ends tomorrow.

Plus, this, this Change.org petition in support of the bill, this is House Bill 6424, has now surpassed -- we have been watching the numbers here -- surpassing 80,000 signatures. One of the sponsors of the petition joins me now.

She is the mother of Dylan Hockley, who died at Sandy Hook Elementary School. He was six years old.

Nicole Hockley, thank you so much for being here. And I am so sorry for the loss of your son.

NICOLE HOCKLEY, MOTHER OF VICTIM: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Just begin with why you do not want officials to release the photos and the 911 recordings.

HOCKLEY: These photos are particularly gruesome. This is one of the worst atrocities that has happened in the United States.

There is no reason and no public interest reason for these photos to be released. We're very concerned about political opportunists using these to advance their agendas, for hoaxsters and truth conspiracists to use these against us and harass us further. They serve no purpose. And they will further traumatize the families and our community.

Veteran first-responders are traumatized from have seen the crime scene and from having seen the photos in their investigative reports. We have no need to see them further and they do not belong in the public.

BALDWIN: I had read I know Dylan left behind a big brother, Jake, and I had read that you in particular do not want Jake to see these photos.

HOCKLEY: Yes.

BALDWIN: Is that correct?

HOCKLEY: Absolutely. Jake is eight years old. His innocence has already been tarnished quite considerably in the last six months.

I can't fathom the horror of him Googling his brother in 10 years' time and coming up with seeing photos or hearing a tape of his killing. There is just no need for that. I would rather that Dylan be forever remembered as the beautiful boy that he was, and not as a multiple gunshot victim.

BALDWIN: Nicole, I know you know this, but the main reason, you know, records like this are made public is to make sure that the government and police, that they're doing their jobs, for government transparency.

And let me just read you this one quote. This is from the Society of Professional Journalists from the board president. Quote: "If you hide away documents from the public, then the public has no way of knowing whether police have done their jobs correctly."

My question coming off that to you is this. What if -- and this is just the what-if -- what if there is important information in how, you know, 911 calls are responded to or handled that could save other children's lives if this information were to be made public? What about that?

HOCKLEY: Well, I heard from a police officer, one of the first- responders on the scene, just this past Friday, who was in here with us at Hartford, the Capitol Building, speaking to legislators.

And he said, having heard the tapes and been present, that there are -- there is nothing more to be gleaned from that. What can be -- what can be gained from this police report and this investigation are forensic details, are information that they already have. There is no additional information in terms of procedure or process time that can be learned from the audiotapes and certainly not from the photos.

BALDWIN: Nicole, what about this? And, again, I cannot imagine, I cannot even begin to imagine being in your shoes now, but when I sat down today and I started to think, you think of the multiple mass shootings that happened last year alone. You had Aurora, Colorado. You had Oak Creek, Wisconsin. You had that mall shooting in Oregon and Newtown.

And I know that these were first graders. But why should you and other Newtown families get this special treatment?

HOCKLEY: Yes.

Well, we're not asking for special treatment for ourselves. We would very much like to see all crime scene photos protected. There is no reason for any family to have to go through this. It is not just about Newtown. What makes this slightly different from other crimes or very different from other crimes is it was 26 people killed within four minutes, 20 first graders, six adults. This is an atrocity within the United States. It is on a more massive scale than what we normally see. And because it is such a unique tragedy, it has received more publicity than anyone could have ever imagined on an international level.

And, therefore, there is international interest in these photos. So it is not a question of your normal -- there is no such thing as a normal shooting. But a normal or typical crime, there aren't a lot of calls for those photos or audiotapes to be released. On this, the police report hasn't even finished and we already have people requesting the audiotapes and people requesting the photos.

This is a unique set of circumstances. And while we're fighting for everyone, we're asking for a particular exemption for the Sandy Hook school shooting.

BALDWIN: Given the unique circumstances, given the tragedy that your family and too many families are still walking through six months later, since you lost your son, how is -- how is 8-year-old Jake handling things?

HOCKLEY: He has his -- he has his good days and his bad days, just like the rest of us. He asks a lot of questions. He's a very intelligent and inquisitive little boy.

And my husband and I, Ian, we're just very focused on keeping him happy and healthy, and playing a lot. And, you know, he sees a therapist every week, as do several of the children. And she's pleased with his progress. We're a very tight and family loving unit -- tight and -- I'm sorry -- I'm so tired.

BALDWIN: It's OK. It's OK.

HOCKLEY: A very tight and loving family unit, and we're looking after him and he's looking after us as well. And I feel confident that together as a family we will get through this.

BALDWIN: Nicole Hockley, thank you so much. I know you're tired. Thank you for sparing us the five minutes. It is important to get your story out there. I appreciate it so much.

HOCKLEY: Thank you. Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Yes.

A special election has been called to replace Senator Frank Lautenberg of New Jersey, who died Monday. Governor Chris Christie made the announcement about an hour ago. We brought it to you live here on CNN. He also said he would appoint an interim senator, but not to expect a clone of Chris Christie in Washington.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: I would suspect that that person will become an instant ingrate. That's what normally happens, right? They will pledge undying loyalty when you interview them and then when you appoint them, they will forget your name. I assume that's what will happen here too.

And I don't suspect this will be any different. So, no, this won't be my proxy down there. And, by the way, I'm a little busy up here. So if whoever I nominate starts calling me and asking me whether to vote cloture on something, I am going to tell them, that's what I appointed you for, leave me alone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Jake Tapper, chief Washington correspondent, host of "THE LEAD."

Jake, I know you have known Chris Christie for years and years. Here is my question. I heard you earlier saying this is blue Jersey, this is New Jersey. He had an option of appointing someone for the next year or so or doing what he did today, which was, you know, announce this special election. How surprising was this?

JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: It is pretty much classic Christie.

BALDWIN: Huh.

TAPPER: It is it conforms to the Christie brand, which is the independent Republican in a state full of Democrats.

But there are a lot of angry Republicans in Washington, D.C., and angry conservative activists throughout the country who see this as a squandered opportunity. Here was a U.S. Senate seat that Christie could appoint someone to be in that seat for a year-and-a-half. They, of course, wanted a Republican. It is a very narrowly divided Senate. Democrats have a slim majority.

This would have been an important Republican voice, they say, for issues such as immigration reform, on fiscal matters. But I have to say, this does do something -- two things, really, that helped Chris Christie. One, it is a no-brainer in terms of his brand and as a Republican and independent. I'm not doing what those Republicans in Washington want me to do. I'm doing what is best for you, the people of New Jersey. You should make the decision, not me.

That's one. And, then, two, this is interesting, Brooke. When you look at the dates where these special elections will be held, there's a special primary in August and a special general election in October.

BALDWIN: October.

TAPPER: OK, you look at those dates. What does having a Senate race in October mean vis-a-vis Chris Christie, who is on the ballot in November?

Well, if you have a popular Democrat running for that Senate seat, like Cory Booker, the mayor of Newark, well, then Cory Booker will not be on the top of the ballot in November, helping to bring out Democratic voters to vote for department, so they can vote for Cory Booker.

BALDWIN: They will be separate.

TAPPER: Yes. They will have voted in October. This means that Chris Christie in November, Chris Christie will be able to likely run up his margin of victory. That's something that he wants to do so he can claim a mandate and also if he runs for president, he can make the case he won in this Democratic state by this margin.

Also, it means the coattails in New Jersey will probably be Republican coattails. Probably, that will help Chris Christie get his legislation passed because there will be more independents and more Republicans in the New Jersey legislature.

So, in addition to this move being part of the Christie brand, it also, even though there's all sorts of statutory reasons why the elections are being held when they're being held, it also, you could be argue -- you could argue, helps Chris Christie in terms of his margin of victory and in terms of Republicans in the legislature. So it really helps him in a lot of ways.

BALDWIN: This is absolutely fascinating, just the dates and the political parties and New Jersey and the Democrats. I will be watching "THE LEAD," because I know you are going to be all over this, "THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER" starting at the top of the hour.

Mr. Tapper, thank you so much.

TAPPER: Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: It's a race against time along the Mississippi River, as water conditions condition to rise. We have just been told there has been another confirmed levee breach.

This is all in West Alton, Missouri.

CNN's Martin Savidge is in West Alton for us now.

Martin, what do you know about that breach and where are you right now?

SAVIDGE: Well, we're standing on one of the roads that leads into that small community of West Alton, Missouri.

But I should tell you this road is closed for the obvious reason. That's the Mississippi running by right at my feet. This has actually receded somewhat. That's the good news. but this new levee breach that you're talking about is a worry. Now, we're told it is a serious breach, that according to authorities that just went by.

However, they also say the area impacted is only about 30 residences or businesses. So it is not that serious for a lot of people, but very serious if you're among those living in that specific area. They are still trying to get a handle on exactly what has happened. And that is the concern here, Brooke, is that even though the flood protection system for the most part is doing well, holding up well, despite the fact that this is some of the heaviest flooding in almost two decades, they're always worried there could be these kind of breaches, and nobody can predict where or when. They just happen.

And one of them has just happened here in West Alton. They don't need any more water in that community. Most of that town, though, remains dry, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Gosh, it was lack of water and rain many months ago and now the opposite issue. Martin Savidge for us in Missouri, thank you, Martin.

SAVIDGE: Yes.

BALDWIN: And now incredible dash-cam video out of Yukon, Oklahoma. A car drives in a road swollen by floodwaters. A driver gets too deep. the water absolutely -- look at this -- engulfs the car, washes it away. The video was shot by Chris Novi (ph), a storm chaser, after his car became submerged in the floodwaters there. He was able to climb out, thank goodness. Police officers were there to rescue him.

Coming up, the parents of that 10-year-old girl in desperate need of a lung transplant asking Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius to step in, use your power to enact change today, that case getting much attention when the secretary appeared on Capitol Hill for a budget hearing. But the questions focused on little Sarah.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATHLEEN SEBELIUS, U.S. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY: The worst of all worlds in my mind is to have some individual pick and choose who lives and who dies. I think you want a process where it's guided by medical science and medical experts.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Kathleen Sebelius, the secretary of health and human services, explained today why she is hesitant to take direct action in what many are calling really an impossible situation here in Pennsylvania.

You know the story of this little girl, the struggle for this dying 10-year-old girl to get a lung transplant. Yesterday, I talked to her dad, and Fran Murnaghan told me that his daughter Sarah knows how serious her situation is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FRAN MURNAGHAN, FATHER OF SARAH MURNAGHAN: We were holding her in our arms, and she was tired and clearly wanted to go to sleep. And she point -- directly asked us, can I go to sleep? And, of course, we said, if you're tired, of course. And then she followed up and asked us, if I go to sleep, will I wake up tomorrow?

BALDWIN: Oh.

MURNAGHAN: As a parent, I mean, there is nothing more devastating to have a child look in your eyes and ask that type of question.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: That father told me that he and his wife here are hoping that Secretary Sebelius could, would intervene by changing a rule on how children under the age of 12 get access to adult lungs.

But Sebelius has so far not acted. She's ordered a review on this rule, but not acted immediately, and so she has revealed actually just what is at stake during this Capitol Hill hearing this morning.

And Jason Carroll joins me now with Sebelius' side of the story.

Jason, what did she say?

JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, from Sebelius' point of view, she's trying to do what is fair for everyone involved, whether you be a child, whether you be an adult, and she was trying to make that point today at what was supposed to be this budget hearing, but she actually ended up facing some very tough questions about whether her department guidelines are standing in the way of this little girl getting the medical care that she needs.

Murnaghan's parents say if their daughter does not get this transplant, she will die. They say it could be a matter of weeks, it could be a matter of months. Right now, she's on that wait list for children, but not the one for adults. Her parents are asking that the guidelines be changed so that Sarah and for that matter all children in critical situations can be moved to an adult list.

Sebelius was pressed on the issue just a few hours ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEBELIUS: First, as a mother and a grandmother, I can't imagine anything more agonizing than what the Murnaghans are going through.

And I talked to Janet Murnaghan, the mother of Sarah, about this case. What I also have done is look very carefully at the history of the rules around lung transplant and organ transplant.

(CROSSTALK)

REP. TOM PRICE (R), GEORGIA: With all due respect, Madam Secretary...

(CROSSTALK)

SEBELIUS: Dr. Price...

(CROSSTALK) PRICE: I'm going to reclaim my time. It simply takes your signature. It simply takes your signature. A study, I know you have ordered, and I appreciate that. But a study will take over a year. This young lady will be dead.

SEBELIUS: Unfortunately, there are about 40 very seriously ill Pennsylvanians over the age of 12 also waiting for a lung transplant, and three other children in the Philadelphia hospital at the same acuity rate as Sarah waiting for a lung transplant.

The worst of all worlds, in my mind, is to have some individual pick and choose who lives and who dies. I think you want a process where it is guided by medical science and medical experts.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CARROLL: Again, Sebelius says she has ordered this transplant policy review. But, as stated there, a policy review could take some time, could take years. The Murnaghans heard what Sebelius said today and They actually sent us a statement. I'm going to read part of it to you.

It says in part: "Secretary Sebelius has said that if she makes an exception for Sarah, she will have to make an exception for all children. We are confused, to say the least, by this. We haven't asked that an exception be made just for Sarah. What we're asking is that all children in similar circumstances be treated the same as an adult in the system for allocation of lungs."

Basically, what you have here, Brooke, is you have got a family that is just trying to do everything they can to save their daughter, to save Sarah, but as you can see from the situation, it is not just as easy as signing your name and ordering -- and ordering some sort of review of a policy. Much more needs to be done here.

BALDWIN: Just talking to a medical ethicist yesterday, and the point he underscored to me, to anyone who is struck by Sarah's story, just become an organ donor.

CARROLL: Yes.

BALDWIN: Just check the box and become an organ donor. There are too few out there to help people like her.

Jason Carroll, thank you.

CARROLL: You bet.

BALDWIN: For the first time now, we're seeing video of a Detroit police department raid that led to the death of a young girl.

This video was released today in court during the trial for the officer. We're talking about the new details we learned today coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BALDWIN: Now some of the hottest videos of the day in something we call "Hit Play."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN (voice-over): A Virginia man reunited with a class ring that he lost 45 years ago.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I got my ring in '68. That's when I graduated. And that's when I thought I had lost the ring then.

BALDWIN: The new owner of his old house found the ring while doing some yard work and then, of course, took the Facebook to find its rightful owner. One week later, the ring was back where it belonged.

Check out this guy. Authorities say he tried to steal a mannequin from an adult entertainment store, actually gets away with half of the thing. Later that night, sheriff's deputies say he put on a wig, came back for more, this time breaking down the door and, oh, yes, stealing lingerie. The suspect tried to make a getaway on his bike, but cops caught up with him and made the arrest.

In Colorado, a moose in the mood for love has turned his affections to a statue.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's in love. He's nuzzling and he kisses and he licks him and he walks around. Then he -- you know, he gets on top of him.

BALDWIN: People in Grand Lake say who are they to tell the moose who or what to love, with one person saying, what happens in Grand Lake stays in Grand Lake.

And in New York, a nuclear missile silo decommissioned back in 1960 now an ultra-modern house. It goes nearly 300 feet beneath the earth's surface. It's got it all, kitchen, living room, bathroom, and a panel that would have controlled the nuclear missile inside the bedroom.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm going through the process of restoring the interior of it to as close as to what it was during the day that it was operating.

BALDWIN: And it can all be yours for about $750,000.

And that is today's "Hit Play."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Coming up next, Senator Jeff Flake just might be the only United States senator who could compete on "Survivor." He took a vacation with his sons to this deserted island. So, coming up next, I will chat with the "Survivorman" himself, Les Stroud. He says trying to do something like this is incredibly serious -- that conversation coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)