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NSA Reveals Foiled Terror Plots; FBI Releases New Attack Video; Still Searching For Jimmy Hoffa; DJS Mock Football Player With ALS; Man Of Steel Compared To Jesus; Digging for Hoffa; Fighting Crime in Chicago

Aired June 18, 2013 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: That is the latest from the NSA hearing on Capitol Hill today. This is CNN NEWSROOM, and I'm Suzanne Malveaux. I want to go straight to it.

Intelligence officials trying to make the case that secret surveillance programs help keep the country safe. At a hearing today, they outlined four terror plots they say were disrupted because of those surveillance programs. They include plots to bomb the New York subway system, the New York Stock Exchange and a Danish newspaper. Also, unspecified terrorist activity that was shortly after 911.

Well, the deputy director of the FBI says, this is just the tip of the iceberg. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GENERAL KEITH ALEXANDER, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL SECURITY AGENCY: In recent years, these programs together with other intelligence, have protected the U.S. and our allies from terrorist threats across the globe to include helping prevent the terrorist -- the potential terrorist events over 50 times since 911. We will actually bring forward to the committee tomorrow documents that the inner agency has agreed on that, in a classified setting, gives every one of those cases for your review. We'll add two more today publicly, we'll discuss. But as the chairman noted, if we give all those out, we give all the secrets of how we're tracking down the terrorists as a community, and we can't do that. Too much is at risk for us and for our allies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: I want to get more from our correspondents Dana Bash, she was the first to report the story, she's on Capitol Hill; Alison Kosik, she's going to have more on the plot to bomb the New York Stock Exchange. Dana, I want to start off with you first because obviously here the goal was to reassure Americans that these programs are worth it, right, that they save lives. Do you think what you heard today, the details, coming forth from these intelligence officials, did they go far enough towards that goal?

DANA BASH, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The jury is still out. But, you know, just in listening to some of the skeptics, and there are a few skeptics on the intelligence committee, the answer looks like likely, no. And the reason is because you just heard from the NSA director, Alexander, most of the plots that they claim were disrupted from these programs are still classified. They are going to bring them, the details, to Congress tomorrow but in a classified setting. And if we could just put back up on the screen what you just -- what you just listed, the four plots that they declassified, only two of them are new. One that you're going to talk about in a little while, the plot they say to -- that they stopped to disrupt the New York Stock Exchange. And then the fourth one stopping unspecified terrorist activity after 911. Listen to a little bit more -- that's the new one, again, unspecified is the key here. Listen to what the deputy FBI director said about that plot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN JOYCE, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, FBI: Lastly, the FBI had opened an investigation shortly after 911. We did not have enough information nor did we find links of terrorism so we shortly thereafter closed the investigation. However, the NSA, using the business record (INAUDIBLE) tipped us off that this individual had indirect contacts with a known terrorist overseas. We were able to reopen this investigation, identify additional individuals through the legal process and were able to disrupt this terrorist activity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Now, we later learned through sources that what they are talking about was disrupting an attempt to give money, to send money to Al-Shabaab which is a terrorist organization that works out of Somalia. But that would be the beginning of a plot certainly not disrupting a full fledge plot and this is really the only new example they gave us of times that they have used the phone records program which is what Americans are most concerned about. So, they're going to have to do a little bit more, probably -- maybe a lot more to reassure the public. But when they may feel pretty good about, just in talking to sources as this hearing is wrapping up, is better explaining that people's civil liberties really have a lot of safeguards they think with regard to having to get court orders, with regard to --

MALVEAUX: Right.

BASH: -- not having records kept of their phone, certainly not the content of their phones.

MALVEAUX: Sure.

BASH: But they are going to have to keep doing more of that.

MALVEAUX: And, Dana, what did they say about Edward Snowden, the guy who basically was -- the leaker who revealed all of these programs. How do they explain how that happened?

BASH: The explanation certainly doesn't seem to be satisfying members of Congress who are absolutely furious and so are members of this panel. They say that he has done irrevocable damage to the U.S. security and safety and they say that much of what he is saying simply isn't true. Claiming that you can just as someone like him who is a contractor --

MALVEAUX: Right.

BASH: -- who is in Hawaii can just read the personal e-mails of the president, for example, it's just not possible

The one interesting question that was asked of the NSA director, what do you see going forward for Snowden? His answer was justice. The problem is you can't bring him to justice if you can't find him and they still haven't been able to find him.

MALVEAUX: Yes, the guy who holds the news conferences they're not finding just quite yet. We'll figure (INAUDIBLE.) Dana, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

I want to bring Alison into the discussion here to talk about this plot about bombing the New York Stock Exchange. Hadn't heard that before. Clear, people must be reacting.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Well, they're reacting but not really that surprised nor are they not spooked by it. You know, this building where I'm sitting at the New York Stock Exchange on Wall Street, it's treated like a target every day. This is an iconic symbol of American capitalism and there are layers of security just to get in this building. You know, you have to wear your badge. You have to have your bag checked. You have to go through, you know, a metal detector every single day. You can't even drive your car through here unless you go through a few check points. So, you know, it's not the first time that there's been a threat here.

In fact, a U.K. man was sentenced to life in prison in 2006 after pleading guilty to planning to attack several targets including the NYSE. Even buildings around here, the New York Federal Reserve right around the corner that was targeted last year. So, you know what, Suzanne? Traders are used to it. I talked to a couple earlier. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's probably always in the back of our minds, the NSA development today brought it to the forefront again. So, yes, we do feel that this is a target. I don't think there's any question about it. It's a -- you know, it's a centerpiece of American capitalism, so, sure, it would be a target. But that said, I don't think anyone feels really threatened by terrorists on this floor.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a very secure place. There's a lot of very hard working people that are making -- just making sure that we're all safe and we can just go about our jobs every day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOSIK: And, Suzanne, what's interesting is that I come here just about every single day and I can tell when security stepped up and when it's not. You know, sometimes I see more police officers and more dogs than let's say on another day. It doesn't necessarily mean there's a threat but it's interesting to see how quickly the security around this building can change and, you know, there are a thousand people who come here to work every day so it really is what many traders call, and what I feel like -- it's really kind of a fortress -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. Alison, thank you, appreciate it. Of course, all of this part of an effort by the Obama administration to try to quiet the uproar over these surveillance programs. I want to know, really, how much did this help, these hearings? I want to bring in our Chief Political Analyst Gloria Borger to talk a little bit about this. And, Gloria, you write in your op ed, it's all about the details, details, details.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Right.

MALVEAUX: You want the president to get out there in front of this thing.

BORGER: Yes.

MALVEAUX: So, we watch the hearings, we watched them this morning, how helpful was it for him?

BORGER: Baby steps. A little bit helpful I think. What we saw were officials who clearly felt constrained about what they could tell the American public. I mean, we learned -- as you pointed out earlier, the data we learned about a couple new plots that with thwarted as a result of the use of this data that we've been talking about. We also learned, for example, that there are over 50 cases they're going to talk about in a -- behind closed doors and that 90 percent of those may have been overseas cases, 10 domestic. But we don't know much more than that. I think much of the hearing this morning was really spent talking about the safeguards that the Justice Department, the FBI, the National Security Agency put on this collection of data so that the American people sort of understand that it's numbers without an identity, without a location, without any content and then they have to go back to a court much like a Grand Jury to try and get more information. But, again, I think it was just baby steps today, Suzanne, because they feel constrained about what they can tell us. And they'd like this all to go away but it's not going to go away.

MALVEAUX: No, it's not going to go away. But the president --

BORGER: Right.

MALVEAUX: -- does seem like he is answering the questions when posed to him, the PDS interview that was on and he talked a lot about the privacy concerns. He was pushed on this. I want you to listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I've stood up a privacy and liberties oversight board made up of some independent citizens including some fierce civil libertarians. I'll be meeting with them. And what I want to do is set up and structure a national conversation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: So, what do we think that national conversation will look like, Gloria? How will -- how will the administration really be able to get out ahead of this issue?

BORGER: He has to lead the national conversation. I don't -- you know, giving a bunch of interviews is great but I think the president has to forcefully explain his point of view. What we've been seeing with the president who's somebody -- who keeps telling us, you know, I -- yes, I have changed from where I was back in the day when I was a United States senator. But we really don't know why. And I think that the president, who will forcefully defend what he's done, needs to kind of make the case and lay it out to the American people. We've heard from the director of National Intelligence. We've heard from people today, for example, at the National Security Agency, at the FBI, at the Justice Department. They all work for one person and that's the president.

MALVEAUX: All right, Gloria, you have more I know in your column there. So, if you would like to check out more, Gloria Borger's column at CNN.com, all about the need to -- really to give some more details in all of this.

We are also getting a look at never before seen video. This is of the 2008 bombing of a U.S. armed forces recruiting station in Time Square. The FBI and New York police just released this video

I want to bring in Mary Snow who is taking a look at all of this. What do we know?

MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Suzanne, when it comes to the suspect, we really don't know much. And that is why the FBI is making this push asking the public for help. It went back to gather any images from surveillance cameras in Time Square that it could find that may yield new clues. Now, the bombings took place in 2008 outside a U.S. military recruiting station and there were no injuries. The FBI says the same suspect may be linked to two similar incidents. One blast at the British consulate in 2005, another in 2007 near the Mexican consulate. Now, all the bombings happened in the middle of the night and the person who detonated the explosives was riding a bicycle. The FBI says the devices that were used were similar, that they were all made with military grade ammunition cans, black powder and a time fuse. A federal law enforcement source tells CNN's Susan Candiotti that the bomb in Time Square was actually stronger than the device detonated during the Boston marathon in terms of destructive capability. But unlike Boston, it contained no shrapnel.

Now, authorities recovered the bicycle after that Time Square incident but wouldn't comment on whether it was able to obtain any forensic information from that bike -- Suzanne.

MALVEAUX: All right. I'm sure people are going to be watching that video very closely. Obviously, they're looking for information. Thanks, Mary. I appreciate it.

Coming up, the search for a former teamster boss, Jimmy Hoffa, continues. As you know, he went missing back in 1975. Police now still continue to dig for his body.

And the morning team on a sports radio show pokes fun at a former football player with ALS. Well, now, they have been fired. Coming up, my personal experience with the player they were addressing.

And the latest "Superman" film starting from the beginning when Clark Kent was sent to earth to save mankind. Some of -- some are saying his character reminds them of Jesus.

And it's no coincidence, some look at this Hollywood marketing strategy. This is the CNN NEWSROOM. I'll have more after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: In a northern suburb of Detroit, the FBI back at work trying to solve one of America's longest unsolved mysteries. What happened to Jimmy Hoffa? The FBI is digging a second day in a field. This out of Oakland Township, Michigan. They are working from a tip now from an 85-year-old reputed mobster who says that Hoffa, the former Teamster Union President, was killed and buried there back in 1975. Susan Candiotti is joining us. Why do we think this is any different from any other tip we've heard before in the last 38 years?

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Let's give you quick update on what's happening here, Suzanne. Over my shoulder and off in the distance, and I know we have some aerial shots where you can see things much better, that is where Jimmy Hoffa is allegedly buried. That's the tip that they're working. So far, they have been using back hoes and shovels to try to dig up some of the spot where this supposedly happened.

They have found among other things a couple of huge concrete slabs but those may be the foundation of a barn that used to be on the property along with a house many years ago. Those are long gone now. It's unclear whether those are foundation or something more. The reason I'm saying something more is because a tipster is telling the FBI that Jimmy Hoffa may have been buried beneath that concrete slab.

We understand his credibility is something the FBI is relying on because he knew a lot of people way back in the day. His father was part of the mob. He was an important figure in the mob too and they all knew important people. This is how his attorney sums up his credibility.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID CHASNICK, ATTORNEY: The difference between this one and the last digging is this a man with credibility. This is a man that would be in the know. This is not some random guy who said I think he's buried there. This is a person intimately involved with some of the players who would be well informed as to where the body would be placed.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What prompted him to come forward now?

CHASNICK: What prompted him to come forward? It's just something that he wanted to get done with, that he's dealt with for a long time and wanted to share where it was.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CANDIOTTI: He also said he needed the money, and in interviewed he has said I need money and I wanted to write a book about this. Online he's posted some information, part of an online manuscript. We're going to read a couple of excerpts for you, Suzanne, about what he is saying about what happened way back when.

He said talking about what other people have told him about what happened quote, "they picked up a shovel and cracked Hoffa over the head." Then he went on to say, " the hit Hoffa a few more times and Hoffa started to moan. They threw him in the hole and buried him alive. That was it. End of story." He went on to say he was covered with a concrete slab. That's where the concrete slab may play an important role.

MALVEAUX: Wow. Okay. We're going to be following that closely. Let us know if you get anything out of that search. Susan Candiotti just north of Detroit.

Violent deaths down in Chicago but dozens of people were shot in that city last weekend. Still to come, we're going to talk to the city's mayor to get you to the root of the heart of the problem.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: In California, a fierce fire burning near an entrance. This is out of Yosemite National Park. It's now forced almost 2,000 people from their homes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wow. Oh, my God. Those are 100-foot-tall ponderosa pine trees.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: This is an ireporter says he's not ready to leave home yet. Firefighters have been able to contain only about the 15 percent of the fire. You're hearing his voice there. No homes have been destroyed at this point. California has had a particularly bad fire season this year blamed on two years of low rainfall, high winds, and lightning strikes.

Today we're learning more about what the mayor of Chicago has so say about the violence that's plaguing his city. Overall crime is down, but this past weekend seven people were shot to death. I spoke with Pastor Corey Brooks. He's the leading member of the clergy in Chicago. Here is what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PASTOR COREY BROOKE, NEW BEGINNINGS CHURCH OF CHICAGO: I know the numbers are down and the police are doing everything they possibly can, but when you live in Chicago at any time in these areas where there are a lot of young people who have a lot of guns and a lot of anger and a lot of hostility, any time gun violence can jump off. And so this weekend, it was a tough weekend. And I hate to say it, but these are the type of weekends that we're going to be experiencing over an over if we don't get our hands on the problem.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: That was a leading member of the clergy, Pastor Corey Brooks. I want to bring in Ted Rowlands out of Chicago. And Ted, he's explaining it saying look he believes there's going be more violence. How does the mayor explain what is happening in the city?

TED ROWLANDS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the mayor and other people in the city think that the opposite is true and that this is not -- this was an anomaly last weekend where seven people were killed. They point to the numbers over the last 6-9 months. Just this year, the murder rate in Chicago is the lowest it's been since 1963. Overall crime down 14 percent this year, 23 percent the last two years. They believe that the things they put into place, the procedures over the last year and a half, two years are now working. They are optimistic that this was an anomaly last weekend, that actually the crime is down, and they're hoping crime will stay down. Listen to the mayor, Rahm Emanuel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR RAHM EMANUEL, CHICAGO: Last year, even while our homicides were up, crime went down nine percent. This year it's down 13.5 percent. That's not an anomaly. Shootings are down 30 percent across the city.

Now, I think you have to do certain things so it's not a blip, it's not just a window of time but it's ingrained. I think we're doing the right things to do that. I think it's way too soon for anybody to say it's a success or anybody to say it's a blip.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROWLANDS: There are more cops on the street. They are implementing higher curfews, stringent curfews, penalties are up. Rahm Emanuel, Gary McCarthy, the superintendent of police here, they are confident that what they have done if they keep these things in place, and they can afford to do to they say, that this is going to change things forever. That's their hope, but as you heard the mayor say it's too close to call and a weekend like last weekend just makes people shudder thinking oh gosh, are we going back to last year and the years - decades before where the violence was just out of control. We'll have to see.

MALVEAUX: The pastor was saying it's an anomaly that happened last weekend, but how does the mayor explain that that it couldn't happen again. Why does he believe that was able to occur with all these programs in place?

ROWLANDS: He is not saying this is a done deal by any stretch of the imagination saying they are declaring victory. Superintendent McCarthy, same thing. They realize this is a long, long road. But if you look at the decades before, the worst years were back in the 90's during the crack wars. Those numbers were astronomical. They really do think that what they put in place is working and the numbers do show it so far this year. They are hoping that this is going be the trend but we won't know for a year or two, at least to see if this is a long trend.

MALVEAUX: Yeah, sure. And of course we're talking numbers, but we're also talking about people's lives and families, and people who really impacted in that community. Ted, thank you so much. Appreciate it. We'll keep our eye on that situation. Chicago, other cities where violence really diminishing the quality of life for so many people in that community.

The FBI says the government surveillance program helped stop more than 50 terror plots since 9/11 but could it have stopped the 9/11 attack? Hear what lawmakers are saying. Up next.

Internet giants coming forward telling folks the government wants their account information. What the NSA wanted from Yahoo! and Facebook. We're going to get that for you as well. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Welcome back to NEWSROOM. Foiled terror plots dominating the headlines today right now, as intelligence officials, they're trying to make the case that secret surveillance programs are helping to keep our country safe. This was at a hearing just a short time ago. They revealed details of planned attacks that they say were stopped by those surveillance programs. They include a plot to bomb New York subway station system, another to attack the New York stock exchange, and a Danish newspaper. More than 50 plots in all. That's according to authorities.