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Dr. Drew
Politicians and Drugs; Girlfriend Wanted Him To Get Help; Singer Charged With Assault Again
Aired November 20, 2013 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, the crack mayor and the cocaine congressman doing drugs. Should they be doing time?
And George Zimmerman -- is he heading down the O.J. Simpson road to ruin?
Plus, Miley Cyrus, what has she done now? Is it plastic surgery? Or another bid for attention?
Let`s get started.
(MUSIC)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Good evening, everyone.
My co-host is Sirius XM host, Jenny Hutt.
And coming up, Miley Cyrus, Jenny, has a new look. And I`m looking at your eyebrows. Your eyebrows may get raised, but they don`t look like hers.
JENNY HUTT, CO-HOST: They won`t get raised. I have too much Botox.
PINSKY: Fair enough. Whether Botox or bleaching eye browse, we`ll talk about it.
But, first, a new scandal could blow up crack Mayor Rob Ford`s fitness plan. Plus, court documents reveal he could be lying about the drugs. Did he use as recently as February? He`s been claiming otherwise. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
ROB FORD, TORONTO MAYOR: I always say there`s more poor people than rich people, and I stick up for the poor people and that`s the bottom line.
I don`t smoke crack and I`m not a crack addict. Have I? Yes, I have.
So, that`s what -- I didn`t lie. I don`t smoke crack. I haven`t smoked crack in over a year.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When`s the last time, for drugs?
FORD: A long time, I`m talking like a long time ago. I haven`t had a drop of alcohol in three weeks. A drop. A drop. I`ll take a urine test right now and if there`s alcohol -- none, zero. I work out every day now. We`ve got a professional trainer with me, and we`re having a lot of fun.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
PINSKY: Joining us HLN`s Lynn Berry, Judge Karen Mills Francis, host of "Supreme Justice" that airs Monday through Friday, check your local listing, and Kinsey Schofield, social media commentator, and Mark Eiglarsh, attorney at speaktomark.com.
Mark, any consequences? Anything really at stake here for him having lied about the last time he used drugs?
MARK EIGLARSH, ATTORNEY: Consequences for a politician lying, hmm. Let`s see.
(LAUGHTER)
PINSKY: That`s my point.
EIGLARSH: We could build more prisons if you`d like.
PINSKY: So, is there anything he has to worry about? Were he -- I don`t understand where there would be a legal liability other than sort of a political liability.
EIGLARSH: I think I agree with you. It`s exclusively a political liability, and hopefully the people in Toronto get it, that this guy is an extraordinary liability, and he`s either going to truly get on the path of recovery, which I pray that he does, or he`s going to die.
PINSKY: Judge Karen --
JUDGE KAREN MILLS FRANCIS, SUPREME JUSTICE: You know what, the problem is, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Go ahead.
FRANCIS: The problem is there is nothing in place in the Canadian system to impeach him or removed him from office. But I understand that there`s a motion on the council`s calendar to ask him to take a leave of absence, like that`s going to happen. This guy is enjoying this ride. He`s enjoying seeing himself on TV, enjoying this more than enjoying being the mayor.
PINSKY: There`s a new scandal involves his fitness plan, Rob Ford`s fitness plan. Here`s a YouTube video showing his trainer. You`ll see he is the one in the hat. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is how we do it. Mutant versus bpi. This is how it`s done. Let`s go. C`mon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Lynn, what`s up? I get confused when I talk about the mayor these days.
LYNN BERRY, HLN HOST: I know. That tends to happen, right? Especially with this trainer, Dr. Drew? Some information is coming out.
If you notice, tweets are starting to disappear. That`s because this guy has been convicted of steroid trafficking in the United States. He`s been banned from coaching in Canada, but he`s had plenty of contact with Rob Ford. He`s been training him. That`s the trainer that he`s referring to, as early as November 16th we have tweets.
We also have some tweets we have seen that have since been deleted that he was in contact and referring to his training with Rob Ford with some Canadian porn actress, so Rob Ford really needs to start consulting someone on who he`s surrounding himself with. I`ll tell you who he`s not surrounding himself with. A lot of his staffers today bolted. He had them trying to give them money and they also said, thanks, but no thanks. They went to the deputy mayor.
PINSKY: We need to mention, the trainer told "The National Post" newspaper that the photo was a joke. We did try to reach him for comment, and did not heard back.
Kinsey I have not heard from you yet, again, you know, I feel this guy -- as time goes on, I feel increasingly sorry for the mayor.
HUTT: Really?
KINSEY SCHOFIELD, SOCIAL MEDIA COMMENTATOR: I feel terribly sorry for him, too. I think that he`s a mess, but in regards to the whole Twitter scandal, you have to tweet before you tweet. This trainer wanted attention. That`s why he was posting the stuff on the Internet. And he got the attention, but got it in tenfold.
And so, then he backtracked and said, oh, I was just kidding. It was just a joke. If you`re putting stuff out there for attention, you`re going -- likely going to get attention and you can`t backtrack like that.
I think obviously he was surrounding himself with something who was almost worst decision that he`s been making lately.
PINSKY: If that`s possible.
(CROSSTALK)
MILLS FRANCIS: Why do you feel sorry for him?
PINSKY: I feel sorry for him because he`s not well. He`s not well. I understand we have somebody who has the reins of power and he needs to step down and take care of himself, which hopefully, Karen, as you pointed out, you hope that`s what he`ll be required to do. But he`s not well.
He thinks he`s in such total massive denial, it`s incredible. The poor guy, he thinks just because he`s not using alcohol, therefore he`s totally well.
SCHOFIELD: But a crack addict, he has to have been doing this a long time. The man got elected. Did we think he was well when he was elected?
PINSKY: That`s an interesting point.
SCHOFIELD: I think it`s hard to feel sorry for him, Dr. Drew, on the other side, because he is so defiant. If he weren`t so defiant and aggressively angry trying to prove a lie, it would be easier.
PINSKY: But as I`ve told you yesterday, Mark, go ahead, Mark.
EIGLARSH: It`s not uncommon for an addict to show these types of defiance and denial. This is what Dr. Drew deals with, with patients who come in all the time. The greatest news I heard today was that his paid enablers, his staffers, are no longer going to support his behavior. That increases the chances of him finally maybe hitting rock bottom, which will finally get him into treatment.
BERRY: Yes, and, Mark, I appreciate your -- I`m sorry, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: I was going to say that they -- the one thing I`ve not seen anybody do that we routinely do with attacks, people walk on egg shells around alcoholics. You don`t do it, you go, hey, cut it out, answer my question. You go right to them, you take it to them, and you know what? They`ll answer you. They`ll kind of shock out of their obfuscation.
I taught you guys that word last night.
Lynn, you want to say something?
BERRY: Well, I just think that people like this -- I understand you`re a compassionate person, and I think that`s why you feel sorry for him. But there are so many people, especially people in power that use their shortcomings as a way to gain sympathy with people. He`s thrown himself out there, said I`m not perfect.
PINSKY: Well --
BERRY: And he`s using that against the people that -- that`s the thing that upsets me.
PINSKY: I get it. And funny you would bring that up, because we have yet another politician caught up in a cocaine scandal. This time, it is in Washington, he is a congressman. We`ll talk about how it`s maybe different down here.
And later on, there are details emerging about George Zimmerman`s state of mind weeks before the girlfriend calling 911. We`re going to get into it. It`s kind of surprising. I`m beginning to wonder that things may be worse than they appear, even.
We`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TV ANCHOR: It was a sting operation set up by the FBI and the Drug Enforcement Administration. And the target was a United States congressman.
REP. TREY RADEL (R), FLORIDA: Hello, my name is Trey. How are you doing?
REPORTER: Radel, who calls himself a hip-hop conservative.
TV ANCHOR: Busted for buying 3 1/2 grams of cocaine from an undercover officer outside a restaurant.
REPORTER: Charges of misdemeanor cocaine possession after his arrest last month.
REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE) related to your alcoholism?
REPORTER: Radel says he struggles with the disease of alcoholism and will do whatever is necessary to overcome it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Back with my co-host Jenny Hutt. Still go Lynn, Judge Karen, Kinsey and Mark.
And we`ve gone now from crack mayor to cocaine congressman, Trey Radel, busted in a sting operation, acknowledged today that he has a problem with cocaine and alcohol.
So, Lynn, what is the deal and what`s the story with this guy?
BERRY: Well, here`s the deal. Here`s how we do it in the States. You admit you make a mistake, you go into rehab.
This guy is in a lot of trouble. This was an undercover sting where he had gotten to dinner with an acquaintance, an undercover cop. They left the restaurant 10:00 at night.
He purchases the cocaine, steps out of the car, boom, there`s a federal agent. He pleads guilty. He is in outpatient care in Washington, D.C. He`s going to go back to Florida to inpatient care, but he says he`s doing that so he can continue to serve his country, aka, he wants to stay in office.
And it depends on how --
PINSKY: Yes, he`s another one.
BERRY: Yes, he`s another one.
But he`s going through the treatment. So, it will be interesting to see whether or not people give him the pass. But really he`s doing the same thing that Rob Ford did.
PINSKY: Ending up in the same place. It`s a different strategy.
Jenny, you want to comment?
HUTT: I do. Dr. Drew, I feel bad for this guy. I`m going to tell you why. And you could --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Everybody feels bad for these drugged politicians.
HUTT: No, no, hold on. Let me explain why -- this is a guy on his wedding night, his mother had a tragic accident and choked right after he got married.
PINSKY: And died.
HUTT: Could that have been why he ended up like this? Choked to die.
PINSKY: Well, alcoholics -- yes, alcoholics get triggered by lots of things, but he`s got alcoholism. Alcoholics do drugs, and alcoholism and addiction, it`s the same thing.
(CROSSTALK)
MILLS FRANCIS: You know, I don`t buy that at all.
PINSKY: What?
MILLS FRANCIS: That`s what offends me about this, because you know what, when all else fails, blame it on the alcohol. Both he and the Toronto mayor are standing behind the legal substance, alcohol, to say that`s my problem.
You are not out buying cocaine because you have an alcohol problem. How many alcoholics are cocaine addicts?
This wasn`t the first time. He takes him back to the apartment if it had been Joe Blow arrested on the street, he doesn`t take them -- he takes them back to the apartment and gives them more cocaine.
And apparently, he`s been doing this a long time. The worst thing that happened to him is he got caught. I don`t feel sorry for him.
PINSKY: Kinsey? Fair enough.
SCHOFIELD: I was going to say, Dr. Drew, I was under the impression that alcohol and cocaine kind of did go together. If you`ve got one addiction, it`s easy to fall into the other one.
PINSKY: Yes. Well, alcohol with cocaine creates a novel second compound called coke ethylene, which is more longer-acting, more cardio- toxic, a little more high. And in my world, when I treat patients, alcohol, cocaine and weed kind of go together. It`s a real common combination.
MILLS FRANCIS: We get offered alcohol at all types of social events. I mean, I don`t buy that he`s an alcoholic. I buy that he`s a cocaine addict and is hiding behind also some legitimate.
EIGLARSH: Judge, what do really know?
(CROSSTALK)
EIGLARSH: What do we really know about his habits, Judge? We don`t know.
MILLS FRANCIS: Because I think it sounds -- look irk that`s why we feel sorry for him. Poor guy, his mother died, and he started drinking and that led to drugs.
HUTT: I feel sad.
(CROSSTALK)
SCHOFIELD: I was ready to rip into him --
EIGLARSH: I`ll tell you this. In Florida, this would have been a felony. When I heard misdemeanor cocaine possession, I`ve been practicing here for 21 years, I went, no, no, wait a minute, they made a mistake. That`s not a misdemeanor. Here in Florida, you have a flake of cocaine, it`s a felony. He lucked out by being in that jurisdiction.
BERRY: That`s a great point.
PINSKY: Or, Karen, did he by pleading guilty or because of his status get some special deal?
EIGLARSH: No.
MILLS FRANCIS: I think he got -- listen, how many people get arrested in the federal system and three weeks later the case is closed? Mark, you know.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: One at a time. One at a time.
I want to bring in a law enforcement professional, Sheriff Richard Jones. He`s an expert in policing tactics.
So, Sheriff, please help us understand: (a), how this becomes a misdemeanor, because we all sort of live in states where it`s thought of more seriously, people have -- are buying or purchasing cocaine, number one. And number two, how do you prevent sort of a sting from being called an entrapment case?
SHERIFF R. JONES, VETERAN POLICING EXPERT (via telephone): Pretty simple. You have to have -- it has to go through the prosecutor for one, in all states and in the federal government. It has to go up to the agent in charge. Then from there it goes to the FBI, and to the federal lawyers, and anytime it`s a public official, then they decide to make sure it`s not entrapment. There`s a lot of cases and a lot of things they have to do to make sure that this isn`t somebody that has never took drugs in their life, never bought drugs, and you go out and try to convict them.
But you have to realize, this is a guy, his drug dealer turned him in.
HUTT: Right.
PINSKY: OK. Mark, go ahead.
EIGLARSH: This is -- this is not entrapment. If I was representing him and he said I was entrapped, I`d say no, no, keep your trap shut, we`re going to plead it out. The reason why, entrapment, which rarely works, is when law enforcement induces someone to do something unlawfully that they wouldn`t normally do.
This guy had a vial of cocaine waiting for them in his apartment.
PINSKY: Sheriff, the drug dealer -- I didn`t know the drug dealer turned him in. Was that some sort of deal to get off the hook, a big fish they wanted?
JONES: Sure --
EIGLARSH: All the time.
JONES: You guys have to keep in mind, here`s a congressman of the United States, and he`s making these deals, and he`s voting on law enforcement deals, and he`s voting on crime bills, and here he`s buying drugs from the people that he`s trying to -- it`s an embarrassment to the country, and I agree with your panel members, when you have a congressman in the United States that, I didn`t get enough lollipops as a kid and it`s made me become an alcoholic, he`s the congressman of the -- he should resign and he should be out of there. No sympathy here.
PINSKY: All right. OK, Sheriff.
Lynn --
MILLS FRANCIS: She voted on the farm bill that welfare recipients should have to take urine tests for drugs before they get money. I mean, they have to pee in a cup to get $300 a month, and he`s spending hundreds - -
JONES: No sympathy here.
PINSKY: He`s being tested himself.
BERRY: He also supported legislation that got rid of mandatory minimums for drug possession.
JONES: And he`s buying drugs from drug dealers.
PINSKY: What does mean?
BERRY: Mandatory minimum, so if he was caught carrying drugs, there had be a mandatory minimum sentence.
PINSKY: He got rid of the mandatory minimum.
BERRY: He got rid of it. You can read into however you would like.
But here`s I find that`s really interesting. Here`s a really good- looking guy, with a beautiful wife, a beautiful 2-year-old baby, and we feel sorry for him. Look at them, they`re a beautiful family.
You put up Rob Ford`s pictures, this overweight blubbering idiot, and we like to make fun of him. I think appearances are so interesting here. If he looked like a meth head, I guarantee you, we would be they look like freaks, get them out of the there.
(CROSSTALK)
EIGLARSH: Drew, I have a question for you. Drew --
PINSKY: Kinsey, you heard her cutting right through all of our conversation, but go ahead, Mark, please.
EIGLARSH: Let me ask you this. Do you recommend someone in early recovery to hang on to a job like this? Is that really a smart move?
PINSKY: It`s not a smart move -- the most significant, the most common reason I would say my patients are unable to sustain their sobriety is they go back to work prematurely. It`s not up to me to tell them what to do with their jobs, but returning prematurely is what takes people out, it takes celebrities out.
I imagine it takes politicians out. But let`s remind ourselves it`s a medical condition, whether the guy is heavy, or good-looking, has a baby, it cuts across all lines when people get this condition. And, by the way, just because alcohol is legal, I understand he`s making laws over the more pernicious substances. I understand, Karen, what you`re saying, but it`s all addictive substances.
EIGLARSH: Yes.
PINSKY: Just because we decided what was legal doesn`t make it less of an addiction.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Karen.
MILLS FRANCIS: This is the point of our lawmakers.
PINSKY: I get that.
Who was that? Kinsey, you`re trying to make a point?
SCHOFIELD: I was going to say, I think one thing that frustrates me about both him and the mayor is that they both have come out and said, oh, I`m kind of sorry -- but they made it sound like it was only one time. There`s no way this was only one time. Fess up and be like, I have a severe problem, all-encompassing. I didn`t just smoke cocaine when I was too drunk.
PINSKY: I agree with you and I`ll bring in --
SCHOFIELD: I sort of screwed up.
PINSKY: I will bring in a behavior bureau to take a good look at the two crack politicians.
And later, you will hear what George Zimmerman`s girlfriend has to say about their relationship and what his mental state is. She claims she`s been trying to manipulate him into treatment, because she`s been so concerned about his mental status. We`ll get into that after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
FORD: No, I don`t smoke crack and I`m not a crack addict. Have I? Yes, I have.
MATT LAUER: And you`re not in any alcohol treatment program?
FORD: No.
LAUER: Not in any drug treatment program?
FORD: No, I`m not in alcohol treatment program. I`m not perfect.
REPORTER: Why not see some addiction specialist, just to make sure?
FORD: I`m not an addict.
REPORTER: Congressman Radel plans to go into an inpatient drug facility.
RADEL: I want to be a conservative voice that stands up for what right and does the right thing.
REPORTER: He`s already also gone into outpatient counseling here in Washington, D.C.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Back with my co-host Jenny Hutt.
Jenny, I want to share a tweet with you, celebrating Judge Karen in the last segment. If you guys would put that up for me.
From @oldhippy, we`re able to get that up? There it is. "Hooray for the judge. She is right. He wants to look like poor sad-sack alcoholic who happened to pick up coke."
I`m amazed, Jenny, people understand alcoholism and addiction. It`s all going to the same place in the brain. People have preferences. They have one drug that predominates. It`s all about the same air of the brain being stimulated.
It doesn`t matter if you`re using a legal substance or illegal substance, agree?
HUTT: It`s sad regardless. I do.
But can I go to something to what Lynn said before, we seem to have more compassion for the better-looking addict? That`s not why I feel bad. I feel bad because I feel like he got kicked into his addiction, because of loss and flipping out. Not that he`s hot.
PINSKY: Let`s bring in the behavior bureau. I know you do think he`s hot, in fact, though.
HUTT: What?
PINSKY: Judy Ho, psychologist, Danine Manette, criminal investigator, author of "Ultimate Betrayal," Samantha Schacher, host of "Pop Trigger" on Young Turks Network, and new to our behavior bureau, my buddy Greg Grunberg, actor from "Big Ass Spider", that is available on iTunes, and you know him from "Heroes."
What you don`t know -- of course, he created the free mobile app, Yowza! You can save money with that. What you don`t know about Greg is he actually reads minds in real life, right?
GREG GRUNBERG, ACTOR: I do. I do read minds in real life. I`m so enjoying this show, by the way.
PINSKY: Thank you.
I`m reminded a little bit, too. You seem to want to say something. So, go right at it.
GRUNBERG: Yes, I do want to say. First of all, this Ford guy is filling a void for me. I`m a huge Chris Farley fan. I am -- without going to the video store and re-renting, this guy is a mess. He`s a train wreck.
And the biggest problem that I have with these guys is that, you know, in the end, first of all they`re saying they don`t have a problem, that`s the first, you know -- addicts, are con men, they don`t believe it. But they`re taking advantage to this press. This is a machine.
I want people to download my app.? Maybe I should start doing crack cocaine. I never knew who this guy was, and now everybody knows who he is, and his approval rating went up, apparently, is that correct? It`s ridiculous.
PINSKY: Well, it was temporarily. It was temporarily. It seems to have plummeted now.
(CROSSTALK)
GRUNBERG: Well, that`s good.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, POP TRIGGER: Dr. Drew?
PINSKY: Sam?
SCHACHER: Dr. Drew, okay, our leaders in -- should be held to a different standard and this is embarrassing, but addiction is, it doesn`t discriminate.
PINSKY: Right.
SCHACHER: So I do have some sympathy for both of them, and I don`t fault them. Where I do blame them is how they deal with their substance abuse problems moving forward. And --
PINSKY: All right. OK.
SCHACHER: Congressman who`s been a much better example than the mayor.
PINSKY: Well, that`s what I want to get into. Judy, I`ll go right to you with this question. On the one hand, so, we have a blustery defense, obfuscating manipulative alcoholic who`s in denial. On the other, we have a guy with an alcoholism, cocaine mixed in also, who was very quick to admit he`s an addict and say I`m going to rehab.
When people in the press say they`re going to rehab, I don`t know what they`re talking about anymore.
Judy?
JUDY HO, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: I know. there`s so many different kinds of rehab. What are you in rehab for? It`s like a thousand problems.
But, you know, he has taken the more quiet approach, the more let me admit my fault right now, I will say that for Trey, but I think it`s interesting that both of them are using alcohol as the gateway drug. Remember who did that before on the Oprah interview -- was Lindsay Lohan. She said alcohol was the reason why she began experimenting with crack and these other things. I wonder how much of that is an excuse?
PINSKY: Alcohol is always there.
HO: Isn`t that an excuse? Because that`s a more socially appropriate thing?
PINSKY: Yes.
HO: And people can accept that more than crack.
PINSKY: Greg?
GRUNBERG: But he`s using the alcohol, the thing I love, it`s like getting stopped for a DUI, and saying the only reason I`m driving drunk is because I`m so drunk.
That`s what he said --
PINSKY: Right.
GRUNBERG: -- he`s like I`m only doing crack cocaine because --
PINSKY: And hey, Greg, he`s also -- hey, I`m being honest. I`m being honest. Obliterated I don`t know where I am. You can`t fault me for being honest.
Yes, we can. We can. It`s not OK to buy cocaine.
Greg, I want to introduce you to Danine Manette. She always has a way of dropping bombs into these conversations.
Let`s have her get to it.
DANINE MANETTE, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: I have two things. Number one, people always seem to go to the lowest denominator, the thing that people can accept the most, which is alcoholism at this time, just like Ariel Castro. He wanted to bulk about that he was a sex addict. He didn`t bother to talk about that he was a child molester or a rapist. He wants to go for the thing that people can identify with.
And everybody uses alcohol, so that`s the only thing they`re going to concentrate on. But, you know, we lift up our celebrities and we lift our sports people to be role models when actually the people that need to be the role models are the people that make the laws that the rest of us have to follow. These are the people that I have no patience for and I have no acceptance of and I don`t feel sorry for because they make the rules that we have to follow. They need to follow them, too. They knew they were having these problems.
PINSKY: I would say --
SCHACHER: But they`re still susceptible to addiction, though.
HUTT: Right.
MANETTE: But they were addictive before they got these positions.
PINSKY: Maybe, maybe not. It does --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: And by the way, politics does attract people with these proclivities, it attracts people with certain personality styles.
Judy, you`re saying yes. What do you know about this?
HO: Well, you know, I think politics attract people who are high self-monitors. You know, they don`t even know who they are anymore because they`re constantly presenting themselves in different ways to please different people.
And you know, that`s a lot of pressure, Dr. Drew.
After a while, you need to get away from that. And you know, we know that alcoholism and drug use is a way of avoidance and escape.
PINSKY: I don`t know, Greg. I don`t know who I am anymore, either. What about you?
(LAUGHTER)
PINSKY: I have to be on TV every day.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Jenny.
HUTT: The idea that it`s because of the life`s pressure, that that becomes some sort of excuse to then use crack cocaine or be obliterated while on the job. That, to me, seems unacceptable. The disease --
PINSKY: All right. Let us remind ourselves, we are -- with the "Behavior Bureau," is that we`re looking at explanations, not excuses. And people are not -- they`re not responsible for their disorders. They are responsible for their treatment. And so, the question with both these guys, bring this camera in here for a second, for both these guys, in our - - we`re going to talk a little later about Chris Brown who went to rehab.
In public and in the press these days -- fine, they`re going to rehab. I don`t know what that means anymore. Sometimes, I think, maybe somebody more like the mayor in Toronto is a little more -- at least you know what you`re dealing with there. At least we know exactly what`s going on. Both frustrating, but one is a little more honest, and people don`t know how to deal with it.
As I said, mayor in Toronto, you got to cut through that nonsense. You got to go after. If you have a question or comment, tweet us @DrDrewHLN #behaviorbureau. We are on Instagram as well @DrDrewHLN.
Next up, George Zimmerman is in hiding tonight, and we are hearing that he apparently is suicidal. We`ll tell you what we know after we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR, @ANAHITASEDA: To be honest with you, Dr. Drew, I actually feel and I fear, I should say, that he is being targeted by people in his life for them to get their 15 minutes of fame.
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: What?
PINSKY: Hold on.
SEDAGHATFAR: Yes. You cannot deny that he has been under a microscope since his acquittal in the Trayvon Martin case.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Jenny and I are back. George Zimmerman charged with felony assault. His girlfriend, Samantha Scheibe, called 911, claimed Zimmerman smashed up her house, threatened her with a gun. But now, we`re hearing, get this, that Scheibe had contacted a reporter three weeks ago, and at that time, provided some very intimate, ominous details about that relationship. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Samantha Scheibe and her mother, Hope Mason, described George Zimmerman as alone, depressed, and fascinated by guns. Scheibe said she feared him, but she stayed with him because she thought she could help him. That`s when she says she and George had an argument over her demand that he get professional help for his depression. Zimmerman moved all of her furniture, clothes, and food out of her Seminole County home.
She`s scared is the bottom line. He`s now threatened her in writing, she said in a text message, and even sent a portion of the video to her baby girl. Mason said that message was a still image from an intimate home video of Scheibe and Zimmerman.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Oh, great. Zimmerman, the sex tape, Jenny. Fantastic.
HUTT: That is just gross, Dr. Drew. I`m sorry.
PINSKY: Back with us, Lynn, Kinsey, Judge Karen, Mark. Oh my goodness. Kinsey, you sorted reacted to that, go ahead.
KINSEY SCHOFIELD, SOCIAL MEDIA COMMENTATOR: I think I would rather die in a fire than see that sex tape, Dr. Drew.
(LAUGHTER)
PINSKY: Judge Karen, why do you think that Scheibe reported this to a reporter instead of the police, if she was really that concerned about him?
JUDGE KAREN MILLS-FRANCIS, HOST, "SUPREME JUSTICE WITH JUDGE KAREN": You know what I think is fascinating, that it`s poetic justice the way this dysfunction that Zimmerman`s life has played out since that verdict. I mean, we found out that his wife stayed with him even though he had been beating her. She acted like everything was OK and sat by him during the trial.
And now, this woman here, who he was friends with in high school, is calling local channel 6 to say I`m terrified of this man instead of calling the police. And we hear now he can`t find a job. He doesn`t have any money. He`s violent. He`s got problem with guns. All this stuff, we should have heard this stuff before the trial.
PINSKY: I agree with you.
SCHOFIELD: If you have that reputation -- yes, if you have that reputation this type of reputation and you just got off from murdering somebody, I mean, he really did murder this child, wouldn`t you not trust somebody that was actively pursuing you to be in a relationship with you? Isn`t that sketch in the first place that somebody wants to be in a relationship with somebody that basically has a target on their forehead?
PINSKY: I think Kinsey point is well taken. Lynn, am I missing something here? I think that what we`re sort of seeing is sort of the O.J. effect, that this has been a long thing that we just now are more aware of.
LYNN BERRY, HLN HOST: Well, and I think that you can speak to the psychology of it. It`s really disturbing to me as a citizen that this guy is walking the streets. It seems like something much larger. Now, Frank Taaffe yesterday called it PTSD. I personally think that Frank Taaffe is looking for his 15 months of fame, not his 15 minutes.
(LAUGHTER)
BERRY: If Frank Taaffe wasn`t being booked on national news show, he wouldn`t be bailing out George Zimmerman. He`d be sitting at home trying to figure out another way to get booked on national news shows. I mean, I pulled that aside. But this guy is likely suffering depression and he`s likely doing something that is forcing him into these situations, and he is on the street out on bond. It is frightening.
PINSKY: Mark.
MARK EIGLARSH, SPEAKTOMARK.COM: I agree with Lynn. Think about it for one second, OK? Legally, he was acquitted, right? A jury found that he -- there wasn`t sufficient evident to prove that he was legally responsible, but let`s step back for one second. Do you think there`s a few times he`s daydreamed and he said, all right, I shot an unarmed teenager. Had I not gotten out of my car -- and I`m not judging him. I`m just saying these are the facts.
Had I not gotten out of my car that night and confronted him or walked to go look, he`d still be alive. You think that that might do some harm to the hole in his soul that`s probably the size of the Grand Canyon right now?
BERRY: Well, you`d hope it would. Sure. you would hope that would haunt his dreams.
PINSKY: And I guess, sort of like attracts like, Karen you asked -- I think, Kinsey, you were asking the question why the girlfriend would stick around. We have a picture of the girlfriend`s mom caught leaving her house, coat covering her head, but before she got in the car, she had a few -- that gesture there you`re seeing is not an accidental flailing of her arm. That is a middle finger extended for everybody to have at it. And a few weeks -- go ahead.
SCHOFIELD: I actually got an e-mail in my inbox today saying that Shellie has an exclusive interview with somebody, Shellie Zimmerman. I definitely think that Scheibe is doing this for attention. She wants her 15 minutes. She likes the attention she`s getting. And she`s got the exclusive, so everybody wants to put a camera in front of her.
BERRY: Let`s be honest, George Zimmerman is not going to attract like Sally Perfect. Do you know what I mean? I mean, he`s not really going to get the best of the crop.
SCHOFIELD: He shouldn`t be in a relationship right now.
BERRY: Well, sure. I mean, obviously, but he`s not going to attract someone that`s logical and knows that. But we should also point out that there were reports that this woman was seeking money from national news organization. That is the motive here. The motive would be that she`s thinking that she can monetize this relationship with --
PINSKY: Karen, finish this up.
MILLER-FRANCIS: No, I just think that there`s a whole lot of players playing around him, but his life is never going to be normal. That`s why I believe that we`re going to see, not his life getting better, but his life getting worse. He can`t get a job. He can`t really just walk down the street. And just like one of your guests just said, he can`t even get a decent woman.
(LAUGHTER)
BERRY: He`s not going to get a decent woman. That`s for sure.
Next up, a judge orders Chris Brown, singer Chris Brown back to rehab, but will that keep him out of jail? There`s a wild story attached to all of that. Lots of things to get into.
Also, Miley Cyrus has a new look and the Twitter-verse just absolutely exploded in response to her new appearance. We`ll be right back to examine all of this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY (voice-over): Chris Brown, at it again. he`s charged with felony assault while on probation for having hit Rihanna.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This time, we`re talking about a felony arrest charge for beating a man outside of posh Washington D.C. hotel.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Four years ago, Brown pled guilty to assaulting then girlfriend, Rihanna.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He got into an altercation with Frank (ph) at the night club. He got into a physical altercation with Frank Ocean in a parking lot.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In case you forgot, Brown is already on probation and this could blow it for him.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY (on-camera): Back with my co-host, Jenny Hutt. Judy, Danine, Sam, and Greg still with me. Chris Brown, ordered by a judge to immediately return to rehab, whatever that is. This all stems from a probation violation, probation violation -- you see how many layers there are, and his 2009 assault on then girlfriend, Rihanna. Brown, he last entered rehab in late October for what was called anger management but exited after just 16 days.
The probation department says Brown he was kicked out of the facility after a violent rage. I think he threw something at his mom`s car or something. Danine -- yes, that sort of was -- Danine, do you have anything to say about this?
DANINE MANETTE, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: I do. You know, I dealt with this kind of kids at juvenile hall. They have what I called controlled uncontrollable rage, which means they only go after people that they think that they can -- that are weaker than them and the people they can beat. Not anybody who can whip their butt.
So, he goes after women and he goes after people he knows he can beat, but he wouldn`t act that way if he was dealing with Ray Lewis or Incognito, or, you know, Jay-Z or somebody he knows --
PINSKY: Or Danine Manette?
MANETTE: Exactly. You`re right on that one.
PINSKY: Greg, your thoughts?
MANETTE: So, he chooses to act this way.
GREG GRUNBERG, ACTOR, "BIG ASS SPIDER": The problem is also this guy is a monster. I mean, he really needs to feel the consequence of what`s going on. He`s a violent guy, but then when, you know, like my kids, when my kids see Rihanna saying that she`ll take him back or, you know, the stories that you see, and then the guy gets in trouble again, we need to use these guys as examples.
My personal opinion, let`s lock him up in a recording studio where he can`t get out but he can still make great music. I don`t want him to be able to hurt anybody else. It`s ridiculous.
(CROSSTALK)
HO: I don`t know about that.
GRUNBERG: Lock him up.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: I think last time that we spoke about Chris Brown, I think last time we spoke about him, I called him a jerk with a capital "J," but now I want to add an exclamation mark to that previous statement. And what`s so infuriating is the majority of these incidents have occurred after he beat up Rihanna.
You thought -- I thought that would have been was his rock bottom and that would have motivated him to get serious treatment then. But, instead, we continue to see this behavior --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: It`s just like Zimmerman not stopping after Trayvon was killed. It`s just like the mayor in Toronto not stopping after he was caught smoking crack. People that do these things keep doing them, in fact, progress with them oftentimes until they have comprehensive treatment, but they have to want to participate in that treatment.
HO: That`s true, Dr. Drew, but you know what, I feel like everybody on the panel feels like he`s a monster, that there`s no hope for him, that he picks on the weak people. And you know what, he has an impulse control problem.
SCHACHER: Look at Rihanna`s face. Look at Rihanna`s face.
HO: If we actually believe that he has a real problem, and he`s only in his early 20s, then let`s try to get him help? If prison is really the answer because we`re just wasting money away, keep him in prison, letting him rot there, we should really try to put some resources into this guy instead of beating him like this. I mean, what do you guys think?
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: One at a time. One at a time. Jenny.
HUTT: Why do we feel bad for an alcoholic or drug addict who might get in vehicular manslaughter situation and we might be angry and -- called a disease and this guy who has rage impulse issues, clearly, there`s something wrong with him, but we have less compassion, I feel like because it`s violent.
PINSKY: Let me be clear. But I`ve said this over again, Jenny, you bring up the issue of somebody hitting someone while -- too late! You should have got treatment before that. When it`s too late, then it`s too late and then the legal system steps in. And I want to share with you guys what the judge is also asking.
He`s asking for a report on last month`s incident in Washington D.C. where he apparently broke some guy`s nose with his body guard. Go ahead there if you guys -- show me the stuff up here of the -- of what it was -- they wanted him like to be able to take his medication. They wanted him to --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Yes. Here it is. He had submitted the drug testing at the rehab. And by the way, you don`t do drug testing, unless, you are a drug addict. So, there we go diagnostically, ladies and gentlemen. We can read between the lines there and know that he has a drug problem, which I didn`t know before that.
And he also has -- this was extraordinary, guys. Judy or Danine, back me up on this, that he`s being forced to take the medication that the doctors are recommending at the facility. That`s kind of an extraordinary little clause there, don`t you agree?
MANETTE: I do agree. I think it is extraordinary, but I don`t think it`s going to do any good because he`s going to do what people allow him to do. He`s going to act the way he wants to act to get the attention that he gets. I don`t think that any drug is going to solve this problem. I think he needs --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Greg, finish me up.
GRUNBERG: I completely agree. Until a guy like this gets smacked in the face with the reality of the consequences for his actions, he`s going to keep doing it. You talk about the fact that he`s preying on vulnerable people, and people, you know, women. You hit a woman, that`s it. You`re going away. In my book, that`s it. And the fact that he`s done this --
SCHACHER: That should have motivated him to get help.
GRUNBERG: He keeps selling records. He keeps getting fame, so the people that he feels like that he can beat on keep getting bigger and bigger. That`s not going to stop.
PINSKY: Or we take a page from Greg`s book and we turn him into like a (INAUDIBLE) and we put him into recording studio --
(CROSSTALK)
GRUNBERG: I love his music. Sorry. Love the music.
PINSKY: I get that. I get that.
Next up, Miley Cyrus with a new look on Instagram. Notice here. There`s anything missing? I don`t even recognize her in that. Be sure to follow us at Instagram @DrDrewHLN. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny Hutt and Judy, Danine, Sam, and Greg. Miley Cyrus going from twerking to what looks like over-tweezing in this Instagram photo with model, Miranda Kerr (ph). Actually, she apparently had bleached her eyebrows, but this new look has been blowing up social media. Greg, you think this is funny?
GRUNBERG: I do think this is funny, because I think she`s playing all of us. I`m of two camps like, first, I think we need to auto-tune her life like she auto-tunes her music.
(CROSSTALK)
GRUNBERG: It would be great if we can control her. But I got to tell you something, she`s brilliant. She knows exactly what she`s doing. She`s not hurting anyone, by the way. All these other people we talked about on the show are hurting other people. And she`s not responsible for anybody but herself. And I know she`s a role model, but she`s really not hurting anyone, and she`s a PR machine.
She knows -- if you saw her on "Saturday Night Live," she`s brilliant. She`s not out of control. She`s not doing drugs --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Hang on, Judy. I`m going on to save Judy. Hold on. Hold on. I`m going to save Judy and then Danine. Go ahead, Danine.
MANETTE: You know, I`ve come full circle on this Miley thing, honestly. I recognize now that she is just rebranding herself. And that, yes, she`s fired her fans and I wish she wouldn`t have done that, but this is who she`s going to be now. So, I guess, she`s not hurting anybody.
PINSKY: I agree with Danine and Greg. I agree with both of you, guys. However, Judy brought up a very important point I think a couple days ago which is that her parents split up and that`s when we saw an escalation on some of this bizarre behavior. So, within that PR machine, maybe some real problematic behavior.
HO: Who she is now is an expression of mental health disorder, Dr. Drew. She needs help and she`s crying for help, and we`re ignoring her.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Sam, finish it up. We got 20 seconds.
SCHACHER: OK. Really quickly, bleaching eyebrows, who cares? She`s 20 years old. She`s trying to experiment with her appearance. When I was 20, I dyed my hair black and got a cholo (ph) tattoo. So, I`m just saying.
PINSKY: Wow. We know Sam is the picture of mental health. So, there you go. Thank you, panel. "Last Call" is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: And "Last Call" goes to Jenny Hutt.
HUTT: First of all, I think Miley is a terrific singer and does not auto-tune. And second, I`d like to see Sam with that black hair.
PINSKY: Let`s see if we can arrangement that. It`d be interesting. Maybe we`ll show everyone her cholo (ph) tattoo some days -- cholo (ph) tattoo, is that what she calls it?
HUTT: I don`t know. She has a few tattoo, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Thank you, guys, thank you all for watching. Thank you, Jenny. "What Would You Do?" starts right now.
END
