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Dr. Drew
Teen Sues Parents for $$$
Aired March 05, 2014 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, mom. Just to let you know, you`re a real (EXPLETIVE DELETED) winner, aren`t you?
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, this honor student is suing her own parents. She says they should pay her bills. What does the behavior bureau say?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I saw a little kid in the back, like, waving his arms around, like screaming "Help! Help us!"
PINSKY: And what made a pregnant woman drive into the ocean with her children trapped in the car?
Plus, is your third grader smoking pot?
Let`s get started.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Good evening.
My co-host is Sirius XM Radio`s Jenny Hutt.
And coming up, you will hear the 911 call that saved that mother and her children from drowning in the ocean after she drove out into the water on purpose.
But first, an 18-year-old honor student and cheerleader suing her own parents. She says they were abusive. They kicked her out of her house for not following the rules. She moved out. They say she simply moved out.
Look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re being sued by our child. It`s -- it`s -- I`m dumbfounded. So is my wife. So are my other daughters.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She alleges her parents abandoned her when she turned 18 and are now refusing to pay for her to go to college.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Rachel`s choice to have a boyfriend is against their rules. I would argue that`s not normal. That`s not normal.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are there privileges to living in my house and under my roof? Yes, yes. Private school, new car, college education.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They say Rachel chose to leave home in a dispute over curfews and chores.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Canning`s parents say the 18-year-old wouldn`t listen, went out drinking all night with her boyfriend, at one point leaving her mother a profanity-laced voice mail.
VOICEMAIL: Hi, mom. Just to let you know, you`re a real (EXPLETIVE DELETED) winner, aren`t you? I really just want to (EXPLETIVE DELETED) all over your face right now because it looks like that anyway.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`d be whole and healed as a family if she were back home. It`s killing us.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Joining us, Lauren Lake, attorney and presiding judge on "Paternity Court", Mike Catherwood, TV and radio host, my co-host on "Love Line," Kaleb Nation from KalebNation.com, Jillian Barberie, co-host of KABC`s "Midday L.A.", and HLN`s Lynn Berry.
Before I go to Lynn Berry, is anyone else having the same experience I`m having? I want to reach to the television and throttle that girl`s attorney. That attorney is causing this break-up of a family.
Yes, Mike, although you liked the use of language in the tape to her mom, I`m telling you, I am so angry at the legal system for breaking down a family like this.
But, Lynn, first, tell me what the latest is on this.
LYNN BERRY, HLN HOST (via telephone): You know, and, Dr. Drew, that`s what so many people have been saying on Facebook and Twitter. They`re disgusted by this lawyer.
They`re also disgusted by the best friend`s family that is allowing this girl to be living with them and paying her current legal expenses.
But here`s the deal. There are two very different stories being told. And it matters that there are two stories being told in the court. The girl is 18. She`s saying her parents emotionally abused her. That she was bulimic as a result of it, that they kicked her out of the house.
The parents say she was combative about chores. She had a boyfriend that was nothing but trouble, that they gave her an ultimatum to break up with him. She disobeyed and she moved out on her own.
She wants her parents to give her about $600 for things like food and clothing, then she wants tuition for her private school paid for. That she wants tuition for her college paid for.
All of these things, she says she`s entitled to -- #entitlement, that`s another thing we`re seeing trending constantly -- because her parents neglected her.
Now, this is just a temporary fix. The judge said not right now they don`t have to pay, but later he`s going to decide whose story is the story that`s the truth. That`s what matters. I`ll let your legal panel get into why that matters.
PINSKY: I`ll tell you what matters is that this poor family and that poor girl who has some significant -- I don`t want to call her -- I don`t want to use too strong a language. She needs help.
This is a standard problem when you have mental illness in a family or someone is in trouble and needs help, you don`t go to the legal system.
Judge Lauren, please help me with this.
LAUREN LAKE, PATERNITY COURT: Mental problems? What she`s got is a lot of nerve, Dr. Drew. I mean, to suggest that because your parents are trying to provide some level of discipline and not letting you sleep overnight with boys and giving you rules and a curfew is abuse, I haven`t heard anything that amounts to abuse.
You know, I sit in Paternity Court every day and listen to people that would kill to know who their father is and to have two parents that love them, support them, put them through school.
Give me a break.
But you know what? These parents might be guilty of some type of bad parenting. But it`s not abuse. What it is is not a girl --
MIKE CATHERWOOD, LOVELINES: Well, even if it is abuse --
LAKE: -- with a level of respect and boundaries so she doesn`t talk to her parents like that. From where I come from, we call it home training and she doesn`t have any.
PINSKY: But let`s at least accept --
LAKE: That was a mouthful.
PINSKY: Indeed, there maybe a treatable situation there. What is wrong with that attorney that`s representing her, Lauren?
LAKE: You know, for me, for her to entertain this, let`s just call it billable hours, because this is just ridiculous.
PINSKY: Disgusting.
LAKE: And for her to sit there and suggest that a parent`s saying that you know what? If you`re not able to have a boyfriend right now because you don`t know how to handle it and come home at night and your curfew, that is allowed under the rights of parenting, and they`re trying to make sure she doesn`t end up in paternity court. She needs to get herself together or get a job.
PINSKY: And, Jenny --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: One second, Mike. I`m going to let you comment about the language. You seem to get turned on by that.
But, Jenny, you`re the attorney here. Since when does an attorney decide what is normal parenting and what is not?
JENNY HUTT, CO-HOST: Well, unfortunately, or fortunately, depending on how you look at it, Dr. Drew, an attorney doesn`t decide what is normal parenting and what is not. An attorney can find whether or not there is a legal issue at hand. Whether the parents haven`t lived up to their duty or have lived up to their duty or there`s been abuse.
I don`t think there`s been abuse here, Dr. Drew.
And let me say one other thing, we`ve talked about this on the show before, that I grew up with parents who supported me beyond their duty to do so, but I have a work ethic, and I didn`t turn out like that. So, why, Dr. Drew, did this happen to her?
CATHERWOOD: I`ll tell you why. I know exactly why.
PINSKY: You tell me why. Go, Mike, tell me.
CATHERWOOD: Listen, I know exactly why. And I know plenty of these girls. I know Jillian`s going to agree with me.
She`s just hot enough to be treated special at that age and wherever she comes from in her little private Catholic school, but she hasn`t been exposed to, like, Hollywood or Vegas or Manhattan where she`s not hot at all. So --
HUTT: Oh, Mike!
CATHERWOOD: -- she should be humbled -- I`m telling you -- and here`s another thing. Here`s another thing.
HUTT: Hot girl syndrome?
CATHERWOOD: Let me ask you ladies on the panel here. I`m glad I have three beautiful women here on the panel.
Isn`t the whole point of your high school boyfriend, isn`t the whole point to piss off your parents?
HUTT: No.
CATHERWOOD: Your first boyfriend, isn`t it your goal to make your parents mad because you date some guy who vomits on himself or is in a rock band?
HUTT: What?
CATHERWOOD: I don`t understand why she can get off by suing her parents.
PINSKY: Go ahead, Jillian. Jillian, go ahead.
JILLIAN BARBERIE, KABC RADIO: Well, you know, Mike, I totally understand what you`re saying. I will say whatever sympathy you might have for this girl went out the window with that message she left her mom. She`s a little witch.
And my parents said to me, you live under my roof. You think you know all this? Get out there and get a job. You will abide by our rules. If you don`t want to abide by our rules, then you will pay us room and board, and you will get a job.
I decided to go to school. This girl, I wanted to say, OK, maybe -- I think the judge is right in this. I feel horrible for the parents. I think the judge is saying, what`s next? A 12-year-old sues for an Xbox? A 13-year-old says I want an iPad?
LAKE: Right.
BARBERIE: It`s absolutely outrageous. Forget her looks. She`s ugly on the inside.
She moved in with a family, and the father was a lawyer. And they`re litigious.
And the father said, hmm, you`re living with us, we`ve got a case here. Your parents --
PINSKY: Kaleb, I`m going to hear from Kaleb. Even if I am sort of compassionate towards these girls who`s leaving these horrible messages for her parents, she needs help, let`s get her that. Not a lawsuit.
KALEB NATION, KALEBNATION.COM: Dr. Drew, the crazy thing about this is she expects her parents to pay for things even though she doesn`t follow their rules. She wants free money from her parents that she didn`t work for to go and get things paid for herself.
Whenever my parents told me that I was to not date girls, that I had to go and follow their rules and stuff, I didn`t want to follow them, and I hated it then.
But if I wanted to live in their house as an adult, I have to follow their rules. It`s their house. It doesn`t matter if I like it or not.
When I didn`t like it, I left. I went out just like a real adult does. I got my own job. I went to college.
I didn`t party. I took the bus. I lived near poverty level, and now I`m on television.
So, I don`t hold it against them. That was their rules.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Just thinking about Mike -- hang on, Mike. Why did -- Mike, Mike, Mike. I was thinking about you as an adolescent in high school, even heading into college. Why didn`t your parents sue you?
(LAUGHTER)
CATHERWOOD: They should have. By the time I was 18, they had plenty of -- they wouldn`t even need an attorney. I would be destitute the rest of my life considering all the bad stuff I did to them.
PINSKY: All right. We got to get a quick break --
CATHERWOOD: But I`m saying, look, if this girl`s 18 now, she`s 18, she could sue her parents, then she`s old enough to just leave them alone and get out of their lives. She doesn`t need to bother with all this. What a terrible little girl.
PINSKY: It`s sad the legal system rips a family part. I`m gusted by that.
Next up, the voice mail the daughter left for her mom. And again, we censor it because every other word is "F" or "S" or something awful, and it really is something to behold. I know, Mike, you were impressed with it, but it gets ridiculous.
And later, the 911 call that led to the rescue of a woman who intentionally drove her minivan daughter left for her mom. We censor it because every other word is "f" or "s" and it really is something to behold. I know, mike, you were impressed with it, but it gets ridiculous.
And later, the 911 call that led to the rescue of a woman who intentionally drove her minivan full of kids into the ocean. We have that call. Back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
VOICEMAIL: Hi, mom. Just to let you know, you`re a real (EXPLETIVE DELETED) winner, aren`t you? You think you`re so cool, and you think you caught me throwing up in the bathroom after eating an egg frittata. Yes, sorry that you have problems and you need to harp on mine because I didn`t. And actually I took a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) which I want to (EXPLETIVE DELETED) all over your face right now because it looks like that anyway.
Anyway, I (EXPLETIVE DELETED) hate you and I`ve written you off. So don`t talk to me. Don`t do anything. I`m blocking you from just about everything. Have a nice life. Bye, mom.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
PINSKY: Wow! Back with Jenny. Can you believe it? Lovely, lovely young lady. Lovely.
A reminder, that was a reenactment of the voice mail left by a teen who is suing her parents now.
Let`s bring in the behavior bureau, Judy Ho, clinical psychologist, Leeann Tweeden, social commentator, Erica America, Z100 Radio personality and psychotherapist, Samantha Schacher, social commentator, host of "Pop Trigger" in the Young Turks Network.
I`m so upset about this damn thing, I`m afraid I`m going to cuss, I`m afraid I would mispronounce your names. This is really a disturbing story to me.
Social media is also buzzing about this story. Sam, what are you seeing?
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. First of all, I cannot get over that voice mail, Dr. Drew. I can`t imagine talking to my mom that way. What a "B" word. Sorry, calling an 18-year-old a "B" word. That`s what she is.
But as far as social media goes, there`s a lot of allegations that are floating around. Rachel`s claiming that her parents are to blame for her eating disorder because her mom called her porky and fat, that her dad unfairly wanted her to earn a basketball scholarship, that he was inappropriate with her, he kissed her inappropriately, that he got her blackout drunk at a wedding, that she wasn`t allowed to date.
Now, of course, the parents are saying none of that is true. And then the court and authorities are backing the parents up.
PINSKY: This is just awful.
Judy, what do you think? What are we looking at here?
JUDY HO, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, Dr. Drew, this is just like that case when they said that there was somebody who had affluenza. It`s like that. I mean, this person is very, very entitled.
Who knows? I think in the family, she probably got away with whatever she wanted for a long time without structure. And all of a sudden, the parents said it`s time for us to actually teach her something. And when they tried to do that, she`s like, you know what, I`m not having this. I`ve never had to obey any rules. Why do I have to do it now?
There`s absolutely a lack of respect. I really wonder what`s going on with the two younger kids in the family, too.
PINSKY: But I don`t -- couldn`t it be, Erica, that this girl -- I mean, the claims are so grandiose and bizarre. I want them to pay the rest of my tuition, I want $625 spending -- it almost sounds like bipolar, or bordering personality disorder, somebody who needs to be looked after, not in a courtroom.
ERICA AMERICA, Z100 RADIO: Well, first, we really need to look -- yes, a lot of it sounds like it should be going on in a group therapy room. But I want to say that --
PINSKY: Yes.
AMERICA: But, first, though, these allegations of abuse do need to be investigated to make sure they`re not true.
SCHACHER: They were. They were.
AMERICA: OK, OK.
PINSKY: Who said they were? Hold on. Listen, you guys, we have this terrible, terrible delay. I`m apologizing to the viewers. A lot of us are talking over one another. We can`t help it.
So, stop telling me that on Twitter. I`m sick of that, too. Stop it. I`ll do the best I can.
Who said they were investigated?
SCHACHER: They were investigated, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Who? Tell me about that.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: You see that delay? That`s the delay we`re dealing with, everybody.
Sam, what was the investigation?
SCHACHER: Well, they did investigate to see if these abuse charges were relevant and that they were warranted, and they were cleared. The parents were free and cleared, and they actually found out that the parents were being verbally abused, and they even found out that the mom was trying to help her daughter get help with her bulimia, as the daughter was saying that the mom wasn`t trying to help her.
So, it`s just all B.S., Dr. Drew. It`s all B.S.
PINSKY: All right. So, Erica, there you go, Erica. There`s the facts. What do you do with that?
AMERICA: Thank you. I still disagree with everybody tonight. And listen, I always want to hear the side of the child first.
That`s just the kind of person I am. I`m close with many teens. I`ve worked with many teens.
What I want to say is why do they want to take away her last semester of high school? No matter what went down, the place for this girl is in school where there`s normalcy. And to pull -- I`m not saying they have to pay for college or weekly for clothes, but high school, that was not nice of them to do that. I didn`t like that.
HUTT: Dr. Drew --
PINSKY: You know what? I`ll let Jenny talk in a second. But I kind of agree, Erica. They`re guilty of not accessing mental health services when they should to get the help they need and the guidance and professional guidance, so this girl can be managed and this doesn`t end up in the courtroom.
Go ahead. Go ahead there, Jenny.
HUTT: OK. Dr. Drew, first of all, Erica, she got in trouble in school and there were truancy charges from the school. So, it`s a Catholic school they pay for. I think she could go to public school. I`m not sure they want to pay for her in this specific school.
But to Dr. Drew, to your point about that it should just be treatment, treatment, treatment, yes, in this situation, it should. But I do think legal remedies are important when they should be used even with family. Sometimes kids should emancipate and there should be legal assistance. This is not that case.
PINSKY: Yes. Horrible, terrible --
SCHACHER: Dr. Drew, they did take counseling, though.
PINSKY: They did? What happened?
SCHACHER: They did take her.
HUTT: It didn`t work.
SCHACHER: This is why it`s so infuriating. They took her to counseling multiple times. She had multiple therapists. And the father gave her strict stipulations. We want you to come home. Come home but you have to continue to go to counseling.
She didn`t want to do that. She wanted her cake and eat it, too. She wanted to be able to do whatever the hell she wants but then have mommy and daddy pay for her. You`re 18, not 12, then go get a job and stop bitching.
PINSKY: So, they may have been using whatever leverage they had.
I`m going to let -- I know, Leeann, I know you`re going to unleash something on this. So, I`m saving you for last.
But they may have used whatever leverage they had, and then what happens to their leverage? Some attorney gets in the way of it. Go ahead, Leeann.
HUTT: Stop with that attorney bashing.
LEEANN TWEEDEN, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: OK, let me just tell you --
PINSKY: What do you mean, stop attorney bashing? They`re ruining a family here! Are you kidding me?
(CROSSTALK)
HUTT: First of all, this one specific attorney, Dr. Drew, is ruining a family, not every attorney.
PINSKY: Leann, finish.
TWEEDEN: OK, my turn. One time when I was a child, I grew up in the South. I back-talked to my grandmother. My dad smacked me across the face.
Not that I`m saying that`s right. Not that I`m saying that girl need to be spanked, but maybe she did need to be spanked.
What I always say, if she`s a brat now, how did she become a brat? The parents probably let her get that way.
Now, I`m not saying the parents are wrong because I agree with the parents. I`m surprised the judge ruled that they don`t have to pay for her high school. If anything, I say, pay the rest of her high school because she started that when she was younger before all these problems started happening.
I`m surprised he`s waiting to rule on college because since when do parents have to pay for your college? There are plenty of kids, me included, that put themselves through school.
SCHACHER: Me, too.
(CROSSTALK)
TWEEDEN: That girl is a little bitch.
HO: Dr. Drew --
SCHACHER: Yes, yes.
PINSKY: Judy?
HO: And, Leeann, I think that they just wised up way too late. These parents wised up way too late when the teen has already gotten everything she wanted for, what, 14, 15 years of her life. Finally, they`re trying to put the smackdown on her and she`s never had it because she`s never experienced boundaries before.
SCHACHER: Exactly. Exactly.
(CROSSTALK)
TWEEDEN: And I want to know what her sisters think. Like she`s saying she was abused. What do the younger sisters think?
PINSKY: They think she`s crazy, but, Erica, I want to hear from you because your take on the teenager`s point of view.
AMERICA: I think that there might be mental illness involved here. It could be a bipolar disorder coming out, borderline personality --
PINSKY: Yes! That`s where I started this talk.
AMERICA: We shouldn`t be villainizing this teen, making her this horrible, spoiled brat when she might not be that. She might not be treated for something that she has. It`s rather bothering me.
PINSKY: Let`s at least say that there`s a unique relationship between the substrate of that kid and those parents and it`s having some sort of -- something is emerging that should be able to be managed, if this legal system didn`t get in the way of it.
If anything, they should be mandating this family into treatment.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: -- ridiculous, destructive, disgusting lawsuit from going guard. I will not stand for that. I`m not going to say it`s OK on any level. It`s not OK.
I have to go to break, ladies, I`m sorry.
Next up, a mother drives her minivan into the ocean on purpose. Three kids inside. I have warmer feelings towards that mother than I do the attorney on this case. We`ve got the video and the 911 call.
And later, are third graders smoking pot at school? We have a shocking, shocking report.
Back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Jenny and I back.
As it pertains to the teen and her parents, we asked the attorneys on both sides for comment. We did not hear back from either camp.
Now, on to the next story. A pregnant woman is caught on video driving her minivan straight into the ocean with her three little kids trapped in the back and screaming for help. Her sister actually called 911 a few hours before this happened. We have that 911 call. It gives you a sense of what`s going on with this woman`s psychiatrically.
We will play that for you. But first, take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A terrifying scene.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can see the waves start to swallow the car and pull it out to sea.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A pregnant woman and her three young children are trapped inside. The mother allegedly drove it into the ocean.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the two in the back seat was crying with their arms out, saying, "Our mommy`s trying to kill us. Please help."
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One rescue seen carrying two of the children out of the water.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I saw her bail right out the window and the kids were still in the car.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As another jumped out of the nearly submerged vehicle with the third child.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has been admitted to the hospital for a mental evaluation.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Let`s bring back the behavior bureau -- Judy, Leeann, Erica and Sam.
Erica, what are your thoughts?
AMERICA: OK. So, I think that the system started to work out well here. We have the mom reporting at the police, then coming. But the issue that I have is that they didn`t take her in because she didn`t say, in two hours I`m going to drive into the ocean and I`m going to kill myself and possibly my kids. Of course, somebody with a mental illness is not going to say that. It needs to be evaluated what the law is to take someone in.
Even the police said she didn`t seem right. How did they let her go on with her children? I don`t understand that.
PINSKY: Yes, that`s a really important point. So the point is the police came earlier for an evaluation. They decided they didn`t have enough evidence to hold her against her will. Even though she didn`t seem right and then let her back to her parenting.
Judy, go ahead.
HO: Well, Dr. Drew, there are actually two opportunities where somebody could have intervened because the sister actually took her into a mental health hospital on Monday to get her evaluated, and then she checked herself out. This mother checked herself out on Tuesday. So that happened. And then there was this police call. And when the police showed up, what she told the police was, you know what? My husband has been abusing me so I`m driving my kids to a shelter to protect them.
So, she seemed lucid and the police let her go. But my question is, why doesn`t the police say, well, let us escort you to that shelter? Which shelter are you going to?
HUTT: Right.
HO: We`ll follow your car. Why don`t they do that? What`s going on here?
PINSKY: I can`t tell you, not only that, Judy, but how many times --
HO: Two chances.
PINSKY: -- are patients allowed -- addicts and non-addicts -- allowed, severely depressed patients, allowed to return home, sign themselves out because they seemed OK. Even though there are firearms at home. That`s where I really get upset and that`s how these kinds of stories usually play out.
I want to show you the evidence we have. Two hours before she drove that car into the ocean, her own sister made this 911 call. Take a listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
SISTER: I need a wellness check. My sister was getting abused by her husband. I tried to take her to the hospital yesterday, and she signed herself out today. She`s getting a little bit better, but she`s still not all here. So she`s trying to drive and I`m trying to stop her. And she has her kids. But I took her keys.
OPERATOR: What is she doing?
SISTER: She`s talking about Jesus and that there`s demons in my house and that I`m trying to control her but I`m trying to keep them safe.
OPERATOR: She thinks there`s demons in the house?
SISTER: Yes.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
PINSKY: Judy, she`s pregnant with a florid psychosis. Do we need anything else?
HO: We don`t need anything else. And this is my problem. Like how many of these emergency responders and policemen and policewomen are really trained to recognize these signs? And don`t they know that when somebody has paranoid schizophrenia, they can do a lot of things to protect those delusions.
So, they can appear lucid sometimes when you talk to them. I one time gave a neuropsychological exam to a paranoid schizophrenic for six hours without knowing it because we were talking about other things not related to the delusions. We were doing cognitive tests. He was totally on top of it. He was in the 99th percentile. He was a smart one.
So they can keep it up for a while especially if they can sort of protect their delusion. That`s what I think she was doing.
PINSKY: OK. I want to give the lay part of the panel a chance to ring in here.
Leeann, do you get what we`re talking about here? This is sort of a failure of the system ultimately. It`s easy to take aim at this mom and go oh, horrible mom. She`s ill.
HO: She`s ill.
TWEEDEN: Right. No, I even read in the report today that she even tried to go to a women`s shelter, and she was turned down because they were full. So, it seems on three different occasions, she was trying to go places to get help.
As a new mother, I am mortified. I feel so sorry for those children. Three of them -- the two of them are the ones that alerted the first responders that there was a baby in the car still. They thought there were only two kids. And they`re saying, "Mommy`s trying to kill me, but we have another -- we have a sibling in the car. Help her."
And to find out that she`s pregnant, she`s going to have a fourth child. These children are probably going to be in the system forever. So, now, we have four children that are going to be mentally messed up as well.
But you`re right. What do we do with the system, Dr. Drew? I don`t think there was any more she could have done to try to get her help. Nothing happened for her.
PINSKY: Here`s what the police said about the 911 call. Sam, I`m going to have you react to it. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was having some mental issues, but when Daytona -- and several officers interviewed her, and she did not display enough of any type of issue that she could be taken into custody. She had the right answers. She said she was heading for an abuse shelter. So, at that time, they could not do anything with her. But then two hours later, it had escalated to this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Let`s remind ourselves, Sam, that they`re afraid -- they`re really afraid to do as -- can`t hold somebody against their will. Even if you have a suspicion that things might not go so well, unless, you have the objective evidence, you can`t do it.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Right. And I think, actually, that Dr. Judy Ho hit the nail on the head. They don`t even really have the appropriate training to assess when somebody is suffering from a mental break. And you know what, Dr. Drew? This scares the hell out of me because also, the sister talked about this mother that just a couple weeks ago, she was a loving and doting mother.
That she never would have thought that her sister would have hurt her children. And we hear this over and over and over again. So, can somebody who is normal, let`s say I just had kids and I love my kids, and then all of a sudden -- and I know that you hate the term "snapped," but all of a sudden, a couple weeks later, be driving my kids into the ocean.
PINSKY: Yes. But Sam, we know what these things are. Listen --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Even on Twitter, somebody says here she`s -- this is J.C. She says, "I`m bipolar and talked my way out of situations. The system fails all the time." So, people sometimes know they have these conditions, and they still can`t get the help. Jenny, you wanted to comment.
JENNY HUTT, ATTORNEY: I do. Well, two things. It`s clearly not the sister`s fault, but I feel bad for her that she didn`t stay with the kids because the guilt she must have today. And "B," I don`t know why 911, Dr. Drew didn`t listen to just the important stuff, she was worried about the children. It`s about that kid who in the back seat was saying, "my mommy is trying to kill me!" That`s what`s making me so sad. That`s what`s so - -
PINSKY: It`s sad, but it`s not necessary.
TWEEDEN: The cops said they went there, though, and they did follow her. They did follow her for a little bit. And then they were, like, she seemed like she was doing fine so they turned away and she went to the beach and then drove into the ocean a little bit after that.
PINSKY: Erica, last thought --
(CROSSTALK)
ERICA AMERICA, Z100 RADIO & TV HOST: I agree. I think it was Judy who said that there definitely needs to be more training on the parts of whether it`s the police officers and the law needs to change that it can`t just be that the person says I`m going to hurt myself or I`m going to hurt anyone else.
PINSKY: Yes, thank you.
AMERICA: Because they`re never going to say that.
PINSKY: That`s right. Thank you. We`ll leave it there.
Next, Oprah tells off Lindsay Lohan. Oprah tells her off. You will see it.
And later, remember this road rage attack? There`s a man now who will never walk again who tells us who is to blame for that incident. We`ll be back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: She was a really talented actress with a promising career.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: To a certified party girl.
LINDSAY LOHAN, ACTRESS: When you`re in L.A. and you hear everyone`s going out, you`re, like, oh, what`s going to happen if I`m not there that one night?
PINSKY: The actress was sentenced 30 days in county lockup.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This one stems from her misdemeanor assault case where Lindsay`s accused of punching a fortune teller in a nightclub.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jail for her behavior. She stood before a judge some 20 times.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lindsay`s stunning confession, finally admitting that she is an addict.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s next for Lindsay Lohan after her sixth stint in rehab?
PINSKY: And I`ve been saying for a long time, Lindsay needs six to 12 months of treatment where she doesn`t even think about work.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: And I still feel the same way. Jenny and I are back. Before we head off into that story, we have coming up, third graders smoking pot at school. We have a report that is really shocking.
But first, as you saw in that clip, Lindsay Lohan did not focus on her treatment. Instead, she jumped back into work. She got a reality series for the Oprah Winfrey Network. And guess what? There`s trouble. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LOHAN: It`s good, good, good, and then, there`s that thing in my head where it`s like oh, time to sabotage.
Don`t put words in my mouth. This is exactly not what I signed up for.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you want me to scrap all of yesterday?
LOHAN: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s not letting us upstairs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She has changed things every single day, not following the rules that they agreed to, not participating. She wouldn`t commit to the shoot next week, so they had to cancel it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is exactly what everybody said was going to happen, and I believed differently. She doesn`t understand, this is your life.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Back with us, we have Mike, Kaleb, Jillian and defense attorney, Anahita Sedaghatfar, joining us. Also Cheryl Arutt, clinical and forensic psychologist, she`s on the phone. Sheryl, a couple things here, just real quickly, do you think some of what we`re seeing here is a bona fide borderline personality disorder or is this just an addict incompletely treated or both?
VOICE OF CHERYL ARUTT, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, Dr. Drew, I think we`re seeing both. I do think that people with borderline personality disorder very often, as you know, also abuse substances or have other types of ways of trying to quickly change their feeling state, because these are people who don`t know how to smooth themselves. They don`t know how to hold on to a sense of identity. Everything is how the last person has treated them. I think we talk about --
PINSKY: Unregulated and chaotic, all the stuff we`re seeing is sometimes hard to tell if it is just somebody who is in there to seize (ph) of addiction and just not had adequate treatment or if they have a real personality disorder. In either case, they need to focus on long-term agreement. Do you agree with me on that, Cheryl?
ARUTT: I absolutely do, Dr. Drew. I so hope that Lindsay gets that. I really, really do. When there`s pressure on her to perform, it`s counterproductive for the kind of steadiness and focus on learning how to take care of herself on the inside that she needs so badly.
PINSKY: Completely, completely agree. Mike, this sounds familiar to you?
MIKE CATHERWOOD, RADIO & TV HOST: Sounds awfully familiar. And if you heard, you know, some of those clips from the upcoming own series with Ms. Lohan, she`s just really resistant to adopting any other new routines. I mean, that`s so common where you, as an addict or an alcoholic, you hold on to these precious areas of comfort. These routines that you know so well, regardless, if they`re hurtful to you or not. And I feel so bad for Lindsay Lohan.
I really do. And I know that she`s probably worn thin on everybody in the public, and she`s earned that. But, I know how hard it was for me and how much focus and effort it took for me to get clean, and I had a really good support group. A really good support group. And I wasn`t on television. And I wasn`t in front of the public eye. And she has all these added layers of burden, you know?
PINSKY: That`s right.
CATHERWOOD: And I just really feel for her.
PINSKY: Focus, focus, focus. And it wore thin on Oprah, too. She confronted Lindsay about the ongoing turmoil, and the own cameras were there. Pick it up. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OPRAH WINFREY, HOST: My truth is that I really do want you to win. I really do. If that isn`t what you want, I`m OK with that. You know, I will tell these guys to pack up and leave today.
LOHAN: No, it`s not that I`m not ready to do that. I do want to.
WINFREY: You need to cut the (EXPLETIVE DELETED). You really do.
LOHAN: I know that this is my last.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Jillian, I don`t think that`s going to do very much. Though, she did threaten the one thing that worked here is I`m going to take the cameras away.
JILLIAN BARBERIE, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Well, yes, but, you know, I sort of feel like it`s a little self-serving of Oprah to say my truth is and I will pack up and leave. It`s not about you, Oprah. Like, Lindsay, this behavior has been going on for years. I read an article five years ago where the editor was followed -- journalist followed her around in Paris. And they`re, like, it`s 2:00 in the morning. She won`t come out of the hotel room.
The next day, they waited. The next day. This behavior has been going on forever. And unfortunately, we live in Hollywood where bad behavior seems to be rewarded. You have a sex tape, here`s a reality show. You are an addict, we`ll put you on TV. Like Mike said, there`s no privacy to get better and to concentrate on what`s important.
PINSKY: Anahita, what are your thoughts?
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Dr. Drew, this is a reality show, OK? This is a trailer. It`s an advertisement. Did you think they were going to show Lindsay Lohan sitting on her porch like knitting a sweater while she`s sipping on iced tea? I mean, come on. No one would watch. We want to see the train wreck. And, you know, I think one time you said that Dennis Rodman told you, here is God and here are NBA players.
Well, here`s God, and here`s Oprah Winfrey. You know, I think that Oprah Winfrey does have Lindsay Lohan`s best interests at heart, but I just can`t seem to think that this is good for her recovery, putting herself in the spotlight.
PINSKY: No, it isn`t. It isn`t.
SEDAGHATFAR: Being subjective to scrutiny all over again.
PINSKY: People don`t understand that. Mike, go ahead.
CATHERWOOD: I was going to say, I think Anahita`s right. In Oprah`s mind, she`s doing what is good and is probably productive in her own eyes for Lindsay Lohan. She`s given her a chunk of cash, getting her back in front of the public eye. But what Oprah doesn`t understand -- and Drew, you have to understand as a physician who specializes in addiction medicine, you`ve said some of your own colleagues truly don`t even understand the addiction, the disease of addiction.
PINSKY: Oh, yes.
(CROSSTALK)
CATHERWOOD: I can`t expect Ms. Winfrey to understand it.
PINSKY: The way this could really work for Lindsay is you use what`s happened in front of cameras to leverage her into more treatment. Though, you see this doesn`t work. You made all money. You got back on TV. Go away for six months, 12 months. Focus on your treatment. I have to take a break.
Next, remember this incredible video, we will hear from the man caught in the middle of all this.
And later, could your eight-year-old be smoking pot at school? Do not be so quick to say no. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: If you remember this terrifying scene on a New York Highway, an SUV surrounded by a group of motorcyclists, and then the driver rear ends one of the bikes. The bikers then box in the driver on all sides. In what appears to be a panic, the driver hits the gas, takes off, running over one of the bikers. Tonight, we hear from that biker. He is paralyzed. His spinal cord has been severed. Listen to what he told NBC "Today" show.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As soon as I turned around and started walking back towards my bike, that`s when I got ran over.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You felt every bit of excruciating pain.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As soon as he hit me -- as soon as he hit me, I shut my eyes. I didn`t want to open my eyes because I knew he had hurt me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you blame the driver of the SUV who hit you for your injuries?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, I don`t blame him because at the end of the day, I`m not him to know what was going through his mind.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny, Sam, Anahita, Jillian, Erica America. Sam, what has been the response to this guy on social media?
SCHACHER: Well, actually, Dr. Drew, there hasn`t been a whole lot of sympathy for Edwin even though that he is paralyzed. And, listen, lot of people are saying that he deserved what he got because he was part of this biker gang incident, and his history certainly isn`t helping him. He is somebody that has had 16 citations.
He`s habitual traffic offender. He does not have a motorcycle license, and that`s why a lot of people aren`t giving him the support. In fact, there`s a Facebook page that is dedicated specifically to calling him not a victim.
PINSKY: Well, "The Boston Globe" reported that Edwin was labeled, quote, "an habitual traffic offender," unquote, and was not actually registered to operate a motorcycle. Anahita, though, in spite of all that, that doesn`t mean he deserves to get run over. Does the guy who hit him still have the same liability effectively?
SEDAGHATFAR: Well, of course, he doesn`t deserve to be run over. And I have sympathy for him. I mean, he`s paralyzed. He`s probably never going to walk. But I agree with what Sam said. And my thing is that he was part of this gang. And the sole purpose of this bike gang was to go and create problems and to torment and harass and basically threaten the life of this innocent man, his wife and his young child for absolutely no reason.
And Dr. Drew, there`s no liability for that driver. And I challenge him to file a lawsuit against that driver because he feared for his life. And I think his fear was absolutely reasonable. He was in a fight or flight situation. And I think any man that has his wife and young child in the car would floor it and try to get the heck out of there.
PINSKY: I`m interested to hear you say that. I`m seeing Jenny and Erica America nod their heads vigorously. You guys are in New York. Jenny, you first. What`s the sort of pulse there of the city?
HUTT: Yes. By the way, that is a nightmare, what happened to that driver of the SUV. And if I was in a car with my kid and my husband and we were surrounded by all those bikers, imagine it, Dr. Drew, if that happened to you.
PINSKY: Yes. Horrible. Horrible.
HUTT: You`d floor to protect your family. You`d want to protect them.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Erica, do you agree? Yes. I agree. Erica, same?
AMERICA: Yes. He cannot be held accountable for preserving his own life. That`s what he was doing, because look what happened when he did get stopped. He was pulled out of the car and beaten in front of his wife and child. So he did, unfortunately, of course, it`s so sad what happened to the guy.
Nobody wants anyone to be paralyzed, but he wasn`t in the best situation. He shouldn`t have gotten off his bike to begin with and surround the car. It wasn`t a good place to be in.
PINSKY: Jillian, I remember having mixed feelings about this when it happened. Are you still -- are you on one side or the other?
BARBERIE: No. I do feel for him. He`s paralyzed, and I feel bad for him because at least he`s come out and said, look, you know, he`s being a decent guy. I don`t think -- I disagree with Anahita that that was his sole purpose is to go and terrorize this family. I think he got caught up in the mob mentality which obviously did not pay off for him. But, I feel like, you know, I agree with everybody. Of course, the man defended his family. What are you going to do?
PINSKY: All right. We`re going to leave it. We`re going to leave it there.
SEDAGHATFAR: What`s his lawsuit? Please.
SCHACHER: He doesn`t have a lawsuit. He has not decided to have a lawsuit yet.
PINSKY: I`m sort of intimidated by Anahita this evening. I have sort of --
(LAUGHTER)
PINSKY: Made me nervous. OK.
SEDAGHATFAR: I`m just as passionate as you, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Loud and clear, counselor.
Next up, reading, writing, and weed. Some third graders are getting busted with pot. Could this potentially be your child?
Reminder, you can find us any time on Instagram, @DrDrewHLN. And we`ll be right back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shocked about the marijuana.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Three grade school students were caught smoking pot in a bathroom.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We saw the three kids get taken out of the bathroom, but that was all we saw.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Another student caught the three and immediately told administrators. Students say they haven`t seen the kids on campus since.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think they should be expelled.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with jenny. Three students caught smoking pot in the school, somewhere on the school. No big deal, right? Well, except for the fact these kids are in third grade. And Jenny, it looked like the entire school was alive with cannabis smoke there. I don`t know what that effect. Bring back our panel, Kaleb, Mike, Anahita, Erica America. Kaleb, is this a new trend or what?
(LAUGHTER)
KALEB NATION, KALEBNATION.COM: Dr. Drew, even the pottiest of potheads knows that pot is bad for kids. They didn`t go to some dealer to go pick this stuff up. There`s some adult out there who gave them access to it, put it in their hand (ph). I didn`t even know whenever I was their age, I didn`t know till I was, like, 14 when I listened to this show called "Love Line" way back in the day.
PINSKY: Oops.
NATION: And I didn`t even know what marijuana was until then. And definitely --
PINSKY: Hold that thought. So, Mike, it`s your fault.
CATHERWOOD: It is. It`s probably my fault. It`s you and I, Dr. Drew, with "Love Line." But I disagree, actually. I think with the given, you know, the setting here in California with dispensaries and new marijuana laws, like the average street pot dealer is probably really desperate and would, you know, even sell -- but more than likely, these kids stumbled upon weed and figured out how to use it.
It`s not really marijuana. We should focus on the fact that -- no, it`s really not marijuana. It`s the fact that these kids are using these type of substances, any mood-altering substance at age eight or nine. It`s insane.
PINSKY: Erica, real quick.
AMERICA: First, I want to say, 13 is more -- 12, 13 is the average age. This is more outlier, you know, situation. But I also want to say that this is a learned behavior. It could have been something in the house. It could have been are there older kids in the school.
PINSKY: I`ve got to wrap there. I`m sorry. I have to go. But it`s also the people don`t perceive any harm for pot anymore. So, it`s more likely young people get into it.
If you have a criticism, if you disagree with that, go to #DrDrew, #gripevine. No middle man, no gatekeeper. I will see all these and we will share them.
And check this out. "Death Row Stories" begin this Sunday on CNN at 9:00 eastern. "Death Row Stories," compelling look at who`s in our prisons and why there they are, and we`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Time for our "Last Call" and our tweet tonight, very quickly, Jenny. This is from @DianeRC. She says "You were spot on about Lindsay Lohan, Oprah. It`s all about the trailer, luring people in to tune in. Won`t be watching." I don`t know what that -- "another ANS." I don`t know what that refers to.
But, thank you all tonight for watching. Jenny, thank you very much.
END
