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Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet; Tracking Planes; Search Continues; Difficulties of Ocean Searches; Interpol Says Malaysian Jet Incident Not Terrorism; Global Economic Recovery

Aired March 11, 2014 - 17:00   ET



RICHARD QUEST, HOST: The closing bell rang on Wall Street just an hour ago, it is 5:00 PM in New York as our clocks have changed. The market was down, both the narrow and the broader market, when they rang the bell. And it was all closed on Tuesday, the 11th of March.

Let me update you: this is what we know about the missing Malaysia Airlines jet. It seems to have radically changed course, flying away from its original destination. We'll discuss that this evening.

The transponder and other tracking systems were either switched off or not working due to technical failure. We'll talk about that tonight.

And on the stolen passports, Interpol says it knows who was using them. Police regard them as unlikely terrorists.

I'm Richard Quest in New York.

Good evening. From the very get-go, I've been saying that it's all about different pieces of the jigsaw, which will make the full picture of what happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight 370. And tonight, a dramatic and potentially crucial piece of that jigsaw in the search for the missing 777.

A senior Malaysian air force official says its last known location was nowhere near its original flight path. Come and have a look, and I'll show you what I mean.

Now, the plane left KL, and it was headed up towards Beijing. But if you look at the route and what we know believe to have happened, or at least what we are being told happened, the plane went up, and then about 20 minutes, 30 minutes afterwards, there is a change of direction.

So, instead of continuing up towards Beijing, the plane makes a sharp dog-legged turn and heads west instead of north, and the tracking then -- this is basically secondary tracking of the plane -- sees it going -- or primary tracking, actually -- sees it going over the Malaysian peninsula again and going over -- out into the Straits of Malacca.

And the tracking puts the plane near Pulau Perak. It's the island in the Straits of Malacca, and it would mean, if this is right -- and if we can run that animation again, I don't know whether we can -- and you'll see exactly to put it into perspective.

You will see that the -- it is a very great difference between where it was supposed to be going and actually what did happen, in which case it goes up to there, and then across. The reason is, why should it have done it?

A US military official says Malaysia has passed on information that the aircraft's transponders, which identifies the plane in flight, was either turned off or had stopped working.

So, as a result of this, what we learned yesterday in the press conference -- you'll remember, we talked about it last night -- was that they changed and shifted the area of search. And this is what they added to the area of search.

Previously, the search had been all around this area, but now, they were adding this block and they were adding parts of Malaysia, too, in the Pulau Perak in the Straits of Malacca.

That would make perfect sense -- perfect sense -- if they now believe that the plane did that. Which would put the debris field somewhere in the Straits of Malacca.

So, many questions, none of which, frankly, we're going to be able to answer for you tonight. But many questions are raised by this new development. For instance, not least, how can a plane go like this and no one notices it's off flight plan?

The former director general of IATA says he finds it incredible that fighter jets were not scrambled as soon as the aircraft went off course. I asked Giovanni Bisignani for his gut feeling about what happened to the plane.


GIOVANNI BISIGNANI, FORMER DIRECTOR GENERAL, IATA: It is difficult to imagine a problem in a structure failure of the plane. The Boeing 777 is a modern plane, so it's not the case. It's not a problem of a technical problem to an engine because in that case, the pilot has perfectly time to address this and to inform the air traffic control.

The only issue that it's now raising is the issue of the Malaysians that just rely -- gave us this information that the plane was out of track for a hundred miles.

Something incredible is that when you have those kind of situations, you don't only follow it by radar, but you scramble immediately fighter jets to follow the plane directly, as it happened recently -- a Ethiopian plane that was overflying Italy and landed in Geneva.

QUEST: Right, but --

BISIGNANI: You just don't follow it by the radar.

QUEST: Right, but on this point, just so that our viewers are absolutely clear, this airspace from where this plane is said to have turned around and then crossed back across the Malaysian peninsula, that is all airspace that is covered -- quite covered by radar.

BISIGNANI: Yes, but the radar is not enough. Because the radar gives you the direction of the plane. When you send a scrambled jet fighter to follow, you start looking inside the cockpit, what's going on, as it happened recently with the Ethiopian.

QUEST: So, you are surprised that this plane was able to fly for an hour and ten, seemingly with nobody really raising an alarm?

BISIGNANI: Absolutely. Absolutely. It's something that never happened. And it's quite strange, because it's a country with a sophisticated air force, and with the right equipment to be vigilant in those cases.

QUEST: I was surprised that anyone in this day and age, particularly from a relatively sophisticated modern country like Malaysia, wasn't checking passports against the stolen database as a matter of course. Is that usual?

BISIGNANI: Absolutely. It's a really great negligence from the police. I've worked a lot with my friend Noble, the director general of Interpol, and we are able now to give the information in real time on the passports that have been stolen. There are 40 million passports stolen, but the information is available in real time to all the airports in the world.

QUEST: So, how many countries do it, and how many don't?

BISIGNANI: Members of Interpol are practically all the countries in the world, so it's just negligence of some police that didn't do their job correctly.

QUEST: It's been suggested by Malaysia Airlines yesterday when they were talking about the passport checks and those sort of things, that this all takes extra time, and for the large numbers of passengers that they are boarding. Would it -- does it add appreciably -- if at each border gate it adds a minute to run the security scan, that could take some time.

BISIGNANI: No, it doesn't take less than a minute, because you just go put the print of the passport in the reader, it automatically gives you the information Not only if you just stop looking at the photo and not looking at the numbers or giving any kind of attention, this could happen.

QUEST: From -- what do you think would have been the long-term goal here? Because surely these passengers who were using stolen passports to get on a plane in Malaysia were certainly going to find in Copenhagen or in Frankfurt a very different response.

BISIGNANI: Absolutely. And also, I'm surprised because in Malaysia, you have a brand-new airport, very well equipped. It's a country with a great reputation in aviation, so I was really surprised of this real high negligent attitude of the police at the airport.

QUEST: Is it the airline that should be scanning, or the immigration authorities when you leave?

BISIGNANI: No, it -- the control of the immigration, the immigration makes the control that the person is that one that is indicated in the passport, and that the passport is a good passport and has not been stolen.

QUEST: Is it one of those cases where they are more concerned about the people coming in, because these two men arrived on Iranian passports, then the people leaving?

BISIGNANI: It has to be followed strictly for passengers in and out with the same in terms of currency.


QUEST: Giovanni Bisignani, the former director general of IATA. Malaysian police are investigating the possibility the plane came down as a result of a deliberate act by someone onboard. They're looking at four possible scenarios.

The first, of course, is the hijacking scenario. The second is sabotage. The third, psychological factors in relations to anyone onboard and what they're calling personal problems, issues between passengers and the crew. Police say they're going through the profiles of everyone onboard to consider all the possibilities.

Patrick Smith is an airline pilot and author of the book "Cockpit Confidential." When we need to understand the situations from the pilot's point of view, there really is none better than Patrick to put it into perspective.

So, Patrick, we're not going to ask about tracking of aircraft and things. Instead, I'm going to take us right into this moment here, when the plane changes direction and the transponder is switched off, and seemingly there's no more telemetry from the aircraft. Give me an idea, from a pilot's point of view, what could be happening or what could be at issue here.

PATRICK SMITH, AIRLINE PILOT: Well, you mentioned the transponder being switched off. That's if the transponder was switched off. We don't know that, and really, there's just so much --

QUEST: Right.

SMITH: -- that we don't know. And I think we need to preface all of this by pointing out that about the worst thing we can do here this early after a major incident is speculate too broadly. Because almost always in these cases, whatever we're going to come up with as far as a theory is either going to be very incomplete or perhaps completely wrong.

Now, having said that, what we're seeing now is that this airplane radically changed its course for reasons that we don't and for now cannot understand. And that pushes the whole conversation literally into another --

QUEST: Right.

SMITH: -- another direction. And what I'm feeling from this is, as you've already hinted, foul play is a distinct possibility here, some sort of inflight takeover, a hijacking. The other option would be some sort of rogue crew element here. I doubt that, but it's conceivable.


SMITH: I mean, anything, really is conceivable.

QUEST: Right.

SMITH: And there still exists the possibility, Richard, of some sort of catastrophic technical issue, maybe a total electronic -- electrical failure of the entire aircraft, and that could render the transponders inoperative, for example. That could be the underlying reason --

QUEST: Right, right. Now --

SMITH: -- for that. We just don't know.

QUEST: If there was, from a pilot's point of view here, if there was a total failure of power in that sense, how flyable is the aircraft? I realize that's how like you, it becomes much more challenging. Systems degrade. But how flyable would it be?

SMITH: That varies aircraft type to aircraft type. And as far as the 777 specifically, I'm not sure, but any airplane remains flyable for a considerable period of time after a total electrical failure.

The issue here is how this failure, however it was caused, relates to the loss of communications. And when I say communications, I'm talking about different things. Because remember that a lot of the world, great parts of the world, are not under air traffic control radar coverage.

And so, when you're in these areas, you're communicating in different ways. We have VHF and HF radios, we have FMS data links, sat com. It varies with the ATC facility that you're working with as well as equipment on the airplane.

A plane is always being racked. You're always in contact one way or the other with air traffic control and company staff on the ground. That stopped happening, and that's what we don't understand why --


QUEST: Right, right, but --

SMITH: -- was it intentionally disabling of the equipment, or was it a crazy malfunction?

QUEST: Right. And what is interesting about that is, Patrick, briefly, finally, is that it seems to have lasted for an hour and ten minutes, if these numbers are right.


QUEST: And there was no seemingly scrambling of fighters or what we don't know. I'm guessing maybe we obviously haven't been told the whole picture yet. That's the troubling part that we don't know yet.

SMITH: Probably.

QUEST: Excellent. Patrick, thank you for joining us. It's good to - - sorry, you were about to say something? Go ahead.

SMITH: No, no, you've pretty much nailed it as usual, Richard. Thanks very much.

QUEST: You're too kind. Good to see you, Patrick. Thank you very much.

Now, the chief exec of Malaysia Airlines spoke earlier to CNN's Jim Clancy and told Jim the search would not stop until the plane, wherever it might be, is found.


AHMAD JAUHARI YAHYA, CEO, MALAYSIA AIRLINES: What I find amongst the team here is every day that we don't have an answer, we are more resolved to get to the answer. We're not discouraged.

So, I think when it gets tougher, I think we just have to be more tough. We just have to be more resolved and pay more attention to every single detail. It must be there somewhere. We have to find it.


QUEST: Well, it must be there somewhere, we have to find it. CNN's Andrew Stevens joins us now from Kuala Lumpur with the latest on the search. Andrew, first of all, just -- I'm a bit lost on times at the moment. So, we're 5:00 -- quarter past 5:00. What time is it with you?

ANDREW STEVENS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We're about 20 past 5:00 in the morning here, Richard.

QUEST: So, with that in mind, the search now starts, and the search starts in the new -- or it continues in the newer areas. Why -- talk to me about this change of direction.

STEVENS: Well, what we learned today from a very senior member if the Royal Malaysian Air Force, a man whose name we can't reveal because he's not authorized to speak to the media, is confirmation of what you've been talking about, of the fact that this plane diverted and diverted radically after the transponders stopped working.

And it diverted across -- almost in a U-turn, back across Malaysia into the Straits of Malacca. Now, where the path looks like it took the plane, it flew across a very tiny island, which is just about in the middle of the Straits of Malacca. The other side from Malaysia to Indonesia is probably about 250 miles wide. So, yes.

But I just want to quickly point out, so now that is the last response -- last known reading we're getting from the plane. What happens now and what we're hearing is the authorities in Malaysia are going to swing the focus very much to that area.

There has been searching there going on. The US navy among others have been there. But now the real focus with more than 40 planes and 35 ships, that's where it starts focusing today.

QUEST: And is anybody there -- and I realize you've been in the overnight hours -- is anybody there talking about how a plane was able to fly for the best part of an hour and 20 minutes and seemingly nobody called it, sent up fighters, recognized the distress of it?

STEVENS: We don't have that information at the moment. It -- this information came to light in the early hours. We got this in the early hours. We haven't been able to get additional information, Richard. We're going to have to wait for that.

But it's a great question. How -- particularly because this was being tracked in real time, obviously, that it continued to fly for at least an hour, probably an hour and ten minutes, apparently with no efforts being made to sort of -- to get some sort of visual on the plane from the air, from another plane.

So, there are questions. The other question of course is why now, as we enter day five of this search, are we only finding this out now. There have been theories, there's been a lot of speculation here about the turn- back theory, which is basically what this is. Only now, it looks like it's not a theory.

Why has it taken five days for this to become firm, confirmed by senior members of the Malaysian air force and, indeed, the Malaysian government.

QUEST: Andrew, you'll be asking those questions as the Malaysian day gets underway, 20 past 5:00 in the morning. Good to see you, Andrew Stevens, who's in Kuala Lumpur.

The sea area now being searched is vast, but nobody's thinking of giving up. CNN's Saima Mohsin went onboard a Malaysian military plane that's conducting the search and shows us just why and how it is so difficult.


SAIMA MOHSIN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This C130 plane carries out regular search and rescue missions. This is still a search and rescue operation as far as the Malaysian government is concerned. We're now flying just 500 feet above sea level, very low, searching for missing plane MA 370.

Now, this is the first time that Malaysia's minister of defense in consultation and the chief of defense force has come out to see, to join the operations. They're overviewing all the ships that are out here, more than 40 ships, from neighboring countries, Vietnam, Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia, and the USA and Australia have joined the search.

They have a vast area to cover, around 12,500 square nautical miles. They also asked fishermen to help them in that search, and they say they will not give up until they find the missing plane MA 370. They owe it to the loved ones of those onboard.

Saima Mohsin, CNN, Malaysia.



QUEST: Interpol's secretary general says he does not believe the disappearance of the Malaysia jet is related to terrorism, at least as regards the two stolen passports. Ron Noble was speaking before news broke that the plane's last known location was far from its intended course. The secretary general said the use of stolen passports may indicate people smuggling rather than terrorism.


RONALD NOBLE, SECRETARY GENERAL, INTERPOL: The more information we get, the more we're inclined to conclude that it was not a terrorist incident, and if you read what the head of the police for Malaysia said recently about the 19-year-old whose photograph is here, wanting to travel to Frankfurt, Germany, in order to be with his mother, it's part of a human smuggling issue and not a part of a terrorist issue.


QUEST: So there are more questions than ever to be asked. Hijacking is still not excluded as a possibility, nor mechanical failure. Our senior international correspondent who is looking at the security side of this, Nic Robertson, is in London.

Nic, when I heard the secretary general's comments, I didn't interpret them as him saying there's no -- there's not a terrorism link. I heard him -- I interpreted it as being specific to the two passport issue. What did you make of it?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The same. He really came out to address those two young Iranians who had -- who'd gone from Iran to Kuala Lumpur, and then boarded the flight seven days later, after they arrived in Kuala Lumpur.

And it seemed to be, and he made the same point that the Malaysian police had made that one of the young boys, the 18-year-old, had actually called his mother in Frankfurt, which is where he was going, to say that he was going to arrive there. That's not the way a terrorist -- you would expect a terrorist to act normally.

And it does seem that these two have had close scrutiny. But of course, as we know, there are more than 200 other passengers on that aircraft, and we can expect right now they will be getting very close scrutiny for the same reasons, because there's question of potential hijacking, sabotage is still out there, Richard.

QUEST: And on that point, where does it go from here in that terms of the investigation, Nic, on the security side?

ROBERTSON: We know that the authorities have been reticent, perhaps, is the best way to describe it, for releasing information that they've had for a time. For a number of days, ships have been searching and aircraft have been searching in the Straits of Malacca.

They have only told us overnight tonight Asia time off the record -- or not off the record, but unnamed source -- that actually they believe that's where the aircraft was last seen. So, we can see that there's a reticence to reveal all the information.

And of course, in any investigator -- investigation, investigators would like to keep information to themselves particularly if there's a potential terror link or other type of nefarious criminal link here.

So, I think at the moment, the lack of information, the lack of detail, means that while they're searching for the plane, extreme scrutiny on those passengers and on the pilot and copilot and crew to see if there's anything in any of their backgrounds that could point to --

QUEST: Right.

ROBERTSON: -- something untoward happening on the aircraft.

QUEST: And the extraordinary thing again is this -- every which way this story turns and this awful happening turns -- stolen passports, that brings up the question of human trafficking and the issue that we've talked about often for the Freedom Project. Terrorism, mechanical failure. Your sources are leaning which way, Nic?

ROBERTSON: They're not ruling out terrorism, and I think that's the bottom line. Although they're also not ruling out that potentially -- I mean, I think the smart thinking says this: somebody took control of that aircraft and turned it around. That person must have known how to fly that aircraft. That could be a terrorist, could be a hijacker, let's say, we'll give him a different name. But it could be the pilot or copilot.

So, I think that's where the smart thinking is right now, that what happened to the aircraft means that somebody knew how to fly it. And also, that moment of turning around. We've talked to experts who say the moment that the plane disappeared was when it was handing over between Malaysian air traffic control, Vietnamese air traffic control. The perfect time to disappear in that sort of handover period.

That's what's happened, that shows a level of insider detail that again speaks to somebody who knows aircraft, Richard.

QUEST: Nic Robertson, perplexing, considering the security side of it. Nic, good to see you as always. Thank you for your expertise on that side of the story.

We will turn to economic matters when we come back, and you'll hear from the secretary general of the OECD in a moment.


QUEST: The OECD says an economic slowdown in emerging markets is holding back the global recovery. I spoke to the secretary general, Angel Gurria, and I asked him why they've gone from leaders to laggards.


ANGEL GURRIA, SECRETARY-GENERAL, OECD: The recovery in the industrial countries is positive, it's good news, but it is modest. And second, it takes some time from the moment you start decelerating to the moment it actually manifests itself in drop in demand.

Then, you also have the problem of the so-called tapering. To what extent does the Fed's actions, meaning the reduction of the stimulus, buying back debt every month, how is that affecting the developing countries? Well, to some extent.

But there's also a question that some of the countries that are more exposed have very high current account deficits, and now --

QUEST: Right.

GURRIA: -- with the turbulence in the markets, it's more difficult to get them financed. And last but not least, reforms, reforms, reforms. Just like the more vulnerable European countries have taken a lot of reforms to catch up, this is also necessary in many of the emerging and developing countries. And some of them have not been as fast on their feet on this.

QUEST: So, you are calling for tapering to continue, you are calling for the ECB to consider doing more, and you're also calling for the Bank of Japan to keep doing what it's doing, basically.

GURRIA: We're saying stay with the stimulus. While the US is pulling out gradually, in the UK -- in the -- well, in the UK and in the European area, we're saying stay with the stimulus. And by all means, in the case of Japan --

QUEST: Right, but --

GURRIA: -- we believe this is the only way to get out of deflation, which they were flirting with for 15 years.


QUEST: That is the secretary general of the OECD. Coming up, just days before Crimea's referendum on breaking away from Ukraine, the main airport closes to all flights except those coming from Russia, when we return.


QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. There's more "Quest Means Business" in just a moment. This is CNN, and on this network the news always comes first. A Malaysian Airport's official says the missing plane was hundreds of miles off course when it was last traced. He says radar tracking puts the last known location of 5370 in the straits of Malacca, and if that's correct, they suggest the plane was flying away from its intended destination at the time.

Police say they've identified two Iranian men who boarded the flight on stolen passports. Malaysian investigators say there's nothing to suggest either man had links to any terrorist organization. However, the director of the United States Central Intelligence Agency John Brennan says he's not yet willing to rule out terrorism overall.

They asked that the Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych insists he's still the country's legitimate president and will return to Kiev when the time is right. In his second press conference from Russia since he left Ukraine, Yanukovych blamed the current confrontation in Crimea on fascists and nationalists within Ukraine.

Angry crowds poured onto the streets of Turkish cities after a 15- year-old boy died in hospital. He was said to have been injured after being hit by a teargas canister fired by police last year. Berkin Alvan had been in a coma for months. We'll be live with a report from Istanbul in just a moment.

Korea -- Crimea's main airport today canceled incoming flights from the Ukrainian capital Kiev, and from Turkey. However, they did allow several flights from Moscow to land. Armed pro-Russian forces are in control of the airport. In just a few days' time we're expecting to see a referendum held in Crimea. Russian leaders say they support the vote. Ukraine's government is denouncing it as illegal. Nick Paton Walsh has been covering the story. He's in Simferopol in Ukraine.


NICK PATON WALSH, SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT FOR CNN INTERNATIONAL: This is what you get for trying to film Simferopol's air traffic control, now in the hands of pro-Russian militia. This is the only airport in Crimea still by its own admission part of Ukraine. Don't even dream about catching a flight here from anywhere unless it's from Russia. All flights from Kiev, even Turkey, canceled Tuesday, airspace restricted indefinitely authorities said. This woman's job is to sell phone cards, but she already knows, presumably from local state TV, exactly why.

LYUBOV KRAVCHUK, RESIDENT OF CRIMEA, VIA TRANSLATOR: For security because the fascist who wants to be president -- he wants to bring his armed men here from Kiev to disrupt our referendum. He doesn't want to negotiate, he just wants to shoot.

WALSH: And those flying in from Moscow seem to know how the referendum on independence on Sunday will go.

Male, TRANSLATED BY WALSH: "Crimea is Russia," he says. At the railway station, security is tightening further. Armbands that say "the militia of the autonomous republic of Crimea. Here, they help police search for rivals, sometimes less than softly.

Male, TRANSLATED BY WALSH: "We are looking for people who are bringing in weapons for security from Ukraine, from Maidan." And later, they change shift and the police vanish, letting them get on with filtering out trouble-makers alone. Ahead of Sunday's vote, the ballots have already been printed apparently here where we are shoved out the front door for asking questions. They offer a stark choice between Crimean independence and joining Russia. If you want to stay in Ukraine, you can only really be heard here. They're singing a Ukrainian anthem that may in five days be obsolete even if most of the world won't recognize the vote's results.

Almost as many media as protesters, and in the wings men -- some without flags, some with a whiff of liquor on their breath.

Male, TRANSLATED BY WALSH: My friends say they're here to support stability, but I don't know who they are.

WALSH: Encircled, their numbers flagging and time running out. Nick Paton Walsh, CNN Simferopol, Ukraine.


QUEST: So, airline flights, for example, from Turkish airlines have also been canceled. I spoke to the Turkish Airline's CEO Temel Kotil and asked him why he decided to stop flights to the capital of Crimea.

TEMEL KOTIL, PRESIDENT AND CEO, TURKISH AIRLINES: This is actually a temporary one. So we watching how it's going -- the things there -- and temporarily we canceled today and yesterday. And (inaudible) so hopefully we start very soon again. And so just it's definitely because of the passenger moment (ph) issues.

QUEST: So, this was a -- it's basically a safety and security issue. You don't really want to be flying into places like this where it's so uncertain at the moment -- is that about it?

KOTIL: No passenger moment is relatively limited (inaudible) stop there actually. But we following very closely and at any time we can start again. And as I said, the passenger coming to a (inaudible) and (inaudible), we caution about it.


QUEST: Temel Kotil talking to me earlier. Clashes have erupted on the streets of Istanbul in Turkey after the death of a teenaged boy this morning. The injury that ultimately took Berkin Alvan's life occurred several months ago during an anti-government protest. Witnesses say the boy was hit in the head by teargas canisters. He's been in a coma since. Our correspondent -- our senior international correspondent -- Ivan Watson is in Istanbul with -- for -- us this evening. Good evening, Ivan, can you hear me?

IVAN WATSON, SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I can hear you fine, Richard. I'm coming -- broadcasting to you -- from Istanbul's Taksim Square, really a central hub in the city with a very large police presence here. These are police vehicles over here, there is the sting of teargas still in the air. The fierce clashes that we were seeing just a little while ago in neighboring streets, they seem to have settled down a little bit. But we see burning barricades in some of the back alleys here. As you can see, riot police have expanded out here as well.

And I've been getting reports from other neighborhoods of Istanbul and other cities of disruptions there, of clashes, of people lashing out in anger over the death of this teenager who was killed -- who was critically wounded last June and stayed in a coma in hospital for some nine months, wasted away to a weight of 16 kilograms and then passed away this morning. Now, the family minister of the Turkish government put out a statement saying, "Berkin," -- the boy's name is Berkin Alvan -- "is our son, our child. I'm deeply saddened by his passing. I extend my condolences to his family, we share their pain."

But the explosion of anger that we've seen in different parts of Turkey's largest city suggests that that is not enough to calm the grief of many Turks who see a young boy and blame the government and its policies for the death of this young boy who was last seen conscious going out for bread for breakfast for his family in June at the height of anti-government protests and a pretty intense police crackdown on the demonstrators with that drama playing out in this very square here in Istanbul. Richard.

QUEST: Ivan, clearly the demonstrations have been hard-felt, and they've been -- but they've been particularly nasty. But is it your feeling, having seen these things before, that they have longevity to them? That they are a groundswell of opposition that will continue?

WATSON: That's very difficult for me to tell. I don't really know. We've seen these periodic bursts of anger, these protests and subsequent crackdowns as well. What is significant here is the timing, I mean, Turkey's just a few weeks away from a major national election. It's for municipal elections -- the mayors of Turkish cities and towns. But it's seen very much as a referendum on the Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan who was democratically elected, whose justice and development party has been in power now for more than a decade. The protests that we saw last summer against Recep Tayyip Erdogan tended to come from more urban, from more secular sides of society. But in the last three months, we've witnessed a fierce power struggle underway between Erdogan and what -- who -- a man who had been one of his most important Islamist allies, an Islamic preacher who lives in self-imposed exile in the U.S. state of Pennsylvania. And we've seen Erdogan and this preacher, Fethullah Gulen, mobilizing their forces against each other in a remarkable political power struggle that's been playing out on Twitter and in Facebook and on TV stations and in the newspapers as well. And that has added a very strong dimension to this kind of defensive crowd -

QUEST: Right.

WATSON: -- that the Turkish prime minister is in right now as he campaigns fiercely coming into these elections at the end of this month. Richard.

QUEST: Ivan Watson in Taksim Square. Ivan, thank you for that, Ivan. Coming up next, it was a question time for the governor of the Bank of England, a foreign exchange scandal that's putting the bank's reputation on the line, and Governor Carney had to answer the tough questions.


QUEST: The Bank of England's creating a new post for a deputy governor to oversee financial markets and banking. The Central Bank's reputation for integrity is under attack. There are claims that some officials knew there were suspicions of price rigging in foreign exchange markets -- a major scandal. And those officials did nothing. Governor Mark Carney told British lawmakers a few traders tried to rig the market to their advantage, and that, he said, was unacceptable. Traders have already been suspended at -- well look at them. You've got Lloyds, you've J.P. Morgan, you've got Citibank, you've got HP -- HSBC -- and you've got PNP Paribas. Those are the ones which we know so far. They've also gone from the Bank of America, UBS, Deutsche, Barclays and Royal Bank of Scotland, RBS. That is a vast swathe of Britain's and indeed the global financial community in terms of names. And last week the Bank of England itself suspended an employee. Governor Carney said today some people in the industry had lost their way.


MARK CARNEY, GOVERNOR, BANK OF ENGLAND: What we saw in Libor, and what the FCA is properly investigating -- FCA and other authorities around the world are investigating -- in the FX markets around fixes (ph) are symptomatic of a group of individuals in markets who clearly in the case of Libor -- because there have been prosecutions and it would appear to be the case in FX -- of individuals who have lost sight of what a real market is. And that's not acceptable. And so part of the way we ensure that the Bank has its rightful place is to help lead the effort to rebalance these markets.


QUEST: Jim Boulden was watching the governor answering questions. Jim joins me now. One thing about -- you know -- what one has to admire about Governor Carney -- he doesn't duck the difficult question, and he always speaks his mind.

JIM BOULDEN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and also we should remember of course he's a new bank governor, and so much of what people allege has gone on would've happened but for -- when he was not even at the bank, but at the Bank of Canada. And could've said, well, you know, it wasn't on my watch, but he didn't. He continued to answer as many questions as he could about all this. I think what's interesting is that it's about London's reputation at stake, is it, Richard? The Libor scandal of course -- the "L" stands for London. That's a previous scandal that really shook the market where people manipulating prices in overnight interest rates. Now, we're talking about a foreign exchange. London is hugely important in a foreign exchange market. And it's fixed every day at 4 o'clock. And there's talk about manipulation in the last half an hour before they fix that price. Now, so what's interesting here is that Mark Carney is under fire because the Bank -- the lawmakers think -- should've known this was happening, they think there was a memo back in 2006 that hinted that the Bank of England might've known. But both Mr. Carney and Paul Fisher said no, no, no, we didn't know until October of last year. Take a listen a bit more about -- of Mark Carney.


CARNEY: The first point is it is the responsibility of Financial Conduct Authority to address these issues of market -- potential issues of market abuse. That's the responsibility given by Parliament. We are doing everything we can to support that. The second point is that in terms of the seriousness -- and I should -- maybe I should start with this. This is extremely serious. This is -- as Martin Wheatley has rightly said, this is as serious as Libor if not more, so -

Male: Yes.

CARNEY: -- time to -- and because this goes to the heart of integrity of markets, and we have to establish the integrity of the market --


BOULDEN: So very serious indeed, Richard. And what the bank has said is they have an internal investigation going on. We know that the banks are firing people as well. So we have to see how many more people are going to be implicated in this scandal, Richard.

QUEST: Just -- he summed it up in that sentence. This is as serious if not more serious than Libor. The only problem with this forex scandal. It is -- hasn't caught fire. Libor had people you know -- I suppose because interest rates are responsible to it.


QUEST: But there's not that same feeling that this is as big, but it is.

BOULDEN: And isn't that -- isn't that odd because Libor nobody knows what it is outside of the market -

QUEST: Ah, well -


BOULDEN: -- follow it like us.

QUEST: Well, except -

BOULDEN: We're foreign exchange -- it affects everybody every day.

QUEST: Yes. Except, Jim, if I say to you it affects your mortgage, or if I say to --


QUEST: -- my crew here in New York -- well, it affects your credit cards and it affects your home loans and it affects your insurance, people become interested. If I talk about foreign exchange, they lose it a bit.

BOULDEN: But every time -- both Libor and forex interestingly -- lawsuits are being filed in the U.S. by pension funds and cities who are upset at what they see going on --

QUEST: Right.

BOULDEN: In London. That's where a lot of the heat's coming from is U.S. law firms. Jim Boulden who is in London fixing nothing for us -- well fixing for us but not fix -- well you get the idea, Jim. Good to see you. U.S. stocks fell for the second day in a row. The Dow and the NASDAQ all ended in the red, shares in mortgage finance companies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac tumbled on news of a proposal in Congress to close them down. Well, I suppose if I -- I suppose if there was any proposal to close you down, you might find that the share price -


QUEST: -- would collapse. I'm sorry. I'm sorry, what were you saying Ms. Harrison?

HARRISON: Just having a conversation with my colleague here in the studio, Mr. Quest. I'm so sorry.

QUEST: No -- don't apologize.


HARRISON: (Inaudible) -- listen to.

QUEST: Oh, but you know me, bit of old tut and nonsense. Look, I've heard there's snow coming my way and there's cold weather elsewhere.

HARRISON: There is. I was actually going to start off with something a little bit more upbeat -

QUEST: Please do.

HARRISON: -- and a little bit more positive. I was. I was going to tell you actually about the weather conditions across in Europe because for the first time in I would say three months, there is actually no severe flood warnings that are posted across the U.K., in particular the southwest. That is very good news. And you can see by these clear skies - - pretty good giveaway -- the high pressure is firmly in control. So it really is forcing all those systems to the north and the southeast. And as for temperatures, the average overnight low in Paris this time of year is about 5 Celsius. It's about the same in London, and right now as you can see, coming up to 10 o'clock at night, those temperatures still almost in double figures. This is the pattern through Thursday -- very quiet weather. We've got temperatures above the average, those storms are staying far off to the northwest. We have got some rain mixed in with a little bit of snow into the southeast, but even here not too bad. And this is the temperature trend over the next couple of days. So when you see yellows and greens, you know that the temperature is actually just a little bit above average or indeed average. So, it is looking and feeling pretty good. The rain as I say staying up to the far northwest.

So, some really good, clear, fine days ahead. So much so that there's actually nothing in the way of travel delays weather-wise to tell you about. But what you can see here of course are the temperatures. These are the high temperatures this Tuesday -- 16 in Paris -- the average is ten, 15 in Berlin and so it goes on. So as you head into Wednesday, this time it is very nice again -- 17 expected in Paris, 16 in London, and remember those temperatures are always four (ph) in the shade. So if you're under some good sunny skies, it will feel better.

Now, it is pretty warm at the moment across the South and the Southeast of the U.S. In fact, 26 Celsius in Atlanta, 28 in Dallas. But that is indeed set to change. We've got this mild pattern across the Southeast as we go through Wednesday, this front will slide across bitterly cold air behind and then as you can see, we've got these rain showers ahead. We could have some severe weather -- some severe thunderstorms in the clash of those two. Different temperature of air of course, and then this is the snow -- this is what you're talking about, Richard.

But you might just about miss out. Now there's likely that we could just see a few flurries, but we're not really expecting much in the way of accumulation. Maybe a centimeter, maybe four in Boston, but you're right on the edge of all this snow that's coming through. So, it could head just a bit further to the north or a bit further to the south. The one thing I can tell you of course -- the historic ice coverage this year in the Great Lakes. That it was last year, this is it this year, and my goodness, it's number two in the tables, Richard, for the number of years that we've had ice of this coverage. So, yes, it's not as cold as that for you. You might get a bit of snow, but nothing too bad.

QUEST: Right, I shouldn't -- I shouldn't put away the winter woollies yet?

HARRISON: I would not.

QUEST: Right.

HARRISON: No, I would definitely be keeping to hand.

QUEST: You keep your eyes out of my winter woollies.


QUEST: Jenny Harrison at the World Weather Center. Now, when we come back in a moment, there's a row over an oil tanker and it ends with the removal of Libya's prime minister. More (inaudible) business in a moment.


QUEST: Libya's Parliament voted to remove the Prime Minister Ali Zidan from office. The vote of no confidence came after rebels in eastern Libya said a tanker carrying oil from a port under their control escaped a blockade set up by the Libyan navy. Ali Zidan's ouster comes after months of infighting that stalled efforts to stabilize the country. CNN's Jomana Karadsheh has the latest from the Libyan capital in Tripoli.


JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The confusion continues on the status of that North Korean-flagged oil tanker. That after the government came out on Monday night and insisted that the forces they had dispatched to the area had full control of the vessel after some skirmishes with that armed federalist group that was controlling the ports. Now we heard from that group today -- on Tuesday -- saying that the tanker has left the port and was in international waters loaded with the oil. A number of members of Parliament have also confirmed that, saying that it had managed to escape. The government has yet to comment on these statements that've come out. We have not heard from the government yet. But if this is true, if this vessel has managed to leave with the illegal oil shipment, this is a big blow to Libya, sending a message really about the situation here on the ground -- the government's inability to control what is going on in Libya and to reign in the many armed groups that seem to be growing stronger by the day. Jomana Karadsheh, CNN Tripoli.


QUEST: And after a short break, a "Profitable Moment."


QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment." You have to admire Mark Carney, governor of the Bank of England. He could have basically said "Didn't happen on my watch." But when talking about the foreign exchange scandal, instead he was quite blunt. He said it's extremely serious, possibly more serious than the Libor scandal which riveted us last year and the year before. So, Governor Carney, time to clean up the act because now you've said that you're going to do something. It's time to get on with it. And that's "Quest Means Business" for this Tuesday. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, (RINGS BELL) I hope it's profitable. Please, come back here tomorrow.