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Dr. Drew
Dottie Sandusky Defends Pedophile Husband; Teen Girls Accused of Torturing Boy
Aired March 12, 2014 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, a convicted pedophile`s wife defends him. Sandusky`s wife says nothing happened, but she does believe her husband showered with kids. Is she fooling herself? The behavior bureau looks at what she says and how she says it.
Plus, family reunion. The girl who was suing her parents has moved back home.
And thigh gap fail. Did these photoshopped pictures go too far?
Let`s get started.
(MUSIC)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Good evening.
My co-host is Sirius XM host Jenny Hutt.
Coming up, that student who was suing her parents, remember that story? It was outrageous. That girl now has moved back home. We will tell you why and what is the latest in that case.
But first, Dottie Sandusky, the wife of convicted child sex abuser Jerry Sandusky, she says she`s sure husband is innocent. Here`s some of what she told NBC News.
JENNY HUTT, CO-HOST: Yes, OK.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DOTTIE SANDUSKY, WIFE OF PEDOPHILE: There was nothing that went on because I was here. It was like -- I mean, I`ll take you downstairs and let you see the basement. It is not a dungeon. It is not what those kids said.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is where the accusations that this is where the sexual abuse took place?
SANDUSKY: Correct.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I this room.
SANDUSKY: That`s where the accuser said.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of the victims said he screamed, he screamed while he was being sexually abused by your husband.
SANDUSKY: And I didn`t come.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And he said, why wouldn`t you have heard it?
SANDUSKY: Because he didn`t scream.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you believe he was guilty of inappropriate behavior?
SANDUSKY: I don`t believe that. I believe he showered with kids because that`s the generation that jerry grew up in. Something good will come out of it, I know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What good will come out of it?
SANDUSKY: I don`t know. Right now, I do not know what good will come out of it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Joining us, Lynn Berry, Mike Eiglarsh, attorney at speaktomark.com, and Janine Driver, the human lie detector, author of "You Can`t Lie to Me."
Mark, you`re up first. Dottie said she wasn`t paid to come forward. She just wanted to prove Jerry`s innocent. My question is, good move or not? And why now?
MIKE EIGLARSH, ATTORNEY: It`s a good move for her. I don`t have to agree with what she`s saying. And for the record, I don`t.
She has every right to continue to be Dottie denial all she wants. No one`s buying it. A jury convicted him.
Let me just say this, our First Amendment gives her the right to spew whatever she wants even if it`s outrageous and offensive, especially to the victims. That`s her cherished right. And we have the right to say good riddance. That`s not correct.
PINSKY: Jenny?
BURNETT: But, Mark, why would you say it`s a good move for her? I don`t think it`s a good move. Sadly, she looks like she`s so steeped in denial and so sad and scared and she can`t face it because that would kill her. That`s what it looks like to me. Why is that good for her?
EIGLARSH: Because obviously, Dottie -- I`m calling you Dottie. Obviously, Dottie felt that that was something she needed to do. Good for her. There`s no allegation Dottie participated or did anything. So I wish her well.
If she needed to do that for herself, let her do it. We don`t have to embrace what she`s saying at all.
PINSKY: We heard Dottie deny that her husband showering -- that the showering with young boys was inappropriate. That`s just the generation that did that sort of thing. Who are we to judge?
But, Janine, you saw something very telling in this video we`re watching from NBC. What did you see?
JANINE DRIVER, HUMAN LIE DETECTOR: Dr. Drew, I`m going to smash my head against the wall when I see this video. First of all, I`ve never said this on national television. I was molested when I was 6 years old by a trusted neighbor, a man who lived two houses down. He still lives in the neighborhood I grew up in.
And my life`s mission is to stop bad people from doing bad things. This makes me sick.
To listen to Dottie, she looks sweet. She looks like she makes home made apple sauce and biscuits for you. I feel like she should be a character on "The Blacklist", on the Readington`s black list because I have so much deception, maybe she doesn`t know what`s going on, maybe she did know what`s going on.
I have to tell you, her eye blocking moves are very suspicious. Her eyes are closing at the answering of the questions. She`s smiling through a lot of this, these questions. Smiling.
When people are saying she`s evil. She should be in jail right next to Jerry Sandusky, she`s smiling through the whole thing. That`s either (a), embarrassment, which we don`t hear her say this is embarrassing this is happening, so I`m going to kind of rule that out. The other option is, doping delight.
And she says he didn`t scream, about the one of the boys who screamed. Wait a minute, you didn`t hear him scream. For her to say that he didn`t scream is an over-denial, it`s overemphasizing, and, quite frankly, this is screaming deceit to me and it`s heartbreaking for me.
I think she`s in denial -- Mark hit the nail on the head, denial Dottie.
PINSKY: And she was asked why the prison guards treated her husband differently because of his notoriety, and her now is what she said to NBC.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDUSKY: Most of the guards he says are nice to him. He said they - - I guess they don`t understand Jerry`s still a happy person. And he smiles and he tries to make people laugh.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Len, what are you (AUDIO GAP)
LYNN BERRY, HLN HOST: There were multiple times during this interview -- I watched the entire 50 minutes when you can watch the raw on the Internet. I wanted to jump through the computer screen and that was one of them. I don`t care if he`s happy. I don`t care if he`s trying to make jokes. All I care about is that`s what`s apparently appropriate to him. He`s getting some hugs himself in the prison shower.
She was asked whether or not if her child had -- a grown man hug her naked child in a shower, how would she feel about it? That`s where she goes from denial to reality.
And what Janine was talking about, that eye blinking, she could not hide or mask her denial then. She knows that happened. She admits to that happening.
And the other thing that came out of the interview that shocked me is they say the closest to an admission was him saying he tested the boundaries with children. You don`t test boundaries with children.
PINSKY: Wow.
BERRY: That is the point that you say he is at least a pedophile, we don`t know how far he went along with it, you don`t do that.
PINSKY: Yes.
BERRY: Just drove me nuts.
PINSKY: Janine, the prolonged eye closing, could that be shame? Like when they bring up these shameful things she can`t even look at it, too shameful?
DRIVER: It could be, but here`s the problem, Dr. Drew -- she`s not doing it throughout the whole interview. She`s doing it in the moments where she`s denying. She has also a lapse in pausing. She says, I don`t believe -- that to have happened or I don`t believe that -- to be true.
When we have this dramatic pausing, we saw this with Scott Peterson. We often see that with people that are holding back information, this pausing. Drew Peterson who murdered his second wife Kathleen Savio, his fourth wife or third wife is still missing, we see these behavioral patterns of people being deceptive.
She looks sweet, but I have to tell you I think she knows more than what she`s saying and she`s in denial.
PINSKY: All right. Next up, I`m bring in behavior bureau to discuss Dorothy. Does she believe, or does she not? Is it duping delight or is it embarrassment and shame?
Later, we`ve got news about the teen who had been suing her parents. I guess she`s still suing her parents. She called her mother horrible things. Tonight, she`s back home.
And we`re back after this.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s a serial predator on children, and he set up this situation at Second Mile to put himself in a position where he could have access to children.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Jenny and I are back.
Jenny, a quick tweet here. This is from Roland_Jenkins. "I feel sorry for her," he said. "That made my wife mad, ha ha. Easier to be in denial than deal with the truth."
That is what Roland is saying.
HUTT: Right.
PINSKY: That he`d rather than stay in denial himself than contemplate the fact that this guy was doing horrible things to kids.
And, of course, we`re talking about Dottie Sandusky`s comments about herself and her husband. He is a convicted sex abuser, Jerry Sandusky.
Let`s bring in the behavior bureau, Samantha Schacher, social commentator and host of "Pop Trigger" on the Young Turks Network, Jennie Ketcham, sex abuse survivor, author of "I Am Jennie", and Wendy Walsh, psychologist, author of "The 30-Day Love Detox."
If you like to join the conversation, you can tweet us right no now @DrDrewHLN #behaviorbureau.
NBC`s Matt Lauer asked Dottie about whether do predators choose spouses? This is a really good question. Do predators choose spouses? Like in other words, was Dottie carefully chosen by Jerry Sandusky as someone who would suppress, quote, "unpleasant ideas".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDUSKY: I`m not a weak spouse. As you know, my name -- they called me Sarge because Jerry said I kept everybody in line. If they want to say that, let them say that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Samantha, if they want to say it, let them say it. What do you say?
SAM SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Well, it`s one of two things, Dr. Drew. Either she is delusional in suppressing those ideas of her husband or she is denying it because she did somehow suspect that something was going on or she knew something more and then the question lies to, why didn`t you say anything? Why didn`t you do anything?
And it is really offensive, Dr. Drew. She`s essentially calling all 48 of these victims liars, that they were easily manipulated for financial gain by their attorneys and that is further revictimizing them.
If you listen to any one of their testimonies, you hear how emotional and raw they are. They`re definitely representative of people who were abused. So as Segun would say, shame on her.
PINSKY: Jennie, I see you nodding your head so almost everything sam said. Same thing your gut tells you?
JENNIE KETCHAM, AUTHOR: Really the issue here is that I think it`s going to be just as painful for her to admit that she gave her trust and her love, devoted her life to a man for so many years who could so egregiously abuse that trust. I think it`s going to be just as difficult for her to admit that she trusted this man as it was probably difficult for the parents of the victims to admit that they had entrusted a man who then went on to abuse their children.
PINSKY: Yes, Jenny --
KETCHAM: I think what we`re dealing with here isn`t an evil woman but a woman who has some serious cognitive dissonance and she`s --
HUTT: Exactly.
PINSKY: Jenny H., that cognitive dissonance for people to wake up and realize their life is not what they thought it was, can almost be like being on a drug trip, it can be mind-bending.
HUTT: Of course. But to that point, to add to that point, the moment she knew or admitted that he tested boundaries with children, Dr. Drew, I think right there that red flag, is a huge red flag. That`s the part I don`t understand her not jumping in at that point and why she`s not seeking further the truth.
PINSKY: I agree. And, Wendy, why do you think that is? She sort of blushes it over. Back in those days that`s just what we did. What are you going to say?
WENDY WALSH, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, I think the big message here is that she`s using this coping strategy of denial, because if she starts to really believe what we now know is the truth, then, her entire life makes no sense. Then, this entire house of cards that she`s built will be blown away.
Remember, this is a woman of a certain generation herself and she`s talking less about him and more about her where she`s totally dependent on a man, loyalty was the number one thing that she could depend on. And yes, she put blinders on.
And I just want to -- for all you people slaying her, she wasn`t convicted of anything except maybe marrying a bad guy. And plenty of women have hooked up with bad guys, you know? And they are not at fault for what he did.
I understand she was in the house. I understand she should have been more vigilant and all those things, but she was not convicted of anything except marrying a two-faced person who presented one thing to her and something else in that dark basement.
PINSKY: Sam?
SCHACHER: OK. But, Wendy, I totally get where you`re coming from, but at the same time what if she did suspect something was going on? What if she did know? She could have prevented all of those 48 victims from having to go through what they went through?
WALSH: I don`t believe this woman of that generation and this style of woman could even contemplate the thought.
PINSKY: Jennie K, last word.
WALSH: I don`t think she could have imagined it.
KETCHAM: Yes, I absolutely agree with you, Wendy. And I agree with you that the horrific -- the potential that this woman could have known something. But I think if we play the could have, would have, should have, we`ll all go absolutely insane.
So, I think we`re best just to leave it that she`s probably in quite a bit of pain right now.
PINSKY: And that`s precise will where we will leave it.
Next, cops say two teens admit to torturing a mentally disabled boy then taped what they had done.
And later, outrage over this ad. Take a look at what someone did to this model`s body, excessive.
Back after this.
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PINSKY: I`m back with Jenny.
Two teen girls have been arrested. They are accused of torturing a 6- year-old boy who was mentally disabled.
Here`s what I mean by torture -- cutting him with a knife, kicking him in the groin, dragged him by the hair, forcing him to perform sex acts some of which involved animals, and making him walk on an icy lake. I heard in fact he broke through the ice and they wouldn`t help him when he was in the water.
And now, police say the girls 15 and 17 have admitted to taping these cruel acts. And I have to tell you, Jenny, the footage is so obscene it would not be appropriate to air it.
So we`re going to have to just take that list, that`s what happened and that`s what`s on the footage.
Behavior bureau is back. Sam, Wendy, joining us, Tiffanie Davis Henry, psychotherapist and HLN contributor.
Samantha, your reaction?
SCHACHER: Oh my gosh, Dr. Drew. These girls are either sociopaths or psychopaths. Until we find out more about their upbringing, we will find out why. But to think that they enjoyed torturing this disabled boy is absolutely sick and beyond me.
And my question is, what`s going to happen to them? Because they`re not going to get life sentences. Can they be rehabilitated, Wendy and Tiffanie? Because I don`t want them on the street.
PINSKY: Well, Wendy, I start with you, first. It depends what this is.
WALSH: It depends what this is. Whether one or both are actually suffering from some kind of mental disorder or whether it`s just extreme lack of empathy, this --
HUTT: Evil.
WALSH: It has to do with upbringing.
PINSKY: Or psychopathy. If it`s psychopathy, that`s not treatable.
WALSH: Exactly. So, in the long run, I don`t really know until I have more information about these young women. But certainly a wake-up call for them.
PINSKY: And, Tiffanie, why film this? What is that -- what are they thinking?
TIFFANIE DAVIS HENRY, HLN CONTRIBUTOR: You know, I don`t think they were thinking a lot at all. Certainly, there are two reasons that I can come up with as to why they would film something like this. Everything now amongst this age group is posted. They post it online, whether it`s nor notoriety to get their 15 minutes, for something to go viral. Or they might have posted it to torture him and taunt him further with this later.
It could be just be another form of bullying that they were intending to do later.
SCHACHER: Or, Dr. Drew, maybe they want to relive it.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Oh, whoa, Sam, I don`t know. I`m not sure I`m in the same room with you again. You went too far with this. You guys always creep me out.
Jenny Hutt, what do you say?
HUTT: I just say -- look, I do agree with what Tiffanie just said. Did it happen if it`s not Instagramed? That`s not clear. That`s like today`s mentality.
But look at this kid -- two psychopaths finding each other, Dr. Drew?
PINSKY: Weird.
HUTT: How likely is that?
PINSKY: Not likely.
Joining us on the phone, we have the sheriff from that town, Tim Cameron.
Sheriff, what did you think when you discovered this?
SHERIFF TIM CAMERON, ST. MARY`S COUNTY SHERIFF DEPT. (via telephone): I`ll tell you, I was shocked as most members of our -- that an incident would go on here or anywhere.
PINSKY: Were these -- are these kids in trouble before this? Are these kids that were just heading down a criminal path? Or is this some sort of crazy acting out behavior? Or can you tell us?
CAMERON: Well, nothing pre-incident indicates anything like this. In fact, in this incident, what we know is that a mother of the co-defendant brought the video, which was on the girl`s phone, to one of our high school resource officers and made him aware of it. That`s what triggered the investigation in this case.
PINSKY: So, the mom herself was alarmed by her daughter`s behavior, would that be accurate?
CAMERON: Yes, absolutely.
PINSKY: How have the girls acted since being arrested? Are they remorseful? Do they understand this is inappropriate?
CAMERON: Well, you know, our investigation continues. That`s one thing I don`t know. I know that these 15-year-old girl is still in the custody of the Department of Juvenile Services of Maryland. The 17-year- old who was charged as an adult has been released, but I don`t believe our detectives had any contact.
PINSKY: Sam, you wanted to ask something?
SCHACHER: Yes. Sheriff, so, these videos were never posted? They were just discovered by the mother?
PINSKY: The mom.
CAMERON: Yes, again, that`s what triggered our investigation. Part of the ongoing investigation is to make sure that they were not posted --
SCHACHER: Good.
CAMERON: -- somewhere on social media.
PINSKY: Wendy, do you have something there?
WALSH: Dr. Drew, I want to know what relationship these girls had with this young boy with autism. Was one a baby-sitter or something?
PINSKY: That, and what was their relationship together. I`d be interested in that, too, if you can answer that.
CAMERON: Obviously, we know that they were all students at a local high school. All of these activities did not occur at the school. They occurred in fact away from the school.
So, we know that there was a relationship of some kind. I don`t know that it was a relationship of a caregiver or a baby-sitter, anything like that. That`s what the investigation, of course, will determine as we continue to work towards that. We know that this went on between December of 2013 and, of course, March of this year.
PINSKY: Thank you, Sheriff. We`ll keep an eye on this trying to wrap our head around it, trying to understand.
Thank you, panel.
Next up, why did a student who took her parents to court suddenly move back home? That`s right. She`s back home with her parents after taking them to court, putting them through hell, calling them terrible names, and now, she`s home.
And later the photo that made #thighgap a trending topic. We will discuss and we`re back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY (voice-over): This honors student is suing her own parents.
VOICEMAIL (re-enactment): Hi, mom. Just to let you know you`re a real (EXPLETIVE DELETED) winner, aren`t you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She alleges her parents abandoned her when she turned 18 and are now refusing to pay for her to go to college.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Since when do parents have to pay for your college?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re being sued by our child. It`s -- I`m dumbfounded so is my wife and so are my other daughters.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Rachel`s choice to have a boyfriend is against their rules. I would argue that`s not normal.
PINSKY: The last thing she needs is some attorney getting between she and her family.
NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST: She said that she wanted to S-H-I-T on her mother`s face.
PINSKY: They`re not guilty of accessing mental health services.
SCHACHER: She didn`t want to do that. She wanted to have her cake and eat it, too.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She needs to get herself together or get a job.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny, Sam, Lynn and Mark.
And that New Jersey teen caused an uproar throughout that case, as Nancy said, she wanted to S-H-I-T on her mother`s face. She was kind of poet, a poetic device she deployed. Thank you very much.
And tonight, she`s back with her parents. Here`s what the parents said just hours ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On behalf of the Canning family, Rachel`s back at home. There`s a long road ahead. This is not something that`s going to happen overnight. The point of this process, healing needs to begin. This needs to be professionally as it should have been done in the beginning.
And, you know, I would like to conclude by saying, nothing good could have come from this case -- absolutely nothing good. Even this amicable resolution and fair and the right resolution occurring is still not good.
This kid`s going to be affected long term.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Mark, he seems sane to me. Why did this case get brought to court in the first place? And what do you think happened behind closed doors that led to the resolution?
EIGLARSH: I think that they probably got real with her and said, listen, your chances of winning this are so low, so remote, it approaches no real value. We`re getting killed in the court of public opinion. And in the words of Kenny Rogers, philosopher and scholar --
(LAUGHTER)
EIGLARSH: -- you got to know when to hold them, know when to fold them, and know when to get your teenaged ass home.
PINSKY: And Lynn -- bringing a great poetry today. This teen -- thank you, Mark, for referencing --
(CROSSTALK)
EIGLARSH: Wonderful chicken maker, too.
PINSKY: Very, very timely. Very appropriate. But Lynn, you know, there`s still a lawsuit pending here. Is this really less about them talking straight to the daughter and somebody trying to set her attorneys straight?
LYNN BERRY, HLN HOST: Well, I think a lot of what happened here is probably the best friend`s father who`s footing her legal bills and footing her lifestyle was like, hey, I can`t do this for much longer. You`re my best friend`s -- you know, you`re a friend of my daughter`s, you`re not my daughter. And she realized she`s already been denied the money from her parents in that first trial and it probably wasn`t going to go anywhere. Mark makes a great point.
But the other issue at hand here and the lawyer brought this up in the press conference as well. There was an issue of precedence here. And the judge said it as well. If this would have gone forward, then, like the judge said, a child can sue their parents asking for an iPhone, for an Xbox, whatever it is.
PINSKY: Yes.
BERRY: I mean, it was so ridiculous and so preposterous that this had to end, somebody had to pull the plug and -- the best friend`s father or her attorney that finally smartened up because they listened to you, Dr. Drew, that really railed on her as you should have.
PINSKY: Yes. I mean, Sam, maybe we -- maybe the internet and the media`s had a little impact on this case, and hopefully, talked some sense into somebody.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: I hope so, but I don`t understand why her father`s best friend would even allow this to get to this point in the first place. Why would he encourage her to file a lawsuit? Why would he pay for everything instead of actually encourage her to go to therapy with her parents, to have a family meeting? This should have never been blown out of the proportion that it has.
And this will follow her for a really long time. She`s now known for this case. And I hope that she grows and learns and loses that disgusting attitude.
PINSKY: Sam, I could not agree more with you.
SCHACHER: Google is forever.
PINSKY: But Jenny, you have a daughter in this kind of age range. Are they talking about this case?
JENNY HUTT, ATTORNEY: I`ve discussed it. My daughter was horrified, by the way, this kid behaved. But I will say, Dr. Drew, I do -- and I said this the other day when we talked about it, I do think the parents have a role in this. I do think that things at home probably were maybe a little too strict. I think she is out of control and needs to be locked in her room.
But I think the parents maybe have to look at their parenting style, and sometimes, you have to adjust how you are with each kid. It`s just the way it is.
EIGLARSH: And Drew --
PINSKY: Mark.
EIGLARSH: Drew, let me say this. For all those parents who think that there`s no harm in giving a trophy to every single kid just because they show up, this is what you get. You get an entitled child who thinks they can sue their lawsuits.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Exhibit A, exhibit B is Justin Bieber we`ve been talking about for a couple of days. That is really -- that`s -- he`s, in fact, he`s exhibit a. He`s the king. He`s the king of this --
SCHACHER: I ship them together, Dr. Drew.
PINSKY: Thank you, Sam.
Next up, a woman claimed she was thrown from a moving car and then she shows this to the world on Twitter. Oh, my goodness. She`s here with her story.
I have a reminder for you, you can find us any time on Instagram @DrDrewHLN. There we are on Instagram. Be right back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: I am back with Jenny, Mark, Tiffanie, and Sam.
A 19-year-old girl claimed she was beaten and then thrown from a moving car by her boyfriend, so-called. She then took to Twitter and posted the graphic pictures of her injuries. As you can see, these are disturbing images, but they are precisely what this young girl was subjected to.
Mori Montgomery is her name, and she joins me now by phone exclusively. There she is with the neck brace feeling better. Mori, tell us what happened.
VOICE OF MORI MONTGOMERY, ALLEGEDLY ABUSED BY EX-BOYFRIEND: Well, we were on our way back home from a party, and we were all going to meet back up at my friend`s house, and on the way back home, he started questioning me about stuff like the whole day he was just acting weird and everything. So, I decided to ask what was going on.
And then, after that he questioned me about different guys and about cheating on him. And that`s when this got started becoming like a problem. He got really mad.
PINSKY: Mori, let me interrupt you. And I want to bring in Tiffanie real quick here. Tiffanie, so many of these attacks on women, these absolutely brutal attacks that I come in contact with are often initiated when the guy becomes jealous or becomes -- or at least thinking that there`s something going on. Is that what you see, too? Yes.
TIFFANIE DAVIS HENRY, PH.D., PSYCHOTHERAPIST: For sure. When they don`t feel like they`re in control. If they feel like they`re territory is being infringed upon. And Mori, I`m wondering if there were maybe some warning signs before this. I`m sure this isn`t the first sign of aggression that you saw from him that maybe before he`d been a little jealous or a little persnickety about who you were spending your time with, who you were talking to, who was on the phone with you, any of that kind of stuff?
MONTGOMERY Yes. Definitely.
PINSKY: Which again -- which is coercion and control, which is what domestic violence is really ultimately all about. Mark.
EIGLARSH: Yes. I think it`s wonderful that you came forward. My question is, have you gone to law enforcement, my guess is he`s not done with his behavior. I`m concerned about future victims.
MONTGOMERY: I have gone to the police and I pressed charges on him. He got arrested the day after I was in the hospital, and after that, he bailed out. He set bail and he`s free currently until his court date.
PINSKY: I saw he was on $100,000 bail. I saw the police report. And we actually reached out to Mori`s ex-boyfriend. His lawyer gave us this statement, quote, "it would be premature to comment as we haven`t even received discovery at this point." That was their comment.
EIGLARSH: That means there`s nothing good to say at this point.
SCHACHER: Yes.
(CROSSTALK)
EIGLARSH: They have nothing to say.
PINSKY: Tiffanie, what do you want to say?
EIGLARSH: I know.
(LAUGHTER)
HENRY: Well, Mark, Mori, I have two questions. One, do you have a restraining order against this young man? And then, certainly, I know that there was an incident where he says he accidentally slapped you previously? I`m wondering what he said to kind of smooth that over and make you think that that was something that wouldn`t happen again?
MONTGOMERY: Well, first he accidentally did -- like we were playing around, like we were literally just playing around and he slapped me in my face, and it was kind of hard. And, I was like, OK, that hurts and stuff. And he was just like "I`m sorry. I didn`t mean to get that angry and upset about it." And I was like, "OK." You know, I just didn`t think about it that much at the time. And I have not filed a restraining order yet, but I do plan on doing that soon.
PINSKY: Sam.
SCHACHER: Yes. Mori, bold courageous move to post those photos online. So, what was your motivation behind that?
MONTGOMERY: I really just wanted everyone to know -- everybody was concerned like my family and friends and that`s mainly who I posted it too, the people who follow me are my family and friends. And I wanted them to know that I was OK. And I want everyone to be aware of what happened to me and what he did to me.
PINSKY: Have you learned about domestic violence or been treated as a domestic violence survivor since this episode?
MONTGOMERY: Yes, I have, actually.
PINSKY: Is there anything you`d like to say to other women that may be caught in a coercive and controlling relationship?
MONTGOMERY: I just want, you know, girls to know that they don`t have to stay in a relationship with guys like that. A lot of girls are afraid to talk about it and afraid to like ask for advice and even, you know, speak about it in general. And, I just feel like, you know, it happened once for me. I just can`t even imagine dealing with it even more.
PINSKY: Right. And more -- as I`m sure you and many victims think it couldn`t happen to me and yet it does. And Tiffanie, you see this as I do, when these guys wear them down, they start believing they`re deserving of this treatment. They start having such shame that they`re afraid to come forward so it`s a cycle they get caught in.
HENRY: For sure. And Dr. Drew, I often relate it to that grooming behavior that a lot of criminals will do where they do a little bit, and then a little bit more and then a little bit more. And I think that first slapping incident and the jealousy and the aggressiveness that she saw in the beginning was kind of a precursor to what was to come.
And certainly, many of us will kind of excuse things away. But Mori, for you and any other woman out there that`s ever experienced something like this, even the slightest little hint of any kind of abuse, you got to take that seriously and go the other way. You are not worth that.
EIGLARSH: Absolutely.
HENRY: You are worth so much more.
PINSKY: And the abuse is not just physical. It can be, again, coercion and control as I keep saying. Jenny, your comment?
HUTT: Yes. So, since you haven`t gotten the restraining order yet, has he tried to make contact with you?
MONTGOMERY: Not at all, actually, except for today --
EIGLARSH: There would be a restraining order as part of the criminal case.
(CROSSTALK)
EIGLARSH: Yes.
PINSKY: OK. Listen, Mori, I just want to congratulate you for being so courageous and stepping forward. I hope it helps other women who have caught in situation like this. Again, most communities have resources. Say something -- if you see something, say something. And that is pertinent to people that are caught in relationships like this, just start reaching out. Help is available. Thank you, panel.
Next up, women are outraged over this photoshop fail. A model`s body being cut and cropped by someone who figures she`s not thin enough, not perfect enough. We`ll discuss this after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It puts young girls in a very vulnerable position.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They have the rest of their life to worry about whose butt is bigger or whatever.
PINSKY: I`m worried about the pornification of young people.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It puts more pressure on girls.
HUTT: Furthermore, it`s false advertising.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny, Sam, Lynn, and Mike Catherwood. Mike, of course, is my radio and television -- he`s radio co-host with me on "Loveline." He`s a TV host. You can catch "Loveline" at podcastone.com. You can get a podcast if you don`t have it locally in your radio district.
Now, take a look at this photo from Target.com. It is supposed to be selling bathing suits to juniors. It`s a junior`s swimsuit. Now, take a closer look at how this photo`s been altered. The model`s arms, waist, and thighs have all been photo shopped. She wasn`t thin enough. There wasn`t enough gaps.
Jenny, I mean, even a teenager has to be photoshopped to be somehow -- let me show you a tweet, response to this a little bit. It`s from -- oh, my goodness, I can`t read her Twitter ad (ph), but it says, "I think people need to stop putting weight and body shapes into categories of a real woman and not a real woman." The point being, there`s nothing real about this teenager who`s being altered by this ad!
BERRY: Yes.
HUTT: Well, that`s what`s so great about it in a way, Dr. Drew, because it`s really laughable. I mean, she`s anatomically incorrect. She looks like a Barbie but a wrong Barbie. The whole thing is bizarre. Look at that body. It`s off. And to your question about the kids in this, listen, my daughter and I talked about it and laughed about it.
And my daughter, though, she would like to be someone with thigh gap because every kid today wants it or every girl. She knows we`re not meant to have thigh gap as our built. So, that`s that.
PINSKY: Sam, help me explain what thigh gap is. I`m not let Mike touch that.
SCHACHER: Thigh Gap is exactly what you see in that picture, Dr. Drew. And here`s the thing what`s scary and it`s disturbing and disgusting as this is. Thigh gap is the new black in the sense of fashion and trends. Just go on social media, and you`ll find a ton of Tumblr accounts and Facebook accounts dedicated to how to get a thigh gap, who has the best thigh gap. It`s so disturbing.
PINSKY: Really?
SCHACHER: Yes! What these young girls don`t understand is that these thigh gaps are photoshopped and manipulated to look like that. And so, they have this unhealthy, unattainable, unrealistic image to live up to. It`s so damaging.
PINSKY: Yes.
MIKE CATHERWOOD, CO-HOST, "LOVELINE": It is sad. And Dr. Drew, I changed my whole perspective on this ad because, originally, we were talking about how I thought that they created that thigh gap image there by cutting her out. Maybe trying to protect a young girl model from having her vulva displayed. And I was serious. But I didn`t know that thigh gap was something that young girls are actually trying to achieve. I didn`t know that.
SCHACHER: Yes!
HUTT: Yes.
PINSKY: But to your point, I mean, when you were on "Dancing with the Stars," they made a lot of efforts to make sure these areas are protected, right?
CATHERWOOD: Yes. No, it`s not a joke. We have often joked about how they needed to use something smaller than an eye patch to cover up my entire genital area.
(LAUGHTER)
CATHERWOOD: But, the truth is is that any type of like outline on genital areas, nipples and stuff is not allowed for most family shows. But I also want to point out, I thought Target was a bigger name than they are. To afford such bootleg photoshopping, like is this the worst photoshopping that we`ve ever seen?
PINSKY: Lynn, I`ll have you respond in just a second. But Target has removed the photo and issued a state, quote, "This was an unfortunate error on our part and we apologize. We have removed the image from our website. Lynn, your response to Mike`s erudition (ph).
BERRY: What I think probably happened that somebody in the graphics department got fired. They probably e-mailed the wrong jpeg. Nobody -- they`re probably getting thousands of images and it ended up on their website and it was an error. Nobody -- that was just a bad -- it was probably the wrong image that they were supposed to send.
But the other part of this conversation that I don`t think we`re having is it affects the person who is photoshopped as much as it affects the young girls that are looking at the person that`s photoshopped.
SCHACHER: Good point.
BERRY: These models, themselves, can`t even live up to their own image. And it`s funny we`ve done a segment before. And I was photoshopped and they showed me the image. And I started crying. And it`s because you see yourself before and after.
HUTT: Aw.
SCHACHER: Yes.
BERRY: I know. Thanks for -- but I mean, you know, you see yourself and you`re not the after. And you feel crummy about it.
HUTT: Really?
(CROSSTALK)
BERRY: I`m a really confident person. And you know, you think, oh, I wish I didn`t have bags under my eyes. You know, I wish my waist was 19 inches. And it really does as much damage, I think, to the person who is being photoshopped than it does the women looking at it.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Really, I feel the emotion coming out of you. It was shaming and what, what was the feeling you got? Like, it`s OK not to be perfect. I mean, somehow this is an attack on how you look?
BERRY: No, I don`t think it was shaming and I don`t know if it was an attack on how I look. I think it just sort of felt like, man, I wish I looked like that after picture. And you know, I work hard to try and keep in shape and to be the best that I can be, but you always feel like there`s more that you can do and then you look at an image like that, it`s probably not healthy. I`m just being honest.
PINSKY: I`m going to tell you what, it`s not just that you always feel you`re better than you can do, and Mike, I`m excluding you and your body images issues. But it`s women do this to each other --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: -- especially women take this on her way that is destructive and the women need to be aware of it. They need to be aware of -- that one tweet said what`s real and what`s not real. Let`s talk about what is real and what men like and what is --
(CROSSTALK)
CATHERWOOD: That`s a very good point, Drew.
PINSKY: Lynn first.
BERRY: It`s also what men say. You hear guys joking at bars and they`re talking about a girl that they went on a date with, yes, but you should have seen the back on her. And you know, I`d never go out with her again. And they make these jokes. And you know that they notice it and so it gets into your head.
PINSKY: But Lynn, Lynn -- Mike, back me up on this. The research shows and Mike you`ll back me up that men prefer women with curves. That`s absolutely been proven over and over again. They`re not attracted to pictures like we see here in Target.
(CROSSTALK)
BERRY: Messages are being sent to women in multiple ways that are unhealthy.
PINSKY: Of course.
BERRY: And that`s a lot of the reason that it affects us.
CATHERWOOD: Lynn, I certainly agree with you that many a negative message is being sent to women, especially young women, about how they should look, but I do think that it`s mostly perpetuated by other women. If you even just analyze how different comments are made on Instagram pictures or YouTube clips, you very often find guys are going to -- and this is -- it`s not right.
I`m not making any excuses. Whether you judge someone physically it`s wrong. But, you`ll see the comments guys make when certain people put up Instagram pictures. And it`s always she`s too skinny. She needs more ass. She needs -- and guys want more.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: We want more too, but we`re going to take a quick break. Be right back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Back with Jenny, Sam, Mike, and Lynn. And we`re discussing this ad on Target.com. It had been photoshopped so this teenaged model has a thigh gap and thinner arms and ridiculous, ridiculous changes in her body that even Stephen Colbert poked fun at on comedy central. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEPHEN COLBERT, COMEDY CENTRAL: Yes. Young girls are obsessed with having a thigh gap. I blame the impossible body standard set by Sponge Bob.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: And frankly, again, Mike, I`m going to ask you to back me up. It`s about as attractive as it is on Sponge Bob. Would you agree?
CATHERWOOD: It is. Just that girl`s physique alone being that she`s so young and thin, it`s so aversive to look at for most guys. And then to kind of exaggerate it even more with thigh gap and lengthening her arms, it really goes again what most men -- and I don`t want to speak for all men, but it goes against what most men --
PINSKY: What`s the matter, Sam? What`s the matter, Sam? He`s right.
SCHACHER: This is my problem, though, Dr. Drew. We`re hearing girls say that women aren`t too -- aren`t thin enough. We`re hearing guys saying that they`re not full enough. I`m sick of body image shaming in general. Why can`t women come in all different shapes and sizes? Why can`t we celebrate that?
Why can`t that be the precedent that we pass down to our youth? I think that photoshopping to this extreme should be banned. I`m sick of people saying that you`re either too fat to this extreme, that`s what I said. And I`m sick of hearing people say that you`re either too fat, you`re too skinny. Why can`t we all be beautiful the way we are?
CATHERWOOD: You`re right, Sam. You`re right. And my penis is never discriminated. I take women of all sizes, colors, races, and (INAUDIBLE). And I think that -- you know, the movement for how women should look and should behave and the images for all women of the standards should start with my penis.
(CROSSTALK)
BERRY: Is Mike trying to get a date?
SCHACHER: He`s married to a gorgeous woman.
PINSKY: I`m reading the bubble over his head where she goes, "Are you married and who are you married to?"
CATHERWOOD: I`m married to a beautiful woman.
BERRY: My thought bubble is Mike trying to get laid.
CATHERWOOD: Well, maybe. But --
PINSKY: No, no. Jenny, go ahead.
HUTT: Lynn, can I go back to Lynn and the whole photoshopping thing and how you were upset by what they photoshopped on you. I like photoshopping when it`s done the right way. I don`t want the wrinkles on my eyes in a still picture, the same reason why I wear makeup or get my hair done or there`s lighting.
(CROSSTALK)
BERRY: When they photoshopped my head shot, I didn`t stop them. I agree with you on that.
(LAUGHTER)
BERRY: I didn`t say, hey, can you put the wrinkles back on my face.
PINSKY: Lots of great tweets. Let me pull one up here for you from Angie B. Lots of Twitter action on this, Lynn. "As a fit woman, it tells me that Target doesn`t know its customers. Athletic non-gappers shop there, too."
CATHERWOOD: I just have to point this out. Girls, I totally understand where you`re coming from. I think it`s horrible the unrealistic standards they set for young ladies. But I have to say, I have thigh gap because there`s nothing in there filling it in. I`m so deficient in my genital region.
PINSKY: Again --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Something else my producers to get out of this little piece here. Now, commenters online, I was going to pull up these tweets for you, are more angry with the tweets -- I`m so lame -- about the bad photoshopping work than the actual teenaged girl`s body image being altered, which is kind of interesting.
So, again, I`m concerned about the fact that we are sending these messages to our young women and that`s the big concern here.
Thank you, everybody. "Right This Minute" starts right this minute.
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