Return to Transcripts main page

New Day

Underwater Vehicle Joins Search for Flight 370; Crisis In Ukraine; Boston Marathon Bombings One Year Later

Aired April 15, 2014 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back to NEW DAY.

The deep sea search for Flight 370 is ramping up once again today with the Bluefin-21, an underwater drone readying for its second mission. This comes after Monday's search was aborted after the vehicle completed less than a third of its intended search.

Joining me to discuss at the map, David Gallo, co-leader for the search for Air France 447 and director of special projects at the Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution.

Good morning once again. So let's talk about what happened yesterday and what we can learn from that.

Let's put up the animation which will show how the Bluefin-21 was deployed. The whole point is, we're now learning, you know and I'm learning, is they wanted it to be about 30 meters off the ocean floor. Then they had to abort because it went to a depth further than -- past its max depth.

Did this surprise you?

DAVID GALLO, WOODS HOLE OCEANOGRAPHIC INSTITUTION: Well, that kind of thing happens. You try to be aware of that if you've got an accurate base map to begin with.

BOLDUAN: Which is our first problem, we don't have an accurate base map, right?

GALLO: If they've got one, we haven't seen it. When the floor takes the dive, so does the vehicle and the vehicle goes, oh, no, I'm not supposed to be here and punch it out.

BOLDUAN: What did you learn from yesterday's search, the aborted search. It was only down there -- the whole trip was 7 1/2 hours. It was supposed to be 24. What did you learn from that? How do you adjust today?

GALLO: Well, their tactics are going to be important, having looked at where else in that area they can look. I guess they're moving to an area that they're more confident. It's totally above their operating depth. So, they'll move and see what happens today.

BOLDUAN: Let's take a look at some of the topography that the Bluefin-21 could be coming up against. I want to get your take on really what this means for the search.

First is the issue of landslides. This was actually surprising to me. I didn't know landslides could occur in the mountain floor.

GALLO: Some of the mountains and scarps and cliffs on the planet are beneath the sea. So, if you're in that kind of area, and there's a plateau just south of this area, that has, what probably has that kind of thing which is near to where they're working.

BOLDUAN: Is there a way to anticipate that?

GALLO: Again, you start with a good base map and some preliminary work and you work from there. You plan layer on layer getting progressively more detail over time.

BOLDUAN: And then, so let's move to the next kind of topography and I want to talk about its challenges. The issue of trenches or canyons under water --

GALLO: Sure.

BOLDUAN: That seems like that could be a real challenge for the Bluefin-21.

GALLO: Sure.

BOLDUAN: What would it do?

GALLO: Well, if the vehicle is tracking along watching ahead for obstacles and in the meantime, walls are closing in on it, it doesn't know those walls out there by the time it realizes it and tries to come up and rise up, it may be too late. So, you can collide with a steep scarp.

BOLDUAN: How do you plan for that? You don't want that to happen to such an important piece of machinery.

GALLO: The machine you say to the robot, if you come in counter with a steep wall, climb quickly because sometimes they're programmed to climb very gently, but we'll get out of there.

But, again, it's going to start with a very good base map and plan about how to attack that area.

BOLDUAN: That just comes from pure analysis of what they have.

GALLO: And experience of the team, people analyzing it, that have worked here in this kind of terrain before will know how to do those things.

BOLDUAN: So, let's move on to the last -- the third kind of option of topography and what they could be coming up against on the ocean floor. The issue is more of like a rolling hill or a rolling bottom.

GALLO: Sure.

BOLDUAN: This is what Angus Houston has said at one point, he believes is the most likely topography at this area in the ocean floor. What do you think?

GALLO: Well, again, it depends on this map. If he's got a map that's not incredibly detailed and done from the surface by a ship, it might look all rolling. But I can tell you, from experience being down there in the terrain, it can have gullies and it can have mounds and pinnacles and all sorts of things that can be trouble for a robot.

BOLDUAN: David, what is it about being 30 meters off of the ocean floor that is -- makes it maybe the best spot to be? Why is that the spot?

GALLO: Anyone who has tried to put a couple of photos to the wants them to be about the same size. If you come off the floor, higher up than the floor, the beam gets wider to either side. If you come closer to the floor, it narrows in.

So, you want to stay 30 meters so when you put the strips together of the sea floor they all match. It's easier to do. It's more consistent.

BOLDUAN: It's like taking -- trying to take one of those panoramic photos with your iPhone.

GALLO: You know, you zoom in or zoom out you've got a problem at the end. That's exactly right. The same thing.

BOLDUAN: Much more high tech panoramic photo. Good thing I'm not doing it, if you've ever seen one of my attempts at it.

David, thanks so much.

GALLO: Thanks, Kate.

BOLDUAN: We'll have you back to continue this conversation a little later in the show.

Michaela?

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Let's take a look at more of your headlines now. Kate, thanks so much.

Ukraine's interim president says an anti-terrorist operation is under way as pro-Russian groups continue to occupy government buildings in the east. The U.S. accuses Moscow of smacking those separatist groups. Russian President Vladimir Putin denied the claim in a Monday phone call with President Obama.

A major shake-up at General Motors. Two top executives leaving the company in the wake of a massive recall of nearly 2.6 million cars. Selim Bingol and Melissa Howell were both senior vice presidents. The company spokesman says their departures are not related to the recall of several models with defective ignition switches linked to 13 deaths. GM for its part has not said whether they resigned or whether they were dismissed.

And today, a federal judge in Cincinnati might stay the rule that Ohio recognize same-sex marriages performed in other states. He asked lawyers on both sides to file their arguments by this afternoon. If he does stay the ruling only the four gay couples who sued the state would have their unions recognized as the case is appealed. Ohio voters ban same-sex marriage some ten years ago.

Those are your headlines at this hour -- guys.

CUOMO: All right. Thanks, Mick.

Let's take a break here on NEW DAY. When we come back, Ukraine is on the brink. Protests on the inside, pressure from the outside. What comes next?

We have a military analyst here who is going to be on the giant map to show us the hot spots.

Plus, you're about to meet a woman I promise you will never forget. Grandma Lillian, she is the very meaning of "Boston Strong". We check in with her a year after the bombings. What she has to say about the granddaughter she lost and what comes next will certainly inspire you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: Welcome to NEW DAY.

Tensions are boiling over in Ukraine. This morning, Western leaders including President Obama are urging Russia to help bring the crisis to an end. All the while, looks like they're doing exactly the opposite. Russia, that is.

Now, joining me at the map is retired Army Major General James "Spider" Marks, CNN military analyst.

Spider, always a pleasure.

ARMY MAJ. GEN. JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Good morning.

CUOMO: Let's deal with one external point here before we get into the specifics and show you showing us the hot areas. I don't even think it's conjecture that Russia is behind what's going on inside Ukraine. The question is, why isn't anybody exposed the canard?

Russia has this unmarked men who are clearly under their control by all the reports on the ground. They're fomenting tensions. They're creating civil strife. They're then calling on the West and the U.S. to fix it.

And why isn't the West and the U.S. calling them out on it and saying this is all about you, why is this being so subtle? MARKS: I don't understand it. This is clearly instigated. This is not organic.

What's taking place in Ukraine is not organic. This is not Ukrainians that are pro Russia rising up saying this is an injustice that we're a part of this democratic society called Ukraine.

This is instigated by Russia. That is a very fair assumption. All of our activities moving forward should be based off that assumption. We haven't done anything to invalidate it.

CUOMO: My sources say the U.S. and the west have to play the game because they don't have an answer yet. So, let's go through the detail of the situation.

MARKS: Let's talk about the possible answers could be.

CUOMO: Right. Now, a great example, almost a metaphor of the agitation going on here is -- let's put the animation of the ship. So, you have the USS ship out there and this Russian fighter jet doesn't buzz -- because that's a technical term that it would be going over the actual ship -- but it's 1,000 feet off who the port side and it keeps looping around this ship taunting it. What's that about?

MARKS: It's all about trying to figure out what the United States rules of engagement look like for this ship in the Black Sea.

This is very, very precise. This is instigated. This was not serendipitous on the part of the pilot. He's trying to figure out what the collection capabilities are on that ship.

CUOMO: Collection capabilities, meaning what?

MARKS: In terms of intelligence, what type of radar return, how are they being -- how is this being painted? So, the Russians are trying to decide on the tactical point what are the rules of engagement? But more importantly, will the United States now exit through Bosphorus and get out of the Black Sea because of this event? The answer is, no, however, Putin is pushing both at the tactical level to gather intelligence and at the strategic level to see what the gumption is.

CUOMO: Where is -- talk about gumption. Where's the confidence coming? It's one thing to push around politicians but he knows he can't push around the U.S. military.

MARKS: Absolutely cannot, absolutely cannot.

CUOMO: All right. So, where are the hot spots and what do they mean to you?

MARKS: Yes, Chris, what's happening is we've got Russian forces that are training here, about 40,000 of them, right across the border.

Now, what's interesting about this, in 2003 and 2002, what did the United States do in Kuwait before they invaded Iraq?

CUOMO: Trained over by the corridor.

MARKS: They did right there. They gave up strategic surprise. We were there. We said we're coming.

This is what's happening right now. There are also some forces, special forces, a new location, has been identified here. We think those are the folks are involved in activities that are taking place here right now in terms of some of the government buildings that have already been taken over by these forces on the ground, these masked men that aren't marked. This is kind of the disposition, if you will, of activity right now.

CUOMO: So you didn't have to be a tactical genius to know what they're doing is they're coming in major points of entry and they're fomenting the biggest ethnic regions inside.

MARKS: Absolutely. Chris, if you'll recall, since Crimea has now been annexed, what Russia has been doing forever since the Black Sea fleet is located down here, is they have a line of communications that runs from this location all of the way down to Crimea. That's been used for years to re-enforce, to bring supplies, to bring personnel, to bring kit down to the Black Sea fleet. So they can drive these vehicles and under the radar pop all these guys out as they are ostensibly en route Sevastopol.

CUOMO: So this basically looks like a big risk board, right? We all know that when you're playing that game and you get me on three sides I have a problems --

MARKS: You do.

CUOMO: So the question is, going forward, can the U.S. do anything until it really shows that the U.S. in the west is going to help these people in here fight back? Don't they have to show that they're going to do that to make any difference to the Russians?

MARKS: Absolutely. But what the United States still has is freedom of action along all the elements of power. Primarily we're looking at some of these sanctions. Those really have to be tightened up. But what has to happen immediately, there needs to be a plus-up of naval forces, NATO forces available.

CUOMO: NATO.

MARKS: NATO forces led by the United States available to react and respond, increase in terms of air capabilities that can be pre- positioned under normal exercise Article V type activities in support of NATO activities. Then ground forces have to be plussed up. The United States, as you recall has really downsized in Europe. We have participating 28 nations within NATO that really need to move up and start taking their military ground forces out of garrison and start to train.

CUOMO: Ukraine not a NATO protected under the treaty, but they certainly could extend it to this type of civil strife. It's going to be interesting to see what happens. The ruble is dropping. People are divesting from Russia, but it hasn't changed their disposition in terms of economic hardship.

MARKS: Not at all. Nothing has poked this to move it off its intended path right now.

CUOMO: Spider, thank you for laying it down for us. Appreciate it very much -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Coming up next on NEW DAY, one year ago today, twin bombings at the Boston marathon killed three people and wounded hundreds more. In the aftermath, we heard from a heartbroken woman who had lost her granddaughter. A year later, she's now sharing an inspiring message of peace and love.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CUOMO: It was one year ago today, two homemade bombs ripped through the finish line of the Boston marathon killing three and injuring nearly 300 others. One who was taken, 29-year-old Krystle Campbell, just days after her death, we sat down with Krystle's grandmother, Lillian who told us of this angel in her life. Monday on the eve of this somber anniversary we sat down with her again. Here is Grandma Lillian.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: The 2013 Boston marathon champion --

CUOMO (voice-over): April 15th, 2013, started as a perfect day for one of the Boston's most loved traditions, Marathon Monday. Spectators lining the streets, cheering on more than 23,000 runners. But four hours, 9 minutes into the race -- back-to-back explosions tearing through Copley Square, causing chaos and panic.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Something just blew up.

CUOMO (on camera): The attacks on the people here have been felt in Boston, in this state, around the country, and the world.

(voice-over): The disbelief of what had happened turning to grim reality as the identities of those lost in the attack were revealed.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: We found out the name of a second victim who died in the terrorist attack here, Krystle Campbell of Medford, Massachusetts. She was just 29 years old.

CUOMO: But Krystle Campbell was so much more than a name to everyone who loved her.

LILLIAN CAMPBELL, KRYSTLE CAMPBELL'S GRANDMOTHER: There she is now. She's a beautiful girl. How could you not love her?

CUOMO: A love you could clearly see in the face of her Grandmother Lillian whom we met just days after the bombing.

(on camera): How do you make sense of this? CAMPBELL: I don't. I don't make any sense of it at all. I can't believe it happened. I can't believe it. I won't even accept it now and I'm sitting here with you. I'm having a hard time when I see her on the TV. It's killing me inside.

CUOMO (voice-over): Now almost a year to the day later, we met with Lillian again, same house, same couch.

CAMPBELL: Yes, there was the last Christmas we all had together.

CUOMO: The passing year has done little to temper the loss.

(on camera): How often do you think of her?

CAMPBELL: All the time, every day.

CUOMO: Now as the nana you're not supposed to have favorites, right? You're supposed to love them all equally.

CAMPBELL: Yes. But you don't.

CUOMO: You don't?

CAMPBELL: It was hard to do that.

CUOMO: There was something special about Krystle?

CAMPBELL: Yes. From the day she arrived here because she -- she was born upstairs.

COUMO: In this house?

CAMPBELL: On the third floor.

CUOMO: And you always had a special bond?

CAMPBELL: Yes, definitely.

CUOMO: She used to make everything OK.

CAMPBELL: Yes. She did. She had that special -- I don't know what it is, that special thing about her. You know? And you felt happy around her because she was always laughing and bubbly. I loved her.

CUOMO (voice-over): Some moments stand out. The tearful statement given by Krystle's mother.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This doesn't make any sense. She was the best.

CUOMO: Krystle's wake attended by thousands and the gazebo named for her by the restaurant where she used to work.

(on camera): How do you keep her memory alive? How do you keep her with you?

CAMPBELL: I got her out at dining room on my buffet there, all her pictures are on there.

CUOMO: So you can go there and look and remember?

CAMPBELL: Every day I come through the room. I see her.

CUOMO (voice-over): Wanting revenge against the bombers would be understandable, but not for Grandma Lillian.

CAMPBELL: When they came out with this part about the death sentence and I said, well, I really don't care what they do with them because whatever they do, it's not going to bring her back. And it's not going to make it any easier, so I wouldn't wish anybody dead, anybody has a right to live. I like everybody to have a good life and be happy if they can.

CUOMO: Even after what he did.

CAMPBELL: Even after what he did.

CUOMO (voice-over): For Lillian, remembering her granddaughter means remembering the advice she would have given her.

CAMPBELL: Krystle wouldn't want me to shed no tears or nothing. She was that type, don't -- don't do it, Nana, she would say. Come on. Get up. We got to get going.

CUOMO (on camera): Do you ever go visit Krystle where you guys buried her?

CAMPBELL: No, I haven't.

CUOMO: In your heart, is that where Krystle is, where she's buried --

CAMPBELL: No, she's upstairs. She's looking down. In fact, Chris, one day we were here in the summer before God called, a big rainbow came out right over my house and my back porch, I said, that's Krystle looking down at us. And I honestly believe that. Every time the rainbow came, that's Krystle looking over us. I believe that.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO: Grandma Lillian says it, I believe it, too. And there are so many families who are hurting. When one is taken, so many feel the loss. But the idea of how you move on and how you recognize it was loss so you can recognize the intensity of it, I just think Lillian does such a beautiful job of displaying both the pain but also the perseverance.

BOLDUAN: I'm sure you were when you were sitting there with her, aren't you just blown away with how she may look frail in stature but she's so strong. She has no bitterness, no real anger towards the people who did this.

PEREIRA: It would be understandable, too, right. When you lose somebody you want retribution, you want justice. You want somebody to pay. She doesn't feel that way. It's really powerful. Really powerful.

BOLDUAN: More powerful than the anger would be.

CUOMO: Yes. I think that she kind of taps into something that's very real up there in Boston right now. They want the two people responsible for this to be irrelevant, to disappear.

PEREIRA: Yes.

CUOMO: I don't think she cares so much what the sentence is. But she just wants it to be done in a way so that nobody gives any tension to it. They should not exist. All that should exist are the memories whose lives who were taken. It was so great to see her again.

BOLDUAN: She looks great.

CUOMO: She's doing well, but she feels a lot of pain. This kid, this 29-year-old, she went and lived with her grandmother when her grandmother got sick. She went and visited her all the time. She went above and beyond. She was a special person to a lot of people. As Lillian says, the world doesn't know what was lost when Krystle was taken.

BOLDUAN: Reminder when the tragedy like this happens, at some point life moves on, but it changes these families forever. It's important to remember them.

PEREIRA: Thanks for introducing us to Grandma Lilian.

CUOMO: It was a pleasure going up there to see her. Great lady.

All right, we have new developments for you in the search for Flight 370. We are also watching the tension in Ukraine closely so let's go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just six hours into its mission the Bluefin-21 surfaced.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It went from 4500 meters, aborted the mission.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Violent protests continue to sweep Eastern Ukraine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are cost for this kind of behavior.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oscar Pistorius continuing to proclaim his innocence on the final day of the prosecution's cross-examination.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Today what we're going to see is a tribute of the city coming together to pay their respects.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Good morning. Welcome back to NEW DAY. It is Tuesday, April 15, tax day. We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. And the search crews for Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 will try again to go deep today. They're hoping to re- launch the Bluefin-21 under water drone into the Indian Ocean.

Now yesterday the search had to be cut short after the sub went too deep beyond its capabilities. New questions are also being focused today on the co-pilot, a U.S. official says his cell phone was on as the plane vanished.

Erin McLaughlin is following the new developments live from Perth, Australia -- Erin.

ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Chris. We're hearing new details about the Bluefin.