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Dr. Drew
KKK Suspect & Sex With Black Male Prostitute
Aired April 24, 2014 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST (voice-over): Tonight, just in. The Ku Klux Klan leader charged with killing three people, a white supremacist who hated gays, did he have sex with an African-American prostitute who was dressed as a woman? Behavior bureau can`t wait to sound off on this.
Plus, this video gives new mean to raw. A naked man goes nuts on California`s pacific coast highway.
Let`s get started.
(MUSIC)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Good evening, everybody.
My co-host, of course, in the studio with me is Samantha Schacher.
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, CO-HOST: Yes. And, Dr. Drew, coming up, we have a video that`s gone viral of a guy naked, pops through his sunroof --
PINSKY: We`re looking at it now.
SCHACHER: That`s a Tesla. There he is dancing naked. We have the video --
PINSKY: On Pacific Coast Highway.
SCHACHER: On the PCH, here in Los Angeles.
We also have the guy who shot the video. We have here on the show. We`re going to talk to him. I can`t wait to hear your thoughts.
PINSKY: Well, you will hear my thoughts. I have a couple theories about this guy. Explain that kind of behavior like so many behaviors, like so many behaviors, I`m just saying.
Before we get to that, we have new information about the white supremacist accused of killing three people in a shooting rampage. Remember this guy? He was wanting to kill Jewish people but ended up killing people near a Jewish institution.
Tonight, some shocking past has been revealed about this guy. Back in the `80s Frazier Glenn Cross apparently got busted by cops, Sam. Guess what? Guess what?
SCHACHER: It`s bad.
PINSKY: Well, it depends what you`re into, for this guy it`s a little interesting. Found him in the back seat of a car with an African-American prostitute who is dressed as a woman. I`m just saying. Same man who spent his life preaching hate against Jews, African-Americans and homosexuals.
Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DISPATCHER, OVERLAND PARK POLICE: Subject shot a female in the parking lot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s a guy with a rifle here shooting at people.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lone gunman opens fire at two different Jewish facilities. Police arrest Frazier Glenn Cross, as he`s being taken away, he shouts a neo-Nazi slogan.
FRAZIER GLENN CROSS: Heil Hitler!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, the 73-year-old suspect has been described as a raging anti-Semite.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Miller is the former grand dragon of the Carolina Knights of the Ku Klux Klan which he started and ran in the 1980s.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He was a lifelong white supremacist, wanted to kill Jews.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, white man.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Frazier Glenn Miller urges white people to unite and, quote, "take our country back".
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you lived in the area in the `80s, you might remember Miller ran for North Carolina governor.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it`s a good idea that I provoke people. I do that deliberately.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Joining us to discuss, Segun Oduolowu, social commentator, Anahita Sedaghatfar, defense attorney, Scottie Hughes, columnist, news director of tpnn.com, the Tea Party News Network.
Now, Cross says he lured this prostitute into the back seat of the car, Segun, so he could beat him.
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: Well, Dr. Drew --
SCHACHER: That`s much better.
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR, ATTORNEY: And > they ended up having sex, right?
PINSKY: Accidentally.
ODUOLOWU: This is like the pot calling the kettle black. What surprises me so many white supremacists follow the teachings of German writers but overlook Herman Hess, the Nobel laureate, who wrote that when you hate someone, you hate that thing in them that`s part of you.
SCHACHER: Yes.
ODUOLOWU: If it doesn`t disturb you, if it wasn`t a part of you, it wouldn`t disturb you. A black prostitute, homophobia. It feels like he protests way too much.
PINSKY: He protests too much. Scottie, do you agree with that?
SCOTTIE HUGHES, NEW DIRECTOR, TPNN.COM: I completely agree. In this situation, I don`t want to make light, this is very much a tragic situation. It`s like he went from black panties, traded them in for a white hoodie. I hope for the rest of his life, all he sees is stripes and orange. This is absolutely horrendous.
SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: Joining us by phone, I`ve got the former federal prosecutor Doug McCullough. He actually prosecuted Cross on several charges. He`s also seen the police report involving this prostitute incident.
Doug, I know it was a long time ago. But what can you tell us about cross being caught with this prostitute?
DOUG MCCULLOUGH, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR (via telephone): Well, a Raleigh police officer saw the vehicle in a high crime neighborhood, black neighborhood predominantly, and it was moving very slowly and suspiciously. So, he approached the vehicle, curious as to what they were doing and when he saw who the driver was, Glenn Miller at that time was well known to the police. He headed the White Patriot Party. He had rallies. The police had had to separate citizens from, you know, having acts of violence there.
He was wondering if, I think, if Miller was in the black neighborhood to commit a violent act against people that he raged against.
PINSKY: So now, do you think there`s anything to his excuse that he lured the prostitute to beat him, or was he going to use his services? What do you think?
MCCULLOUGH: You`re asking my personal opinion. The circumstances don`t leave much to the imagination.
PINSKY: There you go. I think I agree.
Anahita, come on now, you agree with the panel, do you not?
SEDAGHATFAR: Yes, I actually do, Dr. Drew. The thing I don`t agree with is this is shocking because it`s not. We all that know racism and hate doesn`t stem from rational logical thinking. And like Segun said, oftentimes these racists extends from self-hate, something they loathe and hate about themselves.
So, I don`t think this is shocking. We`ve seen this before with politicians. How many times have we seen politicians coming out and saying they`re anti-gay rights, they don`t want homosexuals to have these rights, and later on find they, themselves, are homosexuals?
SCHACHER: Amen, Anahita.
SEDAGHATFAR: This is almost predictable.
PINSKY: Scottie, is that a fair assessment?
HUGHES: You know, it`s somewhat fair. To be honest, the extremists are on both sides like you have the Democrats who come out saying they`re pro-family values. Then they`re bashing Republicans, like Harry Reid, calling domestic terrorists last week and they`re expecting respect. It goes both sides, extremists on both sides.
It`s more like he`s got his own hidden issues as well.
PINSKY: Segun?
ODUOLOWU: Well, it just seems that what we`re losing here is the rational thought. I mean, a man is cruising in a crime neighborhood, picks up a male stripper -- I`m sorry, a male prostitute, had sex with him in the back of the car, professes to hate homosexuals.
PINSKY: Allegedly had sex with him.
SCHACHER: And let`s not forget -- he had a relationship for years with an Asian woman. This is the same guy that sent documents to his followers saying, "I will award you points for killing or hurting gays or Asians or Jews", yet he had a relationship with an Asian woman for years.
PINSKY: Hang on a second, Segun, you guys, hold on. He was in court today in a wheelchair. His bail has been set at $10 million. He`s charged now with killing three people at a Jewish community center.
SCHACHER: Vile.
PINSKY: Yes.
Hopefully justice will prevail. Segun, last thought then I`ve got to go.
ODUOLOWU: Yes, Dr. Drew, remember, now, he was also a government informant on white supremacists. This man is a snitch, no way credible in anything he does.
PINSKY: It`s complicated.
All right. Next, you`ll hear from this man, after the break. Warning you: we`re going to play some tape of what he has to say and it`s pretty disgusting, so bear with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This was a guy who was on Howard Stern a couple years ago saying Hitler was the greatest man ever on the planet. This is a guy how had grenades in his home.
SEDAGHATFAR: This is absolute pure evil. This was premeditated murder.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He went out, he asked these people if they were Jewish and they still responded that they weren`t and he still killed them. So, I`m wondering is there even more to the story we don`t know?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Back here with Sam in the studio.
We`re talking about the KKK murder suspect who was busted for allegedly maybe having sex with, in the back seat of a car with an African- American male hooker dressed like a female.
And we`re laughing because it`s so bizarre, Sam, that this --
SCHACHER: Completely bizarre. You would think this one guy that supposedly hates gays, hates blacks, is in the back seat of a car having sex allegedly with a black gay prostitute.
PINSKY: A great tweet came in, it`s from (INAUDIBLE) please have Ms. Ali on the subject.
SCHACHER: I`d love to hear what she has to say.
PINSKY: It`s hard to predict.
Segun brought up the issue whether or not he protests too much, as you guys were all saying that this was this construct of defensive projection, that he was somehow feeling like attracted to these people and that was abhorrent to him.
SCHACHER: Self-hatred he`s projecting on to others.
PINSKY: Yes, it`s usually much more complicated. I`m sorry to tell you.
So, let`s bring in the behavior bureau. I`ve got Judy Ho, clinical psychologist, also professor at Pepperdine University. Erica America, psychotherapist, Z100 Radio personality. Danine Manette, criminal investigator, author of "Ultimate Betrayal."
So, Judy, you know, it`s very fad, it`s very just so to say he has these urges that he rages against and turns them outwardly. That seems too fad (ph) to me.
JUDY HO, PSYCHOLOGIST: That`s right. There so many factors, as you just mentioned. And I think one of the things that we`re failing to see is that he clearly has anti-social tendencies.
PINSKY: Yes.
HO: Well, people who are anti-social are often hypocrites as well. Those two things go hand in hand. The type of black and white judgment where they believe they`re above the law and above the judgments of other people.
So, to me, this is not a surprise. This seems shocking. But I was kind of expecting something along the lines of this.
PINSKY: Judy brings up the anti-social again. Let`s talk about my brain.
SCHACHER: Brain fact.
PINSKY: My brain on the table right near the camera. Yes, it`s these areas up in here where empathy, late evolving future of the human being. We`re not necessarily born with empathy. As we have relationships with other people and start to begin to understand that their minds have contents and that they have feelings like ourselves, that we start to build an ability to resonate with them and understand them.
Sociopaths don`t do that so much. They have their own agenda and people are just objects for their use. That`s what Judy alluded to.
Erica, you agree?
ERICA AMERICA, Z100 RADIO PERSONALITY: Yes, no, absolutely. But I have to say, I agree with (AUDIO GAP). He said my favorite quote from Herman Hess, we hate the most something within ourselves. He had such self-hatred for homosexual tendencies or liking people of different races, that he put it on these people and got worse and worse throughout his life.
And what I don`t understand why they gave this man the plea deal back then. I understand it`s in swapping to get some other people. They have to think about who is the person they`re letting out in three years instead of 100 years?
PINSKY: Yes. He`s old enough, hopefully I`m just saying.
But, Danine, I want to play something for you. You always come up with good TNT. I`m going to give you real good rocket fuel this time to work on.
This is explosive. We`re going to run something here to help you understand what this man is about. He posted what we`re going to show you on the Web site, the White Patriot. Again, this is a warning, this is disgraceful disgusting stuff. I`ll let you loose on it. Go ahead, watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROSS: Now, we know you black people got to be -- you bitch and you moan, you riot, you demonstrate, you protest. You`re not happy here. You don`t like the way things are going. You don`t like the rules that we have in America.
Let me tell you something. You ought to take your complaint to the Jews because white people don`t rule. The Jews rule this country. Don`t take your complaints to us, take them to the Jews.
I don`t want to hurt your feelings, but I have to tell you the truth. You black folks have small brains. Your brains are smaller, lighter, and less complex than brains of white people. Ask any doctor.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Danine, I present you our candidate for -- what is he running for governor at one point?
SCHACHER: Can you imagine?
DANINE MANETTE, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR: Dr. Drew, he is saying whatever is going to get him some friends. That`s the type of person he is. If it`s making deals with the prosecution, he`s going to make a deal with them. If it`s toting the party line for the racists, that`s what he`s going to do.
We`ve seen this before and the same thing with people who are definitely going full-on against what they hate against themselves. Strom Thurmond, Mark Foley, people who have led the banter against something, of discrimination, and all of a sudden turns out they were in bed with the thing they were protesting against.
This guy is trying to make friends and trying to get some points with whoever he`s in front of.
SCHACHER: I agree. Why, I`m looking at the footage right now, why is he in a wheelchair? Is this a sympathy ploy? Are you kidding me? He wasn`t in a wheelchair last week when he shot three people.
PINSKY: Again, I`m going to get my brain up again. Here`s my gravest concern about this guy, which is that he is full of hate, he`s full of these horrible impulses. He may have emphatic fail.
As we get older, this frontal part of our brain that has executive function and can control our behaviors starts to diminish its ability to contain impulses. He`s old enough, Sam, this may have been why he now started acting out these horrible, horrible, horrible impulses.
It`s not OK to hate. It`s not OK to hate.
SCHACHER: No.
PINSKY: I want to say it as loudly as I can -- if you`re full of hate, this hate becomes action. Even if you swear you would never take action, you can develop a mood disturbance, you could develop a medical problem, you could have aging issues that affect your ability to contain the hate and the hate becomes action.
Judy, last word.
HO: Dr. Drew, I was just going to follow up on Danine`s point that he`s trying to make friends. Well, the way he makes friends is not the way that most of us make friends.
He`s making friends in the way that they will be able to do something for him. It`s all about him and how it`s going to --
PINSKY: That`s the sociopath.
HO: That`s the sociopath. As you were mentioning earlier, too, the attitude is what leads the behavior. If your attitude is hate, the behavior is going to follow.
PINSKY: It`s not OK to hate. Can`t allow people to hate.
Next up, fourth graders buying and selling pot. Check it out. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was afraid to take my kids back to school.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s always something. This ranks pretty high in craziness.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I didn`t think I`d have to have a drug conversation with my 6-year-old who`s barely out of Barney.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A 10-year-old fourth grader did bring up a baggie of marijuana.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That boy sold pot to three other fourth graders on the school playground. And then the following day, one of those boys gave the initial pot dealing boy a marijuana edible.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PINSKY: Back with Sam, Anahita, Segun, Scottie. We`re discussing four kids, 8, 9 years old got in trouble for trading and dealing cannabis, pot, at their elementary school. Why not?
Sam, what do you know about this story, Sam?
SCHACHER: First of all crazy. I know when I was in elementary school we sold blow pops and pixie sticks.
PINSKY: Blow? You sold blow?
SCHACHER: Blow pops.
PINSKY: Sam sold blow in grammar school. What`s wrong with selling pot?
SCHACHER: Great to put that out there on national television. Blow pot. Suckers. Would you rather me say that? Dumdums. Suckers. Tootsie pops. Fine.
So, these four kids were in turn by another student, and two of them were suspended, but all four have been punished. Now, both incidents the kids got the marijuana from their grandparents, OK?
PINSKY: Oh, isn`t that interesting?
SCHACHER: Yes, but the grandparents did not consent to this.
PINSKY: They didn`t know.
SCHACHER: They were unaware. And therefore, the police, they will not be filing charges.
PINSKY: Sometimes young kids will say bad words to get a rise out of adults. Did they know, understand this was a drug? Did they know --
SCHACHER: I don`t know that.
PINSKY: Interesting. OK.
All right. Anahita, what do you say?
SEDAGHATFAR: Dr. Drew, I`ve always said all along nothing good can come from legalizing pot, OK?
SCHACHER: No.
SEDAGHATFAR: Look at what happened in Colorado. OK?
It`s been about a couple months. We had that college student so high he jumped off a balcony and killed himself. And then we had the husband high off pot, kills his wife while she`s on the phone with 411.
So, what are we teaching our children? These are 10-year-olds, Dr. Drew. And contrary to popular belief, pot is not harmless. It`s not cool.
Dr. Drew, you have said -- Dr. Drew, you said yourself that pot can be addictive for certain people.
PINSKY: Sure.
SEDAGHATFAR: Profoundly addictive.
PINSKY: Some people. That doesn`t mean something -- this is going to sound weird me saying this. It doesn`t mean something should be illegal.
Alcohol is a bigger problem. Tobacco is an even bigger problem. We don`t let --
SEDAGHATFAR: I don`t like that argument, though. I don`t like that argument.
PINSKY: You`re right. I`m not saying we want to have more problems necessarily, but people, the people seem to want legalization and I`m in favor of what the people want. We -- I as a physician will deal with the consequences. We`re finding out the consequences as this plays out.
Scottie, you agree?
HUGHES: I`m all for we the people. The problem is, you`re endangering other people in the public. So, therefore, it`s not we the people.
The big issue in this -- Colorado passed this because all the revenue was going to go for education. This was not the education they wanted. And when you`re sitting there packaging it like brownies and cookies and putting it in vending machines, what else would you expect? The kid probably didn`t know he was selling weed or how can the parent say no?
PINSKY: Segun?
ODUOLOWU: I have to disagree with both ladies very strongly.
SCHACHER: Me, too.
ODUOLOWU: For example, would we ban sugar because it causes diabetes and people eat themselves to death? I have to blame the parents in this issue or the grandparents. If you`re not smart enough to keep Huey, Dewey and Louie out of your stuff, don`t blaze up. But you can`t pick and chose the way you want to enforce the law. People kill themselves off alcohol. People kill themselves through tobacco.
SCHACHER: Prescription pills.
PINSKY: Segun, I would argue what you`re saying here, Sam, is in fact the case the real biggest thing that I see deaths and real consequence from is pills and people handling the pills casually in the home, kids getting their hands on them in the home. So, we need to deal with pot as a serious chemical.
SCHACHER: Right. Whether it is pot, whether it`s prescription pills, whether it`s alcohol. You`re a parent, have it in your home, keep it away from the kids.
ODUOLOWU: Exactly. Lock your liquor cabinet. Lock your weed cabinet.
SEDAGHATFAR: It was laughable. Dr. Drew, the school has to send a letter to the parents and guardians saying please keep your weed away from the children, lock it up so they don`t put their hands on it and get ahold of it. That`s so sad. These grandparents --
PINSKY: See, I don`t think so. I disagree.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: I think we ought to give -- I say this to parents all the time, I`ll say it here right now, make a statement to your kids about chemicals in the home whether alcohol, tobacco, pot, pills. You put them behind a locked cabinet.
SCHACHER: Edibles.
PINSKY: Whatever it is, you deal with these. These are chemicals that adults relate to in ways that sometimes are dangerous and sometimes are not, but they need to be dealt with as something very, very serious.
And in the home, that message has got to be loud and clear.
Segun?
ODUOLOWU: Are we not going to address the snitch kid who ratted out the guy --
SEDAGHATFAR: Good for him.
ODUOLOWU: Got snitches. What, in the fourth grade? I`m a little bit upset about that.
SEDAGHATFAR: Well, their parents actually raised them well, I think. Actually, those were parents that raise their child well.
ODUOLOWU: To be a tattle tale?
PINSKY: You guys listen, there`s a difference between somebody revealing a secret that could help somebody -- you know, this could have endangered the health of other kids.
SEDAGHATFAR: Yes.
PINSKY: As opposed to --
ODUOLOWU: He`s mad he didn`t get a brownie.
PINSKY: Anahita, go ahead.
SEDAGHATFAR: I was just going to say I totally disagree with what Segun said. The grandparents here, yes, surprise, surprise, the grandparents here should be very thankful none of these children were harmed or got sick because they could have faced criminal charges in this case.
PINSKY: That`s right. That`s a big issue.
SEDAGHATFAR: They should be very thankful nothing happened.
PINSKY: OK. Next up we`re going to show you more of the naked video that Sam brought up in the beginning of the show. That will be after the break. You`ll see -- we`ll show you the whole -- what we`ve got. We`ll talk to the guy who took the video and what happened before. You`ll find out why so many of you guys are tweeting about this.
Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: I`m back with Sam, our behavior bureau, Judy, Erica, and Danine.
What you`re looking at there is what you`ve been tweeting about most today. It`s raw, unverified, so to speak, video looks funny at first. But what we know, this is no stunt. Man driving a $70,000 Tesla on California`s PCH. We call the Pacific Coast Highway, here along the beach. See the ocean at the background.
He stopped his car, climbed out the sunroof, did a strip tease, went all the way naked and then started directing traffic. Fire department responded and took him to a local hospital because that is a psychiatric emergency, ladies and gentlemen.
SCHACHER: Wow.
PINSKY: Going to start with a man who shot the video, Teddy Bliss.
Teddy, can you tell us what happened before the video started rolling?
TEDDY BLISS, SHOT VIDEO OF NAKED MAN IN TESLA (via telephone): Yes. Hey. Definitely. Well, I was on my way to go on a nice surf and I first noticed the Tesla actually when it was stopped at the middle of the PCH, and the guy was -- it seemed like he was having some car trouble. I ended up stopping and getting some gas to see if the man was OK. Then I noticed he wasn`t OK. He actually got back into his Tesla and started driving with his door open wildly through the traffic that was stopped. Ended up jumping out of the car while the car was driving and ended up crashing into a Mini Cooper.
PINSKY: Uh-huh. See, I figured that. I was asking -- one of the questions I asked, Sa, , was whether or not this guy was behaving erratically before we see what is happening went down.
SCHACHER: I have a question for Teddy. Teddy, did you hear him say anything? Did he talk to anybody? What was he saying? Was he dancing and directing traffic?
PINSKY: I bet gibberish.
BLISS: Yeah. It seems like he was dancing and directing traffic.
PINSKY: But was he doing anything? Was he sort of gibberish, saying words?
BLISS: Yeah. He was just shouting out a whole bunch of gibberish.
PINSKY: All right. Thank you, Teddy. I appreciate it. I`m going to turn to the behavior bureau. Judy, you`re nodding your head, uh-huh. I`m saying uh-huh. That`s somebody in a psychotic mania state. Would you agree?
JUDY HO: That`s right. He`s absolutely having a psychosis. And part of what we`re observing is disorganized speech, making up words. You know, logisim. I mean, who knows? We weren`t there. What it looks like to me is the psychotic break was severe if he`s completely ignoring, there`s no reality reflection at all in this case.
PINSKY: And Erica, could be precipitated by a lot of different things. Could be bipolar disorder out of control or drugs and alcohol.
ERICA AMERICA: You always have to consider drug-induced psychosis? And see about that. Do testing on alcohol and drugs. Otherwise, look into his mental health history and see if he`s someone who normally took medication who then stopped taking it, or who is having a first break of some sort.
PINSKY: Or a family history. Bipolar is highly genetic. Now, Sam, we`ve now reported three or four stories.
SCHACHER: Right.
PINSKY: Remember the McDonald`s lady? You guys showed the McDonald`s outbreak while we`re talking about this.
SCHACHER: Her in a G-string. Remember somebody with a box of wine?
PINSKY: Yeah, yeah. Right. The woman who walked in without clothes on. Throwing clothes off is a characteristic of people in a severe manic state. This is the one with McDonald`s. Now, do you understand what we`re talking about? Julie, Erica and I deal with this clinically. Do you get it?
SCHACHER: I do get it. I still have a little bit of trouble, for instance, I`m almost embarrassed saying this. When I heard this viral video, when I heard about it, and watched it, I thought this is a controversial marketing ploy from Tesla. I mean, I just.
PINSKY: Judy`s laughing out loud.
HO: Sam, you`re so jaded.
SCHACHER: I know. I am jaded. This day and age, you see all these crazy marketing ploys. That`s the first thing I thought about which is really sad. Then of course, learning he`s either suffered from some sort of a mental breakdown or possibly was drug-induced. How do you know?
PINSKY: Well, you can`t. You can`t at this point. Goes to the same place, a final pathway. Danine, we got you back. Your thoughts on this?
DANINE MANETTE: I was wondering the same thing that Sam just said. How do you know the difference between a psychotic breakdown or sp somebody in a drug-induced state? They feel as if they`re on fire from the inside and take off all of their clothes? So many people are getting naked lately.
PINSKY: There are certain drugs, certain PCP, sometimes people will throw their clothes off. The stimulants can cause mania and manic psychoses. Whether you`re bipolar, have a break, drug-induced break, it ends up in the same place. It`s something people want to laugh at a little bit, Judy. It kind of disturbs me. They`re funny if you think people of their right mind. They`re not. They`re very seriously ill.
HO: That`s right. Part of what you`re observing, Danine, is that they are just frenzy. So, the taking off the clothes could be anything. He took off the clothes, just as this man did. He took off the clothes so he can throw it around. So, that frenzy state is a main feature of psychosis.
PINSKY: They`re dangerous. And Erica, one of the things people don`t appreciate, people think about bipolar patients being dangerous, when they`re depressed, they can kill themselves. They`re more likely to kill themselves when they`re manic.
(CROSSTALK)
AMERICA: You can have psychosis during mania. Another thing is this is a scary thing because nobody happened to get hurt. I was reading an account of somebody nearby. Not the guy but a woman. She was really frightened because you don`t know if someone like that is going to take out a gun or do whatever. We`re lucky, we can laugh, but it`s a serious thing like you said, Dr. Drew.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Fire department got him, took him to the hospital. I`m sure he`s a lot, lot better now.
Next up, a real life video of a wrong-way crash. Question we`re asking, could it have been prevented? Back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police dash cam doesn`t capture the impact, itself. Just the flying debris. As a full speed wrong way driver smashes head-on with the car driven by Jared Ford. But the concern from his family is about this responding Michigan State police officer who they suspect did know what was coming since he was responding to the call.
Watch as the officer pulls on to the highway and lights and sirens, a car in front of him pulls over and stops on the right. The officer drives by. Family members say that`s Ford`s car that has stopped there. Ford then continues on to the highway after the officer passed. The wrong-way driver is approaching now. Watch to the left. As the officer pulls on to the shoulder, Ford moves to the far lane and he is hit head-on.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Very sad. I`m back with Sam, Shagun, Anahita. Carrie joins us, pop culture expert. A 21-year-old Jared Ford, and the 29-year-old wrong way driver who was shown in that incident. Tonight, Jared`s family wants to know why the responding trooper did not find some way to alert him or divert him about this approaching driver going the wrong way on the freeway. Sam, help us understand what happened here.
SCHACHER: OK. So, it does sound a little bit confusing especially watching the footage. So, again, he`s 21 years old. Jared Ford.
PINSKY: Sad.
SCHACHER: I know. He`s driving down the Michigan State Highway. He sees lights, he sees sirens. He pulls over because the state trooper is on his way to respond to the driver going in the wrong direction, right? So, Jared Ford is pulled over. State trooper keeps going. Sees the driver coming in the opposite direction and then the state trooper who has not alerted Jared, has not alerted anybody, he then pulls over, the state trooper. Meanwhile, Jared comes back on to the state highway and he head-on gets into a head-on collision.
PINSKY: We`re looking at it right now. Right now, we`re seeing the footage where the trooper pulls over because he sees the oncoming car going the wrong direction.
SCHACHER: Jared`s behind him now.
PINSKY: Jared is behind the cop. He pulled over because the guy had the lights on.
SCHACHER: Right.
PINSKY: Then kaboom.
SCHACHER: Head-on collision. Both drivers died. Jared had a female passenger with him. She survived. The state troopers did save her. Now that Jared`s parents have seen this dash cam video, they feel that his life could have been saved because he was never alerted nor aware of this oncoming driver.
PINSKY: All right. I want to see what the panel feels about this. To you think the trooper is responsible or not?
SHAGUN: Absolutely, Dr. Drew. Maybe I`ve been hanging around Anahita too long, but I picked up a few things from the law, and criminally- negligent homicide is when through your actions, through your negligent actions you caused the death of another person. He`s a cop. Protect and serve. The first thing being protect. He could have protected this young man from the accident by making him pull over to the side of the road or at least telling him what was coming by not doing that.
PINSKY: You agree with Shagun?
CARRIE KEAGAN: No. The only person to blame for this is the guy that was driving the wrong way. You can`t blame a cop. He can`t be in all places at all times. He was doing his job. We don`t know what was being told to him on the radio. We don`t know anything about the details of it except we just see this video.
SHAGUN: Carrie, that`s actually not true. He was going -- he was responding to the fact the man was coming down the road the wrong way.
PINSKY: We think. We think. We think.
ANAHITA SEDAGHATFAR: There was 20 seconds, you guys. You guys left out the part it was a 20 second time from the time the 9-11 call was made and the cop passed the victim. It`s easy for all of us to sit back and judge this officer in hindsight. Hindsight`s 20/20. But remember, he was acting in real-time. OK? He didn`t have much time to respond.
SHAGUN: Other officers have said he was wrong.
SCHACHER: I agree, Anahita, I agree with you tenfold. Let`s also remember that this officer as well as another officer, they risked their lives also that night to save the female passenger. Both vehicles were engulfed if flames. So, again, like Carrie stated, the person to blame here is the driver who`s driving the opposite direction. (CROSSTALK)
SHAGUN: Sam, you can`t get credit after the fact.
SCHACHER: Twenty seconds, Shagun, 20 seconds.
SHAGUN: Other officers have said he was wrong.
(CROSSTALK)
SEDAGHATFAR: Let`s say the officer pulled over and warned this victim, OK? What would happen if there was another car driving down the road and the wrong-way driver crashed into him and killed him? What would we say then?
(CROSSTALK)
SHAGUN: Why didn`t he park perpendicular to the road and prevent any traffic from going forward?
PINSKY: He could have been killed, himself. I`m not sure he necessarily need -- by the way, he doesn`t know the guy is coming 80 miles an hour. All he knows is the guy -- I have to agree with Carrie, trying to make assessments when you`re in retrospect when the people are trying to react in real-time. It`s easy to say he should have -- you wish he would have done something.
SEDAGHATFAR: Of course.
PINSKY: I have to read you a quote from the commander of the Michigan State police. He told a local newspaper, quote, unfortunately there was a lot of life. The troopers used every option they had available that`s allowed to them through the law and official orders. So, next. Thank you, guys. We`re going to talk about Tori and Dean again. Are they faking their sex and marital problems? Is this all a ploy to get more ratings for their reality show? We have new video, and we`ll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: I`m back in the studio with Sam. Now, Twitter, you guys, you are a capricious, capricious world. You have now turned on Tori Spelling and her husband. Yesterday, there was a lot of sympathy for Tori. Now, these folks are exposing their marital troubles on a new reality show. Last night, a lot of you tweeted sympathy for Tori, but tonight a completely different story. Take a look at a clip from their show True Tori on Lifetime.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEAN MCDERMOTT: I cheated on my wife. That`s my worst nightmare.
TORI SPELLING: Or that you got caught.
MCDERMOTT: I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your first marriage.
SPELLING: Both of our marriages. We were both married when we met.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And? The day you met --
SPELLING: We fell in love.
MCDERMOTT: We would have sex once every two weeks. It wasn`t fantastic.
SPELLING: I know. I`m going to --
MCDERMOTT: What? What did I say?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Bring in the Behavior Bureau. Figure out what he said. Judy, Erica, Carrie. Twitter thinks Tori and Dean created the cheating scandal to cash in on their new reality show. Before I go to my behavior specialists, Carrie, what to you think from a pop culture perspective?
KEAGAN: Reality TV by nature is like wrestling. If you`re watching this thinking any part of this is for real, you`re mistaken. I`m really, really sorry. This is all -- I mean, 90 percent of it is scripted and how they play it out might end up being for real, but everything else is just - - it`s not real, you guys. I hope I didn`t burst anybody`s bubble.
(CROSSTALK)
SCHACHER: This is crazy.
PINSKY: What are you thinking?
SCHACHER: I agree with you, Carrie, but to think somebody could concoct lies and cheat and essentially sell their integrity and dignity for fame and money is insane to me.
PINSKY: Didn`t the reason they started talking about on the show was somebody came forward and said they had sex with this guy.
SCHACHER: Well, some people are believing that`s all fake, but other people are saying maybe it`s an exaggeration, maybe they have had infidelity, maybe he`s dealing with his alcoholism, which kind of seems right and they decided to capitalize on it.
PINSKY: Or both.
SCHACHER: Twisted, too.
PINSKY: Also, skeptics are saying Dean did not act like a man who was sorry or contrite when he had cheated. Look at this photo. Here, he is just outside of Starbucks this week, chatting it up with young ladies. Today, this morning, again.
SCHACHER: Oh, wow.
PINSKY: He looks better. But, Judy, he was admitted allegedly for treatment for alcoholism. I looked very carefully to see if I could figure out where he was admitted. If you`re admitted for alcoholism, you have alcoholism. Could he facility will be shutdown who admitted somebody without a diagnosis? You know, didn`t meet criteria for their diagnosis.
HO: That`s right, Dr. Drew. Actually, on the clip you were showing yesterday on your show, he was admitting to a bunch of other stuffs, too, that he had depression, he had sex addiction. So, he was kind of numbering all of his problems, right?
PINSKY: Yeah.
HO: I`m not so jaded to think they`ve made this whole thing up. I think they saw an opportunity and they utilized it.
SCHACHER: Yeah.
HO: And reality TV is all about one-upping somebody else. How are you going to get to the top, how will you make the ratings? There`s pressure from the producers, too, probably.
PINSKY: Carrie, I think the gauntlet was down when Judy called you jaded. No?
(LAUGHTER)
HO: I don`t think I`m jaded. I think I enjoy watching this stuff just as much as everybody else. You have to watch it for what it is.
PINSKY: Erica, I want to show you something. Tori and Dean have done two other reality shows. Tori suggests she was the one that brings up exactly what Carrie was talking about, that these shows are unreal. She writes, "I`m Aaron Spelling`s daughter, I knew how to write the story. I knew what would tug on the heartstrings."
SCHACHER: There`s a tweet from K. Bell, she writes why would she put herself through that humiliation? Why?
PINSKY: Well, the question is this now the fact she has, Erica, said in the past that she was concocting these stories, now coming back and biting her in the butt?
AMERICA: No, I think that`s exactly what this is. I`m echoing what you guys are saying. A lot of people don`t want to believe that reality shows that are not real. That`s what it is. They don`t even want to admit it. It`s not true. I know -- trust me, I love the Real Housewives of New York City, and when I watch it, I want to think that it`s true, but it`s not. There are producers. I always say this. If you step back and see what it looks through the scene.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: There are some reality shows that are real. I did a whole series where producers were not allowed to get anywhere near my patients, and the cameras just documented what was going on. Now, there are people running around and it was constructed in interesting ways, but we just did our treatment. People were aware there were cameras and that does change the reality. And the circumstances of treatment is sort of a hyper-reality and there`s no doubt people on reality shows, things that are set up are not real. They`re hyper-real. They`re trying to get people to have reactions.
I do believe what you guys are all saying some shows are scripted. The Hills are scripted. It`s possible this is all scripted. But I`m telling it`s also possible some shows are documenting things when they go down. Remember the Danny Bonaduce thing? A long time ago. Carrie, remember that?
SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: We watched Danny melt down. That`s what he was doing. He was having severe alcoholism. They went to treatment and they documented that. So, it`s possible that we`re seeing that with this guy, too. So I don`t know.
SCHACHER: Well, there is probably truth here, but then again, why would you put that out there?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That to me makes for good TV.
AMERICA: Any attention is good attention.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Hold that thought. Hold that thought. Hold it. You can tweet us. You can Instagram us. Instagram @drdrewhln. We`re going to pick that question right up after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Back with Sam and the Behavior Bureau, Judy, Erica, Carrie. We`re talking about a cheating scandal that seemed to have rocked the marriage of Tori Spelling and her husband, Dean. The couple is documenting the fallout from this alleged infidelity, whether it was real or not, on the reality show, on Lifetime. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SPELLING: He can never live without sex. He`s never going to be happy with just me.
MCDERMOTT: I`m insatiable.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why her?
MCDERMOTT: I wasn`t attracted to her. It was like -- it was just like a warm body.
PINSKY: Tori is complaining he lies. That is a part of alcoholism. Also that she`s been trying to change him for years. Horrible idea.
MCDERMOTT: I`m dealing with my alcoholism and my addiction and my depression and mental health.
SPELLING: Because this whole affair has been made so public, I guess I assume that everyone is just, like OK, we know what`s going on.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: It smacks of something real but maybe they`re amplifying it, maybe it`s something -- the question we asked before the break is why would they allow this to happen in front of the cameras if in fact it`s real? Sam, a lot of things happen in front of the cameras on reality show that people allow to ha happen. My wife and I have a thing where we say no relationship survives reality cameras. They just don`t seem to.
SCHACHER: Right. If she`s so committed to fixing her marriage and allowing it to heal, especially being so close to him coming out of treatment, I don`t think this is a good idea. I don`t know why.
PISNKY: Yes.
SCHACHER: She would be motivated to. If it`s fame, money, that`s so sad.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: They may be desperate for money. I don`t know. Judy, they`re still having -- we still don`t know where he was treated which I find suspect. I`d love to know what that was because we can figure out what he was treated for then. What do you say to this?
HO: Well, you know, I think we need to keep doing the investigation to find out exactly what he`s treated for. There was a tweet that was shown right before we went to break about, what about the kids? That`s actually something I`m really concerned with. These two parents are so concerned with themselves and their attention-seeking behavior. What are the kids getting? Are they getting the proper care they should be? I`m really worried about them.
PINSKY: I`m worried about that, too. Carrie, do you agree?
KEAGAN: Oh, yeah. Obviously, that`s always a problem. What ends up happening, though, if this was real, if he did cheat on her, if he does really have an alcohol or drug problem, a lot of times I think it`s almost better to try and get in front of the situation rather than letting the press and the media sort of tell the story.
PINSKY: That`s interesting. That`s an interesting idea. So, maybe they were -- this is their way of trying to control it. Erica, do you agree with that?
AMERICA: More of what I was going to say, the reason somebody might want to this -- you have to understand certain celebrities there`s a compulsive need for attention and to be loved and to be -- you know, all that kind of stuff as well as the money. I`m not saying that`s necessarily what it is. I think that`s what it could be. She`s in front of the camera her entire life. Think of her parents, what she grew up with. She`s never not been that. So, I think even if it`s negative, sometimes it still feeds like a desire.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What kind of example is that for their children? They`re not thinking about their kids.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`re not thinking about their kids.
PINSKY: I tell you what, they may be, though -- you guys, it`s funny I`m the one fighting on their behalf.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: I know. Here`s the deal. All -- I deal with lots of families where somebody`s an alcoholic or addict or there`s interpersonal problems, and the one thing the kids want, the only thing they want is dad to be well, get treatment and be well, and mommy and daddy to get along, and heal their relationship. And listen, you ask about why they would allow this in front of the camera. They`re allowing a little piece in front of the cameras. He may be in a steady, you know, a sort of active program of recovery on a daily basis but that`s long ago that those cameras were rolling. Judy?
HO: My concern is these children are probably parentified children.
PINSKY: That what happens when somebody has an alcoholic dad in a feel. The kids start taking care of the parents.
HO: What about their childhood? That`s what I`m worried about. They`re not getting their childhood. They have to be responsible and be the parent.
PINSKY: Erica.
AMERICA: I want to say again, they might be lovely, lovely people, but there`s a reason she`s been in a number of reality shows. She wants this. That`s all I`m saying.
PINSKY: And Carrie, the way both of their relationships ended, they both cheated on their spouses or respective partners in order to get together.
KEAGAN: I mean, you know, whatever works, right? This is how they`re getting their attention. I mean, I just feel like - honestly, I feel like this is absolutely a made-up situation and don`t have to worry about the kids or the family.
PISNKY: Carrie is completely jaded by reality television.
KEAGAN: I have a tweet from Lucia Dee (ph). Hey, Lucia. She writes I think they`re on air for the money and publicity but suspect their issues are real. She hash tags #godrjudy.
(LAUGHTER)
PINSKY: For me, I`ve got to say whether or not it`s something amplified or concocted, it kind of fits for me as at least a version of the problem they`re talking about here on television. Something like that going on in this family. I hope they get treatment and wish them the best. Please DVR us now and watch us any time.
END
