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At This Hour

Ebola Epidemic in West Africa Spiraling Out of Control; Army Investigators Face Bowe Bergdahl; Another NSA Leaker; Murdoch Withdraws Bid for Time Warner

Aired August 06, 2014 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Want to turn now to the two victims of Ebola here in the United States. American missionary, Nancy Writebol, is said to be very weak but she is improving. The 59-year-old arrived after a flight from Liberia. These men wearing hazmat suits wheeled her into an isolation unit at Emory Hospital in Atlanta.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: She is expected to get a third dose of medication today. Her son is expected to be able to see her soon. Doctors also see improvements in the other American stricken with Ebola. Dr. Kent Brantly was the first human ever to receive the experimental serum.

PEREIRA: While the Ebola situation here in the United States seemed to be very much managed, the epidemic overseas in West Africa particularly is spiraling out of control. 45 new deaths and more than 100 new cases have been reported since Saturday. The World Health Organization reports that 932 people have died since the beginning of the year. The virus has killed people in four West African nations, Sierra Leone, Guinea, Liberia. There's no known cure.

It strikes victims so hard, a fever, muscle aches, bleeding, vomiting, organ failure, and in nearly 60 percent of the cases it's fatal.

Our David McKenzie joins us on the phone from Sierra Leone.

David, you were just at a facility that's dealing with this outbreak. We want to play you a piece of that tape and talk about it after. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: In the high risk zone, this woman calls out for help. She has Ebola. So does her son.

"Ebola is so deadly, it's killing our citizens. It's killing our country," she says.

Her husband and son died of the disease. 70 percent of confirmed cases here will die, too.

She said she is confident. To talk to her, we must stand a few feet away. The strict protocols protect us. The cruelty is, they isolate her. Still, she believes her 12-year-old daughter will make it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Again, we're on the phone with David McKenzie, who you saw in that piece.

David, what is it like to be there when you know Ebola is around? Why do you have to be so far away from that woman?

MCKENZIE (voice-over): You have to be far away because Ebola can spread through bodily fluids or if you touch something that a sufferer touches. It's incredibly contagious and especially infectious. That's why, John, you can stand a few feet away like that and talk to them. Of course, for me I've been in one Ebola outbreak before this. This one is far worse and unprecedented in scale. It was really touching to finally be able to talk to people any which way we could and try to get a sense of their personal story.

PEREIRA: We know, David, that Nigeria is releasing information that they have seven cases confirmed in their country and have said, look, we don't have control of this. Sierra Leone has said they're going to need international assistance. When you're on the ground, what are the medical professionals saying about how they're coping with it and if they're getting this under control?

MCKENZIE: They're saying they're not anywhere close to getting this under control. They do get a sense that they've fought this for several months and there might have been an opportunity some months ago when it was more confined to deal with it in a certain way. Now it's way beyond that point. They're saying they do need a lot more assistance, but that assistance is in terms of tracing people who went out into the community and might have contacted people. There are all sorts of complex things you need to do which isn't being done. My sense is that we're in a dire situation here. Now that it's spread to Nigeria and the big African city, that's a very troubling sign.

They do feel that with the right amount of resources, they might be able to stop this outbreak but with the amount of resources that are there now, they will not stop it.

BERMAN: The fact that it is Nigeria, and the population that big, it is alarming to say the least.

David McKenzie, we appreciate you joining us and appreciate the risks you're taking to report on this.

PEREIRA: Absolutely.

BERMAN: Thank you.

PEREIRA: An American doctor who worked as a missionary in Zaire some 40 years ago says he believes that he was the first American to survive Ebola. Dr. Tom Karen says he caught the virus while he was performing an autopsy on a patient who died before he was diagnosed. Apparently, he cut himself during the procedure.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. TOM KAREN, SAYS HE CONTRACTED EBOLA: I nicked my finger with a scalpel. It was two weeks later I came down acutely ill. I lost 20 pounds in the process and finally recovered enough to be able to go back up to the hospital part time and then started getting back into my schedule again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREIRA: Now Karen says that he didn't find out that he had Ebola until four years later when the virus was discovered in the Ebola River. Remember that was first discovered in 1976. He said doctors took his blood and discovered that he had built up Ebola antibodies.

BERMAN: 36 minutes after the hour. Ahead for us, the Army, the investigators, now face-to-face with Bowe Bergdahl today. What will these questions be like? How tough will this investigation be?

Also ahead, first, Edward Snowden, now the U.S. government has discovered another leaker. How did it happen again? What exactly is the U.S. going to do about it this time?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: @THISHOUR, the U.S. military getting ready to find out how and why Army Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl ended up in Taliban hands for five years. The general leading the investigation will question him about his capture back in 2009. Of course, you've heard over these last few months the critics who suggest that Bergdahl deserted his post.

PEREIRA: Bergdahl is now back on regular duty at Fort Sam Houston. New pictures being released. He looks a lot healthier than he did during his days in captivity.

I want to bring in Anita Goreckl-Robbins, a former Army JAG officer and military defense attorney.

Good morning, Anita, and thanks for joining us.

ANITA GORECKL-ROBBINS, FORMER ARMY JAG OFFICER & MILITARY DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good morning.

PEREIRA: We're hearing a little bit more from Bergdahl's attorney talking about this meeting with the general, that it's less of an interrogation and more like a conversation and interview. Do you feel that's a fair assessment?

GORECKL-ROBBINS: It is. You don't have a group of agents or what we call CID interviewing him. Nevertheless, he's going to be read his rights. Obviously the general is not a trained investigator but obviously others will have spoken to him ahead of time. So in some ways, yes, maybe it's a little bit friendlier setting, but the questions will basically decide his fate. So even though a friendlier setting, his attorneys have to be extremely cautious. I'm a little surprised by his civilian attorney's comments.

BERMAN: Why so? What do you mean?

GORECKL-ROBBINS: Well, because, he said words to the effect of any reasonable person wouldn't want to put him back in confinement. Well, this is a serious situation and his military defense counsel is coming in from Hawaii. Why it's significant is, because that military defense counsel is in Sergeant Bergdahl's original jurisdiction, which is back in Alaska, so that defense counsel covers down on Hawaii, Alaska, California and Seattle. Obviously they have picked a military defense counsel from his previous installation where he could be charged. So to assume that reasonable minds will prevail, speaking simply as a defense counsel, I would say is a little concerning.

BERMAN: Obviously, this is serious. He is in legal jeopardy per se, which is not to say that he's being convicted, but this counts, this interview, even if it's not an interrogation. What needs to be proved? The suggestion here by critics is this was desertion. What needs to be proved for that to be the case?

GORECKL-ROBBINS: Great question. It's going to hinge on what was his intent that day. They'll be asking what were his previous weeks like, any statements or e-mails or anything that he did leading up to. But then it really comes down to, what was he thinking on that specific day. Was he just going for a walk, coming back, did he want to leave with the intent never to return? That's really what it's going to hinge on, and that assumes that he can remember what he was thinking that day.

PEREIRA: So let's go next steps then. Let's say they do find that he did, in fact, desert. What happens then?

GORECKL-ROBBINS: It's literally going to be in the hands of the staff judge advocate which is the equivalent of the district attorney if you think of any county. I'm sure there will be input from possibly Pentagon officials. It just depends. But it's literally going to be in their hands to decide is this something we want to move forward with. Instead of a court-martial, do we want to separate him administratively? That's going to bear facts on what he tells them.

PEREIRA: Right. They'll take all of that in consideration. I wonder will they consider that he has spent, some will say, he spent five years in captivity, is that not punishment enough in the hands of the Taliban.

GORECKL-ROBBINS: Of course. How can you absolutely not -- because we don't even know the details of what happened to him. None of us know if he was tortured or threatened, any of those details. So, yes, absolutely. It's all going to turn on that as well.

PEREIRA: We would love to have you back with us to talk about other topics as well. Thank you so much. You're an excellent guest with us.

GORECKL-ROBBINS: Thank you.

PEREIRA: Talking with us about areas that we're not familiar with.

BERMAN: I wonder what we'll find out about this interview, today, and that may be discussed tomorrow.

Quarter to the hour right now. CNN broke the news about a new major leak of U.S. government documents related to terror suspects. This time it is not Edward Snowden behind it. So how serious is this breach? We'll tell you next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: The U.S. government now trying to track down another leaker of national secrets. Now, they say they know it's not Edward Snowden because Snowden is in exile in Russia and has been for a year.

This was Mr. Snowden at the Bolshoi Theatre in Moscow, the first time he's been seen at a public event since his arrival.

PEREIRA: In this new situation, the documents that are now being leaked are dated back from August 2013, which is months after Snowden left the NSA and fled the country.

I want to bring in our CNN justice reporter, Evan Perez, who broke this story for us. Great reporting.

First of all, walk us through it. What exactly was leaked, how serious is it, and how can they really, really be sure that they may not have done this breach from behind Russian borders, behind the Iron Curtain?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Michaela, the documents that we're talking about were leaked to the website, the Intercept, which was started by Glenn Greenwald. He's been publishing some of the Snowden documents, as you know. These documents were from the National Counter-Terrorism Center and they describe how much the Obama administration has increased the number of people that are on the watch lists, that are on these terrorism data bases. And they're pretty sensitive documents because it describes a lot about what the government is up to try to try to figure out -- to stay a step ahead of the terrorists that the government says it needs to protect us from. So these are very sensitive documents. They're very concerned in the government as to how these got out, so now they're trying to figure it out.

BERMAN: Any clues at all at this point, even what agency the leak might be coming from?

PEREZ: We do know, based on the documents, they're labeled "secret," as you can see, from the shot we just showed you. So these were stored on a Pentagon computer system called Cipra Net. That is linked to a lot of departments. It could be the Pentagon, the State Department, the Justice Department. There's a lot of people who have access. That's really the problem. The government says there are about 3.2 million people who have clearance to get access to secret documents, secret information. That's a lot of people. There's a lot of potential for problems like this. PEREIRA: You have 3.2 million people. You're going to have to work

your sources.

(LAUGHTER)

You've got some phone calls ahead of you.

Here's the question for you. Look at the timing of all of this, the extra sensitivity the government has, given the extra sensitive documents that were recently leaked. I almost wonder what's worse to them, the content, or the fact they were leaked at all.

PEREZ: The fact these were leaked and these were clearly documents the government says should not be out is a big problem for them. I'm told they're sensitive about this issue because they obviously don't want to trigger fears that the government is going after journalists who might be getting these leaked documents. Obviously, we all get talked to behind the scenes by officials. They don't want to make it seem like they're going after the journalists. But they do want to figure out where these leaks are coming from. They're fearful that the Snowden incident has encouraged other leakers.

PEREIRA: Evan Perez, thanks so much. Good to have you with us @THISHOUR.

We're going to take a short break. Up ahead, no deal. Did Rupert Murdoch just surrender his bid for Time Warner? And why? We'll talk about it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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BERMAN: Like living through it again for some people.

PEREIRA: I knew you were going to do it. I'm a whole year older than him.

BERMAN: In other news about us, Rupert Murdoch has withdrawn his bid to buy Time Warner, the parent company of CNN.

PEREIRA: Time Warner rejected the offer last month. Many investors carried on as though the deal might go through.

The man to discuss this is our media correspondent, Brian Stelter, also host of "RELIABLE SOURCES".

You have inside details for us. This is obviously going to take a hit on the old stock market, I can imagine there.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: It sure has. Time Warner stock dropped between 10 percent and 12 percent as soon as this came out.

Here's a chart of how the stock had done all year. You can see it was doing well all year. There was this big uptick as soon as Murdoch's interest in Time Warner was leaked. The reason why Murdoch has withdrawn his offer is because his stock, FOX's stock, did basically the opposite. Dropped right around the time his interest was leaked. I'll put his statement up on the screen. He says that's one of the big reasons why he's backing down now. He says at the end of the statement there it made the transition unattractive to FOX shareholders. That's one of the reasons why he's backing away. He has to pay attention to what his shareholders want.

BERMAN: Is this like a bad high school break-up where it's not really over?

(LAUGHTER)

Is it over-other now? What about Time Warner?

STELTER: People have learned over the years not to underestimate rue put Murdoch. That's why it was taken seriously when first rumored. He famously overpaid for the "Wall Street Journal" about seven years ago. But his newspaper, the "Wall Street Journal," said last night there is no, quote, "second target or plan B for Murdoch in this particular case." That said, is Time Warner still in play? A lot of people much smarter

than I think it is. Maybe not right now, but two or three years from now. It's a very valuable asset. Not just because of the three of us.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: Filled with a lot of valuable assets.

(CROSSTALK)

STELTER: But because it's got HBO. It's got Warner Bros. It's got Turner, which includes CNN. It's a pure play content company. It might be even more valuable a year or two down the line. What would Time Warner would want is what any company would want. Not just one bidder like Murdoch but multiple bidders.

PEREIRA: Valuable even in the changing landscape of media and the new players on this scene?

STELTER: It is because actually Time Warner earnings beat Wall Street estimates. One of the striking things to me was HBO. HBO subscription rates were up. People were having to be paying more. But they're willing to. HBO is making money from some new services, like Amazon. Even in this changing world, these big media companies are in a pretty safe position.

BERMAN: And sports, you know, and Time Warner, Turner has sports and these live --

STELTER: Disney came out. ESPN is owned by Disney, and those earnings were strong as well.

BERMAN: A live broadcast. Sports are by definition live broadcasts, hard to TiVo, hard to DVR. People want them.

STELTER: People may not like their cable company. But they do like paying -- let me back up. They may not like their cable company but they like the service. They like the programming. They may hate paying so much for it, but people continue to be willing to pay for television.

PEREIRA: I knew you were the guy to talk about it.

Thank you for joining us, Brian.

BERMAN: Just one of the many valuable assets of the Time Warner company. That is all for us @THISHOUR.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: That is all for us @THISHOUR. I'm John Berman.

PEREIRA: Are you sure?

BERMAN: I am absolutely sure. PEREIRA: I'm Michaela Pereira.

"LEGAL VIEW" with Ashleigh Banfield starts now.