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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Pentagon Considers Humanitarian Aid to Religious Group in Northern Iraq; Other Military Options; Russia Bans Imports

Aired August 07, 2014 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ELISE LABOTT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIR CORRESPONDENT: ... air drop of food, medicine, water, but perhaps also, senior U.S. officials telling Jim Sciutto, our chief national security correspondent, it could also involve some kind of humanitarian corridor, supporting Iraqi and Kurdish forces to get this population out.

We're talking about 40,000 people, Ashleigh, in desperate need of food and water. And there is a concern that the ISIS rebels could -- militants could move in on them.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: And just so people know, this is a group that is sort of considered a pre-Islamic sect.

They draw their beliefs from Christianity and Judaism and Zoroastrianism. I mean, this is sort of a very unique and a group that most people have not heard of, heretofore.

But are they in imminent risk of like all-out slaughter from ISIS? Because I'm seeing reports that they're surrounded.

LABOTT: Well, that's the big concern is that this could become a major catastrophe because they're surrounded.

And they've kind of been ostracized in Iraq. Some people call them devil worshippers. They definitely have been persecuted in the past.

And you know, there is a concern that ISIS, with their extreme Islamic ideology, could find this minority one of their target groups. And that's why they're concerned that they could move in on them.

There's also concern that ISIS could attack the surrounding infrastructure. And that's why the administration, although you know the president has been reluctant to get involved in Iraq militarily until there was a new Iraqi government in place.

But this growing humanitarian crisis could force the administration's hand much sooner than the president would like, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: How safe is it at this point for the American forces to be flying over this area with these kinds of fighters poised on the ground? Even if their mission is as altruistic as it seems, is this safe for Americans to even be there, albeit in the air?

LABOTT: Well, that's one of the things that the administration has been trying to assess in the last month or so is how safe is it. And when we see what's been going on around the world, a lot of these terrorists have been getting man-pads, surface-to-air missiles that could shoot at any type of aircraft.

We saw what happened with the Malaysian Airlines Flight 17 over Ukraine. I think that's a growing concern, that U.S. aircraft, any kind of aircraft, are not safe, and so I think right now what they're trying to do is get a better lay of the land where these people are, how the U.S. can help.

But again, just to be clear, no U.S. troops on the ground. We're talking mostly about U.S. airlifts in support of Iraqi and Kurdish forces, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: And, so I'm getting a visual, and it's never a good one when you're talking a whole lot of civilians and thousands of kids who are in imminent danger, getting food and water may be one thing, but getting protection is a whole other thing.

I want to bring in Colonel Rick Francona with me now. With your former work with the CIA, I know you are familiar with this area. This is predominantly Kurdish. All these reports that the Peshmerga, those Kurdish fierce fighters are on the run.

Who is going to save these people? Because food and water ain't going to do it when ISIS is in this position.

LIEUTENANT COLONEL RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, the trouble is, the ISIS has already pushed beyond where they are, and they're putting pressure on the Peshmerga. They're pushing into the Kurdish area now.

And so this is an enclave that has been surrounded and completely at the mercy of ISIS.

BANFIELD: You just heard Elise Labott saying there's no way there are going to be American boots on the ground with regard to this, although there are. We've got advisers. For whatever purpose, advisers are working at this moment.

Isn't this what's required to save this entire community?

FRANCONA: Well, we could beef up the Kurds, give the Kurds enough air support, maybe some additional munitions and things they need, and they could probably move in and take this place, but that's going to require a lot of U.S. support.

Now, these people are related to the Kurds, so the Kurds have an affiliation with them. So the Kurds would probably be willing to go do this, but they're going to need a lot of support.

The Kurds have been severely damaged now, and they don't have the resupply that they need. From the Iraqi government.

BANFIELD: And the Iraqis can't do this, can they? There's absolutely nothing they can do leading up to this. FRANCONA: Exactly. This is too far in.

BANFIELD: Too far gone.

FRANCONA: Behind the ISIS lines. And the Iraqi army has basically collapsed in front of ISIS as they move down the Tigris Valley.

So the chances of the Iraqi military doing anything up here other than airstrikes and air drops is probably pretty remote. And they don't have enough air to do this effectively.

BANFIELD: It's just unbelievable to think that it's been allowed to get this far with that many innocent people just literally surrounded.

But ultimately, you know, what can you do, if you're not putting boots on the ground, what can you do other than --

FRANCONA: Air drops.

BANFIELD: Drop the -- well, we'll see how that works. Colonel Francona, thank you for that.

We've been also following other news about a security firm that said more than a billion computer passwords have been hacked and stolen, and it's at the hands of a Russian group. But it also says it's not going to be letting the public know which accounts have been breached.

Well, what about those Web sites? Some of them household names that have apparently been breached. Don't they have a legal obligation to tell you and me if someone stole our info?

Turns out it's a really good question with a really good answer, and you're going to want to know this case you end up the victim. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Other breaking news to bring to you at this moment, just as we brought you the news of this dire circumstance for a community that's trapped in northern Iraq and surrounded by ISIS and literally starving to death, reports of dozens of children dying of thirst, women being sold into slavery, and hundreds of men being slaughtered, we are now getting reports in addition to the Pentagon confirming that food and water and humanitarian drops will be made, that potentially -- and I'm just going to quote here -- other military options -- and that's a quote -- beyond the aid to the minorities trapped are now being considered by the United States.

I want to bring in Colonel Rick Francona, an adviser to CNN, also intimately familiar with your CIA work in the past with this area of northern Iraq.

When I see other military options, that doesn't necessarily mean we're sending in the troops.

FRANCONA: No. No, but it opens the way for airstrikes. Now, you can drop food, and as you said before, you can keep these people alive, but you can't free them with food. You're going to have to send some sort of military option, which I read as airstrikes.

You can also give the Kurds additional capabilities so that they can go in there on the ground and liberate this area.

BANFIELD: So can you do that at the same time? Can the same forces be dropping food and ordnance at the same time?

FRANCONA: Yes. Yes, we have the capability to do this, and we're fortunate that the Kurdish area of Iraq abuts a NATO ally, Turkey, a lot of airfields down there.

We have a very close relationship with the Turks. We could mount the humanitarian effort quickly. Aircraft already in Europe, bring them down, fly them over this area and drop them.

BANFIELD: It's never as easy as it seems on paper.

FRANCONA: Never as easy --

BANFIELD: The Turks and the Kurds have a complex relationship as well.

FRANCONA: They do, but over the past year or so we've seen a close working relationship between the Iraqi Kurds and the Turks, because the Kurds on one side of the border want stability, and they certainly don't have it with ISIS.

That whole border, if you look at the Turkish border, Syria and Iraq. The Syrian border with Turkey is almost completely controlled by ISIS now. They regard this as a threat to them, so they would be willing to help us help the Kurds.

BANFIELD: So when we're talking about airstrikes, though, is this something that would be targeted, quick and dirty, or would this be something that is prolonged?

I mean, in my estimation when we're talking about a small community like this, it can't be a large and long operation.

FRANCONA: No. And when you say airstrikes, it is not as easy as it sounds because you have -- what are they going to get down there and bomb?

They're going to have to know what they're hitting, and that requires intelligence. And intelligence, of course, requires collection of information.

BANFIELD: Ah, we sent a bunch of people there for that, didn't we?

FRANCONA: And we have people there, but they're not in position to do that. We're going to need aerial flights. We're going to need targeting. We're going to need to develop how we do this. So this is not going to happen this afternoon.

BANFIELD: Let me bring in Elise Labott again who has been working her sources. Elise, what more do you know about this, these other military options?

LABOTT: Well, right now we're hearing that primarily we're talking about these airlifts, but it could also involve, as we've been saying, a humanitarian corridor, as Rick has been saying, and that would involve airstrikes to kind of clear the way for these people to get out.

But I think it would be a very limited and specific thing to get these people out. I definitely don't think that the administration wants to drag itself back into any kind of prolonged type of military action in Iraq, especially, Ashleigh, because they're still waiting for the Iraqi government to form.

The administration has been very clear that it wants Prime Minister al-Maliki to get a much wider coalition to deal with some of these issues that are allowing ISIS this kind of free rein over the country.

And when you see what's happening right now in the north, you also have to remember that the Kurds and the Iraqi government have a long history. There's a lot of tension there.

Certainly they're going to be looking to the Iraqi government for large kind of airlift and airstrike type of capability, but there's a lot of tension between the Kurds and the Iraqi government, and the Kurds have pretty much used this opportunity of ISIS to nab some territory for themselves.

So this is all kind of caught up in these wider political struggles that Iraq has been going through for several years and have intensified in recent months.

BANFIELD: Well, for some context here -- just quickly if you're just joining us -- this issue has just emerged with the Pentagon confirming to us that they are indeed going to be dropping food and water to this group of -- they're called Yazidis.

They're an old religious culture, the oldest religion in the world, it's thought, ultimately of people who have been driven out of their town by ISIS, radical fighters.

They're surrounded. They are starving to death, literally. They need food. They need water. They need sanitation. Dozens and dozens of children are dying regularly. Reports that women are being sold into slavery. Men being slaughtered. It is a dire circumstance indeed.

Colonel Francona, when Elise and you talk of this corridor and talk about potential American airstrikes, it was only about, I think, a little over a month ago, we had the conversation of the spec ops, the American spec ops who were landing, ultimately potentially to be able to call in the intel from the ground to facilitate these times.

It may be different kinds of airstrikes, which leads me to the question if you're doing airstrikes for humanitarian purposes, are you therefore extending those airstrikes as well for combat purposes against whatever ISIS has planned next? LABOTT: Well, yes, because when you mount an air campaign, you just

don't want to do the tactical things right there. You want to destroy the ability of the enemy to move things in. You want to destroy his ability to resupply.

So to do this properly, we'd have to have the intelligence, as we said, but you'd have to go in there and hit a variety of different locations.

Now, we could do this, and we could move the forces rather quickly into place to do this, but this requires, you know, a decision that we're going to do this.

BANFIELD: So when you say move the forces, I want you to hold that thought for a moment and in fact take this commercial break to think about exactly what kind of mobilization it would require from the aircraft carriers that may be in the region, from the bases in Turkey that we may be able to use or the Americans may be able to use.

Again, this is all potential, folks. I don't want you to think for a moment that this is a fait accompli. This is all consideration that the Pentagon is confirming to our Jim Sciutto and Elise Labott, that in fact not only those humanitarian drops of food and water could happen, but that also, quote, "other military options," end quote, may be on the table as well. Not suggesting boots on the ground necessarily but potentially an opportunity for airstrikes -- yes, airstrikes -- in northern Iraq.

We're going to take a quick break. When we come back, how would that happen? Who would do it? Where would it come from? How dangerous is it? We're back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Continuing with this breaking news that's coming to us via the Pentagon and the State Department, senior officials telling CNN that not only will the Americans engage in northern Iraq by dropping food and water supplies to a community that's in desperate need having fled their homes, terrified of the onslaught of ISIS forces, fearing not only murder but also death by starvation at this point. The Americans saying that they're going to help in that regard, and senior State Department officials also confirming there may be other military options. And that's a quote, other military options that could follow.

I want to bring in Elise Labott, our CNN global affairs correspondent, who's been following this story, working her sources. And also with me is Colonel Rick Francona, CNN military analyst.

And first to you, Elise Labott. Just a little bit more color and context here. Other military options. Be very clear what they're telling us and what they aren't telling us.

LABOTT: Well, Ashleigh, there -- this is all in the consideration phase. There have been a lot of intense meetings over the last several hours between President Obama and his national security team about what the U.S. could do. They're in very close consultation with the Iraqi government in central Baghdad, with the Kurdish government about how the U.S. could help. So they're considering air drops of food, medicine, water. As you know, these people are without supplies. Some 40,000 people without food, medicine. It's very hot. People have been dying because of the heat. So there's those immediate humanitarian drops of air supplies.

But then they're also talking, we understand, about some kind of humanitarian corridor, how they could get these people out. Basically, as we've been discussing, these people are stranded and they're at the mercy of ISIS, really surrounded, and there is a major concern this could turn into a big catastrophe, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: If a humanitarian corridor can facilitate an evacuation, Colonel Francona, maybe you could weigh in on the opportunity for airstrikes to make that happen. Who has the capability right now to effectuate that policy? Is it only the Americans? Do the Iraqis have any kind of air force? The Turks, how robust or willing might they be? Is there any coalition? All of that in one question.

FRANCONA: OK. Look at the Iraqis first. The Iraqis have very, very limited offensive capability. They've got a few airplanes that the Iranians have given them.

BANFIELD: That's it.

FRANCONA: And they've got some Cessnas that can fire hellfires, but not enough to turn the tide here.

BANFIELD: OK.

FRANCONA: The Turks certainly have a capability to do this, but the Turks would require the political will to get involved in this. So far --

BANFIELD: Do they have it?

FRANCONA: I don't see it right now. But they do want stability on that southern border, and they do regard ISIS as a threat. So they may be a player in this.

The United States, of course, we've got the capability, but we'd have to move it to the area. We do have aircraft in Europe that could do this, move them down to Turkey. There are NATO bases there. We've worked closely with the Turks. It could be done fairly quickly. There are some carriers, but they would have to be moved. And that's still a long way inland.

Now, we talk about this humanitarian corridor. That would have to be done with ground units. Whose ground units and how are they going to get in there? They're going to have to - are they going to fight their way in?

BANFIELD: And there are American spec ops on the ground. And we talked about it that there is that capacity to do the intel from the ground, call in those air strikes.

FRANCONA: But to do anything on the ground would require a major commitment of forces --

BANFIELD: Yes.

FRANCONA: That we've said we're not going to do.

BANFIELD: Well, it's all in the --

FRANCONA: So air looks like to be the first and maybe only option.

BANFIELD: It's all - it's all in the conversation stage right now and they - the senior officials who have spoken with CNN have said these are considerations, they are not a fait accompli. It's clear that we need to make that well-know as well.

Colonel Francona, thank you for that. And also Elise Labott for working your sources and getting that story as well.

And another big story and there seem to be so many breaking stories. This one, big implications for American farmers and airline passengers, all at the same time. And it has to do with the Russian president. Yes, Vladimir Putin is getting tough again. He's striking back against all of those economic sanctions against his country for that de facto support of those Russian separatists. And he's saying nyet (ph). He's saying no to any food products from the United States and Europe. Can't sell them here, he says. Now he's also saying maybe we won't let you fly over our airspace either. Any idea how much that means for ticket costs and fuel and re-routing? You may be shocked to find out just how big Russia is and how much of a difference that can make. Details ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Vladimir Putin's been busy. Starting today, a whole lot less food is going to be going to Russia from Europe and Canada and the United States. No meat, no dairy, no poultry, vegetables. There's a big old list of stuff that cannot go to Russia. And this is not punishment from anybody in the west, this is Russia's own decision. Russia's own decision.

Vladimir Putin is pushing back against those sanctions that have been imposed by the EU and Canada and the United States. And he's slamming the door on food imports from the countries that back the sanctions on Russia. And again, the sanctions are because of his support of the Russian separatists in the Ukraine issue.

I know it's all very complex, but the man who knows how to sort things out in the most creative way is Richard Quest.

So, Dr. Quest, start with the food issue. We're going to talk about flights in a moment. What does this mean for American exports?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Tit for tat. That's what's happened.

BANFIELD: I knew it.

QUEST: There -- well, you had the EU, and now (INAUDIBLE) the U.S. doing their bit.

BANFIELD: Yes.

QUEST: Now the tat comes from the Russian side. In terms of U.S. exports, it's only about $800 million so -- of products that go to Russia.

BANFIELD: That's a lot.

QUEST: Beef will not be affected because no beef goes there because of food additive (ph) argument.

BANFIELD: OK.

QUEST: And limited pork products. Poultry, over $300 million a year. Russia is the second largest export market.

BANFIELD: And they're shutting that off.

QUEST: And they're shutting it off.

BANFIELD: So that's a big hit.

QUEST: It will be. For the poultry, absolutely.

BANFIELD: Yes. I can't imagine it's not a bigger hit to the Russians -

QUEST: It's about 7 percent - it's about 7 percent of U.S. poultry exports.

BANFIELD: It's like cutting their nose off to spite their faces here?

QUEST: Welcome to the world of sanctions.

BANFIELD: And I said - I say faces. Did you hear that? And I want to talk about that because there's also this issue of flights. Vladimir Putin is now threatening shutting down a particular part of the airspace. I think it's the Siberian portion of Russia, correct?

QUEST: Right. The quickest way from the U.S. and Europe to Asia going eastbound is to go over Russia.

BANFIELD: Over the (INAUDIBLE).

QUEST: It's the (INAUDIBLE) - no, no further (INAUDIBLE).

BANFIELD: (INAUDIBLE).

QUEST: It's to go over the great circle, which takes you over Siberia.

BANFIELD: OK.

QUEST: So if you want to go from Helsinki to Seoul Inchion (ph), or to Tokyo, or to Negoya (ph), you go the quickest way is over Russia. And that's, of course -- now, that, of course, is the eastbound route, not the westbound route. You can see both of them over there at the moment.

BANFIELD: So, once again, just like the food issue, this is crazy. They can't -

QUEST: And not only -

BANFIELD: He flies more over Europe than Europe flies over his airspace.

QUEST: It's (ph) these long routes from Europe to Asia that will be affected because otherwise they have to go the longer way around. It costs about $30,000 more in fuel if you end up going the long way around versus over Russia. But Russia will suffer as well because the cost of making those trans-Siberian flights gets to about $300 million. And that money goes to the Russian airlines.

BANFIELD: You think -- one answer. Is this going to happen? Is he really going to be able to do this?

QUEST: That I'm more doubtful about flights than I am about food, which is (INAUDIBLE).

BANFIELD: Yes. Than about the food. Well, and I'm flat out of time, but you know I could talk to you forever. Thanks for being on, Richard Quest, host of "Quest Means Business" on CNN International and so much more.

I'm flat out of time, but my colleague, Wolf Blitzer, gets going right away. Thanks for joining us. He'll continue the breaking news. I'm Ashleigh Banfield. Thanks for watching LEGAL VIEW.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello. I'm Wolf Blitzer, reporting from Washington.

We're following important breaking news. A humanitarian crisis and a wave of violence in Iraq unfolding right now.