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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

U.S. Jets Bomb in Iraq; FAA Prohibits U.S. Passenger Planes Over Iraq; ISIS Brags They'll Take the White House; U.S. Military Bombing Own Equipment Stolen By ISIS From Iraqis

Aired August 08, 2014 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: This - AT THIS HOUR Monday. Have a great weekend, everyone. Ashleigh Banfield takes it away from here.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone, and welcome to LEGAL VIEW. It is Friday, August 8th. Two major stories breaking this hour. I'm Ashleigh Banfield.

Americans, once again, in combat operations in Iraq, dropping 500- pound bombs in airstrikes against ISIS.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Jake Tapper in Jerusalem, where the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is raging once again. The latest cease- fire, as you know, coming to an abrupt end. Full coverage just ahead.

But first, to the strikes on Islamic extremists in Iraq.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: ISIL's campaign of terror against the innocent, including the Yazidi and Christian minorities, and its grotesque targeted acts of violence show all the warning signs of genocide. For anyone who needed a wake-up call, this is it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Secretary of State John Kerry speaking today in Afghanistan about the escalating crisis in Iraq. Just minutes later, we've got word that U.S. fighter jets attacked artillery used by the Islamic militants known as ISIS, or sometimes ISIL, and who now call themselves simply the Islamic state. The group's reign of terror now extends deep into the Iraqi heartland, but the wake-up call for Washington was a push against Erbil, in the formerly table Kurdish region where the United States keeps a consulate.

You also heard Secretary Kerry mention genocide against Yazidi and Christian minorities. By the tens of thousands, they've been driven from other cities on this map. Many are now stranded on the mountainside where yesterday U.S cargo planes dropped 8,000 meals and more than 5,000 gallons of water.

For his part, Pope Francis is doing more than just praying for the persecuted innocents, though he's certainly doing that too. He is sending a cardinal to northern Iraq to help the situation.

The Islamic state has a message for America that I can sum up in three words - bring it on. In an interview with Vice Media, an ISIS spokesman says this, and I'm going to quote directly. "I say to you, America, if you are real men, don't send your drones, send your soldiers whom we have humiliated in Iraq." It goes on to say, "we will humiliate them everywhere and, God willing, we will raise our flag in the White House."

Joining me now with pretty strong thoughts about that is Pentagon Press Secretary and U.S. Naval Rear Admiral John Kirby. He's on the telephone right now from New Delhi, India.

Admiral Kirby, just your reaction to that very strongly worded statement from ISIS.

ADM. JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY (via telephone): Well, look, I mean, just to claim yourself an Islamic state doesn't make one and real men don't behead and abuse and kill children and innocent people who are just simply trying to live a peaceful life. This group is nothing but a destabilizing threat to Iraq, to Iraq's people, to Iraq's sovereignty and frankly to the region. And we remain committed, the mission we've been given is to help (ph) Iraq's security forces in their fight against ISIL and, of course, to protect U.S. personnel and facilities. And we're going to do that. And you saw that evidenced earlier today by a strike against an artillery piece, a piece that ISIL was using to fire on Kurdish forces in Erbil, forces who were very close to where our people are serving right now.

So we're going to continue to do that. We've been given a very clear mandate, a very clear mission from the commander in chief and we are more than prepared, more than ready, to execute that mission.

BANFIELD: So, can I ask you if you can give us some further details other than the statistics that were released by the Pentagon, that 45 armed ISIS fighters were killed, 60 others were wounded, and that a close aide to an ISIS leader named Abu Gaza (ph) is among those killed. And, by the way, I should just correct, saying that that is an Iraq airstrike that did that. But can you give me the net effect of the airstrikes that the Americans effectuated over northern Iraq today? What happened?

KIRBY: Right now there's only been the one strike, two aircraft, a couple of 500-pound bombs, very precise weapons, did destroy -- we know we hit - we hit the artillery piece and the truck that was towing it with great success, completely destroyed it. That's the only strike that we've participated in, in Iraq since, again, getting the authorization last night from the president.

BANFIELD: And what about a further operation? Are we going to hear of more airstrikes that perhaps aren't just targeted towards those specific locations close to Erbil, but further and broader, other ISIS forces elsewhere in Iraq?

KIRBY: The president's authorization was very clear, Ashleigh. We -- we're going - we are authorized to do what we need to do to protect U.S. personnel and facilities and to assist the Iraqi security forces as they take the fight to ISIL in the Mt. Sinjar region, which is where those refugees that we supplied last night are holding up. That's where we're - that's where we're going to be focused. And as the president said, that could even include areas down in and around Baghdad where, again, we have a not insignificant American presence.

So I can't tell you with any specificity that, yes, there will be another strike or when that will be, but we've got the authorization to do it and the central command commander, General Austin, if when he deems appropriate and fit to do it, he will do it.

BANFIELD: Is it enough what happened today in terms of our military advisers, our consulate in that area, that the U.S. personnel who were in that area and protecting them is what happened today enough to keep them safe, or is there further airstrikes or even - God -- hate me for saying this -- boots on the ground required to make sure those Americans are safe and to make sure that that humanitarian assistance can actually work?

KIRBY: Well, the president made clear, we're not going to introduce troops on the ground in Iraq in a combat role. That's pretty clear. But he also made it clear that we're going to do what we need to do to protect our people and our facilities. This artillery piece had only just recently been put in position and only recently had started firing on Kurdish forces and we took it out pretty quickly. We're going to continue to be very vigilant. We're going to monitor the situation very, very closely. And, again, if and when needed, we're going to strike.

And I would also, you know, back to the humanitarian relief mission, the air drops that we conducted also last night, very successful. More than 60 of the bundles, of the 72 bundles we dropped, more than 60 of them we know for a fact actually reached into the hands of those Iraqi citizens who needed that food and water.

So we know how to do this. We're very capable. We have a very discrete, very clear mission and we're ready and postured to execute it.

BANFIELD: And, Admiral Kirby, one of the big questions, since you mentioned it, about those humanitarian drops, those C-130s and those C-17s have to fly real low in order to be able to drop those effectively. I know that they were accompanied by the F-16s. But do those forces on the ground, those ISIS forces, do they have any capacity like anti-aircraft tanks or any kind of ordnance that they might be able to take something out of the air if the Americans are flying too close or even flying too high?

Admiral Kirby, are you still with me? Can you hear me? I think we may have lost our connection with Admiral Kirby. You know what, I'm going to -- we're going to try and re-establish that. That's a huge question. We need to get that answered, just how safe are those American forces who are flying over northern Iraq right now.

I want to bring in our Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr. This has got to be a huge question among many of the media troops

right now. Just how safe has this operation been and just how possible might it be for further operations, a broader operation against the rest of the ISIS force, Barbara?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, at this point, what we are hearing from the Pentagon and from the administration is exactly what Admiral Kirby said as the spokesman, the president is very clear, there are parameters about what the U.S. is authorized to do, what the U.S. military's authorized to do. I think it's fair to say there will be more air strikes, more humanitarian air drops. But against these ISIS targets in the north and only in Baghdad if it is to protect U.S. personnel at the embassy or the airport. That has not emerged as a target set yet.

So, you know, we've seen sort of the first step going against a target in Erbil that they thought was a threat, and now watching very carefully to see if there are more of those types of targets struck or targets in those mountains in northern Iraq, if the ISIS forces move against those Iraqi minorities. But this is pretty much within that box at this point, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: Barbara, the United Nations has made no secret, they are desperate for a corridor to try to evacuate those tens of thousands of Yazidis and those who are being persecuted by ISIS. But is anyone where you're sitting in the Pentagon suggesting that that's a reality, that that can actually happen on the ground, when we don't have American forces on the ground and we certainly can't rely at this point on the beleaguered Iraqi forces?

STARR: That's going to be a very difficult proposition. You know, it has happened in the past in situations in humanitarian crisis where they worked to get people out of there. But this is such a large number of people. Some 40,000. And, you know, if they were going to do it, one could envision that they would have to strike ISIS along the way and push those ISIS forces back from their advancing positions in those mountains so the people could get out of there.

The president has been very clear, no boots on the ground. And it's not at all clear that boots on the ground would even solve this problem. But it's going to be going after those ISIS forces. The problem right now is it's very hard to see what would turn them around. And if they were going to do something to get that humanitarian corridor, it might be a much broader military mission to try and accomplish that.

BANFIELD: Barbara, stand by if you would, for me. Thank you for that.

I do have the Navy Rear Admiral John Kirby, the spokesperson for the Pentagon, back with me on the telephone live.

And I understand your phone's cutting out somewhat. You're joining us from New Delhi and I do appreciate you re-establishing a connection with us, admiral.

The question I was asking just before - KIRBY: Yes.

BANFIELD: We lost our contact was this, are there any forces on the ground, ISIS forces on the ground, equipped with the kind of artillery, you know, anti-aircraft tanks, et cetera, that could take out an American C-130, C-17, or even the higher flying fighter jets?

KIRBY: No, that's terrific question, Ashleigh. Look, I'd rather not get into intelligence assessments of their capability. They are well resourced. There's no question about that. And they're well led, well organized.

What I will tell you, though, is force protection is always a top priority for us. We always take into account those kinds of threats and challenges. We did that in last night's operation. We will continue to do that in every operation that we conduct.

And I'll point out to you that last night, you know, it was a very safe and successfully conducted operation. Again, a lot of hard work went into that. A lot of planning. And we're going to continue to do that in every step of the way.

BANFIELD: Help me out with that hard work and planning. It was a little over a month ago I had a conversation with many in your ranks talking about those U.S. advisors, the military advisors, the spec ops who were headed to that area. They're there now. They're in Erbil. Did they assist in this, calling in the intelligence for where those airstrikes needed to actually happen?

KIRBY: Well, again, I'm loathe to get into too much on the intelligence front. But you're right, we have a joint operation center in Erbil. We have between 35 and 40 U.S. personnel inside that joint operations center. They are working closely with Kurdish forces, sharing information, participating in coordination activities as best we can. So, yes, a lot of work and planning went into this. Both from - from help from there in Iraq, but also from great planning and operational work done in Tampa, at U.S. Central Command. So, I mean, it was a - it was a real joint effort all around.

BANFIELD: And then also, just to the air effort, the FAA announcing just within the last hour and a half or so that the airspace is now restricted over Iraq. I'm curious as to the need for that. Is that for the safety of overflying aircraft, or is that because the United States military aircraft need to have as wide open a work space as possible?

KIRBY: I won't speak for the FAA, Ashleigh. I'm sorry I'm not - I'm not familiar with that decision that they made. I'm sure, though, as all decisions they make like this are for safety of flight. Again, I can only speak for the military. We - we have been flying aircraft, manned and unmanned, over Iraq now for quite some time the last few weeks in an intensified effort to gain intelligence and information about what's going on, on the ground. Now, as you saw today, in addition to those flights, which continue, we are now flying -- the potential to keep flying strike missions as well. BANFIELD: Admiral Kirby, it's great of you to join us. Thank you so

much for your time. And I hope you can join us again as clearly Barbara Starr just mentioned, it is - it's possible that there could be further air strikes. We certainly want to get your thoughts when you are able to speak with us more about the specifics of what's happening. Admiral John Kirby joining us live on the phone from New Delhi.

And while the United States is striking ISIS targets, ISIS is making no secret of its desire to strike back at America. That terror group putting out pictures of its fighters in action, hoping to recruit new fighters and some of those fighters are westerners. And now ISIS has made a direct threat on the United States of America, talking about the White House and its flag flying over top. The details, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: With United States warplanes back in the skies over Iraq, passenger planes shouldn't be, so says the FAA, and CNN aviation correspondent Rene Marsh joins me with that.

Give me the particulars as you know them, about why the FAA made the decision.

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: Ashleigh, we know this crossed just about an hour ago. We should say, prior to today, the mandate from the FAA was any U.S. carrier flying over Iraq airspace, they had to fly above 30,000 feet.

Fast-forward to today, we now know that all U.S. carriers are banned from flying over Iraqi airspace, so it begs the question -- was this decision based on new intelligence that perhaps ISIS has the ability to shoot down a passenger plane above 30,000 feet?

Well, one government source just told me a short time ago it has less to do with intelligence that they have the capability of shooting down a plane, more so to do with the fact the U.S. is essentially bombing this area with these air strikes.

So there is this tense situation going there with the air strikes happening, but, Ashleigh, let's put this all in context here. This comes right after MH-17 was shot down over Ukraine airspace, pro- Russian separatists to blame for that one.

Also, let's not forget about that rocket that landed about a mile from Tel Aviv's Ben Gurion airport. So that's the full context here, and now we have this announcement from the FAA that no U.S. carriers should be flying over this airspace.

We now wait and see what will the European equivalent of the FAA do. We've seen in the past they've been in lockstep with the FAA. We already know there are some carriers who stopped flying over this airspace.

But waiting to hear some official comment from, again, the European equivalent of the FAA, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: I was so curious about that. I just asked the Pentagon spokesperson regarding that. At least, you know, he's not aware of any information, that this would have been at the behest of the Pentagon, so at least we know that much about why the FAA made this decision.

Rene Marsh, thank you. Thank you very much for that.

Just something quickly I want to bring to your attention as well. This has just come into CNN's newsroom, and that is that Iraq's largest hydroelectric dam, which is just north of the second largest city in the country, Mosul, has now officially been captured and is in the control of ISIS militants.

That is a key issue, because control the dam and you have a lot of the control over the people and the geography as well.

United States air strikes destroying targets inside Iraq, artillery pieces obliterated are rated by a militant group called ISIS, being taken out by those air strikes.

This is the same group whose spokesperson is bragging that group could take over the United States of America. Have a listen for yourself.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Speaking foreign language)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Did you catch that last part? "We will raise our flag in the White House."

Probably not a stretch to say that's highly unlikely, but U.S. intelligence officials are more troubled by ISIS today and their ambitions beyond Iraq.

Jim Sciutto, chief national security correspondent at CNN, is with me, and also joining us, retired Army three-star general, Mark Hertling.

Jim, first of all, something we just heard in that sound bite and some of the information until now is ISIS is rolling across Iraq using U.S. military equipment they swiped from Iraqi army members who dropped and ran.

If there's going to be more air strikes, could the United States military be targeting some of our own artillery pieces and tanks?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, no question, and one of the many irony of ironies in this story. You had reluctance to arm Kurdish militias in this fight, although that is changing now.

And part of the reason that's changing is that these Kurdish militias, the so-called Peshmerga, are outgunned by ISIS because is has stolen so much equipment from the Iraqi military supplied by the U.S. So, yes, you're now arming the Kurds to fight with U.S. weapons

against ISIS that is using U.S. weapons against the Kurds. It's --

BANFIELD: General Mark Hertling -- sorry, go ahead, Jim.

SCIUTTO: No, it's just one of the many demonstrations of how just entangled this whole region has become.

Just one other point, Ashleigh, this is interesting, the president last fall was going to conduct air strikes -- of course, he pulled back -- against the Syrian leadership of Bashar al-Assad.

He pulled back from that, but, remember, ISIS is fighting Bashar al- Assad in Syria. Now there are air strikes against ISIS in Iraq on the other side of that battle in Syria.

The region is so messy right now. That's just one of many measures to show how messy.

BANFIELD: I think messy and complex has been used so frequently when it's come to the last decade and a half of war in Iraq.

General Hertling, maybe you can speak to this, the messiness or the relative ease that the Pentagon is dealing with right now when it comes to the ISIS troops and convoys and what they call artillery that is close to Erbil and close to the Americans who are there.

Is this a simple operation, or does it get more complex if they decide to broaden out?

LIEUTENANT GENERAL MARK HERTLING, U.S. ARMY (RETIRED): You couldn't design it to be more complex than this, Ashleigh. This a very complex situation. There's complications all the way around.

Jim is exactly right. The shifting of tides between sale of ammunition and supplies to the Iraqi army versus not to the Peshmerga is something that we attempted to coordinate when I was there and when other commanders like me were there, very close relationships with the Peshmerga.

But we were trying to incorporate them, several years ago, into the overall Iraqi army. There were conflicts with the Iraqi government in terms of doing that. And now we're seeing that the Peshmerga, very loyal, very capable fighter, might be the saving grace in some of the ground operations as we reinforce that area with perhaps some overhead fires.

BANFIELD: But they seem to be struggling, General, against the onslaught of ISIS fighters who have some pretty sweet equipment, courtesy of the Iraqis, courtesy of the Americans.

Is there not that fear? I mean, you touched on it, but is there not that fear that if the Americans go in and arm the Peshmerga, as bold and tough as they are, the same thing could happen again?

HERTLING: Well, you could never say never on anything, Ashleigh. This is the complexities of combat, the complexities of shifting forces in war.

But what I would suggest is the strike that took place that Admiral Kirby talked about just a little bit ago was the first brunting of the ISIS assault toward the Kurdish region, and I think that's significant for many reasons.

First, it took out an artillery piece. It destroyed an artillery piece, which could have been firing into distances towards Erbil where the joint operations center is.

Would they have hit the joint operations center? Probably not. But what I would suggest is the destruction of that piece tells ISIS we now have a new game in town, we perhaps better back out.

And this is an opportunity for the Peshmerga to get resupplied and perhaps carry on the offensive. This could be a key.

BANFIELD: General Mark Hertling, thank you so much. Jim Sciutto, thank you as well for your input on this continuously breaking story.

And I want to take you to another top story we're following as well, and that's fighting between Israel and Hamas. That fighting gears back up as a cease-fire is effectively over.

We're going to take you live to the region for what exactly is happening at this hour. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Hello, I'm Jake Tapper live from Jerusalem, following developments in the other battle in the Middle East.