Return to Transcripts main page

Don Lemon Tonight

U.S. Strategy in Iraq?; Missouri Protests Continue; Discussion About Celeb Suicides; Witness Describes Shooting of Teen; Tear Gas Fired at Protestors in Missouri

Aired August 13, 2014 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening, everyone. This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Alisyn Camerota.

Breaking news, the first American forces on Iraq's Mount Sinjar, what they found on the mountaintop during their secret 24-hour mission. Is the U.S. getting in deeper? And it is enough to stop ISIS?

LEMON: Plus, if you knew that something was killing over 38,000 Americans a year, more than the number of people who are killed in car crashes, you would expect somebody to do something about it, marches, ribbons, bucket challenges, whatever it takes to raise awareness. Well, that is how many Americans die of suicide every year.

And in the wake of the Robin Williams suicide, there are fears that the toll may go even higher because of copycat.

CAMEROTA: And, Don, does talking about Robin Williams' death raise awareness or does it create copycats? There is an answer to that question, and our experts will share it with us tonight.

We have to get to breaking news first off here, tear gas being fired in Ferguson, Missouri in another night of protests over the shooting of Michael Brown, the unarmed teenager gunned down by a police officer.

CNN's Yon Pomrenze, he's a producer. He's on the scene now, and he joins us now by phone.

Yon, what are you witnessing there?

YON POMRENZE, CNN PRODUCER: Hi, Don.

Well, when we arrived at scene of the Q.T. gas station -- that's the -- this is the gas station we have seen in previous nights, the one that got burned down during Sunday night's unrest. And when we arrived, there were -- it looked to be about 100 people protesting, blocking the street.

And the police were announcing over a loudspeaker on a megaphone that everyone needed to move back 25 feet in each direction. When this didn't happen, the police announced that they no longer considered this to be a peaceful protest. And then they shot off a number of canisters of tear gas.

We couldn't count how many. And as soon as they did that, people took off. People were running. It was very chaotic. People were running down the main street and also all the side streets. We saw a lot of people who couldn't see because of the tear gas. People sort of didn't even know where they were running to. People had to grab each other's arms to get out of there.

So it was chaotic. Right now most of the main street, the main avenue there is clear. There is still a heavy police presence here. Police now on top, they are up above with a spotlight. And people seem to be holding back, waiting to see what happens next. We don't know if people are going to try to loop around and return.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: And, Yon, the question is when you witnessed all of this, was anyone hurt during the firing of the tear gas or during any of this unrest?

POMRENZE: We could only see from one vantage point. The side we were on, we saw people affected by the tear gas. We didn't see anyone injured any more seriously than that. So people were rubbing their eyes and the burning.

But, again, we couldn't see what was happening on the other side of the street. But from where we were, we didn't see anyone hurt beyond the effects of the tear gas.

LEMON: And, Yon, we have been hearing people there all day long and all this week since this has happened describing it. This is appearing to be a police state right now, even saying that it looks like something out of a war zone. How much presence is on the street and are those portrayals accurate?

POMRENZE: I mean, it is an incredibly heavy police presence, especially any time you try to act to get close to, you know, what you might call ground zero of the protest.

There are checkpoints, you know. And this is something -- it is somewhat accurate. It reminds me of some military places that -- places overseas that I have covered. Everywhere you try to go, there is a heavy police checkpoint. They're trying to steer people away. They're trying to not let people get too close, including the press.

We have to sort of camp out before we get to the checkpoints, and then just go down on foot, despite police saying today that they're going to keep the streets open. You encounter a very heavy police presence of local, county. And there are police here in riot gear, so it's in a very specific area. This isn't something that is all over the town.

But when you come down to this area, it is a very, very strong police presence, there is no question. It does not feel like a normal town in a normal way of living right now. LEMON: And as you're speaking now, we're looking at some of the

police presence out on the street there. And we have gotten word of journalists who are arrested, Yon. What can you tell us about that?

POMRENZE: Yes, we have reached out to the police to see if they can comment about that. We haven't gotten a response from that.

But two journalists from "The Washington Post" and Huffington Post have been writing online and on Twitter that while they were working at a McDonald's, which is again just here in the area, that police came in, Wesley Lowery of The Washington and Ryan Reilly of The Huffington Post, they wrote about this, saying that it was a SWAT team, that they tried to take their picture and that when they asked the police for their I.D., when they tried to take photos of them, the police asked them for their I.D.s.

They decide they weren't leaving quickly enough, and that they were roughed up. One of them wrote that they were slammed into a soda machine there, and that they were arrested, held for about 45 minutes before being let go.

Now, again, we reached out to the police to get comment on this. We haven't heard back both from local and from county police. But we're going to try to get that information as soon as we can.

LEMON: It's certainly awful. There has ban lot of unrest happening in that Saint Louis suburb of Ferguson after the 18-year-old Michael Brown was killed by a police officer either after a confrontation or whatever, it's still being investigated.

But Yon Pomrenze, thank you. Stand by. If we need you, if we get more information, we will get back to Yon there.

But it's really unbelievable. We should tell you that we have an exclusive interview coming up, Alisyn, a new eyewitness to the shooting of Michael Brown at the top of the next hour.

And we want to get now to the special forces, the secret mission on Mount Sinjar.

CNN's Jim Sciutto joins us live now from Washington.

Jim, what do we know about the role of U.S. special forces in the operation on Sinjar Mountain?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, let me tell you, Don, a pretty remarkable turnaround from just a few hours ago.

A special forces team, a little more than a dozen special forces soldiers went to Mount Sinjar today to assess the severity of the situation. And they came back with the conclusion that it was less severe than originally believed.

For one, there had been reports of 10,000 to 20,000 Yazidi -- this is the religious minority that has been under assault there -- Yazidi refugees on the mountain. The team came back and said, actually, it's a number in the low thousands. Those refugees still there are getting the food and water they need from U.S. humanitarian airdrops.

And that they can get off the mountain without a massive U.S.-led air or ground evacuation. First of all, I'm told by a senior military official that there are a number of Yazidis who want to stay there. Their homes are on the mountain. And that the ones that want to get off, they're finding a way off, escorted by Kurdish militia fighters at a pretty remarkable rate. I'm told at about 1,000 a night.

And because that is happening, and again, under the cover of U.S. airstrikes, the military concluding after getting to the top of the mountain that they don't need, in effect, more American help, that they can get the job done with what they're doing now, airstrikes, plus the help of the Kurdish forces on the ground.

LEMON: And, Jim, CNN has known about this mission for a bit now, since Tuesday, is that correct?

SCIUTTO: That's right. Our Barbara Starr knew about these special forces going to the top of the mountain for some 24 hours or so.

She held back. CNN held back that reporting because of concerns about their safety. CNN is seen all over the world. And the idea that we might report special forces are on the mountain while they were still on the mountain is information that could have gotten very conceivably to ISIS fighters on the ground there. So held back until that team was back to a base in Irbil safely and then reported that.

That is just a measure of the real very real threat that certainly the Yazidis are under there on the ground, but also any American forces who venture on the ground as well.

LEMON: All right, Jim Sciutto in Washington tonight. Jim, thank you very much.

CAMEROTA: All right. So does what Jim Sciutto just reported constituted boots on the ground in Iraq?

We also learned today that ISIS fighters say they have abducted more than 100 Yazidi women and children from the Northern Iraqi town of Sinjar. So what price is America willing to pay to stop ISIS?

Joining us now is Fareed Zakaria. He is host of CNN's "FAREED ZAKARIA GPS."

Fareed, great to see you. So aren't these boots on the ground?

FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN WORLD AFFAIRS ANALYST: You know, they are boots on the ground.

But I think in a way that's a kind of weird shorthand that we have developed to try to understand whether or not this is an open-ended mission. The really important question is, what is the nature of the mission? You go into a country and say we are going to save the country, restore it to its normal functioning, nation-build, those are vast open-ended missions. It's not clear how you would do them. It's not clear how you would ever know you had succeeded.

Here, you have a very defined mission. The idea is to try to save these Yazidis, to perhaps bolster the Peshmerga, the Kurdish forces. That seems to me pretty doable. As Jim described, this was a reconnaissance mission.

There is a great danger, and I understand it, and I share in it, a wariness about getting more involved in Iraq. But you don't slip down every slippery slope. This is a case where the mission is fairly carefully designed, and I think so far it seems fairly sensible.

CAMEROTA: So you say it's doable. And the mission is to save the Yazidis. It was nice to hear Jim say that there are thousands, not 40,000, as we previously heard from some Iraqi officials. But now what? Once they come off the mountaintop, now what do we do for the Yazidis?

ZAKARIA: Well, that is why this mission is both actually in a humanitarian sense worth doing, but also strategically doable.

You know, there is always a question of, can you do it? Where they will go is probably the ones that want to leave will go into Kurdistan, the Kurdish part of Iraq, which is very tolerant, but also very secure, and will become increasingly secure because we are now supplying the Kurdish forces with arms.

Remember, because these guys are an autonomous part of Iraq, the United States wouldn't sell them weaponry, wouldn't give them weaponry, because the idea was, well, that's violating the central government. You know, we're meant to be giving money to the Iraqi army, not to this group of militias.

Well, we have gotten over that now. We're helping -- the United States is helping the Kurdish Peshmerga. They will -- the Yazidis will go there. That's a secure, safe, tolerant place and can be defended.

CAMEROTA: So we're helping the Yazidis. It's a humanitarian effort that we're doing. Everyone seems to agree that they desperately needed our help. But why didn't we help in other places, as it's been pointed out, that the Obama doctrine seems to pick and choose, and is it just because this one was doable?

ZAKARIA: That's not a small concern.

The fact that Syria is experiencing a humanitarian catastrophe is very real. What are you going to do about it? How are you going to go in? Is there a way you could actually lessen that? A lot of people say we should arm the people opposing the Assad regime in Syria.

CAMEROTA: In fact, Hillary Clinton said this week that she wishes, I think, that that had happened. And that's where she saw a divide between her and the president.

ZAKARIA: Right.

But this the short-run, you have to understand -- and there is very good academic literature on this. When you support one side in a civil war that is pretty intense, it only prolongs the conflict, right? Because what is going to happen is Assad is now winning, sort of. The United States and other forces start helping the other side, they're going to start killing more Alawites and Assad supporters.

The war goes on, and if it goes inconclusively, more people die. Again, that's why I think this one is both from a humanitarian point of view worth doing, but also doable, because there's a discreet, narrow mission, you're trying to save these people, there is a place they can go to. You can secure it.

None of those conditions obtain in Syria. So, yes, there is a practical reality, just as we all face. You want to help lots of people in the world. But you do ask yourself, is there a smart way? Is there a charity I can do something where they do good, it's effective, it actually makes a difference?

Those are reasonable concerns for the Obama administration.

CAMEROTA: Fareed Zakaria, great to have your insight, as always.

ZAKARIA: Pleasure.

CAMEROTA: Thank you.

LEMON: And, of course, there is always politics. Right? We need to talk about that now.

CAMEROTA: Let's do that.

LEMON: So, joining us now to talk about that, about that President Obama finds himself being drawn deeper into conflicts in hot spots around the world while facing tough questions from his critics here at home.

What option does he really have left? And who better to talk to than our Gloria Borger. She is our chief political analyst here on CNN.

I was particularly struck, Gloria, by something you wrote last week, you calling the very reluctant warrior, President Obama the very reluctant warrior. Tonight, we learn that the reluctant warrior has special operations forces on the ground operating against ISIS, as well as airstrikes. Does he need to clarify his position?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: You know, I think as Fareed just pointed out, he has tried to make it very clear to the American public that this is a narrow mission, that it is humanitarian on the one hand. It is also to protect American personnel in the region.

But -- and here is where the confusion comes in a little bit, is that the administration has also made it clear that they want to help the Iraqis defeat ISIS. And so what you might want to ask is, OK, what will that involve? Will that involve airstrikes? Are the Iraqis themselves competent to do this? What happens if the Iraqi government isn't the government that we want?

How long are we prepared to help? And what would victory mean? So I think these are all legitimate questions that the president will be asked. I think he had a -- you know, tonight is really, really good news here. And I think, when you step back, these are questions that are not only going to be asked by Republicans, but also Democrats in his own party, particularly on the left.

LEMON: Well, I was going to ask you if he has any allies left, because you remember, you remember the run-up to the war? And President Bush didn't consult with Congress.

BORGER: Right.

LEMON: So now that the shoe is on the other foot, what gives here?

BORGER: Well, actually, I think this president has the American public with him because, if you look at the polling, a majority of the American public does not want to get involved in Iraq in any way, shape, or form.

LEMON: But what I'm saying is essentially he is say nothing boots on the ground. But still we have people there. We're essentially going back to war.

(CROSSTALK)

BORGER: Well, I wouldn't go that -- and, again, if you think he is going back to war, then he needs to tell the American public exactly what he is doing, because he would say to you, Don, no, we're not going back to war. This is a narrow, focused mission, that it's humanitarian. It's protective.

But he also says, wait a minute, we want to help Iraq defeat ISIS. So, what is that?

LEMON: OK.

So, Gloria, I have to run. Thank you very much. It's a great conversation.

We have some breaking news tonight, Alisyn, that we need to get back to, because we want to explain. You have been looking at the lower right-hand side of your screen. That is tear gas fired at protesters. That's Ferguson, Missouri, that you're looking at, another night of unrest after the death of 18-year-old Michael Brown.

Of course, we know that Michael Brown is the unarmed young black man gunned down by a police officer that was on Saturday.

Yon Pomrenze back with us now on the phone. And, Yon, Alisyn has been talking about tear gas being fired there

just moments ago at people. Let's take a look, and then you and I will talk to Yon.

This happened just a couple of moments ago, Yon. What are we looking at here?

POMRENZE: Well, what we had here was a protest of people on the main street. They were blocking the street. The police asked them to step back at least 25 feet in every direction. When that didn't happen, the police said that this is no longer a peaceful protest and began firing tear gas.

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Yon, just to interrupt, was it peaceful? Were they just refusing to back up, or were they doing things that were less than peaceful?

POMRENZE: Well, this was a large enough crowd, I want to be clear that I couldn't see every aspect of the crowd.

From the side we were on, we saw people lined up, chanting. We didn't see any altercations. But I do want to be clear that we could not see -- from our vantage point, we could not see the entire crowd. I don't want to speak to what may have happened in a different part of the crowd.

But the police announced that they no longer considered it peaceful, for those people to move back and then they fired the tear gas, at which point it turned very chaotic. People ran out in every direction. We got hit. Our team got split up little bit. And you could see the effects were pretty quick.

You know, people were bent over, coughing, covering their eyes, and then they couldn't see. So they didn't even know which way to run, which way. You had people sort of covering their faces with their shirts.

And just now in the past few minutes, we heard probably at least 10 more booms of the canisters, of the tear gas being fired. And the police line has moved it looks like north along the main street, essentially trying to push back the line, trying to clear out more people from this area which has become the flash point for protesters.

There's a police helicopter up above. And they seem to be using the tear gas to continue to clear out the area in a way to try to, you know, not let things get even more out of hand, the way we have seen previous nights...

(CROSSTALK)

POMRENZE: ... particular on Sunday evening. But they definitely do not want people on the streets here now.

LEMON: Yon, stand by. Yon Pomrenze is a producer. If you're just tuning in, he is a producer with CNN. He is in

Ferguson, Missouri, tonight, the fourth night really of unrest since the 18-year-old was gunned down there by a police officer, Michael Brown. We're going to continue to follow this story.

You're looking at pictures, live pictures there in Ferguson, Missouri, which many have described as a police state right now, and, again, tear gas being fired. We're checking on the action there.

I need to tell you that we're going have much more on this, and we're going to talk exclusively to a new eyewitness to the shooting at the top of the hour here on CNN.

CAMEROTA: All right, we will check back in with Yon as things develop on the ground.

When we come back, more airstrikes, a secret mission on Mount Sinjar. What will it take to stop ISIS? And can we avoid mission creep? We will ask our panel of experts.

Plus, as people around the world mourn Robin Williams, the rate of suicide in this country may be worse than we realize. We will talk about if the media coverage might somehow do more harm than good.

And a very special bond, one of the most touching tributes to Robin Williams we have seen.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: Welcome back.

The swift advance of ISIS militants across Northern Iraq and parts of Syria has stunned governments across the Middle East. And the question many are asking is, how can ISIS be stopped?

We're joined by retired Lieutenant General Michael Barbero, former director of the Joint IED Defeat Organization, and Ambassador Christopher Hill, former U.S. ambassador to Iraq, now dean at the University of Denver.

Gentlemen, thanks so much for being here.

General, I want to start with you. You just returned late last night from Iraq. Tell us what you saw there.

LT. GEN. MICHAEL BARBERO (RET.), FORMER DEPUTY DIRECTOR FOR REGIONAL OPERATIONS, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF: Thank you, Alisyn.

I was in Kurdistan and spoke to a number of Kurdish officials. And they're under two crises. The first is a huge and overwhelming humanitarian crisis, anywhere from 1 million to 1.4 million refugees. In the words of the chief of staff to President Barzani, they're overwhelmed. They need an international support. They need -- frankly, and asking for our help to pull this together.

CAMEROTA: And what does that look like, General? When they ask for our help, what do they need from us?

BARBERO: They need everything. They need supplies, obviously. They need camps to be established. They need health care for these people.

And it continues to grow as ISIS continues to put pressure. And that leads to the second crisis, this military crisis that the Kurds are facing. We have focused our attention in Irbil and Sinjar. They are under pressure and fighting in eight different areas, all the way to the Iranian border, along 1,000-kilometer front with ISIS.

And they're outgunned an overmatched. They are confronting tanks and artillery and they have very little armor-piercing weapons, really no indirect fire. And they say the trickle of U.S. small arms and ammunition is coming in, but they need much more and they need heavier equipment to face up to ISIS.

CAMEROTA: Ambassador Hill, what do you think? Is that our role? And are we going to provide those things that the general just outlined that they're asking for?

CHRISTOPHER HILL, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO IRAQ: I think we absolutely should, whether you want to call it mission creep or not.

I think the Kurds for years have wanted independence and not gone after, not demanded it and moved on it because the United States didn't want them to. And so if there is a situation that develops where the Kurdish people don't feel we have been there, we have been there to help protect them, I think that sentiment could change, and I think you would end up with a very messy situation of Kurdistan declaring independence.

So, on that basis alone, I think we have to be much more -- we have to be doing more than we have done. But I must say we have done a great job in the last couple of days. And what happened in Sinjar is a real credit to our people who are there. Also, there has been some improvement in Baghdad.

I think it's very clear that Maliki is on his way out. And believe me, there has been a lot of U.S. diplomatic effort there. So, I think things are coming together. But ,yes, we're going have to look at a lot of mission creep in the coming weeks and months.

CAMEROTA: The administration, General, seems to be drawing a distinction between the use of troops for a humanitarian mission and the use of troops for a combat mission. But is there really a difference?

BARBERO: You know, Alisyn, I'm not sure. I think that's a distinction without a difference.

What is the -- the real question is not whether we have boots on the ground, whatever that means -- is, what is our strategy? And how are we going to deal with this ISIS threat that is I believe an existential threat to the Kurds and to Baghdad?

And they have the momentum. They're on the march. And unless we do something more significant, they are going to continue to pound the Kurds and continue their VBIED, their explosives campaign in Baghdad that we have seen. So, really, what is the strategy here going forward? Slogans -- one should not mistake slogans for strategy.

CAMEROTA: Mr. Hill, what is our strategy moving forward, do you think?

HILL: Well, I think it's for the president to explain to us, because I don't think it's adequate to talk about protecting these endangered people.

I think the issue is, we need a strategy to roll back ISIS. And when you hear people in the State Department, Brett McGurk today, speaking about it, it's very clear we understand what we're dealing with. We're just not quite sure what to do about it.

One of the real problems, though, is we chose a policy of regime change in Syria without really the means to make that happen. All the confusion, the undermining of the central government there, hideous that that central government may be, has caused that situation, that chaos to metastasize into Iraq.

So I think we need to have a strategy that also embraces what are we trying to do in Syria, and I think we need a forward looking strategy, at least get out there with a diplomatic political plan for what Syria might look like in the future. Otherwise, I don't think we can just defeat ISIS in Iraq.

CAMEROTA: Former Ambassador Christopher Hill, General Barbero, thanks so much for your expertise tonight. Great to talk to you.

HILL: Thanks, Alisyn.

LEMON: We have a lot of breaking news going on.

We're going to get you back to Missouri coming up in just a little bit here on CNN. You're looking at pictures now. These are from our affiliate KTVI and KPLR in Ferguson, Missouri. And there have been some protests there, police firing tear gases at some of the protesters who got a little bit violent there. We're trying to figure out exactly what is going on. Our reporters and producers are on the scene.

And also we want to tell you tonight that there is a new eyewitness that has come forward to the shooting death of this teenager by a police officer in Ferguson, Missouri. There she is. She will join us for a live exclusive right here on CNN coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Our breaking news tonight here on CNN. It's really a tale of two scenes in one town tonight. And I'm talking about Ferguson, Missouri, that suburb of St. Louis.

On the left you see peaceful protesters, what all Americans are allowed to do, have the right to do to protest. And on the right you see what looks like a police state, really, where a violent protest broke out earlier, and police shot tear gas into a group -- a crowd of a group of protesters. Our producers are on the scene. We're checking on that breaking news.

Let's talk more now about the death of 18-year-old Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri, shot, killed at the hands of a police officer. Joining me now exclusively, a woman who says that she saw the whole thing as it happened, as it went down. Her name is Tiffany Mitchell. And she's also join -- she also joins us with her attorney, Peter Cohen.

Thank you so much, Tiffany, for joining us tonight. Peter, as well. We appreciate you. I'm going to start with you, Tiffany. So what did you -- you said that you were -- when did you arrive at the scene?

TIFFANY MITCHELL, WITNESS: I arrived at the scene whenever they were tussling through the window. It looked as if the kid was pulling away and officers pull him in.

LEMON: So you -- so almost at the beginning of the confrontation, but not right in the beginning.

MITCHELL: Yes.

LEMON: So explain to us. You were driving and then what you saw.

MITCHELL: So as I come up on the -- up on to it, I saw the officer pulling him in. And I saw him trying to pull away. I pulled out my phone to try to get a video because it just didn't look like. I don't know exactly what was going on, but I know it didn't look right for somebody to be wrassling [SIC] with the police through the police window.

But I didn't get the video, because a shot was fired through the window. So I tried to get out the way. As I pulled onto the side. The kid, he finally gets away, and he starts running.

As he runs, the police get out of his vehicle, and he follows behind him, shooting. And the kid body jerked as if he was hit from behind. And he turned around and he puts his hands up like this. And the cop continued to fire until he just dropped down to the ground, and his face just smacks the concrete.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And you saw all of this?

MITCHELL: Yes.

LEMON: So police have said that there was some sort of tussle at the car with the police officer and with Michael Brown, that they have said that Michael Brown tried to grab the weapon. Does it look like Michael was trying to get into the car to you or he was trying to get away?

MITCHELL: It looked as if he was trying to pull away. I saw his hand, like, pushing up against the vehicle as he was pulling off, trying to get away from the cop. LEMON: And so -- and then you heard a shot?

MITCHELL: Yes.

LEMON: And then you said Michael ran away from the car? Got loose?

MITCHELL: Yes, he finally gets away. He yanks away and he runs away from the cop, away from the vehicle. And the cop gets out of his vehicle and pursues him. Shooting.

LEMON: And so he's shooting. And then Michael, you said his body jerked and then he falls to the ground.

MITCHELL: No, he didn't fall to the ground. As his body jerked, when his body jerked, he turns around facing the cop and he puts his hands in the air. And that's when the cop continued to come up on him and shoot him. And so he fell down to the ground.

LEMON: Did you see a weapon by anyone other than the officer?

MITCHELL: No. Nobody else had a weapon besides the officer.

LEMON: How many shots did you hear or see fired?

MITCHELL: I didn't count the shots. But it was more than about five or six shots.

LEMON: And what did the officer look like?

MITCHELL: He was a white male, kind of tall, not too big. But yes, he was a white male.

LEMON: Did he say anything -- did anyone say anything, Michael or the police officer?

MITCHELL; No. I didn't hear anybody say anything at all.

LEMON: And then what did you do after that?

MITCHELL: I went upstairs on the balcony where I was on my way to pick up my employee. She was standing on top of the balcony, recording the afterwards. And she was just crying, and I was trying to talk to her. I called my fiance and told what happened and I called the news reporters for all of them to come out there so I could tell them what I saw. Because it just -- the whole thing wasn't right. So I just called everybody that I could.

LEMON: So how many officers -- how many officers were on the scene as this was going down? Was this just...

MITCHELL: It was only one officer and then one other officer pulled up, like, right after it happened.

LEMON: But only one officer was involved in the shooting?

MITCHELL: Yes. LEMON: Correct.

MITCHELL: Yes.

LEMON: How long-- one officer pulled up after. And then how long did it take other people to get there, other help, backup?

MITCHELL: It was minutes, within minutes other cops started pulling up. Because right after he shot him, he got on his -- his speaker and started calling other people.

LEMON: So, Tiffany, I want you to stick around because it must be quite shocking to witness something like this. I want to get more about your personal feelings. And I also want to talk to you more about what you think went on and why you said it was shocking for you to see it. We will be right back with more with an exclusive eyewitness. Another eyewitness has come forward in the Michael Brown shooting. And she joins us now on CNN. More right after this break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Back now with our breaking news here on CNN. We're keeping a close eye on Ferguson, Missouri, where there has been unrest. This is a fourth night really of unrest since 18-year-old Michael Brown was gunned down on the street by a police officer. That was Saturday during the day.

On the left you see peaceful protesters out there. On the right you see police and their gear, in their riot gear having to deal with some protesters. And they -- a crowd in which they had to shoot tear gas into.

Joining us now exclusively, we want to get back to our interview with another eyewitness to the shooting that has come forward. Her name is Tiffany Mitchell. And also with her, her attorney Peter Cohen.

And Peter, I'm going to speak to you a little bit later. But Tiffany, I just want to know, what is it like being in the community now? You heard me just now reporting on the unrest that's there and the tear gas that's being fired. What's it like living in that area?

MITCHELL: It's -- it's really weird. I really don't live in North County in the area. I live in the downtown area. And I try to kind of stay away from that. Like I did want to go to the candlelight vigil, but I didn't know how it would turn out. In the beginning, and then when I saw what happened afterwards, I was glad I didn't go. And I really try to stay out of, like the whole thing, really.

LEMON: Let's get back -- let's get back to what happened on Saturday. So you said you were going to pick up someone you work with or a friend. And that friend...

MITCHELL: Yes. I was on my way to pick up my employee, and I drove right into it, driving down her street. She lives right over where it happened.

LEMON: And she saw it?

MITCHELL: Her balcony is right in front of it.

LEMON: And Peter, she has come forward as a witness, as well. So there's another witness, eyewitness who is there with you now?

PAUL COHEN, ATTORNEY FOR TIFFANY MITCHELL: That is correct. Tiffany brought her with her tonight. They do work together so she did bring her, as well.

LEMON: And she has given a statement to police?

COHEN: Tiffany -- Tiffany gave a statement to St. Louis County detectives right after this happened.

MITCHELL: And Piaget did, too.

COHEN: Piaget did, also, proudly. And I had talked to Tiffany about that. She said the police did treat her well and were interested and didn't try to influence her story at all and were interested in getting -- getting the facts as she related them here, basically.

LEMON: What does Piaget tell you happened? What does she say to you?

COHEN: She essentially backs up what Tiffany said she saw it, and she was upset and shocked.

LEMON: She actually got a better view of the shooting, though, than Tiffany did, right, Tiffany?

MITCHELL: Yes, she did.

COHEN: Right.

LEMON: Tiffany, to witness something like this, and, you know, I saw -- we had the video last night here on CNN of Michael Brown's body laying [SIC] on the street. It had been covered. But many say he lay there for hours.

MITCHELL: He did.

LEMON: He lay there for a long time without being covered, and finally they did. Talk to me about how -- how things went down on the scene, and was he treated with respect?

MITCHELL: No, he wasn't. Whenever -- his family wasn't either. Whenever they came and they were trying to find out exactly what happened, they just kept pushing them off and pushing them off. Like they would keep moving the tape back farther and farther.

Like, when they came they said, "What happened to my baby?" And I was on the balcony and told them. I said, "Well, I saw everything." The police would just keep taping them off and off further away from me.

And then when the investigators came to talk to me, like they took me straight to the quiet room. They really didn't want me to talk to the family before I talked to them.

So like, the investigator that talked to me, he was really fair with me. He didn't try to switch up my story at all. But the cops that were on the scene that were dealing with the public, they were very rude to them. They didn't...

LEMON: Go ahead.

MITCHELL: They didn't want to tell them what happened at all, and they were just like -- they showed no kind of remorse for what happened to the kid at all.

LEMON: And listen, there is -- it's no secret. You can look at the website, the state website, and you can see the numbers there for people who are arrested. Many people believe that a lot -- a whole lot of racial profiling is going on in the St. Louis area. Not just in Ferguson.

What is -- what's the relationship? And you can speak to this, Peter, as well, either one of you. What is the relationship like there in the area between police and African-Americans, especially young black men, or black men in general?

COHEN: Well, I think it can be -- can be tense. I have a lot of African-American clients, and they consistently do relate problems that they have with the police. And I think -- I think everybody just wants -- you know, just wants to be treated on the same level, whether you're white or black or Hispanic, whatever your background.

And I think what I'm seeing with a lot of my African-American clients, particularly the younger ones, is they feel like they're not being treated as part of the community. And that's a concern, because I don't want people to be ostracized in the community.

And hopefully, you know, this event, some good can come out of it, will bring -- bring people closer, you know, and realize that there is -- there are some racial issues that we do still need to address.

LEMON: Right. If you're just tuning in, you're watching a CNN exclusive. This is another eyewitness who has come forward. Tiffany Mitchell, you see her there, obviously, on the left side of the screen. Her attorney, Peter Cohen, joins us as well.

We're following this and the breaking news happening in Missouri in Ferguson, Missouri, now. Police having to just shoot tear gas in a crowd of unruly protesters. We're going have much more on this, and also more with our interview right after the break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: We want to get back to our breaking news. Tear gas fired on protesters on another night of unrest in Ferguson, Missouri.

Joining us now is CNN's David Mattingly. He is on the scene. David, tell what's you're seeing. DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What we're seeing tonight is sort

of a repeat of what we've seen the last couple of nights. The crowds gather in the location of close to where the looting was going on. The crowds refuse to disperse when police move in, and then they fire the tear gas, and the crowd disperses.

That's what we're seeing tonight. A crew on the scene was describing what they saw as the crowd was moving into the streets. Police ordering them to move back and then launching the tear gas when the crowd did not move. There was a huge cloud of tear gas. You can see the video that we had from the scene there tonight, just blocking out all view of the crowd. And then police moving in to disperse everyone and to presumably send them back to wherever they started tonight.

But it has become almost a regular sight here ever since Sunday when we saw the looting that was going on in response to this shooting. So tonight, where it's difficult to judge the scope, because we couldn't exactly see how large the crowd was behind that cloud of tear gas, but it is becoming a very familiar sight here.

CAMEROTA: David, where you are right now, we see people behind you. Is that a peaceful protest that has begun since the tear gas, or were there two separate protests?

MATTINGLY: I am just outside the police headquarters here in Ferguson. This is a demonstration that goes on through the day and through much of the evening. It is peaceful. At least it has been the entire time that we've been watching it. People standing on the side of the road, holding signs, chanting. A lot of people driving by, blowing their horns in support. Most of the protesting and most of the demonstrating we see in this town has been peaceful.

But like I said, every night there's a large crowd that gathers in the area where the looting was going on. The crowd refuses to disperse immediately when police arrive. And that's when the teargas flies, and then the crowd disperses.

But for the most part, the crowds have been pretty much like what you see behind me. People expressing themselves and expressing themselves peacefully.

CAMEROTA: David, we understand that this has rocked the community. In fact, it was announced today that school, the beginning of school will be pushed back by days to next week to let the crowd or everyone there sort of come to terms with what happened and try to, I guess, cut down on the agitation. What is the mood of the town throughout the day like?

MATTINGLY: So much is in flux right now. The anger and the outrage that we saw erupting in the streets on Sunday night that turned violent. That outrage is still there. And while we have not seen a repeat of the violence of Sunday night, we are continuing to see the same things repeated over and over and over again with every single protest.

People are absolutely outraged by what they saw happen here. They're demanding answers. And answers probably more quickly than the investigation will allow. So there is also that building sense of frustration that people aren't going to hear what they need to quickly enough.

CAMEROTA: All right, David. Be careful, and please keep us posted as to what else happens this evening. Well will stay on it.

And the answer is what everyone wants. There will be unrest until people get answers of exactly what happened in that police car.

LEMON: Yes. And exactly what happened and not just what happened then, but also what happened afterwards, as you have been seeing here on CNN. We saw the body of Michael Brown laying [SIC] on the ground. You heard what the young lady said. They could have treated it with more respect.

And then also you saw there's video of the father, we believe the father going to the scene and police hustling them away. And they're just -- again, just trying to get answers. We're going to talk more about that in just a moment here on CNN.

But up next, a flag flies outside a house in New Jersey, Alisyn. Someone tweets that it is in support of ISIS, and the reaction goes viral.

And then later, the shocking toll of suicide in this country and fears that, in the wake of Robin Williams' death, there may be copycats.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)