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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Chaotic Shooting Protests; Reporters Detained; Ferguson Mayor Says Police Endangered by Anonymous Hacker Group; President Obama to Make Statement on Iraq and Ferguson

Aired August 14, 2014 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Ashleigh Banfield. It's Thursday, August the 14th, and welcome to LEGAL VIEW.

So much is happening at this hour and so much of it's happening live. We're going to expect to hear from President Obama in just a couple of minutes on the crisis unfolding in Iraq, as well as the unrest that's been unfolding right here at home in Ferguson, Missouri.

And also any second now Missouri's governor is expected to speak live. We're going to bring you special coverage of a rapidly moving and emotional story, the shooting of an unarmed 18-year-old Michael Brown and the violent crashes between police and protesters in Ferguson. There were 12 arrests last night and there were two police officers who were injured. The group Anonymous released the name of an officer that it claimed shot Brown. But Ferguson Police Chief Tom Jackson is telling CNN that that name is incorrect and not the officer involved in the shooting.

New cell phone video has emerged showing the moments after the shooting. Two witnesses say Brown did appear to tussle with the officer before he was killed, but they insist that he did not enter the police cruiser as authorities have claimed he did.

From the looks and the sounds of it, the clashes between protesters and police could get worse before they get any better. Our Ana Cabrera joins us live now from on the ground now in Ferguson, Missouri, with a look at what went down last night and how the stories from the people who watched Michael Brown get shot are strikingly similar.

So, Ana, start with the situation on the ground. I want to talk about what's happening this moment as we wait for the governor to speak live. And then just merge into the situation last night as well.

ANA CABRERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Ashleigh, we're waiting for the governor and the president, who are both supposed to make statements here in this hour. You can see behind me protesters are gathering on this location. We're right across the street from the police department. And we've seen protesters on this spot before. Right now people are peacefully assembled here. You can see they are standing around, cars are honking horns, some of them have signs. I spoke with a woman across the street who has an American flag also.

And what we're hearing, the overwhelming sentiment is that this protest has turned from not only a protest demanding answers and justice for the death of Michael Brown, but it's also a protest now about making sure they get a message across. They -- this is a community now and ethnicity in this community that's predominantly black, that feels like they have been oppressed and that their voices have been diminished and that they are being intimidated now by the law enforcement and other city leaders within this community. And so this is why the energy here and the outrage, the frustration, the anger still growing now five days after the death of Michael Brown, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: So, Ana, the situation behind you looks very quiet. And often times during the day, as we've been watching for these five days -

CABRERA: Yes.

BANFIELD: There are peaceful protests. There doesn't seem to be any volleys of anything from either side. And then by nightfall, the dynamic changes so incredibly. Are they the same people in the day as they are at night? What is the difference other than the darkness?

CABRERA: Many of these people are the same people who are protesting at night, but those night protests have been much larger. And I must say that those protests at night are in a different location. They're outside the Quit Trip (ph), where many believe that the incident really began. And that's a couple of miles across town. Again, a smaller group in front of the police department here.

But the biggest difference between what's happening during the day and what's happening at night is the show of force by the police and law enforcement agencies who turn out at night. Now, the police department, and I'm using that term loosely, it's the Ferguson Police Department, St. Louis County Police, State Highway Police that are all now helping to keep the peace, as they put it, here in the community of Ferguson. At night is when they bring out those armored vehicles, when we see police suit up in riot gear, when we have witnessed them pointing guns at the crowd, who, by and large, are initially peacefully assembled.

Now last night was a real flash point in this dialogue in this situation, as we heard from protesters that police actually used force first. This is according to the protesters. And many protesters, who repeated this story, saying they were fired upon with tear gas because -- simply because they would not leave the street when they were asked. Now police say they only fired after somebody lit a Molotov cocktail last night. So there continue to be two different story lines here that are only increasing the situation and really driving more divisiveness in this community, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: Ana Cabrera live for us on the ground. And a reminder, as you can see in the bottom right-hand corner of your screen as well, the Missouri governor is going to speak any moment from Ana's location in fact. So, Ana, stand by if you would for a moment. We'll jump right back in live as soon as the governor does begin to speak.

There's another issue that we want to get to as well, and that is that two journal who were covering the protests last night say they were arrested inside a local McDonald's restaurant while they were just doing their jobs. Wesley Lowery of "The Washington Post" and Ryan J. Reilly of "The Huffington Post," were never told why they were being detained except that they were, quote, "trespassing." Wesley captured some of the confrontation on video before he was cuffed. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm working on it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop videotaping. Now, let's grab our stuff and go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) right to video tape this here (ph).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hurry up. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please don't (INAUDIBLE) me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You see me working. Please do not tell me not to use my (INAUDIBLE) -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's time to go. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) could (ph) you please not wave a gun at me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're down to about 45 seconds. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) people are subject to arrest after I say the word (ph). (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, is the street (INAUDIBLE) -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm trying to ask him questions -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You don't have time to ask questions. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) can I move my car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can move your car if your car's out here. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is. That's what I was asking. You didn't have time to answer or you're (ph) just being mean?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) sir.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's a door over here. Let's go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm going to walk (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go. You can move. Let's go. Move.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's move. Let's move. Let's move this way. Here's - here's the door. This way or this way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Wesley Lowery, he's the reporter for "The Washington Post" who was behind that lens, joins me on the phone now live from Ferguson, Missouri.

Wesley, just walk me through this a little bit. It seemed to me the officer was being very, very clear, move out. The circumstances seemed quite exigent. Did it seem that way from your vantage point. What was the surrounding scenario?

WESLEY LOWERY, REPORTER, "THE WASHINGTON POST" (via telephone): The surrounding scenario was that there were two reporters sitting at a McDonald's. There was no protest outside. There was no riots outside. There was no imminent, clear danger whatsoever. Two reporters who had purchase meals from McDonald's, who had been working there for hours, who had been told initially that we did not have to leave.

Then that changed. All of a sudden there was an immediate evacuation. The two of us had already been recording, in part because when SWAT teams show up to evacuate a McDonald's, any responsible reporter would pull out their phone and start recording that. That's what we did. And, unfortunately, some of the officers took exception to that. At that point I was being gestured out with a large assault weapon. I tried to pack up my bag and people were (ph) questioning about, you know, how long that took. I'd say it was only, what, 30 seconds long. At the very end of the video he says we're down to about 45 seconds. And my arrest came about 5 seconds after the video cuts out. And that certainly wasn't 45 seconds, as you know.

And so - and so, no, I think that what we see in this case is we had officers who were upset that we had the audacity to have video phones that did not respect the rights of the - of, one, customers of a local establishment and, two, of journalists who were just - like I said, just recording and cooperating. I had many notebooks spread out. My computer was plugged in. I had to reach down and unplug it. I had pens. I had to collect everything into my bag. It was taking -- I was doing with one hand because I had to record the, you know, the officer who was waving a gun at me.

BANFIELD: So, Wesley, let me just take it from there for a moment because everything that the officer was doing, while it seemed very strategic and he seemed as though he were - he was in quite a hurry to get that place cleared out, something changed. Ultimately, as you reported in "The Washington Post," you were - you were assaulted. I've heard the words used, "assaulted." What happened when the recording stopped?

LOWERY: So at the end of that recording, as you can see at the very end there is some confusion. One officer is saying -- pointing me to one door. Another officer is pointing me to another door. I had asked them, you know, I -- in the process of cooperating and leaving, I had no intention of staying in this McDonald's. I want to go get work done. I collected my things. I have a rental car there sitting in the McDonald's parking lot. I'm asking them, I said, can I go get my car or do I need to walk? Can I get my car? We don't have time to answer that question. What do you mean you don't have time to answer the question? You have time to arrest me in the McDonald's but you don't have time to answer, can I go out this door to my car or not?

So we -- I'm put in this scenario and I'm asking them, what door can I walk out of? Two officers gave me two conflicting doors. And so I say, sirs, which door would you like me to walk out of? As I turned to go out the second door they'd given me, my bag begins to slip off my shoulder, at which point I say out loud, officers, my bag is slipping, I need to stop for one second to readjust it. Again, I'm holding my phone so it's -- everything is falling. And at that point they say, all right, let's take him. And they throw me up against a fountain soda (ph) machine and told me I am resisting arrest, even as I say, officers, you can arrest me. I'm not going to resist. My arms are behind my back. You are resisting. You are resisting. You are resisting. And so, no, I don't think that - I don't think that this is something that journalists should be subjected to while sitting at McDonald's where they've bought lunch.

BANFIELD: And, Wesley, the mayor is standing by. I'm going to ask him about that. If you could, hold on for just a moment. I just want to let you know that Wesley and his colleague ultimately were released and the mayor - or rather the police chief of Ferguson has already, in several accounts, said that it was wrong and that he was going to make a call and ultimately in "The Washington Post," if you want to take a look at Wesley's story, he said that that's what the officers who released them from their holding cell said, that they were being done a favor.

So again I want to bring in the mayor of Ferguson, James Knowles.

You're very kind to join us again. I know this has been a tough time for you, Mayor Knowles, but I just want to get your reaction to two reporters with laptops in a McDonald's, a long way away from any noise or protests being roughed up like that and being arrested and thrown in the back of a paddy wagon. Who is running the show here?

MAYOR JAMES KNOWLES, FERGUSON, MISSOURI: Well, I mean the show is ultimately being run right now by the St. Louis County Police Department. So as far as the Ferguson Police having any kind of command over the scene or the scenario, we don't -- we're not - we're not in charge. But, no, this is a situation that's grown outside of our city limits. So the county police have been in charge, you know, tactically since Sunday.

BANFIELD: I just don't understand, though, the tactics that are being used. Having a militant-like presence going into a McDonald's where nothing seemed to be going on. There didn't seem to be any crisis. There didn't seem to be any need to push reporters doing their duty who identified - well, at least one identified himself, Wesley identified himself to the arresting officers. I just don't understand what the mission is? So from your perch, could you please tell me, what are the different agencies out on the street being told to do?

KNOWLES: Well, I mean, right now, I mean they're being told to, you know, try to create a safe environment out there. You know, as far as this incident and the way it occurred, I've only seen some of the videos and heard some of the stories that have gone on. I was not there, obviously, and it does not seem fair to those reporters that it happened that way. I realize that it's chaos out there just as much for the officers as it is for the protesters but I'm not sure what was going on there.

BANFIELD: Yes, and I agree, the chaos can be very troubling and there can be a great fog in the chaos of riots, et cetera.

KNOWLES: Absolutely.

BANFIELD: But you've got to agree, Mr. Mayor, there was no chaos in the McDonald's, there was no chaos near that McDonald's.

KNOWLES: Well, that -- just a couple doors down from that McDonald's, they burned down a building, so, last night. So I don't know.

BANFIELD: Several nights ago. Yes. OK.

KNOWLES: No, no last night.

BANFIELD: Last night.

KNOWLES: Last night there was another building burned. So I don't know what happened.

BANFIELD: So are you saying this was a - this was a - this was because of the safety of the people inside the McDonald's? Are you going on the record saying that they were cleared out of these because there was a safety issue that the McDonald's was at risk for the same kind of vandalism?

KNOWLES: I have no idea. I wasn't there. So, you know, again, all I can say is the facts of last night was a -

BANFIELD: You're not getting the report?

KNOWLES: Spending a lot more time with you than I am getting other reports, so -

BANFIELD: And the reason you're with us is because we need the answers to these questions. It's pretty critical stuff. I mean we have a -

KNOWLES: I understand.

BANFIELD: We have a community that is making lead headlines in every paper on every national newscast every day for five days. These are critical questions.

KNOWLES: Right. Well, again, you know, after I leave this interview, we'll be going in to meet with the St. Louis County prosecutor to talk more about the -- this issue. So, you know, as the information comes through, you know, down the chain of command from the county to our chief, and he keeps me informed, you know, we'll, obviously, release that information. But I think our chief earlier already discussed the situation, said that the scenario appeared regrettable.

BANFIELD: Yes.

KNOWLES: And we will make sure that reporters are treated in a proper fashion because we want you to be there to give the entire story.

BANFIELD: Yes. I mean it is a First Amendment issue. And even the, you know, the governor of your state has weighed in on this critical need to have transparency and to have the press, you know, able to do their jobs and inform the nation as to what's going on in your jurisdiction.

I also just want to bring something up. I don't know if you know about this, but the congressman for your community, Lacy Clay (ph), has expressed some concern about the investigation, even though the investigation has been passed from the Ferguson Police Department to the county, to St. Louis County. The congressman has concerns even about the county and is even suggesting resting the control of that investigation away. Do you know anything about this?

KNOWLES: Well, I mean, there's a parallel investigation being done right now by the Justice Department and the FBI. I mean -- so there's three different agencies with their eyes on this - on the information. I don't see that -- how that's going to change anything to just take St. Louis County out of the - out of the scenario. So what I can tell you is that there are three independent agencies -- the Justice Department, the FBI and St. Louis County looking at this. I'm very confident that as they work together and draw their own conclusions that once that's done we'll release that information in a timely fashion and hopefully at that point move on towards achieving justice for this individual.

BANFIELD: One other question I wanted to ask you about. All morning long there was a trail of threats being made by the group Anonymous, that if they didn't have the name of the officer released, they would release in dribs and drabs the name of the officer, the identity, the address, and the photo.

And now we're beginning to hear at least from the Ferguson police department on record that the name they released is, in fact, wrong. Can you confirm that as well?

KNOWLES: Yes, in fact, there's been a lot of rumors from people locally, people who are familiar with our police department making assumptions. So far there's been no information that's been credible that's been correct.

They have spray painted the names of our officers asking for violence. None of those officers have anything to do with what went on, and so it's unfortunate all around.

BANFIELD: Just one other quick question, the person who was named, there have been varying reports that he's not even an officer with the Ferguson police or the county police.

Is that person in any danger because of this mass release by Anonymous? Do you know anything about him?

KNOWLES: Absolutely. I don't know anything about him, but anybody right now who is named is absolutely in danger, and so any name they put online, any address, any phone number is obviously going to create danger for that individual.

So people here are looking to do harm. They are not looking for justice. People who are looking to do that kind of violence are not looking for justice, the peaceful protesters maybe, but obviously not the people trying from Anonymous.

BANFIELD: Mayor Knowles, it's good of you to join us. I appreciate it. Thanks very much.

And I just want to let our viewers know that right behind you, sir -- I know the images are a bit unusual -- there have been protesters wandering in front of the camera lens behind the mayor.

Mayor Knowles, thanks for with us.

The screen is showing on the bottom right-hand corner there that the president is expected to speak soon. He's running a little bit late, but we have our live eye trained on it. We're going to bring it as soon as we can.

In the meantime, we're continuing to watch the unfolding situation in Missouri, especially who started this, especially last night. There have been claims the police started. There have been claims the protesters started it.

We're going to get to the bottom of a lot of it in a moment.

The president, coming next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR, "THE SITUATION ROOM": I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world.

We're waiting for President Obama. He's on vacation, but he's breaking his vacation for a little while to address the nation right now, what's going on in Iraq, also what's going on in Ferguson, Missouri. That's just outside of St. Louis.

Our senior White House correspondent, Jim Acosta, is on Martha's Vineyard covering the president right now. They made this announcement about a half an hour or so ago. The president wants to make this joint -- this dual statement, shall we say, on Iraq and Ferguson. Is that right?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf. And we're reporting to you now from inside the cafeteria at the school here on Martha's Vineyard. It's been transformed into a briefing room for the president.

The podium is set. The presidential seal is on the podium. He'll be here in about 10 to 15 minutes, we're told. That's the latest guidance from White House officials.

But, yes, Wolf, we do expect to hear the president talk about the situations in Ferguson and in Iraq.

As for Ferguson, we can tell you that late last night he got a briefing from his attorney general, Eric Holder, and from his senior adviser, Valerie Jarrett. He was expected to have another briefing later on this it morning.

In the meantime, though, Wolf, the White House has been tweeting about the president's developments out here and there's pressure building on this president to make some comments about the situation in Ferguson.

Last night the White House spokesman, Eric Schultz, tweeted about a party the president was at with the first lady and Clintons. In response to that tweet, there was a torrent of tweets from around the country, from around the world, probably, really sort of furious with the president that he had not made a statement on what is happening in Ferguson.

So I think the White House is feeling some pressure to talk about the police shooting death of Michael Brown, the teen who was unarmed and was shot by police. We'll hear if the president has spoken with the governor of Missouri, Jay Nixon, perhaps.

As for the situation in Iraq, that's also a critical situation. It was thought as of just yesterday when the deputy national security adviser, Ben Rhodes, came out here to the school to talk to reporters that perhaps the president might authorize some sort of rescue mission on Mount Sinjar to try to retrieve those refugees who have been huddled there for days, trying to escape those ISIS militants.

We now know, obviously, from hearing from Barbara Starr and others in the Pentagon that that appears to be off the table. The U.S. military appears to have made some decent progress in suppressing the ISIS targets and relieving that situation, so we expect to hear the president talk about that as well.

We haven't heard as to whether or not -- we don't expect him to take any questions, but we haven't heard for sure one way or another. But, Wolf, he's been known to say beforehand through officials that there wouldn't be questions and then take a couple of questions.

And I think it's important to note, Wolf, he's on vacation right now in Martha's Vineyard, but this is his second on-camera statement in just four days. That's almost a pace that we don't see back in Washington at the White House. It's a working vacation more than an actual vacation.

BLITZER: Yeah, the president is never really 100 percent on vacation. Any president, whenever they go, they have national security advisers, top domestic advisers.

Eric Holder, the attorney general, he's there supposedly on vacation on Martha's Vineyard, as well? Susan Rice, the national security adviser? Are they there on Martha's Vineyard as well?

ACOSTA: Susan Rice is here on Martha's Vineyard. And we know just last night, Wolf, that the president was at a party for Vernon Jordan, the longtime Democratic strategist. The president and the first lady, he was with Hillary Clinton, President Clinton at this party last night. There have been pictures tweeted out.

We never got a picture or confirmation as to whether or not the president and Hillary Clinton hugged it out. As you'll recall, there was that disagreement between the president and the secretary of state. All of that now that seems rather trivial when you consider what's happening in Ferguson, Missouri, the unrest that we've seen there for the last several days.

In addition to that, Wolf, reporters who have been detained by police, had their constitutional rights infringed upon, arrested for no reason, it seems, it will be interesting to see, Wolf, if the president has something to say about that.

There have been some concerns in that community, as you know, about the militarization of that police department. Claire McCaskill, the senator from Missouri, just put out a statement in the last several minutes, saying that she wants to demilitarize that situation in Ferguson.

So really the problems for this president seem to be piling up on top of one another, even as he's out here on Martha's Vineyard. They did not foresee, obviously, the situation that unfolded in Ferguson before they came out here, and it's just made his vacation out here that much more difficult, Wolf.

BLITZER: Yeah, and what's going on in Iraq, obviously, further complicating what's the president's agenda.

I think Eric Holder is on Martha's Vineyard, the attorney general. I know Valeria Jarrett, the president's senior adviser, is there as well. So he does have many of his top advisers with him, and maybe we'll see some of them in the course of the president's statement.

Let's take a quick break. We'll await the president. He's about to make a major statement on Iraq and what's going on in Ferguson, outside of St. Louis, much more of our special coverage, right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)