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ISIS Beheads American; Grand Jury Hears Testimony Today; Brown Family meets with Holder

Aired August 20, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: And here we go. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

And we will take to you Ferguson, Missouri, in just a moment here, where we now know Attorney General Eric Holder is right now. He is meeting with leaders within that community.

But first, a chilling message in a cruel and absolutely horrific video here showing the sickening execution of an American. ISIS is uploading the footage of kidnapped American journalist James Foley. You see him on his knees next to a masked man. And we're showing you only these images, as you're about to see here, moments prior to his brutal beheading.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Any attempt by you, Obama, to deny the Muslims their rights of living in safety under the Islamic Caliphate will result in the bloodshed of your people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: That was the -- that was the British accented voice of the man standing next to Foley. The terrorists say they executed Foley in retaliation, specifically for the U.S. air strikes in Iraq. And now ISIS is threatening to kill another American prisoner, another American journalist, also seen in this video, if these air strikes do not stop.

We just heard within the past hour or so from President Obama speaking about that video for the very first time. Here he was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No faith teaches people to massacre innocence. No just God would stand for what they did yesterday and what they do every single day. ISIL has no ideology of any value to human beings. Their ideology is bankrupt. They may claim out of expediency that they are at war with the United States or the west, but the fact is they terrorize their neighbors and offer them nothing but an endless slavery to their empty vision and the collapse of any definition of civilized behavior. And people like this ultimately fail. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: And now we have sound from Foley's parents. They talked about the loss of their son just a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, just that we're very proud of Jim. You know, he was a courageous, fearless journalist. A very compassion American. I mean the best of America. And he always hoped that this would -- he would come home. That was his hope. And he sustained all the others who were with him really with that hope.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But before coming home, he wanted to support his fellow inmates. He was always the first guy in line. The one who would take the bullet first. The one who would speak to the guards about inequities in food. He was never a slacker. He was always the standard, the bearer, the stand-up guy, you know, which is his passion. That's what he wanted to do for others. That's what he wanted to do for his fellow journalists.

We also - we also appreciate the tremendous number of prayers that we've - we've received and Jimmy received throughout all of our communities. They -- Jimmy had said in Libya, and we're very sure now that he could feel the prayers. And we think his strength came from God - strength came from God.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, we know it did. As a matter of fact, we are the only American family that has never received a letter from Jim. They apparently were all confiscated. So the last hostage to come out -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'll get it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Daniel (ph) - she (ph) memorized a letter from Jim. And within hours of his freedom, he was good enough to call and voice that letter to us. And it just spoke of his yearning to see all of us once again. Jim was very close to the family, too. And his niece and nephews. You know he was -- but so he really expressed his love in that.

Honey, please shut it off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So anyway, so we're very grateful for that. But we -- as John said, so many people were praying for Jim. And I really think that's what gave Jim an unusual courage. Jim just could feel the prayers. He was strong, courageous, loving to the end. I mean we just hardly recognize our little boy. I mean he just -- he was just a hero, you know -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you know from the videos that his last words were, I wish I had more time to see my family.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So, Jim had a big heart and just - I just -- you know, we -- that's what we shared with President Obama, you know. We just pray that Jim's death can bring our country together in a stronger way, and with the values that Jim holds dear.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Held dear.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Held dear. Jim would never want us to hate or be bitter. And we cannot do that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you shut that thing off.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And so we are just very proud of Jimmy. And we are praying for the strength to love like he did. And to stay courageous and to keep fighting for all the people that he was fighting for. And again, to pray for mercy for the remaining American hostages.

QUESTION: Do you have a message for the people behind Jim's death?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We beg compassion.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And mercy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We beg compassion and mercy of Jim's captors, for Steven Sotloff and for the other captors. We just beg mercy. They were - they're not - they never hurt anybody. They were trying to help. And there's no reason for their slaughter.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jim was just innocent. And they knew it. They knew that Jim was just a symbol for our country. And it's that hatred that Jim was against. Jim was there to hear the truth and bear witness to the love and the suffering, the hopes of the people, to be free, like we are. And they knew that. So, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So we've done this before. So let her rip. We'll --

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) speech that he was forced to give (INAUDIBLE) -

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In the what? Yes. Oh.

QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE). How (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know, I mean, all the brothers. I mean Jim was the oldest. Jim was just so loved. I mean he was the big brother. And one of the reasons he was drawn to conflict journalism was because of his brothers in the military. He -- as a matter of fact, one of his first assignments was in Afghanistan, where his Air Force brother had -- was stationed at the time. And so I think Jim wanted to be there. He wanted to be there where John was. He wanted to cover what was happening at the human level. So --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Actually before that he was with the Indiana National Guard in Iraq. It was the largest single-state contingent sent. And he was able to write articles that would humanize the soldiers and actually were sent back to their local newspapers. And the parents of these soldiers were so grateful because they had some news about their children. And again, it's a -- there was a humanizing nature of Jimmy. Yes, there's a war, yes there's conflict, but there are people involved, you know, and there are feelings involved and there's sacrifice involved. And he felt that that was worth sharing. And I couldn't agree more.

QUESTION: Your other son is also -

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Pardon.

QUESTION: Your other son in also in the military?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Three.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We had four sons. We have three sons. This is - Michael's the second oldest. The other two are in the military.

And one other thing -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have a Navy nurse also.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And we have a Navy nurse. But - but -

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's not a son.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: To speak - to speak to -

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So you've been listening to the parents of James Foley, who was the victim of that brutal beheading at the hands of that ISIS militant, that the video has now been made public. And just if I may, think for a minute of the strength between that mother and father and one of those brothers to stand there in front of multiple members of the media and speak about their son. And just a couple of things I would like to point out. They mentioned, you know, he was in journalism for a reason, very passionate about it. Was first in line. He said he would - the father said he would take the bullet for any of his colleagues. He wanted to tell the human stories. He wanted to shine light on the truth that was happening, specifically in the Middle East. We know he covered stories in Iraq. We know he was in Afghanistan. He was actually captured some years ago in Libya for a little while. And also Iraq.

And then just finally hearing the father's voice certainly crack just a little bit when he said -- reiterating his son's final words in that video, he said James Foley said I wish I had more time.

So let's go to Nick Paton Walsh. He's our correspondent - our senior international correspondent live in Baghdad right now.

And, Nick, I don't know how much of that, you know, news conference you were able to hear from the parents of James Foley, but, I mean, what a tremendous human being - son, brother, journalist.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Certainly and putting himself on the line to report on the fate of Muslims in Syria when he was first abducted in November 2012. An important point to remember given the fierce rhetoric the ISIS militants espouse claiming to be the protectors of the Muslim faith. He was first abducted reporting on the extraordinary violence of a war that's been working across Syria now for three years.

We should also, you know, point out things have changed substantially since that time. Back in November 2012, where he may have been picked up by criminalized gangs or fractious parts of the Syrian insurgency, he's now somehow, in nearly two years, ended up in the hands of these ISIS militants who put out that video, deeply chilling, and I think almost ruthlessly professionally put together. The high-definition video they used to give people such a clear view on the horrors they perpetrate. Deeply chilling for anyone who comes across it on their multiple Twitter feeds.

But hearing those parents there, the compassion with which they spoke, the desire for forgiveness for that man with the British accent who stood next to him with a knife and decapitated him, an extraordinarily powerful statement from them.

Brooke.

BALDWIN: Parents begging for compassion and mercy from ISIS. Nick Paton Walsh, thank you so much, in Baghdad for us. And we'll talk about the other freelance journalist seen in that video, Steven Sotloff, coming up a little later this hour.

But that chilling video released by ISIS, it begins with the on-screen words, "a message to America." What is the message? Let me bring in representative Adam Schiff. He's the Democrat from California and he is a member of the Intelligence Committee.

Congressman Schiff, welcome.

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D), CALIFORNIA: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Let's talk about the message here. I mean what - what do you think ISIS is telling America by beheading James Foley, you know, announcing -- showing the execution as they did, and furthermore, saying that the life of now American Steven Sotloff depends on President Obama.

SCHIFF: Well, they're attempting to use this horrible image of this beheading to terrorize people in the United States, to try to, I guess, intimidate the White House, which it won't succeed in doing. On the one hand, I think they've got conflicting objectives. They want to stop the air bombardment, which has been the first thing that really set them back. They are in retreat as a result of our air campaign and the combination of Kurdish and Iraqi special forces. So on the one hand they want to stop that.

On the other hand, they conversely want to pull us in. Part of al Qaeda did before them, and part of what ISIL wants to do, is draw America into the fight with them. That aggrandizes them. So I think the president has to be very cautious in reacting to this. you know, I don't think it's going to change the administration's game plan. We're still going to be strategic about where we apply force and I think we really need to be.

BALDWIN: You know, you point out the U.S. won't be intimidated. That -- the former head of the CIA did this interview this morning and he said three little words, "mark the date." He said "mark the date" as if perhaps changes - changes are coming. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE MORELL, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: I think what the - ISIS is trying to do here, Nora, is intimidate the United States into backing off of the attacks that we've done the last several weeks. And I think our response should be and our response will be to not do that. In fact, we should - we should pick up the pace here. The definition of terrorism, Nora, is political violence. Violence for political effect. So we should mark this date down because this is ISIS' first terrorist attack against the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Congressman Schiff, I know, you know, you say the president has to be cautious, but let me just ask you specifically, what should the U.S. response be? Should it be retaliation? We know the U.S. is already bombing ISIS in Iraq. Do you think the U.S. should be bombing ISIS in Syria?

SCHIFF: Well, I don't think we should go to bombing ISIS in Syria over the killing of this journalist. There may be strategic reasons down the road why select targets are necessary to hit. I don't think we're there yet. Syria and Iraq are two very different circumstances.

BALDWIN: What would get us there?

SCHIFF: Well, you know, right now we have a government that we can work with in Iraq. We have a Kurdish military that we can help support. We don't have those elements in Syria. And I don't see that changing any time soon. But there may be a fight and it goes on near the Syria and Iraq border. The military equation may change in Syria where air strikes are either necessary or desirable.

But I don't think we're there yet, and I think the president is going to have to resist efforts, and I think he is, to become fully entangled in the civil war in Syria and in the conflict in Iraq. We need to play a supportive role. And I think, Brooke, we also have to understand that regardless of what we do, whether we strike in the air now or we don't, ISIL has made it clear, they want to attack us and attack us in the homeland. So that's regardless of whether we go after them from the air. And that can't be a deterrent whatsoever.

BALDWIN: Right, which is frightening in and of itself. We talked to a terrorist analyst who's been talking about that specifically, targeting the west, targeting Europe and perhaps closer, closer to all of us. Congressman Adam Schiff, thank you so much for your time today on CNN. We really appreciate it.

SCHIFF: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: And just ahead here, Attorney General Eric Holder is right now in Ferguson, Missouri, as we hear witnesses may appear before a grand jury today, looking into Michael Brown's death, even though their account seemed to be drastically different. We'll talk to Michael Brown's family lawyer about what's going on behind the scenes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

We take to you Ferguson, Missouri, here. And we can now report that the nation's top law enforcer, Attorney General Eric Holder, is now there over a killing that officially is still not labeled a crime. But that could change based upon what this local grand jury does, what they decide. Today, that grand jury is hearing testimony on this officer shooting of Michael Brown. And we're also now learning it may be mid-October before that panel gets through all of the evidence. So if Officer Darren Wilson is charged, his arrest may not happen until then.

No doubt, Attorney General Eric Holder is watching all of the local movements as his office is deciding if federal charges are warranted. Today he plans to meet with leaders in this community while checking in on the investigation. And just timing wise, we know that Eric Holder's visit comes one day after a night of progress in Ferguson. While not fully peaceful, there were 47 arrests after a bottle of water was tossed. Police leaders say it was a turning point for the better after 11 straight nights of protest.

CNN's Don Lemon is live once again for us in Ferguson.

And, Don, St. Louis County Prosecutor Robert McCulloch says the grand jury will hear from eyewitnesses. The first one to come forth is Michael Brown's friend, Dorian Johnson, who was there walking with him before he was shot. What - remind us of his version of events.

DON LEMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, he says that, obviously, there was a struggle, that he ran away. He believed his friend was gunned down. And as he said, it didn't have to happen.

Several new developments that we want to talk to you about, at least three, and I want to get it in quickly here. And the Brown family attorney, one of the attorneys is here, Anthony Gray, to talk about that.

I want to talk first about the attorney general being in town. The family, the mom and dad, meeting with him, or on their way to meet with him as we speak.

ANTHONY GRAY, ATTORNEY FOR MICHAEL BROWN'S FAMILY: That is true. That is true.

LEMON: OK. So how - what - how long - or do you know if they're with him and what do they expect to learn from him?

GRAY: Well, I anticipate that they will be getting together today. I think there was agreement on both sides to come together for a meeting, a very private and confidential meeting. And I fully anticipate that that's taken place. Probably as we speak or in the process of being taken place.

LEMON: OK. We'll talk about him in just a little bit, because he is a federal witness. But anyone from your team meeting with the attorney general?

GRAY: Not from the legal team, no.

LEMON: Not from the legal team.

GRAY: It's just going to be the attorney general and the parents.

LEMON: OK.

GRAY: And they're going to meet privately together and there will be no attorneys in the room or anybody else, for that matter, as I understand it.

LEMON: And you won't be meeting with the special county -- with the special counsel, the grand jury?

GRAY: I will not be meeting with the grand jury, no.

LEMON: OK. OK. So let's talk now about Darren Wilson, the cop, the police officer. He has been invited to speak, to be a witness.

GRAY: That - I understand that the prosecutor has extended him an invitation to present him -- his information before the grand jury. That is correct.

LEMON: That's all the information you know about that. Do you know if he's accepted it?

GRAY: That's all I - I do not know if he has accepted that invitation. No, I do not.

LEMON: OK. So one of the federal witnesses we spoke to his attorney, Freeman Bosley. The federal witness is Dorian Johnson, right?

GRAY: Yes.

LEMON: He said he would not grant us interviews because Dorian is a witness. And is there some concern to you about Dorian as a witness because he's a friend, he saw it and everyone thought he would be on Mike - or Big Mike's side, as they say.

GRAY: Sure.

LEMON: I want you to take a listen quickly to his first interview here. It was on "AC 360" with Wolf Blitzer. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Do you understand that some people may question your client's credibility about what he's saying, because if he did not mention what happened in the convenience store, that he may be leaving something out that happened at the scene (INAUDIBLE).

FREEMAN BOSLEY, ATTORNEY FOR EYEWITNESS DORIAN JOHNSON: That may be the case. I'll admit to that. But at the end of the day, that's just one thing to be taken into the overall scheme of things.

LEMON: Yes.

BOSLEY: And at the end of the day, I think fair-minded people are going to conclude that the officer used excessive force when he killed Mike Brown.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Did Michael ever try to get the weapon that the police officer had?

DORIAN JOHNSON, EYEWITNESS TO MICHAEL BROWN SHOOTING: No, sir, that's incorrect. At no point in time did they struggle over the weapon, because the weapon was already drawn on us. So we were more trying to get away out of the angle or aim of the weapon besides going towards the weapon, because it was drawn on us already.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK, just to explain, I meant to -- we meant for those to go the opposite way. The first interview with Wolf Blitzer where he's saying that there was no struggle for a gun. And then later I asked him about credibility, his attorney about credibility, because he did not tell Wolf Blitzer or anyone that he - that there was a robbery at the convenience store. Although his attorneys have said that he did mention it to federal investigators, to the FBI. So in that - and there are reports now that he's possibly saying that there was a struggle with the gun, unconfirmed reports. Are you concerned about his credibility, that, in fact, it may hurt your client?

GRAY: No, I'm not. On the key aspects of what happened on that Saturday afternoon, Dorian is consistent with the other eyewitnesses to whom he has no connection. These individuals do not know each other, from what I understand, from a can of paint (ph).

LEMON: It has always been said that there was some struggle. The first witness who we spoke to on CNN said that there was a struggle. It looked like to her that it was arm wrestling. The second witness we spoke to on CNN said the same thing. So there's never been any dispute that there was some sort of struggle between Mike and the police -- Mike Brown and the police officers, correct?

GRAY: That -- from what I understand, I haven't heard or reviewed these statements, but I will give you that, that there is perhaps some indication that there was a struggle in the beginning. Yes.

LEMON: Right. But then -- but is there any indication that there was a struggle for the gun? That Mike Brown got ahold of the officer's gun? GRAY: Not that I'm aware of. I have not heard a statement that makes

that claim. So I cannot speak to that.

LEMON: OK. So, again, the family is meeting with Attorney General Eric Holder. We'd love to have you back to talk about it, because I know that you'll be meeting with the family a little bit later on and we'd like some insight into that. Thank you, Anthony Gray.

GRAY: No problem, Don. Thank you.

LEMON: We appreciate you joining us here on CNN.

GRAY: Appreciate you.

LEMON: Thank you.

And there's a lot of developments happening here still on the ground in Ferguson, Missouri, Brooke, and we're going to follow them as, of course, until there is some sort of resolution. But as you said, it could be October before this grand jury really comes to any sort of resolution about anything.

BALDWIN: Yes. Yes. And you bring up issues of witness credibility. We'll talk about that with lawyers coming up. Don, thank you so much for your reporting.

You know some critics, they're calling for the prosecutor overseeing this investigation, as we've have told you, to recuse himself, to leave the case because of his past, relationships with law enforcement, what happened to his father. But he has a message today, telling the governor of the state of Missouri to man up. What does that mean? We'll talk to our legal experts, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Just about the bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

A major question surrounding this investigation into Michael Brown's death, will it be fair? Right now, a lot of folks in the Ferguson community, they do not trust that it will be. And one reason being, the county prosecutor on this case. Some people in Ferguson believe this man, Robert McCulloch, has a bias because of his family's ties to the police department, to law enforcement. There, you're looking at them, a number of people protesting outside of his office today demanding he recuse himself, demanding that he step aside.

This is all very important because it is McCulloch's office that is presenting evidence to a grand jury and it's the grand jury who will consider the case, you know, behind closed doors and decide whether Officer Darren Wilson should be charged. McCulloch has promised he will be fair, but when it comes to calls for his removal, he told a morning radio show today that he wishes Missouri's governor would quote/unquote, "man up" and make a decision.