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President Obama Punts On Immigration Reform - For Now; U.S. Military Launches Fresh Air Strikes In Iraq; Media Blackout Plays Into ISIS' Hands; ISIS Targets, Recruits Women

Aired September 06, 2014 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, everyone. You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Poppy Harlow joining you today from New York.

President Obama is punting on taking executive action on immigration reform at least for right now. No action he says until after the November midterm elections. That being confirmed this afternoon from the White House. And powerful people on all sides of the immigration debate are reacting. Our Erin McPike is at the White House. She will join me in just a moment.

First, though, I want to go to Florida Senator Bill Nelson. He joins me on the phone. Thank you for being with us, Senator.

SEN. BILL NELSON (D), FLORIDA (via phone): Good afternoon.

HARLOW: You support the president's move. You came out with this statement today saying it's a good idea. You said there is no way anybody was going to listen to an informed debate on immigration while House Republicans are scared of tea party members before the election. But this is something the president vowed to do on June 30th before the end of the summer.

NELSON: Well, Poppy, you have to be practical. Now, I'm one that supports total immigration, comprehensive immigration reform. We've passed it in the Senate. I voted for it. And, of course, I want to see it come about. It's the right thing to do. But we've only got two months until the election. And I think the president was correct to hold off. If we can't get the Congress read specifically the House of Representatives to move in the lame-duck session right after the election, then the president needs to go ahead and use his executive authority to do as much as he can.

HARLOW: I want to read you a response that we got from Christina Jimenez of united We Dream. She said this quote "the president's latest broken promise is another slap to the face of the Latino and immigrant community." There are some obviously that support this. And there are others that are disappointed, that wanted to see executive action. There are others like speaker John Boehner who wants to see no executive action taken at all and this abandoned completely. What is your reaction to what Miss Jimenez said in terms of her response to this?

NELSON: Well, if she is one of the dreamers, I certainly understand the emotion because a number of those dreamers are in my state of Florida. They're kids that know no different. They think they are American. They came here as small children. They've been educated. And then they suddenly find that their parents were not legal and, therefore, they are not either. And I think the president has already done some executive action, stopping the processing of dreamers from being sent back to the original homeland of their parents.

However, I understand her disappointment. A day delay is another day of disappointment. That's understandable. But the practical politics is we need to wait until after the election. Let's see if we can get something going in the lame-duck session. And if not, the president can use his full executive authority.

HARLOW: Senator Bill Nelson of Florida joining us on the phone. Thank you for joining us during your weekend, sir. We appreciate it.

NELSON: Have a great day.

HARLOW: You as well.

Key Republicans are slamming the president's decision to delay this executive action on immigration. House speaker John Boehner says the decision to simply delay smacks of raw politics. This is part of a larger statement he issued today. He frankly wants the president to abandon taking executive action altogether.

Let's go to Erin McPike at the White House. Erin, what's the reaction you're hearing outside of Boehner and certainly some Mr. Detail on how he reacted very quickly to this?

ERIN MCPIKE, CNN GENERAL ASSIGNMENT CORRESPONDENT: Well, Poppy, we're also hearing from a number of groups who support immigration reform, and I want to show you some of the language that they are using. It's the service employees international union, America's voice and fair immigration reform movement and they're using words like we're deeply disheartened, we're fairly disappointed. Somebody else said it was a breathtakingly harsh movement or motion by the president.

I also want to read you this one comment. They say we advocates didn't made the reform promise; we just made the mistake of believing it, Poppy. So essentially, a lot of Latinos here feel abandoned by President Obama.

HARLOW: And when you talk about the politics of all of this, I mean, you had, you know, White House officials coming out and saying it's too big of an issue to allow it to be used as a tool to get votes. You are talking about the key contest states in terms of November elections for certain democratic senators who clearly, you know, this could have -- could have hurt to see executive action taken. Other people say, look, it could help. But when you look at what John Boehner said, he wants to see the president abandon this altogether, but certainly not supporting the president even in terms of delaying it.

MCPIKE: Well, right. And, look, one thing that we're hearing from the White House is that they thought simply by making some sort of action on an immigration reform in the next two months would inflame the right wing and Republicans would come out to vote more. And they were -- they're obviously afraid of losing the Senate. And they think just by holding this off for another two months they're going to do no harm to democratic candidates. And that's really the goal here to keep the Senate and they think by delaying this past midterm elections, they have a better chance of doing that, too, Poppy.

HARLOW: And so, we'll see what happens after the elections as we see as Bill Nelson said will we see comprehensive reform passed by Congress, are we going to see the president take action. Important to note here, the White House is saying we're not not doing it, we're just putting it off and it will happen after November if necessary.

Erin McPike, thank you. Appreciate it.

Well, we just got confirmation a few minutes ago that U.S. military forces launched fresh air strikes today against more is positions in Iraq. This video that I'm showing you is not from those most recent strikes to be clear. But these strikes were from prior in the same area. CENTCOM said that today's strikes were on ISIS-controlled humvees and armored personnel carriers and trucks with machine guns mounted on them. This makes a total of 133 U.S. ire strikes so far against that militant group across Iraq.

And while the United States is hitting is from the air Kurdish fighters are trying to pound them from the ground. Our Anna Coren reports from the front lines.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On a dirt road less than an hour from Kurdistan's capital, a long convoy of Peshmerga head towards enemy territory. They're gearing up for a major mission to eradicate ISIS across a 30-kilometer front.

This is 4:30 a.m. and these soldiers have been up all night preparing for the attack. We've been hearing the jets overhead. They've been circling for the last few hours getting ready to strike those ISIS positions.

At dawn the offensive begins, a barrage of heavy weapons raining down on ISIS from multiple positions. And these heavy plumes of smoke the result of U.S. air strikes. The Islamic extremists seized control of this area and the strategic (INAUDIBLE) back in June after its lightning advance across northern Iraq.

On the other side of the mountain are the plains that run directly to the heart of Mosul, Iraq's second largest city and ISIS stronghold.

Well, these mortar and artillery strikes have been pummeling the five villages at the base of the mountain where U.S. air strikes have also been hitting the top of the mountain according to the fighters. They had killed a number of militants.

Leading the assault, Iraq's Deputy Prime Minister Dr. Rowsch Shaways. Normally based in Baghdad, this proud Kurd knows his men need him now more than ever.

ROWSCH SHAWAYS, IRAQI DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: This is a duty of everybody who lives democratic and freedom and human rights to struggle against the terrorists especially against them.

COREN: But while the Kurds are looking to create a bigger buffer around their capital, they're also positioning themselves for when they could take part in a move on Mosul. We're then taken to one of the villages reclaimed in recent weeks now less than two kilometers from the fighting.

This is what the fight against is looks like. The Iraqi forces taking village after village with the help of U.S. air strikes. This is the model for a coordinated campaign to achieve president Obama's objective, degrade and destroy is, a hard and bloody task according to these soldiers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, you have a sniper and you have to be very careful if they get you and they shoot you. You have to be very careful.

COREN: But during this assault, it was the Peshmerga who only sustained a few injuries. The commander boasting that more than two dozen ISIS fighters were killed while a number were captured, a victory they know won't always be easy in the days ahead. Anna Coren, CNN, Zardaq Mountain near Mosul, Iraq.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: Thank you for that, Anna.

Also, coming up here next in the NEWSROOM, the crash site of Malaysian airlines flight 17 has been off-limits because of the intense fighting in that of eastern Ukraine. A new ceasefire is offering hope, though, for families of the victims on board that flight.

We are going to explain why also just how well is the truce holding up between Russia and Ukraine and frankly what are the long-term prospects for peace? We'll take a look as well straight after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Big news in the world of sport to tell you about. A dramatic upset at the U.S. open tennis tournament right here in New York. Number one seed Novak Djokovic has been defeated. He lost in four sets this afternoon to Japan's Kei Nishikori, 6-4, 1-6, 7-7, 6-3. Nishikori who is the number ten seat in the tournament will be the first ever Asian man to reach a grand slam final. Congratulations to him and I'm sorry for Djokovic but what a match.

All right, in other news a team of Malaysian investigators will soon travel to eastern Ukraine to retrieve remains from the Malaysian airlines flight 17 crash site. The plane as you know was shot down back in July killing all 298 people on board. Pro-Russian rebels have been accused of hitting the plane with a missile. Meanwhile, after five months of violence, a ceasefire between the

Ukrainian government and rebels appears to be holding at least for right now. But as Diana Magnay reports fighting took place up until the very last moment.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DIANA MAGNAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): What a difference an hour can make. At 5:00 p.m. on Friday, a massive artillery bombardment set stubble fields ablaze. Smoke billows across the horizon. By 6:00 p.m. all is quiet. The ceasefire one first fragile step towards peace. But the devastation is lasting, the kindergarten in the village of (INAUDIBLE) is destroyed. These two Ukrainian tanks looked like they tried to leave in ha hurry.

Who knows why the Ukrainians chose to use this summer camp and kindergarten to position their tanks. But it looks like mortar rounds and grad rockets were fired in here taking out that one and immobilizing the other two. The targeting was clearly extremely accurate.

These two men think their village became the target when the Ukrainian sent in their tanks on midday on Friday. They hope the cease-fire lasts.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

MAGNAY: It's the first night I've been able to sleep properly, this man says. I'm a man and I'm not meant to be scared but only people who were crazy wouldn't be scared.

Even if the ceasefire holds there are huge challenges ahead. There are heavily armed groups on either side who don't care much for the rule of law. There's also insignia one indication of the fascist inclinations of at least some of the Asof (ph) men fighting on the Ukrainian side.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our president afraid of our battalions, of own will battalions.

MAGNAY: Volunteer battalions?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Volunteer, yes, sure. Because we were fighting until dawn and he afraid such people as we are because if we don't like our government, we will say it that we don't like it. Maybe he afraid of some revolution, I don't know.

MAGNAY: Most have had enough of revolution and of its bloody aftermath. In Mariupol, Canadian (INAUDIBLE) shakes his head gloomily when I ask if the ceasefire will hold. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

MAGNAY: There is so much confusion, he says. We really don't know what will happen. Because when people say we must live in a united Ukraine and we see at the same time Ukrainian forces in retreat, what should we think?" This ceasefire gives both sides time to regroup and recover, a

temporary respite but a dangerous one. These hills are quiet for now. But who knows how long that may last?

Diana Magnay, CNN, Mariupol, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: Diana, thank you for that.

We are going to continue discussing this on the next side of this break because Russia's president has been called as you know a bully by some and when people try to get tough with Vladimir Putin he often laughs it off. So, what would it take to scare the Kremlin leader? We'll discuss next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Coming up here on CNN at 7:30 eastern tonight our special CNN Spotlight on a legend, comedy legend Joan Rivers, learn about her life and times, her groundbreaking career. She accomplished a whole lot in 81 years. That is only right here on CNN at 7:30 eastern time.

Meantime, Russian president Vladimir Putin not present at the NATO summit this year but very much certainly in focus while NATO leaders met in Wales. Vladimir Putin did stay home. NATO wants him to keep his armed forces there as well.

Moscow insisted it's not helping the rebels in eastern Ukraine but most people don't buy that. How to make Putin pay the price for meddling in Ukraine, so much tougher question, a lot of opinions on that.

Let's bring in one opinion, someone who knows very well, Michael Weiss. He joins me now. He is a foreign policy columnist and also recently spent a good deal in time in Kiev. You were there for about a week meeting with a lot of government officials. So we have a ceasefire now.

MICHAEL WEISS, FOREIGN POLICY COLUMNIST: So to speak.

HARLOW: So to speak. Ukrainian president and Vladimir Putin speaking on the phone yesterday. At the same time you have these really frankly occupied areas that are still going to remain under the control of pro-Russian rebels.

WEISS: Absolutely. I just saw today a German member of parliament, member travel (INAUDIBLE) and said the entire city is chockablock with Russian soldiers, not separatists, not Russian -- Russian conventional soldiers. And in the midst of the "ceasefire," quote/unquote, the Russian forces are building power lines from Luhanks (ph) to Russian and they are handing out Russian pass ports. So this is exactly what the Russian forces did before (INAUDIBLE). This is the sort of end game as a frozen conflict as they say.

HARLOW: Well, that's what Senator John McCain talked about. I mean, this fear and he's been pushing for military aid to Ukraine for a long time and look what Vladimir Putin wants is this frozen situation where perhaps he doesn't control that region in name but in every other aspect he does.

WEISS: It's de facto control, absolutely. I mean, look, Russian has overwhelming military force that can bring to bear in eastern Ukraine. You know, a few weeks ago, it was said that a thousand paratroopers across the border.

In Kiev, I mean, when you say a thousand Russian soldiers everyone laughs. They think that number is higher by orders of magnitude. They are probably right. There were reports that in Donetsk, Russian soldiers were billeting themselves in apartment buildings. Remember, these are not guys wearing their insignias and their uniforms and waiting to fly to Russia. This is what is called (INAUDIBLE), the warfare, special warfare. Everything is hidden and concealed. Putin does not acknowledge that he is at a state of war with Ukraine.

HARLOW: Then why a ceasefire?

WEISS: Well, I think that the idea is they're looking for some kind of diplomatic kabuki theater. I mean, remember a few days ago, Putin and Petro Poroshenko, the new president of Ukraine had a phone call. Mr. Poroshenko got off that phone thinking, look, we've agreed to a ceasefire.

HARLOW: And Moscow said something very different.

WEISS: Well, actually, it was really quite funny and farcical. What happened first with, you know, Russian state propaganda organs like RT, put out a statement saying breaking, you know, we have a ceasefire. And then, in the very next breath saying there is no ceasefire because Russia is not in Ukraine, you know.

So I mean, even the plausible deniability is coming undone and unspooled. But I think look, fundamentally, Putin doesn't -- I mean, this is, you have to understand, there's a sort of cynical game being played here and also a very kind of sinisterly funny one, I think, on the part of the Kremlin.

Putin knows that everyone realizes that he's in Ukraine. Remember, he denied that he had occupied and seized Crimea until he gave a press conference saying this was us. This is all about testing the limits of the west. What can I get away with? How far can I push it? The United States government comes out and says we don't want to further militarize the conflict. Well, Putin reads that as a green light to go further.

Now, they will play, as I said as diplomatic Kabuki, talking about ceasefires, offering peaceful settlements. All the while every time he does that, and this is very important, if you look at the timeline on this crisis, every time Putin soothes for peace publicly, privately he is escalating the conflict.

HARLOW: You have said one of the biggest mistakes you believe western experts and politicians and strategists on this have made is saying that Putin doesn't have a strategy. And that he will just sort of advance reassess, advance reassess.

Given that and what you learned on the ground, you weren't ease with the country, but what you learned on the ground there, what should the U.S. strategy be right now? How involved this United States get when, by the way, we're also -- have a huge issue with ISIS?

WEISS: Sure. Our attention span is quite stretched at the moment. I mean, I don't envy the president at all. However, he does have a strategy, Mr. Putin. His strategy is to keep Ukraine from being a functional democracy, from reconstituting itself in all levels of society, including and most especially, the economic, right?

Ukraine is not about Ukraine. I know that sounds strange to western ears. But it's about Russia. Remember 2004, the orange revolution, that was sort of a bellwether moment for Putin and his own strategy domestically and geopolitically. The last thing he can afford to see are protests in the streets of Moscow such as those that occurred in 2011, the (INAUDIBLE) protest movement.

If Ukraine becomes a functioning democracy, a viable state with foreign direct investment, actual laws of anti-corruption on the books, you know, pro-western, pro-EU orientation then that is a signal threat to Russia, the same thing can happen in Russia.

HARLOW: But how long is it sustainable to keep Ukraine hanging in the balance like in disarray?

WEISS: Indefinitely. I mean, it has been -- since 2008, Russia has a virtual demilitarized zone, 20 percent of Georgia's territory, you know. It controls transnitian (ph) in Moldova, if he wanted to. And a lot of Ukrainian military analysts and experts including those on the national Security Council who I spoke to, say that look, he doesn't have to stop in Donetsk or Luhanks (ph), he can go all the way to Odessa. Cut the country in half and deprive it of any access to the sea. In which case, they have no shipping industry. The economy collapses.

HARLOW: And here, we've seen the economy impacted by the sanctions but Putin certainly laughs it off. And basically says bring it on.

Thanks for the expertise. We are out of time, but thank you for coming in

WEISS: Sure. My pleasure. Any time.

HARLOW: Thanks, Michael. Appreciate it. We will come back to you later in the hour with more.

Also consider this. We do not know much about the hostages being held by ISIS. And there's a reason for that. Families often request a media blackout when someone is abducted. Our next guest says that's a mistake. Why is that? We'll talk about it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: When a westerner goes missing in Syria we don't always hear about it and there's a reason for that. Often the families ask for a blackout of any media coverage. Don't use their name or report on it or even the fact that they are missing.

British citizen David Haines is the latest hostage who appear on an ISIS tape. We saw him on the video showing the execution of Steven Sotloff. Now, Haines was working for an aide group when he was abducted. We're showing you him now and using his name because his family said that we could. They agreed only because his was already widely distributed on the Internet.

I want to bring in "Daily Beast" contributor Jamie Dettmer who said look, the media blackout explains right into ISIS' hands. He joins me from Washington. Thank you for being with us.

JAMIE DETTMER, CONTRIBUTOR, DAILY BEAST: Thanks for having me on.

HARLOW: When we think of David Haines and just our best to him and his entire family, you can't imagine what they're going through right now. He's a 44-year-old aid worker. He was over there helping Syrian refugees. His captivity was kept secret for months. Why is that a bad idea? Why does that hurt his prospects for survival?

DETTMER: There's been an acrimonious debate behind the scenes for several months actually about the media blackouts within the journalist community. Some would feel, though, we've been observing them that the blackouts actually are not helping the hostages. They're actually helping western governments by keeping pressure off them when they might be -- when they should be doing maybe more. They are keeping the European governments out of the spotlight when they're underwriting terrorism by providing ransoms.

They're keeping information away often from journalists in the field. I can think of two or three occasions when I could have done with a little bit more detail when I was going in, in particular cases. And they're also allowing ISIS really to have more control of the propaganda narrative by this power of naming. It's adding to the shock of this campaign of beheadings and I think we should be take can that power of naming away from ISIS.

HARLOW: And you talk about that more in detail in your article. You talk about how you think the United States is losing the information war. In part you write, the most immediate way to stop them from doing that is to sop suppressing information about the hostages and to ask the families and employees of hostages, you know, to lift their media blackout requests.

At the same time, you know, when you look back to 2008 "New York Times" reporter David Rogue who escaped his Taliban captors did say that the media blackout was helpful.

DETTMER: But he's changed his mind. He wrote a very interesting piece a few weeks ago for Thompson Reuters where he says as he looks back, he believes these blackouts are actually helping -- keep the pressure off governments. And that the families and I think he's completely right and like all of the journalists, my sympathies are with the families of the hostages. It's a terrible position to be. And in James Foley's parents have been with great, great dealing with this, dealing with the death of their son.

The families are placed in a very, very difficult position, because they got corporations who have been pressured to be quiet about it because their insurers want them to, because the security consultant come from a counter secrecy, are advising this.

But a lot of us feel that the time has come for us to lift a lid off of this. That we can't see how this is helping the hostages themselves. Look. There are occasions when you have to keep some information and there are some cases now going on where none of us feel right about revealing certain information. And I think there's a very good argument to say in the immediate days after a hostage taking it is best to have a blackout. First of all, the corporation, the employer, needs to find out as much information as they can without distraction and there may be an opportunity for negotiation. But, look, ISIS is not really interested in negotiations about the American and British hostages. I don't believe it.

HARLOW: We have to go in just a moment, but very quickly, you do note in this article that European officials have told you that lifting the media blackouts can hurt their ongoing financial negotiations with terrorists, something important to point out.

DETTMER: Yes, it is. But then, you know, it raises this question about whether ransom should be being paid.

HARLOW: Of course.

DETTMER: And there needs to be accountability about this. Again, I'm not too sure it would necessarily undermine these negotiations. None of us can -- you know, there's no evidence being provided that blackouts are helping. It's a point that Robert Young who has been arguing and (INAUDIBLE) in "The New York Times" as well.

HARLOW: Appreciate it. Jamie Dettmer, stay with us. We are going to talk to you more in the hour here on CNN. Thank you for that.

Coming up next, another big story this week. Pictures of celebrities that were hacked, stolen, leaked on the web. The victims are rightly furious. But in some cases, people could post their pictures and frankly there was nothing that anyone could do about it.

And here in New York, also of course, we're following this a private funeral for comedienne Joan Rivers is set for tomorrow morning. A short time ago CNN saw her daughter, Melissa, leaving her mother's apartment with her young son there. She told CNN the tributes to her mother are, quote, "amazing."

Meanwhile, also this, an investigation in to the clinic where Joan Rivers suffered complications from surgery is under way.

And now, today's CNN hero.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a working class neighborhood. It's difficult for a lot of us to afford fresh produce. We just have corner stores basically. And they don't have a large variety of fresh fruits and vegetables.

CHIP PAILLEX, CNN HERO: These are awesome, aren't they? I started the farm with my daughter. The first year we were able to get 120 pounds of produce with all the extra produce we brought it down to the local food pantry. I realize people are hungry for fresh food and vegetables. We grow and glean and give. When we first started the program it was basically my family and now we're around 4,000 volunteers.

Excellent!

It's not just feeding people. Our goal is really to educate the folks who receive the produce.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All right. Are you guys ready for some corn?

PAILLEX: When kids come out for the first time from the inner city, they immediately are struck by the fact that food grows out of the ground.

There you go.

For them to be able to actually harvest it and bring it home to their families, that was huge. When is the first time you ate corn off the stalk, look at that? We go to inner city areas and set up a free farm market.

Thank you, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have diabetes and high blood pressure. Some things that I need for my diet a lot of times I can't afford.

PAILLEX: You like this corn? Yes, this is good stuff.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Since I've been going to the farmers market, I have lost some weight. My sugar is better controlled. And the food is delicious.

PAILLEX: I believe that everyone deserves to be able to eat healthy. There's no greater reward.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Get this. A gallery in Florida plans to show naked celebrity pictures leaked online as art. Nude, private photographs of women, celebrities like Jennifer Lawrence, Kate Upton, this is part of an exhibit by the artist XVALA, it is titles "No Delete." He says quote "we share our secrets with technology and when we do our privacy becomes accessible to others."

Here to talk about it CNN commentator and legal analyst Mel Robbins. Well, I can guess how a lot of us feel about that. How can it be legal to do that? I mean, it's obviously not legal to leak it, but you don't know who is hacking these and leaking them. You know who is putting on this exhibit.

MEL ROBBINS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Right. Right. I can't imagine that it's going to be legal and I would suspect that you're going to see a lawsuit where they're going to try to enjoin this particular artist from holding a public display with these photos that he clearly doesn't own.

But, you know, when you talk about how can this be legal? You got to look at three different categories of the law, Poppy. The first one is whether or not it's legal under copyright law. The second is whether or not it's legal under criminal law and the third is whether or not it is legal or if you have a legal remedy if you are a victim of this under criminal law.

HARLOW: So part of the legal argument here on those is that want these photos out there or think that they can do that is who took the picture. That's actually critical.

ROBBINS: Yes. And I think many people that are watching are going to find this stunning. So if I were to take a picture of you right now with my phone, the law presumes that I own the photo.

HARLOW: Not me.

ROBBINS: Because I took it. Now, if I took a selfie of myself --

HARLOW: You own it.

ROBBINS: -- I own it. And so, what they're saying now is that in some of these celebrity leaks, you notice that they are selfies. There is a presumption that the celebrity owns the photo. She's got a copyright claim to assert to get the photos taken down from website immediately. Bu in those instances where it is clearly a photo taken by somebody else there's a decisional legal hurdle to try to get it down at least from a copy right perspective. But they had other options.

HARLOW: So what can be done in terms of suing? We know Jennifer Lawrence is taking legal action. I would expect many others are. What is the precedent? What can they win other than damages?

ROBBINS: Well, unfortunately, there are very few states that have enacted legislation that actually make it a crime. I know of three for sure. There are 13 where legislation has been enacted but it doesn't necessarily make it a crime and there are 27 where it's been pending. So what most women or men that are victims of revenge porn or of this sort of leak of private information are doing is they're going to civil court and they're suing for invasion of privacy or they're suing for intentional infliction of emotional distress which obviously it's causing.

HARLOW: You think states, every state, should make it a crime for this to happen. ROBBINS: A 100 percent they should make it a crime. And, you know,

keep in mind that in Houston this year there was a jury that awarding a woman half a million dollars for a sex tape that was leaked. There was a jury in California that awarded a woman a quarter of a million dollars. And what we do know is that the harm is substantial and we're going to see more and more and more of this. And I think every state has an obligation to basically say unless you have a release from somebody, it is a crime to publish photos of people that are nude.

HARLOW: No matter who technically owns it. Where is the decency? We'll talk about it more throughout the evening. Mel, thank you for coming in. We appreciate it.

ROBBINS: Great to see you.

HARLOW: Coming up tonight, who is behind the leak of these pictures? Those are the hackers behind what it is called the dark web. We are going to delve into that. And in depth discuss for your private information, information of about half of all Americans, half of all Americans, is for sale right now. Learn more. Our special on the dark web coming up here at 7:00 eastern time.

Next in the NEWSROOM, how did a young woman from a seemingly very stable background end up as a matchmaker for ISIS? You have to see this story to believe it. Her parents say their daughter was brainwashed online. But now she's the one on the web recruiting wives for ISIS fighters.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: This story you are about to hear seems pretty impossible. It is a story of a young woman from a stable background. She went to a good school. Show was a Harry potter fan and then one day she told her parents she was going to Syria to marry an ISIS fighter. Now she is trying to persuade other women to do the same.

Here is our Atika Shubert.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is Aqsa Mahmood as her parents know her -- a loving daughter who messaged her mom's tired feet, a Glasgow teenager who didn't even know which bus to take downtown much less board a plane by herself.

But this is Aqsa in Syria, unrecognizable in an all-encompassing Niqab with other brides of ISIS fighters.

Online, she posts photos of guns and the Koran, urging Muslims to carry out attacks like the bombing in Boston, the British soldier hacked to death on the streets of London.

MUZAFFAR MAHMOOD, AQSA'S FATHER: She was the best daughter we could have. We don't know what happened to her. We thought there was nothing wrong with praying and reading the Koran. SHUBERT: The last time MUZAFFAR and Khalida saw their daughter, she

had only her university backpack and kissed them goodbye. Four days later, she called from the Turkey border just as she was crossing into Syria.

M. MAHMOOD: We are a moderate Muslim family. And it was a big a shock for us.

SHUBERT: What did she say when you asked her to come home?

M. MAHMOOD: Her one message was that I will see you on the day of judgment.

SHUBERT: That must have been very hard for you as a father.

M. MAHMOOD: It was. I will take you to heaven. I will hold your hand. That's what she said. I want to become a martyr.

SHUBERT: So how did this happen? Aqsa grew up in an affluent neighborhood, attended a prestigious private school. She loved Harry Potter books and the British band Cold Play. Her family believes that whatever radicalized their daughter happened online.

AAMER ANWAR, FAMILY LAWYER: She was a bedroom radical and that this could happen to Aqsa who had all the life chances, the best education that money could buy, a family that were moderate, liberal and views freedom, education, love and affection, if this could happen to her, somebody so intelligent, then it could happen to any family.

SHUBERT: They have refused to do any interviews, but they spoke to CNN to deliver a personal message to Aqsa.

KHALIDA MAHMOOD, AQSA'S MOTHER: Aqsa, please (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE).

SHUBERT: My dear daughter, please come back. I'm missing you so much. Your brothers and sisters miss you a lot, her mother says. My dearest daughter, in the name of Allah, please come home. I love you.

In February, Aqsa called for the last time with important news, she was getting married to an ISIS fighter.

One of her last blog posts was this poem to her mother that ends with the line. "Forgive me, Umee I left, and I know you've accepted that I'm never coming back," words her parents desperately hope will not come true.

Atika Shubert, CNN, Glasgow, Scotland.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: Our thanks to Atika for that.

We are going to talk about this a lot more after a break. How can videos and forums online seduce a young man or a young woman like that to join such a ruthless, vicious group? We'll discuss next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: All right. Let's talk more now about how ISIS is seducing young people online convincing them to join a barbaric group known for beheadings and massacres. Joining me now to discuss is columnist Michael Weiss, also Jamie Dettmer with "the Daily Beast."

Let me go to you, Michael. When you talk about Mahmood's parents, part of what they said if our daughter had every chance and freedom in life, could become a bedroom radical, then the same thing could happen to any family.

WEISS: Sure.

HARLOW: What is the lesson learned here about how the internet is completely broken down borders in terms of recruiting ISIS members?

WEISS: I mean, look, you know, it would take kind of an acute psychological profile to understand why this particular girl decided to go join. But the point is, in the 20th century if you wanted to join a cult or indeed a terrorist organization, you had to make physical contact with the recruiter. They would bring you over to a foreign country. This is all changed now. You know, ISIS, even before ISIS, in the last five years or so national security gurus have been talking about sort of lone Wolf terrorist attacks. So forget about al-Qaeda planning a bombing from Afghanistan to kill thousands of Americans. You could simply get a 19-year-old, a disaffected 19- year-old who is not even a Muslim to begin with, much less an integrated one, convert to this radical ideology over the Internet, watching (INAUDIBLE) on You Tube, reading facebook posts in this kind of thing, and before you know it they're perpetrating, you know, very targeted, specific terrorist attacks on U.S. soil.

The most common example of this I would say not even on U.S. soil on European soil, Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, the so-called underpants bomber. This was the son of a Nigerian government minister, extraordinary wealthy, actually the father alerted British authorities to his son's radicalization.

HARLOW: Student in college in London.

WEISS: University College London which is a very prestigious university. Joined the Islamic society of that school, became president and then started doing things like hosting commemorative events of 9/11 showing New York City on fire. Was the promulgator of these sermons of Anwar al-Awlaki, an al-Qaeda cleric that U.S. drones took out several years ago in Yemen. This guy didn't have to go to Somalia or Iraq or Yemen.

HARLOW: You don't have to now. And to that point I want to bring Jamie in, because when we talk about how ISIS recruits differently, say, than al-Qaeda, and specifically recruiting women, talk to us about the purpose that they are recruiting women for.

DETTMER: They're slicker than al-Qaeda. I mean, they're a lot slicker. They tailor the propaganda depending on which social media site they're using and what kind of group they're targeting. For example, Aqsa Mahmood is a recruiter herself. She's part of a group of western jihadist women there who have been tweeting and blogging trying to attract other western girls, women to go to Syria, marry a jihadist and become part of the new caliphate.

So, they are much slicker about how they target. I mean, in a sense I agree with Michael, that in a way she's stereotypical. Most of the people who are going over there, whether they are male or female fighters, are actually people who are university educated or could be. They seem to be lacking a purpose. For some of them they're lost souls, I think. Others I think there's psychopathic element to them, particularly some of the fighters who go over there who are turned on by the blood loss pornography they are looking at.

But ISIS is very interesting how it is using it. Al-Qaeda on the whole didn't. The first time al-Qaeda used suicide female, suicide bombers was actually in 2005 when there were a series of them around Baghdad. And that taboo was broken by the mentor of the man who now leads ISIS. So, there's a feeling that they're useful in a number of ways. They can recruit other women. They can provide children if they marry a jihadist. They sometimes have professional skill that they can provide to this new caliphate. And the worrying thing is, some of them maybe turn into bombers as well. It can be used on their homeland later on. And that is very worrisome.

"Time" magazine today had some very odd figures. They were suggesting only about 30 women from the west had gone to Syria. In fact, UK intelligence sources are saying 50 alone from the UK. The Swedes have officially admitted 30 from Sweden, so we could be looking at 200 to 300 of them.

HARLOW: Yes. No matter what the number is, it is a big problem and a terrifying reality as we've seen play out for the parents of that young woman who was recruited. Michael Weiss, Jamie Dettmer, thank you. We appreciate it.