Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Newsroom
New Video Could Shake Up Ferguson Case; Legal Aspects of Brown Video; Obama Observed 9/11 Anniversary; Making 9/11 a Day of Remembrance.
Aired September 11, 2014 - 14:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
RANDI KAYE, CNN ANCHOR: New witnesses are coming forward in the shooting death of 18-year-old Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri. I spoke with two construction workers who say Brown put his hands in the air. I want to show you this exclusive cell phone video. It shows the construction workers reacting just moments after those gunshots rang out. Both men say they did not see how the confrontation began, but here's what the construction workers told us in a CNN exclusive interview.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KAYE (voice-over): Just after 12:00 noon, Ferguson, Missouri. The men you see in this exclusive cell phone video hear gunshots. They are about 50 feet away from Michael Brown and Officer Darren Wilson. The unidentified person recording this video captured the witness' reaction during the final moments of the shooting.
(SHOUTING)
(GUNFIRE)
KAYE: Both were contractors in the area and did not want to be identified.
The man on the left in the pink shirt told CNN they heard one gunshot and about 30 seconds later a second shot. He saw Michael Brown staggering and then Brown put his hands up and said, OK, OK, OK. The witness told us the cop didn't say "Get on the ground." He just kept shooting. That same witness described the gruesome scene saying he saw Michael Brown's brains come out of his head. Again, reiterating his hands were up.
Watch how he motions on the video.
(SHOUTING)
KAYE: The video these witnesses say was taken shortly after the shooting ended. If you look closely, you can see a police officer in the distance beginning to put up crime scene tape. Both men said, by the time it was over, there were three officers on the scene, but only one involved in the shooting. Another voice is also heard on the tape. The contractor in the green
shirt told me that voice belongs to a man he didn't know who pulled up alongside them yelling this.
(SHOUTING)
KAYE (on camera): That same contractor in green told me he saw Michael Brown running away from the police car. He said Brown put his hands up and that the officer was chasing him. He also said that Officer Wilson fired another shot at Brown while his back was turned.
(voice-over): The contractor in the pink shirt also shared this, that a second officer, who arrived later to the scene, also drew his weapon. He said, "The one cop was the one who shot him and I saw another officer pull a gun out but he didn't shoot." That same worker described how Brown staggered dead after the second shot 20 to 25 feet to the ground explaining, "He was like a walking dead guy."
Keep in mind, these men don't live in Ferguson and don't know the Brown family. But their account does square with what other witnesses said.
The woman who took video of Brown's body lying in the street said Brown was shot from behind, just like the contractor in the green shirt says.
PIAGET CRENSHAW, WITNESS: While he was running away from officer, trying to get away, he was getting shot at.
KAYE: This witness told Anderson that he didn't see Brown's hands up perhaps because he was running outside to the scene. But he did see Brown turn around before being fatally shot.
MICHAEL BRADY, WITNESS: By the time I get outside, he's already turned around facing the officer. He has his arms under his stomach. He was halfway down, like he was going down. The officer lets out about three or four shots at him.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAYE: After that shooting, the contractor in the pink T-shirt told us they were the only two white people out there on the streets so he told his co-worker they had to, quote, to "get the hell out of there before things got ugly." He said it was starting to get ugly when they left. Groups were gathering in the streets. They have since given statements to the police and FBI.
And one other quick note here. That same worker told us that they talked to the officer who was putting up that crime scene tape that you saw in the video before they left. He told them that they were leaving Brown's body uncovered in the street for evidence and putting up the tape to keep people away. That was his explanation.
So legally speaking, with the investigation still pending against the officer, is this video a game changer? "Anderson Cooper 360" and Mark Geragos always have a spirited discussion. We'll talk about that coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAYE: Welcome back. New video could shake up the Ferguson, Missouri, case. Two construction workers in this video say the teen put his hands in the air and that the officer was chasing him. Both men say they were 50 feet away when Officer Wilson opened fire. A private autopsy shows Brown was shot at least six times.
Joining me to discuss, legal analysts, Sunny Hostin and Mark Geragos.
Nice to see both of you.
Sunny, let me start with you.
Other witnesses have said before that Brown put his hands up but this video really shows in real-time the reaction. How do you think it could impact the case?
SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I think it's going to be very helpful because we're talking about a video taken three minutes after this incident. So it is in real-time and it's important to show that. But I think what is remarkable is that everyone is saying this is the game changer. This is what's really going to matter. Guess what? Five other witnesses from the community said the same exact thing and it's befuddling to me how these two witnesses that are now not from the community, they're white, suddenly this is the game changer. I've got to tell you -- I know Mark Geragos is laughing. I can't begin to tell you how many times when I prosecuted cases in D.C., I had to go into the community and knock on doors begging people to come into my office to give their eyewitness account. It's brave these people did this. This is how prosecutors and investigators make cases every day. You want people from the community to be very brave and come forward and tell you what they saw without having everyone say they didn't really say what they saw.
KAYE: Mark, what do you think?
MARK GERAGOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Look, it is a game changer in this sense. You now have two white witnesses. And I loved Sunny euphemistically saying in the community out of the community.
That's code, isn't it, Sunny, for we have some white witnesses opposed to black witnesses.
We know we've got a predominantly white grand jury. Let's try to strip away code words and call it what it is. You now have some witnesses who the majority of this grand jury will better relate to -- I hate to say it -- but that's the reality of it. That's why it's a game changer to me.
HOSTIN: Which is sickening in many respects. I think, Mark, you and I can agree on something, which is rare, but that it is very brave for people that witness a shooting to come forward, especially if they witnessed a shooting in their communities, to come forward and explain what they saw. Because you know these people are going to have to get on the witness stand. And they're going to be cruise side by members of the defense bar, like yourself, and made to appear as if they didn't see what they saw.
KAYE: Speaking of what they didn't see, Mark, both construction workers say they didn't see how this confrontation actually began, that initial moment at the officer's car. Does that give Officer Wilson's defense an opening do you think?
GERAGOS: Absolutely. That's why I said all along that until we get his initial statement that was given, you really don't know what you've got here. Because I think that he's going to -- if he was bright, he knows enough to construct something so that he used the deadly force and he's going to claim that the reason he used deadly force is because he was threatened or there was some kind of force that was used against him. If he's brain dead and said, no, I just overreacted and went chasing after this poor kid and executed him, you know, I don't understand why he wasn't arrested and charged already.
HOSTIN: He should have been arrested and charged already because there's more than enough given the seven eyewitness accounts, Mark, that --
(CROSSTALK)
GERAGOS: Coming from an ex-prosecutor like you, you know that cops have a double standard when it comes to cops.
HOSTIN: Well, that's true. The bottom line is this is the universal signal of surrender. I think, even if there was some sort of altercation at the car -- let's assume that that is the case. Once a fleeing felon is running away and turning around and surrendering, I think a defendant then cannot avail himself or herself of this fleeing felon rule. So at this point --
(CROSSTALK)
GERAGOS: Except what --
HOSTIN: -- I just can't imagine that he doesn't get indicted.
GERAGOS: Sunny? Sunny, you just said this is the universal symbol when he's up like this.
HOSTIN: It sure is.
GERAGOS: But if the officer then testifies that, no, instead, he's coming at him like this or to attack him or he perceived it in some other way, that's where you'll have -- that's why we have lawsuits.
HOSTIN: That's a big question.
GERAGOS: And that's why we have defenses. And --
(CROSSTALK)
HOSTIN: That's right, Randi. GERAGOS: -- the officer's statement.
HOSTIN: But that's why it's going to be so, so important that you have not one but two but seven eyewitnesses all saying the same thing, hands up.
KAYE: Hands up. Some say, was he falling towards him. Was he charging him? That's the big question. Either way, his hands were in the air.
GERAGOS: But you also -- and you're also going to have to take a look to see where the shell casings fell. They do wonderful things forensically with the shots that were fired, where the casings fell --
(CROSSTALK)
GERAGOS: -- the kind of ejection profile and things of that nature. Someone is going to go through and do a detailed analysis of all that.
KAYE: Very important stuff.
Mark Geragos, Sunny Hostin, thank you both.
HOSTIN: Thanks for having me.
KAYE: On this anniversary of 9/11, hundreds of Americans prepare to head over to Iraq to help that country battle ISIS. Coming up, I sit down with a group of veterans and ask them, should the U.S. go back, and their answers are surprising.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAYE: President Obama today marking the somber anniversary of 9/11, twice, first with a moment of silence on the South Lawn of the White House and then in Arlington, Virginia, at the annual 9/11 observance at the Pentagon.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's now been 13 years. 13 years since the peace of an American morning was broken. 13 years since nearly 3,000 beautiful lives were taken from us including 125 men and women serving here at the Pentagon. 13 years of moments they would have shared with us. 13 years of memories they would have made. Here once more we pray for the souls of those we remember, for you, their families, who loved them forever, and for a nation that's been inspired by your example through determination to carry on, the resolve to live lives worthy of their memories.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KAYE: Jay lost his brother, Glenn, on 9/11 and pushed to make September 11th a national day of service and remembrance.
Jay, your brother was one of the true heroes of 9/11 from what I understand. Tell me a little bit about his story. JAY WINUK, LOST BROTHER ON 9/11: Thank you for saying that. He
really was an extraordinary man. He was a partner at a law firm about a block and a half from ground zero. That's where their offices were. When towers hit he raced into the south tower to save lives. For 20 years, he was as volunteer firefighter and an EMT. So he did what firefighters do. He perished when the South Tower collapsed.
KAYE: He wasn't in the towers when they were hit but went in to help.
WINUK: Yes.
KAYE: You have started an organization called "My Good Deed" to try and inspire people to remember 9/11 in a more positive way and do good work. How many people are marking today as a national day of service?
WINUK: I can tell you that last year research indicates that more than 47 million people engage in some form of charitable service and good deeds on 9/11. We are hoping to exceed that this year. It's clearly become the largest day, annual day of charitable engagement in the history of the country.
KAYE: Why have people gravitated toward that?
WINUK: I think there are two reasons. We don't tell people what to do. They can do good deeds and service in anything they're comfortable with in their comfort zone. People still 13 years later want to find something meaningful and appropriate to do to mark the day. When they come across this notion of doing something good for people or communities in need, it strikes home and it's reflective of the way people responded right after the attacks.
KAYE: What do you do on this day?
WINUK: This morning, I had the privilege of ringing the bell at the stock exchange and be with the financial community that was hit so hard 13 years ago. Then I volunteered at a school in the lower east side with 150 other people refurbishing the school. So my day is filled with that. I'll always wind up down at the grounds of the memorial museum to pay my respects to Glenn and all those who perished.
KAYE: It's so nice what you've done, and so nice to have something positive come out of such a terrible day.
WINUK: I think so. You know, for people who want to find out more about it, go to 911day.org. Register their pledge, their intensions, see what other people are doing. It's a great way to be part of a community marking the day in service.
KAYE: It certainly is.
Jay Winuk, thanks you so much. Nice to see you.
WINUK: Thank you.
KAYE: Did the NFL have the videotape of Ray Rice hitting his then- fiance? One report claims they have had it since April. And now former FBI Director Robert Mueller is leading an independent inquiry, leads the investigation. But Mueller has some controversial connections to the league. That story ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAYE: This weekend, more than 5,000 people will compete in the Malibu Triathlon, among them the "Fit Nation team." In this week's "Human Factor," Dr. Sanjay Gupta introduces us to one member of our team who has overcome a lot but now sees himself crossing the finish line.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): 18 months ago, Jamil Nathoo was in his prime, young, healthy and training for a triathlon, but race day came and went.
JAMIL NATHOO, CANCER PATIENT & MALIBU TRIATHLON PARTICIPANT: I was diagnosed with stage-three testicular cancer that spread into my abdomen and chest.
GUPTA: His triathlon dreams had to be put on hold as he battled cancer with chemotherapy and surgery. It took a toll on his body. But he was determined to get healthy again.
NATHOO: I owe it to myself and to other cancer patients and survivors to let them know that you can be fit again. You can be healthy again.
GUPTA: Nathoo started training and he joined the CNN "Fit Nation" triathlon team. Over the past seven months, he's rebuilt his strength in the water, on the bike, on the run. He even held a cycling fundraiser in New York raising money for the Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center. And now he's cancer free, ready for his next triathlon this weekend with the "Fit Nation" team.
NATHOO: I feel good. I feel strong. I feel like I'm ready for next week. It's exciting to feel like me again.
GUPTA: He has a renewed determination to his cause.
NATHOO: I took an oath early on saying if I can get through this, even if I can get through the ordeal, the journey will never be over for me.
GUPTA: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, reporting.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAYE: I'm Randi Kaye, in for Brooke Baldwin.
