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Interview With Florida Senator Bill Nelson; NFL and Child Abuse; Battle Against ISIS

Aired September 16, 2014 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: And we continue on. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

America's top general seemingly contradicting the commander in chief, opening the door to embedding U.S. forces within Iraqi units fighting ISIS.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEN. MARTIN DEMPSEY, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF CHAIRMAN: Our military advisers will help the Iraqis conduct campaign planning, arrange for enabler and logistics support and coordinate our coalition activities.

If we reach the point where I believe our advisers should accompany Iraq troops on attacks against specific ISIL targets, I will recommend that to the president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: General Martin Dempsey, Joint Chiefs chairman, and Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel there spent much of the Senate hearing today trying to define the role of Americans in Iraq and Syria.

For now, we're told to think of them as close combat advisers. But what does that mean, how might that evolve over time?

Let's discuss with Jim Sciutto, chief national security correspondent for us here at CNN, and Lieutenant General Mark Hertling, CNN military analyst.

Gentlemen, welcome, and, Jim Sciutto, to you. Just, OK, it gets complex, but what are exactly these advisers trained to do, and then at what point might their roles change, might they have to go up to the front lines?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, to this point, their role has been limited to being at these joint operation centers that have been set up in Irbil in Northern Iraq and in Baghdad where they are in a big center, but inside a base and helping to coordinate intelligence, targeting, et cetera, but not anywhere near the front line.

The possibility that General Dempsey raised today and said that he might ask the president for is to move them closer to the front lines. Even in his opening remarks, he said, listen, if I see circumstances where they would fight alongside Iraqi fighters, for instance, against ISIL targets, he may ask the president for that to happen.

He even described specific missions. He said, for instance, if the air campaign was failing and I needed forward air controllers, ground controllers, special operations forces to help direct those airstrikes, he might ask for that.

He described as well that if Iraqi forces tried to take back Mosul, the ISIL stronghold, he might have close combat advisers that are outside of those joint operations centers and close to the front lines. Those things are not specifically -- and General Hertling will know this much better than me -- they're not combat troops in that they're not taking up firing positions.

But they're very much in combat. And it really is -- it does appear to be parsing the definition of combat pretty thinly.

BALDWIN: But is that not, General -- just weigh in on what Jim just said, but also, in combat, words matter, don't they?

LT. GEN. MARK HERTLING (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes. They do, Brooke.

And Jim has got it exactly right. I don't see General Dempsey, who I know pretty, well contradicting the president at all. What he's suggesting is, this could evolve to the point where after these advisers advise within the operations centers, they say, hey, here's the kind of intelligence that might help you out on the battlefield as they turn to their Iraqi or Peshmerga counterparts. Here's what we might be able to do to contribute to better synchronization of forces. Here's the point of emphasis we may want to attack.

At a certain point, that operation may evolve and that Iraqi or Peshmerga commander may require some assistance on the battlefield itself. That's not a close combat troop in the fight. You know, the president has said we will not have close combat troops fighting. And the way I read it as a former military guy, he's talking about large formations of Americans.

If you have your counterpart, and we have done this a lot in the last 14 years, your U.S. counterpart is right next to the Iraqi or Peshmerga counterpart, giving advice on the front lines. That's just a little bit -- I guess it would be consider close combat advising, and that's the difference.

BALDWIN: So I hear you that it's not contradictory.

But, Jim Sciutto, you can understand why and certainly in situations like these, you're nimble and situations evolve based upon events on the ground. But you can understand why American lawmakers and certainly the American public would have questions before the U.S. gets into this.

SCIUTTO: No question. And that's part of the problem, because, as you say, words do matter. And it's the president who has gone out here and said so definitively that there will be no ground forces. And there was an interesting moment in the hearings when General Dempsey was pressed.

And he said that the president had said to him in General Dempsey's words to come back to him on a case-by-case basis as to when he as the commander of the troops on the ground there might need U.S. forces in a more forward position, so at least leaving the door open to something more forward than has been described so far.

I think at a minimum we could say that. I spoken to administration officials so many times. You have heard their public comments where they have said no ground forces, no combat whatsoever. But here you have them describing roles, the general describing roles that go beyond what officials have said in public so far.

And that is a change. And those troops will be in danger even if they're not firing guns, you know, exactly at the enemy. Just one story I will share, but during the Iraq invasion, I was embedded with U.S. Special Forces in Northern Iraq, which General Hertling knows well because he commanded U.S. forces there during the surge. And I was with U.S. Special Forces embedded with Kurdish Peshmerga basically playing the role of combat support advisers.

BALDWIN: OK.

SCIUTTO: And I will tell you, during that invasion, we were getting shot at a lot. It felt to me like I was in combat. There were bullets flying over our heads. They were certainly in danger and some of them were injured, So, that when you're in that role, you do face more risk.

BALDWIN: And so, General, can you just, if and when that has to happen as the U.S. moves forward both with Iraq and Syria, what would those decisions look like behind closed doors between, you know, top brass at DOD and of course the president?

HERTLING: It would look something like this. I think General Austin might call General Dempsey and say, hey, boss, we have got the opportunity to really -- I will use a doctrinal term here -- schwack them.

So we want to put a lot of airpower on something or we want to ensure the Iraqi or Peshmerga force really concentrate their efforts and really defeats the enemy. Can you get the president to allow me to do that? And General Dempsey will probably say, hey, that's an option. And if it's such a good option that General Dempsey does take it to the president, then the president makes the call as the commander in chief whether he wants to take that risk or attempt to mitigate it more.

BALDWIN: General Hertling, thank you. Jim Sciutto, thank you, both, very, very much here.

And as we stay on this, you know, it's a frightening development in the fight against ISIS, is just where that fight is taking place, when you look at the geography, very close. We're talking very close now to the capital of Baghdad. When you look at a map, you see the red areas here on the periphery. These are places ISIS fighters tightly control and will quickly defend.

Then you see that chunk of yellow kind of in the middle of the screen, the highlighted area. That's what experts are calling ISIS support zones. And that's where those fighters are relatively safe to travel around without actually facing a fight.

Now, to the U.S. airstrikes yesterday, they targeted ISIS positions southwest of Iraq's capital. And they're the closest that American airstrikes have been to Baghdad since this campaign against ISIS began. And that is very significant.

To Baghdad we go to Jomana Karadsheh, who is there live.

And talk about just a real shift in tactics, Jomana. The U.S. has gone from, you know, what initially was billed as this humanitarian mission protecting U.S. interests to directly taking the fight to ISIS.

JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Certainly.

And, Brooke, we're just receiving word from Central Command saying there were additional airstrikes also today in that area southwest of Baghdad. So we're really starting to see that expansion that President Obama was talking about last week, one geographically.

If you look at the focus earlier was in the northern part of the country. And now we're seeing this operation, the mission really expanding into other parts of the country. In addition to that, the scope of the operations as you mentioned being broadened here, in cases like this, they say it is too to help and enable Iraqi security forces to go on the offensive against ISIS.

That area southwest of Baghdad where these airstrikes took place, this is an area that has been of concern, the southern Baghdad belt where ISIS is really active. Iraqi security forces there have been engaged in intense battles there for the past couple of months. And we have seen an increase in attacks in recent weeks targeting Iraqi security forces.

So these airstrikes, this air cover is much needed by these forces to facilitate their mission to allow them to make advances. But whether they will be able to hold any territory that they recapture is something that is yet to be seen, Brooke.

BALDWIN: We will keep in close contact with you as this news is developing on these additional airstrikes near Baghdad.

Jomana Karadsheh, thank you so much in Iraq for us.

Coming up next, Adrian Peterson, he's facing child abuse charge, and now reports he was investigated for a different case with a different child of abuse as well. He is responding to the claim, and, today, another NFL player making headlines for how he says he disciplines his 1-year-old daughter. We will play that for you. That's next.

And, in about 45 minutes from now, I will keep a close eye on the clock today because we're waiting for big news from NASA. NASA making a major announcement about how it will send American astronauts into space. Hear the agency's new plan and what impact Russia had on the news today. Stay with me.

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BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

As a pro player, Ray Rice knows all about watching the clock. But today's countdown is unlike any in his career, because this guy has until 11:59 p.m. this evening to appeal that indefinite suspension the NFL has now imposed on him. This happened after TMZ released that surveillance footage of Ray Rice knocking out the woman who would become his wife.

It is expected Rice and the NFL Players Association are going to appeal. As we watch the clock to see what news is made there, let me bring in sports super agent we will call him and attorney Leigh Steinberg.

Leigh, great to have you back.

LEIGH STEINBERG, SPORTS AGENT: Good afternoon, Brooke.

BALDWIN: So, as the deadline is approaching tonight, basically midnight for Ray Rice, what is -- what is your -- you know, from a super agent perspective, what is your advice to this man?

STEINBERG: There never really was any rational basis for commissioner Goodell to do more than what he did with the two-game suspension. It was ridiculously light, and it shocked and offended the conscience that it would only be two games. But no new facts came forward.

He had every fact he needed by just reading the police report that said defendant punched victim in the face and knocked her out. And then he had Rice's own words that he knocked his then fiancee out. The second tape was superfluous. You cannot punish someone twice with the same facts and a punishment.

BALDWIN: It's interesting. Certainly not superfluous in the court of public opinion, but I hear you loud and clear that NFL, to your point, had the facts. And so too a lot of players have been convicted of crimes, and many of them have not been suspended. Maybe, maybe they're making Ray Rice, you know, this example here.

I mean, there wasn't even a domestic violence policy until a couple of weeks ago. Do you think if he does appeal, would he have a case?

STEINBERG: I do think he has a case. Harvey Levin, TMZ and public reaction don't make policy. The fact that the NFL should've had a domestic violence policy some time ago and that the commissioner should've acted decisively at the time he gave him two games doesn't give him the ability to go back because he flubbed it and keep re- punishing the same player.

So this is a very good case that Rice has. And that's how badly the NFL has mishandled this entire sequence.

BALDWIN: Nothing coming from you. As we wait to see what happens there, let me just pivot to another player who is in sort of a different kind of trouble spotlight, Adrian Peterson.

He was just indicted on that alleged child abuse after he disciplined his son. And I just want you to listen to something. I want you to listen to Detroit Lion Reggie Bush voicing his support for Adrian Peterson and spanking a child. Here he was.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

REGGIE BUSH, DETROIT LIONS: I got what we call a whooping, whooped with belts and stuff like that. For me growing up, it was normal. I most definitely discipline my daughter. I have a 1-year-old daughter. But I definitely will try to -- will obviously not leave bruises or anything like that on her. But I definitely will discipline her harshly depending on what -- again, what the situation is.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

BALDWIN: There are a lot of -- I know -- I'm watching you shaking your head, shaking your head. He's not the only professional athlete coming forward, retired or current.

I mean, if you're advising these guys, these players who are commenting on Adrian Peterson, how would you advise them?

STEINBERG: I would advise them to not say a word. The specter of the strongest physical people in this society taking a branch off a tree and beating a helpless 4-year-old to the point that a week later he has physical bruises all across his body, including his genitals, is sickening.

They have a special responsibility, whether it's a woman or a helpless child, to understand what their strength is and the fact that they do no harm. We're blowing a real opportunity here for NFL athletes to lead the way in standing against domestic violence and standing against abusing young kids. They could be setting a great example, instead of being the abusers.

BALDWIN: Leigh Steinberg, his 1-year-old child, but, yes, should be examples, absolutely agree with you. Leigh, thank you so much for coming on. Always love to hear your perspective on these sports stories.

Coming up next, there's definitely a heated debate on Capitol Hill today over how the U.S. plans on fighting ISIS, taking the fight both to Iraq and Syria. You had the secretary of defense ask a lot of questions, including, how do you explain arming rebels in Syria, how would that not spiral out of control? Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: Will we repel Assad's air assets that will be attacking them? (END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Ahead, the secretary's answer to Senator McCain and what he said when asked if the U.S. will work with the Syrian dictator.

Plus, at the top of the hour, NASA is awarding a major contract to take U.S. astronauts to outer space from the U.S. Next, who is in the running for the multibillion-dollar contract and why there is controversy actually brewing about these finalists.

Stay with me.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: In less than an hour, NASA says it is going to be making a -- quote, unquote -- "major announcement." And it means we could be seeing a little bit more of this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All three engines up and burning. Two, one, zero, and liftoff, the final liftoff of Atlantis on the shoulders of the space shuttle.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Space shuttle Atlantis, and there she went. Man, oh, man, that was bittersweet for all of us there to cover that. Since that final launch more than three years ago, U.S. astronauts have had to hitch a ride, if you will, on Russia's Soyuz spacecraft to get up to the ISS, the International Space Station, but that will be changing, because NASA's expected to announce it's awarding both Boeing and SpaceX these contracts to get U.S. astronauts to and from the space station from the U.S. starting in 2017.

So to Capitol Hill we go to Senator Bill Nelson of Florida.

Senator, nice to have you on.

SEN. BILL NELSON (D), FLORIDA: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: So, you are not just a member of Congress. A lot of people may not realize you have been to the space station. You were a payload specialist back in 1996, which is awesome, and a whole other conversation I would love to have with you.

But when you hear this news -- and there's your picture. Nice job, guys.

When you hear this news finally the this comes back to the U.S. that we get to get our men and women up to the ISS, what does that mean for you?

NELSON: Well, of course, the interim is tough. But we had to shut down the space shuttle. The investigation of the last destruction of Columbia mandated that. And they said replace it with a safer rocket. And if you look at the designs of these two that are being announced

today by NASA, you will see the crew is in a capsule on the top of the rocket, so that you could have even an explosion on the pad, and you can save the crew, because the capsule separates to a safe distance, and then either parachutes or comes in under its own power.

BALDWIN: OK. So that's how this would work and safety is, of course, paramount. But when you also think about the space shuttle itself and these different companies who will be helping get these men and women up there, both Boeing and SpaceX, in terms of space coast jobs, because that's a really, really huge deal, a lot of them lost because the shuttle program was shuttered, how will this affect the people back in Florida?

NELSON: Well, it means more jobs.

They're spending upwards of $2 billion, redoing all the infrastructure right now at the Kennedy Space Center. We're going to have one pad that is all commercial rockets. We're going to have another pad for the monster rocket that, by the way, one of its engines will be tested later this year. The capsule will fly for the first time in December.

So all of this is going on concurrently with this award that's being announced today for the commercial companies to take our astronauts to and from the International Space Station.

BALDWIN: OK.

So we will watch for the official announcement from NASA happening at the top of the hour. But, before I let you go, I can't, without just asking, favorite space memory, Senator?

NELSON: Well, of course, what's emblazoned on my mind's eye is looking back at Earth. And it is so beautiful. And yet it looks so fragile.

And to me, as a politician, I looked and I didn't see any political divisions. I didn't look and see any religious or ethnic divisions. I saw the planet that we call home. And we're all in this together.

BALDWIN: Hmm. I could think of some groups of people who sounds like space would do them some good.

Bill Nelson, Senator Bill Nelson, thank you so, so much for coming on. We appreciate it very much from Washington for me today.

NELSON: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Just into us here at CNN, a grand jury will review the Tony Stewart case, the NASCAR driver who hit and killed another driver at that spring car race just last month. We are talking to our legal experts, doing some digging here on exactly what this could mean for Tony Stewart. That's next.

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