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Don Lemon Tonight
Attorney General Eric Holder Resigns; Iraq's Prime Minister Warned of Imminent Attack on the Subway System in New York, Paris; State Trooper Fired on Unarmed Black Man During Traffic Stop; FOX News Host Under Fire After Controversial Remark; Police Chief in Ferguson, Missouri Apologizes to the Family of Michael Brown
Aired September 25, 2014 - 23:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening. This is CNN tonight. I'm Don Lemon.
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Alysin Camerota. It's 11:00 p.m. on the east coast.
New Yorkers got quite a scare when Iraq's prime minister warned of an imminent attack on the subway system here and in Paris. And it only got more complicated with U.S. officials saying it is not true.
LEMON: And we have some big news in Washington. Attorney general Eric Holder is resigning his post. We are going to have the very latest on that for you.
CAMEROTA: Plus, our experts will be here to weigh in on a dramatic scene in South Carolina. It was caught on dashboard camera. It is an unarmed man being shot by a state trooper. What happens next, we will show you.
LEMON: And Lisa Ling is here to talk about her -- her exiting -- her exciting, I should say, excuse me, new series.
Not exiting the series. It's Sunday night. It is right here on CNN. She is also dishing about the changes at her old haunt.
CAMEROTA: I can't wait to hear that.
LEMON: Take time to enjoy "the View" this hour. Right.
CAMEROTA: All right. But let's begin with warning that scared Americans. Senior White House correspondent, Jim Acosta joins us, now, what happened, Jim?
We are obviously having audio problem with Jim Acosta's microphone. He is going to update us about the subway scare that ended up not being accurate.
LEMON: You know, the Iraqi prime minister came out earlier today and said that they had a credible threat, he said threat, or forwarded a threat by ISIS for the subway in Paris, the subway in New York City. And then U.S. counterterrorism official and members of homeland security didn't know about this. And FBI said that they had no idea about this threat. So there was consternation going back and forth and from lawmakers in Washington as well.
CAMEROTA: Right. And it forced the mayor of New York and that police commissioner come out and try to assuage the fears of New Yorkers to say it is OK. In fact we will show you how OK it is. We will ride the subway. Everything is fine.
But of course, the Iraqi prime minister said that he got it from prisoners, from detainees that had given that. Basically what one of our experts said, he is not used to dealing with the American media who takes everything literally and we follow up on things like that.
LEMON: Well, and we should considering what is going on. Air strikes, led by the U.S. But there is a coalition.
CNN's Jim Acosta in Washington tonight. Jim, you know -- .
JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Is it working now?
LEMON: Ii is working now.
CAMEROTA: We can hear you now.
LEMON: We can here you know. We did a little dancing here.
ACOSTA: That's good.
LEMON: Hey, listen. It scared a lot of people today.
ACOSTA: It really did. I used to live in New York. And so, any time something like this happens, you know, it gets everybody very worried. But let me walk you through this because I think there is sort of a rational explanation here.
This all started when Iraq's new pr prime minister Haider al-Abadi told a small group of reporters that Baghdad intelligence officials had information about an imminent ISIS terror plot aimed at subways in the U.S. like New York City and Paris. And officials from the White House to the FBI director, you know, we were talking to the folks all day. They said they were not aware of such a plot. So a lot of confusion.
Same goes got New York's mayor Bill de Blasio. He went out in front of the cameras today, said people can safely ride the big apple subway system. But earlier this evening to sort some of these confusion out, a big state department official, Brett McGurk went over to Haider al- Abadi and said wait a minute, what is going on here? And Abadi confirmed with Brett McGurk essentially that there is no threat.
According to McGurk, Abadi was only speaking about the danger post by foreign fighters in general terms. So it almost sound as if this was lost in -- literal lost in translation moment that happened over, at the U.N., where the, as you said, Alysin, perhaps the prime minister just didn't exactly have the words right. And people took it as, "whoa, we are talking about an imminent threat, there wasn't one.
LEMON: Yes. As I said, it caused a lot of people to freak out -- no, a little freak out. And I was getting on the subway, they have though -- should I take a taxi, instead? And I said no. And I'm not going to be scared.
CAMEROTA: Good for you, Don Lemon. You are going to show everybody --.
LEMON: Well, I think most New Yorkers did the same thing.
And you know, Jim, I want to talk to you about some other big news out of the White House today. And that is attorney general Eric Holder resigning. He is really one of the last holdouts from, you know, the old Chicago group that came -- (INAUDIBLE), Arne Duncan, the last two and Eric Holder was the third. Now he is going. How did that come about?
ACOSTA: He is very tight with President Obama, Don. And apparently, Eric Holder has been hoping to leave this post for some time. It is one of the toughest jobs in Washington next to being the President. But the President kept asking him to stay on longer. Now it is official. Holder is stepping down as attorney general. We all know that. The question is how soon. A White House official told me the President is likely to take his time making a decision in replacing Holder who had become very close friends with Mr. Obama over the last several years. A relationship that is visible today at the White House. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This is bitter sweet. By with his typical dedication, Eric has agreed to stay on as attorney general until I nominate a successor. And that successor if confirmed by the Senate which means, we will have a chance to add to a prime career of public service, one that began nearly 40 years ago as a young prosecutor in the department that he now runs.
ERIC HOLDER, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: In the months ahead, I will leave the department of justice. But I will never, I will never leave the work. I will continue to serve and try to find a way to make our nation even more true to its founding ideals.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ACOSTA: Now, White House officials say it is not likely the midterm elections that are coming up will accelerate the process of finding Holder's successor. Yes, Democrats could lose the Senate between now and next year. But as one official told me picking a new attorney general is going to be contentious no matter who controls the Senate.
So, you know, there is this political debate here in Washington among Democrats as whether the president should just go ahead and do something now while they still have control of the Senate. But you know, over at the White House talking to people today, Don and Alysin, they seem to think that, you know what, the president is going to take his time and pick who he wants. He wants somebody he can be comfortable with. After all, he is replacing somebody who is very, very close friends with. And the attorney general, as you know, is one of the top cabinet positions in an administration. So he wants somebody there he can trust.
CAMEROTA: Make sense.
Jim Acosta, thanks so much.
ACOSTA: You bet.
LEMON: Other news here tonight, we are talking about a controversial shooting in South Carolina. A state trooper fired on an unarmed black man during a traffic stop. The incident was caught by a dashboard camera.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can I see your license please? Get out of the car! Get out of the car!
(GUNSHOTS)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get on the ground! Get on the ground!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just got my license. You said get my license. I got my license right here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put your hands behind your back. Put your hands behind your back. Put your hands behind your back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What did I do?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put your hands behind your back. Put your hands behind your back.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What did I do, sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you hit?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think so. I can't feel my leg. I don't know what happened. I just grabbed my license.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why did you shoot me?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you dove head first back into your car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm sorry.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You dove back out. I was telling you to got out of your car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm sorry. I didn't hear two words.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Unbelievable.
CAMEROTA: Unbelievable.
LEMON: And he is apologizing for being shot.
CAMEROTA: I think he is in shock.
LEMON: He said -- yes. Like I'm sorry. He didn't look like he was going hit first back in to the --
CAMEROTA: He was getting his license like the official who just told him to.
LEMON: That trooper has been fired and charged with aggravated assault and battery.
CAMEROTA: Let's talk about this incident with Chris Chestnut, an attorney who represented the family of Jonathan Ferrol, an unarmed black man who was fatally shot by police -- by police officer in North Carolina. Mark O'Mara, CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney and Marc Lamont Hill, CNN's political commentator.
Mark O'Mara, let me start with you. What was happening here? What was that police office doing?
MARK O'MARA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, thank God, first of all for dash cams because it is going to make our lives a lot easier figuring of what really happened. Because there is no misinterpretation as to what happened.
You know, it was one of those things where this maybe an example of where the subtle vices against black males that caused interact with showed up. Because when it starts, it doesn't seem to be anything aggressive -- license and registration. But it at the moment that the black guy did anything; that the cop then misinterprets as being an aggressive act, the gun comes out. Thank God he still alive. But it just seems that that momentary over reaction that we can look at and maybe it was based on nothing else but those subtleties that makes it between cops and black males.
LEMON: So I want to get your reaction, and Mark, and you just spoke for long time there. But for just quickly, what is your initial reaction to this video, Mark O'Mara?
O'MARA: It is cop should never have shot that guy.
LEMON: Marc Lamont Hill?
MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I agree. I mean, this is stunning. It was disappointing. It was disgusting. But it really correspond with, again, decade of (INAUDIBLE) research to show. When people have to make a quick momentary judgment and a subjective interpretation of people's behavior, race and forms the decision.
LEMON: All right. Chris?
CHRIS CHESTNUT, ATTORNEY, THE CHESTNUT FIRM: I'm afraid to go outside. I'm afraid to drive. I think there is a serious concern amongst black Americans, especially black men today. What do we do?
LEMON: It is. This is an amazing incident to -- and people say, you know, black men are treated a certain way or treated differently when it comes to dealing with police officers. And when I saw this earlier, I said -- I had the same reaction that you had, Mark O'Mara. I said thank God for the videotape because you got say well, you don't know what he did. Did he just (INAUDIBLE) to provoke? Provoke the officer. And interactions that many of us have had with the police and you say, you know, I really wasn't doing anything. People don't believe you. This is evidence of that -- Marc Lamont Hill.
HILL: That's exactly right. And we this with Michael Brown, with Trayvon Martin. We always speculating about what happened. And we always seem to get the benefit of the doubt to the people who keep killing unarmed teenagers, unarmed adults, unarmed citizens. That's the problem. This tape is evidence of what many of us have been trying to say for decades.
CAMEROTA: Well, hold on. I mean, there is another lens through which to look at it, Chris. Let me just throw this out to you. First of all, it is easy to think that this was just about that driver being black and there was something subconscious going on with officer. In fact, the driver was pulled over or at least approached for a seatbelt violation.
But there is another element that I want to tell you about. Because this officer was given a medal of valor, earlier, I think a year ago for shooting a bank robber. I guess there was a bank robbery in progress. And so, we was lauded by the community because he did the right thing.
Maybe he was suffering for some sort of PTSD after that incident. You just never know.
(CROSSTALK)
CAMEROTA: Listen. My point is you never know what is in somebody's head.
CHESTNUT: Yes. But I think there are some concerns about even applauding him for shooting someone. He wasn't shooting someone who is threatening a patron at the bank. He shot someone. That's kudos to him but he should not be applauded for that. He shouldn't get an award for that.
CAMEROTA: Well, that's what officers do. I mean, they shoot bank robbers.
CHESTNUT: No, they arrest bad guys.
(CROSSTALK)
HILL: But Alysin, I don't think -- I don't think it necessarily competing claims here. He could have PTSD. And the PTSD can make him more prone to shoot quickly when he perceives a threat. But that doesn't negate the fact that he sees black people as threats more than other people. In fact, that's often the case when people are traumatized. They see threats more quickly and they over react more. But again, race informs that decision. Gender informs that decision. (INAUDIBLE).
O'MARA: You know, there may be another insight to look at this videotape and tell us what it says and that's this. People act in very strange ways under perceived threats, or trauma. I don't think this cop went to that scene to do so. But when he felt threatened, he overreacted in a way that he probably didn't intend and it could have been a tragic result. But it was just an overreacting to a trauma.
CHESTNUT: Why is the gun out on a seatbelt stop? There is no force probably happened here. There is no threat to anyone else. And frankly, this is the middle of the day at a crowded gas station. Look behind him. Look at the cars there. So he is shooting. He hit him twice. He shot four times. There are bullets that are going astray. The citizens are threatened.
LEMON: Listen, police officer under -- police officers have a very tough job. They're under a lot of pressure. But I think, I think, Mark O'Mara is exactly right. It comes -- this is an issue of perception. It is an issue of bias. He could very well be, you know, had a lauded career before this. But in this instance, what the videotape shows, is an overreaction or the wrong reaction to someone who is following his orders.
CHESTNUT: I commend this agency for releasing the video. We still haven't seen the video on Jonathan Farrow's (ph) case.
CAMEROTA: And by the way, Marc Lamont Hill, you should also commend the agency for acting so quickly. This officer was fired and charged with aggravated assault and battery. The system worked here.
HILL: The system worked. Justice is awesome, man. I hope people Ferguson are watching. This is exactly what supposed to happen. The guy violated the rules. They acknowledged they violated the rules. They said his name out loud and they enacted justice. I'm excited to see it happen.
LEMON: But the difference is, though, as of now, there is no videotape for Ferguson. This is very clear. There is video and there is audio. There is evidence here of what is happened, Marc Lamont Hill.
HILL: Well, the difference, though, with the Ferguson, they are not looking for it. The prosecutor said irrespective of what we find. I'm not trying to prosecute.
Look. I'm not saying make up evidence. I'm not saying to have a kangaroo court. I'm just saying have a commitment to truth and justice. That's what we saw here. That's why it worked. That's why I am happy today. I'm not happy to death. I'm happy that justice, in some semblance of justice was formed here.
LEMON: All right, everybody, standby. Just ahead, another professional athlete arrested and charged with domestic assault. CAMEROTA: And the police chief of Ferguson, Missouri publicly
apologizes to the family of Michael Brown. But will he stay in his job? We'll find out.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAMEROTA: Here is some breaking news. There is word that Jeffrey Matthew Taylor of the Charlotte Hornets was arrested this morning on charge of domestic assault. He is yet another professional athlete A facing allegations of domestic violent.
LEMON: And we are back now with Chris Chestnut, Mark O'Mara and Marc Lamont Hill.
Before we get to that. I want to -- can we get to this NBA story regarding Ray Rice. Because tonight, we are hearing that law enforcement source claims that they sent the second Ray Rice video to the attention of the NFL of the security chief that was back in April. He has responded saying he didn't see it. But does this change anything, Marc Lamont Hill?
HILL: Well, it doesn't change many of our perceptions. Over a week ago, I said I didn't believe the NFL. But in terms of what happens, I think it is going to put greater scrutiny on the NFL to make a case that they really didn't know. It doesn't pass the basic smell test here. People don't believe it. And if turns out that Roger Goodell knew something or was so extravagant trying to give him plausible deniability, he is going to have to go. At some point, it looks like he just lied to us and that is a problem.
CAMEROTA: OK. Mark O'Mara, they are making the case that they didn't know. Here is the case that they're making. They released this statement. They say that the head security who supposedly saw it that "I unequivocally deny that I received at any time a copy of the video and I had not watched it until it was made public on September 8th." So.
O'MARA: And if he is -- if he is that incompetent, he should be fired from his job. If that thing hangs in his office or on his desk for six months and he is going to tell us now, he didn't take the time to look at event. That would be in discussed for six months. He should be fired. Quite honestly, I don't believe that someone would write a statement that they owned the office, that they run it and then he didn't know anything about it.
LEMON: We have another case now of an athlete who is being charged with domestic abuse. And we mentioned the Charlotte Hornets player, Jeffrey Matthew Taylor arrested this morning on the charge of domestic assault and list of destruction of property.
Do you expect to see more cases like these reported in pro-sports? I believe the light has been shown on this. And I think more people are going to start coming out and talking about this and being more open about it, Chris?
CHESTNUT: I think it is. And I think it is also the power of social media. Social media promotes social justice. And these leagues should be held accountable, not only for training athletes about domestic violence and how to deal with contentious situations other than violently. But also, you know, let's look at statistics on a number of athletes who end up broken in the NFL, such a short time after leaving the league. Then you have got a $40 million CEO who says he doesn't even, not only doesn't watch the video. He doesn't feel a duty to watch the video.
So there are a lot of issues and leadership, I think, in the league that need to be addressed both in the NFL and NBA who is also experiencing some issues with racial discrimination.
LEMON: Very good point.
CAMEROTA: Mark, we want to talk about another developing crime story. More breaking news that happened today. And that was, of course, that police announce that they had in custody the suspect in the UVA missing student case, Jesse Matthew. He was wanted in Virginia. He was arrested in Texas. Here is his perp walk. They are charging him with something peculiar, charge abduction with intent to defile Hannah Graham. Some people think that they're actually isn't enough evidence here. We don't know about any forensic tests. They haven't come back yet. What do you think of this arrest?
O'MARA: Well, probable cause is not hard to come up with when you are trying. And the investigators certainly were looking for him. They wanted to have a good reason to bring him in. So the probable cause warrant is what they used.
I defer to them for a few days because they said they had probable cause. They want to talk to him. They don't want him getting lost. My concern is that when they're going to do that that they don't do anything more than they need to.
I was very concerned that they already talked about some event 12 years ago where he wasn't charged. And they seem to be trying to do not just the visual perp walk, but now the digital perp walk of trying to bring out information to incorporate into his mold.
LEMON: Mark, let's explain to our viewers what happened and then we can continue talk about. Because we are learning tonight that Jesse Matthew was investigated for sexual assault at Liberty University back in 2002. You were talking about this according to Lynchburg Police and the Virginia commonwealth attorney. Matthew said the woman consented ultimately. She decided she didn't want to go forward with the case. And there was not enough evidence for the authorities to move forward with any charges.
So, would that be usable in court proceedings? How might that affect this case? You continue your thought, Mark and then get the others.
O'MARA: I don't think there would be anywhere near admissible in any trial he may have on this particular case. That's why I don't like the cops doing something like that because they just turn the public against him. Turn the potential jury against him when it is really irrelevant information. LEMON: Chris, quickly?
CHESTNUT: Agreed. It is inadmissible on court. This seems like inconspicuous are obvious way of tainting a jury pool. It is inappropriate for the law enforcement to release this information, I think, at this time because it would be inadmissible at his trial.
LEMON: Inadmissible. Marc Lamont Hill, not surprising correct?
HILL: Not surprising. And I agree with legal experts, man. This is bad stuff here. Again, he might be a terrible guy. But he deserves due process and appropriate legal protects.
LEMON: Thank you, gentlemen.
CAMEROTA: Thanks so much, gentlemen. Good to see you.
All right, coming up, offensive or political stick; that is the question being asked after a FOX News host quips about a female pilot flying a mission against ISIS. We will tell you what he said and we will tell you the update from tonight and then you can decide for yourself.
LEMON: I can't wait to hear what you have to say.
CAMEROTA: I can't wait to hear that also.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: All right, here we go. FOX News host under fire after a controversial remark that he made about a female fighter pilot flying an airstrike mission against ISIS referring to her service as boobs on the ground.
CAMEROTA: Let's bring in Brian Stelter. He is our CNN senior media correspondent and host of CNN's "RELIABLE SOURCES."
So this is on FOX's "the Five." And they bat around all sorts of, you know, fun hot topics. And it was at the very end and Kimberly Guilfoyle.
BRIAN STELTER, CNN HOST, RELIABLE SOURCES: Right, one of the hosts.
CAMEROTA: -- who was trying to make this great point that this first female fighter pilot for the United Arab Emirates had just done this mission for ISIS and one of her co-hosts, Eric Bolling, seemed --
LEMON: Well, listen. That someone says she could bomb them but she couldn't park it.
(CROSSTALK)
CAMEROTA: Let's watch it. Let's watch it and see what happens.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, FOX NEWS, THE FIVE: Major Miriam Al-Monsuri and to did this remarkable, very exciting. I wish it was an American pilot. I will take a woman doing this any day to them. I hope that hurt extra bad for you because in some Arab countries women can't even drive. Her nickname, per Jennifer Griffin, Lady Liberty.
GREG GUTFIELD, FOX HOST, THE FIVE: : After she bombed it she couldn't park it.
GUILFOYLE: Now, did you really have to ruin it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I salute the.
ERIC BOLLING, FOX HOST, THE FIVE: Would that be considered boobs on the ground or no?
GUILFOYLE: My goodness.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What kind of --
GUILFOYLE: You ruined my thing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: Ago head, Brian, your thoughts?
STELTER: Well, I was going to be outraged. And I chose not to be. Once you look at program as "the Five" as entertainment and not as news, you better understand what they're going for, you know. There are some important great journalists at FOX News, just like there are across television. But, those hosts are more like entertainers. And that's what I think we were seeing there. It is easier to dismiss it than be outraged by it. But I do bet that both of those men got a good talking to afterwards.
LEMON: Thank you for saying that. I watched it because I watched it. It's, you know, and I occasionally watch "the Five." And I looked at. I didn't see this live. But I looked at it online and I said what's everyone -- come on, lighten up, people? I'm sure the feminists are going to be mad at me. And listen, I am a male feminist. I grew up in a house full of women, by single mother and all sisters. I get it.
But sometimes a joke is just a joke. And so you say that to the audience. I don't know if he needed to apologize. But come on, people.
CAMEROTA: Well, I mean, I'm sure that he got a lot back from that. And in fact he did apologized. I mean, I know what was going on on "the Five" there. I know these guys. They're all -- they're former colleagues.
LEMON: People are watching. They don't know what they're going to say and they are actually entertaining.
CAMEROTA: Of course.
LEMON: They dent go, when around the country there is a feminists are going to. Come on.
CAMEROTA: No. But also, I know -- they were going for the cheap joke. They are being juvenile. They are just -- it doesn't mean there was anything bad in their hearts. But Eric Bolling did apologized today. We should mention. He apologized at the end of the program because he did get a lot of criticism for that. And he says, I made a joke. And when I got home I got the look, he is talking about his wife I assume.
STELTER: There it is.
CAMEROTA: And I said, sorry, to my wife. I apologize to you all. And I want to make that very clear.
STELTER: And you know, no, you can say boobs on television. That's what I learned from this.
CAMEROTA: There you go.
STELTER: So that was interesting.
LEMON: Many people and many of my guests have called me a boob.
STELTER: "The Five," you know, you seen a lot of those shows like that on cable news because it does work. There is something about, not knowing what those folks are going to say next. It worked on "the View" in the 90s. It works for them. And we are seeing copy of them.
(CROSSTALK
LEMON: And I think that, what was worse than people to pick up, was the saluting thing. I mean, you know what that means? That was even, if you really think about it.
CAMEROTA: You are suggesting?
LEMON: No.
CAMEROTA: I don't like the thought of not this salute.
LEMON: No, no. Not that one.
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: That's why I think both stories belong in the same category. Much adieu about nothing.
STELTER: These are narratives they went out over real news. Latte salute. That was kind of made up narrative. It wasn't real news. But it sure, it is the kind of thing that goes viral and gets people excited.
LEMON: Why don't we talk about real news.
CAMEROTA: Yes. I'm interested in the interview that you did with the, Islamic, the extremist, cleric. STELTER: Yes. I woke up to a shock this morning. He was arrested.
CAMEROTA: And so, tell us about your impressions.
STELTER: I had him on "RELIABLE SOURCES" about three weeks ago, wanted to talk to him, because he uses the media in, in incendiary ways.
LEMON: Hold that thought. Let's listen.
STELTER: Let's watch it. Yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STELTER: You talk about wanting the truth to prevail, but here's what bothers me. When we were setting up or our interview here, the audio engineer asked you to do every guest us to count to ten to check the mic. You started to do that. But then you said, 9/11, 7/7, 3/11. Is this all some sort of joke to do that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you know, if you had a sense of humor, maybe you would have laughed. It was just a sound check, you know. And you shouldn't take any of these things that seriously. Obviously, you know -- .
STELTER: A sense of humor? A sense of humor?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were setting -- we were setting up the sound check. And I said, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 9/11, 7/7. Making sure that you could hear me. It is not a big issue. It is not a big deal. If you want to make it a big deal, by all means do so. But it means -- it makes you look much more shall low really than me.
STELTER: I have nothing more to say.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STELTER: I actually was speechless. And I was trying to wrap up the interview, but I was speechless because I thought he would pretend to apologize for something like that.
CAMEROTA: And you know, that's sickening. I mean, it is sickening. He is really sort of poking you and, the American audience in the eye.
STELTER: And yet, the conversation we all been having all evening. Because it gets to this issue of First Amendment right to say anything and not something that is in every other country, you know, to have a band group the way that he is allege to have been associated with in Britain. That's not a concept we have here in the United States. And we are thankful for that.
So, I relate to what Marc Lamont Hill and the other guests were saying a few minutes ago about a very different story. We still have to give this guy, even this guy, the benefit of the doubt because we don't know exactly what he was arrested for. And what the authorities are accusing him of. And God, it is hard in cases like this to have to have that restraint and that to have that care.
LEMON: Well, beyond that. I mean, that is beauty of America that you do have freedom of speech here. And that's -- what people hate about our country. But that's what we love and that's what makes us so great.
CAMEROTA: Right. He is allowed to say all that. But it is possible that he is still a radical troublemaker.
LEMON: Yes.
STELTER: And somebody who is believed to be recruiting others, you know, to that cause. Even if he is just an, in an air conditioned studio spouting off. He may be recruiting others to the cause. And yet, us, as, for us journalists this is the hardest time to ask tough questions and be skeptical. And to the time of war that we have to do that more than ever.
LEMON: Yes. Thank you, Brian Stelter.
CAMEROTA: Nice to see you, Brian.
STELTER: You too. Thanks.
LEMON: Up next, a report that looks at policing across America in the wake of what happened in Ferguson, Missouri and other communities when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Police chief in Ferguson, Missouri says he intends to remain in his job. But today, nearly seven weeks after the shooting of Michael Brown he issued this video statement.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THOMAS JACKSON, FERGUSON POLICE CHIEF: I want to say this to the Brown family. No one who has not experienced the lost of a child can understand what you are feeling. I am truly sorry for the loss of your son. I am also sorry that it took so long to remove Michael from the street.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Chief Jackson also said that his department does not intentionally target black residents, but many would disagree. Events in Ferguson have other police departments around the country taking a close look at their policing standard.
Miami-Dade County has long practiced community policing as a means of establishing better relationships with the public. That's sometimes at something that may have prevented what happened in Ferguson, Missouri and other communities.
More tonight from CNN's Susan Candiotti.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Lieutenant Gary Oliver works a high crime neighborhood where shootings and drug deals are part of the zip code.
LT. GARY OLIVER, MIAMI-DADE POLICE DEPARTMENT: We want kids to come out and play without fear of gunfire flying overhead and things like that.
CANDIOTTI: Gunfire, these kids are used to it.
GEORGE DONALD, JR., ARAB RESIDENT: : Ever heard the alarm go off in your car. Ring in your head. Get down and go to my house.
CANDIOTTI: Right up there with fighting crime is jumping another hurdle overcoming police mistrust even among the youngest.
OLIVER: There was this little girl maybe, two, 3-years-old. They were sitting of on the second floor. And, as we were walking by, the little girl says, there is the police. They're here to kill us.
CANDIOTTI: What did you think of that?
OLIVER: It just shocked me. You could hear your child say that and not correct them.
CANDIOTTI: That kind of distrust and frustration spilling into the streets of Ferguson, Missouri after the shooting of unarmed teen, Michael Brown. Since July, a spotlight on allegations of excessive police force against unarmed men including L.A., Salt Lake City, and New York.
A grand jury investigating a police chokehold homicide of Eric Gardner in New York, arrested for allegedly selling loose cigarettes.
In L.A., Ezel Ford (ph), man unarmed walking done a street confronted by police, fatally shot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have had our own Michael Brown.
CANDIOTTI: And in Salt Lake City, five separate investigations into the shooting death of fugitive Dylan Taylor (ph) who his family says did not have a gun.
New York professor, Maria Haberfeld, is tracking cases worldwide.
I think these days we have a sense there are more incidents of alleged excessive use of police force. Is that true?
MARIA HABERFELD, PROFESSOR: No, it is not because of the social media, because everything is on twitter, on facebook. The moment it happens it goes viral.
CANDIOTTI: From 2003 to 2009, the justice department says more than 2,900 people were killed in police homicides, 42 percent white, 52 percent, more than half were minorities. HABERFELD: They need to, the deadly force based on national standard
and not based on how a given police jurisdiction feels they should use it.
CANDIOTTI: In Miami-Dade County, police director, J.D. Patterson says police need to be engaged. Keep diversity in the ranks. Better relating to people.
J.D. PATTERSON, POLICE DIRECTOR, MIAMI-DADE POLICE DEPARTMENT: Even when you are dealing with fear, you have to understand it is not just your fear being brought to the fore. And that might give you've the strength and the insight to understand where they're coming from.
CANDIOTTI: Which is why Lieutenant Oliver and his squad spend every shift in a gated housing project, changing attitudes to avoid another Ferguson.
OLIVER: They play basketball with them. They do, you know, jumping jacks. The kids love them. And that was part of our goal.
CANDIOTTI: Ferguson is having a lot of repercussions. For one thing, it certainly has more police departments around the country, talking more about community policing, doing a better job of getting to know the people they protect, and residents getting to know the people behind the badge.
With a goal of getting parents to better help police keep their neighborhoods safe. Especially after Ferguson, the squad knows they may be under a microscope.
OFFICER MANUEL GONZALEZ, MIAMI-DADE POLICE DEPARTMENT: My goal is to come in here and to clean up my community and to make sure that nothing like that would occur here.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We just let them know. We are human. We are human. You know, they think we are heroes.
CANDIOTTI: For these teens with these officers, it's working.
DONALD: They're not here when stuff happens. They're like, that man and they rob, you know.
CANDIOTTI: So if bad stuff ever does happen, that Batman and Robin bond could pay off down the road.
Susan Candiotti, CNN, Miami-Dade County, Florida.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Thank you, Susan.
How often do you see that? Now, that is real community policing that could prevent a lot of these tragedies from happening.
CAMEROTA: And I think that what Chief Jackson says in terms of his apology seemed really genuine and heart heartfelt. LEMON: Yes. We'll see. We'll see what happens over the next or the
coming days and weeks and months.
We will have to tell you about an exciting new program. And it debuts Sunday right night here on CNN. It is called "this is life with Lisa Ling." She is a journalist and a former co-host of "the View." Up next, she'll tell us about the first episode and get her take on the brand new "View."
CAMEROTA: Good.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: You see here sitting across from us, Lisa Ling officially joins the CNN family with her show, "THIS IS LIFE WITH LISA LING." And each Sunday night, she will look at Americans who are living their lives outside the norm.
CAMEROTA: I'll say. She joins us now with a look at her new show and her take on some other stories in the news.
Lisa welcome to CNN.
LISA LING, CNN HOST, THIS IS LIFE WITH LISA LING: Thank you so much for having me. I am so excited. You know, CNN is the network I have had on consistently and constantly in my home since the Gulf War. And I'm just thrill to be part of the network.
CAMEROTA: That is so great. I have been captivated by watching the promos for your show because it looks so juicy. There is strippers, sugar daddies, there is pill poppers. Explain the concept.
LING: So, this is an exploration into worlds within our world. And yes, the topics are juicy. And what I love about the series is when you hear the topics, you are probably predisposed to thinking a certain thing or having an opinion about them. But when you watch these episodes, I guarantee that you will possibly think differently that you did when you first started.
What we are trying to do is really provoke people to think and ignite conversation. Because no -- you know, these stories aren't so black and white. There are so many shades of gray.
LEMON: And they are underreported stories. Because you used such a -- I know you love what you do. You can tell. You ex-cued (ph) that. You have such a varied background from "the View." You have done documentaries. And you have done this. And this one is really sort of off the radar a little bit, stories that are under reported. That don't you agree?
LING: Well, there are so many -- there are so many American subcultures. There are so many things that are happening that aren't reported on at all. And I have always believed the more we know about each other, the more evolved we are as people. And so my hope is that the audience will watch these shows. And, and, and be prepared to have their perspective widened. And watch with an open mind. And possibly, even -- have, come with a little, be ready to show some compassion.
CAMEROTA: All right. So we have a clip of a sugar daddy and a sugar baby. Our first episode. Yes.
LEMON: Sugar daddy. Sugar baby.
LING: Yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LING: Taylor grew up in a traditional middle-class family. But in her early 20s, she realized her tastes were anything but ordinary.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When I started dating guys, they wanted to go to maybe a fast food burger chain or something. I wanted to go out and experience a different lifestyle. So naturally I ventured out.
LING: Taylor embraced the sugar lifestyle when she was just 22. And this is Rich, her sugar daddy of nearly a decade.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How you doing, you sexy thing. Give me a hug. Give me a hug. How you doing.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good seeing you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You want to get in?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to get in.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let's ride.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sound good.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: That is fantastic.
LEMON: It is a little creepy or a lot creepy. How is it, the question is, how is this different from prostitution?
LING: Well, these days there are a lot of web sites that are trying to facilitate these relationships. I mean, it is kind of a new phenomenon in that regard. And what these people engaged in the sugar lifestyle say is that you can negotiate the terms of your relationship. You know if you are a woman that you want to seek out a man who can help you financially. And you know if you are a man you would like to see out this younger woman for companionship or whatever. And you know, you might agree that if the relationship evolves, sex could become part of the equation, or if you are a young woman who is defiant about fact that she, will not want to have sex, she can be very explicit about that.
CAMEROTA: So what surprised you? As you traveled around the country and looked at subcultures, what was most --?
LEMON: Can I ask you just on this one subject? I hate to interrupt you. But, it reminded me of the Google executive on the yacht, right, met on one of these sites. Did you think about that or talk about that in any of your reporting?
LING: Well, you know, not in this particular episode. But there are dangers in online dating and meeting people that you have never known before. And even in this episode, there is a story that turns out very differently than you might expect. And -- and actually surprised us.
And this was difficult for me to do, to the extent that I have always considered myself a pretty ardent feminist. And so, it was kind of Hard for me to talk to these young women who were seeking these men to pay for college tuition and so on.
But what they said to me, which was kind of interesting, that we are the first generation to grow up being told constantly that we are not going to make as much money as our parents. And with job prospects so dismal, this is a way for us to be able to have our tuition paid for. And, for us to be able to focus on our study. Because some of them were working three jobs and not able to focus on their studies. So it was just a perspective. Not that I am endorsing the lifestyle by any means, but it was the perspective that I had never thought about.
LEMON: maybe that was the most interesting.
CAMEROTA: Right, absolutely. So your horizons have been expanded. And I mean, in other words, you think that none of this is really stereotypical once you get into it.
LING: Absolutely. And that goes for every one of the episodes. You know, I learned something. Every time I immerse myself in different, you know, amongst different people, I always go into it thinking things are going to be one way and always enlightened when I leave a place.
LEMON: Yes. And I think what is interesting is, and I know your work, is that, you don't, it's not judgy or preachy. It is just curiosity.
LING: I try. I try.
LEMON: Right? You just want people to learn about these folks.
LING: Yes. I mean, I don't consider myself an interrogator, I consider myself a communicator. And I really believe that everyone deserves an opportunity to tell their story and I try to let them.
CAMEROTA: I know you don't want to be judgy or preachy, but we do. What do you think of the new "View," the new cast?
LEMON: Will you be a host again?
LING: You know, I have gone to promote some of my projects. But I haven't seen the new "View." I think it is a really interesting cast. And I like all of the people that they have brought on. But I haven't seen it yet.
CAMEROTA: With Rosie and with Whoopi,, there is a lot of attitude now on the set. And when you were on it, were you sort of fighting for oxygen to talk or was there more, everybody got their share?
LING: Yes. I mean, it was the hardest table to get a word in, a drive that I never experienced. And that, I still think holds true today. And "the View" to me was, at its best, when they did have really interesting conversation about politics and about things that were going on. And I hope that this combination of people, because they all, you know, have substantive backgrounds, will engage in that kind of conversation.
LEMON: You are right. I sat around the table, once or twice, and it is really tough. And they tells you when you go in. You have to, you have off to speak even if Barbara, people will be like, my God, it is Barbara Walters. Don't, it's --
LING: It matters.
LEMON: Don't be stunned that it is Barbara Walters. You can talk. You can interrupt Barbara. Just do it respectfully. And I'm like, OK. Yes, ma'am. But I need to say this.
LING: I was in mid-20s doing this, you know. And I had never -- I'm sitting next to Barbara Walters and Meredith Vieira and Star Jones. And every now and then I can get -- we'd all get a kick under the table from Barbara if she needed to talk. We weren't able to do that.
LEMON: Can you book back and go, my God, was I on that show?
LING: Yes, every time tie turn it on. I just can't believe I was part of the show. I had a great time. And I learned a lot from it. But it's just, yes, it is a different environment.
CAMEROTA: I'm kicking Don now under the table.
LEMON: I know. Look where you are now. We are so happy to have you here.
LING: Thank you so much. I am thrilled.
LEMON: Thank you, Lisa ling. The new series is "THIS IS LIFE WITH LISA LING." It airs Sundays, 10:00 p.m. eastern here on CNN. Part of the family. We will be right back.
LING: Did you just kick me.
LEMON: I did. I did kick you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: That is going to do it for us tonight. Thank you so much for joining us. I'm Don Lemon. CAMEROTA: And I'm Alysin Camerota. Our coverage continues now with
John Vause and Dan Asher (ph).
