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At This Hour

Tracking Down People Who Had Contact with Ebola Patient; Ethical Questions about Ebola Patients; Bell Gardens Mayor Shot by Wife

Aired October 01, 2014 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: So @THISHOUR, health officials in Texas are scrambling to track down and locate everyone who came into contact with the first person ever diagnosed with Ebola in the U.S. Now, this is a critical step in preventing the virus from spreading.

There's an unidentified patient right now is in an isolation ward in Dallas in a hospital there we're told he's in critical condition. This is what we do know about him. He left the Ebola hot spot of Liberia September 19, arriving in Dallas, Texas, the next day. He did not feel sick until four hours later. He then went to the hospital and then was sent home. It wasn't until the 28th, though, that he was hospitalized and put into isolation in Dallas.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: And it was yesterday that the CDC confirmed that the patient is, indeed, infected with Ebola.

Dr. Anthony Fauci, the director of the National Institutes of Health, points to a red flag that was missed during the patient's first trip to the emergency room.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTES OF HEALTH: If someone comes into an emergency facility, I mean, that's happening thousands of times a day throughout the country, but what we need to get the word out even more is a simple travel history. So if the emergency room physician had asked this person, do you have any recent travel outside of the country and if the person said, well, I just came back from Liberia, that would have been an enormous red flag for anybody given the publicity that we have.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Just a huge red flag, but we have been told he was not, in fact, asked in that first trip to the emergency room.

I want to bring in our senior medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen. She is outside Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital where the Ebola patient is now being treated.

Elizabeth, what do we know about the condition of this man? ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: We now know that

he is in stable condition so that's certainly an improvement from critical to stable. We've talked before about how Ebola is obviously a very deadly illness, but if managed properly, people can survive. We certainly saw that with the two U.S. patients who were at Emory in August.

PEREIRA: It's interesting to hear Dr. Fauci say that travel history that included travel from Liberia would be a huge red flag. Interestingly, you just got back from Liberia. I'm curious what your screening was like. What did you encounter along the way?

COHEN: You know what, Michaela? It was interesting. In Monrovia, in Liberia at the airport, they were scrupulous about checking. We had our temperature checked three times before we were allowed on the plane, once in the car as we were driving into the airport and then twice in the airport et cetera. We were asked about our exposure, did we meet anyone with Ebola, did we wash bodies, attend burials? We were asked if we had diarrhea or vomiting et cetera and nurses looked at us. You could tell the nurses were looking because they know people lie sometimes and they want to look and see does this person look sick. If so you're sent on for more screening. When I arrived in the U.S., our temperatures were not taken. None of that happened so we returned this past Saturday, myself and my two fellow crew members. We told them web in Liberia covering Ebola, we told them that, no questions about exposures. They did ask me, hey, for 21 days -- or they told me, for 21 days you should watch and see if you develop symptoms of Ebola but they couldn't tell me what those symptoms were. They did not ask my photographer and producer who were there with me. Curiously, they did check our photographers' shoes for mud, which would have nothing to do with Ebola -- Michaela, John?

BERMAN: That's so interesting. Now they're doing this contact tracing where they're trying to go through every person that this Ebola patient may have had contact with in those four days that he was symptomatic but not isolating. You know, are you confident, Elizabeth, they can get to every such person?

COHEN: You know, I -- I feel like they've got a lot of boots on the ground. They have at this point about 11 CDC members here to help with that contact tracing. There's excellent infrastructure in this country so they can go out there and talk to these people, put them in quarantine if they need to.

There is a little question in the back of my mind, you know, when you ask someone who did you have contact with, is he going to remember everybody? Is it possible he might want to protect --

(CROSSTALK)

COHEN: I don't know that I would. Is it possible he might want to -- I don't want to ascribe bad motives but we might want to protect somebody and not mention them for fear the authorities will come after them. I have some concerns.

PEREIRA: Absolutely. And then there's the other question, if you can compel somebody to be tested, and that's something I think we want to explore a little further.

Hey, we want to take advantage of advantage that you're here with us, Elizabeth, and get with us answer for us, if you can, some of the questions that we've been getting from our viewers. They've been using the Twitter, #EbolaQandA. You can do this throughout the day on CNN.

BERMAN: Our first question," is it possible for Ebola to spread via mosquitoes? Like malaria and not to mention a whole bunch of other diseases. If not, why not?

COHEN: I reached out to an expert about this and he said they don't think mosquitoes spread Ebola. In fact, they're quite sure. Here's why. Ebola has been around for 40-something years. When you look at who gets it, it's close contact. If this were mosquito-borne, it would be all over the place in that area. You would have people getting who had no idea why they were getting it. But when someone has Ebola, they know who they got it from, a family member, et cetera.

PEREIRA: Next question, is have somebody using the handle "Debatable." And this is a really good point. "If it takes 21 days for someone to show symptoms, how have they cleared the EMS who transported the patient on 9/28?" They're talking about the ambulance crew that would have transported the patient from Dallas there. They have been given a clear. They were tested negative for Ebola. How could that be?

COHEN: I'm not sure that they were given a clear. They may have tested negative, but I will tell you, a negative test doesn't mean anything. If you have -- if you're infected with Ebola but not yet showing symptoms, you're going to test negative. You only test positive when you start having symptoms. And even then, for the first day or two, it takes a while for it to kick in. So, again, you're going to be negative until you have symptoms, so I highly doubt that they tested these people who were told they're all well, got a negative result and said, "See ya," and sent them on their way.

(CROSSTALK)

PEREIRA: So they'll keep monitoring them?

COHEN: Right. They're monitoring them and telling them to take their temperature and all of that. So I don't think they are in the clear.

PEREIRA: Elizabeth Cohen, fantastic. Thanks so much for joining us. You'll be a busy lady for the next few days for sure.

Continuing, to you at home, if you want to use #Ebolaqanda, @THISHOUR.

BERMAN: I have a lot more questions myself.

PEREIRA: A thousand, and ethical questions, too.

BERMAN: There really are so many.

Ahead, we'll talk about the ethical questions. How concerned should we be? How do hospitals need to respond to that concern? We'll talk to one of the most preeminent medical ethicists about those issues, from screening to bending medical privacy rules.

PEREIRA: And this man. He was the mayor of a California town. He was shot to death by his wife. She has not been charged. We'll give you a look into this terrifying, sad, and bizarre case.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In the unlikely event that someone with Ebola does reach our shores, we've taken new measures so that we're prepared here at home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: That was President Obama speaking in mid-September at the CDC. He called it an unlikely scenario that someone in the United States would end up with Ebola, but we now know it's a reality. A patient with a confirmed case of Ebola is in isolation being treated at a hospital in Dallas.

PEREIRA: Joining us right now, Arthur Caplan, director of the Division of Medical Ethics at NYU's Langone Medical Center.

Professor, great to have you here to talk about the ethical issues that are coming up. You've written an article saying that you get Ebola flashing on the breaking news banners, et cetera, Americans are going to panic. You say, hold on, let's slow our roll a little bit here.

DR. ARTHUR CAPLAN, DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF MEDICAL ETHICS, LANGONE MEDICAL CENTER, NEW YORK UNIVERSITY: Right. No reason to panic. Reason to pay attention, no doubt about that, but not panic. Why? The disease is tough to transmit. The authorities are tracing everybody that this guy came in contact with. So I don't think there's a reason to panic at all. That we shouldn't be doing.

BERMAN: Panic is never a good response.

PEREIRA: It's a bad response.

BERMAN: Generally.

But I do think it's obviously of concern, and of note that this disease, that was not here before, is now here, and someone has it.

CAPLAN: And it came in on an airplane as opposed to bringing somebody here. I think that's --

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: Exactly.

CAPLAN: That's the important thing. BERMAN: You do say some of the ethical things we need to face. Let me give you a list. Rigorously screening plane and ship passengers. Publicizing hospital procedures. Clarifying the rights of patients' relatives. Deciding who pays for treatment of the uninsured. And considering bending medical privacy rules. I think number five there is the one that will flash out for a lot of people. Why bend privacy rules?

CAPLAN: We have a lot of speeches, we've seen CDC and NIH and many officials say, "Don't worry, we're tracing, we're doing this and that." Normally, it wouldn't be anybody's business who you saw, how you went to the hospital, and so on. But in this situation, to avoid the panic, I think you have to earn the trust, and I think we should get more information. I don't need this guy's name. I don't need his family's name. I don't need to know where they live, but I would like to know when he got to the airport did he take a taxi. If he went in a taxi did he go to a restaurant? If he went to a restaurant and the hospital, how did he get there? Tell that story in more detail because then you get people saying, look, no one did get sick, I trust what they're telling me. What I'm worried about is you can't presume trust in what the public health officials say, you have to earn the trust. So a little more information.

PEREIRA: I wanted to ask you about something that you made a point of asking both John and I as you sat down. He looked at us and said, "You guys got your flu shot?" And I thought you were going off on a tangent, Professor, but you say there's a connection to this.

CAPLAN: There's a tight connection. Why? What are the symptoms of Ebola? Flu-like symptoms. I know a lot of people are paying attention to this. But a lot of people who have flu like symptoms, I better go to the E.R. because maybe I've got Ebola. They didn't hear us say, "You weren't near Africa." They just heard flu-like symptoms. Get the flu shot, rule it out.

(CROSSTALK)

CAPLAN: Gets it out of the way. So it's a strange connection but an important one.

BERMAN: You are an important voice of reason, Professor Caplan. Thank you very much for coming in and talking us to.

CAPLAN: My pleasure.

BERMAN: I'm afraid we may have to do it again --

PEREIRA: Yeah, for more issues.

BERMAN: -- because we'll face these issues for some time in the United States.

CAPLAN: Yeah.

PEREIRA: Thank you. BERMAN: Ahead @THISHOUR, police say the mayor of a Los Angeles suburb

was shot to death by his wife but she has not been charged with any crime. Why is that? What led up to this? We have a live report ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PEREIRA: Sad story to tell you out of California today. Police say the mayor of Bell Gardens, just outside of Los Angeles, was shot and killed by his wife. They believe it happened during a domestic dispute. Daniel Crespo was just 45 years old, mayor of that community. His wife has not been charged with a crime.

BERMAN: Yeah, so why? That's one of the unanswered questions here.

We're joined by our Kyung Lah in Los Angeles.

Kyung, police have released more details about what led up to this incident. What can you tell us?

KYUNG LAH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, what we do know is that there was an argument. It began as a verbal argument in the home between the mayor and his wife, Levette. It became very heated. Their 19-year- old son, present at the time, he tried to intervene. It became a physical fight between the mayor's son and the mayor. The wife, Levette, left the room, somehow came back with a handgun. We don't know who owns this handgun. And she shot her husband four times. It's important to note that the mayor also has a job as a probation officer in that region. So we don't know exactly what happened after that. What neighbors do tell us is that they heard the son screaming. They called the police.

The mayor and his wife, married 28 years. High school sweethearts. She was briefly taken into custody but homicide detectives released her -- John?

PEREIRA: So the question, Kyung, then, is why wasn't she charged? Do we know anything about the circumstances?

LAH: Very good question. It's a natural question. We just don't know why. The detectives had not specifically said exactly why they decided to release her. But in cases like this, what they operate on, detectives here, is probable cause. There just, in this case, most likely, wasn't enough probable cause to hold her, to arrest her. We know that they have handed the case over to the prosecutor's office here in Los Angeles. And prosecutors will make the final determination of whether there should be official charges.

BERMAN: Whenever you see a chief executive, whether of a state or a city, being killed, this is a rare thing.

PEREIRA: A rarity. Different circumstances.

BERMAN: But it's rare, Kyung.

LAH: Fairly rare, I would say. If you look back in history, we asked our research department to see what they could find. We actually found seven cases of sitting mayors who were shot, from the Chicago mayors to the San Francisco mayors.

PEREIRA: Such tremendous sadness. I know Los Angeles is reeling. Bell Gardens, specifically. Our thoughts go out to that community right now.

And hopefully, Kyung, you can help us understand this story better as days progress. Thanks so much for that.

We're going to stay in California in our next block and we'll tell you about some young people who are hacking the hood. Doesn't sound good. It is. I'll tell you how it is and how it's being rewarded by a big tech company.

(CROSSTALK)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PEREIRA: Let's take you to Oakland County, California, and tell you about a problem called Hack the Hood. It's the latest in our series called "The Science of Work." Had an opportunity to speak with a young man who is fighting for his American dream with hope.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA (voice-over): Matt Ho came to America when he was just a year old.

MATT HO, CHASING THE AMERICAN DREAM: My parents fought on the side of the United States during the Vietnam War. They were imprisoned for eight years. I'm a product of two refugees that endured a lot of hardships to get me here to America.

PEREIRA: But chasing the American dream wasn't always easy.

HO: I grew up in Oakland, living in apartments and my mom was robbed with a gun to her head.

PEREIRA: Ho says his escape was to play video games and he taught himself how to write computer code. The youngest of six, he sees his siblings struggle.

HO: All my brothers worked two jobs and my sisters worked all day from 9:00 to 7:00 at a nail salon.

PEREIRA: At 21, Ho is on a different track. He joined Hack the Hood, a non-profit that teaches students how to build websites for businesses.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We work with kids of color, folks who have historically been left out of the technological conversation.

HO: When I first came to Hack the Hood, I was lost. I had the skills to code but I didn't have an outlet to put my work out there.

PEREIRA: Ho designed several websites including one for Woody's Cafe and Laundromat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The whole process was seamless. In about a week or so, we had this amazing website.

PEREIRA: Ho is now studying computer science at U.C.-Davis. He's the first in his family to go to college.

HO: When I graduate, I'm planning on maybe starting a start-up company. My first real investment is going to be buying my parents a house. I feel like that's going to make them really proud.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BERMAN: Follow that guy.

PEREIRA: I know.

BERMAN: I have a feeling we're going to be hearing from him on the billionaires' list in a few years.

PEREIRA: You will. Hopefully, it will spread. Google awarded Hack the Hood with $500,000. That allows the organization to train more than 5,000 young people. Again, we hope the spreading will happen there.

Let's not forget that's the first kid in his family to go to college. That's a big deal for that family and that community.

We're talking about kids. One of the biggest problems we have in our schools right now, bullying. Today, the 1st of October, kicks off National Bullying Prevention Month. Yesterday, I had the opportunity to host a panel conversation with some educators. Cartoon Network set up this website and this whole platform called "Stop Bullying, Speak Up." Their goal is for one million kids, parents, educators, celebrities, newscasters to submit videos vowing to speak up if they witness someone being bullied. You can take the pledge yourself or spread the word on Twitter.

BERMAN: What a great cause that is as well.

PEREIRA: It was really interesting. You know this one researcher told us, in the 13 years she's researched, only four families admitted that they had a child that was a bully. Think about how many victims there were.

BERMAN: Right.

That's it for us. Thanks for watching. I'm John Berman.

PEREIRA: And I'm Michaela Pereira. See you tomorrow.