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Feds: Chicago Teen Busted On Way To Join ISIS; Is U.S. Winning Online War Against ISIS?; Airstrikes Take out ISIS Fighters; U.S. to Ramp Up Ebola Airport Screenings

Aired October 07, 2014 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: He faces up to 15 years in prison if he's found guilty. Federal agents busted Kohn at O'Hare airport. They say he was on his way to Turkey to meet up with an ISIS contact he met online. The Pentagon says these people who gravitate to ISIS are, of course, worrisome.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REAR ADMIRAL JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: This foreign fighter threat. The idea that people could get radicalized either here or over there and then learn skills, terrorist capabilities and bring them back home.

In fact, it's not just something that Secretary Hagel or those in the United States government is concerned about, it's something that foreign governments all over the world are worried about. Particularly in Europe so it remains a real threat.

When we talk about the immediacy of the threat that ISIL poses, that's a big component of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: CNN Money tech correspondent, Laurie Segall, joins me now. Laurie, you've been talking to Khan's friends online. Seriously he was going to join a humanitarian group for ISIS? Has he watched anything else online?

LAURIE SEGALL, CNN MONEY TECH CORRESPONDENT: What's surprising is when you talk to his friends online, they say he went to a predominantly Muslim school, that he took some time off to go and memorize the Koran, but they all said he was smart. He was funny. He was social. They were all shocked.

That's what every single one of them used. Of course, I went online and decided to look at his digital presence. Look at his Facebook page and there was one indicator, you're looking at it now. Those lions, if you talk to any terrorism expert, they'll tell you that those lions, that image is overwhelmingly used by ISIS supporters.

You look at the rest of his Facebook profile, however, he talks about liking "The Walking Dead" "Muslims For Peace." So you really don't put the two and two together. But one of his friends actually help me gain access to his restricted Facebook page. Looked at some of his Facebook status updates before the arrest. From September 2nd, this one will surprise you. He says "ISIS's actions are just going to make our lives harder." That's something you would think someone about to get on a plane would say.

Another one right before he was arrested, he said, "Sometimes I wish I could go to the desert, study Koran and be a shepherd, a simple life away from this craziness."

So when you look at his digital presence, you don't immediately think this guy is an extremist. I've been looking these guys and a lot of them are very extremist, but the feds must have had something pretty powerful to be able to go pick him up right there, you know.

COSTELLO: While he was on his way to the Middle East. We don't know who he was meeting. You also looked at this guy's YouTube page. Did that show anything suspicious?

SEGALL: You know, it was also a mix. He actually commented on a lot of very religious videos, which is gets you thinking well, you know, how religious, how extreme was he being? But he also talked about his love of vice news.

He commented on "Godzilla," the trailer and on the Boston bombings, he had some comments on that. So when you put all of these together, it's hard to wrap your head around this, but you begin to think that the feds must have been monitoring for a long time and there must be something besides this digital foot print that is pretty damming.

COSTELLO: Laurie Segall, thanks so much. I appreciate it.

So this guy Mohammed Hamzeh Kahn was all over Facebook. We don't know what led authorities to arrest him, but the Obama administration says its online campaign to stop home grown terrorism -- like we're watching right here -- is working. And listen to what a top State Department official told CNN.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD STENGEL, UNDER SECRETARY OF STATE FOR PUBLIC DIPLOMACY AND AFFAIRS: I think we are stopping them and I think that very few Americans are --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What evidence do you have?

STENGEL: We have evidence that there are young people who are not joining because we have somehow interceded, that they're reading messages, hearing messages not just from us, but from the hundreds of Islamic clerics who have said that this is a perversion of Islam.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: With me now, Jeff Bardin, chief intelligence officer for Treadstone 71. He is on the phone and Arselon Iftikar, senior editor of "The Islamic Monthly" and founder of themuslimguy.com. Welcome to both of you. JEFF BARDIN, CHIEF INTELLIGENCE OFFICER, TREADSTONE 71 (via telephone): Good morning.

COSTELLO: Welcome, Jeff. I'll start with you. The U.S. says it's persuading Americans not to become home grown terrorists. Do you agree?

BARDIN: I don't think it's very effective at this point. The message is still clear and online. It's being broadcast over multiple social networking sites. I don't see it changing much at all at this point.

COSTELLO: So that State Department official was just talking?

BARDIN: Well, they're taking steps to do it, but what I look at is their messages are all over YouTube and Facebook and I think it would be very easy to shut these sites down, largely -- you don't have to issue a warrant for arrest for these folks or read them their Miranda Rights.

They are violating the terms of services of these sites and they actually need to be taken down. That's one way to shut this down. If this was an earlier time, say World War II, there's no way we would allow the enemy to be continuing to communicate through our newspapers.

It doesn't make sense that we allow this type of communication as a method of recruitment to continue at this point.

COSTELLO: There are many out there who agree with Jeff, who are amazed ISIS is able to conduct such an effective online campaign, not just to recruit but promote. Perhaps "Saturday Night Live" said it best. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are underestimated how effective ISIS would be at social media. They blew us out of the water.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With all due respect, Mr. President, you had a historically effective social media campaign in 2008. How could you be worse at social media than a band of terrorists in a desert in Syria?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Steve, you don't understand. These terrorists have nothing to do. They can be tweeting all day. And I'm talking peak hours between 11:00 a.m. and 3:00 p.m. When they can maximize faves as well as RTs, those are retweets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So I know it's a comedy routine, but they have a point, don't they?

ARSALAN IFTIKHAR, SENIOR EDITOR, "THE ISLAMIC MONTHLY": Well, Carol, I think it's important for people to keep in mind that, you know, when you have isolated lone wolves like Mohammed Hamza Khan, that essentially are self-radicalizing themselves on the internet.

And we know that anything can be found on the internet. You go to Facebook, YouTube, Twitter. You can find good things and you can find bad things. And I think what's important to keep in mind is that it is succeeding in that.

You know, only 10 or 12 people from the United States, a population of 300 million people, would even contemplate doing such things and I think a lot of that has to do with self-policing within the Muslim community within the United States, at mosques and amongst leaders and thinkers.

I think it's important that the resounding messages sent on places like CNN is that Muslims condemn terrorism and if anybody breaks the law they should be held accountable. And I'm glad this young man was arrested and I think that shows the success of our law enforcement agencies.

COSTELLO: Also, Jeff, there is a story out there today that a Taliban member inadvertently tweeted his location. Could social media also backfire on terrorist groups?

BARDIN: Absolutely. I'm not saying shut it down completely. There's definitely needs out there to infiltrate their sites and to gather information and gain data upon them. We've also known, though, that the Taliban have been operating from Pakistani territory. This is just a validation of the mistake he made with respect to turning on location services.

On the other hand some of the first things you do against enemies is disrupt their command-and-control and especially communication. We take away their safe haven on the ground, but we have not done so on the internet.

COSTELLO: And Arsalan, if the Muslim community flooded social media, would that be more effective than the government doing it?

IFTIKHAR: Well, you know, that I'm glad you brought that up, Carol, because the community has -- there have been numerous viral hashtag campaigns like "not in my name" or "Muslims against ISIS" where hundreds of thousands of Muslims from around world are holding up posters.

And rally signs saying "Muslims Against ISIS" to push back against the narrative that this is somehow indicative of Muslims or Islamic culture. So I think social media can play the great equalizer as well in terms of Muslims pushing back against ISIS and related organizations.

COSTELLO: Jeff Bardin, Arsalan Iftikhar, thanks to both of you. I appreciate it.

IFTIKHAR: Thanks, Carol.

COSTELLO: The fight against ISIS is growing more intense by the day. This morning we're learning that 29 suspected ISIS fighters were killed overnight, most of them in airstrikes near Mosul, Iraq. Five coalition airstrikes pounded Kobani, a critical town on the border of Syria and Turkey. That happened overnight.

This is the town where ISIS is trying to wrestle control from Kurdish fighters. CNN's Phil Black is just outside of Kobani where hundreds have been killed in weeks of fighting.

PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Carol, the accounts coming from within Kobani match what we are hearing and seeing here across the border in Turkey. We're hearing the sound of aircraft overhead often followed by large explosions around the perimeter of Kobani.

All sides, the biggest explosions we think we've seen in the weeks we've watching this battle unfold behind us. Those in the city strongly believe that they are coalition airstrikes and they're pretty thrilled because the situation for those Kurdish fighters resisting ISIS is increasingly dire.

ISIS is now in the city. The fighting is street to street. It is intense. We're hearing about heavy casualties on both sides and those Kurdish fighters, the some thousand that do remain, believe they cannot hold out indefinitely without more help from the outside. And what they're talking about there is more coalition airstrikes. Carol, back to you.

COSTELLO: Phil Black reporting for us this morning.

In other news, secret waiting lists and long wait times at VA hospitals across the country. Now four senior officials inside the Department of Veterans Affairs are in the process of being fired. They may not be the only ones.

Senior White House correspondent, Jim Acosta, is here now with more. Good morning, Jim.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. That's right. The Department of Veterans Affairs was given this new authority earlier this summer to speed up the process of firing top officials who've been accused of wrongdoing and after those allegations are substantiated, that's exactly what the VA is doing right now.

We got this word overnight that the VA is removing four top officials. One in Washington that appears to be not related to the secret waiting list scandal. But look at these other systems that are affected, Carol, Pittsburgh, the director of the VA system there removed according to the press release coming from the Department of Veterans Affairs.

It was for allegations of conduct unbecoming a senior executive were substantiated. So some pretty tough language. Also in Central Alabama and Dublin, Georgia, in that Dublin, Georgia, case, Carol, it says that allegations of data manipulation were substantiated.

That talks about those secret waiting lists, the hiding of long wait times that plagued many, many veterans out there and resulted in some very poor and substandard care and in some cases potentially deaths.

And, Carol, we want to put out a quote to you that the deputy secretary of the Veterans Affairs Department put out on this saying -- and this is what you were just talking about, Carol, about how there may be more to come.

He says the VA will actively and aggressively pursue disciplinary action on those who violate our values. There should be no doubt when we discover evidence of wrongdoing, we will hold employees accountable.

Carol, it's important to point out that in some of these cases where firings took place it was the work of our CNN investigative team led by Drew Griffin that did a lot of the reporting on this that resulted in what we are seeing today and as the VA seems to be suggesting, more may be on the way -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right, I know you'll keep us posted. Jim Acosta reporting live from the White House.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, new hope for the Ebola patient fighting for his life. CNN's Elizabeth Cohen is in Dallas. Good morning.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Carol, we know that the patient here started getting this experimental drug nearly a week after he'd been in the hospital. Is that too late? The family is praying for his life.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Tackling Ebola on two fronts in the United States. President Obama is promising protocols for the screening of more airline passengers while doctors in Dallas are hopeful an experimental drug will help treat a patient fighting for his life.

CNN's senior medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen, is in Dallas with more for you. Good morning, Elizabeth.

COHEN: Good morning, Carol. We're told that the patient inside here, Thomas Eric Duncan, he began receiving an experimental drug called Brincidofovir ten days after he started feeling sick. Now, that could be an issue. It's best to get this drug as soon as possible.

Ten days is actually quite a bit of time considering how quickly Ebola attacks its victims. Nevertheless, his family is praying that it works.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I consider this a top national security priority.

COHEN (voice-over): U.S. efforts to keep Ebola out of the country now ramping up. With President Obama announcing the development of new screenings at U.S. airports to detect those who may be carrying the virus. PRESIDENT OBAMA: The procedures and protocols that are put in place must be followed.

COHEN: What those protocols are, yet to be determined. A federal official tells CNN it could include temperature readings for passengers arriving from infected countries. Something that takes place now as passengers leave those countries.

This, amid a frightening new development, a Spanish nurse's assistant becomes the first person to contract Ebola outside of Africa in this outbreak. The woman helped treat a Spanish missionary and priest, both contracting Ebola in West Africa, and dying after returning to Spain.

An investigation now under way to find everyone the assistant came into contact with while contagious. This as Thomas Eric Duncan, the Ebola patient seen here when he arrived in Dallas on September 20th, is now being given an experimental drug called Brincidofovir.

Originally developed to treat viruses like smallpox. Duncan couldn't be given ZMapp, another drug used on two Emory University patients who survived. Duncan remains in critical condition, but his family hopes for the best.

WILFRED SMALLWOOD, HALF-BROTHER OF THOMAS ERIC DUNCAN: We know he is going to be OK. After he receives the drops, he'll be fine.

COHEN: The fifth American to contract Ebola, NBC cameraman, Ashoka Mukpo, strong enough to walk off a plane Monday in Omaha from Liberia. Health officials at the Nebraska Medical Center where he is being treated say, they are preparing for the worst as the disease runs its course.

DR. BRAD BRITIGAN, INFECTIOUS DISEASE SPECIALIST: In most cases, the symptoms tend to progress over a period of time.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: Elizabeth, another question surrounding Mr. Duncan. I know contacts of Duncan's are being monitored. They haven't had contact with him for at least nine days and they're healthy. Does that mean they're clear?

COHEN: They're not quite in the clear, Carol, but it's definitely a good sign. On average when people get Ebola it's within 10 days of having a contact to someone who's sick. So they are nearing the end of that window and so that would certainly be an optimistic sign.

However, they're still going to follow all of these contacts for 21 days until October 19th because that's just an average. It might take longer than that.

COSTELLO: Elizabeth Cohen reporting live from Dallas. Thanks.

A bit of breaking news, Britain's counterterror police have arrested four people suspected of planning a terror attack. A statement says two of the men aged 20 -- one of the men was aged 20, the other was 21. No shots were fired during these arrests, but one of the men was tasered, though not injured, in the process.

This is what the statement from authorities in Britain are telling us. Following these men's arrests, a number of residential addresses and vehicles are being searched as part of an ongoing investigation into Islamism-related terrorism.

That's all I have for you right now. Of course, we'll pass more along, more information along as it becomes available. I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Well, get this. The idea of a local grocery store may be becoming a thing of the past. A new report says Americans are changing the way they shop for groceries and shifting away from picking up food at traditional supermarkets like Publix and Safeway. You ask, where are they going? The woman in the know is Christine Romans.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: It's so interesting. This has changed so much. It was already starting, but the recession nailed it. People started going to dollar stores. They went to Walmart and big discount retailers more and started putting more grocery there.

So people are not just going to the traditional grocery stores, they're also going to dollar stores and Walmart, Trader Joe's or Whole Foods. They have new categories of fresh foods and limited kind of offering places like Trader Joe's so they have more to choose from.

And the share of your grocery dollar going to the traditional grocery stores is forecast to keep shrinking and shrinking as we find other places to shop for groceries.

COSTELLO: Well, the thing that surprised me is like more and more people are shopping at Whole Foods which, of course, its nickname is Whole Paycheck, but people are flocking there.

ROMANS: They are flocking there, but then you look at Walmart, they're going to start ramping up its organics offerings and so if you're already a value consumer and you can get cheaper organics at Walmart, Walmart could become a competitor at Whole Foods. Think of that. It sounds like two completely different things.

COSTELLO: But it make sense because you get your healthy food at Whole Food and your milk and stuff at Walmart.

ROMANS: People are very price sensitive and that's what we know. I mean, people want the best deal on things and now another trend is people are going to multiple different places. Maybe they'll go to Walmart for some things, but they are going to Trader Joe's because they want something else.

It's going to be interesting for the -- you'll see more consolidation in this report from a real estate tracking firm. Basically, you'll see more consolidation in the grocery stores and you'll see grocery stores adding more.

Have you noticed there's a coffee bar or you can pick up contact lens? You'll see more experiences and hybrid experiences because they have to compete for your dollars and the most important part of this online. A lot of people in your urban areas are buying their groceries online and foregoing the store experience completely.

COSTELLO: Because it's awful. There's nothing like shopping for groceries in New York City. It's like hell on earth.

ROMANS: It is, actually.

COSTELLO: Thanks, Christine.

Still to come, from trusted advisors to stunning disloyalty. That's how one prominent paper sums up the stream of former White House officials who have gone public with their criticisms of President Obama. The latest, Leon Panetta. We'll talk about it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Good morning. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Carol Costello. He was President Obama's defense secretary and a former chief of staff, but now Leon Panetta can add another title -- critic. After taking aim at the president's policies in his new memoir "Worthy Fights."