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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

When Did 2nd Infected Nurse Fall Ill?; Nurse Nina Pham in Fair Condition; Dallas Lab Worker Monitored for Ebola

Aired October 17, 2014 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

BANFIELD: And some breaking news to bring you that actually might be extremely good news coming from overseas. The Nigerian government has apparently been able to broker a cease-fire with the terrorist group Boko Haram. And if you remember, that's the group that captured nearly 276 schoolgirls back in April. Since that time, some of them were able to escape but it is thought that approximately somewhere over 200 have still been held since April.

The cease-fire that the Nigerian government apparently had brokered includes some kind of a deal to return the kidnapped girls.

Here's what we don't know. How many of those girls could be returned because it was widely reported when this began breaking back in April that many of them had been sold into slavery or sold off as wives or had been moved and migrated into different regions within that area. But at this point, the good news is that a government official is telling CNN that a deal was reached yesterday and that the negotiations took months.

We'll continue to update you on this story especially the circumstances involving those kidnapped schoolgirls. But that has been just devastating news and hopefully this is a very bright spot in what's been a terrible, terrible story.

Something else I want to take you to, another story offshore that has a direct connection to America. And that is that a health worker who may have actually handled some of the samples from Thomas Eric Duncan, that's the Ebola patient who died in Dallas, that lab worker is now self-monitoring for Ebola symptoms on board a cruise ship in the Caribbean.

State Department says that the person has no signs of the disease at this point. Very important to note. And dealt with the samples or may have dealt with samples from Mr. Duncan almost three weeks ago. That would be within that window, that critical window. But the government contacted the authorities in Belize just to make sure that they were aware of this.

That lab worker apparently boarded the cruise ship back on Sunday and did so in Galveston, Texas.

CNN's Rene Marsh has been following the latest developments on this story. I sort of shake my head yet again on a story like this because yet

again a person who had possibly direct contact with a crisis at Texas Presbyterian Hospital somehow was able to travel and get him or herself involved amidst lots of other people.

Can you update me on this?

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: I can, Ashleigh. So at the point when she got onboard this cruise ship, she was not showing any symptoms. We do want to point out that this lab worker did not have direct contact with Duncan. However, this lab worker did test his fluid samples and what the State Department is saying is that she may have come in contact with the fluid.

As you mentioned, she boarded this cruise ship on October 12th in Galveston, Texas. Of course that was before she was notified of updating monitoring requirements.

Now we are in contact with the cruise line. This is what they are telling us in a statement. They are saying that, "At no point in time has this individual exhibited any symptoms or signs of infection and it has been 19 days since she was in the lab with these testing samples. She is deemed by the CDC to be very low risk."

I did speak with a passenger who is onboard, as we speak, onboard that cruise ship, and he described the situation to me when they received the news that this person was onboard, he said that the passenger got on the intercom but never used the word Ebola, probably because they didn't want to stir up panic among people onboard this ship.

But what they did say is this worker worked at the Texas Presbyterian Hospital. She did not have symptoms and that she was quarantined in her cabin. But again, saying that the captain never actually used the word Ebola but everyone on board knew what he was talking about.

BANFIELD: It was the captain who got on the intercom, right, not the passenger? The captain got on the intercom to make the announcement?

JONES: Right.

BANFIELD: OK.

JONES: That's what I am told by one passenger who's on board.

BANFIELD: So, Rene, can you play this up for me because it was fairly confusing that this lab technician from this hospital in question may have handled the samples or may have come in contact with the samples? It seems that -- you know, there was testing done so she definitely handled the samples.

JONES: Right.

BANFIELD: Presumably with protective gear but may have come in contact with the samples. What does that mean?

JONES: Right. So, you know, if by some chance some of the fluid somehow made contact with her, that's a possibility. That's the wording from the statement that we're getting. So yes, Ashleigh, you're stated it absolutely right.

BANFIELD: You're kidding me? How would that --

JONES: You know --

BANFIELD: Rene, how would that not result in an automatic quarantine, if you came in contact with actual samples from a now dead Ebola patient?

JONES: Well, what they are saying is may have. So I think what this is all about is an abundance of caution. I don't know that anyone actually thinks that that happened but it's a possibility because this person was dealing with these fluid samples. But at this point, I don't have any reporting to suggest that she actually did come in contact with this fluid. Again, I think everyone is acting out of an abundance of caution at this point -- Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: Rene Marsh, thank you for that.

I just want to bring in Dr. Alexander Van Tulleken again on this one.

Did you hear what I just heard?

VAN TULLEKEN: Yes.

BANFIELD: I find that astounding. May or may not have come in actual contact with the bodily fluid?

VAN TULLEKEN: Well, what's extraordinary about this is we're now hearing the term abundance of caution.

BANFIELD: And traveling on a cruise ship.

VAN TULLEKEN: Well, you've got a cruise ship with thousands of people in the port. I mean, this is --

BANFIELD: That's not an abundance of any caution.

VAN TULLEKEN: Absolutely. And what -- the other justification, which is so interesting that we're hearing from the CDC, is these 19 days, you know, we're almost at 21 days. So two days ago we have a paper published out of Drexler University, widely reviewed and at this point accepted quite positively by the scientific community saying 21 days is not enough.

BANFIELD: It's not enough?

VAN TULLEKEN: That the average -- the average incubation period is not the 6.3 days. I've been saying it, lots of other people have been saying, when they went back to the data they found the average incubation feared maybe as high as 12 days and a quarantine of 31 days will be more sensible. So we're even seeing the date from the CDC has not been reviewed thoroughly enough at this point to decide a sensible quarantine measure. So nothing -- nothing about this is reassuring. What I would say very

clearly is exposure to blood in the blab would be very, very limited. I think we owed to this person having Ebola are exceptionally low.

BANFIELD: Less potent.

VAN TULLEKEN: I would not be worried if I was on the cruise ship but it is yet again another extraordinary example of how poorly we're managing this.

BANFIELD: Possible breach. Right. Exactly. And you know what, for those who say, quit it with the sky is falling, tell that to the family members who are all affected by this and maybe if the Dallas hospital has had a sky is falling mentality, very little of this would have actually happened.

VAN TULLEKEN: Yes.

BANFIELD: Dr. Xand, stand by if you will for me.

A nurse who works at the Dallas hospital where that Ebola victim who died, Eric Duncan, was being treated, well, she is speaking out very vocally. She says she's upset that nurses did not have enough protective equipment when treating him and you're going to hear directly from her, just ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Brianna Aguirre knew she was exposing herself to extreme danger when she volunteered to care for Ebola patient and fellow nurse Nina Pham. But what she didn't know was that the protective gear that she was given by Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital would leave her neck exposed. She told our Anderson Cooper that that left her outraged and absolutely incredulous.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIANNA AGUIRRE, NURSE AT TEXAS HEALTH PRESBYTERIAN HOSPITAL: Why? Why? What explanation can you give me or anyone about why we would be in the second week of an Ebola crisis in our hospital and we don't even have the same equipment or protection that's given to sanitation workers that have no contact with patients at all. And they said, we know, we've ordered it, we've ordered it. I mean, I talked to charge nurses, I talked to supervisors, I talked to house supervisors, I talked to the CDC about it, I talked to infectious disease about it. I raised a stink with anyone and everyone and I said, there is no explanation why we don't have it. If - you know, we're a part of an organization of hospitals. They could have gone to another one of our THR hospitals and said, we have next -- we have nurses with their neck's exposed dealing with a very, very dangerous situation and we will now need your supply to get them in the right hands. And they chose not to do that.

ANDERSON COOPER, ANCHOR, CNN'S "AC 360": I can't believe their response was, well, we've ordered it. I mean, that's - that's inexcusable. AGUIRRE: Two weeks? I mean, I could have - this -- and not to be taken

lightly, but I'm sure I could have ordered that on Amazon Prime and had it in two days. I'm sure I could have. I mean at least a box of them or something. I mean if you can't get them from another hospital, go to a sanitation department that has them and buy them from them and give them to us. And it's just -- it's just -- it's outrageous. And the most outrageous part about it is, is that every time I think about the facts that I'm saying right now, I just know that the nurses that have been infected, they were dealing with the same equipment while they were dealing with so much more than I dealt with personally. They were dealing with an Ebola positive patient with copious secretions of diarrhea, vomiting, continuous dialysis, you know, mechanical ventilation, all these dangerous, dangerous medical procedures and they put their life on the line and without the proper equipment. And there's nothing --

COOPER: You believe Nurse Pham was wearing that kind of equipment when she was exposed?

AGUIRRE: I know she was because the equipment we needed was still on order.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Well, that's the story regarding Nurse Pham's treatment and several hundred people flew on the same plane as the other nurse, Amber Vinson. That nurse infected with Ebola during her travels between Dallas and Ohio.

Just ahead, we're going to talk with two passengers who were on that same flight with her. In fact, not just on the flight, sitting within three feet of her. Now they're in quarantine themselves for 21 days. What happens when you're under quarantine and what did they see on that plane? We're going to talk about that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: OK. Stick with me through this one. Two male models who were returning home to Dallas from a romance novel convention were on the plane with one of the American Ebola patients. And they actually were sitting just a few feet away from her. Definitely too close for comfort. They also shot this video on the flight as well. Unbeknownst to them, this is a blurry picture, but it was the plane carrying Amber Vinson.

By now you probably know that Amber is the nurse who contracted the virus while treating Thomas Eric Duncan, the patient who died of Ebola at that Dallas hospital. Now, both of the men on the plane were contacted by Frontier Airlines and they were told about the fact that they were sitting just feet from someone, Amber Vinson. They didn't know who it was, but they knew that they had an issue. And now they are self-quarantined and they join me now live, Taylor Cole and Axl Goode.

Thanks for both of you - thanks to both of you for joining me. Taylor, I want to begin with you. I understand that you've actually

been contacted now by the CDC. How did that happen and what was said to you?

TAYLOR COLE, PASSENGER ON FRONTIER FLIGHT WITH AMBER VINSON: Well, they sent a package this morning that basically said no public transportation and just stay in quarantine.

BANFIELD: And is that going to be something you can actually do, stay in quarantine? I assume that means in your own home?

COLE: Yes, yes, I'm fine here. I'm -- I mean I want to stay here anyway, even if they didn't, for the duration of the 21 days, just to protect everyone that I know and the public.

BANFIELD: Axl, same with you? You've been told the same thing, stay in your home and don't travel anywhere?

AXL GOODE, PASSENGER ON FRONTIER FLIGHT WITH AMBER VINSON: Yes. You know, me and Taylor actually decided to self-quarantine before we were ever contacted. Frontier Airlines never contacted us. We contacted the CDC and then finally the Dallas County Health Department contacted us 24 hours later.

BANFIELD: Wow. Taylor, no call from the airline or from the CDC to you either before you received the packet? You actually made contact first?

COLE: Yes, the first CDC package I got was today. That was the only thing I ever got from them. The Texas Department of Health, they contacted me yesterday. That was the first time I heard anything.

BANFIELD: So do you remember anything about the flight, Taylor? Can you describe for me where you think it might have been where she was or at least did you see or hear anything that was unusual on that flight?

COLE: She had to have been probably either in front of us or behind us because like on the video she's not in the seat next to us and I think anything around that vicinity would have been more than three feet. That's what they told us the proximity was. So -- but I didn't hear anything. I didn't hear any coughing or sneezing or anything. I would have probably noticed that because I was already a little paranoid about that.

BANFIELD: And, Axl, what about your day-to-day right now? Are you monitoring yourself? Are you taking your own temperature? Is anyone coming to see you from the public health authorities?

GOODE: Yes. Yes. I'm self-monitoring twice a day at a minimum. I'm self-monitoring more. And then I have a nurse coming once a day to just verify that my temperature is what I report that it is because we were in such close proximity to the nurse.

BANFIELD: Taylor, same with you? Are you doing the same protocol, someone visiting you too? COLE: Yes. Yes. Same thing. A nurse comes and, you know, throughout

the day I'm checking my temperature once every hour at least.

BANFIELD: It goes without saying, I have to ask you, are you both feeling OK? Is everything all right? And start with you, Taylor?

COLE: Yes. I feel great. I haven't had a temperature. I haven't showed any signs of anything yet. So, so far, so good.

BANFIELD: Axl?

GOODE: I feel fine so far. You know, hopefully it stays that way. Just worried.

BANFIELD: Is anyone allowed to visit you two or do you have to stay outside a certain perimeter, a certain zone of contacts? Taylor, what have you been told about how to behave and how your friends and family have to behave around you?

COLE: Well, the nurse came and she's - she's not as safe as I would like her to be. I've told everybody that I know to stay completely off of my property, family members, you know, everything, friends, don't come anywhere around me just to be safe.

BANFIELD: And what about -- how are you getting food? I mean are you -- do you have supplies? Is someone dropping something off for you?

COLE: Yes, my family came. They brought about two weeks' worth of groceries. And they left it at the end of my property line. And I just ran down there and picked it up after they left.

BANFIELD: God, I can't imagine this.

Axl, how about you? What have you told your friends and family and how are you managing by yourself?

GOODE: You know, same story, really. I live in an apartment, in an apartment complex, so I am I'm really limited on what I can do. I'll step outside my balcony, but I won't go anywhere near the fence (ph) or anything of that nature. And I've just had friends that have, you know, been very generous and offered to pick up groceries, et cetera, that I need. So I'm just kind of keeping a running list right now and trying to just get everything that I need and it's not been too hard so far. You know, like I said, it's --

BANFIELD: Have you been given a day, Axl, how long this goes on for? Like when - when is the out time for this circumstance you're in right now?

GOODE: Well, you know, what's really interesting is our quarantine is voluntary so far and they - they told us that it was -

BANFIELD: So you don't know?

GOODE: That it was not mandatory. And that concerns me because I think that it should be. And although me and Taylor are being proactive with our actions, and we were saying, listen, it's not worth the risk, you know, we're definitely going to stick it out for 21 days. And I certainly feel like everybody else should have taken that same protocol and we wouldn't be in this situation in the first place.

BANFIELD: Taylor, are you - are you mad? Are you angry that this has happened?

COLE: I'm more worried than I am angry. You know, it's kind of one of those things where it's -- it happened. Now I just want to be positive and deal with it and move on.

BANFIELD: And what about the public health officials that come to you? You mentioned once a day. If it's a nurse, how is she dressed? Like, what do they show up looking like if they're coming into your apartment, Taylor?

COLE: I didn't -- I'm doing the quarantine also to protect myself, not just everybody else. So the nurse, I know she sees other patients who possibly have been affected. So I don't let her come into my house. I don't touch anything that she has. I just do the thermometer, I show her the temperature and that's fine. She -- the first day, you know, she was just kind of dressed normal. I was - I had a shirt wrapped around my face, gloves, anti-bacterial just to be safe, you know, on my --

BANFIELD: But is she -- is she also protected? Does she show up wearing protective gear and what does she look like?

COLE: Today she had a - today she put a mask on.

BANFIELD: That's it?

COLE: Yes.

BANFIELD: Interesting.

COLE: I mean we have no contact so I'm not sure if that's protocol or not, but I stay as far away from her as I can?

BANFIELD: What about gloves?

COLE: Yes, I wear gloves. I wear the whole thing.

BANFIELD: Does she wear gloves?

COLE: She didn't have gloves on.

BANFIELD: She didn't have gloves on. OK. And, Axl, what about you? What did your - what do your health care professionals look like when they come in your door?

GOODE: You know, they're -they're just dressed regularly. And as much as we know, I've just had mine outside. And so as much as we know, there's no reason to assume that if they stay several feet away and I take my temperature and I hold the thermometer out to them and they look at it and they keep their distance and they don't touch anything around, that there's any real possible risk unless the virus, you know, were to mutate or something like that, which we don't know at this point. So, you know, I feel like it's - I feel like it's pretty safe so far as long as they're keeping their distance.

BANFIELD: I'm so sorry that you guys are going through this. Axl Goode and Taylor Cole, thank you so much for taking the time to talk us through this. And, listen, we wish you the best and we're going to stay in touch with you and make sure you stay in touch with us as well.

COLE: Thank you. Thank you for having us on.

GOODE: Thank you.

BANFIELD: Thank you, guys. Appreciate it.

I'm going to turn the mike over to Wolf Blitzer, who starts right now.