Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Police Search Vacant Homes for More Victims; Denver Schoolgirls Tried to Join ISIS; Government Social Security Benefits to Rise;; Report Reveals Michael Brown Autopsy Details; Detained American Returns to U.S.

Aired October 22, 2014 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Chris. Have a great day, guys. Thanks so much.

NEWSROOM starts now.

Happening now in the NEWSROOM, in court convicted sex offender and suspected Indiana serial killer Darren Vann, he's before a judge this morning for the crimes at least a decade-long from Texas to Indiana. Why were the warning signs missed?

Also breaking new details in the death of Ferguson teenager Michael Brown. What the autopsy report is telling us this morning and what it could mean for a possible indictment against Officer Wilson.

And back in the U.S., American Jeffrey Fowle now free after being held in North Korea for five months. His crime? Leaving a Bible at a nightclub.

We are live for his Ohio homecoming.

Let's talk, live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

And good morning, I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

We begin this morning with breaking news on a suspected serial killer. Less than an hour from now Darren Vann will face charges that he killed a teenager and left her body in a motel room. The police say 19-year-old Afrika Hardy may not be Vann's only victim, but rather his last. They say Vann confessed to six previous murders and even led cops to the bodies dumped in abandoned homes.

Police now fear there could be more victims. Search teams fanned out across Gary, Indiana, peering inside the decaying buildings -- the decaying buildings of this rust belt town.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SGT. WILLIAMS FAZEKAS, GARY, INDIANA POLICE: The individual that committed these crimes, his M.O. was to put people in abandoned house. Stab women in abandoned houses.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They just need to get the houses away. Like you say, people are getting killed in these houses.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Do you know any of the women that have been found dead?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. But I don't -- I don't leave the house past 8:00.

HARLOW: At night?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It'd be so dark out here they call it Scary Gary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: CNN correspondent Poppy Harlow is outside the Lake County, Indiana, jail where Vann will face a judge. HLN legal analyst Joey Jackson is in Atlanta and criminal defense attorney Midwin Charles joins me here in New York.

Welcome to all of you.

MIDWIN CHARLES, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Good morning.

COSTELLO: Good morning.

Poppy, what do we expect in court today?

HARLOW: Well, what we expect is for the prosecutors here in Lake County to officially bring these charges against 43-year-old Darren Vann.

Look, the Gary, Indiana, Police chief said yesterday evening in their press conference he believes there is enough evidence against Darren Vann to charge him with first-degree murder in at least three of these cases.

We know at this point, Carol, that police have identified four of the seven victims, but three of them were so badly decomposed they still have not been able to make those identities known at this point in time.

Also important to note, did this cross state lines? And if so, the FBI will become involved. So you not only have people here, police here continuing to search in Gary, Indiana, Hammond, Indiana, you also have authorities in Cook County, Illinois, searching as well in some of these abandoned homes.

COSTELLO: Joey, when would you expect charges in the other deaths to be filed against this man?

JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: That's the critical question because certainly we know or the police think they know that they have evidence linking him to the crime that Poppy was just speaking of. However, the investigation continues and, although today he'll be formally charged, you know, in at least one of the deaths, we certainly would expect that the investigation would be ongoing. And so the question really turns on when police are confident in

whatever jurisdiction, at whatever location they believe he had committed crimes that they have enough evidence to bring forward charges against him, number one, and that those charges are viable and strong enough to stick, number two.

We know there are confessions apparently that he made. We know that the investigation is ongoing, not only as to the bodies that he's admitted to but they're searching other places which he has not admitted to. So we'll see when the police are confident enough to bring him up on other charges.

COSTELLO: But, Midwin, supposedly this guy led police to bodies. What more do they need? Why doesn't he just plead guilty?

CHARLES: Well, you know, that seems to be sort of the question that a lot of people ask in these kinds of cases but as you know we have a criminal justice system where prosecutors have to do their jobs and they have to prove people guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. So I guess they're still trying to put together different facts and making sure that everything is lined up perfectly so that he could be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

COSTELLO: So, Joey, I would assume that prosecutors want to push for the death penalty. Might that be a reason why Vann isn't being completely cooperative because he wants to avoid that himself?

JACKSON: Well, you know, regardless of whether he's cooperative or not, Carol, what the police do, what the prosecution does is they try to put together enough evidence that we don't need you.

It's nice if you want to confess, it's nice if you want to cooperate, but what they attempt to do is therefore bring forth enough trace evidence, fiber evidence, DNA evidence, blood evidence, serology, forensics, everything that they need so that whether you cooperate or not, they believe that they have a strong case because any case where you're relying upon the defendant's cooperation could be a problematic one.

And finally, Carol, regardless of whether he cooperates or not, we do know that Indiana certainly is a death penalty jurisdiction and if ever there would be a case to charge and pursue the death penalty this certainly would be.

COSTELLO: So, Midwin, you're a defense attorney. Is there any defense for this guy?

CHARLES: Well, I wouldn't be surprised, you know, in these kinds of cases where you see multiple bodies and you see very heinous and sort of gruesome facts that are associated with the deaths, it wouldn't surprise me if you saw perhaps a mental health defense, some sort of insanity defense, or perhaps this person doesn't have the same sort of capacity that we all do.

Oftentimes defense attorneys will go down that road. It's the more sympathetic road. It's the road that tends to garner sympathy from people so it wouldn't surprise me if we saw that with this case.

COSTELLO: We'll see.

So, Poppy, a final question because there is a sad, bigger issue associated with this case. Vann is a convicted sex offender and as such he was subjected to monitoring. Is there a feeling that the system failed?

HARLOW: I think that is the critical question right now, Carol. Look, we talked to the sheriff's department. They told us they only checked on him one time in September because that's all that was required by law. They said we can't just make arbitrary checks and all they checked is that he lived in the residence he was supposed to live in.

So what good does that do? That's a real question.

Last night, Lori Townsend, the mother of the most recent victim, Afrika Hardy, spoke with CNN. I want you to listen to what she said about the system.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LORI TOWNSEND, AFRIKA HARDY'S MOTHER: The justice system the way it's -- it is right now, there's a lot to be said for that. I think if he was a registered offender in the state of Indiana that he should have been checked on more frequently as well as all the other, you know, people who are registered just to check on him once, that's -- that seems null and -- you know, null and void, actually.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Carol, let's not forget, this is also a man that in 2004 served 90 days in jail for pouring gasoline on himself and his then girlfriend and trying to light her on fire. I just talked to the police officer who de-escalated that situation 10 years ago and I said, was 90 days in jail really enough for that, and he said no.

COSTELLO: I would have to agree with him.

Poppy Harlow, Midwin Charles, and Joey Jackson, thanks to all of you.

CHARLES: You're welcome.

COSTELLO: I appreciate it.

It's unbelievable.

This just in to CNN, we are seeing huge explosions and heavy smoke in the town of Kobani, that's the Syrian town right near the border with Turkey. The U.S.-led coalition carried out more airstrikes there overnight against ISIS. A Kurdish fighter says six of his fellow fighters have been killed in battles with ISIS militants. He says at least 10 ISIS fighters are also dead.

As you well know, ISIS is trying to recruit Americans including American schoolgirls. Denver officials say three teenage girls played Hooky from school, caught a flight to Germany carrying $2,000 in cash. They allegedly hoped to go to Syria and join up with ISIS.

CNN's Pamela Brown tells us what happened next.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Three high school girls from Denver are the latest American teenagers drawn in by the radical world of Islamic extremism. Only 15 and 16 years old, two of them sisters of Somali descent, allegedly aspiring to join the fight in Syria.

According to law enforcement sources, the teens boarded a flight in Denver over the weekend and made it to Frankfurt, Germany, where police arrested them before they could continue on to Turkey and then Syria. CNN has learned they allegedly self-radicalized online.

AKI PERITZ, FORMER CIA OFFICER: They're oftentimes searching for an identity because what the jihadists are actually pushing is a specific narrative which is your people are being oppressed in this place called Syria. Your government is doing nothing. We're the only ones who are actually going to help you out, why don't you join the fight?

BROWN: The only reason the teens were caught, one of their parents called police and the FBI quickly flagged their passports.

Across the border in Canada, new concerns tonight after a 25-year-old man ran over two soldiers with his car, killing one and injuring another. Police shot and killed him. Canadian authorities say the man may have been radicalized and had been on their radar.

STEVEN BLANEY, CANADIAN MINISTER OF PUBLIC SAFETY: This is a terrible act of violence against our country, against our military, against our value.

BALDWIN: And this 17-year-old Australian teenager raising alarm bells after he recently showed up in video alongside ISIS fighters in Syria, threatening to behead Western leaders including President Obama.

Pamela Brown, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: OK. A bit more breaking news this morning for the 58 million Americans who receive Social Security benefits, your check is about to get a little bigger.

CNN's Alison Kosik joins us now with details. Really?

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, the increase is 1.7 percent, and it sounds like it's good, but before you get all excited I'll put it into perspective.

So right now payments for Social Security for older Americans, for disabled veterans, they run about $1200 a month. This 1.7 percent increase winds up being an extra $20. Look, it's an increase, that's great, but I mean, in the realm of -- you know --

(CROSSTALK)

KOSIK: It really isn't. But here's the thing. The government comes up with this increase every year. It has to. It was actually -- a law passed by Congress that this has to happen automatically every year and it's based on inflation and the reality is inflation has been remarkably low for years. So that's why you're seeing this increase, actually for the third year in a row, under 2 percent.

It's below the target actually of what the Fed wants to see, but it's an increase nonetheless. I guess on glass half full, $20 extra for groceries.

COSTELLO: $20 is $20 and it's worth something.

KOSIK: Yes.

COSTELLO: Not as much as it used to be, but whatever.

KOSIK: Yes.

COSTELLO: Alison Kosik, thanks so much.

KOSIK: You got it.

COSTELLO: Stories for Wednesday morning, the new White House Ebola czar, Ron Klain, starts today. He'll meet President Obama and senior members of the team responsible for coordinating the government's response to the unfolding pandemic.

The head coach and four other coaches at New Jersey's Sayreville High School have been suspended indefinitely. The hazing scandal allegedly involved older members of the team brutalizing freshman players.

Storied "Washington Post" editor Ben Bradlee died of natural causes at his home yesterday. He was 93. The legendary newspaper man led the paper's newsroom through Watergate and the Pentagon papers.

The Dallas Cowboys have waived defensive end Michael Sam. Sam became the first openly gay player to be drafted by an NFL team when he signed with the Cowboys. Sam tweeted, "I want to thank the Jones family and the entire Cowboys organization for this opportunity."

And the dashing duchess, Kate Middleton stepping out for the first time since announcing her second pregnancy. She was seen at an event at Buckingham Palace and you can just see a hint of that baby bump.

And that's a look at your headlines this morning.

NEWSROOM is back after a break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GOV. JAY NIXON (D), MISSOURI: As the smoke clears and the shouting dies down, the question that lingers in the air is this: what now? What will we do in this moment while the whole world is watching? What will we do to move forward after 73 days of civil unrest? How do we move on from shouting past one another?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: How do they move on?

That was Missouri Governor Jay Nixon contemplating the long-term consequences of the fatal shooting of black teenager Michael Brown by a white Ferguson police officer.

Well, now, a blockbuster new report seems to back that officer's account of what happened before Brown was killed. If this report stands up, it is possible Officer Darren Wilson will not be indicted in Brown's death.

"The St. Louis Post Dispatch" obtained the official autopsy on Brown and had two experts review the findings. The autopsy says Brown was shot in the hand at close range. Reports say Brown's blood was found on Wilson's gun and Brown's tissue was found on the exterior of Officer Darren Wilson's vehicle. As you know, Wilson said there was a scuffle inside his squad car and that he feared for his life.

One expert who reviewed the autopsy says it does support that there was a significant altercation at the car.

"The Post Dispatch" also obtained the toxicology report accompanying the autopsy. That report found Brown had been using marijuana.

Joining me now to talk about this, Dr. Bill Manion, the medical examiner for Burlington County, New Jersey.

Welcome, sir.

DR. BILL MANION, CHIEF OF PATHOLOGY, MEMORIAL HOSPITAL: Good morning.

COSTELLO: Thank you for being here.

Dr. Manion, the Brown family paid for its own autopsy. It seemed to suggest Brown was shot from far away, possibly with his hands up, but that's not what the county's autopsy shows. Why the discrepancy?

MANION: Well, Dr. Baden did the autopsy and he did the autopsy looking with his eyes at what he could see and he did not see any stippling or burn marks on Michael Brown's gunshot wounds. In other words, if a gun is discharged close to the skin, hot gunpowder will come out and burn the skin and leave a stippling pattern. Dr. Baden didn't see that.

Now, you may not necessarily see that with a close-contact gunshot wound. There can also begun gunshot residue that's dispersed. And for instance, if someone's holding a gun and it's discharged there may be residue on your hand even though the bullet and hot projectile gunpowder go forward, it wouldn't hit the skin.

So, in this case, I believe the FBI has performed scanning electron microscopy. They've identified gunpowder residue, they look at for lead, barium, antimony and certain chemicals in gun powder and they found Michael Brown's blood on the gun of the officer, indicating there was a struggle that the blood was on the gun, they found gunpowder residue on Mr. Brown that may not be seen with the eyes, but can be picked up by scanning electron microscope and x-ray analysis.

COSTELLO: Understand -- just so we all understand, the Brown's autopsy, the private autopsy, lacked x-rays, clothing and evidence from inside the police car.

The county's autopsy showed Brown was shot in the thumb and that the bullet traveled toward his wrist. As you said, was there residue on the gun barrel on Brown's thumb wound.

Tell us again what that says to you.

MANION: That means that gun was within at least 18 inches when it was discharged. It's not a contact wound. You didn't see impressions of the barrel on the skin, but there well is gunshot residue, so that was between an inch and 18 inches and close contact wound, but not a direct contact wound. Just close gunshot wound.

So, that would support the officer's theory or the officer's version of the story that Mr. Brown was struggling with him for the gun.

COSTELLO: OK. So the experts who reviewed the county's report also says there is no indication that Brown had his hands up when Brown took a shot to the forehead. You know, that's become a symbol of this controversy. Hands up. And I'm going to read you a quote from one of the experts. The expert said a sixth shot that hit the forearm traveled from the back of the arm to the inner arm which means Brown's palms could not have been facing Wilson as some witnesses have said.

The trajectory shows Brown probably was not taking a standard surrender position with arms above the shoulders and palms out when he was hit.

Do you agree?

MANION: Well, you know, you have to be very careful interpreting these gunshot wounds and back to forth. The way we report them normally is the body in the anatomic position and the anatomic position means the hands down like this and the forearms out.

A person can be shot shrugging their shoulders and the gun shot wound would go front to back. A person can be up like this to punch you and assault you and the gunshot wound can go from front to back. A person can be surrendering and the gunshot wound -- so you have to be very careful looking at these.

And I think we have to look at these wounds in the context of the other wounds. If all of the other wounds are from front to back, why would this one be from back to front, or be totally different than the trajectory of all of the other gunshots? So, I think we still have to study this.

COSTELLO: As you know, there is a third autopsy coming out and the results of that autopsy not known the yet. But both of these autopsy reports, the private one and the one done by the county shows Brown was shot six times and at some point, you could argue, Officer Wilson had control of his gun.

So, let's say, the fight took place inside the car, right? But then Michael Brown was running away from the officer and the officer had control of his gun and he knew Brown at this point was unarmed. Was it necessary to fight so many shots of Brown, in your opinion?

MANION: Well, that's getting into someone's mind and this is a fight or flight mechanism. If the officer is accurate, is correct, he's saying Mr. Brown tried to take his gun, the gun is discharged and your heart's pounding a hundred times a minute, your epinephrine, adrenaline is firing, and if this guy who's a lot bigger than you is coming at you, you're going to empty your gun.

COSTELLO: Dr. Bill Manion, thanks to your insight. We appreciate it.

MANION: My pleasure.

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM: he was arrested and detained for five months after leaving a Bible in a North Korean nightclub. Now, American Jeffrey Fowle is back on American soil. You see the touching reunion with his family.

CNN's Miguel Marquez was there. Good morning.

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning there, Carol. I can tell you that Mr. Fowle -- this is his home behind us and he will soon be returning here and we have a little information on whether he will get his job back here as well. All of that, coming right up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

For more than a month, we did not get a single glimpse of the North Korean leader Kim Jong-un. But now, for the second time in just two weeks, new pictures of him are coming out. These latest images appeared on Korean central television. They show Kim inspecting a rest home for retired scientist. He's using a cane.

There had been speculation that he dropped out of public sight for health reasons, but he's back because it was Kim Jong-un who in a surprise move dismissed a case against detained American Jeffrey Fowle. This morning, the 56-year-old father is back on American soil after spending five months of detention for leaving a bible in a North Korean nightclub.

Earlier this morning, Fowle was reunited with his family at Wright- Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio. In the meantime, the White House has called for the immediate release of two other Americans, Kenneth Bae and Matthew Miller who remain in North Korean custody.

Let's bring in CNN's Miguel Marquez. He is outside Fowle's home near Dayton.

Good morning, Miguel.

MARQUEZ: Good morning there, Carol.

This is the home where we expect in the next half hour or so Mr. Fowle to show up. He is en route after that emotional and tearful reunion with his family this morning at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, an unbelievable sight to see this guy who was in a facility in Pyongyang one moment and then in Guam and then on to Hawaii, stops once for fuel, flown in by special delivery by the Department of Defense, at the request of the State Department, walks off that plane with his carry-on only baggage to see his kids run up to him.

His kids, says the commander of the air base, didn't know what was coming.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. JOHN DEVILLIER, U.S. AIR FORCE: I was pretty nervous. You know, the children knew something was up when the airplane arrived and they had cameras, but as soon as they saw dad, the tears came out. I got very emotional because you can anticipate what would your children react, how would your children react if you were in that situation? So, it was just great.

MARQUEZ: No, not a typical mission for you?

DEVILLIER: No, not a typical mission at all.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MARQUEZ: Now, Mr. Fowle who is an operator, heavy truck operator for the city of Moraine, was let go by the city some months ago because they weren't sure when he was going get back and I just spoke to the city manager, Dave Hicks, who says that Mr. Fowle is welcomed to reapply to reinstatement, the job is still open, it's likely he could get that job back.

COSTELLO: Oh, good.

MARQUEZ: We know the mayor of Moraine is going to speak to the media today as well.

The family has really struggled. He has three kids. You know, this is as lovely in a country as it gets, and it is a small house out here in between several cities here in central Ohio.