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Don Lemon Tonight
New Terror Alert; NASA Rocket Explodes; Will Ferguson Police Chief Step Down?
Aired October 28, 2014 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon, everyone.
Breaking news: a major development out of Ferguson, Missouri. We're going to have the details in just a moment.
And our other big breaking news, a new terror warning for thousands of federal government buildings all across this country. I'm going to talk with Glenn Greenwald. He says the only surprise about attacks on the West is that they don't happen more often.
Also, launch failure. A NASA-controlled rocket explodes into a fireball moments after liftoff, and the president is being briefed at the White House. We're going to have the very latest details on that.
We're going to get right now to our breaking news. It's out of a city council meeting in Ferguson, Missouri, tonight.
Joining me now, CNN's justice reporter, Evan Perez.
Evan, what is the latest news on this huge development in Ferguson?
EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, the development is that the police chief of Ferguson, Missouri, Tom Jackson, is expected to step down as part of an effort to reform the police department there.
Now, the announcement is not expected to come until about next week, most likely. And it's all part of an effort by the local officials to bring down some of the tensions there. As you know, Don, it's the scene of demonstrations almost every night. A lot of people have been calling for the police chief to step down and he's been defiant so far, but the officials there know this is part of an effort to try to make sure that when the grand jury announcement comes down, whether or not there are charges again officer Darren Wilson in the shooting of Michael Brown, that this is one of the way that they can show the public they're trying to reform the police department there.
LEMON: Evan Perez, this is according to your reporting here, that -- the police chief is Tom Jackson.
PEREZ: Correct. LEMON: In Ferguson.
PEREZ: That's right.
LEMON: According to your reporting, under the proposed plan, city leadership would ask that Saint Louis County Police Chief -- and that is Jon Belmar -- take over the role over the management of Ferguson's police force once Chief Johnson leaves. Chief Johnson has said -- Chief Jackson, I should say -- excuse me -- has said he was not going to step down, that he was going to see this out, ride this out. What changed?
PEREZ: That's right.
You know, he's still talking to us tonight saying that he has not been asked to step down, that he is still the man in charge, but this is also something that he knows, we believe, that is coming, simply because it's part of the effort there to keep the peace, Don, as you know. The Saint Louis County Police Department has much better resources to be able to manage the situation there.
It's not without precedent. The police in a couple neighboring towns, in the same way, were taken over by the police department, by the Saint Louis County Police Department, simply because some of these small towns don't have the resources to be able to do this.
LEMON: Evan Perez, stand by. I'm going to need you here.
But I want to go to CNN's Sara Sidner. She's on the phone in Ferguson.
Sara, I'm not sure if you have any reaction there in Ferguson. I'm sure it will come as a surprise -- it may not come as a surprise to a lot of people that this is happening.
SARA SIDNER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It hasn't happened. We want to make that clear. The police chief has said to us in person at the city council we were in today that he is not planning on stepping down.
We also asked the mayor, Mayor Knowles, very pointedly, saying, look, there are sources, and some of Evan's reporting, look, there are people saying that you are putting a plan in place, and his answer was no. Of course, the mayor would be the person that would have to have these conversations with the police chief to ask him to resign or force him to resign.
And his words were, look, people have been saying that for months, and asking for him to step down for months, but we have stood by him this entire time, and there is no change on that. That's the kind of pushback that we are seeing here. Both the mayor of Ferguson and the police chief both denying, both saying that it's not happening.
You know, we don't know what we're going to see. We do know, though, that we have sat and talked with both of them in times past. In the last couple of weeks, I had a conversation with them and we asked, would you step down if that was the best thing for the city? The protesters aren't only asking for the police chief to step down. They're asking for the mayor as well, in some instances, to step down.
And they both said, we would think about it, it's something we would consider, but at this time we don't feel that is necessarily the right thing to do. And that's the kind of language that they have been using throughout.
LEMON: Sara...
SIDNER: At this time, they're saying, no, there are no plans.
LEMON: Sara, as I'm looking at the reporter that is again coming from Evan Perez, our justice correspondent -- Evan is still with us as well. Right?
As I look at this reporting, Sara, I'm wondering, is this enough to tamp down some of the anger among protesters? Will this be viewed as the beginning of some sort of at least movement in this case?
SIDNER: Yes and no.
We have talked to a lot of protesters over these many weeks that we have been here, and the answer to that is, yes, people will see it as movement, but will it stop and completely quell people's frustrations? Absolutely not.
Many people have said to me, it's too little too late, but it is a step forward, a small step at this point, because it's gone on so long, but it's too little too late. And the real reaction and what they really want to see is the arrest of Darren Wilson, who with the way that the laws work, is still in the justice process. The process is still going.
LEMON: OK.
SIDNER: And, you know, so that is one of the things that you're going to hear from people, that it's too little too late, Don.
LEMON: OK. Stand by.
Do we still have Evan Perez with us? Is Evan still there?
Because, Evan, let's -- you did an interview with the attorney general. And this was his quote. He said, we have an ongoing, ongoing, have a practice investigation into the Ferguson Police Department and we are looking at a whole variety of things, including the leadership of that department, the practices of the department engages in, the nature of the interaction between the department and the community that it's supposed to serve.
So, if -- reading between the lines there, he's saying looking at the leadership of the department, that would mean the chief of police.
PEREZ: Well, yes, Don. I mean, and this is also -- we have to think about it this way. This is part of a larger discussion between the local officials, the county, the state officials, and the federal government.
The federal government has two investigations into this situation in Ferguson. One is focused on the police department and the practices there. And then the other is into the shooting itself. Now, you know, there are some people down there in Ferguson who would like to dissolve the police department completely and have it completely be managed by the county police, as has been done in some of the other municipalities.
That is not in the works just yet simply because this federal investigation is still ongoing, but that is something that you can perhaps see coming down the line.
LEMON: Stand by, Evan.
I want to bring in Marc Lamont Hill, CNN political commentator and he joins us on the set.
What's your reaction?
MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Not surprising. A little later than we had expected.
I thought at some point they would have given in. My concern is that this is a primer for a grand jury decision that's trying to prepare the crowd by giving them some of justice in the wake of something that will feel unjust to people.
LEMON: Yes, which is the thing -- with all the leaks and information that alleged through sources that this may be a primer, but you're not surprised by it?
HILL: Not surprised. I actually thought it would happen two weeks ago.
LEMON: All right. Stand by, everyone. Stand by.
We're going to continue with our breaking news. We have more breaking news now to discuss, that spectacular explosion of a NASA- controlled rocket just seconds after liftoff.
Joining me now is CNN's Tom Foreman and our digital correspondent Rachel Crane.
Tom, we have new video of the launch from a WFOC chopper that was in the air when the rocket exploded. Look at this. This is an eyewitness. Check this out.
So apparently we don't have the sound from that, but what are we learning about this explosion? What do you know?
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right now, the company that actually launched this, Orbital Sciences, says basically they know what you can see on this video, that the rocket started taking off, they said, and I quote here, there was some disassembly of the vehicle.
If you watch it closely you can see it basically start to separate at the bottom of the rocket as the explosion begins, then it fell back to earth and it blew all apart. We also know at this point that the final explosion of this was actually triggered by safety officers on the scene, because they don't want a wounded rocket to take off sideways, for example, and fly somewhere where it doesn't belong.
The final explosion was actually triggered as they tried to make sure this thing was completely destroyed, but they have secured the ground around the launch facility. They're keeping everyone away and they say at first light they're going to be out there picking up the pieces, Don, to try to find out what really did go wrong with this, a rocket that was taking off with roughly three-quarters-of-a-million pounds of thrust, Don.
LEMON: I was just to say that, 13 pounds -- the rocket was carrying about 1,300 pounds of food. It was heading to the International Space Station and I want to talk about the impact.
Stand by, Rachel and Tom. Let's listen to the sound and then I will continue to question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Five, four, three, two, one and we have liftoff.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: My goodness.
Rachel, what kind of an impact could this have on the space station and future flights?
RACHEL CRANE, CNN DIGITAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Bill Gerstenmaier at the press conference that happened just moments ago was very, very intent on saying the astronauts have all the logistics they need on the International Space Station to last them until next year.
We're not exactly sure what kind of equipment, what kind of research equipment was on board, but we do know that in terms of the food, as you mentioned, there were about 1,300 pounds of food on that cargo spaceship right there ,that the astronauts will be able to last until next year with what they have on board right now.
LEMON: And, Miles, NASA now relies on private companies to get things to the space station. What do we know? We don't have Miles.
I will ask Rachel.
What do we know about the company that launched this unmanned rocket, Rachel?
CRANE: So Orbital Sciences is one of two private companies that has been contracted by NASA to ferry cargo missions back and forth to the International Space Station, SpaceX being the other one.
Now, Orbital Sciences, their contract with NASA is worth $1.9 million -- billion dollars -- excuse me -- and this was the third of eight missions that Navy has contracted them to run to the International Space Station. And SpaceX's contract with NASA is worth $1.6 billion.
These are just cargo missions, though. NASA recently awarded both Boeing and SpaceX contracts worth $6.8 billion in terms of, for Boeing, and $4.2 billion for -- I'm sorry -- $2.6 billion for SpaceX, $4.2 for Boeing. Now, those are set to carry manned missions to the International Space Station.
LEMON: Right.
CRANE: So we don't know yet how the public's perception of the private sector's ability to carry these missions to the International Space Station.
LEMON: Rachel Crane, thank you very much for your reporting. Miles O'Brien, both of you stick around, because when we come back, much more on that stunning rocket -- and -- Tom Foreman, excuse me. Thank you, Tom. I appreciate that. I called you Miles O'Brien. Thank you very much.
I'm going to talk to two former astronauts, and much more from Ferguson on the breaking news that the police chief is expected to step down. We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: More now on our breaking news.
The police chief in Ferguson expected to step down.
Sara Sidner is here with more.
Sara, what do you know?
SIDNER: We talked to him and told him about Evan's reporting, having several sources saying that they are making plans for the police chief to step down. We talked to the mayor who was in the midst of a council meeting.
And, afterwards, he answered our question and said, flat out, no, and then let me let you hear what he said when he asked him, are you getting pressure from the federal government or from others to ask the police chief to step down?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SIDNER: Have you gotten pressure from any other...
(CROSSTALK)
JAMES KNOWLES III, MAYOR OF FERGUSON, MISSOURI: They have been saying that for months, for him to step down, but we have stood by him this entire time. So...
SIDNER: And there's nothing...
KNOWLES: There's no change on that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So, Sara Sidner speaking with the mayor tonight.
Sara, again, and Tom Johnson (sic), the chief in Ferguson, has really said the same thing, that he's going to continue to stay.
SIDNER: Yes, police Chief Jackson, we talked to him in person. He did not want to talk to us on camera, but in person, he said, there is -- I am not planning on stepping down. I am not planning on resigning. He said that to us before, and he said to do us again today.
And so I think what you're seeing here is, you know, we don't -- we don't know, but, at this point, the local authorities here are being pretty clear that that is not what they're planning to do. If that changes, I am sure we will let you know.
LEMON: All right. Thank you very much. We appreciate that, Sara Sidner.
I reached out personally to Tom Jackson and I haven't heard back. I also reached to Jon Belmar, the chief of the Saint Louis County Department, waiting to hear back from him.
So, let's talk about this now. Let's bring in Michael Smerconish. He's a CNN political commentator and anchor of CNN's "SMERCONISH." And also with us, Mel Robbins, Marc Lamont Hill, and Mark O'Mara.
First, let me -- is this coming from Washington? Let's just be honest about it.
HILL: It feels like it.
There's so much national and really at this international scrutiny on Ferguson. They had to do something. The local police department feels corrupt. It feels unresponsive to the needs of the public. Whether they're right or wrong isn't even the issue here. It's the appearance of being unresponsive that's the problem.
LEMON: Mark O'Mara, will this help things out at all you think in this situation in Ferguson?
MARK O'MARA, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: The animosities that existed in Ferguson were way before Mike Brown's shooting, justified or not.
Obviously, there was a lot of animosity because of the way the neighborhood reacted. Unfortunately, the leadership in the police department has to change. And if he's sort of a sacrificial lamb to get this started, it's going to have to be, because let's not forget, no matter what happens with the indictment, Ferguson has got to move forward and it doesn't seem like they can move forward with this police chief in place.
LEMON: Do you agree with that, Mel Robbins?
MEL ROBBINS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: You know, I do.
It's interesting. Mark O'Mara, I'm sure, will agree with me because Mark obviously represented George Zimmerman and I was there covering it for CNN. And you will recall that two months after Trayvon Martin was shot to death, Chief Lee was forced to resign, and it was one of the things that started to move things forward.
So I do think it's important for the future of Ferguson that he step aside, but I heard our colleague Marc Lamont Hill say earlier that he thought that this might be some of the P.R. moves towards softening the blow in case that there isn't a vote to indict.
And my initial reaction, Don, was, holy cow. I wonder if they're getting signals from inside that grand jury that there's not going to be an indictment and they're starting to do things publicly to try to kind of play this down, Don.
HILL: And that's how people on the ground feel.
LEMON: All right, Michael Smerconish, you have covered this a lot on your show and on your show CNN here on CNN, and on the radio.
People are very passionate about this. And also they say that this is -- many people think this has been a rush to judgment. I wonder how that plays in this particular instance, if the chief does step down next week.
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I view it as total confirmation of a suspicion that I have had for a couple of weeks and have spoken openly ago.
All of those leaks, "The New York Times" a week ago offering Officer Wilson's account from his grand jury testimony, leaks in "The L.A. Times," leaks in "The Saint Louis Post-Dispatch" relative to the African-American accounts that apparently were supportive of the officer, as well as the official autopsy supposedly suggested that his arms weren't in the air.
As I read those tea leaves, Don, I have been saying, to me, this is all calibrated and intended to take the temperature down of the community. And now with this news tonight, I'm absolutely convinced we're headed for no indictment in this case.
LEMON: But does this take the temperature down at all or does this just...
(CROSSTALK)
HILL: Oh, no, not at all.
ROBBINS: No way.
HILL: Just in the 15 minutes since we have been talking about this, I have gotten text after text from local activists and local organizers in Ferguson who are saying that this infuriates them because it feels like a P.R. move. It feels as if they're being faked out.
And, as a result, I think it will ratchet things up. Again, it's not a question of right or wrong. It's how people are feeling right now.
LEMON: Mel, why do you say no way?
ROBBINS: Well, I 100 percent agree with Mark.
They really on some level, Don, don't care about the chief of police. They care about Michael Brown getting his day in court and there being justice served in this case. If there's no indictment, when you have a process where it's been leak after leak, as Michael Smerconish has been talking about, it doesn't feel like justice has been served.
I think they're looking at whether or not there's an indictment, Don, as the only litmus test as to whether or not justice is served.
LEMON: Not just maybe the beginning of something, right? Maybe it's the beginning of something, but instead of just being the beginning of something, you guys all think it's a setup to the officer not being indicted, disappointment on the side just from, as Michael Smerconish said, reading the tea leaves.
Mark O'Mara, go ahead.
O'MARA: Yes. I'm just -- I'm very frustrated, because it does seem like a sort of juvenile semi-conspiracy to try and appease the black community in Ferguson.
There should never have been leaks. There still shouldn't be leaks. If the chief has to go, so be it, but I'm very frustrated that what we're doing is letting out the process a piece at a time, because then it denigrates whatever the grand jury will do. It's going to be suspect, only because of those people who let out these leaks ahead of time when they shouldn't have.
LEMON: Go ahead, Michael.
SMERCONISH: I would like to think it's all going to come down to what the evidence shows and the reaction will be predicated by the facts.
I have long said that that which we know about Ferguson is outweighed by that which we don't know. What's been going on behind closed doors in that grand jury really ought to be that which holds sway for all of us, folks who were in that community and people who were paying attention on a national level. I'm not going to base my judgment as to whether there's an indictment or not. I'm going to base my judgment as to what was the basis for the
decision that led to that call.
HILL: Yes, but, see, the problem, Michael -- and I agree with you. That's exactly what we should be doing.
But I think that that presumes a level of trust in the system itself and I think because of the lack of transparency, because of the leaks, because of how the Ferguson Police Department had responded initially, the people in the town don't trust the system. They don't trust the justice system at all, or, primarily, they don't trust the law enforcement agency, they don't trust the police chief, and as a result, it's going to be hard to just believe that the grand jury as such is trustworthy.
LEMON: OK. Let's pull back here, because there's a lack of trust in the system.
O'MARA: Well...
LEMON: Was that Mark O'Mara who wanted to get in?
(CROSSTALK)
O'MARA: I just wanted to say that best thing the prosecutor did was he guaranteed us that he is going to release all of the transcripts of the grand jury testimony when is the right time, meaning if no indictment is going to come right out, and at least we will have a lot of evidence to show to document whatever the decision was.
LEMON: There's lack of trust in the system, right, which everyone sort of agrees it's obvious.
But then there's also due process for this officer. How does one separate the two? Because the officer, you know, has to go through the process, whether he was guilty or innocent, what the evidence shows and all of that, but then also you have this huge tide, tidal wave of people are saying we don't trust the police department here.
Mark O'Mara, as an attorney, how do you separate that?
O'MARA: Well, you have to -- I know people get frustrated when I say this. You have to trust the process to a certain extent.
If you decide not to trust the grand jury process, then what's the alternative? If we don't allow that process to work, transparent as it will do, we have to. We don't have an alternative to a lack of trust. We have to believe that the grand jury is going to do what they have to do. If there is not an indictment, we have to let the wounds heal and move on. And if it is an indictment, you will good counsel representing him in a fair trial in front of a jury hopefully in open court.
LEMON: All right, final word on that. I want to get in Michael Smerconish's on this, because, Michael,
I have people who are telling me that they have been listening to your radio show and that you have been talking a lot about the comments from Charles Barkley and that was big on your show today.
Let's play a little bit of it, Michael, and then I want to get your response.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
CHARLES BARKLEY, FORMER NBA PLAYER: When you are black, you have to deal with so much crap in your life from other black people.
It's a dirty, dark secret. I'm glad it's coming out. For some reason, we are brainwashed to think if you're not a thug or an idiot, you're not black enough. If you go to school, make good grades, speak intelligent and don't break the law, you're not a good black person.
And it's a dirty, dark secret, Anthony. Listen, I hate to bring white people into our crap, but, as a black person, we all go through it when you're successful.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
LEMON: OK. So he was talking about the Seattle Seahawks -- Seattle Seahawks quarterback Russell Wilson and other team members reportedly not thinking that he is black enough. What are you hearing from your listeners?
SMERCONISH: All right.
Let me begin by saying, I am a bald, middle-aged white guy.
(LAUGHTER)
SMERCONISH: So it's very hard for me to assess exactly what's going on in the African-American community on this.
But callers overwhelmingly, African-American callers, said, Don, there's a lot of truth in this. And what I would throw in is to say jealousy don't know bounds that are defined by race. I think there's a tendency, unfortunate as it is, for a lot of folks to be resentful when they see people in their own community on the rise.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: And 94 percent, Michael. We have your poll up here, 94 percent...
(CROSSTALK)
SMERCONISH: Unbelievable.
LEMON: ... on Michael Smerconish said that they agree with him.
(CROSSTALK) HILL: Could we put nonscientific in bold there? I love Michael
Smerconish, but the black people who...
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: OK. Stop it. Stop it. The conversation we had before, I told you, I was in Harlem at brunch with a bunch of black folks. And we read the comments. And everybody says the same thing.
HILL: We brunch with different black folks.
LEMON: Come on. Barkley has -- Barkley has a point, but he shouldn't have said it. He shouldn't have said it in public. Tom Joyner said that to me on the radio this morning. He's right, absolutely, but he should not have said it in public.
HILL: I disagree with you, Tom, and even my bald-headed white friend Michael Smerconish.
LEMON: You did not in the commercial break. Come on, man.
HILL: See, this is called snitching.
(LAUGHTER)
HILL: But let me talk about the community.
No, I agree that there are people who have a problem with success.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: That's not the overarching problem in the African- American community.
HILL: No, no, but I'm saying that to frame it -- because this comes from this whole body of work called acting white and that there's this idea that if black people succeed, they compromise fictive kinships and black people think of them as sellouts.
I'm saying, not only does the social science data not bear that out. My own experience doesn't bear that out. I find black people are proud of me. Black people love what we do.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Absolutely.
HILL: Black people walk up, they show love. They don't say, he act white.
LEMON: Absolutely. Yes. I mean, absolutely, overall.
But you don't get hate? You don't read the Twitter feeds? You don't hear what people say about me and about other people who don't... (CROSSTALK)
HILL: And some from black people, some from white people.
LEMON: Right.
HILL: But it's not because of your achievement. It might be because of things I say or you say, but I don't think that there is this culture of pathology or anti-intellectualism in the black community and it's certainly not more than any other community.
I think Charles Barkley is peddling the same urban myth that President Obama peddled when he talked it about in a speech, that many people peddle. And I don't think that it's largely true.
LEMON: All right, I'm going to give Michael Smerconish the last word, since he is the authority on African-Americans and bald white guys.
HILL: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
SMERCONISH: Listen, I hope it's not true, but so many folks are telling me that it is true.
And from what I see, in the white community, there's a lot of jealousy out there and it's a part and parcel of who we are, all of us.
HILL: But they don't say, you're not white enough. When you do well, they don't say Michael Smerconish isn't white enough.
LEMON: Right. We're going to go. The rocket has exploded. We're going to go. This is a great conversation we're having.
Right, they don't say you're not white enough. Right? They just call you other things. They're jealous of you, but no one says you're not white enough.
HILL: Yes.
And I don't find people that say I'm not black enough or that you're not black enough, except for maybe because you brunch.
LEMON: Yes, all right.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
LEMON: Great conversation.
More on the rocket. And we will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) LEMON: More breaking news tonight. Disaster from NASA, an
unmanned rocket contracted for a private firm explodes six seconds after liftoff. NASA says no injuries or loss of life. Joining me now to talk about this is Captain Mark Kelly. He is a former space shuttle commander, and on the phone with me is Senator Bill Nelson of Florida who is also a former astronaut. Good evening, gentlemen. Mr. Kelly, you first, when you see the video of the explosion, what is your reaction? What do you think could have caused this?
CAPTAIN MARK KELLY, FORMER SPACE SHUTTLE COMMANDER: Well, space flight is a difficult thing to do. Launching a rocket presents a number of different challenges. In the video, what you see is it's pretty obvious that there is a first stage failure. Now, I don't think NASA knows and probably won't know for some time whether it was the engine or something else in the first stage. But the first stage providing all the propulsion at that point came apart.
LEMON: While you watch the slow motion launch of this rocket in the cargo spacecraft, doesn't anything look out of the ordinary to you? Because NASA tweeted that the explosion happened six seconds after the launch?
KELLY: Well, they had an anomaly pretty early. It looks quite normal to me. But with the high-speed video and as they start to analyze it, they'll might see something, but I guess probably not. But where they'll see and where they're going to find out what happened is analyzing the data that comes down to the ground, which they got an enormous amount of data you know every millisecond perhaps and then from the debris. So, they'll figure out what happened.
LEMON: Senator Nelson, can you tell which part of the rocket may have -- this may have started in?
SENATOR BILL NELSON, FLORIDA: No, you can't. And Mark's exactly right. They'll do the investigation. I think NASA's going to issue some kind of report later on tonight, but it will take a much lengthier investigation to pinpoint the exact cause.
LEMON: So how will the impact of this -- how will this impact us? Say operations on the international space station? We know the rocket was carrying thousands of pounds of supplies including you know food, and there were also experiments onboard. How does this affect further space travel, Senator Nelson?
NELSON: It won't. I've spoken this evening to the administrator of NASA General Bolden. They have plenty of supplies already on the space station. Later tonight, another cargo rocket from Russia, The Progress is set to launch. We have the Space X rocket ready to go with another cargo coming up in December. They can add to that cargo. So they're not going to miss very much, even though this is a setback. It's one of the rockets, the Antares, that takes cargo up to the space station, but they're not going to miss a beat up there in what they're doing and all of the experimentation.
LEMON: Well, the question is, too, and I'll ask you this as a senator and then I'll ask Mark Kelly this -- Senator, we know there was classified equipment onboard this rocket, so what may have been lost here?
NELSON: Well, I can't answer that until we know the results of the investigation, but there are plenty of backups to get additional equipments up. If something is lost, it can be duplicated and sent up on a later rocket.
LEMON: Mark Kelly.
KELLY: Well, Don, you know, I could tell you, but that's classified. Actually, no. In all serious about this, we don't use the space station as any kind of military platform. So when they talk about cryptographic information, stuff like that, I think it's probably more likely to be part of the rain safety system which is a system that was actually actuated today to destroy the rocket in case of a failure. You know, to make sure it doesn't wind up over any populated area. So they initiated the rain safety system today, but to protect that system, to protect it from somebody, say, like a hacker on the ground. It is done with cryptographic equipment. So that's probably what they're concerned about. I can't imagine that there's something else that was being sent up to the space station. I can't imagine what that would be.
LEMON: Is this a big setback for NASA you think for NASA and private companies you know that they contract?
KELLY: Well, so Senator Nelson talked about how, you know, he talked to General Bolden today, and you know, this won't be a big impact, and one of the reasons is they plan for this. The head of the space station program, Mike Suffredini will plan in the event we do lose something, but also keep in mind we did lose from critical equipment, some spare parts and also four months of my brother's clothing that he was going to have when he was up there for a year at the international space station.
LEMON: Thank you very much, Mark Kelly and Senator Bill Nelson. We appreciate it.
Coming up, 76,000 fans at a Denver Broncos' game on Thursday, but one seems to have vanished without a trace. Paul Kitterman disappeared at halftime. I'm going to talk to his stepson Jared, who was with him at that game. That's next.
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LEMON: Denver Broncos' fan Paul Kitterman was last seen by his stepson Thursday night waiting outside a bathroom at 76,000 seats Sports Authority Field where the Broncos play their home games. Paul vanished soon after that. Authorities are revealing the stadium surveillance footage and treating the bizarre disappearance as an active missing persons investigation. I want to go to Mark Meredith. He is a reporter from KDVR. He is outside Sports Authority Field in Denver. Good evening, Mark. Walk us through what we know.
MARK MEREDITH, KDVR: Don, as you mentioned, this really is just bizarre. Start where it began. Thursday night, Paul Kitterman came down to Denver. He lives about two hours away with his son and two other family friends. They were having a good time. It was his first time at a Denver Broncos' game. Then at some point during half time, his son left his seat to go use the restroom. He comes back. His dad is gone. At first, he doesn't think anything of it, maybe his dad went to get a beer or is walking around the concourses, but by the end of the game, he thought it was strange that his dad had mot shown back up. They go back outside the stadium thinking maybe he was lost or got kicked out of the stadium for whatever reason, still no sign of him. They wait around. The crowds leave.
At this point, tense of thousands inside. But by the time it clears out, it's like a ghost town out here. That's when they really started to worry. So they checked with the paramedics, they checked with the jails, they checked with the detox units, and no sign of the 53-year-old. A day goes by, they file a missing person's report with the Denver police department. That's not uncommon. People can go missing all the time. But what was strange, this guy did not have his cell phone with him. He left it up where he lives about two hours away. He also did not have his car. He rode down with friends. So he would not have had an easy way of getting around. So they couldn't call him either. That wouldn't have done any good. So Denver police have been trying to figure out exactly what happened to him by, as you mentioned, reviewing the surveillance inside the stadium. All these days, five days of them, we still have no idea where Paul Kitterman is and his family, well, they are anxious for answers and are looking for any help they can get to try and find him.
LEMON: Absolutely. I'm going to talk to a family member in just moments. Thank you. And you're going to hear from a family member in just moments. Thank you, Mark Meredith, KDVR, a reporter from Denver there.
I want to bring in now Candice Delong, a former FBI agent and criminal profiler, and the host of investigations discoveries, Facing Evil with Candice Delong. Candice, I watch all the time. Here is what Paul Kitterman's stepson told me just tonight about what he thinks happened to this dad.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So authorities are saying that they don't think foul play is evident here or involved, but they're not ruling it out. They say because there are so many cameras around. There was so many people that someone would have seen something, if it looked the out the ordinary. So what do you think happened?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I get that. I get that side of it, and you know, the question, then, to get that footage, when we first talked to them wasn't about looking for foul play on the cameras. It was about finding why, where he went after that, you know? Maybe you don't see what happens outside the stadium, but you know where he left, and if something bad did happen, out there related, you can find out where it was at. You know, the direction.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. I want Candice and everyone to stand by because we are hearing now that Kitterman has just been down found. That is what Denver police are tweeting out now. Paul Kitterman who disappeared at a Denver Broncos' game this weekend has been found. I want to get back now to reporter Mark Meredith from KDVR. He is on the ground now. Mark, that is coming from the official feed of the Denver police department?
MEREDITH: It is coming from the Denver police department as you mentioned. It was coming on Twitter when you and I were just talking a few minutes ago, I could see my phone lighting up. Just as we got done with our segment, they are reporting that he was found safe, meaning he is alive. Now, where he's been the last five days, that's still the big question. We don't have answers on that. We'll be reaching out to the family in the next few minutes. I checked with them an hour ago, and still no idea where he was but as you mentioned, the word now coming from the Denver police department that Paul Kitterman five days after vanishing from Sports Authority Field has been found, and he is alive. I am now just starting to work on the story, and as soon as I have some more information, I'll make sure to get back to you, guys.
LEMON: Absolutely. Mark, stand by because we are going to go through this again. Again, I spoke with his stepson, Jared Thompson this evening and he said, he mentioned what you said, Mark. He said he didn't have this cell phone with him. As a matter of fact, it wasn't that unusual he didn't carry it all the time. He was a rancher. He liked to be alone, he would go out sometimes, and go for long rides, but he will always let people know where he was. The interesting thing as well is someone said you know in the final moments of the game that they saw him, and again, this is according to -- according to The Sun and according to reports that they saw him and he was a little concerned. He was waiting for his son. He looked concern, but had issues with the crowd. He said he didn't like crowds. So now, the police department reporting that he has been found safe and sound. The question is again as you said where has he been all of this time?
MEREDITH: That is the big quirks and right now, Denver police have not put out the information. I'm kind of watching my phone just to try to get an idea where that's going to be. They have always done it on Twitter when they have new information, especially late at night. They'll tweet it out. His family, they were talking what they are going to do next. They were trying to see whether or not he was still trapped inside the stadium. That was their big fear, that he got into an emergency exit or one of the concession stands. But right now, again the latest information that Denver police are putting out, again on Twitter, that he was found in the last few minutes and that he is alive and that he is safe. We're going to be working to figure out where he's been all of these days now, later.
LEMON: All right, Paul Kitterman last seen by his stepson on Thursday night at a Denver Broncos game, now has been found. He's been missing since Sunday, and according to the Denver police department, and their official Twitter site, Mark Kitterman -- Paul Kitterman I should say has been found.
We'll continue to update you on this breaking news as well as the other big stories. We'll be right back here on CNN. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: More breaking news now. We have a new terror warning tonight for thousands of federal government buildings across the country. The department of homeland security is ordering beefed up protection for more than 9,500 buildings and their 1.4 million daily visitors. The move is being called a precaution in the wake of the attack on Canada's parliament.
I want to bring in a man who says we in the west are fooling ourselves that terrorism is a term that means nothing but justifies everything. Glenn Greenwald, co-founding editor of The Intercept and author of No Place To Hide, and he joins me now. Thank you for joining us, Glenn. Let's get right to the United States federal buildings are under increased security measures tonight in part because of last week's attacks in Canada. Does that surprise you?
GLENN GREENWALD, NO PLACE TO HIDE AUTHOR: It doesn't surprise me at all. In the last six years, just under President Obama alone, the United States has dropped bombs on seven different predominantly Muslim countries as well as bombed a Muslim minority Philippines, which makes eight. The United States has proclaimed itself at war for 13 years now. You cannot go around the world dropping bombs on people, imprisoning them are without charges, torturing people and expect no one will want to bring violence back to your shores as well. That's the nature of war.
LEMON: In your article, Intercept, you say the same about Canada. You say, Canada has been at war for 13 years, a terrorist attack -- you write this, it is always stunning when a country that has brought violence and military force to numerous countries acts shocked and bewildered when someone bring a tiny piece of that violence back to that country. So for many people, it is still shocking that violence comes to North America, to the U.S., and to Canada.
GREENWALD: Well, I mean, I think the reason why it's shocking is twofold. One is we seem to think it's perfectly normal and OK for the Middle East and for parts of Asia to have a never-ending stream of our bombs dropped on them, but somehow North America is sacred soil, and that that's the one place bombs shouldn't be dropped, and wars don't work that way. You don't get to go around, as I said earlier, dropping bombs on people all over the world and think your precious soil won't ever be the target of violence. The other thing that's important to realize is that we pay a huge amount of attention whenever there's a single person killed or two people killed in one of these attacks. Our government has killed thousands upon thousands of children and women and innocent men and we never focus on them. We don't know any of their names the way we do our own victims. We don't hear from their grieving relatives and so it's easy to think that our government isn't bringing violence to other parts of the world, but it is, and I think it's important for us to realize that.
LEMON: You make it sound as if the -- that it is justified, that all of these acts are justified. How do you justify acts of violence?
GREENWALD: Well, no. I don't actually -- I am not addressing the question of justification whatsoever. I'm addressing the question of causation. So if somebody smokes four packs of cigarettes a day and contracts emphysema, I everybody absorb that their behavior caused that to happen. It doesn't mean I'm justifying it or celebrating it. I think though that if you want to about rational citizen and decide whether or not you want to support your government bringing violence to other parts of the world, one of the things you have to accept is that violence will be brought back to you. That's a reason not to do it. You asked me how you can justify violence. It's the United States that is doing more violence in the world than any other country. We're bombing more countries, invading and occupying them. We're supporting countries like Israel and Saudi Arabia that bring enormous amounts of violence to the world. So I think if you ask how can you ever justify violence we ought to begin with our own government and ask them that question.
LEMON: Hey, Glenn, I have a short time left, but I want to address that New Yorker article about newyorker.com, he said that Harper is speaking of another writer, and that Glenn Greenwald are wrong to frame in a simplistic monocausal way. If military and political interference is such a dominant driving force in terrorism, why are these acts more common and he goes on to say it is more likely mental illness that ISIS and other groups are really appealing to disturbed individuals, preying on disturbed individuals rather than causation, as you say.
GREENWALD: Well, I was in Canada that whole week and the government claimed, insistently it was ideology that caused these attacks. There was a video apparently left by the Ottawa shooter as the Canadian police revealed, in which he said he was acting in protest of Canadian foreign policy in that region. We've seen it over and over. People accused of terrorism. Why did you try to blow up a bomb at Times Square? They say the same thing. Because I watched you drop bombs from drones and kill innocent Muslim women, children and men, and I felt it was my only recourse. They say it over and over.
LEMON: Glenn Greenwald, thank you.
GREENWALD: Appreciate it, Don. Thank you.
LEMON: We'll be right back.
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LEMON: The survivors of Ebola may hold the only key to defeating the deadly virus. And tomorrow night, I'll talk exclusively to one of them. Ashoka Mukpo is the NBC cameraman who is working with Nancy Snyderman when he became ill in Liberia. Now, he is virus-free and he is telling his story of survival. That's right here tomorrow night on CNN. I'll see you then. Thanks for watching. I will be back here tomorrow night. Our coverage continues now. AC360 starts right now.
