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Nancy Grace
Maury Show Couple Child Sex Abuse Charges; Broncos Fan Vanishes From Stadium
Aired October 28, 2014 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Mommy and Daddy duke it out on national TV on the TV hit show the Maury Povich show, slinging mud
about who`s the baby`s daddy. Bombshell tonight. Just after, cops point the finger at them, suspecting Daddy sex abuses the 5-year-old little girl,
calling it, quote, "a game." And Mommy, you`re not off the hook, either!
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An Alabama couple who appeared on the Maury TV show charged in connection with the alleged sexual abuse of the woman`s 5-
year-old daughter. Williams, 21, is charged with raping the little girl. Authorities claim that the child told her mom about the alleged abuse, but
they did nothing to stop it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And live, Denver. It was a sold-out game at Denver Broncos stadium. But tonight, mystery surrounding the game and the disappearance
of a fan who disappears inside the stadium at halftime, never seen again. How do you disappear in front of 76,000 people?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The family of Paul Kitterman, sports authorities feel, is the place they come to search.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were looking everywhere, parking lots, in trees, bushes, anywhere we could think of.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now they`re hoping you might be able to help.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And we are live at the Phoenix courthouse, bringing you the latest in the Jodi Arias death penalty retrial.
Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. Mommy and Daddy duke it out on national TV on the TV hit the Maury Povich show, slinging mud about who`s the baby`s Daddy, of
course. But then just after, cops point the finger at them, suspecting the stepdaddy sex abuses the 5-year-old little girl, calling it all, quote, "a
game."
And Mommy, you`re not off the hook, either, because according to police, the little 5-year-old girl told her mom repeatedly that Mommy`s
live-in stepdaddy was sexually abusing her. Now, it`s just amazing to me that you would go on a nationally syndicated show with huge ratings and not
think you`re drawing attention to yourself?
We`ve done a little investigating. It seems that the sex abuse, the alleged sex abuse, on the 5-year-old little girl was happening at the time
that Mommy and Stepdaddy appear on the Maury Povich show. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Brittney, you are one confused young lady!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know. I know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What is the deal? Do you have feelings for him?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do care about him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have feelings (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You`re in love with him?
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) out of my face!
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) send (ph) me home now!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s been with you throughout the entire time with this little boy.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, what is this, one big cheating town? What`s going on down there? Who do you want to be the father?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (DELETED)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You want (DELETED) to be the father.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What are you going to do if David`s the father?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m not sure.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you want to do if (DELETED) is the father?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to be with him (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You are seeing video of NBC`s Universal "Maury" from YouTube. The child at the central of this controversy on the show is the baby
sibling linked to the child in this case. The other man in the video is not part of this case. The title of that is, "I love my fiance and my ex.
Who`s my baby`s Daddy?"
All right, that`s my jumping-off point right there, is that is how all the attention was brought to this couple.
Straight out to Dave Mack, syndicated talk show host. Dave, I mean, the couple brings all the attention to themselves by going on national TV.
I mean, if I didn`t know who my baby`s daddy was, I don`t know that I would go on TV on Maury and talk about it. But you know, you can buy DNA kits at
the drug store now. Long story short, what, they didn`t think that that would draw attention to their living arrangement?
DAVE MACK, SYNDICATED TALK SHOW HOST (via telephone): Nancy, it is so sick and perverted. I look at the -- you know, you keep saying that
Mommy`s not off the hook. I blame the mommy for all of this! She`s the one that drug them onto national television to humiliate at least one of
the men she claims to have loved. It turns out to be the very man who was abusing her older daughter! A 5-year-old daughter was sexually molested!
She was raped. She was sodomized! And this mother did nothing except bring more attention to humiliate that guy and pressure him to do even more
damage!
GRACE: Everybody, he goes from the Maury Povich show to behind bars. And what`s so disturbing, the little 5-year-old girl who`s the center of
this controversy, told the mother over and over and over that her live-in, her stepdad was abusing her.
Joining me right now, I`m hearing in my ear, Sheriff Larry Amerson, the Calhoun County sheriff. Sheriff, thanks so much for being with us.
SHERIFF LARRY AMERSON, Calhoun COUNTY, ALABAMA (via telephone): You`re welcome. Thank you for having me.
GRACE: You know, Sheriff, it just amazes me -- number one, you know, I tried child molestation cases for 10 years. But what adds another layer
of incredulity to this, is this couple goes on the Maury show, which has ratings out the ying-yang! I think it`s actually syndicated and it just
runs and runs and runs really all over the world. What, they didn`t think, that`s like waving a red flag in front of your nose?
AMERSON: Well, certainly, there`s a tragedy here, several layers. But there`s a 5-year-old child that`s the victim of sexual crimes against
her, as well as the public aspect of this case. We know -- we try make sure the victims of sex crimes are not revealed. But this is certainly an
unusual case.
GRACE: You know, Sheriff, what`s another layer that`s disturbing me is that it`s bad enough that Mommy brings this guy into the home, all
right, and he lives there. But the little girl apparently is telling her mother that he is abusing her, right?
AMERSON: That is correct. That is what -- we have a children`s center here, a child advocacy center. When we have sexual or physical
abuse allegations on a child, we work as a team. Our investigators, the district attorney`s office, the Department of Human Resources all work
together in the interview of the child to ensure we have a valid interview. During those -- that time with the child, the child did reveal that they
had asked her mother, or told their mother that this was happening.
GRACE: Well, Sheriff Amerson, another thing I don`t understand is that the stepfather -- everyone, these two appear national TV in a
paternity dispute, all right? Who`s my baby`s daddy? As if that`s not waving a red flag in front of the bull, I don`t know what is. As if that
wouldn`t bring attention to them.
But Sheriff Amerson, it`s my understanding that the stepdaddy allegedly tells the little girl it`s all a game when he is molesting her?
It`s a game?
AMERSON: That is correct. That is what the victim stated in the interview, that that`s the way it was described as to what was happening to
her, and that she participated in the...
GRACE: What was the game?
AMERSON: Well, I don`t want to get all deep into that, if you can understand it because...
GRACE: I do.
AMERSON: ... the nature of the case. But the fact is, the child said that the suspect said this was a game and if the child went along, that she
would be rewarded.
GRACE: Unleash the lawyers. Joining me, Dwane Cates out of Phoenix, Danny Cevallos out of New York. All right, Cevallos, why shouldn`t Mommy
go to jail for the rest of her life? She knew this was happening.
DANNY CEVALLOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, first of all, Nancy, I know the first thing you`re going to want to do is play that
video on an Imax screen in front of the jury five or six times, and we`re going to move as defense attorneys to keep that out because it...
GRACE: You didn`t answer may question.
CEVALLOS: ... as offensive as it is -- all right, I`ll get to that. I`ll answer your question, then. So as you know from prosecuting these
cases, there are many situations where parents themselves may be victims, as well, and mothers are often abused spouses and unable...
GRACE: Really?
CEVALLOS: ... to effect the kind of change that a jury might conclude holds them liable. And you know that from prosecuting these cases, Nancy.
GRACE: OK, first of all, let just get this straight. Don`t tell me what I know because what I know is this mother needs to go to jail for 20
to life. Now, you`re claiming Mommy is too weak and abused to stand up for herself or her child, so she lets the child be sexually abused by her live-
in, the stepfather.
But let me remind you, Mr. Cevallos, that the topic of the Maury Povich show was, "I love my fiance and my ex. Who`s my baby`s daddy?" All
right? That`s the mother talking! Not judging. I don`t care who she sleeps with.
CEVALLOS: Videos that...
GRACE: But what I do care about is she let her child be molested, and she knew about it. Now, hold on. Let`s take a look at the shrinking
violet you`re talking about, Cevallos. Roll it, Liz, please.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re going to find out right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am sorry, baby.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When it comes to 4-month-old (EXPLETIVE DELETED) (EXPLETIVE DELETED). You are not the father!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: She`s not afraid. Well, OK, look at this. She`s just sitting there, loving it, basking in the attention that these two guys are
fighting, basically, over her.
Everybody, that`s video from NBC Universal`s "Maury" off YouTube. The child at the center of this paternity controversy, not the 5-year-old girl.
Now, the other man not linked to this abuse case, I guess that is the ex.
Michael Christian -- could you cut that off, please? Michael Christian, let`s get it straight. The fiance is the man accused of
molesting the child, right?
MICHAEL CHRISTIAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER (via telephone): That`s correct, Nancy. His name is David Anthony Williams.
GRACE: OK. All right, so that`s the fiance, the stepdaddy, so to speak -- that`s loosely applied -- the live-in. OK, that is David Anthony
Williams. So the ex is not part of this. All right, good to know.
Unleash the lawyers, Dwane Cates and Danny Cevallos. So Dwane Cates, she was sitting there loving the attention, loving that these two guys are
fighting over this infant. This is the sex abuse sibling, the little 5- year-old`s little sibling.
Now, all this, the sex attack was happening at the time of this show, Dwane.
DWANE CATES, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It was, Nancy. But just because you`re an idiot doesn`t mean that you`re a molester. I mean, just because
she`s on this show doesn`t prove that she knew her daughter was being molested. Now, it may have been mentioned that she had. The daughter may
have said something. But we have no idea of the context of what it was said or how it was said. So you can`t put it all on her. Again, she`s an
idiot for going on the show...
GRACE: I`m not putting it all on her.
CATES: ... but that doesn`t mean...
GRACE: I`m not putting it on her. I`m not putting on it her! But when Cevallos says that she is an abused woman and she`s afraid -- she
didn`t look afraid to me. You got to agree to go on the Maury Povich show and tell your story. She obviously was not concerned. These two guys were
fighting over her. She did not look like a shrinking violet to me.
CEVALLOS: People don`t put on public faces...
GRACE: That is not going to fly!
CEVALLOS: ... that are different than their private faces, Nancy? You know that. And I will tell you what you know because...
GRACE: There you go again.
CEVALLOS: ... you know that, too.
GRACE: Back to you, Dwane Cates. The issue is not whether she`s on Maury Povich or not. The issue is that the girl told her -- the girl, the
little 5-year-old girl told Mommy that her live-in was molesting her. And mommy let it happen, Dwane Cates. Now, how does she get out of being an
accessory to the crime?
CATES: Well, the thing is, is the Maury Povich show, you`re right, has absolutely nothing to do with this. And the way she gets out of the
crime is, is did she know her daughter was being molested? OK, was there - - did she have credible evidence? You know, what was the context that she was told that her daughter was being molested? Did she witness it? I
mean, we don`t have any facts of this at all (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: Hold on. Let`s go to Sheriff Amerson...
CATES: None at all!
GRACE: Sheriff Larry Amerson joining me, the Calhoun County elected sheriff. Sheriff, our research shows that she told several relatives about
it, that she had told Mommy order and over and over, and that`s how the case got brought to light. These two appear on the Maury Povich show, and
the relatives then come forward and remeet with this little girl is telling them. Is that how it all cracked wide open?
AMERSON: (INAUDIBLE) it started with a domestic violence incident between Williams and Brittney Day. And during that situation, they were
fighting over a child (INAUDIBLE) fighting, tugging on the child. They were both arrested. While the child was placed in the safety plan by the
Department of Human Resources is when the disclosure came that there was an allegation of sexual abuse. And that`s how we got into the scene, and in
that investigation, again, the evidence we have shows that the mother was informed, clearly informed about what was going on with her child and chose
to not reveal it to anyone.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: David Anthony Williams and Brittney Day were featured on an episode of the Maury Povich television show. But now
they`ve both been arrested on felony charges stemming from the alleged sexual molestation of Day`s 5-year-old daughter. Police say that David
Anthony Williams, 21, raped the little girl. And Brittney Day, 25, the child`s mother, has also been arrested as the police claim that she learned
about the alleged abuse but didn`t do anything to stop it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: This couple brings national attention to themselves by appearing on the Maury Povich show, where Mommy pits her fiance, her live-
in, and her ex against each other, trying to determine, "Who`s my baby`s daddy?" obviously loving every moment of it. It`s like waving a red flag
in front of a bull. Next thing you know, charges leveled against them that the live-in molesting the little girl.
To Marc Klaas, president and founder, Klaas Kids Foundation. Marc, weigh in.
MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION (via telephone): Well, there`s a couple of things. First of all, children`s advocacy centers have a
wonderful approach to interviewing children. It`s a carefully crafted multi-disciplinary approach that holds up in court time after time after
time. And they do that without causing harm or further harm to the child.
But one of the lawyers invoked the abuse excuse. And I would like the suggest that that`s blaming somebody else, rather than yourself. I`ve met
so many people that have been abused as children, that have determined that when they became adults, they were going to protect their children from the
very kind of harm that was caused to them. So this idea that when you`re abused as a child, you automatically turn into an abuser I think is
something that really needs to be taken -- that needs to be looked at very seriously.
GRACE: You know, the thing is also, Marc Klaas, is that Mommy should not skate on this.
KLAAS: Oh, no, she`s odious. Oh, she`s an odious character! Both of these adults (INAUDIBLE) never be allowed near children again in their
lives!
GRACE: To Dr. Ramani Durvasula, clinical psychologist in LA -- Dr. Ramani, I don`t understand. Do you have to have a man that badly in your
home that you will stand by, one who abuses your 5-year-old little girl?
RAMANI DURVASULA, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: I mean, Nancy, the dynamic in this case is so disturbing. And I agree, the bad judgment in taking
their relationship public on the Maury Povich show -- I don`t think the two are related. I just don`t think there`s any judgment here.
And yes, some women, particularly young women sometimes of her age who have the responsibility of kids, they can`t see straight for wanting the
boyfriend, for wanting the partner. And then they do not protect their child. Nancy, I`ve said it before. Just because you can have a baby
doesn`t mean you`re a good mother.
GRACE: Everyone, they really brought attention to themselves by appearing on the nationally syndicated Maury Povich show. Not judging that
Mommy sleeps around. Don`t care. But the fact that Mommy stood by while her 5-year-old little girl told her she was being abused? Mommy is going
to jail! Take a look at these two.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What (ph) did she tell you she loved? Me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who`s she engaged to? Me!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These two men want to be the father of this beautiful baby.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She told me there was not a doubt in her mind that it was mine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who`s the father (DELETED) David or someone else?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What is this, one big cheating town? What`s going on down there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The results will surprise you. But first, Brittney has something to reveal.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have feelings for him?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do care about him.
(CROSSTALK)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That`s Mommy, all right! Video of NBC Universal`s "Maury" from YouTube. The child at the center of this controversy on "Maury" not
the child being linked to the sex abuse case, the other man in the video also not linked.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... vanishing during halftime of Thursday`s Broncos-Chargers game...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Never, ever just (INAUDIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) middle of the football game.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We`re just reaching, and we`ve exhausted all of our sources. And we just really do not know what else to do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Live to Denver. It was a sold-out game at the Denver Broncos stadium. But tonight, mystery surrounding the game and the disappearance
of a fan who disappears inside the stadium at halftime, never seen again. How do you disappear in front of 76,000 people?
Joining me right now, Randy Corporon, KLV. Randy, thanks for being with us. How do you disappear in front of 70,000 people?
RANDY CORPORON, TALK SHOW HOST, KLV (via telephone): Well, this is something, Nancy. This strikes home for me because I was at that game with
my 19-year-old son, Noah (ph). So I can`t imagine. The place was packed, full of security. There are cameras, police. And this guy seems to have
disappeared without a trace.
GRACE: OK, Randy, how did the whole thing go down? I understand this was the first time they`d ever been at the stadium.
CORPORON: Yes, what a great outing for these folks, 21st birthday of the son coming up, first time to go to a Bronco game for Mr. Kitterman, the
gentleman who disappeared. And apparently, at halftime, while he was waiting outside of the restroom for his son, the son came out of the
restroom and Dad was gone.
GRACE: OK. I got to tell you something, Randy Corporon. I took my - - I`ve taken my children to every major ballfield that we could get to -- New York, Atlanta, California. I took my twins to the bathroom and brought
them back out. They were standing right there with me. I turned to look for ice cream for them, turned around, my son was gone in the crowd. Gone!
Of course, I started screaming, got security, called 911, the works. He was just around the corner. But in that many people, Randy, that
crowded, and all the music and the sound, it`s hard to find somebody. But it`s been four days.
CORPORON: It`s terrifying. And I can tell you from experience, those hallways and concierge areas and concession areas are packed during
halftime. But this is a grown man, a hunter, a rancher. It`s not like somebody could pick him up and carry him away.
GRACE: You know, another thing -- out to Jean Casarez, CNN correspondent joining us on the story. For those of you just joining us, a
dad and his son go to a Broncos game, sold out. They go to the bathroom at halftime. Dad is never seen again. He vanishes somewhere inside this
stadium.
And it seems to me, Jean, no offense because you know, I always take the side of the cops, but it seem like they just blew it off. They didn`t
think it was serious. This man has never, ever missed work. He shows up - - never, ever, ever. This is not like him. Jean, that would be just like somebody telling me that you didn`t show up to work and you were spotted in
Jamaica on a cruise or something. I wouldn`t believe it!
CASAREZ: You know, Nancy, here`s what Tina said to me. She is the lifelong friend that was with Paul Kitterman and helped him get the tickets
because they had two spare tickets. She said the police told her that they believed he had just walked away and left his life. He was a grown man
with no health issues, really nothing at issue. And that he was free and voluntarily walked away. That`s not a crime. She says he would never do
that. That wasn`t his constitution, those weren`t his values. And Nancy, it is a very close window of time. Because Tia Bakke (ph) and her
boyfriend, they were all four together talking by the restrooms at the intermission. The third quarter started. Tia and her boyfriend left.
Last words they said were, we`ll meet you at gate number eight when the game is over. The son went into the bathroom. When the son came out, he
was gone. That short time span right there.
GRACE: And the other thing, when you hear of a guy saying, hey, I`m going out to get some milk and they never come back, they`re running away
from something, like a bad marriage, a lot of debt, problems at work or some kind of substance abuse. This guy had none of that. He had none of
that. Not only that. A lot of time you hear a man leaving their spouses. This guy was there with his son, Jean Casarez. You aren`t going to just
leave your son standing there looking for daddy. Somewhere in that stadium is a clue, Jean Casarez.
CASAREZ: I asked all the questions of this close family friend. She said they come from a really small town. She said she believed he could
have been overwhelmed with the crowds of people. You said 77,000 people you believe were there that night. But she said if he had to leave the
stadium because of that feeling, he would have let someone know. That was just who he was. He wouldn`t have just left. She did say that a couple of
times, he needed to be by himself and he would go out on his horse for the day. But he would tell people and he would always come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s a place where thousands of people come almost every week to celebrate but for the family of Paul Kitterman, Sports
Authority Field is the place they come to search.
We met Kitterman`s son Jarod outside the stadium on Sunday. It was then he told us about his father vanishing during halftime of Thursday`s
Broncos Chargers game. And after searching for a few hours around the stadium, the family also checked hospitals and jails but came up empty.
Trying to find Kitterman has not been easy. He did not have the cell phone at the game and rode down with friends, leaving him without a car.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Joining me right now is that son. Jarod, thank you so much for being with us.
JAROD TONNESON, MISSING DAD`S STEPSON: Yes, no problem. Thank you for having me.
GRACE: Jarod, I just don`t believe that he left. I don`t believe it. Somewhere in that Broncos stadium, there is a clue. Tell me what happened.
TONNESON: Do you want, you know, the whole story? Or from when we last saw him?
GRACE: When you last saw him.
TONNESON: Okay. You know, we had all been there (inaudible) at halftime. I said, hey, I have to go to the bathroom real quick. During
the time I was in the bathroom, apparently Tina and he (ph) went back to their seats. I came back and Paul wasn`t there. At that point, I realized
that there was the possibility that Paul may have gone to a different bathroom. Right around the corner there was a larger bathroom. The one I
was at was just a three-person bathroom, with pretty long lines. He could have gone to get something to drink or just anything. So I stood there
waiting, 15, 20 minutes just in case he came back, because that`s where I told him I would come back to. And he didn`t come show up. I thought
maybe he wanted to watch the game and our seats are really close by. So I went to our seats. Still not real alarmed. A little concerned. But
mostly confused.
GRACE: I mean, I don`t see -- this guy had a functioning job, he had never had any problems in his life. He hasn`t gone missing before.
Highly, highly intelligent. Has been a great father. I don`t understand, Randy Corporon, how he can suddenly just disappear. One thing that`s
bugging me is that the police acted like it was no big deal and it has taken them quite a while to start going through the video.
CORPORON: Well, we are four days in. I guess the police response here is that, listen, we have no evidence of foul play. We have no reason
to believe something happened, and an adult man can wander off and not be found if that`s what he chooses. But they have stepped it up here in the
last 10 or 12 hours with missing persons alerts and Denver police department tweets and that sort of thing.
GRACE: To Justin Freiman on the story, what more do we know?
FREIMAN: Nancy, we know that there is hundreds of hours of footage from inside that stadium. The problem is this fan like so many others is
dressed with a Broncos cap on him. That makes it very difficult to spot him in these giant crowds.
GRACE: Let`s take another look at him, look at this stadium. 77,000 people in the stadium. How do you go missing amongst 77,000 people? So
Randy, the cops at first thought he just left. Left what? He is not in a bad marriage. He has tons of freedom in his job. He can go riding out on
the ranch any time he wants to. He doesn`t need to get away from anything, Randy.
CORPORON: Well, I`m a practicing defense attorney in Denver as well, and I think the police were using the 72-hour rule. Somebody is not gone
for 72 hours, they get too many of these reports. You`re right. In a stadium lake this, the first trip with the son celebrating a birthday a
little bit early. Nobody would just walk away from that. You have to wonder why the police didn`t get more active early on.
GRACE: To Marc Klaas, founder of KlaasKids foundation, how rare is it for a dad in this situation to just disappear?
KLAAS: Well, Nancy, I have a friend or had a friend down in Texas about a decade ago that did exactly. He seemed to have a perfect life. He
had a great marriage, a wonderful woman he was married to, and one day he just absolutely disappeared. It was only years later that he was located
living under a freeway onramp.
That having been said, I don`t think he necessarily walked away from his life, but there are a couple of avenues that haven`t been explored.
That they can explore as they continue to search for him.
I haven`t heard anybody talk about checking homeless shelters. I haven`t heard anybody talk about posting on social media, putting up a page
for him. That is a very effective way to get missing persons back or to find out where they are.
GRACE: Well, from what we know, Randy, he is not in a shelter. He did not leave on his own. Is there any evidence he left willingly? Has
his ATM been used? Have he checked out money? Has his cell phone -- gotten his cell phone back and he`s using it? There is nothing to suggest
he left on his own. The clue is inside that stadium, Randy.
CORPORON: You`re probably right. As an earlier commentator said a minute ago, there are literally hours and hours and hours of footage
because of the multiple number of cameras there, so that could take some serious time. There`s no evidence either way. There is no evidence of
foul play or there is no evidence he had any reason to just walk away.
GRACE: Jean Casarez, what more can you tell me? You take your dad, or your dad takes to you a game to celebrate your birthday. You`re going
to pick time at halftime to disappear out of your son`s life? That doesn`t make sense to me.
CASAREZ: Nancy, I`ve been on the phones several time with police today, and it appears as though, the only thing they`ll tell me is they are
going through the surveillance video. And they won`t say if they found anything. That tells me they haven`t found anything because otherwise they
would be doing more things. I asked them have search warrants been executed at all on his home computer, on his cell phone that he didn`t
bring that day to the stadium. They said no. And I also asked about bus stations. And anything around town that searching for this person. It
doesn`t seem like they`re doing it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: We are live in the Phoenix courthouse bringing you the latest in the Jodi Arias death penalty retrial. Straight out to Mike Duffy,
standing by at the courthouse. I understand that Jodi Arias` own defense attorney put up giant blow-up photos of Arias naked?
DUFFY: Nancy, these graphic photos were difficult for everyone from family to jurors alike to watch. What he was saying was this woman was
welcomed in the home.
GRACE: Okay, wait, wait. Mike Duffy, why did her own defense lawyer have to put up naked photos of her to show she was welcome? Aren`t there
other ways to do that than to put up photos of her genitals? I don`t know that that`s such a great trial strategy.
DUFFY: Well, it seemed he was trying to indicate that Travis Alexander was perhaps in love with her. That`s what these photos were.
They were showing her in a vulnerable state.
GRACE: Mike, mike, mike. You`re not married, right?
DUFFY: Correct, I`m not married.
GRACE: Okay. Let`s talk about love for a moment. In love. In love. So Nurmi plasters the courtroom with blow-ups of Jodi Arias`s genitals.
All right. Now you`re saying, he was trying to show Travis was in love with her? Wasn`t he taking another woman to Cancun on a trip?
DUFFY: Yes, that is the case. But obviously she was there in his home.
GRACE: You said, Mike, that he`s trying to show that Travis Alexander is in love with her. That was your take on it. He`s taking somebody else.
Yes, he had sex with her all day, but he is taking somebody else to Cancun. There has got to be another reason he`s putting the photos up. What is it?
DUFFY: That`s not just my interpretation. He in fact did try to say the word love at one point, which of course was objected to. But that was
the message he was trying to get across today.
GRACE: What did he say about love?
DUFFY: He was asking Flores on the stand if this looks like someone who might have been in love with her. That was immediately objected to by
Martinez.
GRACE: Hold on. Let`s just go out to the line. Hay, Joe, what`s your question?
CALLER: Nancy, in connection with the facts of the murder, the actual murder, it occurs to me that bathroom floors and shower floors are
slippery. And then when she started stabbing him, which she did -- she didn`t shoot him first, she shot him at the end when he was probably dead.
When she was stabbing him, the blood flowed easily and quickly. He could not get any stability. He was in his bare feet. How could he, you
know, really be able to be stable enough to defend himself? She had her shoes on, I believe, and she might have been dressed. So that poor guy.
He didn`t stand a chance.
GRACE: No, he really didn`t, Joe. And we`re talking right now about the unusual tactic, Joe, in Florida, of the defense attorney plastering the
courtroom with giant blow-up photos of Arias`s genitals. I don`t know if that really -- you know, guys, control room, I`ve seen it. Thanks. But
how does that go to prove that Travis Alexander was in love with her? Joe, are you still there? I think I`ve lost him. Out to Kinsey Schofield, a
blogger. Explain to me, did you see jury reaction during all this?
SCHOFIELD: I did. And they were uncomfortable and they didn`t want to sit through it at all. I think what Nurmi is doing is trying to prove
that Travis is a monster. I think he is showing these photos to say that Travis was a bad guy and he emotionally and physically abused Arias and
took advantage of her. And that`s why we`re seeing these pictures. I don`t necessarily believe it is love, although I do think he is showing the
jury that Jodi was welcome in his home, as long as she was willing to give it up.
GRACE: All right. Valerie Paraso, anchor, KFYI, what is your take on it? What else happened in court, Valerie?
PARASO: There were several other things that happened in court. For example, the phone conversations that for some reason Jodi Arias decided to
tape. We still don`t know why she did that. But some very explicit phone conversations, but I think the defense attorney was trying to point out
that Travis Alexander was not such a good guy after all.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ARIAS: It was a little confusing. Sex, where the lane should be drawn. Sex is sex but there are different ways to have sex. He had like
the Bill Clinton version, whereas over here, it seemed like, you know, oral and anal sex were also sex to me but not for him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: An odd and twisted day in the courtroom today. The Jodi Arias death penalty retrial has commenced. To Dr. Joy M. Carter joining us,
chief forensic pathologist, author of "I Speak for the Dead." Thank you for being with us. You know what I noticed, Dr. Carter, with the gunshot
wound to the head -- you know there were the 29 stab wounds, including the slash to the throat of Travis Alexander. There was not blood or
hemorrhaging along the trajectory path of the bullet. What does that mean?
CARTER: That means he had suffered a lot of injury and blood loss from the stab wounds. And that his circulation wasn`t working. In other
words, he was nearly dead by the time the gunshot was inflicted. This is an example of overkill.
GRACE: Basically like shooting a dead body. If he was still alive at the time he was shot, he was either dead or near dead at the time that he
was shot because there wasn`t bleeding through the trajectory path.
Another thing, Dr. Carter, if you can show the photos of the bloody sink. We know the attack likely started in the shower. And that he was
walking while bleeding. So if he had taken a shot to the head, I don`t understand. I`m just a lay person. I don`t understand how he can be
walking around and standing over the shower bleeding if he had been shot in the head.
CARTER: Yes. It certainly suggests the gunshot wound was certainly toward the end, the very end, and the injury to the hands indicating he was
fighting for his life. He was in a self-defense mode with multiple injuries to his hands and multiple stab wounds to his body.
GRACE: Lawyers, Dwayne Cates, Danny Cevallos. Dwayne Cates, explain why it was so important that the state prove he was shot last.
CATES: Well, you know, he was shot last because it is for important them because they`re going to show that he suffered greatly. If he had
been shot first, he wouldn`t have suffered.
GRACE: Right. Let`s stop and remember Army Sergeant Kenneth Ross, 24, Peoria, Arizona. Bronze Star, Purple Heart, Air Medal, loved flying.
Parents, David and Mary, sister Stephanie. Kenneth Ross, American hero. And congratulations to Robin Johns Grant, named author of the year by the
Georgia Association of College Stores. (inaudible). She coached me through algebra 2. Her latest book, "Summer`s Winter." A mystery teaching
us to believe in a divine plan for our life.
Everyone, thank you for being with us. Drew up next. I`ll see you tomorrow night. 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
