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Nurse Vows to Fight Ebola Quarantine; Obama Stands with Ebola Caregivers; Apple CEO Proud to be Gay; Christie Tells Heckler: "Sit Down and Shut Up"

Aired October 30, 2014 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now in the NEWSROOM, Quarantine showdown. Casey Hickox versus the state of Maine. She says she's prepared to fight. And not be forced to stay in her home.

Plus, a live and possibly still plotting attacks. U.S. officials this morning raising concerns that airstrikes did not get two top Khorasan terrorists and --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: Sit down and shut up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: That heckler tries to repeatedly interrupt Chris Christie, but the New Jersey governor, well, as you heard, he has some advice of his own.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIE: Turn around, get your 15 minutes of fame and then maybe take your jacket off, roll up your sleeves and do something for the people of this state.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Let's talk. Live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

Good morning. I'm Carol Costello. thank you so much for joining me. We begin with the tense showdown between American nurse Casey Hickox and the state of Maine. Right now, state police are standing guard outside of the home where Hickox is staying in Fort Kent, Maine. This as health officials begin the process of filing a court order that would require Hickox to follow a 21-day Ebola quarantine.

Now overnight, Hickox, who spoke from her front lawn with her boyfriend at her side, said she is prepared to fight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KACI HICKOX, QUARANTINED NURSE: I have been told that the attorney general's intention is to file legal action against me. And if this does occur, then I will challenge those legal action. NORMAN SIEGEL, ATTORNEY FOR KACI HICKOX: At this point, the worst

thing would be is if she steps out of her house in the next hour and they try to put handcuffs on her. I sincerely hope that never occurs. If we're going to have a disagreement, let's have the disagreement in a court of law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Since returning from Sierra Leone, Hickox has shown no symptoms of Ebola and says she has tested negative twice for the various. She's already undergone mandatory isolation at a New Jersey hospital so let's talk about all of this.

Let's bring in CNN's Jean Casarez, she's in Fort Kent, Maine, this morning, outside of the home where Hickox is staying.

So what does it look like there? Where are state police or are they just hanging out in front of the driveway?

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

Well, Casey Hickox just left her home. It was minutes ago. She was on her bicycle, we believe, with her boyfriend. But they got on their bikes, drove down that road and the state police, there was one man -- two-manned vehicles, one marked, one unmarked, they both then followed them as they were on their bicycle.

So, now it's official, according to the directive from the CDC in Maine and Maine Health and Human Services, they asked her to voluntarily stay in her home for 21 days, so we can say that she is effectively doing what she said she was going to do. She wasn't going to follow it, so the big question is now, what is next.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HICKOX: It is not my intention to put anyone at risk in this community.

CASAREZ (voice-over): Just steps away from the front porch Wednesday night, quarantined nurse Kaci Hickox addressed reporters. Thankful to be home, but opposed to being forced to stay indoors. State officials are demanding Hickox abide by their 21-day quarantine.

HICKOX: We have been in negotiations all day with the state of Maine and tried to resolve this amicably, but they will not allow me to leave my house and have any interaction with the public. Even though I am completely healthy and symptom free.

CASAREZ: Hickox was released Monday from isolation inside this tent in New Jersey after treating patients in West Africa, then allowed to return to her boyfriend's home here in Fort Kent, Maine. State troopers standing guard outside.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The governor is merely pandering to the fear that exists that supposedly she's contagious. She has a right to live her life. CASAREZ: Hickox tested negative for Ebola twice, but that's not

stopping state officials from seeking a court order to mandate quarantine for a full 21 days.

MARY MAYHEW, MAINE COMMISSIONER OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES: We feel strongly about the protocol that we've established and we have grave concerns about the lack of leadership at the federal level.

CASAREZ: The state says Hickox is required to remain isolated at home until November 10th, but she says she's not planning on it.

HICKOX: And I have been told that the attorney general's intention is to file legal action against me. And if this does occur, then I will challenge those legal actions.

CASAREZ: Some residents in Fort Kent say they have nothing to fear.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If it's only transferrable by bodily fluids, I guess we don't really have anything to worry about if you don't come into contact with them.

CASAREZ: But others are not so sure.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She comes here and she does that, you know. I don't want to bring it home.

CASAREZ: On Wednesday, Hickox wouldn't say if she would defy the mandate by leaving the house.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CASAREZ: And so, once again, Kaci Hickox has just left on her bicycle, and Carol, this is a small town logging community. We're in northern Maine. Right on the border with Canada. It's a very divided community at this point because a lot of people say she doesn't have the symptoms, she doesn't have Ebola, we welcome her, we want her to come into the community, but others are saying just respect what the state is asking of you. It's only 21 days, do that and don't put our little community into this national spotlight -- Carol.

COSTELLO: OK. Well, let's review because I'm sure it wasn't an accident that Kaci Hickox chose to ride a bicycle. You know, she left her home, right, physical, showing she's healthy. She was with her boyfriend, right? Did she wave to the crowd? I mean, what was that like when you saw her take off with her boyfriend?

CASAREZ: No. All of a sudden, it wasn't out the front door. They just come from behind the house. And they've got their helmets on, and she and we believe her boyfriend, because it's his home behind us. And they just got on their bicycles, they didn't talk to anyone, but all of the media, the cameras were rolling, everybody watched them as they got on their bikes and drove off.

And then the state police vehicle, which has been here we believe all night because they were here last night when we were here. This morning when we were here. They took off and then also the unmarked police vehicle took off, also, and local media is saying that they are just there the to monitor her and keep track of anyone she may come into contact with.

COSTELLO: All right, Jean Casarez, you stay right there. I know your photographer got video of Kaci Hickox and her boyfriend them riding away. We're trying to turn that around so we can show our viewers. But thank you so much. We'll get back to you. Jean.

As you know, President Obama was trying to show support for medical workers coming back from West Africa. On Wednesday, he actually met with a group of medical workers just to show they were perfectly healthy.

Some of these medical workers were not under any kind of 21-day quarantine. In fact the doctor who recovered from Ebola spoke at this public event.

I want to bring in Sanjay Gupta now because you were at this event, but before we talk about this, I want to talk a little bit more about Kaci Hickox.

So would you have ever envisioned that a nurse getting on her bicycle and riding down the street would garner such attention?

(LAUGHTER)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: No. I definitely would not have ever imagined that. Of course, you know, her story has become something I think has really captured people's imagination. And in some ways, even though she's not the first person that we've heard about, you know, health care worker coming back to the United States, this whole circumstance, the quarantine at the airport and now the possibly mandatory quarantine in Maine, it's an interesting thing.

I mean, we've seen this with other infectious disease in the past such as HIV/AIDS, for example. It's a different sort of pathogen, but it will go down, I think, in medical history what is happening right now.

COSTELLO: And, you know, the state police did not arrest her when she came out of their home because -- and you can sort of understand why because Maine's caught in this weird place. They want to protect the public, but they know it might look bad if they cuff this nurse.

GUPTA: It was interesting. Norm Siegel who's her attorney was on "NEW DAY" this morning. I was hearing him speaking. He basically said look, there is no court order right now. It's incorrect to assume there's a court order, so there's no way they really could arrest her. They could give a court order and then she'd have a certain amount of time to respond to that.

And it looks like that may be where this is all headed. But it is a fascinating thing. And I want to show you a quick picture, if I can, Carol, because I was at that White House event. I don't know if we have this picture. But, you know, you mentioned this, the president was with a bunch of health care workers who were -- had just come back from West Africa within the 21-day period. They're at the White House. They're with the president of the United

States. OK? Kaci Hickox fits that same profile and she's facing possible mandatory quarantine. If a Martian were looking at our country right now, they would say you can't get more diametrically opposed than that. These are two opposite extreme.

Take a look. That's the picture. These doctors fit the same profile. These health care workers with the same profile, some of them are with the president and the White House, and there she is on the right.

COSTELLO: That's why people are so confused in this country and I can't get past the fact that there are doctors treating Ebola patients right now, who go home to their families, they go out to restaurants, they're not under quarantine either and they have direct contact with someone with Ebola.

GUPTA: That's an excellent point, right? So what about the doctors at Emory who have now treated four patients successfully? The doctors in Nebraska who took care of Ashoka Mukpo. The doctors at the NIH, including Dr. Fauci, who's on our air all the time. Should they all be quarantined as well? Because that seems to be what some of the states are saying.

I don't think they should be quarantined. To be clear that's not what I'm saying.

COSTELLO: Yes, I was just going to ask you. What do you think of Kaci Hickox? Is she doing the right thing?

GUPTA: Well, she's obviously -- she's being provocative. I think there's no question. But from a scientific perspective, if the question is, is she a treat to the public's health? No. I mean, you know, the science is pretty clear on this. Is she making them nervous? Yes, probably. And is that her problem? Probably. But a lot of people make other people nervous. You know, how far does this go?

So, again, you bring up the point about these health teams in the United States at big hospitals. Should they all be quarantined as well? How far does this whole thing continue on.

COSTELLO: Well, hopefully we'll all figure it out one day. Right? And one day soon.

(LAUGHTER)

GUPTA: Right. I'll be here.

COSTELLO: Yes, exactly. Maybe.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

GUPTA: Thank you.

COSTELLO: The U.S. ambassador to the United Nations says she's bringing home a message of hope about what's being done to stop Ebola from spreading. Samantha Power is in Brussels this morning. She just wrapped up a visit to three West African nations -- Guinea, Sierra Leone, and Liberia, where thousands have died of Ebola.

Power tweeted, "The surge of help from the United States and others is working." In Liberia, she said Washington is in it for the long haul to defeat the epidemic there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAMANTHA POWER, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO U.N.: We have nearly 1,000 forces now on the ground who are teaming up with our experts from the Centers for Disease Control with our USAID family and all of our international NGO partners.

My main message to the Liberian people, on behalf of President Obama is that we will beat this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Power also says she will obey the law when she returns to the United States, although it is not clear whether she'll be quarantined.

In other news this morning for the first time Apple's CEO Tim Cook is speaking out about his sexuality and acknowledging that he is gay. Cook made the announcement in an essay published in Bloomberg Businessweek writing in part, quote, "While I have never denied my sexuality, I haven't publicly acknowledged it either until now. So let me be clear. I'm proud to be gay and I consider being gay among the greatest gifts God has given me."

So let's talk about this and more. CNN's Christine Romans is here.

And, you know, I can't help but thinking kind of everybody already knew Tim Cook was gay.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: I don't know. I mean, I don't think the average person who uses an iPhone would know that. I think people who were in the media maybe did, people who worked with him, but he wanted to publicly speak up and say, I am gay and this is one of the greatest gifts god has given me.

Why is it's such a great gift? Because it's made him empathetic he said, it's made him relate with people who might be downtrodden or might be discriminated against, it has made him a better person.

One thing that he says here that I think is really, really fascinating, and I want to read this quote to you from this very -- beautifully written peace.

"I don't consider myself an activist," she says, Carol. "But I realized how much I benefitted from the sacrifice of others. So if hearing that the CEO of Apple is gay can help someone struggling to come to terms with who he or she is and bring comfort to anyone who feels alone, or inspire people to insist on their equality, then it's worth the trade off of my own privacy." And he is a very private person, of a very big public company. This

is the second biggest company in the world. He also goes on to say, again, beautifully written, he says, that "We paved the sunlit path towards justice together, brick by brick. This is my brick. He's not saying he's going to change the world. He's just saying this is his little part.

Now he has been known before for being a very supportive of marriage equality and antidiscrimination within companies. I mean, that has been very clear but he never so publicly spoken about his own sexual orientation. That is a very big deal for a big company CEO. You don't hear them talking very much about their private life and he's making a big stand here.

COSTELLO: Yes. And also in that essay, he said, you know, I'm a modest person. I come from humble backgrounds. I don't like to draw attention to myself.

ROMANS: No, he doesn't. And he likes to -- you know, he like to do good work, he likes to think about how people use his products. He likes to products to stand for themselves. He gave I think last year he accepted a lifetime achievement award at Auburn, I think his alma mater, and it was very beautifully well done. He grew up in the south at a time when blacks were discriminated against and he has very deep and personal and well spoken feelings about how you should relate to the least among us and you should try to help everyone have a chance.

And that -- he's spoken about that several times, but this is the first time you've really seen him talk about his own sexual orientation. And I think these are really changing. I think 15 years ago, this would have been a big deal. People can lose their jobs for talking so publicly about their private lives. Things have changed. Things have really changed -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Thank goodness for that, Christine. Thanks so much.

ROMANS: Yes.

COSTELLO: Next hour first, we'll take a more in depth look at workers from the LGBT community who still fear repercussions at work if they choose to go public with their sexuality.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO (voice-over): More top stories for you this Thursday.

ANNOUNCER: The Giants win.

COSTELLO: The Giants win, crowned World Series champions for the third time in five seasons, pulling it out 3-2 against the Royals in game seven.

But all was not joyful during the celebrations in the streets of San Francisco. Two people shot, one person stabbed as people filled the streets setting bonfires and vandalizing businesses.

In Hawaii, the slow creep of molten rock lava continues. Marty Savidge is there.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This morning, about 80 members of the Hawaii National Guard will be deploying to the town of Pahoa. They'll be there to provide present patrols and to man the various roadblocks beefing up authorities helping to provide security.

COSTELLO: NASA investigators are back at it this morning in Virginia, checking damage to the Wallops flight facility and trying to figure out what caused that unmanned rocket to explode. People in the area are also being warned not to swipe up debris because the material may be hazardous.

The galaxy off its axis for Samsung. Profits plunging 60 percent from last year. Samsung says sales of its smartphones are taking a hit as more people are buying the new iPhone 6.

And Derrick Rose is back and even though he played only seven minutes in the second half, he scored 13 points. Not bad for a guy who's missed most of the last two seasons recovering from serious knee surgery. As for Rose, he says he didn't mind hanging on the bench for most of the game. For him, it was real fun being able to talk to teammates again.

I'm back in a minute.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: I want to take you back to Maine for just a second. The bike riders you're seeing are Kaci Hickox, the nurse, and her boyfriend, leaving for a morning ride. State police followed them on their bicycles. As you know, the state of Maine had wanted Kaci Hickox to be under a voluntary quarantine for 21 days and not leave the home.

But as you can see, she is defying their wishes. We do expect the state of Maine to file a court order, forcing her to stay inside the home for 21 days. Of course, when it happens, we'll pass it along to you and return to Maine later on in the NEWSROOM.

In political news this morning, sit down and shut up. Those were the final words from Chris Christie to a heckler at an event marking the event for Superstorm Sandy. And Christie got pretty fired up during the entire encounter. Look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: I got the picture. We know -- we know. We know. Now, listen, you all know me, so if we're going to get into a debate here today, it's going to get interesting and very fun, so, yes. I understand.

So, I'll be more than happy to have a debate with you any time you like, guy, because somebody like you doesn't know a damn thing about what you're talking about, except to stand up and show off. I've been here when the cameras aren't here, buddy, and done the work. I've been here when the cameras weren't here and did the work. So, I'm glad you had your day to show off, but we're the ones here to

do the work. So, turn around, get your 15 minutes of fame and maybe take your jacket off, roll up your sleeves and do something for the people of this state.

So -- so, we'll see. Now, listen, everybody, what we need, what we need -- yes. Good. And there's been 23 months since then when all you've been doing is flapping your mouth and not doing anything. So, listen, you want to have the conversation later, I'm happy to have it, buddy, but until that time, sit down and shut up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: And with that, the heckler left.

So, let's talk about this. Joining me now are CNN political analyst and editor-in-chief of "The Daily Beast", John Avlon, and CNN political commentator and Republican strategist Ana Navarro.

Welcome to both of you.

ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning, Carol.

JOHN AVLON, THE DAILY BEAST: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: Good morning, John.

So, Ana, this heckler was not average Joe citizen. He's a former councilman and he has organized a job called finish the job. This is sort of how he operates.

So, is it fair that Christie fought back?

NAVARRO: Well, that's also how Chris Christie operates. I think this is Chris Christie being quintessential Chris Christie. You either love him or hate him. Take him or leave him, but this is what he is. You see what you get.

If you provoke him, he's going to react. He's going to react strongly. We know he's going to say these type of things and that's just who the man is. At this point he can't be anything else. If he tries to pretend to be Mother Teresa, it's not going to play as genuine.

So, he's got to play to what is his strength. This is who I am, you're seeing me unscripted, this is my genuine reaction, I do get emotional and I'm going to express it.

COSTELLO: So, John, this heckler, his name 6 Kitty, by the way, he said he was angry that New Jersey hasn't distributed $800 million in aid for Superstorm Sandy victims. He told Bloomberg, quote, "If I just stood up, sat down, been polite, you and I wouldn't be talking right now. It's necessary at times to do small and large acts of civil disobedience. So, people's voice can be heard, and if Governor Christie doesn't like that, he's in the wrong business.

Does heckling really work?

AVLON: Well, I don't think heckling usually works. I mean, there's an argument from the professional potential protest crowd that that draws cameras, then the media buys into it big time. The issue here is that in the middle of a Sandy remembrance when a guy stand up and keeps talking directly to Christie, guess what?

He's going to push back and that's when we start talking about this debate. There are real issues about how Sandy money has been distributed, but the reconstruction after Hurricane Katrina took eight years. But I got to say, you know. Christie is going to pushback. Chris Christie's going to be Chris Christie and this guy probably on the wrong end of that debate when it comes to winning it.

COSTELLO: Well, Ana, the crowd certainly seemed to be on Chris Christie's side. They applauded when he told the guy to sit down and shut up.

Obviously, Chris Christie wants to run for president. Does this sort of thing help him?

NAVARRO: You know, Carol, whether it helps or hurts frankly is irrelevant, because I said I think It's such a part of his personality and I think part of what Chris Christie brings to the table as a candidate and why he is appealing to so many people, is that he is genuine.

In area of scripted, poll tested politicians who said angel what's popular and stick with, you know, safe coloring lines. Chris Christie does Chris Christie, and does it to the hill. So, he cannot pretend to be anything else at this point.

It's not Minnesota nice, it's not Midwestern nice, it's not southern charm, okay. It may sell in some places. It may not in others, but he's got no choice. He's got to be Chris Christie.

COSTELLO: John, I want to pivot and talk about -- go ahead. I just want to talk a little bit about Jeb Bush before I had to let you go.

His son told ABC News his dad was more than likely going to run for president in 2016. Jeb Bush told NBC News last night, quote, "My son, he's got an opinion. He didn't talk to me and when you have kids, you'll probably have the same frustration. You love them to death and they have their own opinions, but I'll make up my own mind at the end of the year."

So, what's your bet? Will Jeb Bush run for president?

AVLON: At this point, I'm betting he does. I mean, they're certainly trying to freeze the field and e send out signals this is something they're taking seriously and the son went off script as with all large, powerful families, that can be a real problem.

Jeb Bush is the opposite of Chris Christie in this. He's not going to shoot from the lip. He's going to try to be a structured about this as possible. And George P. went off script and glad a little blowback from dad.

COSTELLO: He sure did so.

Ana, what do Republicans think about another Bush running for president?

NAVARRO: You know, Carol, you know, I have the same question of Democrats. What do they think about another Clinton running for president? I think it's a very similar situation.

And to me, what it boils down to this -- serving in elected office, being elected to any of the office, it's not a family heirloom. It's not something that's passed down from family to family, or generation to generation.

COSTELLO: But there's no reason why being part of a family should impede you from competing and earning the vote and trust of the U.S. voters and the American people.

So, does it entitle him to the position? No. Does it impede him from running and he's got the competition? No. He has got the right to do it and we've got the right to choose whether we want it or not. Run, Jeb, run.

COSTELLO: Ana Navarro, John Avlon, thanks for your insight. I appreciate it this morning.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM: still alive and still plotting attacks. That is a chilling warning from U.S. intelligence officials who say initial air strikes in Syria may have actually missed two key terror operatives.

CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr is here this morning.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Carol, still alive and still plotting, but where are they? That's the question for the intelligence community. We'll have all of it when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)