Return to Transcripts main page

Don Lemon Tonight

Inside Iran; Obama Writes to Ayatollah about ISIS; Interview with Ebola Survivor Amber Vinson; American Voters Send Clear Message; Nearly Six Million Watched Daredevil Nik Wallenda; Did Jon Stewart Vote?

Aired November 06, 2014 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: This is CNN TONIGHT. I'm Don Lemon.

You just saw an incredible episode of "PARTS UNKNOWN" as Anthony Bourdain goes inside Iran. He's here with me right now.

Thanks for joining me. So despite the antagonism between the two countries, were you surprised really at how friendly everyone was there to you?

ANTHONY BOURDAIN, CNN HOST, "PARTS UNKNOWN": Very confused by it. I mean literally under the mural that says, you know, "Down with America," people, everyone, reaching out. Outgoingly friendly. Where are you from? America. Oh. You know? Have you tried this? You know, will you come to my house? I'll feed you. The hospitality. The general mood on the street.

I'm not being facetious about this. Much friendlier and outgoing, just on the basis of being a random American with or without cameras, than Western Europe. In spite of a very tough history and a lot of very contentious relationships, a lot of bad history. And yet, everywhere we went, people were kind to us. Generous. And the government were not obtrusive in their --

LEMON: I was just going to ask you. It appeared that you have -- but first, before we get to how much access you had. Do you think that the Iranian people have been unfairly demonized either by the American government or by American media?

BOURDAIN: Well, I think we -- we understandably tend to look at countries by their policies. We associate people with their governments. Iran is, in that respect, not that different than many other places in the world. Hopefully America. We are not our government necessarily.

LEMON: So --

BOURDAIN: And it's worth noting that, this is a very young country.

LEMON: Right.

BOURDAIN: Seventy percent are, I think, under 30. They didn't vote necessarily. They were not there for the revolution. They were not there for the hostage crisis. They weren't born yet. LEMON: I'm sure you've heard about this, speaking about the

government about the secret letter that the president supposedly sent to the Iran, the supreme leader there. We are going to get into that a little bit later on in the show. But my question is, did you get the sense that there is more that the government could or should be doing with Iran?

BOURDAIN: You know, who's up, who's down, who's talking, who's in charge, there's a pretty impenetrable issue for me. I thought -- we all felt during our time there, wow, this is surprisingly friendly. It's very different than we thought it would be. And it felt look a window was opening. That things were changing in a positive way that might lead to at least more communication, more understanding. An opening of a window.

But with the arrest of Jason and Yeghi, soon after we left, it appears that that window slammed shut. So I don't know. There are various factions and agendas at work in Iran.

LEMON: You're talking about "The Washington Post" reporter.

BOURDAIN: Yes.

LEMON: Have you heard anything since you left about the detention of the reporter?

BOURDAIN: There are indications that perhaps there will be some kind of resolution, meaning that he has been held in captivity in solitary confinement for over 100 days now, without charge, without any accusations being spelled out. There are noises coming out of Iran now that there will be some kind of resolution. Hopefully that's a good sign. Hopefully.

LEMON: And what about the people who invited you into their homes and into their lives? Were you -- how afraid were you, if you were at all, about your safety or their safety?

BOURDAIN: I was not concerned for my own safety at all. I just didn't feel anything but -- we just didn't feel it. There wasn't -- one has to watch one's behavior. That we weren't doing anything wrong. We weren't making any inappropriate contacts. And our agenda was in fact to explore Iranian food and culture, and what it's like for an average Iranian. What does it look like in Tehran.

This is something that we don't seen a lot of in the West. We haven't been exposed to -- what are ordinary Iranians like? What do they do for fun? These are fairly simple questions. So we didn't really feel at risk. We were of course very cognizant of the fact that the people who we talk with and hang out with in Iran, after we left, that their behavior or comments, might be misinterpreted. So we were acutely aware and careful about it.

LEMON: And you watched.

BOURDAIN: Right.

LEMON: OK. So let's talk more about access, right? Because you mentioned it earlier. The religious police.

BOURDAIN: Yes.

LEMON: They're watching you. Were you aware of it? And how much access did you have?

BOURDAIN: We had an extraordinary access to pretty much go wherever we wanted and point our cameras anywhere we wanted. And do -- given the constraints of a society where your behavior, your comportment, your dress is open to question at all times, we moved freely where we wanted to without obtrusive surveillance. Now that's not to say that we were not being watched or listened. But what I do mean is there were not people with us trying to shape the story as has happened in other countries where they can be pretty clunky about it.

So we were pretty free to move around and to meet with whom we -- whoever was willing to talk to us. We did a lot of meeting with people like in sort of last minute. The mood was good. People were happy and grateful for the opportunity to show another side of society of a -- of a country, of a once glorious empire, the Persian empire, that just hasn't been looked at.

And as Jason said at one point in the show, as Americans, as any free society, it's exactly those places that we are hostile towards or have bad feelings towards or even irreconcilable ones. Those are exactly the places we should at least look at.

LEMON: Right. Have some knowledge. The information, knowing about.

BOURDAIN: It can't hurt.

LEMON: It can't hurt.

BOURDAIN: You cannot be contaminated by knowledge.

LEMON: By -- thank you. Thank you, Anthony Bourdain.

So let's talk about, what you do, food, alcohol, there was some -- you had some peach concoction that was nonalcoholic because there's not supposed to be any alcohol in the country.

BOURDAIN: Yes.

LEMON: Is there alcohol there, just not on camera?

BOURDAIN: I have heard elsewhere that -- that there is. I am sure this is something the Iranian authorities are very aware of. We didn't see it. We would have honestly, we -- we would not have accepted it or responded to an offer. That would have been, I think, irresponsible.

You see us drinking what looks like beer, but it's nonalcoholic beer, it's very popular there. They're nonalcoholic beer. It's not. There is a -- look, god, that food is delicious.

LEMON: I know. I was just saying, you're talking about alcohol, I'm like, that food looks amazing.

BOURDAIN: The food I should point out is glorious. And that's a deep, deep culinary culture.

LEMON: What were you going -- you were going to say something about alcohol and you didn't.

BOURDAIN: Well, no, that -- I mean, it's not really a party country. There isn't -- you know, but there is a sense of yearning, the question of how much fun even is permissible. You know are you allowed to rock visibly? To what extent that -- how cool can you look?

On a day-to-day basis, these cultural issues are really being tested.

LEMON: Pushing up against -- how far can you push up against the boundaries. And as you said you can do it. You are aware of it. You're aware that the police are watching you. You're not some times --

LEMON: Yes. The religious beliefs -- the besiege are, as far as I understand it, not particularly an official body. But they are -- they can arrest you and they did arrest our crew briefly.

LEMON: Thank you, Anthony Bourdain.

BOURDAIN: My pleasure.

LEMON: Now to bring in CNN's Jim Sciutto with the latest on America's relationship with Iran and that letter from President Obama to Iran's supreme leader.

Hi, Jim, you know, we referenced that a moment ago here in the newscast with Anthony Bourdain. What exactly do we know about the secret letter President Obama sent to Iran's supreme leader?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: We know that there was a combined message in there. It said that the U.S. and Iran have shared interests in combating ISIS, in effect inviting Iran to cooperate with the U.S. in this battle. In effect, the U.S. and Iran are fighting ISIS at the same time. The president inviting them to find a way to perhaps bring, the fight together or do something together.

But at the same time, the president qualified that by saying that all -- this kind of cooperation including against ISIS is contingent upon an agreement in the nuclear space. And you have these nuclear negotiations going on with Iran, very difficult. And a big deadline coming up. November 24th. To either extend or reach a final agreement with Iran over their nuclear program so the president connecting those two very difficult issues there or leaving the door open to further cooperation.

LEMON: Jim, as I understand it, you have some new reporting. The U.S. has also opened communication channels with Iran via the Iraqis? What have you learned? SCIUTTO: They have. And this is very interesting. It is cooperation

via the Iraqis regarding U.S. military action against ISIS. They're not coordinating military action with Iran, but they are allowing information to be exchanged with Iran via the Iraqis and the intention here is to do what the military calls deconflict because right now the U.S. and Iran both fighting ISIS in Iraq.

That means a lot of U.S. and Iranian aircraft, for instance, the air, drones, et cetera. And by sharing information, the intention is to prevent you from conflicting in the air whether it's running into each other or possibly mistaking the other one for a foe. So it's a form of military cooperation with actually coordinating airstrikes.

But in light of this, you know, interesting relationship going on between the U.S. and Iran, the president sending a letter to the supreme leader, the military is allowing information to go back and forth via the Iraqis, it shows that these two countries are adversaries, but they have areas where they can agree, where they can potentially -- where they have shared interests.

LEMON: Listen. Iran is not a fan of ISIS. But they aren't fans of the West either, Jim. So what are potential drawbacks to reaching out look this?

SCIUTTO: Well, the trouble is, despite the fact that you have shared interests, for instance, in a nuclear agreement possibly or in fighting ISIS, you have a tremendous number of conflicting interests. One of them right there in the same zone. Bashar al=Assad, the regime of Bashar al-Assad. Iran is its chief backer. The U.S., although it's not fighting Assad right now, has sworn itself in effect to removing him. That's one thing.

So in Iraq they may be cooperating against ISIS and Syria. They're frankly on different sides there. That's one issue. Plus, the U.S. and Iran continue to have tremendous disagreements. Iran is holding a number of Americans illegally at the view of the U.S. plus Iran is a -- a horrible record on human rights at home. So as you have this kind of communication and potential cooperation, there's a lot of baggage that comes with that. It puts the U.S. at risk of being seen as cooperating with the regime that we know is up to some very bad stuff at home.

LEMON: Before I let you go, beyond the White House, what's the reaction from congressional leaders?

SCIUTTO: Deep skepticism from the beginning, particularly of these Iranian nuclear talks and that's not just from the Republican side, but also from the Democratic side. But you heard today the House speaker, John Boehner, asked directly about nuclear negotiations with Iran. He said in no uncertain terms, quote, "I don't trust the Iranians." And that's a view you will hear from many congressional leaders.

And the trouble with that is the president -- may need Congress on board for a nuclear agreement because it's Congress that has imposed many of these economic sanctions on Iran. So if they're going to come to a nuclear deal, the president is going to have to find either a way to get them on board or a way around that.

LEMON: Jim Sciutto in Washington tonight. Jim, thank you very much.

SCIUTTO: Thank you.

LEMON: When we come right back, a primetime exclusive, Amber Vinson, the nurse who battled Ebola and won. What it was look for her to face criticism for taking a commercial flight after she treated Ebola patient Thomas Eric Duncan.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Amber Vinson is a Dallas nurse who contracted Ebola after helping treat Thomas Eric Duncan who died of the disease. She got a lot of criticism for taking a commercial flight before she was diagnosed.

In our primetime exclusive she tells her story in her own words.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: You survived Ebola. What does that feel like?

AMBER VINSON, EBOLA SURVIVOR: Like a blessing. Really. I feel amazing. I feel -- well, physically, I do feel tired as the day goes along. But I'm just so happy I am here.

LEMON: So let's go back and talk about it because you were one of the very first nurses to treat Thomas Eric Duncan, right?

VINSON: Yes.

LEMON: How did you come in contact with him? Did you -- did you volunteer for that or did you just happen to be on call?

VINSON: He was on my unit. And I went in for assignments like usual. And I was assigned to him. That was my patient assignment so I was -- I was it. It was my turn. So I was going in.

LEMON: And you took it on. And you said, hey, I'm going to -- I'm going to do this.

VINSON: Mm-hmm. There was a patient there that needed care. And I was capable. And I had the nursing skill to do it. And there was no way I would refuse.

LEMON: Do you know when you contracted or how you contracted Ebola?

VINSON: I have no idea. I go through it almost daily in my mind. Like, what -- what happened? What went wrong? Because I was covered completely every time. I followed the CDC protocol for donning and doffing every time. I've never strayed. It is a mystery to me.

As an ICU nurse it's all structure and rules and guidelines and protocol. And if you misstep, it is a matter of life and death. And I respect that. And I am always following everything to the T. As stringent as I can be. Because I know what the Ebola exposure is a matter of life or death. For me, my family. You know? I followed the rules the best I could to the T every time.

LEMON: Did you ever think that your own health was at risk when you were doing that? Did you know that much about Ebola? Did you know that you were at risk at that point?

VINSON: I understood that there was a level of risk just because -- when you are dealing with that much body fluid and there is, there is a risk. And I understood that. But I felt protected. And the -- the equipment that we had at the time.

LEMON: A lot has been written about the hospital and what went on. And some of the nurses. One of the nurses was on with our very own Anderson Cooper. And here's what she said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN AGUIRE, TEXAS HEALTH PRESBYTERIAN HOSPITAL NURSE: No one ever spoke to me about Ebola. There were no classes offered. There were no training offered.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Was your neck exposed?

AGUIRE: Absolutely. Yes. There's a --

COOPER: What part of your neck?

AGUIRE: Well, the zipper ended about here on me. And the hood ended about here on me. And, you know, this part right here made a triangle that was open.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Do you think that you had the gear that you needed? Were you protected enough? Were you exposed at all?

VINSON: I felt like I had no skin exposure at all. I'm a hippy gal, so I always wore a suit that was a little too big. So the extra length it covered my neck. I was completely covered every time. My sleeves were a little bit longer than they probably would have been if I wore my correct size. But it just added extra protection in my opinion.

LEMON: But some of the nurses may not have done that? Do you -- did you -- were they ever exposed or was there a gap as this nurse talked about?

VINSON: Yes, I did see some that they would put tape over that area or -- at one point they were putting like a surgical max and taping the mask down. But personally I've never had that problem.

LEMON: So all of a sudden you're following protocol. And then your -- you're friends with Nina Pham. And then Nina Pham gets sick. What are you thinking? VINSON: My heart dropped. I was afraid for myself. My first thought

was Nina is a great nurse. I know her nursing. She follows rules and protocol as closely as I do. If this happened to her it can happen to me.

LEMON: Do you think you could be next?

VINSON: That's what I thought. It rocked my world.

LEMON: Did you have a mini freak-out?

VINSON: I did.

LEMON: What did you do?

VINSON: A breakdown. I cried. It -- I mean, this is my colleague. And I know what I saw firsthand. And I know what I thought that the disease process was. And I didn't want that for her.

LEMON: And then two days later?

VINSON: Yes. Like I had no idea. Like I didn't feel -- before going to Ohio, throughout my whole trip, and even getting back here to Dallas, I felt fine. Like no fever, no aches, no pains. Nothing.

LEMON: But here is the thing, is when I say two days later, you found out that what is that moment like, what happens?

VINSON: When I went into the ER, they took me to a special isolation unit and then they drew blood. And then they told me we're going to send it off and we'll get results early in the morning tomorrow. So it was a waiting time. And from the time I entered the ER until I went up to the ICU I kind of developed some more symptoms. And I kind of had a feeling once the other symptoms came along that this could be it.

LEMON: And it could be it in a number of ways.

VINSON: Yes. Yes. My first thoughts going into the ER, if we were in West Africa, and Nina and I both have the disease, it is a 50/50 chance of survival. And I'm like one of us wasn't going to make it. So -- but that wasn't the case. And I just -- I thank God every day.

LEMON: What does it feel like?

VINSON: It takes so much out of you. It really does. It is very draining. And even now, I -- walking a short distance. I get short of breath. And when I was going through my very rough couple of days, it was -- you've got to force yourself to get up. And forcing yourself takes a lot out of you, too. It's a struggle. You're fighting for your life.

LEMON: Did you ever think that you could lose your life, that you might not make it?

VINSON: I have such great faith. And I was reading my bible, reading scriptures. And I didn't feel like it was my time yet. I felt like God would carry me through.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: Coming up, emotional moments with Amber Vinson, her mom and her fiance. What it was like for her family to be separated from her while she was fighting for her life in quarantine.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Why did Amber Vinson get on that plane from Cleveland to Dallas knowing she had been exposed to Ebola? She explains along with her mother, Debra Berry, and her fiance Derrick Markray.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VINSON: My flight from Cleveland to Dallas got delayed a few times. And before I boarded each time or thought I was going to board I would go and check my temperature and call my contact at the health department and report it. She would tell me if I was OK to go not. And I got the OK every single time.

LEMON: So you never as reported called the CDC to check?

VINSON: Yes. I never had a CDC phone number to call. I would always contact the health department and then they would contact the CDC.

LEMON: So when did you start feeling sick?

VINSON: When I woke up on Tuesday. Before going in the ER. I checked my temperature. It was 100.3. I called my contact at the health department. And she said, I think you should go in.

LEMON: But when your temperature went up did you go, OK, here we go?

VINSON: I did not think I had the exposure and so I was hoping it was something else.

LEMON: The CDC director, Thomas Frieden, did you get a chance to see any of the press conferences, what he discussed to you>

VINSON: I heard some things, yes.

LEMON: Yes. All right. So here's what he said. "The second health care worker reported no symptoms and no fever. However because at this point she was in a group of individuals known to have exposure to Ebola, she should not have traveled on a commercial airline."

What would you make of his statement? Did you feel look like he was blaming you?

VINSON: Yes. Because I followed everything they told us to do. I am a nurse. I care. I care for me. I would not put myself in danger first. I would not take Ebola to my family and my best girlfriends. I would not endanger families across the nation, potentially, exposing them to anything. It's never my goal or intention to bring harm to anyone. LEMON: That really affected you?

VINSON: Yes.

LEMON: Why?

VINSON: Because it's not me. Like all I do is care. All I want to do is help. I would never try to hurt anyone.

LEMON: Do people treat you differently now?

VINSON: Well since I have been back. Everyone who has noticed me around town has just been great. They come to me. They want to, they want hugs. And they tell me that they prayed for me, and they're happy to see that I'm doing good. That my bridesmaids that I met with one in Ohio. I have heard stories that, you know, just because they know me or they saw me that day. A day, you know, people plan to stand away.

LEMON: Well, because when Nina Pham got a people were like, they were worried. And then you are on the airplane, they contacted all the people on the airplane, they cleaned the plane, the kids in the school. I mean, you, you know the whole thing, right? The bridal shop closed, and on, on, on. I have to be honest, even when we were looking for places to do this interview, many places said --

VINSON: No. It is so much fear. The public really needs to be educated about transmission and -- you know, I now, am Ebola free. I don't have it and I have antibody against it. There is ignorance about it.

LEMON: When you first heard about her getting Ebola, would she -- what went through your head?

DERRICK MARKAY, AMBER VINSON'S FIANCEE: Number one, it was just like seeing how hard she worked on Mr. Duncan, and he passed. Then I started thinking of the fact that God forbid if Ebola did take her away, it wouldn't be no funeral procession, it wouldn't be no urn, because even in death, the body is still contagious. They would have to cremate her immediately and get rid of her as hazardous waste, and that I would never see her again. It was just been a picture and memorial service. And -- the reality of it all just really, set in, gravity of it.

LEMON: You were in, stuck in a hotel room. And you couldn't be with your baby? And the moment that hit home is when I was, I was actually on the phone with you. And the video came up of amber in the suit walking out off of the plane into an ambulance. I'm sure you saw the pictures. You couldn't be there.

DEBRA BERRY, AMBER VINSON'S MOTHER: I knew she was alone. And having her alone was the worst thing, because we would have been there. And I wouldn't have cared if she -- if she had triple Ebola. I'm her mother. Give it to me. Wrap me up in hefty bags. I just wanted to be there, because I knew in my gut that she was alone. I stayed with -- with my son. And we, we, got each other through it, and I know that's why I was able to come here.

LEMON: Your -- your house was sterilized. They burned a lot of your things. They incinerated your engagement ring.

VINSON: Yes. I was crushed. It's -- it's thing but it has sentimental value to me. Derrick proposed in Belize on the beach, under the candlelight, and it was just so romantic and everything. It's, that's gone.

LEMON: Because you're here.

VINSON: I'm here.

LEMON: What was it like the first time that you guys saw each other after that, the first time you hugged, you got to touch them and lay eyes on them.

VINSON: Yeah, so I could see them from the plane. So I was waving like frantically, and I saw mom and Derrick standing off in the distance and then I couldn't see mom, I'm like, where did she go? But -- when they let the stairs down, she was right at the bottom of the steps. All tearful and red faced. But, -- and we hugged.

LEMON: What was it like to see her? Here she is.

MARKAY: It was beautiful. I mean, it was definitely a prayer answered to really see her walk down those steps. Man, it was so majestic. Because I mean, for a short brief time there was a time when I thought I may never see her again. But to see her walk down the stairs and hair looking good, smile all over point and I hugged her, and you know, I take pride in not just silent crying, but I hugged her not to sob into her chest when they got a picture of me too.

VINSON: He's been great, through this whole thing. When I got to see him for the first time is -- I can't even put it into words, you're my everything.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LEMON: My thanks to Amber Vinson, her mother and her fiancee. They are a brave family.

Up next here on CNN, the voters have spoken. But will Washington listen? My CNN colleagues, Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota join me to talk about the midterms. And Jon Stewart says, "He didn't vote." Then he backtracks and says he did. Does it matter?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: American voters sent a clear message on Tuesday. They're not happy with President Obama's leadership, but Democrats across the board, took a drubbing. I am joined now by my CNN colleague, Alisyn Camerota. Hi, Alisyn.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR, "NEW DAY": Hi.

LEMON: Oh, Chris Cuomo is here as well.

CAMEROTA: He's here also. He is. CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR, "NEW DAY": No respect.

LEMON: You get no respect at all. So, the election is over. People spoke, right? Republicans won control of the Senate. So now is, so now what? What does a president do? What happens?

CAMEROTA: Oh, well, as you know, all of the Beltway is filled with conversation about bipartisanship...

LEMON: And were in love.

CAMEROTA: Collaboration. And they're gonna cross the aisle, and then of course, what is the first thing that happens the next day? The president comes out and says he will use an executive order in GOP (ph) to pass immigration reform. And then Mitch McConnell and John Boehner write an op-ed...

LEMON: Obamacare.

CAMEROTA: And say they want to overturn and get rid of Obamacare. So it doesn't -- you know like a new day in Washington.

CUOMO: Well, I love the expression, new day. But, you know...

LEMON: That is an expression.

CUOMO: I think that there's a...

LEMON: TV show.

CUOMO: There's a general feeling of dissatisfaction. People didn't come out and vote. What they did come out and vote on was decidedly negative. This was not a positive uplifting election. There's nothing to do with the outcome. Even Republicans, they are not satisfied. They're not happy. They are in control. Those are the swings, this was going to happen. I am not surprised it did. The question is what does it mean? What is the mandate? What do they do with it? I am not surprised by what we saw today either. There is no indication, that President Obama on immigration is willing to take the chance of compromise, because we haven't seen it yet.

LEMON: Right.

CUOMO: What I'm concerned about is, where is taking one step, just take one step toward doing the work of the people, because that's what they say they want. Why don't they at least come together and debate...

CAMEROTA: We have to start it.

CUOMO: Debate the war, because that's something that we need leadership on.

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: How many times have we had this conversation over the last six years?

CUOMO: Not enough, because it doesn't have.

LEMON: Alright, I want you to listen to this, because this stood out to me, from the president, something that he said yesterday, after this was on Wednesday after the election. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATAS: Everyone who voted I wanted you to know that I hear you. To the 2/3 of voters who chose not to participate in the process yesterday, I hear you too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That was a disc (ph) to me.

CAMEROTA: What does it say to you?

LEMON: I hear you too, that you were, to me it is saying that you didn't care enough to get off your butt and go to the polls and vote. So I hear you, as well.

CAMEROTA: Oh, I hear it differently.

LEMON: That could because it's the minority decided, the direction of the country rather than the majority. I think that's what he is saying.

CAMEROAT: I hear him saying that your silence is...

LEMON: Defying.

CAMEROTA: It's speaks volumes.

LEMON: Yeah.

CAMEROTA: In other words, you don't even want to engage with the process, I hear you are disgusted. That's how I heard, that what I interpreted.

CUOMO: Point, this time around.

LEMON: No, I think, I think that was a disc (ph). Oh, I hear you too. Then he goes on.

CUOMO: It was a disc (ph), it was a disc (ph) to him.

CAMEROTA: Yeah.

CUOMO: By those voters who didn't come out. That's his base. That was alienated

LEMON: This president can't even convince his own party at this point to support him. So then why should people go out to the polls to send people to, who are suppose to enact his policies to Washington. CUOMO: Why isn't the party abandoned its president and paid the

price...

LEMON: Exactly.

CUOMO: By running away from what it is and what its core values are. And I think the Democrats aren't getting enough stink on them. They're getting stink on them for the result, but how they guide them.

LEMON: I heard that, but I don't he did -- even Joe Biden said in the interview with Gloria Borger, I don't thing he did the administration does a good job of selling the accomplishments. Because even though he has been -- you know...

(CROSSTALK)

LEMON: He's accomplishing to what? And he said it in this press conference. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The fact is more Americans are working. Unemployment has come down. More Americans had health insurance. Manufacturing has grown. Our deficits have shrunk. Our dependence on foreign oil is down, as are gas prices.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: All true.

CAMEROTA: Yes, and he does talk about it. The funny thing is, if he does talk about it, he does travel around the country and talks about it but somehow the message doesn't resonate. I don't know if it is his tone or if he doesn't do it enough. But somehow...

LEMON: Or is it us?

CAMEROTA: I don't know, because that's what voters say. If that -- the messaging isn't getting to them, they don't believe they don't -- in other words Americans don't know that the economy is getting better. There's also some (inaudible) to show that they don't feel that way, they don't know that.

LEMON: He says it is because income is stagnant. People aren't getting raises. And they're not feeling it at home in the pocketbooks. And that's what it makes a difference.

CUOMO: You have two parties pushed as far apart as I have seen in my lifetime. So one of the reasons that it is unsatisfying / confusing / absent to the voter. Is that they're getting such different messages, they hear this from President Obama. But then they will hear from Republicans, "This is the worst ever, it's horrible, everything's horrible, nobody likes this, there is no leadership. The country's gonna hell on a hand basket, and you don't know where to go, because you don't know who to believe. And then what do you see, you see apathy. And you see 33 percent of the country coming out in Afghanistan, they risk their lives to vote.

CAMEROTA: Keep your point.

CUOMO: And they come out twice as much...

LEMON: And in Australia, if you don't vote you get fined. Do you know that? Aren't should we do something like that?

CAMEROTA: No. But we should always remind people that it is what we fought for, it is democracy. It is the heart of democracy. And even if you don't like what is going on, you still have a voice.

CUOMO: I listen to a fallen veteran last night. Who is just an amazing recovery story in his own right, and he said, "Hey you want to know what to do for veterans? Go on volunteer. Take your citizenship seriously. Show that you want to do something to make this country better I gave almost all of myself to do."

LEMON: I wrote an editorial this morning, and it started with a tweet the someone sent me the night after the election I said, here's the first thing CNN should do when they go to Ferguson, to protesters. It should say, "Did you go out to vote?" And the person says, "No." Then you go on, move on to the next person and say, "If you knew cannot just complain. You have to go to the polls and vote. You have to show some sort of political acumen and that's the only way that you're gonna change anything. Not just through being angry, and I said, at first time I shrugged it off, and I said, you know what? This person really makes a good point.

CUOMO: They are angry though. See, here's the -- look, it's hard to reason with anger. Anger is an emotion, when you are providing as intellectual construct how you get the pass the emotion to change. You have to deal with the anger first, then has to do with leadership. One of the things that bothered me in Ferguson from the beginning was where are the leaders who should be there? Something amazingly great had happened in Ferguson, the governor would be all over at U.S. senators -- would have been there, everybody would wanted a piece of the pie.

LEMON: Right.

CUOMO: Agreed.

LEMON: You mentioned Obamacare, right? And you know, and immigration. Why do people vote against their own interests? Because if you look at West Virginia, Kentucky, Arkansas, they put a lot of Republicans, mostly Republicans in office this election, but they are the states that are benefiting the most from the Affordable Care Act. Why is that?

CAMEROTA: Well, I have a theory. And it is the -- really at our heart we do want a balance of power. And really, though we claim about that we hate obstructionists and we hate the impediments to progress. Really, we don't like what things go too quickly. So when something big and comprehensive happens like Obamacare, we're actually not that comfortable with it. And that's why, you know, you can say, we want things done in Washington, but we really want our things done.

LEMON: But you don't, I mean...

CAMEROTA: We don't want your things done, or somebody else's has been done.

LEMON: You don't think it just because, it was proposed by a Democrat. You don't think that has anything to do with it?

CUOMO: Certainly has a lot to do with it, because it is about how it is explained to them. One, we know there's something is true in politics in general. People don't see themselves as -- you know, as they actually are, OK? They -- we all have misperception about ourselves, so you see it two ways one, you're benefiting from Obamacare OK? You don't realize that, you don't want to realize it instead, you want to say this government spends too much, because that makes you feel better about it. The second way you see this, people always say don't tax the rich, because I'm gonna be there someday.

LEMON: Yeah.

CUOMO: Even if the tax plan will help you now. You don't like that it is gonna hurt you where you want to be.

LEMON: Will probably never be there. Stand by. Alisyn and Chris, I want you to stay with me. Is reality going too far? A man is gonna be eaten alive by a giant anaconda, that's right, giant anaconda.

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: And we can all watch it. Would you believe that? Is it entertaining or just as degradation, degrading. We're gonna discuss that, coming up.

CUOMO: It does not gonna be tamer in Amazon.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Is reality going too far? Back with me now, my CNN colleagues, Chris Cuomo, Chris Cuomo not Chris Cuomo, and Alisyn Camerota.

Alright, so last Sunday, nearly 6 million viewers watched daredevil NiK Wallenda, tightrope walk over the streets of Chicago without a net or a tether. Discovery Channel is promoting a show called, eaten alive. And this were a man will cover himself in pig's blood, wearing a custom built suit, and allow himself to be swallow live by an anaconda. Let's take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Catch it, catch it. Oh, my God.

UNIDENTIIFED MALE: We're gonna get me inside of the snake.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're gonna make me as appealing as possible, so the snake says, well I got this big thing here. I might as well get a free meal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: You have got to go head first.

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: You have to go head first. Why? Why?

CAMEROTA: Why? I don't know. I mean it is so disgusting. It appeals to our most voyeuristic base.

LEMON: Are you gonna watch? Are you gonna watch?

CUOMO: You are flipping through the channels.

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: You're flipping through the channels, and you see a guy hanging out a snake's mouth. You're not gonna stop and figure out how he got there.

CAMEROTA: No, and I do -- and I also want to know how he gets out. But who cares.

CUOMO: You know he does get out right? If they actually let someone -- you know, who just decided this is the way they want to go and got eaten by a snake, I think they have a much tougher time getting it on TV.

CAMEROTA: I hope so. I hope so, Chris. And I'm starting to feel like, life is turning into a real life hunger games, between Nik Wallenda who could have plummeted through his death, between being eaten by an anaconda, why are we watching this?

LEMON: I don't think it is anything new. We all watch it. Didn't you watch Evel Knievel as a kid?

CUOMO: Sure.

LEMON: And he would jump over all the cars?

CUOMO: Did you have the motorcycle?

LEMON: The off course is the news. What if he's pull the thing out.

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: He probably jumps over. He could crash.

CAMEROTA: Yes, I agree with you as much.

LEMON: Didn't he break every bone in his body or something like that.

CUOMO: Oh yeah.

CAMEROTA: It's not new, but there are up in the ante.

LEMON: Jon Stewart now.

CUOMO: People gonna watch it, I'll tell you right now.

LEMON: Jon Stewart, Christiane Amanpour. Remember the whole thing? He didn't vote, it's been around he had to apologize. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIRSTIANE, CNN HOST, "AMANPOUR": Did you vote?

JON STEWART, HOST, "THE DAILY SHOW": No.

AMANPOUR: No?

STEWART: No, I just moved. I don't even know where my thing is now.

STEWART: First of all, I have known where my thing is since I was 13.

(LAUGHTER)

STEWART: But to set the record straight, I did vote today. I did know where my, vote is, I was being flip. And it kind of took off, and I knew -- I want to apologize.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: 13. That was a long time to figure that out.

CUOMO: I know.

(LAUGHTER)

CUOMO: I feel bad for him. It was like, wow.

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Took away a different message from what he was saying than I did. It's absolutely.

LEMON: Do you think he actually was joking?

CAMEROTA: Well, I don't think he was joking. I mean, look, all we never know, I take him at his word, but it didn't seem like a joke. There was no punch line. He didn't seem like he's lying.

LEMON: Well he said he moves states or something and so it didn't.

CAMEROTA: He did just he moved out of New y, and he didn't know where his polling place is. There are a lot of people don't vote because they don't know where the polling place is. It's easy to find out.

CUOMO: Polling takes a while.

LEMON: When you move. You've got a lot of things to do. CAMEROTA: You can find it online.

LEMON: Yeah, yeah.

CAMEROTA: But it seemed like, he was caught. It seemed like he was caught, saying something, and then the reason that it erupted on social media is because, he spend so much time pointing out the hypocrisy and the absurdity of government and the media and then he was caught in that (inaudible)

LEMON: And the power of going to polls and voting, he talks about that.

CAMEROTA: Of course, he does talk about that.

LEMON: You, buddy, you and him have much love for each other. What did you think?

CUOMO: Look, I don't think it matters if he voted. I don't people should check that if he voted.

CAMEROTA: Why, how can you have matter?

CUOMO: No, it matters if you vote, of course it does.

CAMEROTA: No, but how can it not matter if Jon Stewart, who makes this a policy of his.

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: I don't know that, I don't that it is that is that much of a policy of his. I think that there's just all this online stuff now about, oh, we have to find out if he really voted or not. Leave it alone.

LEMON: We have other things to talk about. There is, there is an irony in it though. It would be nice if he gave the same benefit of the doubt he gave to himself, to the people that he decides to pillory on his show.

CAMEROTA: Well, that exactly the point.

LEMON: OK.

CAMEROTA: If he found out that a politician or Bill O'Reilly say didn't vote. He would make hay of it.

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: Can't you see him doing this on his show. Didn't vote? Did he vote? Did he not vote? Don't know where my thing is, and everybody going crazy. I see him doing it.

LEMON: Listen, it's called comedy central.

CAMEROTA: Oh you say he get the title... LEMON: I don't really care that much. Jon Stewart makes fun of me, or he likes me, whatever, it doesn't really matter to me, at the end of the day, its comedy and that's how, that's all I see all of it.

CAMEROTA: So he gets a pass.

CUOMO: You should get a pass. People should not chase him on his voting record. Let him do what he does best.

LEMON: Thanks guys. Thank you, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: You're welcome. Great to see you.

LEMON: And you too.

CUOMO: Yeah, whatever. Say my name again.

LEMON: Chris Cuomo.

LEMON: Don Lemon. We'll be right back.

(LAUGHTER)

CUOMO: Always a pleasure.

(COMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: It wasn't just Republican who's scored big on Tuesday night. Marijuana enthusiasts knocks (ph) some big victories when in legalization votes in Alaska, Oregon and Washington, D.C. Is America going to pot? Monday night, we'll take a look at what happens as the smoke clears after Election Day.

I'm Don Lemon. That's it for us tonight. Thanks for watching. "AC 360" starts right now.