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At This Hour

Another Navy Seal Claims to Kill Osama Bin Laden; Patient Attack at Minnesota-Area Hospital; Interview with Willie Nelson about Pot

Aired November 07, 2014 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: This morning, a debate is raging about a hero. Not over what he did, that is undeniably heroic, but the fact that he is talking about it. A former Navy SEAL is creating shock waves by declaring he fired the fatal shots that killed Osama bin Laden.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Robert O'Neill told the "Washington Post" he didn't think he'd survive the 2011 raid on the terror chief's compound. He says his telling the story has brought peace to some 9/11 families. Yet, O'Neill is being criticized by some who say he broke this unspoken code by drawing attention to his service.

Our Brian Todd is following the story for us from Washington.

First of all, I think -- let's look at the facts. What are you hearing from your sources about his claims?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Michaela, John, there are sources disputing Robert O'Neill's claim he fired the kill shot at Osama bin Laden. Sources in SEAL Team Six, that's the team that conducted the bin Laden raid, have told our national security analyst, Peter Bergen, that it was not Robert O'Neill who fired the kill shot. Those sources are telling us that it was a man they call the point man who has not revealed his identity and who Peter Bergen says will never reveal his identity. They say that man fired the shot at bin Laden from the top of the stairs leading to the third floor where bin Laden's bedroom was, that he fired the shot from the stairs as bin Laden was peering out his bedroom door, clipped bin Laden there with a fatal wound, presumably to his head, and once bin Laden fell over, mortally wounded, then two other SEALs came into the room and finished bin Laden off. According to those sources, Robert O'Neill was one of those two SEALs who finished bin Laden off when he was mortally wounded and Matt Bissonnette, the author of the book "No Easy Day" was the other. But neither of them, according to sources from SEAL Team Six who spoke to Peter Bergen, neither of the men were the man who fired the fatal shot that killed Osama bin Laden, they say that was an unnamed SEAL they call the point man.

BERMAN: As you say, Brian, the point man, who will never reveal his name or come forward --

TODD: That's right. BERMAN: -- which is the issue here is, should these Navy SEALs who are bound by an unspoken code here not to talk about their duties, should they be talking. Earlier today, the Pentagon spokesman, Admiral John Kirby, spoke about this code of silence. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REAL ADMIRAL JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: There's a code in that community that you don't talk about what you do and you don't try to get financial gain off of your operations. So it's disappointing that some have sought to do that. I won't speak to the specifics in this. Some of these things are, as you know, still being investigated. But it's -- it does violate a code of ethics that this community holds dear and 99 percent of them live by that code.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: There is a flip side, Brian, too, isn't there? Generals, admirals, plenty of people retire from the military and government service and go on and write books. Nevertheless, how is this going public being received inside the SEAL community?

TODD: Not very well, John. There's a real brotherhood inside the SEAL community and a lot of SEALs who we talked to, former SEALs, have said that these two men have broken the code there and are not necessarily welcome back into that brotherhood.

And it's not so much even an unspoken or unwritten code, it's been written about and spoken about just this week or last week. Admiral Lowsy (ph), the SEAL team commander, wrote a letter to current and former SEALs saying, listen, do not break the SEAL ethos, is what he said. And the quote is, "The SEAL ethos is I do not advertise the nature of my work nor seek recognition for my actions." And the admiral warned of, quote, "judicial consequence" if you do break that code. You could be criminally prosecuted for it. Matt Bissonnette, the author of the book "No Easy Day," is under criminal investigation for possibly divulging classified information in paid speeches and other avenues. So -- his lawyer says he did not do that, that he's not guilty of that. But he is under criminal investigation for that. So not only is there an ethos, but you could be prosecuted for doing this kind of thing.

PEREIRA: And that's a very real thing to be worried about.

BRIAN: Right.

PEREIRA: It's interesting, as we talk about the loyalty that is such a part of this world, a part of the Navy SEALs, and to many this seems absolutely disloyal.

Brian Todd, thanks so much for that. We appreciate it. We'll watch it obviously with you.

BERMAN: Ahead for us at this hour, just an awful attack in a Minnesota hospital caught on video. A patient on a rampage. We'll talk about violence inside health care facilities.

PEREIRA: Later on, Willie Nelson talking about weed. He's talking about politics and the White House. He talks about it with our Brooke Baldwin.

BERMAN: That's quite a tease right there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SINGING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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PEREIRA: New this morning, deeply troubling video of a various attack at a Minnesota-area hospital. A patient there went on a rampage in the middle of the night. It shines an important light on the risk our health care workers take everyday. This attack was caught on camera. The man, armed with a metal bar, he broke off of his hospital bed and he charged at nurses.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA (voice-over): In just seconds, the very people who help heal, suddenly need help of their own inside this Minnesota hospital. The disturbing incident caught on camera after a patient apparently removed a bar from the side of his hospital bed. 68-year-old Charles Logan storms the St. John's Hospital nurse's station around 2:00 a.m. Sunday, swinging wildly. Nurses running toward the exit. One woman here even tries to secure the doors but Logan barrels through. The bar held high above his head, hurling it down right on one nurse's back. And then another. Repeatedly striking two nurses that are left helpless.

Once the patient made his way outside, even the police had a hard time subduing him.

PAUL SCHNEILL, CHIEF, MAPLEWOOD, MINNESOTA POLICE DEPARTMENT: The taser was ineffective. In other words, it did not connect to the man.

PEREIRA: Officers finally tackling Logan to the ground, but not before he injures four nurses, one reportedly suffering a collapsed lung.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That kind of thing can happen. It happens all the time.

PEREIRA: This brutal rampage highlights the dangers health care workers face everyday.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've heard stories of primarily nurses who have been hit or spit on or punched.

PEREIRA: A survey from the International Health Care Security and Safety Foundation says 60 percent of workplace assaults occur in health care facilities. For these nurses, running this sanctuary for the sick has come at a cost.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA: So Charles Logan died just moments after he was taken into police custody just two or three blocks away from the hospital.

An autopsy, John, now is happening to determine why he died. There's still so many questions about why he went -- even went on this attack to begin with.

BERMAN: Yeah, but really highlights something that is important to see. That you have stat in your piece right there that 60 percent of all workplace attacks happen to health care workers or in health care facilities. That's a lot.

I want to bring in Deena Brecher, president of the Emergency Nurses Association.

Deena, let me start off by asking you, I assume you've had a chance to see that video. What goes through your head when you see something like that?

DEENA BRECHER, PRESIDENT, EMERGENCY NURSES ASSOCIATION: Unfortunately, that's it all too familiar. I can tell you from an Emergency Nurses Association perspective, half of the nurses we've surveyed have reported being a victim of either verbal assault or physical assault in the last seven days they worked so this is an epidemic of violence in our health care system.

PEREIRA: Do you think this is something on the rise? Has it always been this way and maybe we're only just sort of realizing it now in talking about it now? Or has something changed?

BRECHER: I think it's been going on for a long time. And we can -- we have the data from an emergency department perspective to show that. I think what's happening now is now we can see it. Now it's on tape and it's much more difficult to ignore.

BERMAN: You say it's all too familiar.

PEREIRA: That's upsetting.

BERMAN: Yeah, that is upsetting. I was with my son a month ago in the emergency room, he's OK and everything, but there was somebody flipping out right there in front of everybody. What can you do to stop this?

BRECHER: With so there's a lot of things that we can do. First we have to remember that hospitals are high-stress environments. And so their accessibility 24 hours a day, seven days a week can really -- you tend to see more violence in those situations.

There are several things that we recommend doing. The first is actually we need to change the culture around violence and the acceptance of violence in health care. It's not part of anybody's job in health care. It's not part of any nurse's job to be assaulted while at work. And that's not only a culture within nursing itself but throughout the hospital and all the way out to the judicial bench. We need to work to change that culture.

(CROSSTALK)

PEREIRA: But to be fair -- we should point out -- before you get to your second point, I want to make that point, Deena. I think it's also important we don't know what led to this man's outburst, because often times, and you'll fully admit to this, I'm sure, people present to the hospital, to the E.R., especially, with all sorts of problems. Sometimes it's mental illness, sometimes it's something else, a change in their medication. There's all sorts of things that could bring people there and they could have underlying issues. So it's not necessarily that they mean to be violent. We don't know what happened here, if he had some sort of psychotic break.

BRECHER: But we do understand that violence happens in the hospital and there cease some precipitating factors. So drugs and alcohol is one. Overcrowding is another. And patients with dementia, there's a lot of reasons. We're not saying -- I understand that it's a very easy parallel to make between someone with behavioral health issues and violence but what we have to understand is that the vast majority of patients with behavioral health emergencies are not violent. So really being able to assess the situation and understand when things are escalating and behaviors are escalating and to create a safe environment is what we feel that nurses and all health care workers should be trained to do.

PEREIRA: Well, we certainly appreciate you coming on to react to what we just saw there. Maybe we can keep this conversation going. Obviously, the situation in Dallas and the health care workers there putting themselves in harm's way to care for patients. We see our health care workers always on the front lines in these E.R.s and medical centers across the country. We appreciate the hard work you all are doing.

Thank you for joining us.

BRECHER: Thank you so much.

BERMAN: Still ahead at this hour, I'm going to say four things that will make you pull up very close to your TV. Marijuana, Willie Nelson, the White House and Brooke Baldwin.

PEREIRA: I'm done. You sold me.

BERMAN: We have all four.

PEREIRA: I'm sold.

BERMAN: All four, starting right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: He a music legend, an American icon, and he likes pot. Willie Nelson, a man who makes music and news. PEREIRA: He's part of a White House Salute to the Troops that is set

to air tonight on PBS.

Our Brooke Baldwin asked him about this week's victory for marijuana legalization in the capital and whether it will help smoke out some of the gridlock.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Do you think it would help people in D.C. Get along?

(LAUGHTER)

WILLIE NELSON, SINGER: Well, I really think stress is the cause of a lot of our problems and I really believe the best medicine for stress is pot. Yeah, I think it would make us get along better all over the world.

BALDWIN: I want you to tell me what you did on the roof of the White House.

NELSON: Well, Brooke, it's that short-term memory thing.

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: Oh, come on, we've talked about it on CNN before.

(LAUGHTER)

It involves maybe some rolling papers, Willie Nelson.

NELSON: Well, I'll tell you this much. Up on top of the White House it's really a great scene up there. All of the roads come together up there and you feel like you're at the center of the world.

BALDWIN: Is this anything you will address this with the White House as you enter said White House?

NELSON: Oh, I probably won't say anything to the president about it. But I think I realize how he feels about it and I've read his books about when he was a kid that he may have delved into that matter a little bit, so I'm sure he's understanding of what is going on and he may be happy to see it happening.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREIRA: Brooke Baldwin graces our set today.

So lovely to have you here --

BALDWIN: Hello.

PEREIRA: -- fresh off your conversation with the legend. How great is this?

BALDWIN: Listen, any day is a good day when you get to talk to Willie Nelson. So we initially --

BERMAN: Everyday is a great day for Willie Nelson.

BALDWIN: Every day is a wonderful day for Willie Nelson.

When we talked about the Salute to the Troops event airing on PBS and issues are near-and-dear to his heart, and then given the news worthiness -- I saw that eyebrow raised, Michaela. It was Alaska, D.C., and Oregon passing different pro-pot ballot measures, I wanted his thoughts. And I was sort of surprised. I talked to him. He has a wonderful relationship with Jimmy Carter. He's absolutely taken a bit of a toke on roof of the White House during the Carter administration. I said, Willie, is that true, is it myth? And he said, well, I didn't exactly roll it. Before I was on top, maybe, before I went up there. True story. But I asked how long he thinks it is will take half of the country to legalize recreational use of marijuana and he seems to think not very long.

BERMAN: We can joke about it, going into that interview, it makes me hungry.

(LAUGHTER)

But the point is, he takes this very seriously. This is something that he works for.

BALDWIN: This is something that has been near and dear to him for a long, long time. I didn't actually expect him to say, yes, I plan to address this with President Obama when we sing "On the Road Again." But it's been incredibly important to him. He's been a voice in this mass legalization movement. So as we're watching and seriously covering state by state by state, I think it will not be too long before we see the tides turning.

PEREIRA: Especially because for him, look it, how old is he? He's --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: His hard trigger is 50. I know that. So he's north of 70.

PEREIRA: It's not just a thing he did in his youth. It's been a lifestyle for him. And if anybody is at the forefront of this conversation, he'd be the one to broach it with the president.

BALDWIN: Well, I doubt they had the conversation yesterday.

(CROSSTALK)

I'm guessing that they didn't. But there are many people on the flip side who argue that it's not OK, it's not safe, based upon designation that it has with the department of health but, yeah, I mean, this is so important for Willie Nelson. I thought it was awesome for him to come on live on the tour bus with me.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: He was on the tour bus?

BALDWIN: He was on the tour bus. Live from the tour bus. Thank you very much, Willie Nelson. You know when you show up, the painting on the side, you know where he is in town. And it was so wonderful for him to set up shop and talk to us. And, again, hours before the Salute to the Troops event at the White House.

PEREIRA: Tonight on PBS.

BALDWIN: Tonight on PBS.

BERMAN: A great cause.

PEREIRA: Watch it.

BERMAN: Brooke Baldwin, great to have you here.

PEREIRA: What a treat for us. Thank you.

BALDWIN: You're welcome. Always.

PEREIRA: That's it for us at this hour. And that's it for us this week at this hour.

BERMAN: That's Michaela Pereira.

PEREIRA: And you're John Berman.

BERMAN: "LEGAL VIEW" starts next with Ashleigh Banfield.

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