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At This Hour

Obama Calls for Patient, Persistence after Brown, Garner Shootings; Mother of Tamir Rice Speaks Out; Are Cops Afraid of Black Men; "Rolling Stone" Clarifying Apology on UVA

Aired December 08, 2014 - 11:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: President Obama is calling for patience and persistence in the battle against racism. His advice to younger African-Americans comes in response to the intense protests nationwide after grand juries decided not to indict the white police officers who killed Michael Brown and Eric Garner.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This isn't going to be solved overnight. This is something that is deeply rooted in our society. It's important to recognize as painful as these incidents are, we can't equate what is happening now to what was happening 50 years ago. And if you talk to your parents, grandparents, uncles, they'll tell you that things are better. Not good in some cases, but better.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: The president speaking to BET. That interview is set to air in its entirety later today.

I want to turn to our White House. Our Sunlen Serfaty with us.

Good to have you with us Sunland. Good to meet you as well.

We know the president has come under pressure to speak especially after the grand jury decision. (AUDIO PROBLEM). Poignant that the president decided to speak directly to young African-Americans.

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Michaela. You could say this is something of a presidential pep talk. White House officials say the president really wanted to reach out to young African-Americans who may have been feeling discouraged after these two grand jury decisions in Ferguson and in New York and he goes on to say that. He says when you're dealing with something as deep rooted as racism or bias in any society you have to have vigilance and realize it's going to take time.

This next part really struck me, too. He goes on to say that you have to be steady so you don't give up when you don't get all the way there. I thought that was particularly poignant coming from a president who we all know has been somewhat reluctant to discuss race in the past -- Michaela?

BERMAN: Interesting with who he chose to do the interview and when. The president seems to want to reach a very specific audience. He's been busy since he went to the doctor because he had a sore throat. He did the Kennedy Center Honors, meeting with the prince today. Any update on his health and how he's feeling.

SERFATY: He has been busy, John, but he doesn't appear to be sick. He doesn't sound sick. His voice is not raspy. We were just in the Oval Office with him and Prince William and he didn't sound any different than he normally does. But we know from White House officials that he is suffering from acid reflux. He made a brief visit to the hospital over the weekend. White House officials say he's had a sore throat for the last few weeks so clearly it is causing him some sort of uncomfortableness. And White House officials, though, tell us it hasn't changed his schedule or influenced his routine all that much. But it's something we have a lot of questions about going forward -- John?

PEREIRA: Sunlen Serfaty, thanks so much for joining us.

Ahead here, we have heard many times African-American say this, that they're afraid of police. But are police afraid of African-American men? Our next guest says they are, but that there are ways to overcome the fear on both sides.

BERMAN: In a much, much lighter note, some people turned on the TV last night because they thought a snake was going to eat a dude, swallow him whole. These same people are very, very upset that the snake did not swallow the guy whole. What is wrong with these people? That's what's coming up later.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: The family of 12-year-old Tamir Rice is speaking out today. A Cleveland police officer shot the boy last month. The boy was carrying what turned out to be a pellet gun. Some people call it a toy gun. You can see what happened here. It was all caught on video. Police killed Rice less than two seconds after pulling up beside the boy at a park. His mother spoke just moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAMARIA RICE, MOTHER OF TAMIR RICE: November 22, about 3:30 p.m., reminding you that I stay right across the street from the recreation center, two little boys came and knocked on my door and said "the police just shot your son twice in the stomach." So my 16-year-old son stormed out the door and I was right after him. When I arrived on the scene I seen my son, the 16-year-old, off to the side with the police and they was putting him in the police car. I noticed my son laying down on the ground and I went charging and yelling and everything at the police because they wouldn't let me through and then I seen my daughter in the back of the police car. The same car that the shooter got out of. As I was trying to get through to my son, the police told me to calm down or they will put me in the back of the police car. So of course I calmed down and I asked the police to let my daughter go and they wouldn't at that time and I asked them, you know, what's going on? And they wasn't telling me anything but just "calm down, calm down."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREIRA: Samaria Rice, the mother of 12-year-old Tamir Rice recounting the moments when she learned her son had been shot dead by police.

Now, more about the other police incidents that have inspired protests across our country.

BERMAN: We've heard protesters in black communities say repeatedly that they are scared of police. The question is, could that fear be mutual?

Civil rights attorney, Connie Rice, joins us. She filed lawsuits against the Los Angeles Police Department back in the 1990s during the O.J. Simpson and Rodney King era.

Thanks so much for being with us. Really appreciate it.

(CROSSTALK)

CONNIE RICE, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: My pleasure. Thank you.

BERMAN: You interviewed hundreds of police officers and they were very, very honest with you over time. They talked about their feelings towards African-American men. What did they tell you?

RICE: Fascinating. It was very fascinating for me to hear because once I got their trust and they realized that Chief Bratton, the chief of LAPD at the time, wanted me to find out what were his cops thinking -- and so I just made up a list of very provocative questions and I asked them. I said "what is it that makes you afraid?" And they actually decided to talk to me. I don't know why, but they did. And they would say, "Miss Rice, can I be honest with you? I'm afraid of black people. I never grew up around black people, I don't understand them, and they scare me." Or "Miss Rice, I'm scared of black men."

And I was stunned, but understood that they were being honest. And from there once you understand the fears you can address them and get them to dial it down so that there isn't a hair-trigger response when they see a black man and they misinterpret every move that he's making as a threat.

PEREIRA: So you didn't -- when they were sort of coming clean and really baring their souls, you also in the course of this didn't necessarily believe that these officers as individuals were necessarily racist, did you?

RICE: Well, when you say "racist," did I think that they were Klansmen in a police officer's uniform? No. I think that what we have to do in the United States is understand. Everybody has inside of them racialized thinking, racial fears. We all have those fears. I mean, keep in mind that black cops also make negative associations and threat associations when they're presented with black images. So it's across the board. The two of you probably understand this because you see in the media all the time. It is across the board.

So what we need to do is step back, stop the finger pointing and say, look, we've all got in stuff inside of us because it's been drummed into us. Now, how do we neutralize it? How do we get beyond it? How do we make sure that it doesn't cause us to pull a trigger or beat somebody up or have a negative consequence?

BERMAN: First of all, I think it's indisputable we all come at every situation with our own internal biases and notions. I think we probably need to be careful of saying every cop is scared of every black person. I know that's not what you're saying here.

RICE: That's true. No.

BERMAN: The question is, if these feelings do exist and cause dangerous situations, how do you deal with it? What do you do? You seed there needs to be discussions. What can you implement to change things?

RICE: It starts with the discussion and the confession. I had black cops confess they were afraid of Latinos. I had Asian cops confess they were afraid of black people and Latinos. So we have an intertribal problem here and I think what we need to do is simply acknowledge that reality and the next step is to sit down and figure out the training protocols for how you expose each tribe to the other. And you get them to tamp down the fears because there's a constant exposure. And you want to know something? Once these white cops that I was dealing with, I would take them into Watts, I would introduce them to Mrs. Day and Mrs. Toliver, and I would get them around the older black guys who had been members of gangs. And we started having breakfast together and lunch together, and pretty soon, they were on a first name basis and they felt like they knew one another. Once they felt like they knew one another, guess what? The confrontations dialed way, way, way down.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: That's like community policing.

RICE: Exactly.

PEREIRA: Well, maybe if you'll allow us, Connie, it would be great if you can come back and talk with us about community policing and community partnership policing which is something we've seen implemented in Los Angeles maybe we can do that another day. How about that?

RICE: Yes, please do.

PEREIRA: We'd like that very much. Really lovely to speak with you.

RICE: Thank you.

BERMAN: Ahead for us @THISHOUR, "Rolling Stone" magazine is now clarifying its apology over a report about gang rape allegations at the University of Virginia. This story says they no longer stand behind it. What does it all mean now?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: National fraternities and sororities are demanding an apology from the University of Virginia and reinstatement of the school's Greek system. This is the latest fallout over the latest discrepancies, shall we say, that surfaced after a bomb-shell article on an alleged gang rape on campus.

PEREIRA: "Rolling Stone" had to apologize for the article, then they had to revise the apology. However, UVA officials have yet to respond to allegations that key details of the story may not be true.

Our Sara Ganim is at the UVA campus in Charlottesville, Virginia. Also, Brian Stelter is here, our senior media correspondent and host of CNN's "Reliable Sources."

Sara, I'm curious what you are hearing from people on campus, what they're saying might what might have happened.

SARA GANIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, John and Michaela. I just spoke to a friend of Jackie's, who spoke to her last night, and says she is overwhelmed, did not see this coming, but the friend told me she stands by her and support her and generally the friends of Jackie's that we've talked to have said that. That they believe something bad did happen to Jackie even if there are some inaccuracies or changes to her story. They don't believe that this was a hoax. Now, you mentioned the apology demand from the national Greek organizations. That seems to imply they do believe the story was false. Now, that's not what we're hearing here on campus. People here want to wait for the police investigation to conclude to sort out those discrepancies.

BERMAN: But that's why "Rolling Stone" did such a disservice here, Brian. Because if something bad did happen, the fact that they got the details of the story mixed up or there are discrepancies, really puts smoke over that.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT & HOST, "RELIABLE SOURCES": It reminds me that it's too good to check. Something was too good to check. In this case, it was too horrible to check. The story was so brutal and so many awfully details that the accuser asked the magazine not to talk to the attackers. "Rolling Stone" agrees that not getting their side of the story. I spoke to the "Rolling Stone's" spokesperson. No updates today. They are continuing to investigate. They are belatedly doing the fact checking that they should have done before. I don't know when we'll hear from them about this.

PEREIRA: The other side of this is it sort of sets back the fight against rape on many African-American campuses and a great conversation going on nationally. And there's concern that there will be a setback. GANIM: That's what we've heard from survivors here. Their first

initial reaction to the apology from "Rolling Stone" was, oh, my gosh, this is going to set us all back. Here on campus, I have to say, from the survivor groups you'd expect that and also you'd hear that from the fraternity members and campus sexual assaults is a problem. Something else that shouldn't get lost here. Jackie's story and the "Rolling Stone" issue, the University of Virginia has never expelled a single student for sexual assault, even when the student admitted to it. That issue has nothing to do with "Rolling Stone" or with Jackie. And that's still something that people here want to be addressed.

STELTER: "Rolling Stone" is making the point that they don't believe she made it up. They don't have evidence that she made this up. Maybe some details are sketchy but they are not saying that it's a hoax. And people that are saying it is a hoax, they don't have proof of that.

BERMAN: Brian Stelter and Sara Ganim, thank you.

Ahead for us @THISHOUR, we'll shift gears.

PEREIRA: Oh, boy, aren't we.

BERMAN: A man fails to be eaten alive by a snake and some TV viewers are upset that this man failed to be swallowed by a snake.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: The Discovery Channel show was called, "Eaten Alive." No surprisingly, viewers tuned in to see a guy get eaten alive.

PEREIRA: Yeah, it didn't happen. The guy doing the stunt had to call it off because the weirdly the giant snake started to actually eat him and he panicked when it put its mouth around his head.

Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

: (INAUDIBLE)

(SHOUTING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREIRA: Brian Stelter is back with us. He's our senior media correspondent.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: And snake eating correspondent.

(LAUGHTER)

PEREIRA: The only thing eaten alive was the show on Twitter.

STELTER: There you go.

PEREIRA: People were outraged. I don't know what's more outrageous, the prank or stunt or whatever you want it call it, or peoples' reaction to not getting to see the man eaten alive.

STELTER: To be fair, we have been waiting a month for this. Discovery was promoting this very intensely. They started promoting it when Nik Wallenda walked across the tight rope in Chicago. In the early, early ratings, looks like he did as well as that stunt. Both stunts did pretty well.

BERMAN: It's the top-rated, snake-eating live special ever.

STELTER: I believe that's right. I will check that.

(CROSSTALK)

STELTER: Of course, I went to Discovery and said this is outrageous. You didn't deliver on your promise. They said the whole point of this was to get maximum attention for the Amazon, for the rainforest, for the animals there. We have gotten a statement from Discovery. Shall we read it?

PEREIRA: Sure.

STELTER: "He went to great lengths to send this message and it was his absolute intention to be eaten alive. Ultimately, after the snake constricted Paul for over an hour and went for his head, the experiment had to be called when it became clear that Paul would be seriously injured." What did expect to happen -- oh, sorry. It continues on -- "The safety of Paul, as well as the anaconda, was always our number-one priority."

BERMAN: That was the best statement. The absolute intention to be eaten alive.

STELTER: To be eaten alive.

BERMAN: My only issue is this, is that Discovery can do whatever it wants to get television viewers. It seems like people were sitting around saying, how can we get the most viewers to watch, oh, let's have a snake eat a guy.

PEREIRA: Yeah.

BERMAN: I can't believe people are upset --

PEREIRA: That he didn't get eaten?

BERMAN: -- that there was false advertising somehow in the notion that a snake was going to eat a guy.

STELTER: I actually believed it, though. I guess I'm embarrassed by this. I shouldn't admit this. I thought he was going to go all the way.

PEREIRA: You also understand that they constrict, right, and squeeze the heck out of you before they kill you.

STELTER: So this is working. We're learning more about snakes. We're learning more about the Amazon.

PEREIRA: Which was -- he's a conservationist who was hoping to shed light on the habitat being ruined by the mining in the Amazon. Do you think there will be such a backlash that that message will be --

(CROSSTALK)

STELTER: I think it will be missed by a lot of people, yes. There's an amusing but legitimate amount of outrage about the false advertising part of this. That this was a show called "Eaten Alive."

BERMAN: Brian, do you think people will continue to try to one-up themselves?

STELTER: That's the one thing I can say for sure. I'm trying to think of another animal that they can try this with. I do think that we're going to keep seeing this. We're going to see the high wire walks and see more of these stunts like this and also taped stunts like this.

BERMAN: Tomorrow, on this broadcast, I will be "Eaten by a Dragon." And if it doesn't happen, don't be upset.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: That's all I can say.

STELTER: I'm going to set my DVR right now.

PEREIRA: Yeah, right now.

BERMAN: Brian Stelter, great to have you here. Appreciate it.

PEREIRA: We're coming undone, aren't we?

BERMAN: Yes.

PEREIRA: We really are.

BERMAN: As a society.

PEREIRA: That's what I mean. I don't mean just you and I. We're OK.

BERMAN: No, no.

(CROSSTALK)

PEREIRA: That's it for us @THISHOUR. I'm Michaela Pereira.

(LAUGHTER)

BERMAN: And I'm john Berman.

"LEGAL VIEW" with Ashleigh Banfield starts blessedly right now.

(LAUGHTER)